I have notice cities in Missouri mainly use the straight traffic light mast arm for almost everything. Does anyone know why?
Quote from: ColossalBlocks on August 07, 2016, 11:20:22 PM
I have notice cities in Missouri mainly use the straight traffic light mast arm for almost everything. Does anyone know why?
Arkansas isn't much different.
As long as the traffic lights are mounted on some kind of real pole structure I don't mind. What I dislike: overhead signal lights dangled from cables. Now that's an approach that looks totally ghetto.
Most likely because the straight mast arm is MoDOT standard, and most agencies in Missouri do want to take the time to look into alternative designs. Also, if MoDOT gets as picky with the use of federal funds as some other states, they get some influence on the mast arm type and may make it harder to use alternative designs.
Probably cheaper to manufacture than something more complicated?
Springfield uses a lot of truss arm signals throughout the city.
Unlike in some other states, in Missouri, MoDOT provides signals and mastarms on all state routes they maintain. MoDOT style also overrides the cities' style on the signage on the signal arm. So if you're just going through cities on state routes, you won't get an accurate picture of what each city's signals really look like.
Quote from: Bobby5280 on August 08, 2016, 10:40:23 AM
As long as the traffic lights are mounted on some kind of real pole structure I don't mind. What I dislike: overhead signal lights dangled from cables. Now that's an approach that looks totally ghetto.
Those are called Span wire signals, you'd hate Indiana, because we have them everywhere :-D. I like them except in downtown areas, IMO downtown areas should all be mastarms.
Those cheap things are all over the place in South Georgia too. I suppose those cable hanged signal lights are better than nothing for controlling traffic in a more rural setting. But they're an eye sore when strung across a more busy intersection in a suburban or urban location.
Quote from: Bobby5280 on August 09, 2016, 11:20:03 AM
Those cheap things are all over the place in South Georgia too. I suppose those cable hanged signal lights are better than nothing for controlling traffic in a more rural setting. But they're an eye sore when strung across a more busy intersection in a suburban or urban location.
Span-wire signals are hideous enough. GDOT's continued insistence on using span-wire overhead signs is even worse.
Quote from: paulthemapguy on August 08, 2016, 09:14:22 PM
cheaper
It being Missouri, this is the explanation I'd go with.
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 09, 2016, 11:15:58 AM
Those are called Span wire signals, you'd hate Indiana, because we have them everywhere :-D. I like them except in downtown areas, IMO downtown areas should all be mastarms.
Someone who was in charge of a signal in downtown Belleville, Illinois, apparently disagrees with you: Streetview. (https://www.google.com/maps/@38.5137748,-89.9828597,3a,75y,187.59h,83.27t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sW6L5lyxzgewzgxZcl9kbTQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656) :spin:
Quote from: Revive 755 on August 09, 2016, 09:43:02 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 09, 2016, 11:15:58 AM
Those are called Span wire signals, you'd hate Indiana, because we have them everywhere :-D. I like them except in downtown areas, IMO downtown areas should all be mastarms.
Someone who was in charge of a signal in downtown Belleville, Illinois, apparently disagrees with you: Streetview. (https://www.google.com/maps/@38.5137748,-89.9828597,3a,75y,187.59h,83.27t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sW6L5lyxzgewzgxZcl9kbTQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656) :spin:
Haha that one isn't as bad as this one https://www.google.com/maps/@38.7362663,-85.3802076,3a,75y,181h,90t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sLEyKfM7aVKXnCOkAEnUSvQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Both of those examples are pretty awful. The community spends all that money to make the streets and store fronts look nice, but strings some cheap span wire signals through there? Ugh.
I can understand the cost concerns for installing better looking traffic signal pole structures. But those things make a big visual difference in the look of a neighborhood or business district. Some cities and towns will spend a pretty good amount of money on more decorative pole structures. And they'll invest in good looking way-finding sign systems too. Then they'll spend pretty heavily trying to bury as many power lines and phone/cable lines as they can to get that visual clutter out of the way too.
Quote from: Revive 755 on August 09, 2016, 09:43:02 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 09, 2016, 11:15:58 AM
Those are called Span wire signals, you'd hate Indiana, because we have them everywhere :-D. I like them except in downtown areas, IMO downtown areas should all be mastarms.
Someone who was in charge of a signal in downtown Belleville, Illinois, apparently disagrees with you: Streetview. (https://www.google.com/maps/@38.5137748,-89.9828597,3a,75y,187.59h,83.27t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sW6L5lyxzgewzgxZcl9kbTQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656) :spin:
Municipal signal. It has only two signals per direction as opposed to IDOT's three. IDOT also would've used a mastarm (straight or curved).
It is Missouri's subtle way of giving all drivers a two fingered salute as all lights must have at least two signals.
Missouri's two largest cities, KC, and St. Louis, each have a more unique mast style arm. KC uses a curved mast arm that resembles something more out of CA. St. Louis, at least their older installations, uses an aluminum truss style that is similar to NJ Style installations. Although, many of the newer masts in St. Louis appear to be MoDOT standard.
Quote from: Brandon on August 10, 2016, 01:23:11 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on August 09, 2016, 09:43:02 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 09, 2016, 11:15:58 AM
Those are called Span wire signals, you'd hate Indiana, because we have them everywhere :-D. I like them except in downtown areas, IMO downtown areas should all be mastarms.
Someone who was in charge of a signal in downtown Belleville, Illinois, apparently disagrees with you: Streetview. (https://www.google.com/maps/@38.5137748,-89.9828597,3a,75y,187.59h,83.27t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sW6L5lyxzgewzgxZcl9kbTQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656) :spin:
Municipal signal. It has only two signals per direction as opposed to IDOT's three. IDOT also would've used a mastarm (straight or curved).
All signals in the state still have to conform to IDOT's basic standards. Those standards only require two signal heads for each movement. On an IDOT roadway, however, you're right...they use their "preferred" standards and probably would have a third signal head in there.
So what you guys are saying is that MoDot has low standards for mast arms?
Honestly the Midwest is known for their straight masts, while some other states use curved or truss like arms.
Like Mississippi for example, they use curved masts that look like KC arms.
https://goo.gl/maps/XDVGAzuUaix (https://goo.gl/maps/XDVGAzuUaix)
And Minnesota uses the truss like style
https://goo.gl/maps/Brg3mvLmD4R2 (https://goo.gl/maps/Brg3mvLmD4R2)
While down here in Missouri we have the same, generic, straight mast arm.
https://goo.gl/maps/zQg4DLjLYF52 (https://goo.gl/maps/zQg4DLjLYF52)
It's not really a low standard. Just that MoDOT has picked a design that isn't terribly fancy.
As I mentioned before, truss arms are common throughout Springfield:
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/4f/Shrine_Mosque.JPG/800px-Shrine_Mosque.JPG)
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/81/400_East_Walnut%2C_September_2014.jpg/800px-400_East_Walnut%2C_September_2014.jpg)
Span wires can look ghetto. Or look OK. Some states are better than others
I like the span wires in Florida with concrete poles. They generally look finished. I agree even a brand new Georgia or South Carolina spanwire assembly can look ugly
LGMS428
Quote from: Scott5114 on September 28, 2016, 10:00:04 PM
It's not really a low standard. Just that MoDOT has picked a design that isn't terribly fancy.
As I mentioned before, truss arms are common throughout Springfield:
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/4f/Shrine_Mosque.JPG/800px-Shrine_Mosque.JPG)
(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/81/400_East_Walnut%2C_September_2014.jpg/800px-400_East_Walnut%2C_September_2014.jpg)
Those Missouri truss arms look like an updated version of what is still common in CA urban areas: a curved pipe (corresponding with the lower truss section in the MO pix) carrying the signal wiring, but with the upper truss replaced by cable stays connected to the mast. Those tend to flop around a bit (and even rotate in extreme circumstances) in windy weather situations; when they reach their usable life end, they're usually replaced by single-unit thick piping.
Quote from: ColossalBlocks on September 28, 2016, 09:39:54 PM
So what you guys are saying is that MoDot has low standards for mast arms?
Honestly the Midwest is known for their straight masts, while some other states use curved or truss like arms.
Like Mississippi for example, they use curved masts that look like KC arms.
https://goo.gl/maps/XDVGAzuUaix (https://goo.gl/maps/XDVGAzuUaix)
And Minnesota uses the truss like style
https://goo.gl/maps/Brg3mvLmD4R2 (https://goo.gl/maps/Brg3mvLmD4R2)
While down here in Missouri we have the same, generic, straight mast arm.
https://goo.gl/maps/zQg4DLjLYF52 (https://goo.gl/maps/zQg4DLjLYF52)
It's cheap and efficient, and it works. And most likely those other states have an agreement with the manufactures of those types of setups. I'm pretty sure Minnesota is an example of that. The other side of it is just how things have been done forever, and the lack of wanting to change. Like NDDOT and many ND cities with their yellow painted signal poles.
Here is SD, they've adopted a standard, in terms of traffic signals and lighting.
https://www.google.com/maps/@43.6019295,-96.7910971,3a,75y,338.88h,87.27t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s-fOyuxCam48j3FhGrE-hLQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1?hl=en
Those street name signs on the signal poles are from the City of Sioux Falls. I've seen SDDOT, recently, put their own signage on signal poles when it comes to that.
Most everywhere I look in Arkansas has the straight mast arm. However in Little Rock, they also have the curved truss arm
Example: La Harpe / State Blvds https://www.google.com/maps/@34.7499912,-92.2787561,3a,75y,103.1h,83.74t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s4JrjrrLViM6EOGNLLN3h5g!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
In the affluent area of Chenal, I spotted some slightly curved-ish mast arms... And the overheard street light arms look really wacky!
https://www.google.com/maps/@34.7695793,-92.4586202,3a,75y,341.08h,88.34t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sHRrmacoBbXabvAr-ZOw4pw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
Quote from: US71 on August 07, 2016, 11:45:21 PM
Quote from: ColossalBlocks on August 07, 2016, 11:20:22 PM
I have notice cities in Missouri mainly use the straight traffic light mast arm for almost everything. Does anyone know why?
Arkansas isn't much different.
Neither is Illinois.