This goes back about 30 years ago (wow how time flies).
Anyhoo, when I was in college, we went on a spring break trip to Toronto, and stayed at a hotel in town, near the subway and other transportation.
One thing that caught my eye back then was a sign at the intersection of Younge & Bloor St., near downtown. It was a metal street sign (about 12" x 20"???) with metal slats that would automatically/electronically "turn" over to reveal a different sign (my guess it was a No Left Turn restriction during certain hours). When the restricted hours were over, the sign assembly would flip back over to its normal side. There was a solid metal backing so it was only seen from the one side.
Questions:
- Anybody else remember seeing this type of unusual assembly in & around Toronto, or elsewhere???
- Anybody have a photo of said assembly. Current GSV shows them long gone at Younge & Bloor.
- Is there an official term for this type of signage???
- How long did this type of sign last? Obviously it never widely caught on anywhere else.
They're mainly used for extreme events, such as a long(er than a few hour) road closure. Otherwise, it just takes up too much manpower to flip/unflip the sign a few times each day...not to mention today's safety standards which in many cases precludes easy sign flipping.
Many times, the sign is disguised as another sign, so you wouldn't even know it's a flip sign, such as this one on NJ 29: https://goo.gl/maps/sXpyBwph6c22 . If flipped open, it reveals a yellow background sign mentioning 29 is closed, and to use use NJ 129. On NJ 129 itself, for some reason this sign has been flipped open for a few years now (no detour is in effect): https://goo.gl/maps/sXpyBwph6c22.
Let me clarify the flipping segments:
IIRC, it was composed of 3 or 4 vertical metal slats/segments/louvres that would electronically turn in tandem either to the left or to the right at the appointed time revealing what regulatory sign was in effect at that time. The sign was mounted on top of the crosswalk signals or on the vertical part of the traffic light pole about 10-12 feet off the ground. This also was not a prism or trilon assembly either.
There was no need to manually "flip" the sign as it was all done automatically -- which is what made this type of sign unique.
Since I don't remember what both signs said, let me use another example:
Take a regular Speed Limit 35 sign. Put it in a school zone. When it's time to display the school speed limit, the individual sign segments flip horizontally (left to right) from the normal sign to the SCHOOL SPEED LIMIT 20 sign, all by itself, electronically. At the end of the school day, the sign segments flip back (right to left) to reveal the normal speed limit.
If we can ever find a photo or a diagram of this style of sign, you'll understand much better.
The only place I've seen manual flap board signs erected is before the weigh stations on US 6 in Mashpee, MA.
https://goo.gl/maps/uHdTTcqwga22 (https://goo.gl/maps/uHdTTcqwga22)
That one's on the westbound side, and I've only seen it say "open" once. MassDOT never seems to use their weigh stations.
Are they like these signs, as seen in El Paso?
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4494/37612976701_7c41ae9d76_b.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/ZiJkyi)
Sounds like something similar in concept to the batter's eye advertising at Nats Park? Notice where the big "Tickets" ad is and compare to the other photo. Bunch of vertical panels, sort of like big vertical Venetian blinds, that rotate to provide the green background during play.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ballparksofbaseball.com%2Fnl%2Fpictures%2Fnats15952.jpg&hash=f49e13e0aeeec867b146eed4c554b1a95382f177)
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimages.performgroup.com%2Fdi%2Flibrary%2Fomnisport%2F7e%2Fc1%2Fnationals-park_26ivsr45642n12hhgiaju9hym.jpg&hash=2b2482b571ef005e063bf58debeb77783a069fad)
Quote from: thenetwork on October 09, 2017, 11:24:13 PM
This goes back about 30 years ago (wow how time flies).
Anyhoo, when I was in college, we went on a spring break trip to Toronto, and stayed at a hotel in town, near the subway and other transportation.
One thing that caught my eye back then was a sign at the intersection of Younge & Bloor St., near downtown. It was a metal street sign (about 12" x 20"???) with metal slats that would automatically/electronically "turn" over to reveal a different sign (my guess it was a No Left Turn restriction during certain hours). When the restricted hours were over, the sign assembly would flip back over to its normal side. There was a solid metal backing so it was only seen from the one side.
Questions:
- Anybody else remember seeing this type of unusual assembly in & around Toronto, or elsewhere???
- Anybody have a photo of said assembly. Current GSV shows them long gone at Younge & Bloor.
- Is there an official term for this type of signage???
- How long did this type of sign last? Obviously it never widely caught on anywhere else.
I recall seeing those on Yonge Street a while back (10-15 years ago). The first time I saw one it was clearly malfunctioning, opening and shutting rapidly. I would guess that reliability issues may be why they switched over (back) to standard signs printed with time of day restrictions.
Not really "flippy" but I remember one intersection near my childhood home would switch the stoplights to flash mode from 11pm to 6am, and a little stop sign would unfold on the side street. Another folding sign was near a railroad crossing, where left turns were prohibited in the minutes before a train went by. The sign would unfold to reveal a "no left turn" sign.
I have never seen anything else like those signs, and both have been replaced; the folding stop sign is gone and the no left turn sign is now electronic.
There used to be billboards like this all over Orlando area.. now it seems there are more digital billboards
Z981
How about various points along the quadruple-carriageway section of the New Jersey Turnpike? https://goo.gl/maps/d5WvGGwSSUN2
The signs mentioned in the original post sound like rotating-prism changeable message signs. US 59 in Houston has them for the HOV lanes, and that term was used to refer to them in the plans sets for the construction contracts (advertised 2002-2003) that redeveloped the highway into its current configuration.
These signs are used extensively in western Europe as well. They are not to be confused with folding "secret" signs, used extensively for permanent detours in Britain (the message is changed when an authorized person turns part of the panel on a hinge to expose the side ordinarily left hidden), or a different type of hidden sign common in Switzerland that consists of an ordinary sign turned parallel to traffic when the message is not applicable and then turned perpendicular to traffic either manually or remotely when needed.
Quote from: cbeach40 on October 10, 2017, 08:45:47 AMI recall seeing those on Yonge Street a while back (10-15 years ago). The first time I saw one it was clearly malfunctioning, opening and shutting rapidly. I would guess that reliability issues may be why they switched over (back) to standard signs printed with time of day restrictions.
I understand the fixed permanent signs for turn restrictions in Toronto are now being phased out in favor of LED blankout signs because the time restrictions are too complex to depict at a size of lettering that is reasonably legible to traffic.
Sounds like fillup's description is the closest to the sign I described. Everything else so far (prismatic, manual flaps, NJT rotating boxes, billboard signs,...) does not fit the bill.
I'll try to visualize it one more time. Picture an average-sized regulatory sign. Then imagine 3 vertical hinged segments of metal that, if it was in the middle of changing, stuck out at a 90 degree angle. Just like if you were turning pages in a book x 3.
Or if I laid this assembly on its back:
<--FLIP--->
| | |
__|__|__|__
SIGN BACK
The flaps that stick out have segments of Sign A on one side, Side B on the other. The far left of the fixed back was the first segment of Sign A. The far right end of the assembly was the last segment of Sign B.
If the louvre segments flipped right, sign A was revealed -- if they flipped left, sign B was revealed.
Hope that helps.
There were a handful of these on I-95 in MD, the purpose of which I never quite understood. They've all since been replaced by VMS's.
This looks like a closer match to Thenetwork's more detailed description:
http://www.alamy.com/stock-photo-traffic-road-signs-heading-north-on-waterloo-bridge-69664426.html
Quote from: J N Winkler on October 10, 2017, 02:28:34 PM
I understand the fixed permanent signs for turn restrictions in Toronto are now being phased out in favor of LED blankout signs because the time restrictions are too complex to depict at a size of lettering that is reasonably legible to traffic.
LED turn restriction signs are being used more in advisory applications. The biggest issue with them is that they're not legally enforceable on their own.
Arizona had used these signs on I-8 & I-10, one side was a standard BG Pull thru sign (https://www.arizonaroads.com/wrong/alert1.jpg)on the other was a yellow dust storm alert sign with radio stations(https://www.arizonaroads.com/wrong/alert2.jpg).
How about this on Chicago's Kennedy for the reversible express lanes?
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.891601,-87.6515832,3a,15y,310.91h,93.85t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sJUfVipKZBWHFDUEI1cccLQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656