AARoads Forum

Let me start off with Arkansas, we use a varying design (in terms of executeability), it is a butterfly style and I honestly think it's dated. I read a post on here about how our gantry design was stuck in the 80's, but to be honest I have seen the same design (referenced from photos) in other states to a degree (if not the same).

What is your favorite gantry assembly?

Do you like your state's setup or not?

Thanks!

Personally, I'm fond of Michigan's squared off ones: https://goo.gl/maps/twqXWu6H3Qn
Although, they sometimes use a heavier looking one: https://goo.gl/maps/HYQb2fB37Tv
And cantilevers: https://goo.gl/maps/SRXAGJRyejD2

IDOT's are fairly bland, IMHO: https://goo.gl/maps/Z6XocrvgDBC2
And cantilevers: https://goo.gl/maps/Px6ZLPVAUTn
Although, some parts of the state (especially District 1) used these in the 80s and 90s: https://goo.gl/maps/G3kVJt4BJo92
Cantilevers: https://goo.gl/maps/4CLfTkPr5hk

ISTHA uses a different, and better, IMHO, style: https://goo.gl/maps/8w8Aw75XtxR2
Although they use the IDOT style for some signs (due to length, I think): https://goo.gl/maps/6D4WiVkPMXF2
Cantilevers: https://goo.gl/maps/E4gy1VQ7gbE2

I have a liking for tubular assemblies. They seem way more modern than most states, but MoDOTs Silver Dollar City assemblies (https://www.google.com/maps/@36.6711233,-93.3351752,3a,75y,0.15h,94.89t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sRVh0VqHSJKrjpuXTTeztOA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656) heading to (and from) the location look nice. I will also never understand the overuse of doghouse assemblies on the MO 76 Strip in Branson, like, damn! Every intersection has them.

Oklahoma uses an almost caltrans-type gantry, however they are starting to use tubular mono-tube gantries. honestly, I don't like the new ones. I wish they would use more aesthetically pleasing gantries... or at least paint them...

Quote from: MCRoads on October 16, 2017, 10:09:18 AM
Oklahoma uses an almost caltrans-type gantry, however they are starting to use tubular mono-tube gantries. honestly, I don't like the new ones. I wish they would use more aesthetically pleasing gantries... or at least paint them...

I've seen Oklahoma use Arkansas' style closer to the border. But, Oklahoma's tubular style is cool, and most states tend to follow suite with California. Despite the state's debt, they tend to lead the way in transportation development and innovation (Hint: Botts' Dots). Most states now use Botts' Dots or a similar style with the same function.

With the exception of the Big Dig monotubes, which were a standardized design (purely for aesthetic reasons) that proved to be horribly expensive and (IMO) poorly designed in regards to actual sign loading, Massachusetts practice has always been to give fabricators only general design guidance, and leave the actual support style they use up to them.  The final design calculations and drawings are then reviewed and approved by either in-house engineers or the designer of record for a specific project.  Only then, are the structures released for actual fabrication.

This practice seems to have worked out well from both a cost and durability standpoint, as only two support structures (both cantilevers) installed during the current generation (1980s to present) of sign replacements have failed as a result of overstress due to weather (one was an anchor bolt failure during a blizzard, and the other took a direct hit from a tornado).

As with the last thread we had on this subject, it's a good idea to review the different types of truss, as not all trusses are the same:
(https://i.imgur.com/Dd81fg3.png)

(The image I used in the last thread died, so I had to make my own.)

Examples from the field:
(https://i.imgur.com/GBDrq9B.jpg)
Oklahoma, Pratt (although note modified Warren on top and sides)

(https://i.imgur.com/bDHRBQ7.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/WvwQpd4.jpg)
Kansas, box

(https://i.imgur.com/iJllqaV.jpg?1)
Illinois, modified Warren

(https://i.imgur.com/lmnbc2i.jpg?1)
Illinois, Vierendeel

Quote from: Scott5114 on October 17, 2017, 05:27:25 PM
As with the last thread we had on this subject, it's a good idea to review the different types of truss, as not all trusses are the same:
(https://i.imgur.com/Dd81fg3.png)

(The image I used in the last thread died, so I had to make my own.)

Examples from the field:
(https://i.imgur.com/GBDrq9B.jpg)
Oklahoma, Pratt (although note modified Warren on top and sides)

(https://i.imgur.com/bDHRBQ7.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/WvwQpd4.jpg)
Kansas, box

(https://i.imgur.com/iJllqaV.jpg?1)
Illinois, modified Warren

(https://i.imgur.com/lmnbc2i.jpg?1)
Illinois, Vierendeel

Arkansas also uses Howe on the I-430 bridge. But, thank you Scott for the reference! The point I was making, in regards to Arkansas, was that we seem to use either a variation between Box (in some fashion) and Howe (in another). To me both are dated.

Now for the opinion post: To me, a truss (of any design, but I like the KS box gantry most) is the best-looking option. The gantry has to be able to support the visual "weight" or the signs (note that this is not referring to supporting weight in the engineering sense, but the architectural design sense). In the example photos I posted, the Kansas one is the best example–the gantry's vertical height is proportionate to what you'd expect would be "needed" to support a sign panel of that size. The Oklahoma and Illinois ones are so deep that they overpower the sign panels and feel like overkill (and Oklahoma's newest trusses are even taller). On the other hand, monotubes are so thin that they feel too flimsy to hold up most average-sized panels (although I know there's engineering rigor that proves that they're not).

Here's an example of a Texas Pratt truss that almost feels too small for what it's holding up:
(https://i.imgur.com/eNUfZZY.jpg)

I-430 Bridge Ganry, Pratt or Howe origins? (https://www.google.com/maps/@34.7967243,-92.3830249,3a,41.1y,242.06h,91.52t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s2RYFqJjojqAc0P_UCn2lXQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656)

Looks like Pratt to me.

I believe Colorado's older trusses and cantilevers are all Pratts.  Most newer trusses and cantilever replacements are monotubes.

WSDOT exclusively utilises a box-monotube gantry, like the one pictured below. This design is used for both partial- and full-width gantries. Often, the gantries are painted to match surroundings (like guardrails sometimes are). Brown, dark green and black are the most common colors besides unpainted, although the 705 in Tacoma has some painted a sort of peach color.

(https://i.imgur.com/p8f8jcd.png)

Formerly, the box truss was used for full-width gantries, and a narrow version with a single up-right mast was used for partial-width gantries. There are also gantries in Clark County (Vancouver) that are the traditional curved monotube design, but they weren't used for very long, and AFAICT were only used there.

Quote from: roadman on October 16, 2017, 10:39:50 AM
With the exception of the Big Dig monotubes, which were a standardized design (purely for aesthetic reasons) that proved to be horribly expensive and (IMO) poorly designed in regards to actual sign loading, Massachusetts practice has always been to give fabricators only general design guidance, and leave the actual support style they use up to them.  The final design calculations and drawings are then reviewed and approved by either in-house engineers or the designer of record for a specific project.  Only then, are the structures released for actual fabrication.

This practice seems to have worked out well from both a cost and durability standpoint, as only two support structures (both cantilevers) installed during the current generation (1980s to present) of sign replacements have failed as a result of overstress due to weather (one was an anchor bolt failure during a blizzard, and the other took a direct hit from a tornado).

On some recent installations; I've noticed three two-panel per cantilevered gantry setups: Two along I-95/MA 128 (southbound in Burlington at Exits 3B-A & northbound at Exits 19A-B-C in Needham), the other along I-90/Mass Pike westbound in Springfield (at Exit 4) which features a single pipe/tube cantilever.

Quote from: jakeroot on October 18, 2017, 12:48:42 AM
WSDOT exclusively utilises a box-monotube gantry, like the one pictured below. This design is used for both partial- and full-width gantries. Often, the gantries are painted to match surroundings (like guardrails sometimes are). Brown, dark green and black are the most common colors besides unpainted, although the 705 in Tacoma has some painted a sort of peach color.

(https://i.imgur.com/p8f8jcd.png)

Formerly, the box truss was used for full-width gantries, and a narrow version with a single up-right mast was used for partial-width gantries. There are also gantries in Clark County (Vancouver) that are the traditional curved monotube design, but they weren't used for very long, and AFAICT were only used there.

see, if only OK would paint the gantries, then they would look good [better_{(ok, maybe not that much better, but its a start)}]!




Off topic!

WOW! are those vmses? do they display in color? are other citys doing this "German autobahn" type thing?

Quote from: Scott5114 on October 17, 2017, 05:27:25 PM
As with the last thread we had on this subject, it's a good idea to review the different types of truss, as not all trusses are the same:
(https://i.imgur.com/Dd81fg3.png)

(The image I used in the last thread died, so I had to make my own.)

Examples from the field:
(https://i.imgur.com/iJllqaV.jpg?1)
Illinois, modified Warren

(https://i.imgur.com/lmnbc2i.jpg?1)
Illinois, Vierendeel

IDOT uses the above.  ISTHA tends to prefer a triangular Warren truss.

The Chicago Skyway (for some reason) uses Monotubes.

Quote from: MCRoads on October 18, 2017, 09:50:45 AM

Quote from: jakeroot on October 18, 2017, 12:48:42 AM
WSDOT exclusively utilises a box-monotube gantry, like the one pictured below. This design is used for both partial- and full-width gantries. Often, the gantries are painted to match surroundings (like guardrails sometimes are). Brown, dark green and black are the most common colors besides unpainted, although the 705 in Tacoma has some painted a sort of peach color.

(https://i.imgur.com/p8f8jcd.png)

Formerly, the box truss was used for full-width gantries, and a narrow version with a single up-right mast was used for partial-width gantries. There are also gantries in Clark County (Vancouver) that are the traditional curved monotube design, but they weren't used for very long, and AFAICT were only used there.

see, if only OK would paint the gantries, then they would look good [better_{(ok, maybe not that much better, but its a start)}]!




Off topic!

WOW! are those vmses? do they display in color? are other citys doing this "German autobahn" type thing?

ISTHA is using them along the Northwest/Jane Addams Tollway (I-90) from Elgin to O'Hare.

You can see one on Google Street View here, while the road was under construction: https://goo.gl/maps/e43zATjZkr22

Update (ISTHA's website was down this morning for some reason): https://www.illinoistollway.com/documents/20184/582259/SmartRoad+One+Pager.pdf/102f501d-e64b-4f80-8797-ecbb98a241c8
There's a far better photo at the top of the PDF showing the Smart Road gantry on I-90.

Quote from: TheArkansasRoadgeek on October 17, 2017, 06:06:58 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/iJllqaV.jpg?1)
Illinois, modified Warren

Those two signs could be a reality in North Little Rock (in some fashion). Now, whether it will be within my lifetime, that is to be determined... (Also I-49)

As a sidebar to this thread, which states have standard design plans for overhead sign supports/gantries, and which states allow the fabricators to choose the support/gantry design based on the span length/sign sizes/loading requirements/etc.?

MassDOT is generally in the latter category (if you don't count the Big Dig monotubes).

Quote from: roadman on October 18, 2017, 11:00:29 AM
As a sidebar to this thread, which states have standard design plans for overhead sign supports/gantries, and which states allow the fabricators to choose the support/gantry design based on the span length/sign sizes/loading requirements/etc.?

MassDOT is generally in the latter category (if you don't count the Big Dig monotubes).

IDOT*, MDOT (Michigan), and ISTHA are in the former category.  Every gantry is the same for them, regardless of where in the state it is.

*And that even includes the brown Vierendeel trusses IDOT used during the 1980s and 1990s.

Quote from: TheArkansasRoadgeek on October 15, 2017, 05:32:55 AM
What is your favorite gantry assembly?

Cantilevered monotube, followed by Kansas-style box truss.

Texas seems to be somewhat varied, with the El Paso District and some districts bordering New Mexico using monotubes as standard, but with other districts mostly using trusses (although monotubes are occasionally used).

Quote from: kphoger on October 18, 2017, 11:58:38 AM

Quote from: TheArkansasRoadgeek on October 15, 2017, 05:32:55 AM
What is your favorite gantry assembly?

Cantilevered monotube, followed by Kansas-style box truss.

I'm in agreement here–the monotube cantilever is sleek but doesn't feel "flimsy" like the full-width monotubes due to me. And there's something I find very aesthetically pleasing about the Kansas box truss in particular–it feels complex and industrial, but not overpoweringly so, for some reason. (That being said, Kansas's Howe cantilevers are pretty good too, and pair well with the box trusses. KDOT just hits the sweet spot for me on gantry design, I guess.)

Quote from: roadman on October 18, 2017, 11:00:29 AM
As a sidebar to this thread, which states have standard design plans for overhead sign supports/gantries, and which states allow the fabricators to choose the support/gantry design based on the span length/sign sizes/loading requirements/etc.?

MassDOT is generally in the latter category (if you don't count the Big Dig monotubes).

I think you'll find more states with standards than those that leave it up to the contractor. Most states I've been to have a standard design that can be identified throughout the state, with exceptions usually being limited to individual projects or regions.

Quote from: Scott5114 on October 17, 2017, 05:27:25 PM
(https://i.imgur.com/lmnbc2i.jpg?1)
Illinois, Vierendeel

I wonder if Baltimore copied this to make its own:
(https://www.aaroads.com/mid-atlantic/maryland083/i-083_nb_exit_008_04.jpg)

I have also seen that Chicago style posted here on I-95 in Philadelphia, and it was in extensive use in Charleston, WV, until a sign replacement project  claimed most of them. A few are still in use, but the brown metal mesh behind the signs that used to be used was removed.

Kentucky uses a unique style of side-mounted overhead, that I've heard some refer to as "erector set." I haven't seen this in any other state.

(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4408/36953368260_c3292fe5bf_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/YirEWY)2017 Tennessee eclipse trip Day 2 - 039 (https://flic.kr/p/YirEWY) by H.B. Elkins (https://www.flickr.com/photos/hbelkins/), on Flickr

(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/317/31934844362_274d01891b_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/QDYqCS)2016 East End Bridge Trip Day 1 - 211 (https://flic.kr/p/QDYqCS) by H.B. Elkins (https://www.flickr.com/photos/hbelkins/), on Flickr

Quote from: hbelkins on October 19, 2017, 10:37:33 AM

Kentucky uses a unique style of side-mounted overhead, that I've heard some refer to as "erector set." I haven't seen this in any other state.

(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4408/36953368260_c3292fe5bf_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/YirEWY)2017 Tennessee eclipse trip Day 2 - 039 (https://flic.kr/p/YirEWY) by H.B. Elkins (https://www.flickr.com/photos/hbelkins/), on Flickr

(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/317/31934844362_274d01891b_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/QDYqCS)2016 East End Bridge Trip Day 1 - 211 (https://flic.kr/p/QDYqCS) by H.B. Elkins (https://www.flickr.com/photos/hbelkins/), on Flickr

Multi-post cantilever upright.  Massachusetts allowed the use of a three post version of these in the 1960s and early to mid 1970s, particularly with aluminum structures.  The majority of these structures have since been replaced with single post upright/box truss horizontal cantilevers, but there are a few stragglers still in the field on the few sections of I-495 where signs haven't been recently updated.

Which brings up another sidebar question:  Are there any states that still allow the use of aluminum for sign structures/gantries?  Massachusetts discontinued the use of aluminum in 1974, except for projects that were in the construction phase.

Quote from: hbelkins on October 19, 2017, 10:37:33 AM
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4408/36953368260_c3292fe5bf_c.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/YirEWY)2017 Tennessee eclipse trip Day 2 - 039 (https://flic.kr/p/YirEWY) by H.B. Elkins (https://www.flickr.com/photos/hbelkins/), on Flickr

Is that a "mumble" strip (Sinusidal Strip)? Not to be confused with its counterpart the rumble strip.

^^^

It's a sawed-in (as opposed to rolled-in) rumble strip.

Quote from: hbelkins on October 19, 2017, 11:18:13 AM
^^^

It's a sawed-in (as opposed to rolled-in) rumble strip.

Sounds laborious!

I like my state's setup. It mostly has Clearview.

Quote from: epzik8 on October 19, 2017, 12:16:19 PM
I like my state's setup. It mostly has Clearview.

(https://m.popkey.co/737465/w6yRN.gif)

Quote from: jakeroot on October 19, 2017, 02:19:41 PM

Quote from: epzik8 on October 19, 2017, 12:16:19 PM
I like my state's setup. It mostly has Clearview.

(https://m.popkey.co/737465/w6yRN.gif)

:no: Gross Clearview!

Quote from: epzik8 on October 19, 2017, 12:16:19 PM
I like my state's setup. It mostly has Clearview.

Unfortunately, the font on the signs has little to do with the style of structure/gantry a particular state uses to hold those signs up.

Quote from: hbelkins on October 19, 2017, 10:37:33 AM
Kentucky uses a unique style of side-mounted overhead, that I've heard some refer to as "erector set." I haven't seen this in any other state.

KY is the only place I've seen them.  I always thought KY had the most consistent design for their overheads  (granted, I've only personally been from Cincy to Louisville via I-71, and what I've seen in pictures on this site).  All of the "Side-Mounted" look like the ones posted, and the full overheads all have the same design, just changed for size/length requirements.

For the record, the PA Turnpike/I-95 project seems to be making use of monotubes.
(https://www.patpconstruction.com/paturnpikei95/images/progress_photos/d1e_279.jpg)
Not sure if they will be both on the pike and I-95 (or the soon-to-renamed I-295), though. 

Full link here: https://www.patpconstruction.com/paturnpikei95/current-sectiond10.aspx (https://www.patpconstruction.com/paturnpikei95/current-sectiond10.aspx)

North Carolina now uses pretty beefy pole/truss assemblies.
<iframe width="640" height="360" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/nMkieZw_2JM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

They also are increasing use of raised pedestal signs on shoulder without cantilever, I'm ambivalent for now on that.

Georgia uses a full sign bridge spanning across highway even for one small sign. It looks ridiculous, they're unwilling to go out and inspect bolts every couple of years for cantilevered signs (which I think are elegant ), therefore they don't do any cantilevers whatsoever anymore.

I-85 through Gwinnett has about 70 full sign bridges, maximizing visual clutter and ugliness for what was once a decent looking highway.

Quote from: Mr_Northside on October 19, 2017, 04:12:44 PM

Quote from: hbelkins on October 19, 2017, 10:37:33 AM
Kentucky uses a unique style of side-mounted overhead, that I've heard some refer to as "erector set." I haven't seen this in any other state.

KY is the only place I've seen them.  I always thought KY had the most consistent design for their overheads  (granted, I've only personally been from Cincy to Louisville via I-71, and what I've seen in pictures on this site).  All of the "Side-Mounted" look like the ones posted, and the full overheads all have the same design, just changed for size/length requirements.

Yes, Kentucky is consistent. The below is in Kentucky, but it's easy to tell that it's a Tennessee installation.

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.millenniumhwy.net%2FJune_2006_Day_2%2FJune_2006_Day_2-Images%2F83.jpg&hash=6fbdb05e0c9407968e47440ad9a7389e710e63f4)

Because not too far away, well within the Volunteer State, you have this...

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.millenniumhwy.net%2FJune_2006_Day_2%2FJune_2006_Day_2-Images%2F74.jpg&hash=01edd880aa88b04ef9851665c65cef726362aba6)

Quote from: roadman on October 19, 2017, 10:53:37 AMWhich brings up another sidebar question:  Are there any states that still allow the use of aluminum for sign structures/gantries?  Massachusetts discontinued the use of aluminum in 1974, except for projects that were in the construction phase.

Kansas DOT has allowed aluminum sign structures in recent contracts.  I think it may also have standard plan sheets for them, though I haven't checked recently.

The dominant gantry style in California is the Pratt truss.  Unlike ones pictured earlier, California's trusses use a single pole (or poles for full-width gantries) to support the truss...

and some are painted...

California also uses monopoles (a.k.a. Tubular) which are almost always painted...

The final gantry style used in California is called the "Box-Beam".  It's basically a Pratt truss that's been wrapped in a metal sheeting.  While this is the most aesthetic, it was removed from Caltrans' Standard Plans in the early 2000's but many of them are still in use today.  These gantries are always painted and have been seen in mint green, dark green, reddish-brown and tan.

Quote from: roadman on October 18, 2017, 11:00:29 AM
As a sidebar to this thread, which states have standard design plans for overhead sign supports/gantries, and which states allow the fabricators to choose the support/gantry design based on the span length/sign sizes/loading requirements/etc.?

Caltrans has standard design plans for all overhead gantries including mounting signs from overpasses.

Nevada is similar to California.


The Pratt truss is the dominant style used throughout the state, and what you'll find in the NDOT's standard plans document.

There are a few Warren trusses used in older, light-duty sign applications (mostly on roads, but there is a pair of these on US 395 over Moana Lane in Reno)–I believe these are still seen in the standard plans, but I have not seen a new installation of this type in the last 15+ years.

NDOT used unpainted monotubes throughout the I-80 reconstruction in Reno-Sparks a few years ago. Monotubes are not in the standard plans AFAIK. I believe monotubes were used on this project because a unified design aesthetic was desired and the standard Pratt truss might not have been able to accommodate the APL signs at the US 395 interchange.

Quote from: roadfro on October 21, 2017, 04:19:52 PM
There are a few Warren trusses used in older, light-duty sign applications (mostly on roads, but there is a pair of these on US 395 over Moana Lane in Reno)–I believe these are still seen in the standard plans, but I have not seen a new installation of this type in the last 15+ years.

These types of trusses are used in California too.  Caltrans calls them "lightweight" trusses.  Current standards state that only small warning signs (i.e. "Signal Ahead") or extinguishable message signs (i.e. "Meter On" or "Prepare to Stop") along with flashing beacons are allowed to be mounted on these trusses.  For example...


However, at one point Caltrans allowed small guide signs to be mounted on these trusses.  There are a few examples of that scattered throughout the state and here is one of them...

Arizona once used Pratt truss, but now uses monotubes.  Some older portions of the Phoenix area freeway system still have some of the truss gantries intact.

Quote from: Pink Jazz on October 21, 2017, 05:26:20 PM
Arizona once used Pratt truss, but now uses monotubes.  Some older portions of the Phoenix area freeway system still have some of the truss gantries intact.

I've always seen Arizona as a monotube state, same as California. I don't know.... Movies?

Quote from: TheArkansasRoadgeek on October 21, 2017, 09:15:06 PM

Quote from: Pink Jazz on October 21, 2017, 05:26:20 PM
Arizona once used Pratt truss, but now uses monotubes.  Some older portions of the Phoenix area freeway system still have some of the truss gantries intact.

I've always seen Arizona as a monotube state, same as California. I don't know.... Movies?

There are still plenty of trusses on many of the older freeways in the Phoenix area. I don't recall seeing many trusses in the rural areas of the state though.  They are still very common on I-10 and SR 143 in the Phoenix area, with a small number still on I-17 and US 60; most of those surviving on the latter being full-widths (I think the one-sided ones were replaced by monotubes in a construction project in the early 2000s), although some one-sided trusses still survive east of Loop 202.

Quote from: lepidopteran on October 19, 2017, 04:19:55 PM
For the record, the PA Turnpike/I-95 project seems to be making use of monotubes.
(https://www.patpconstruction.com/paturnpikei95/images/progress_photos/d1e_279.jpg)
Not sure if they will be both on the pike and I-95 (or the soon-to-renamed I-295), though. 

Full link here: https://www.patpconstruction.com/paturnpikei95/current-sectiond10.aspx (https://www.patpconstruction.com/paturnpikei95/current-sectiond10.aspx)

Both PennDOT and PTC have gone monotubes lately. All of their recent projects have used them.

Also good see that PTC has dumped Clearview.

Quote from: ekt8750 on October 22, 2017, 06:56:52 PM

Quote from: lepidopteran on October 19, 2017, 04:19:55 PM
For the record, the PA Turnpike/I-95 project seems to be making use of monotubes.
(https://www.patpconstruction.com/paturnpikei95/images/progress_photos/d1e_279.jpg)
Not sure if they will be both on the pike and I-95 (or the soon-to-renamed I-295), though. 

Full link here: https://www.patpconstruction.com/paturnpikei95/current-sectiond10.aspx (https://www.patpconstruction.com/paturnpikei95/current-sectiond10.aspx)

Both PennDOT and PTC have gone monotubes lately. All of their recent projects have used them.

Also good see that PTC has dumped Clearview.

Everyone has dumped Clearview. Its not permitted anymore.

Quote from: jeffandnicole on October 22, 2017, 07:47:20 PM

Everyone has dumped Clearview. Its not permitted anymore.

What about Texas?  Texas is the state that has been the most vocal on challenging the FHWA's decision, and several new Clearview signs have gone up well after the decision was announced.

AFAIK, Clearview is allowed on all signage that was approved before the date of revocation, not necessarily installed. Which is why new signs still pop up.

Quote from: ekt8750 on October 22, 2017, 06:56:52 PM

Quote from: lepidopteran on October 19, 2017, 04:19:55 PM
For the record, the PA Turnpike/I-95 project seems to be making use of monotubes.
(https://www.patpconstruction.com/paturnpikei95/images/progress_photos/d1e_279.jpg)
Not sure if they will be both on the pike and I-95 (or the soon-to-renamed I-295), though. 

Full link here: https://www.patpconstruction.com/paturnpikei95/current-sectiond10.aspx (https://www.patpconstruction.com/paturnpikei95/current-sectiond10.aspx)

Both PennDOT and PTC have gone monotubes lately. All of their recent projects have used them.

Also good see that PTC has dumped Clearview.

What's with the severe alignment with the sign to the right? They didn't even try to algin the top edges! :banghead:

Quote from: TheArkansasRoadgeek on October 22, 2017, 08:43:50 PM

Quote from: lepidopteran on October 19, 2017, 04:19:55 PM
For the record, the PA Turnpike/I-95 project seems to be making use of monotubes.

https://www.patpconstruction.com/paturnpikei95/images/progress_photos/d1e_279.jpg

What's with the severe alignment with the sign to the right? They didn't even try to algin the top edges! :banghead:

Sign on the left isn't finished yet. Will align properly soon enough.

Quote from: myosh_tino on October 21, 2017, 01:48:14 PM
The final gantry style used in California is called the "Box-Beam".  It's basically a Pratt truss that's been wrapped in a metal sheeting.  While this is the most aesthetic, it was removed from Caltrans' Standard Plans in the early 2000's but many of them are still in use today.  These gantries are always painted and have been seen in mint green, dark green, reddish-brown and tan.

(https://www.aaroads.com/california/images280/i-280_sb_exit_005b_00a.jpg)

(https://www.aaroads.com/california/images085/ca-085_nb_exit_016_05.jpg)

Three other U.S. states utilize "Box-Beam" gantry in some of their overhead sign installations.

Hawaii:
<iframe src="https://www.google.com/maps/embed?pb=!1m0!4v1508726369885!6m8!1m7!1sGMskvYpibDmwQnBXqvId1A!2m2!1d21.33261709804911!2d-157.889692492098!3f296.0293767838921!4f1.4964597840133678!5f2.7551508706423364" width="600" height="450" frameborder="0" style="border:0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Virgina:
<iframe src="https://www.google.com/maps/embed?pb=!1m0!4v1508726028995!6m8!1m7!1sTXqWSoFawAJokOMB_emDEw!2m2!1d38.93122609105566!2d-77.19992496432067!3f249.78641214994204!4f6.754250273193449!5f3.1418696762068836" width="600" height="450" frameborder="0" style="border:0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Wyoming:
<iframe src="https://www.google.com/maps/embed?pb=!1m0!4v1508726287786!6m8!1m7!1s_2hiM5-PXKex-mig3Xhy1w!2m2!1d44.83276897673437!2d-106.9622689101092!3f131.71614332832098!4f1.1900643646526134!5f1.7431718349436869" width="600" height="450" frameborder="0" style="border:0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Quote from: hbelkins on October 19, 2017, 11:18:13 AM
^^^

It's a sawed-in (as opposed to rolled-in) rumble strip.

I meant to ask, if it is sawed-in vs. rolled-in, does it have the same visual characteristics as if it were rolled-in?

Quote from: jeffandnicole on October 22, 2017, 07:47:20 PM

Quote from: ekt8750 on October 22, 2017, 06:56:52 PM
Also good see that PTC has dumped Clearview.

Everyone has dumped Clearview. Its not permitted anymore.

But notice that the W in WEST is larger than the other letters.  Wasn't that introduced with Clearview?

Utah currently exclusively installs monotubes. If the signs aren't too big, Utah will typically install something like this (https://goo.gl/maps/m7WaHafbE1H2).

This (https://goo.gl/maps/3fjRsDtwEzv) is the typical design for when the signs are too tall for the first option.

There used to be several of what look to be Pratt truss gantries in the area of the 80/215/Foothill interchange in eastern Salt Lake City, such as this one (https://goo.gl/maps/cecGjNrZbWS2). All were replaced this summer as part of a resigning project. As far as I know, there are only five truss gantries still standing in Utah. There's one on each approach to the I-15/I-70 junction at Cove Fort, and then there's a pair on I-15 at the SR 56 exit in Cedar City.

Quote from: lepidopteran on October 22, 2017, 11:48:09 PM

Quote from: jeffandnicole on October 22, 2017, 07:47:20 PM

Quote from: ekt8750 on October 22, 2017, 06:56:52 PM
Also good see that PTC has dumped Clearview.

Everyone has dumped Clearview. Its not permitted anymore.

But notice that the W in WEST is larger than the other letters.  Wasn't that introduced with Clearview?

No, that was introduced in the 2003 MUTCD. It just so happened that a few years after that was both when that version of the MUTCD was being picked up by DOTs and also when Clearview was being experimented with.

Quote from: Scott5114 on October 23, 2017, 04:21:19 AM

Quote from: lepidopteran on October 22, 2017, 11:48:09 PM

Quote from: jeffandnicole on October 22, 2017, 07:47:20 PM

Quote from: ekt8750 on October 22, 2017, 06:56:52 PM
Also good see that PTC has dumped Clearview.

Everyone has dumped Clearview. Its not permitted anymore.

But notice that the W in WEST is larger than the other letters.  Wasn't that introduced with Clearview?

No, that was introduced in the 2003 MUTCD. It just so happened that a few years after that was both when that version of the MUTCD was being picked up by DOTs and also when Clearview was being experimented with.

The elongated initial letter for cardinal direction words requirement was originally issued by FHWA in 1993.  It first appeared as a requirement in the 2000 MUTCD, not 2003.

Quote from: roadguy2 on October 23, 2017, 12:35:38 AM
Utah currently exclusively installs monotubes. If the signs aren't too big, Utah will typically install something like this (https://goo.gl/maps/m7WaHafbE1H2).

This (https://goo.gl/maps/3fjRsDtwEzv) is the typical design for when the signs are too tall for the first option.

There used to be several of what look to be Pratt truss gantries in the area of the 80/215/Foothill interchange in eastern Salt Lake City, such as this one (https://goo.gl/maps/cecGjNrZbWS2). All were replaced this summer as part of a resigning project. The only remaining truss gantries in Utah that I'm aware of are at the I-15/I-70 junction at Cove Fort.

I think New Mexico does something similar.

Quote from: roadman on October 23, 2017, 12:25:24 PM
The elongated initial letter for cardinal direction words requirement was originally issued by FHWA in 1993.  It first appeared as a requirement in the 2000 MUTCD, not 2003.

And I first saw it in the field (in Kansas) a full two years earlier, in 1991.

Quote from: TheArkansasRoadgeek on October 22, 2017, 10:56:55 PM

Quote from: hbelkins on October 19, 2017, 11:18:13 AM
^^^

It's a sawed-in (as opposed to rolled-in) rumble strip.

I meant to ask, if it is sawed-in vs. rolled-in, does it have the same visual characteristics as if it were rolled-in?

No. Sawed-in is much wider and deeper.

Quote from: hbelkins on October 23, 2017, 01:36:04 PM

Quote from: roadman on October 23, 2017, 12:25:24 PM
The elongated initial letter for cardinal direction words requirement was originally issued by FHWA in 1993.  It first appeared as a requirement in the 2000 MUTCD, not 2003.

And I first saw it in the field (in Kansas) a full two years earlier, in 1991.

Some then-new PennDOT signs along I-95 & 476 also had such circa 1991.

Quote from: hbelkins on October 23, 2017, 01:36:04 PM

Quote from: roadman on October 23, 2017, 12:25:24 PM
The elongated initial letter for cardinal direction words requirement was originally issued by FHWA in 1993.  It first appeared as a requirement in the 2000 MUTCD, not 2003.

And I first saw it in the field (in Kansas) a full two years earlier, in 1991

The 1993 FHWA directive referenced Kansas, and how they had started the practice in the late 1980s.

Quote from: myosh_tino on October 21, 2017, 01:48:14 PM
The final gantry style used in California is called the "Box-Beam".  It's basically a Pratt truss that's been wrapped in a metal sheeting.  While this is the most aesthetic, it was removed from Caltrans' Standard Plans in the early 2000's but many of them are still in use today.  These gantries are always painted and have been seen in mint green, dark green, reddish-brown and tan.

(https://www.aaroads.com/california/images280/i-280_sb_exit_005b_00a.jpg)

(https://www.aaroads.com/california/images085/ca-085_nb_exit_016_05.jpg)

My apologies for the bad links.  Here are some workable links of the locations.

Hawaii:
https://goo.gl/maps/djRu7j9PyX12

Virginia:
https://goo.gl/maps/prrVsPFLpDG2

Wyoming:
https://goo.gl/maps/u9ubEVrqoS52

Quote from: FreewayDan on October 23, 2017, 10:39:39 PM
My apologies for the bad links.  Here are some workable links of the locations.

Hawaii:
https://goo.gl/maps/djRu7j9PyX12

Virginia:
https://goo.gl/maps/prrVsPFLpDG2

Wyoming:
https://goo.gl/maps/u9ubEVrqoS52

I was able to access them just fine (the original links)!
Great photos! The quality is as if they were taken a while ago.

Quote from: TheArkansasRoadgeek on October 23, 2017, 11:01:21 PM

Quote from: FreewayDan on October 23, 2017, 10:39:39 PM
My apologies for the bad links.  Here are some workable links of the locations.

Hawaii:
https://goo.gl/maps/djRu7j9PyX12

Virginia:
https://goo.gl/maps/prrVsPFLpDG2

Wyoming:
https://goo.gl/maps/u9ubEVrqoS52

I was able to access them just fine (the original links)!
Great photos! The quality is as if they were taken a while ago.

You do know the "photos" are just Street View links right? :-D

NORTH CAROLINA SUPPORT STRUCTURES

(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4460/37776796562_f913a8e4d4_k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/ZycXuE)BEA99614-BD17-452A-9C26-F1C771BC5E4A (https://flic.kr/p/ZycXuE) by Stephen Edwards (https://www.flickr.com/photos/151506681@N05/), on Flickr
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4492/37157164274_8bb56eb4ce_k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/YBsbpm)8A74106B-30FB-4D43-987E-CB780EBAA75C (https://flic.kr/p/YBsbpm) by Stephen Edwards (https://www.flickr.com/photos/151506681@N05/), on Flickr

Quote from: architect77 on October 24, 2017, 05:37:08 AM
NORTH CAROLINA SUPPORT STRUCTURES

THANKS

Quote from: Pink Jazz on October 21, 2017, 09:35:32 PM

Quote from: TheArkansasRoadgeek on October 21, 2017, 09:15:06 PM

Quote from: Pink Jazz on October 21, 2017, 05:26:20 PM
Arizona once used Pratt truss, but now uses monotubes.  Some older portions of the Phoenix area freeway system still have some of the truss gantries intact.

I've always seen Arizona as a monotube state, same as California. I don't know.... Movies?

There are still plenty of trusses on many of the older freeways in the Phoenix area. I don't recall seeing many trusses in the rural areas of the state though.  They are still very common on I-10 and SR 143 in the Phoenix area, with a small number still on I-17 and US 60; most of those surviving on the latter being full-widths (I think the one-sided ones were replaced by monotubes in a construction project in the early 2000s), although some one-sided trusses still survive east of Loop 202.

New Mexico uses monotubes statewide, but in the past they used trusses.   In fact, older stretches of I-25 and I-40 in Albuquerque used to have Pratt trusses, and they were exactly the same as the ones dominant in California and Nevada.  The stretch of I-25 from Lead/Coal to Gibson used to have trusses but were replaced with monotubes, despite the stretch has yet to be reconstructed.  As I mentioned, I-40 also had them, but now only uses monotubes as the entire stretch through Albuquerque has been upgraded to modern-day interstate standards (the last project was widening the freeway from 6 to 8-10 lanes between Carlisle and Louisiana and rebuilding the interchange with San Mateo Blvd., which wrapped up in late 2009).

Ohio mainly use truss gantries.

From what it seems like based on the diagram upthread (correct me if I'm wrong)...
Older ones are Box trusses (https://www.google.com/maps/@39.2835064,-84.4407713,3a,75y,199.28h,98.65t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sjkgQ89KFtFOvOHUFCNMpNw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192).
Newer ones are Warren trusses (https://www.google.com/maps/@39.1932119,-84.3850605,3a,65.4y,238.71h,98.07t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s4-mmQ0eW5r_vmsKfXahQMg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192).
A lot of the box trusses are getting replaced with Warren ones in recent years.

The side gantries in the state look like this (https://www.google.com/maps/@39.2032085,-84.3732484,3a,29.5y,346.02h,97.01t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s_dQ-40LMctnb8z6AZ3m56A!2e0!7i16384!8i8192), which I don't know the name of.

There are also some other gantry types in the state that are only used at one-off municipalities, like Monotubes  (https://www.google.com/maps/@41.672698,-83.5726071,3a,75y,167.73h,97.12t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sQ7v21k_oU6Sfb4e6CLrBOw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)in Downtown Toledo and Vierendeel (https://www.google.com/maps/@39.0978213,-84.5176852,3a,73y,124.15h,88.82t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1ssPz27_NNFDGF5kmC5Bbn0g!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) on Fort Washington Way in Downtown Cincinnati.

Quote from: SkyPesos on March 24, 2021, 11:18:00 PM
The side gantries in the state look like this (https://www.google.com/maps/@39.2032085,-84.3732484,3a,29.5y,346.02h,97.01t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s_dQ-40LMctnb8z6AZ3m56A!2e0!7i16384!8i8192), which I don't know the name of.

That's a Pratt truss.

Quote from: SkyPesos on March 24, 2021, 11:18:00 PM
... which I don't know the name of.

Check out this thread (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=19784.0) for good info.

Quote from: Pink Jazz on October 23, 2017, 12:48:18 PM

Quote from: roadguy2 on October 23, 2017, 12:35:38 AM
Utah currently exclusively installs monotubes. If the signs aren't too big, Utah will typically install something like this (https://goo.gl/maps/m7WaHafbE1H2).

This (https://goo.gl/maps/3fjRsDtwEzv) is the typical design for when the signs are too tall for the first option.

There used to be several of what look to be Pratt truss gantries in the area of the 80/215/Foothill interchange in eastern Salt Lake City, such as this one (https://goo.gl/maps/cecGjNrZbWS2). All were replaced this summer as part of a resigning project. The only remaining truss gantries in Utah that I'm aware of are at the I-15/I-70 junction at Cove Fort.

I think New Mexico does something similar.

New Mexico only did that along I-25 and I-40 in Albuquerque when the Big I was rebuilt. 

(https://live.staticflickr.com/8335/8084471352_4f367bc77c_k.jpg) Typical PennDOT..
(https://live.staticflickr.com/1972/45037544551_bb8987a8a2_k.jpg) Missouri gantries single poles.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/54480415@N08/48009424443
Texas varies, but urban areas seem to use different types of concrete supports.
(https://www.flickr.com/photos/54480415@N08/48009424443)
(https://www.flickr.com/photos/54480415@N08/48009424443/)
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/48009424443_27d5a61774_k.jpg)

MoDOT's single-pole gantries reminds me of what is used in California.

Actually, it's the other way around because I've been in Missouri first  :D

I have always liked what Wisconsin does for gantries especially the new ones in Milwaukee.
Side gantries: https://www.google.com/maps/@42.5175995,-87.9515513,3a,75y,16.49h,103.04t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1soNXIJDvlIhYdMzQfZlfsCQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?hl=en
Full gantries:
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.5615552,-87.9523471,3a,75y,352.48h,95.97t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sb_ZUYvBCXBEY-5YL6QaTDA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?hl=en
Older Median gantries:
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.9626148,-87.9978301,3a,75y,234.53h,103.47t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sgLvQfNtBVvcRz6YWrV8BzQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?hl=en
Newer Milwaukee style:
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.932279,-87.9350832,3a,75y,7.19h,92.24t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s9NcrVfcET9-q8ORdOF8k5A!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?hl=en
Newer Median gantries:
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.9333481,-87.9350713,3a,75y,353.06h,100.51t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sugm3pFVZU0ouFWhhB25-NQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?hl=en

Minnesota has kept it nice and simple over the years. Like many states at the dawn of the interstate age MNDOT used howe gantries. Many of these are still in use today, especially in Minneapolis/Saint Paul and Duluth, though they become less and less common with each passing year. That design was scrapped in the early 1980s, though they briefly made a resurgence about ten years ago during MNDOT's intelligent traffic lane management project in Minneapolis that wound up flopping.
From the 1980s onward, it's been warren all the way! I really like MNDOT's gantry design- it's clean and doesn't seem overly flimsy or overly thick/overbuilt. Unlike some other states, both full-width and side-mounted gantries use the same design.

From what I can figure, these are the only six standard MNDOT gantry designs that have ever been used:
1980s full-width warren (despite the age this design is still current, like I mentioned above) (https://goo.gl/maps/HqqBHxyhZ22n5qNZ7)
Early 2010s side-mount warren (current design)  (https://goo.gl/maps/XdEiMyJYo3kaAnR67)
1960s "big" full-width howe  (https://goo.gl/maps/KkTtKoeHVidbYZRx8)
1960s "little" side-mount howe (https://goo.gl/maps/9DcVHv8WVMPLJsix5)
1970s "big" side-mount howe  (https://goo.gl/maps/8AfjBHXHw7x2wLY77)
early 2010s howe installed as part of the intelligent lanes project (https://goo.gl/maps/zxs5mChqH3mywPdn8)

Quote from: TheArkansasRoadgeek on October 16, 2017, 10:20:57 AM

Quote from: MCRoads on October 16, 2017, 10:09:18 AM
Oklahoma uses an almost caltrans-type gantry, however they are starting to use tubular mono-tube gantries. honestly, I don't like the new ones. I wish they would use more aesthetically pleasing gantries... or at least paint them...

I've seen Oklahoma use Arkansas' style closer to the border. But, Oklahoma's tubular style is cool, and most states tend to follow suite with California. Despite the state's debt, they tend to lead the way in transportation development and innovation (Hint: Botts' Dots). Most states now use Botts' Dots or a similar style with the same function.

California has not led the way in transportation development for decades, there was certainly a time when that was true, but the only leadership CA has provided lately has been how NOT to get anything done.
Texas has led the way with many designs and innovations especially where roads are concerned. Super 2, Texas U turn, actually building roads rather than demolishing them, the list goes on. Even rail is arguably better a domain of TX, their high speed rail, if it comes to fruition, will be a much better model than CA.
Not that I am happy to see CA in such straights though, its sad.

Quote from: EpicRoadways on March 29, 2021, 07:39:16 PM
Minnesota has kept it nice and simple over the years. Like many states at the dawn of the interstate age MNDOT used howe gantries.

Those are actually Pratt trusses, not Howe. (Pratt trusses have the opposing diagonals meet at the bottom-center of the truss, while Howe trusses have them meet at the top-center.)

Quote from: Scott5114 on March 30, 2021, 12:59:44 AM

Quote from: EpicRoadways on March 29, 2021, 07:39:16 PM
Minnesota has kept it nice and simple over the years. Like many states at the dawn of the interstate age MNDOT used howe gantries.

Those are actually Pratt trusses, not Howe. (Pratt trusses have the opposing diagonals meet at the bottom-center of the truss, while Howe trusses have them meet at the top-center.)

Sorry Scott. :)

https://youtu.be/sTDENzpW7tw

Ontario uses a few gantry types, and I'm not well versed in gantries so I don't know what their names are, so if you do, please let me know.

Here is a picture with a side-span as well as a full-span, and these appear to be the most common ones and also the current standard of gantry:
(https://i.imgur.com/19K6OFK.png)

These two styles are being phased out from my understanding, and the one with the 407 ETR signs have largely disappeared from Ontario-maintained freeways.

Older:
(https://i.imgur.com/CRXSsOe.png)

Oldest:
(https://i.imgur.com/r5o3KA8.png)

These are common in IL.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/749/31873618753_2b87ab8a69_5k.jpg)
The poles are above the truss and seem to lean on each other with a connector beam.

Kentucky is the only state I know of that uses this style. I've heard it called "Erector set."

(https://live.staticflickr.com/4313/35530448480_dce0423794_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/W8GQtj)2017 Various KY pics Jan-June - 0033 (https://flic.kr/p/W8GQtj) by H.B. Elkins (https://www.flickr.com/photos/hbelkins/), on Flickr

Quote from: roadman65 on March 31, 2021, 12:05:51 PM
These are common in IL.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/749/31873618753_2b87ab8a69_5k.jpg)
The poles are above the truss and seem to lean on each other with a connector beam.

Kentucky uses this style as well.

My short time in Omaha, I noticed NEDOT doesn't have a particular design they stick to. I saw box, monotube, and a few others.

Quote from: Pink Jazz on October 21, 2017, 09:35:32 PM

Quote from: TheArkansasRoadgeek on October 21, 2017, 09:15:06 PM

Quote from: Pink Jazz on October 21, 2017, 05:26:20 PM
Arizona once used Pratt truss, but now uses monotubes.  Some older portions of the Phoenix area freeway system still have some of the truss gantries intact.

I've always seen Arizona as a monotube state, same as California. I don't know.... Movies?

There are still plenty of trusses on many of the older freeways in the Phoenix area. I don't recall seeing many trusses in the rural areas of the state though.  They are still very common on I-10 and SR 143 in the Phoenix area, with a small number still on I-17 and US 60; most of those surviving on the latter being full-widths (I think the one-sided ones were replaced by monotubes in a construction project in the early 2000s), although some one-sided trusses still survive east of Loop 202.

Arizona has a few interesting ones although most everything built within the last 20 - 25 years by ADOT itself is a monotube (the South Mountain Freeway supports were built by the partnership that built and maintains the road).

ADOT standard one sided truss:

SR 51: https://goo.gl/maps/19y2VNNtgYyufQkEA

I-17: https://goo.gl/maps/kXS2tudxHA1cAGx68

ADOT standard full width truss:

I-10: https://goo.gl/maps/kjepjMjf5MRiMoU37

I-17: https://goo.gl/maps/4SXB9DNMgB7AYS299

ADOT nonstandard one sided truss (used only on I-10 near the I-10 / I-17 stack):

I-10: https://goo.gl/maps/Wz1z9RS3tSWYVdJYA


ADOT nonstandard full width truss (used only on I-10 near the I-10 / I-17 stack):

I-10: https://goo.gl/maps/DB5uGUf4wo6Kg3Bv5

City of Phoenix installed one sided truss (used only on older portions of SR 51):

https://goo.gl/maps/D5W9kLHYHaU6N1hG8

https://goo.gl/maps/g1WaYZzbzYHCsgzp6

South Mountain freeway one sided truss (used only on Loop 202 South Mountain Freeway):

https://goo.gl/maps/n56PSXxmrmnPxBNj6

South Mountain freeway full width sign support (used only on Loop 202 South Mountain Freeway):

https://goo.gl/maps/8PqDkPSNUNiox4MD7