What road or stretch of road for that matter gave you white knuckles when you traveled it?
Here are a couple of my examples:
MA 2- The only part of MA 2 that gave me white knuckles was the Whitcomb Summit hairpins. That stretch was my first hairpin and I thought I was going to pass out. I had heard of the hairpin and knew it was the only way to get down into the Hoosic Valley and North Adams. If this traversal had been during the day I would have had a little less stress, but this was at around 10:30 at night and I was dying to get that clinch of 2.
MO 94- This is from one of my storm chasing trips. If anyone in St. Louis remembers the Good Friday Tornado of 2011, I was one of the first chasers to call in one of the tornadoes (the one that had mentioned "long tracks of trees") to the NWS in Weldon Spring and that was relayed to KMOX 1120. The stretch of MO 94 I'm about to refer to is in E. Saint Charles County. The ground is low and flat. Rain happens. Rain leads to flooding. Road closes, leading you into finding roads that you hope are open. Luckily for me I was able to break off of 94 at Portage Des Souix, go north on J and then cut over to this little place called Seeburger and cross 370 into higher territory. I believe I went 5-10 miles out of my way in a shallow arc. I saw some shit, let me tell you. Some roads became streams and were flooded about 10-12 inches. Drainage is poor out that way. Also, some of the locals will outright challenge you to try to cross the flooded roads. Potential Darwin Award right there. I tended to avoid chasing in that part of St. Charles County because of the road network: it looks good on paper but in reality the roads are so poorly maintained you'll want to stay out!
Kaiser Pass Road in the Sierras is definitely bad ass enough to get me sweating on it and more than a little nervous. After the first five miles it is just a single lane (and I mean single) with several large slopes on cliffs that require low gear. Basically the rule of thumb I go by is to roll my windows down and turn off anything that makes noise so I can hear. If I hear a noise off in the distance more than likely it is another car which means I need to stop. The drop from Kaiser Ridge is particularly brutal and requires someone to back up if traffic encounters each other. I don't think many people want to start backing up downhill on this:
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4313/35382964603_73cc6fc3d7_k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/VUEWDR)IMG_2657 (https://flic.kr/p/VUEWDR) by Max Rockatansky (https://www.flickr.com/photos/151828809@N08/), on Flickr
This past July I actually encountered a fire truck a little behind where I took this photo. I wasn't really in position to back up so I just wheeled as close to the cliff as I could and we managed to pass each other:
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4298/36020056332_ef88f71d03_k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/WSYcQ1)IMG_2719 (https://flic.kr/p/WSYcQ1) by Max Rockatansky (https://www.flickr.com/photos/151828809@N08/), on Flickr
US 550. It took me a couple days to convince myself to drive it, then immediately as Red Mountain Pass started I met two RVs travelling in the opposite direction which didn't ease my nerves.
Hard to say but probably Going to the Sun Road. Most won't understand unless you drive there.
A narrow, unnamed, one lane road that went to the peaks of Trinidad's Northern Range Mountains to service radio towers. My father was driving up the road, and decided that he was going to try and turn around, when he realized that road wasn't going anywhere, right next to a steep drop off. He proceeded to do this, and unknowingly nearly drove right off the damn road. Everyone in the car was screaming for him to stop, and fortunately, he did. He also drove the wrong way (this country drives on the right) multiple times, and my mother was not inclined to let him drive the car anymore.
US 221 below the blue ridge parkway between Linville and Blowing Rock NC. Super gnarly drive, lots of sharp corners and elevation change.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on January 27, 2018, 01:20:53 AM
US 550. It took me a couple days to convince myself to drive it, then immediately as Red Mountain Pass started I met two RVs travelling in the opposite direction which didn't ease my nerves.
CA 180 in Kings Canyon says hello:
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4160/34324060221_10bbcf8928_k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/Ui6MgK)IMG_6587 (https://flic.kr/p/Ui6MgK) by Max Rockatansky (https://www.flickr.com/photos/151828809@N08/), on Flickr
I'm assuming it was the section of US 550 immediately south of Ouray?
(https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3691/32900872006_58789672c1_k.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/S8kyZU)IMG_7142 (https://flic.kr/p/S8kyZU) by Max Rockatansky (https://www.flickr.com/photos/151828809@N08/), on Flickr
Quote from: Hurricane Rex on January 27, 2018, 02:56:46 AM
Hard to say but probably Going to the Sun Road. Most won't understand unless you drive there.
I have been there and don't understand what is scary about it.
Quote from: Rothman on January 27, 2018, 10:46:20 AM
Quote from: Hurricane Rex on January 27, 2018, 02:56:46 AM
Hard to say but probably Going to the Sun Road. Most won't understand unless you drive there.
I have been there and don't understand what is scary about it.
The reason why I think it is scary is because of a almost nonexistent guardrail with a 2000 foot plunge below and the people who are on it park in the median making it more unsafe. My parents started the term "tourons" for this purpose (and others.
LG-TP260
I-95 between DC and Richmond. Bumper-to-bumper traffic and people driving like idiots.
Quote from: hbelkins on January 27, 2018, 03:22:47 PM
I-95 between DC and Richmond. Bumper-to-bumper traffic and people driving like idiots.
And that's the irony... The busiest Interstates no matter how well built will always have way more dangers on them simply due to the volume of bad drivers. For all the mountain roads everyone has listed so far none of them will approach the fatality level of a good urban Freeway.
My two nominations:
I-90 in IL between Rockford and Elgin during the reconstruction work in 2013 and 2014. They had 2 9-foot wide lanes in each direction, no shoulders, and concrete barriers, mixing it up with semis and other traffic doing 20+ over the posted 45 mph speed limit. I purposely drove 45 minutes out of my way on I-39 and I-88 to avoid it.
M-28 between Munising and Marquette, MI, during a lake effect snow squall in high winds. The highway runs just on-shore of the lake for extensive stretches, and I had the misfortune of driving it during a storm with 40+ mph winds driving heavy snow bands on-shore. I literally couldn't see beyond the end of my hood, and the only thing keeping me on the road was substantial snowbanks from earlier plowing delineating the shoulders. I literally drove at 10 mph with my 4-ways on hoping that nobody would slam into me from behind. Usually, in those conditions, the Michigan State Police shuts the road down, but for some reason that night they hadn't.
Quote from: hbelkins on January 27, 2018, 03:22:47 PM
I-95 between DC and Richmond. Bumper-to-bumper traffic and people driving like idiots.
Good point and very much agree.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on January 27, 2018, 04:04:03 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on January 27, 2018, 03:22:47 PM
I-95 between DC and Richmond. Bumper-to-bumper traffic and people driving like idiots.
And that’s the irony... The busiest Interstates no matter how well built will always have way more dangers on them simply due to the volume of bad drivers. For all the mountain roads everyone has listed so far none of them will approach the fatality level of a good urban Freeway.
Yep. Maybe it's because I grew up as a driver in McCall, Idaho, but twisty mountain roads never faze me, even in winter conditions without guardrail.
I get most nervous as a driver on heavily-congested-but-still-moving-above-speed-limit urban expressways with lights in unfamiliar areas. Can't name any specific ones, and it's not like I avoid them, but to me driving on that kind of roadway requires the most concentration.
I'd say the most "frightened" I've been driving is on Albania Highway 4 south of Durres - lots of fast moving truck traffic and giant holes where the road has failed, making for a lot of quick acceleration and sudden braking.
Mexico 199 between Palenque and San Cristobal is also a generally exhausting drive - there must be 300 topes along that stretch and there are frequently roadblocks somewhere along it.
In 2012 I was driving from Michigan to North Carolina and for some reason had my GPS set to avoid toll roads which on this trip avoided the Ohio Turnpike and West Virginia Turnpike. I thought it was giving me a strange routing since it told me to take I-75 to exit 156 in Ohio then US 68 down to Kenton SR 31 to Marysville then US 33 to I-270 and on from that way. I was fine following US 33 on the other side of Columbus heading towards West Virginia somehow though the GPS routed me along a road up in the mountains, it was a long winding road following a river and railroad tracks, I remember the road had to make a curve just to get around a house. It was frightening because I had no idea where I was headed and what might come next.
Quote from: Hurricane Rex on January 27, 2018, 02:56:46 AM
Hard to say but probably Going to the Sun Road. Most won't understand unless you drive there.
My parents have driven on it, but not me. From pictures, I'd tend to agree.
If you want hairpin, try US 60 in West Virginia at night. Or this road (https://www.google.com/maps/@36.6085811,-83.6683413,3a,75y,277.43h,77.42t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sYLZ8VvwK0ubxo6SArCsaTw!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo1.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3DYLZ8VvwK0ubxo6SArCsaTw%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D225.76022%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i3328!8i1664) leading to the summit of Cumberland Gap.
Quote from: Hurricane Rex on January 27, 2018, 02:56:46 AM
Hard to say but probably Going to the Sun Road. Most won't understand unless you drive there.
In 86, my father, brother and I went on an Amtrak trip to Seattle with a stopover in Glacier park. Our tour bus driver told us that they have a "Wall club" of first time drivers who accidentally get a wheel up on the retaining walls on the valley side of the road. Unnerving.
As for me, the most frightening road I've ever driven onwas AZ 88, the Apache Highway, east out of Phoenix AZ. Scenic as all hell, but the Fish Creek Hill section of the road looks like it's going to slide into the valley. Scary stuff.
I'm certain that the top level of any four- or five-level stack interchange (mainline or ramp) would most certainly qualify. As for actual highways, I'd say the Dan Ryan Expressway in Chicago, because you run the risk of having rocks thrown or getting shot at your car from one of the underpasses.
This one is rather different from most of the others mentioned: This thread made me think of Rockaway Freeway in Queens, the road that runs underneath the elevated subway trestle and used to have two lanes per side with people driving way too fast, plus people slamming on the brakes to make illegal U-turns, plus there used to be those traffic lights with no yellow signals. They reduced it to one lane each way in the late 1990s. I haven't been out to Far Rockaway in years (no reason to go since my grandmother who lived there died), but I hear part of Rockaway Freeway has now been closed completely.
In terms of more "normal" reasons for a road to be "frightening," I suppose the trip down the Moki Dugway might qualify due to the sheer drop-offs and the lack of guardrails, but I was enjoying the drive and the scenery too much to be scared. Ms1995hoo, however, was decidedly NOT happy on the trip down because she was on the side closer to the drop-off as we started down from the top.
Quote from: Henry on January 29, 2018, 09:42:52 AM
I'm certain that the top level of any four- or five-level stack interchange (mainline or ramp) would most certainly qualify. As for actual highways, I'd say the Dan Ryan Expressway in Chicago, because you run the risk of having rocks thrown or getting shot at your car from one of the underpasses.
That happened on I-75 in October a little north of Flint, Michigan. Some teenagers from Clio thought it was a good idea to throw rocks at cars traveling on I-75. They were throwing rocks at cars going south from the Dodge Road overpass, one person was killed in this situation and the teenagers did get caught and are facing adult charges. They even went to a McDonald's to eat after doing this.
Black Bear Pass Road going into Telluride, CO. I doubt I have the know how to make it all the way, but I drove a short stretch of it..
http://www.dangerousroads.org/north-america/usa/177-black-bear-road-usa.html (not my website)
National Forest Road 062 heading SW out of Jarbidge, Nevada toward Bear Creek Pass and Elko. I'd seen it on some website (long since forgotten) that mentioned it as part of a scenic loop drive. The road into Jarbidge from US 93 was mostly good to excellent, and the town was well worth the visit, but the outbound trip scared the living crap out of me.
I grabbed a photo of the warning sign at the beginning, but I wasn't expecting the steep cliffs ... and a surprising amount of ATVs using the road.
After Bear Creek Pass, conditions generally improved. I did this in September 2015, so no idea how conditions might have changed since then. (And, of course, not even worth considering in mid-winter.)
(https://i.imgur.com/FyMvIHH.jpg)
Submitted for your consideration:
- California State Route 4 between Lake Alpine and California State Route 89. Drove it as part of a CA-4 end-to-end one day. That section is a single lane paved roller coaster.
- California State Route 29 between Middleton and Calistoga. Very twisty and busy section of road.
- Yankee Jim Road between Foresthill and Colfax, CA. Goes over the very old Yankee Jim bridge. (See this link (http://markholtz.info/yankeejim1) and this link (http://markholtz.info/yankeejim2)). I took this road by MISTAKE, too. I missed the sign that said "primitive road".
Most of the "frightening" roads I have driven I was well-prepared for, but I do remember once as an over-confident young driver in my late teens, I took a road-geeking trip specifically for the purpose of driving US 666. I was prepared for back gravel roads to be challenging, but not a US highway. I badly underestimated the concentration required for sustained mountain driving on that road. The scenery was gorgeous, but there was so much traffic - so many drivers drifted out of their lane even with the cut rock-face on one side and the no-guardrail steep cliff on the other. It was exhilarating but exhausting, and took far more time than I had budgeted.
US 1 (Roosevelt Blvd) in Northeast Philly, especially turning left onto it from Red Lion Road. After probably doing it wrong twice (blocking oncoming turning traffic the first time and thru traffic behind me the second time) I gave up started going straight and making a few turns to get onto Woodhaven Road (PA 63 freeway) bypassing US 1 entirely. I still don't know how to navigate that intersection properly, or whether what I did was normal.
Never experienced "white knuckle" driving before, but probably the Kahekili Highway south of Kahakuloa on Maui. Most of the Kahekili is pretty tame, but it drops down to single lane for quite a while. Which is no issue. I've driven plenty of single-track roads in my time. But there was a lot of blind corners, where your only options are to slow way down, open a window and listen, or blow the horn and proceed at a decent but able-to-stop-quickly pace. The Hana Highway seemed much tamer in comparison, despite how much more publicity it gets.
Mount Evans Road, Colorado; US 550, Colorado; Moki Dugway, Utah; Trail Ridge Road, Colorado; Beartooth Highway, MT/WY; Going to the Sun Road, MT.
I drove CA 130 over Mount Hamilton for the second time today. The first time was westbound and in a really dense fog with light rain. The road was difficult and narrow but it wasn't really apparent today how on the edge you are until the clear weather today. Considering I passed only two cars after I got to Mount Hamilton Road I wouldn't say it was the most "frightening" state highway in California but it is closer to CA 4 over Ebbetts Pass than I thought.
Mine had to be the BQE through Brooklyn. Was driving from Long Island to Woodbridge, NJ one night, and took the LIE to the BQE. Naturally, it started raining, so a combination of the rain, heavy traffic (including an accident), and the dark of night, made for a harrowing experience. I was exhausted as I got across the Verrazano onto Staten Island, which was a delight to drive by comparison.
Second place goes to the stretch of US 6/202 leading up from Peekskill to the Bear Mountain Bridge. 5 miles of twisting turning road. One wrong move once you get out of the woods onto the upper palisades of the Hudson, and it's all over.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on January 29, 2018, 09:05:00 PMI drove CA 130 over Mount Hamilton for the second time today.
Drove that once. Also a challenging road. However, I did stop by the "The Junction" restaurant for a bite to eat too. I also recall assisting a motorcycle rider who had a solo accident thanks to a pothole.
Mount Washington auto road.
I have an ATV trail behind the house here with 2 stretches of 57% grade. First several traverses of it were pretty scary, I'm still quite cautious going up or down it.
I'll admit it's fun to surprise a visitor with a ride on that trail. Going down it one is put in mind of plunging off a cliff.
The first time I drove CA 17 it was pretty frightening, but I quickly got used to it as it was part of my commuting route for about 10 months (yikes!). CA 9 between Santa Cruz and Felton was somewhat unnerving for me, too. Interestingly, I was never that scared on the Devil's Slide (CA 1). I think forests scare me more than ocean cliffs 😄
Another one that was disconcerting was CA 108 over the Sierra Nevada. Much windier and narrower than the Tioga Pass, and it seemed like it went on forever.
Quote from: Flint1979 on January 29, 2018, 12:28:21 PM
the teenagers did get caught and are facing adult charges. They even went to a McDonald's to eat after doing this.
That's fucked up. It should be illegal to prosecute minors as adults. Their actions afterward clearly indicate there were not doing that rock throwing with appreciation of consequences.
Digression complete...
I'm not too freaked out by mountain roads or tall bridges. I have driven through a few two track roads with an unnerving amount of deep mud and massive puddles; the kind of thing where if one loses the momentum, that's where the vehicle is going to be until someone else shows up with a tow strap.
I think "frightening" would be another anecdote about driving through flooded roads. This was in Canada after several days camping where it rained constantly all week. The one road out had water flooding over it in multiple places, sometimes half a km at a time. Now that's frightening to not see where the flooded road ended. I even got out and walked in front of the vehicle where the water was turbid just to verify that there was still a road beneath the murky waters and to keep the driver on the crown of the road. I'm certain the sides were all mush and we would've gotten stuck for sure. Fortunately, it was only ever as deep as my knee-boots and we got outta there just fine.
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on February 01, 2018, 06:24:08 PM
Mount Washington auto road.
I can imagine what that road is like. I've never driven on it myself but looking at it on Google Maps it looks pretty eery in places.
Quote from: catsynth on February 02, 2018, 02:27:45 PM
The first time I drove CA 17 it was pretty frightening, but I quickly got used to it as it was part of my commuting route for about 10 months (yikes!). CA 9 between Santa Cruz and Felton was somewhat unnerving for me, too. Interestingly, I was never that scared on the Devil's Slide (CA 1). I think forests scare me more than ocean cliffs 😄
Another one that was disconcerting was CA 108 over the Sierra Nevada. Much windier and narrower than the Tioga Pass, and it seemed like it went on forever.
108 has a huge climb from the western flank of the Sierras. Pretty much every state highway has a shallow climbing up the western flank followed by a big drop on the eastern crest. 108 has a brief section on the eastern flank of Sonora Pass that is listed at a 26% grade, but is way more easy to handle than Ebbetts Pass on 4 up to the north. 4 is over Ebbetts has two huge drops, is a single lane, and is listed with a 24% downhill grade.
Quote from: ZLoth on January 29, 2018, 11:26:12 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on January 29, 2018, 09:05:00 PMI drove CA 130 over Mount Hamilton for the second time today.
Drove that once. Also a challenging road. However, I did stop by the "The Junction" restaurant for a bite to eat too. I also recall assisting a motorcycle rider who had a solo accident thanks to a pothole.
The first time I drove it there was a dense fog above 2,000 feet. I didn't think the roadway was all that bad but that was largely due to not being able to see how high the cliffs were. I can't think of any other roads that aren't in the Sierras that on the absolute knife edge like 130 is.
Quote from: Hurricane Rex on January 27, 2018, 02:56:46 AM
Hard to say but probably Going to the Sun Road. Most won't understand unless you drive there.
That's the only time I can recall being actually scared of a road.
TN 165/NC 143 is pretty unpleasant, but nothing like Glacier.
Quote from: triplemultiplex on February 02, 2018, 04:32:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on January 29, 2018, 12:28:21 PM
the teenagers did get caught and are facing adult charges. They even went to a McDonald's to eat after doing this.
That's fucked up. It should be illegal to prosecute minors as adults. Their actions afterward clearly indicate there were not doing that rock throwing with appreciation of consequences.
Why? These things are typically done on a case-by-case basis. The Marshall County, Ky. school shooter is 15, but is going to be prosecuted as an adult. Do you disagree with that? Most teenagers have an appreciation of right and wrong.
Most frightening due to topology: CA 168 over Westgard Pass through the White Mountains between US 395 and CA 266. Single lane through bottom of canyon (the road is the bottom of the canyon!), no room to pass for anything larger than a Camry; always feels like flash-flood bait!
Most frightening for traffic: a tie: the BQE/I-278, particularly the portion between the Prospect Expwy. and the Brooklyn Bridge exit -- to me, an alley masquerading as an Interstate (and I'm accustomed to the Arroyo Seco Parkway!). The other is ONT 401 -- I thought Boston drivers were self-aggrandizing maniacs until I had occasion to drive 401 just before rush hour. I've never seen so many lanes crossed in as short a distance by so many vehicles as this particular facility.
Most frightening for topology and traffic combined: CA 17, Scotts Valley-Los Gatos. See the CA 17 thread in SW for details.
Definitely this road in Iceland (https://www.google.com/maps/@65.7138824,-14.4348173,3a,75y,12.67h,93.93t/data=!3m8!1e1!3m6!1sAF1QipMKPXy5m87PTNzZAWWCbqZOX7P-nG7rKAxRO7_a!2e10!3e11!6shttps:%2F%2Flh5.googleusercontent.com%2Fp%2FAF1QipMKPXy5m87PTNzZAWWCbqZOX7P-nG7rKAxRO7_a%3Dw203-h100-k-no-pi0-ya39.588993-ro-0-fo100!7i7168!8i3584?hl=en). Super narrow, windy, and steep (the rental car we had on that trip was a manual Chevy Spark, and it needed to be in first gear in several segments to make it up the hill). Also, the top was snowy even in the middle of summer, and most of the uphill side was foggy when we were there, to the point where we wouldn't have been able to tell if there was an oncoming car. Thankfully, we didn't see anyone else driving across it.
Very close runner-up: this nearby one-lane tunnel (https://www.google.com/maps/@66.179328,-18.9099607,3a,15.4y,305.73h,93.19t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1swGRpAcgsH5HuwRVMVkmSJw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en). There was quite a bit of traffic there, and there's no formal traffic control to separate the directions of travel.
Quote from: hbelkins on February 03, 2018, 02:32:58 PM
Quote from: triplemultiplex on February 02, 2018, 04:32:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on January 29, 2018, 12:28:21 PM
the teenagers did get caught and are facing adult charges. They even went to a McDonald's to eat after doing this.
That's fucked up. It should be illegal to prosecute minors as adults. Their actions afterward clearly indicate there were not doing that rock throwing with appreciation of consequences.
Why? These things are typically done on a case-by-case basis. The Marshall County, Ky. school shooter is 15, but is going to be prosecuted as an adult. Do you disagree with that?
Yes.
The real question is why do
you want to treat someone with a sub-adult brain as an adult in a court?
Quote from: hbelkins on February 03, 2018, 02:32:58 PMMost teenagers have an appreciation of right and wrong.
My observation is for most teenagers, this is still a 'work in progress'.
And any way, it's not about right vs. wrong, but an appreciation of long term consequences of actions. Teenagers don't have that fully developed yet. That's why teens do so much dumb shit.
Quote from: triplemultiplex on February 05, 2018, 09:25:40 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on February 03, 2018, 02:32:58 PM
Quote from: triplemultiplex on February 02, 2018, 04:32:49 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on January 29, 2018, 12:28:21 PM
the teenagers did get caught and are facing adult charges. They even went to a McDonald's to eat after doing this.
That's fucked up. It should be illegal to prosecute minors as adults. Their actions afterward clearly indicate there were not doing that rock throwing with appreciation of consequences.
Why? These things are typically done on a case-by-case basis. The Marshall County, Ky. school shooter is 15, but is going to be prosecuted as an adult. Do you disagree with that?
Yes.
The real question is why do you want to treat someone with a sub-adult brain as an adult in a court?
Quote from: hbelkins on February 03, 2018, 02:32:58 PMMost teenagers have an appreciation of right and wrong.
My observation is for most teenagers, this is still a 'work in progress'.
And any way, it's not about right vs. wrong, but an appreciation of long term consequences of actions. Teenagers don't have that fully developed yet. That's why teens do so much dumb shit.
At their age they are old enough to know right from wrong.
Quote from: sparker on February 03, 2018, 11:58:05 PM
Most frightening due to topology: CA 168 over Westgard Pass through the White Mountains between US 395 and CA 266. Single lane through bottom of canyon (the road is the bottom of the canyon!), no room to pass for anything larger than a Camry; always feels like flash-flood bait!
Most frightening for traffic: a tie: the BQE/I-278, particularly the portion between the Prospect Expwy. and the Brooklyn Bridge exit -- to me, an alley masquerading as an Interstate (and I'm accustomed to the Arroyo Seco Parkway!). The other is ONT 401 -- I thought Boston drivers were self-aggrandizing maniacs until I had occasion to drive 401 just before rush hour. I've never seen so many lanes crossed in as short a distance by so many vehicles as this particular facility.
Most frightening for topology and traffic combined: CA 17, Scotts Valley-Los Gatos. See the CA 17 thread in SW for details.
Funny that 168 has more or less come up twice. Good ole Kaiser Pass apparently was intended to be part of a full Trans-Sierra Route if memory serves from what was discussed on Pacific Southwest. Even the portion west of Bishop isn't exactly the tamest road ever.
And poor 17....really that road like you guys said is engineered to the fullest extent it can be without tunnels. The only other expressway that has a similar feel to it off the top of my head might be CA 60 in the bad lands east of Moreno Valley.
Try entering the Pulaski Skyway from the center ramps. Though the Skyway is more of a bridge than a road, its still counts as one on the ground as its so long.
There is such a bad sight distance and no merge lane, with drivers going 60 mph or better its scary pulling out and continuing at a calm pace.
Quote from: Flint1979 on February 05, 2018, 01:43:30 PM
At their age they are old enough to know right from wrong.
At 18 you can assume that. But not before then. There's a reason that 18 is an important age.
The only time I can see children being tried as adults is for aggravated murder. The Marshall County shooting would count, but the Flint overpass rock-tossing incident would not (since there was no intent to murder).
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on February 05, 2018, 01:55:25 PM
Quote from: sparker on February 03, 2018, 11:58:05 PM
Most frightening due to topology: CA 168 over Westgard Pass through the White Mountains between US 395 and CA 266. Single lane through bottom of canyon (the road is the bottom of the canyon!), no room to pass for anything larger than a Camry; always feels like flash-flood bait!
Most frightening for traffic: a tie: the BQE/I-278, particularly the portion between the Prospect Expwy. and the Brooklyn Bridge exit -- to me, an alley masquerading as an Interstate (and I'm accustomed to the Arroyo Seco Parkway!). The other is ONT 401 -- I thought Boston drivers were self-aggrandizing maniacs until I had occasion to drive 401 just before rush hour. I've never seen so many lanes crossed in as short a distance by so many vehicles as this particular facility.
Most frightening for topology and traffic combined: CA 17, Scotts Valley-Los Gatos. See the CA 17 thread in SW for details.
Funny that 168 has more or less come up twice. Good ole Kaiser Pass apparently was intended to be part of a full Trans-Sierra Route if memory serves from what was discussed on Pacific Southwest. Even the portion west of Bishop isn't exactly the tamest road ever.
And poor 17....really that road like you guys said is engineered to the fullest extent it can be without tunnels. The only other expressway that has a similar feel to it off the top of my head might be CA 60 in the bad lands east of Moreno Valley.
I think it's pretty certain that SSR 168 was indeed intended to not only cross the Sierra but cross into Nevada; the original east end of that route (LRN 76) N and E of Bishop was 168 prior to US 6 being extended into the state in the late 30's.
As for CA 60 between Moreno and Beaumont -- it certainly is an underpowered highway considering its high level of traffic (and the main access to Riverside from WB I-10 and the Coachella Valley) but it isn't quite as bad as CA 17; at least it doesn't have 40mph unbanked curves. But, like the topology encountered along CA 17, CA 60's "badlands" environment isn't particularly amenable to expansion either (at least without
very considerable expense).
Quote from: jakeroot on February 06, 2018, 01:46:55 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on February 05, 2018, 01:43:30 PM
At their age they are old enough to know right from wrong.
At 18 you can assume that. But not before then. There's a reason that 18 is an important age.
The only time I can see children being tried as adults is for aggravated murder. The Marshall County shooting would count, but the Flint overpass rock-tossing incident would not (since there was no intent to murder).
There was intent to do damage to cars passing by. To sit here and think that I travel that stretch of I-75 a lot kind of bothers me that things like this happen. When I was 14 years old I knew it wasn't wise to throw rocks at cars from a freeway overpass.
Quote from: Flint1979 on February 06, 2018, 04:11:34 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on February 06, 2018, 01:46:55 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on February 05, 2018, 01:43:30 PM
At their age they are old enough to know right from wrong.
At 18 you can assume that. But not before then. There's a reason that 18 is an important age.
The only time I can see children being tried as adults is for aggravated murder. The Marshall County shooting would count, but the Flint overpass rock-tossing incident would not (since there was no intent to murder).
There was intent to do damage to cars passing by. To sit here and think that I travel that stretch of I-75 a lot kind of bothers me that things like this happen. When I was 14 years old I knew it wasn't wise to throw rocks at cars from a freeway overpass.
No doubt the kids are a couple of c***s. But wanting to damage a car, and wanting to kill the driver of a car, are two different things.
On my way to work a few months ago, I had a kid throw his blanket at my car while I was driving by. He was much younger than these boys, but there's an important similarity. They were both looking to have fun, perhaps piss off a couple people. But by no means was there any intent to kill.
Quote from: jakeroot on February 06, 2018, 05:31:25 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on February 06, 2018, 04:11:34 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on February 06, 2018, 01:46:55 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on February 05, 2018, 01:43:30 PM
At their age they are old enough to know right from wrong.
At 18 you can assume that. But not before then. There's a reason that 18 is an important age.
The only time I can see children being tried as adults is for aggravated murder. The Marshall County shooting would count, but the Flint overpass rock-tossing incident would not (since there was no intent to murder).
There was intent to do damage to cars passing by. To sit here and think that I travel that stretch of I-75 a lot kind of bothers me that things like this happen. When I was 14 years old I knew it wasn't wise to throw rocks at cars from a freeway overpass.
No doubt the kids are a couple of c***s. But wanting to damage a car, and wanting to kill the driver of a car, are two different things.
On my way to work a few months ago, I had a kid throw his blanket at my car while I was driving by. He was much younger than these boys, but there's an important similarity. They were both looking to have fun, perhaps piss off a couple people. But by no means was there any intent to kill.
They did more than want to damage a car, they did damage several cars, had about 20 rocks and just threw them at cars going by at 75-80 mph.
I can remember several years ago I was driving down Mackinaw Street in Saginaw and had already passed Arthur Hill High School which had open campus meaning that students were free to leave the campus during the day instead of being closed campus students wouldn't of been allowed to leave freely. Well during their lunch hour I was driving down Mackinaw and had someone throw a glass bottle at my truck. No damage or anything but it's something I've always remembered for some strange reason.
Needles Highway in the Black Hills (SD Route 87)
Quote from: jakeroot on February 06, 2018, 01:46:55 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on February 05, 2018, 01:43:30 PM
At their age they are old enough to know right from wrong.
At 18 you can assume that. But not before then. There's a reason that 18 is an important age.
The only time I can see children being tried as adults is for aggravated murder. The Marshall County shooting would count, but the Flint overpass rock-tossing incident would not (since there was no intent to murder).
How a suspect is tried should be based solely on the severity of the crime they're accused of committing. The age of the suspect is largely irrelevant in the context of the actual crime.
Quote from: catsynth on February 02, 2018, 02:27:45 PM
The first time I drove CA 17 it was pretty frightening, but I quickly got used to it as it was part of my commuting route for about 10 months (yikes!). CA 9 between Santa Cruz and Felton was somewhat unnerving for me, too.
In the same general area, the southern end of CA 35. Very narrow, curvy, mountainous, and plenty of drop-offs with no guardrail.
Quote from: roadman on February 07, 2018, 10:24:06 AM
Quote from: jakeroot on February 06, 2018, 01:46:55 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on February 05, 2018, 01:43:30 PM
At their age they are old enough to know right from wrong.
At 18 you can assume that. But not before then. There's a reason that 18 is an important age.
The only time I can see children being tried as adults is for aggravated murder. The Marshall County shooting would count, but the Flint overpass rock-tossing incident would not (since there was no intent to murder).
How a suspect is tried should be based solely on the severity of the crime they're accused of committing. The age of the suspect is largely irrelevant in the context of the actual crime.
They also threw a tire from the Farrand Road overpass, 3 miles north of the Dodge Road overpass from which they tossed the rocks.
Quote from: TheCatalyst31 on February 07, 2018, 11:22:49 AM
Quote from: catsynth on February 02, 2018, 02:27:45 PM
The first time I drove CA 17 it was pretty frightening, but I quickly got used to it as it was part of my commuting route for about 10 months (yikes!). CA 9 between Santa Cruz and Felton was somewhat unnerving for me, too.
In the same general area, the southern end of CA 35. Very narrow, curvy, mountainous, and plenty of drop-offs with no guardrail.
I'll probably be checking that one next month now that it's reopened. 35 and 36 are the only single lane stretches of state highway I haven't driven. I'd like to see how it stacks up to 4 over Ebbetts Pass and Pacific Grade Summit.
Quote from: roadman on February 07, 2018, 10:24:06 AM
Quote from: jakeroot on February 06, 2018, 01:46:55 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on February 05, 2018, 01:43:30 PM
At their age they are old enough to know right from wrong.
At 18 you can assume that. But not before then. There's a reason that 18 is an important age.
The only time I can see children being tried as adults is for aggravated murder. The Marshall County shooting would count, but the Flint overpass rock-tossing incident would not (since there was no intent to murder).
How a suspect is tried should be based solely on the severity of the crime they're accused of committing. The age of the suspect is largely irrelevant in the context of the actual crime.
I agree, but only to a point. A child's mind is just that: a child's mind. There are certain things that we can expect of them, but one of those things is not to learn
very early on all what is right and wrong in our world (and what is legal and not). Children should know that murder is not okay, but not all murder is cold and calculated. There are four degrees of murder. Children should only be tried as adults under the first three degrees. The fourth is involuntary, under which there was never an intent to kill.
After reading a bit, I discovered that the Flint teens are being charged with second-degree murder. I completely disagree with this decision. Fourth degree makes more sense, unless there's substantial evidence to suggest the teens knew they'd kill someone. With that in mind, I'm fine with the teens being charged as adults as long as the second-degree murder charge sticks. Since, if they really did try and kill someone, they should be served as adults. They should know that killing is not okay.
Quote from: jakeroot on February 06, 2018, 01:46:55 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on February 05, 2018, 01:43:30 PM
At their age they are old enough to know right from wrong.
At 18 you can assume that. But not before then. There's a reason that 18 is an important age.
The only time I can see children being tried as adults is for aggravated murder. The Marshall County shooting would count, but the Flint overpass rock-tossing incident would not (since there was no intent to murder).
Somebody was killed, so intent or not.. it is a murder when you kill someone, so it does make sense to try them as an adults.
Quote from: Strider on February 07, 2018, 08:26:07 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on February 06, 2018, 01:46:55 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on February 05, 2018, 01:43:30 PM
At their age they are old enough to know right from wrong.
At 18 you can assume that. But not before then. There's a reason that 18 is an important age.
The only time I can see children being tried as adults is for aggravated murder. The Marshall County shooting would count, but the Flint overpass rock-tossing incident would not (since there was no intent to murder).
Somebody was killed, so intent or not.. it is a murder when you kill someone, so it does make sense to try them as an adults.
Read my post above:
Quote from: jakeroot on February 07, 2018, 06:46:20 PM
There are four degrees of murder. Children should only be tried as adults under the first three degrees. The fourth is involuntary, under which there was never an intent to kill.
Driving drunk and killing your friend is not the same as plotting the death of someone, and then carrying it out.
I am massively off-topic at this point. Mods should consider moving the Flint I-75 Overpass Incident discussion to its own thread.
US 40 in Colorado by far. Lots of curves and given the high elevations ran into a hail storm there. Had to pull over I was afraid the trucks were going to slide and run me off the road.
Quote from: roadman on February 07, 2018, 10:24:06 AM
Quote from: jakeroot on February 06, 2018, 01:46:55 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on February 05, 2018, 01:43:30 PM
At their age they are old enough to know right from wrong.
At 18 you can assume that. But not before then. There's a reason that 18 is an important age.
The only time I can see children being tried as adults is for aggravated murder. The Marshall County shooting would count, but the Flint overpass rock-tossing incident would not (since there was no intent to murder).
How a suspect is tried should be based solely on the severity of the crime they're accused of committing. The age of the suspect is largely irrelevant in the context of the actual crime.
I personally 100% agree, and what's so significant about the arbitrary age of 18 anyway?
Although yes, we have drifted very far off topic.
Development of the nucleus accumbens occurs in the early teens, years earlier than that of the prefrontal cortex - incomplete until mid twenties. Teenage brains have a biologic predisposition to seek pleasure and reward and an impaired ability to judge or anticipate consequences. No, this does not excuse risk-taking behavior, but this biologic truth should be relevant to how the legal system handles these offenders.
I linked over one of my blog posts about the Nacimineto-Fergusson Road on the Historic California Highways Facebook page. Apparently it is one of the more dreaded roads in California given some of the conjecture that has been discussed due to the sheer cliffs and single lane.
Quote from: jakeroot on February 07, 2018, 08:46:44 PM
Quote from: Strider on February 07, 2018, 08:26:07 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on February 06, 2018, 01:46:55 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on February 05, 2018, 01:43:30 PM
At their age they are old enough to know right from wrong.
At 18 you can assume that. But not before then. There's a reason that 18 is an important age.
The only time I can see children being tried as adults is for aggravated murder. The Marshall County shooting would count, but the Flint overpass rock-tossing incident would not (since there was no intent to murder).
Somebody was killed, so intent or not.. it is a murder when you kill someone, so it does make sense to try them as an adults.
Read my post above:
Quote from: jakeroot on February 07, 2018, 06:46:20 PM
There are four degrees of murder. Children should only be tried as adults under the first three degrees. The fourth is involuntary, under which there was never an intent to kill.
Driving drunk and killing your friend is not the same as plotting the death of someone, and then carrying it out.
I am massively off-topic at this point. Mods should consider moving the Flint I-75 Overpass Incident discussion to its own thread.
And they can still charge you for anything related or similar to murder if they want to. It is all depending on each state. Don't like it? Become a politician and change the law.
VA SR 193 (Georgetown Pike) heading WB from the Beltway during a summer nighttime thunderstorm. Might seem a bit pedestrian compared to the others, but I couldn't see a damn thing and it was utterly nerve-wracking.
Just remember that treating teenagers as adults in court started because of racist policies toward gang affiliated crimes starting in the 1980s. It was an action based entirely on emotion in an era when white folks were freaking themselves out about crimes committed by black teenagers. (Some things never change)
By prosecuting them as adults, they could be put in prison for longer, thus placating the fascist law and order crowd. Now it's become normalized even though there is nothing to support the idea that society benefits by locking away immature humans for longer periods of time. The opposite seems to be true.
Quote from: triplemultiplex on February 15, 2018, 12:52:09 PM
Just remember that treating teenagers as adults in court started because of racist policies toward gang affiliated crimes starting in the 1980s. It was an action based entirely on emotion in an era when white folks were freaking themselves out about crimes committed by black teenagers. (Some things never change)
By prosecuting them as adults, they could be put in prison for longer, thus placating the fascist law and order crowd. Now it's become normalized even though there is nothing to support the idea that society benefits by locking away immature humans for longer periods of time. The opposite seems to be true.
Not around here, it didn't.
AZ 88....pretty bad ass little highway on the Apache Trail. I suspect you're so far out there that juvenile justice courts would be the last thing on anyone's mind while on a single lane dirt trek.
Quote from: hbelkins on February 15, 2018, 01:14:47 PM
Quote from: triplemultiplex on February 15, 2018, 12:52:09 PM
Just remember that treating teenagers as adults in court started because of racist policies toward gang affiliated crimes starting in the 1980s. It was an action based entirely on emotion in an era when white folks were freaking themselves out about crimes committed by black teenagers. (Some things never change)
By prosecuting them as adults, they could be put in prison for longer, thus placating the fascist law and order crowd. Now it's become normalized even though there is nothing to support the idea that society benefits by locking away immature humans for longer periods of time. The opposite seems to be true.
Not around here, it didn't.
And why? How? Kentucky just wants to lock up kids?
Quote from: ET21 on February 07, 2018, 10:17:57 AM
Needles Highway in the Black Hills (SD Route 87)
Nah man, SD 87's tame. Mine is OR 46 going to the Oregon Caves National Monument... yay for curvy mountain roads with no guardrail!
Other than that the only time I've had white knuckles while driving is in the middle of a blizzard on I-90 west of Wall... but weather-related crap almost deserves its own thread.
Quote from: SD Mapman on February 15, 2018, 09:32:40 PM
Quote from: ET21 on February 07, 2018, 10:17:57 AM
Needles Highway in the Black Hills (SD Route 87)
Nah man, SD 87's tame. Mine is OR 46 going to the Oregon Caves National Monument... yay for curvy mountain roads with no guardrail!
Other than that the only time I've had white knuckles while driving is in the middle of a blizzard on I-90 west of Wall... but weather-related crap almost deserves its own thread.
SD 87 is way too slow and isn't really cliff-side all that much. Yes it is extremely narrow in the one-lane granite cuts but I wouldn't call that frightening, more fascinating.
Quote from: triplemultiplex on February 15, 2018, 12:52:09 PM
Just remember that treating teenagers as adults in court started because of racist policies toward gang affiliated crimes starting in the 1980s. It was an action based entirely on emotion in an era when white folks were freaking themselves out about crimes committed by black teenagers. (Some things never change)
By prosecuting them as adults, they could be put in prison for longer, thus placating the fascist law and order crowd. Now it's become normalized even though there is nothing to support the idea that society benefits by locking away immature humans for longer periods of time. The opposite seems to be true.
Ah, reciting the left's rhetoric; bonus points for playing the race card.
Quote from: Super Mateo on February 16, 2018, 09:28:17 AM
Ah, reciting the left's rhetoric; bonus points for playing the race card.
Vise versa, dude.
I think driving on Blind 35 in the middle of the night in the middle of winter would be a frightening road to drive on.
Quote from: jakeroot on February 07, 2018, 08:46:44 PM
Quote from: Strider on February 07, 2018, 08:26:07 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on February 06, 2018, 01:46:55 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on February 05, 2018, 01:43:30 PM
At their age they are old enough to know right from wrong.
At 18 you can assume that. But not before then. There's a reason that 18 is an important age.
The only time I can see children being tried as adults is for aggravated murder. The Marshall County shooting would count, but the Flint overpass rock-tossing incident would not (since there was no intent to murder).
Somebody was killed, so intent or not.. it is a murder when you kill someone, so it does make sense to try them as an adults.
Read my post above:
Quote from: jakeroot on February 07, 2018, 06:46:20 PM
There are four degrees of murder. Children should only be tried as adults under the first three degrees. The fourth is involuntary, under which there was never an intent to kill.
Driving drunk and killing your friend is not the same as plotting the death of someone, and then carrying it out.
No - the latter is FIRST degree murder.
This fits the textbook definition of second degree murder - "any intentional murder with malice aforethought, but is not premeditated or planned."
Throwing rocks off an overpass at moving traffic is malicious. Teenagers should know the difference between right and wrong and held accountable for their actions.
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on February 01, 2018, 06:24:08 PM
Mount Washington auto road.
Second this one. Without a doubt, the most terrifying road I've driven on or seen IRL.
Quote from: drrosenrosen on February 25, 2018, 07:01:37 AM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on February 01, 2018, 06:24:08 PM
Mount Washington auto road.
Second this one. Without a doubt, the most terrifying road I've driven on or seen IRL.
I think for the simple fact that there are no guardrails in places that should have guardrails. If an accident happened on that road a car could be sent sliding down the mountain.
I would say Owyhee Lake Rd on the way to Lake Owyhee State Park in SE Oregon. It's not bad in the canyon up until you get near the dam: mostly unpaved 35 MPH, just follows the river, not bad. Around and beyond the dam though, it's narrow, windy, and cliffside. Unfortunately no GSV anywhere in the area.
Also, it was hot as hell the July 4th weekend we stayed there, 100+ and even at night it was still like 80. We cut our camping trip a day short. Didn't have a lot of choices though, most campgrounds were full around then (understandably). Still had a good ~24 hours. We may go back sometime, but in May or something.
The road I've been on in which I have endured the most fear would have to be Alabama Highway 117 near Mentone, while climbing this plateau (a kind of mountain). (https://www.google.com/maps/@34.5755711,-85.5955017,3a,75y,26.07h,90.63t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1s7cGn_hSVRrcjjI7k2J6f1A!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo0.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3D7cGn_hSVRrcjjI7k2J6f1A%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D284.49374%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656) I have been on this stretch of road in Fall 2011 and Fall 2012 on a bus during Fall Retreat trips with my Church. On both of those rides, there was absolutely no railing of any kind whatsoever on the side of the mountain - as a result, it was scary as hell for me. It was a beautiful stretch of mountain road, but I could not truly enjoy it, because my nerves were going nuts to the perceived (or actual) lack of safety. I was truly, undescribably anxious during those rides, especially since I was in a huge bus that could possibly lose control, so this has definitely got to be the most frightening road I have ever been on - I don't think anything else in my memory compares. But thankfully, as can be seen in the aforementioned link, (https://www.google.com/maps/@34.5755711,-85.5955017,3a,75y,26.07h,90.63t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1s7cGn_hSVRrcjjI7k2J6f1A!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo0.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3D7cGn_hSVRrcjjI7k2J6f1A%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D284.49374%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656) there is now, according to current Google Maps Street-View, some new, very nice stone railing on the side of the mountain, along what seems to be the entire stretch of AL SR 117 higher up on the mountain. I am very glad that this is present in the modern day, so that no one else has to experience fear like that while driving on that stretch of road ever again. :wow: :clap:
Quote from: adventurernumber1 on March 02, 2018, 08:11:34 PM
The road I've been on in which I have endured the most fear would have to be Alabama Highway 117 near Mentone, while climbing this plateau (a kind of mountain). (https://www.google.com/maps/@34.5755711,-85.5955017,3a,75y,26.07h,90.63t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1s7cGn_hSVRrcjjI7k2J6f1A!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo0.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3D7cGn_hSVRrcjjI7k2J6f1A%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D284.49374%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656) I have been on this stretch of road in Fall 2011 and Fall 2012 on a bus during Fall Retreat trips with my Church. On both of those rides, there was absolutely no railing of any kind whatsoever on the side of the mountain - as a result, it was scary as hell for me. It was a beautiful stretch of mountain road, but I could not truly enjoy it, because my nerves were going nuts to the perceived (or actual) lack of safety. I was truly, undescribably anxious during those rides, especially since I was in a huge bus that could possibly lose control, so this has definitely got to be the most frightening road I have ever been on - I don't think anything else in my memory compares. But thankfully, as can be seen in the aforementioned link, (https://www.google.com/maps/@34.5755711,-85.5955017,3a,75y,26.07h,90.63t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1s7cGn_hSVRrcjjI7k2J6f1A!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo0.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3D7cGn_hSVRrcjjI7k2J6f1A%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D284.49374%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656) there is now, according to current Google Maps Street-View, some new, very nice stone railing on the side of the mountain, along what seems to be the entire stretch of AL SR 117 higher up on the mountain. I am very glad that this is present in the modern day, so that no one else has to experience fear like that while driving on that stretch of road ever again. :wow: :clap:
Those guardrails and stone barriers are just a false sense of security. The good news all those trees would probably catch a vehicle or slow it down considerably. :rolleyes: Kind of interesting to consider that are actually places in Alabama that aren't flat and boring near the Tennessee state line.
Quote from: Flint1979 on February 25, 2018, 12:45:38 PM
Quote from: drrosenrosen on February 25, 2018, 07:01:37 AM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on February 01, 2018, 06:24:08 PM
Mount Washington auto road.
Second this one. Without a doubt, the most terrifying road I've driven on or seen IRL.
I think for the simple fact that there are no guardrails in places that should have guardrails. If an accident happened on that road a car could be sent sliding down the mountain.
It's weird, I've been up three times, driving two of those, and it's never bothered me. The most frightening for me is in New Hampshire, and that is Sandwich Notch Rd, because you fear trashing even a well equipped truck/SUV on it.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on March 02, 2018, 08:48:50 PM
Quote from: adventurernumber1 on March 02, 2018, 08:11:34 PM
The road I've been on in which I have endured the most fear would have to be Alabama Highway 117 near Mentone, while climbing this plateau (a kind of mountain). (https://www.google.com/maps/@34.5755711,-85.5955017,3a,75y,26.07h,90.63t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1s7cGn_hSVRrcjjI7k2J6f1A!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo0.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3D7cGn_hSVRrcjjI7k2J6f1A%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D284.49374%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656) I have been on this stretch of road in Fall 2011 and Fall 2012 on a bus during Fall Retreat trips with my Church. On both of those rides, there was absolutely no railing of any kind whatsoever on the side of the mountain - as a result, it was scary as hell for me. It was a beautiful stretch of mountain road, but I could not truly enjoy it, because my nerves were going nuts to the perceived (or actual) lack of safety. I was truly, undescribably anxious during those rides, especially since I was in a huge bus that could possibly lose control, so this has definitely got to be the most frightening road I have ever been on - I don't think anything else in my memory compares. But thankfully, as can be seen in the aforementioned link, (https://www.google.com/maps/@34.5755711,-85.5955017,3a,75y,26.07h,90.63t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1s7cGn_hSVRrcjjI7k2J6f1A!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo0.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3D7cGn_hSVRrcjjI7k2J6f1A%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D284.49374%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656) there is now, according to current Google Maps Street-View, some new, very nice stone railing on the side of the mountain, along what seems to be the entire stretch of AL SR 117 higher up on the mountain. I am very glad that this is present in the modern day, so that no one else has to experience fear like that while driving on that stretch of road ever again. :wow: :clap:
Those guardrails and stone barriers are just a false sense of security. The good news all those trees would probably catch a vehicle or slow it down considerably. :rolleyes: Kind of interesting to consider that are actually places in Alabama that aren't flat and boring near the Tennessee state line.
Yeah, northeast Alabama is actually full of incredible scenery, all along I-59, on some of I-20, in the Birmingham area, and even in Huntsville. Some of our Huntsville and northeast Alabama members on this forum can attest to that. There's all sorts of neat stuff in this region (roads, bridges, and scenery alike). :nod:
Missouri State Route 21. The road goes through the St Francis Mountains, so it sits pretty high up. And guardrails are practically nonexistent (if there is a guardrail it's more than likely a stone wall). Then there's impatient truck drivers from the industrial buildings in the area (Annapolis mines, a factory north of Centerville, etc).
US 51 bridge at the Illinois-Missouri border, because of its incline and is so narrow.
I'll nominate the Schuylkill Expressway. This road is extremely narrow - four (yes, FOUR, on a major freeway) 10 foot lanes crammed between housing and the Schuylkill River, separated by a guardrail. Combine that with substandard interchanges - left exits all over the place, crap ton of weaving, and an extremely short ramp. Then, the drivers are probably going 70+ when traffic isn't a standstill, and they're weaving in and around all the cars. Makes it quite the challenge to drive.
Quote from: golden eagle on March 04, 2018, 10:17:58 AM
US 51 bridge at the Illinois-Missouri border, because of its incline and is so narrow.
I think you meant US-62, US-51 goes between Illinois and Kentucky at the same location pretty much but US-62 goes between Illinois and Missouri. I know what you are talking about though I've been across both bridges and both are very narrow with no shoulder.
Quote from: noelbotevera on March 04, 2018, 11:51:22 AM
I'll nominate the Schuylkill Expressway. This road is extremely narrow - four (yes, FOUR, on a major freeway) 10 foot lanes crammed between housing and the Schuylkill River, separated by a guardrail. Combine that with substandard interchanges - left exits all over the place, crap ton of weaving, and an extremely short ramp. Then, the drivers are probably going 70+ when traffic isn't a standstill, and they're weaving in and around all the cars. Makes it quite the challenge to drive.
DC-295 has many similarities (though most of it is 6 lanes with no shoulders).
Then there's U.S. 50 between Echo Summit and South Lake Tahoe in California. Not dangerous per se, but it's a surprise anyway when headed eastbound down (signs say 5% descent) that mountainside ledge, which means drivers really cannot pay much attention to the views of the area.
Twisty mountain highways are quite common on many states in the East (and places in the West as well, see comment about U.S. 40 in Colorado upthread).
My favorites (probably not fun in the rain or snow but fine on a nice day):
U.S. 60 (Midland Trail) shunpiking part of the West Virginia Turnpike (https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Sam+Black+Church,+West+Virginia+24977/38.3146469,-81.5596963/@38.0182051,-81.5647801,9z/data=!4m14!4m13!1m10!1m1!1s0x884c3cd51785b16d:0x35be8bb1fc4b1340!2m2!1d-80.6311648!2d37.8988948!3m4!1m2!1d-81.0309763!2d38.1252764!3s0x884eba8a6b252849:0x53ff32f23a4bc248!1m0!3e0);
U.S. 250 between U.S. 219 at Huttonsville, W.Va. and West Augusta, Va. (https://www.google.com/maps/dir/38.7106921,-79.9791215/West+Augusta,+Virginia+24485/@38.4902588,-80.2053012,9z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m9!4m8!1m0!1m5!1m1!1s0x89b4ac3dd174972f:0xde46824767e9f9c2!2m2!1d-79.3077829!2d38.2701695!3e0) (over 70 miles);
U.S. 33 between Elkins, W.Va. and Rawley Springs, Va. (https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Elkins,+West+Virginia+26241/Rawley+Springs,+Virginia+22831/@38.7137305,-80.0754405,9z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m14!4m13!1m5!1m1!1s0x884ae3b56cffb24b:0xce8579539c7bb6d2!2m2!1d-79.8467349!2d38.9259397!1m5!1m1!1s0x89b4c05a7930f22b:0xecf0aa987e32ec6a!2m2!1d-79.0564215!2d38.5054005!3e0) (almost 90 miles);
WV-42/WV-93 (Union Highway) between Bismarck and Scherr (https://www.google.com/maps/dir/39.2188759,-79.2109607/Scherr,+West+Virginia+26833/@39.2002121,-79.2174991,13z/data=!4m9!4m8!1m0!1m5!1m1!1s0x89b5464e9e769855:0xda735b1f419dc5f2!2m2!1d-79.1700363!2d39.1931616!3e0) (the routing via Corridor H is longer but vastly better);
U.S. 50 between I-79 and Gore, Virginia (https://www.google.com/maps/dir/39.2806947,-80.2782229/Gore,+Virginia+22637/@39.1539008,-80.219691,8z/data=!4m19!4m18!1m10!3m4!1m2!1d-79.4758162!2d39.3106917!3s0x884ab18f21aac65b:0x1569b5925e86384d!3m4!1m2!1d-79.0016542!2d39.3604898!3s0x89b56743e3adff5b:0x3be4b403b09c3d2d!1m5!1m1!1s0x89b58d043de026d9:0x5f2e076f4f386025!2m2!1d-78.3319494!2d39.2639911!3e0) (about 160 miles of rough mountain highway);
MD-135 between Swanton and Bloomington (https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Swanton,+Maryland+21561/Bloomington,+Maryland+21523/@39.4751282,-79.2920415,11z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m14!4m13!1m5!1m1!1s0x89b557b8f524438d:0xf958c366183114cc!2m2!1d-79.2308703!2d39.4589834!1m5!1m1!1s0x89caa091dca95673:0x3b2ff6ddbd6cd050!2m2!1d-79.0723342!2d39.4772479!3e0), one of the most-deceptive mountain descents to be found (though less so with the numerous truck warning signs eastbound); and
U.S. 30 between Breezewood and Fort Loudon, Pennsylvania (https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Breezewood,+Pennsylvania/39.9066709,-77.8839098/@39.9286488,-78.206765,29333m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m9!4m8!1m5!1m1!1s0x89ca34f8dfb7603d:0xfc801d508a5f4c68!2m2!1d-78.2388071!2d39.9991865!1m0!3e0) a road so bad that transit agencies across Pennsylvania thank you for staying on the Turnpike and paying their Act 44 subsidies.
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on February 01, 2018, 06:24:08 PM
Mount Washington auto road.
Seconded. Very steep, narrow, gravel road. Luckily, I was on a trip with my friend from West Virginia, a veritable expert on driving mountain roads. I let him take the wheel haha. I thought brakes that steam was only something that happened in cartoons and old movies. Nope! I have seen steam emanate from my cars' tires from such intense braking during the downhill trip. Those bumper stickers "my car climbed Mt. Washington" aren't bragging about nothing!
As for the roads I've driven personally, I've gone up AND down the Moki Dugway, satisfying a bucket list item of mine. Driving through Custer State Park was especially memorable as well-- not to mention it was in my friend's grandparents' bulky boat of
a Buick whose brakes started squeaking halfway through the trip...
US 169 in Tulsa.
The Road to Hana on Maui.
Quote from: OCGuy81 on March 18, 2018, 11:56:34 AM
The Road to Hana on Maui.
For me it was the continuation of that road (Piilani Highway, county 31) past Hana.
Quote from: MarkF on March 19, 2018, 02:39:44 AM
Quote from: OCGuy81 on March 18, 2018, 11:56:34 AM
The Road to Hana on Maui.
For me it was the continuation of that road (Piilani Highway, county 31) past Hana.
Yes, I noticed that when I was there. Between Kahului and Hana, I found the road to be pretty tame. The single-track stuff southwest of Hana was far more interesting. It was like a really, really long driveway.
My wife would say Rim of the World Dr (CA 18) in the San Bernardino Mountains. I grew up with that road, as my grandmother lived in Lake Arrowhead, so my parents were always going up there when I was a kid (and when I got a car, I'd explore myself).
The first time I took my wife on that road, it was night, and it was foggy...
For me, there was a recent (somewhat) scary road, and that was US 163 in SE Utah, between Monument Valley and Bluff. There are some steep grades (10%) and curves, it's in the middle of nowhere...and it was dark....and I had to get to Cortez, CO that night, so I might have been in a bit of a hurry.
Matts Landing Road (Cumberland County 736) in Maurice River Township, New Jersey runs along a narrow land strip about three feet above the water with almost no shoulder – and no guardrails. Woe betide you if you're on that road in the rain.