Recently I noticed that the exit numbers on the Capital Beltway increase counterclockwise, whereas with most other beltways I've driven (435 in KC, 494/694 in Minneapolis, 465 in Indy, 270 in St. Louis), they go clockwise. It seems like clockwise exit numbers are the more common convention - does anyone know of any beltways (aside from DC) where the exit numbers increase going counterclockwise? I would like to know.
I-265/KY 841 in Kentucky increases in the counterclockwise direction. We don't know when IN and KY will sign the East End Crossing as a single I-265 3/4 beltway, but when they do, we also don't know if the bi-state I-265 will keep the Indiana mileage separate from the Kentucky mileage, or if INDOT will continue KYTC's mileage as part of the unified signing of the route project. At present, Indiana's segment of I-265 does count increasing mileage in the clockwise direction
Speaking of St Louis, the I-270 signed segment of the STL Beltway increases clockwise, that is correct. The I-255 signed segment of the STL Beltway increases counterclockwise
Another quirk regarding the STL Beltway: I-270's mileage resets at the Mississippi River.. I-255's does not
Denver does-sort of. C-470 begins at US 6 in Golden on the west side of town and numbers ascend south then east to I-25 where mile markers reset and E-470 (toll) begins. E-470 numbers ascend from I-25 south of the city to its terminus at I-25 north, where the numbers continue ascending on the Northwest Parkway to 96th Street in Broomfield where the tollway terminates.
I-610 around Houston and I-410 around San Antonio both increase counter-clockwise.
Counterclockwise goes with the rule of exit numbers increasing from south to north and from west to east, assuming Exit 1 is approximately at the 6 o'clock position.
The Capital Beltway's original exit numbers increased clockwise from Exit 1 (US-1 in Alexandria) to Exit 38 (I-295 in Maryland). The gist of the reason why it changed is because I-95 was assigned to the eastern half of the Beltway and Maryland renumbered exits statewide during that period. That's an oversimplification, of course.
Regarding roads that potentially run exit numbers in the opposite direction, one possibility is Virginia's I-295. I say "possibility" because it is not a complete beltway. It's more like a two-thirds bypass. Its numbers run anticlockwise insofar as the top portion of the road is more east/west, and I assume the reason is that most of the road runs north/south. Exit numbers start at the southern end near Petersburg. (So if you were heading from, say, Charlottesville to Williamsburg and you exit I-64 onto I-295 to bypass Richmond, the exit numbers on I-295 will decrease as you head east, the opposite of what you might expect if you're attuned to such things.)
Quote from: SeriesE on July 13, 2020, 02:42:17 AM
Counterclockwise goes with the rule of exit numbers increasing from south to north and from west to east, assuming Exit 1 is approximately at the 6 o'clock position.
That would be clockwise.
Quote from: Hot Rod Hootenanny on July 13, 2020, 08:58:32 PM
Quote from: SeriesE on July 13, 2020, 02:42:17 AM
Counterclockwise goes with the rule of exit numbers increasing from south to north and from west to east, assuming Exit 1 is approximately at the 6 o'clock position.
That would be clockwise.
I was thinking this way: counterclockwise from the southernmost point goes east first before heading north.
Quote from: ilpt4u on July 12, 2020, 11:01:18 PM
I-265/KY 841 in Kentucky increases in the counterclockwise direction. We don't know when IN and KY will sign the East End Crossing as a single I-265 3/4 beltway, but when they do, we also don't know if the bi-state I-265 will keep the Indiana mileage separate from the Kentucky mileage, or if INDOT will continue KYTC's mileage as part of the unified signing of the route project. At present, Indiana's segment of I-265 does count increasing mileage in the clockwise direction
KYTC is working on a widening project of both 265 & 71 and will build at least one C/D lanes at the interchange. I'm assuming they'll make the sign changes with that project. No clue about INDOT. I doubt they will change their exit numbers. Likely will just stay the same with KY MM 39 being IN MM 13 on the Lewis & Clark bridge.
I feel like if Indiana was going to change exit numbers and mileage, it would have been when the bridge was done.
New Circle Rd (KY 4) in Lexington, KY is a perfect circle almost. Exit numbers begin at the southernmost point going clockwise. The southern US 27 interchange (Nicholasville Rd) is signed as Exit 19. MM 0 = MM 19.283. The inner loop is the cardinal direction regardless of what direction it's signed as.
Quote from: zzcarp on July 12, 2020, 11:31:16 PM
Denver does-sort of. C-470 begins at US 6 in Golden on the west side of town and numbers ascend south then east to I-25 where mile markers reset and E-470 (toll) begins. E-470 numbers ascend from I-25 south of the city to its terminus at I-25 north, where the numbers continue ascending on the Northwest Parkway to 96th Street in Broomfield where the tollway terminates.
So are most of the exits on C-470 numbered now? I know for years it seemed like none of them were numbered, and the last time I drove on it a couple of years ago the widening construction was still ongoing so I haven't seen the signage on the finished project.
Quote from: sprjus4 on July 13, 2020, 01:44:59 AM
I-610 around Houston and I-410 around San Antonio both increase counter-clockwise.
But Fort Worth increase clockwise. I wonder what the numbering convention was when 820 also covered the southernmost concurrency with I-20?
iPhone
Quote from: CardInLex on July 13, 2020, 09:58:08 PM
KYTC is working on a widening project of both 265 & 71 and will build at least one C/D lanes at the interchange. I'm assuming they'll make the sign changes with that project. No clue about INDOT. I doubt they will change their exit numbers. Likely will just stay the same with KY MM 39 being IN MM 13 on the Lewis & Clark bridge.
With multi-state 3DIs, and even beltways, there are precedents for both unified/continuous mileage across state lines and also resets across the state line
That said, a sudden change from counting up to counting down for mileage (putting it another way, where the max mileage from both states meet at one point), does that have precedent, when crossing the state line?
Maybe not so much for navigation purposes these days, with GPS and Smart Phones, but maybe an argument for unified/continuous mileage could be made for 911 Operators and 1st Responders
Quote from: wriddle082 on July 13, 2020, 10:09:49 PM
Quote from: zzcarp on July 12, 2020, 11:31:16 PM
Denver does-sort of. C-470 begins at US 6 in Golden on the west side of town and numbers ascend south then east to I-25 where mile markers reset and E-470 (toll) begins. E-470 numbers ascend from I-25 south of the city to its terminus at I-25 north, where the numbers continue ascending on the Northwest Parkway to 96th Street in Broomfield where the tollway terminates.
So are most of the exits on C-470 numbered now? I know for years it seemed like none of them were numbered, and the last time I drove on it a couple of years ago the widening construction was still ongoing so I haven't seen the signage on the finished project.
Yes. There are exit numbers posted from I-70 (Exit 1) to Yosemite Street (Exit 25). Neither terminus currently has an exit number posted.
One thing I've always wondered: why is the Twin Cities beltway both 494 and 694? After all, it's the same set of exit numbers - why not just call it one or the other?
Quote from: KCRoadFan on July 14, 2020, 12:49:05 AM
One thing I've always wondered: why is the Twin Cities beltway both 494 and 694? After all, it's the same set of exit numbers - why not just call it one or the other?
That's a great question, but I don't think that will ever get a definitive answer, like the question about I-35's two splits, where the eastern half of both uses the main I-35 exit numbers and the western half its own numbers. Two routes may exist for the Twin Cities beltway (not counting the I-94 concurrency in the NW corner), but it works to perfection, and people could care less what it's called.
It was done to ease potential confusion. Even though they form a beltway, the two routes serve different interests. 694 is the long distance I-94 bypass route, and 494 is a route used much more heavily by local traffic.
The rule for Texas is to start at the south and increase clockwise. I-820 starts at the southwest end, presumably because if you start at the south of the implied loop (along which it originally ran) and move clockwise, the southwest end is the first part that is actually I-820. Interstates 410 and 610 increase clockwise, but it should be noted that I-410 starts at I-35, which is at the southwest corner, presumably because that's the main intersection on the south side. Beltway 8 also starts at the south and increases clockwise. Both it and I-610 start at SH 288. I guess that's important enough that they start there instead of at I-45, which intersects both of them in the southeast. SH 99 currently starts at I-69, because that's all that's been built, and increases clockwise. I-635 is anomalous. It's a half-loop along the east and north sides of Dallas. It starts in the southeast and increases counter-clockwise. State loops 12 (Dallas) and 1604 (San Antonio) follow the rule.
Out if curiosity, I looked to see if there are any rules mentioned in the MUTCD about this. Couldn't find language that specified what to do... but the sample diagram does show that you start at the southernmost point and proceed clockwise.
Quote from: CardInLex on July 16, 2020, 10:51:46 AM
Out if curiosity, I looked to see if there are any rules mentioned in the MUTCD about this. Couldn't find language that specified what to do... but the sample diagram does show that you start at the southernmost point and proceed clockwise.
As with everything else, it's subject to exceptions. In the case of the Capital Beltway, for example, the standard convention is trumped by I-95 running along the eastern half of the Beltway, which is why Maryland numbered their portion anticlockwise (I-95 mileposts from the state line up to where I-95 leaves the Beltway to head north to Baltimore, and then continuing that numbering around the rest of the Beltway). Virginia had separate exit numbers for a good 20 years or so, but some people apparently found it confusing and eventually Virginia decided to continue Maryland's numbering with the exception of the seven-mile segment of Virginia's Beltway that's used by I-95.
In other words, if a 2di shares pavement with a 3di, the theory is that the 2di's numbering would trump the 3di's because the 2di is the "primary" route, even when the result is something that's likely to be illogical to the average motorist who has never heard of the MUTCD (such as Virginia's Beltway abruptly jumping from Exit 57 to Exit 173 within three miles). Of course, it's also fair to recognize that a local driver who uses the road on a regular basis should know about the inconsistency and be used to it, but I never underestimate the ignorance of the average motorist based on some of the letters I saw in the Washington Post's "Dr. Gridlock" column over the years.
Quote from: 1995hoo on July 16, 2020, 11:07:28 AM
Quote from: CardInLex on July 16, 2020, 10:51:46 AM
Out if curiosity, I looked to see if there are any rules mentioned in the MUTCD about this. Couldn't find language that specified what to do... but the sample diagram does show that you start at the southernmost point and proceed clockwise.
As with everything else, it's subject to exceptions. In the case of the Capital Beltway, for example, the standard convention is trumped by I-95 running along the eastern half of the Beltway, which is why Maryland numbered their portion anticlockwise (I-95 mileposts from the state line up to where I-95 leaves the Beltway to head north to Baltimore, and then continuing that numbering around the rest of the Beltway). Virginia had separate exit numbers for a good 20 years or so, but some people apparently found it confusing and eventually Virginia decided to continue Maryland's numbering with the exception of the seven-mile segment of Virginia's Beltway that's used by I-95.
In other words, if a 2di shares pavement with a 3di, the theory is that the 2di's numbering would trump the 3di's because the 2di is the "primary" route, even when the result is something that's likely to be illogical to the average motorist who has never heard of the MUTCD (such as Virginia's Beltway abruptly jumping from Exit 57 to Exit 173 within three miles). Of course, it's also fair to recognize that a local driver who uses the road on a regular basis should know about the inconsistency and be used to it, but I never underestimate the ignorance of the average motorist based on some of the letters I saw in the Washington Post's "Dr. Gridlock" column over the years.
I-465 in Indiana does not give way to I-74 (nor will it to I-69 when finished) in mileage markers or exit numbers. In fact, while I-74 is clearly signed during its concurrency with I-465, I've never once in my life heard anybody refer to the road as 74, either along or in conjunction with 465. Everybody just calls it 465. If you polled people who regularly drive on that section of 465, I'd guess that at least half don't even realize that the road is also 74.
Quote from: 1995hoo on July 16, 2020, 11:07:28 AM
In other words, if a 2di shares pavement with a 3di, the theory is that the 2di's numbering would trump the 3di's because the 2di is the "primary" route, even when the result is something that's likely to be illogical to the average motorist who has never heard of the MUTCD
Some Midwest 3di's challenge your notion about this theory that that 2di's numbering trumps the 3di's when multiplexed
I-80/294 uses I-294's Mileage and Exits. I-74/465 uses I-465's Mileage and Exits. I-41/43/894 uses I-894's Mileage and Exits. I-94/694 uses I-494/694's Mileage and Exits
I-74/275 does have I-74's Mileage and Exits take over the Cincy Beltway Mileage for the short multiplex segment, as a case supporting your theory. I-74/280 also has I-74's Mileage and Exits take over the numbering when the multiplex with 280 begins
Then there is the ultimate Odd Duck case of I-88, terminating at Interstates I-290 and I-294, instead of I-290 terminating at the junction and letting the E-W 2di be the main number to Downtown Chicago. I-290's Mileage, Exits, AND Numbering trump I-88's. Even IDOT sees I-290 to the Hillside Strangler Interchange to I-88 is the "thru route" on some level, as I-290 has a Control of Aurora posted Downtown somewhere
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 16, 2020, 11:16:38 AM
Quote from: 1995hoo on July 16, 2020, 11:07:28 AM
Quote from: CardInLex on July 16, 2020, 10:51:46 AM
Out if curiosity, I looked to see if there are any rules mentioned in the MUTCD about this. Couldn't find language that specified what to do... but the sample diagram does show that you start at the southernmost point and proceed clockwise.
As with everything else, it's subject to exceptions. In the case of the Capital Beltway, for example, the standard convention is trumped by I-95 running along the eastern half of the Beltway, which is why Maryland numbered their portion anticlockwise (I-95 mileposts from the state line up to where I-95 leaves the Beltway to head north to Baltimore, and then continuing that numbering around the rest of the Beltway). Virginia had separate exit numbers for a good 20 years or so, but some people apparently found it confusing and eventually Virginia decided to continue Maryland's numbering with the exception of the seven-mile segment of Virginia's Beltway that's used by I-95.
In other words, if a 2di shares pavement with a 3di, the theory is that the 2di's numbering would trump the 3di's because the 2di is the "primary" route, even when the result is something that's likely to be illogical to the average motorist who has never heard of the MUTCD (such as Virginia's Beltway abruptly jumping from Exit 57 to Exit 173 within three miles). Of course, it's also fair to recognize that a local driver who uses the road on a regular basis should know about the inconsistency and be used to it, but I never underestimate the ignorance of the average motorist based on some of the letters I saw in the Washington Post's "Dr. Gridlock" column over the years.
I-465 in Indiana does not give way to I-74 (nor will it to I-69 when finished) in mileage markers or exit numbers. In fact, while I-74 is clearly signed during its concurrency with I-465, I've never once in my life heard anybody refer to the road as 74, either along or in conjunction with 465. Everybody just calls it 465. If you polled people who regularly drive on that section of 465, I'd guess that at least half don't even realize that the road is also 74.
You're sort of making my point for me. I said "the theory" is that the 2di should trump, but I don't think most people out on the road view it that way.
Quote from: ilpt4u on July 16, 2020, 11:18:40 AM
Quote from: 1995hoo on July 16, 2020, 11:07:28 AM
In other words, if a 2di shares pavement with a 3di, the theory is that the 2di's numbering would trump the 3di's because the 2di is the "primary" route, even when the result is something that's likely to be illogical to the average motorist who has never heard of the MUTCD
Some Midwest 3di's challenge your notion about this theory that that 2di's numbering trumps the 3di's when multiplexed
I-80/294 uses I-294's Mileage and Exits. I-74/465 uses I-465's Mileage and Exits. I-41/43/894 uses I-894's Mileage and Exits. I-94/694 uses I-494/694's Mileage and Exits
I-74/275 does have I-74's Mileage and Exits take over the Cincy Beltway Mileage for the short multiplex segment, as a case supporting your theory
See above. Again, you're sort of making my point. Certainly we know various highway departments will ignore MUTCD guidance when the guidance doesn't make sense. For example, on the Beltway in Virginia, VDOT signs the straight-thru movement on the Inner Loop (where I-95 splits off and heads south) as an "exit," even though you're staying on the same highway, because they say that's what the MUTCD requires because you have to "exit" I-95 onto I-495. Halfway around the Beltway from there, however, Maryland does not sign the equivalent thru movement on the Outer Loop (where I-95 splits off and heads north) as an "exit" even though the situation is essentially the same. I personally think Maryland's way of doing it makes more sense because it seems to me most motorists will view the road as "the Beltway" regardless of route number (though for years when the eastern Beltway was posted solely as I-95 and the western Beltway was solely I-495, people kept saying that was "confusing").
Interestingly enough, North Carolina has two examples that show both scenarios mentioned above, both fairly new.
In Greensboro, I-73 overlaps I-840 for its first three miles, and uses I-73 milemarkers and exit numbers, going from the 100s down to single digits once I-73 exits.
In Raleigh, I-87 overlaps I-440 for its last three miles, and still retains I-440 milemarkers and exit numbers with no intention of changing this.
Quote from: ilpt4u on July 13, 2020, 10:58:07 PM
That said, a sudden change from counting up to counting down for mileage (putting it another way, where the max mileage from both states meet at one point), does that have precedent, when crossing the state line?
Just in the last two years, when I-95 became I-295 in Pennsylvania and New Jersey, mileposts and exit numbers increase in both directions of I-295 toward the state line (Delaware River). Of course, the cardinal directions also change at the state line, which makes this happen. Pa-bound, for instance, increases to 76 (as North), then decreases from 10 (as West).
I did not think there were too many cases like this.
Quote from: 1995hoo on July 16, 2020, 11:29:29 AM
See above. Again, you're sort of making my point. Certainly we know various highway departments will ignore MUTCD guidance when the guidance doesn't make sense. For example, on the Beltway in Virginia, VDOT signs the straight-thru movement on the Inner Loop (where I-95 splits off and heads south) as an "exit," even though you're staying on the same highway, because they say that's what the MUTCD requires because you have to "exit" I-95 onto I-495. Halfway around the Beltway from there, however, Maryland does not sign the equivalent thru movement on the Outer Loop (where I-95 splits off and heads north) as an "exit" even though the situation is essentially the same. I personally think Maryland's way of doing it makes more sense because it seems to me most motorists will view the road as "the Beltway" regardless of route number (though for years when the eastern Beltway was posted solely as I-95 and the western Beltway was solely I-495, people kept saying that was "confusing").
You could say Maryland is prioritizing I-495's numbers over I-95's in that case, seeing as they're otherwise the same on the Maryland side.
Quote from: CardInLex on July 16, 2020, 10:51:46 AM
Out if curiosity, I looked to see if there are any rules mentioned in the MUTCD about this. Couldn't find language that specified what to do... but the sample diagram does show that you start at the southernmost point and proceed clockwise.
Correction: after further reading the MUTCD does specify this as the way to do it. However, as others have pointed out there are countless examples where this rule is not followed.
Quote from: 1995hoo on July 16, 2020, 11:07:28 AM
Quote from: CardInLex on July 16, 2020, 10:51:46 AM
Out if curiosity, I looked to see if there are any rules mentioned in the MUTCD about this. Couldn't find language that specified what to do... but the sample diagram does show that you start at the southernmost point and proceed clockwise.
As with everything else, it's subject to exceptions. In the case of the Capital Beltway, for example, the standard convention is trumped by I-95 running along the eastern half of the Beltway, which is why Maryland numbered their portion anticlockwise (I-95 mileposts from the state line up to where I-95 leaves the Beltway to head north to Baltimore, and then continuing that numbering around the rest of the Beltway). Virginia had separate exit numbers for a good 20 years or so, but some people apparently found it confusing and eventually Virginia decided to continue Maryland's numbering with the exception of the seven-mile segment of Virginia's Beltway that's used by I-95.
In other words, if a 2di shares pavement with a 3di, the theory is that the 2di's numbering would trump the 3di's because the 2di is the "primary" route, even when the result is something that's likely to be illogical to the average motorist who has never heard of the MUTCD (such as Virginia's Beltway abruptly jumping from Exit 57 to Exit 173 within three miles). Of course, it's also fair to recognize that a local driver who uses the road on a regular basis should know about the inconsistency and be used to it, but I never underestimate the ignorance of the average motorist based on some of the letters I saw in the Washington Post's "Dr. Gridlock" column over the years.
I stand corrected. Didn't know MUTCD requires it clockwise from the southernmost point!
Quote from: sprjus4 on July 13, 2020, 01:44:59 AM
I-610 around Houston and I-410 around San Antonio both increase counter-clockwise.
Um, they increase clockwise. zero for I-410 at the southern intersection at I-35, running clockwise the intersection with I-10 is Exit 16
I-610 zero mile post is at SH-288 running clockwise the turn at Post Oak Rd. is at mile 4
Quote from: ethanhopkin14 on July 17, 2020, 05:14:27 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on July 13, 2020, 01:44:59 AM
I-610 around Houston and I-410 around San Antonio both increase counter-clockwise.
Um, they increase clockwise. zero for I-410 at the southern intersection at I-35, running clockwise the intersection with I-10 is Exit 16
I-610 zero mile post is at SH-288 running clockwise the turn at Post Oak Rd. is at mile 4
For some reason, I had thought otherwise. You are correct.
Quote from: ilpt4u on July 16, 2020, 11:18:40 AM
I-80/294 uses I-294's Mileage and Exits.
Which becomes a really bizarre decision when:
a. I-80/94 uses I-80's Mileage east of there, resetting after 2 miles going east into Indiana and neither Interstate uses I-80's mileage after they split going west (meaning Torrence is exit 161, but no matter which way you go, the next exit number is much lower)
b. I-294 terminates at the east end of the segment
c. I-80 mile markers are used on both sides of it
d. I-80 runs in the natural direction of the concurrency
And in Knoxville, I-75 uses I-640 miles and exits between I-75/I-275 and I-40.
Quote from: Super Mateo on July 18, 2020, 06:52:15 AM
Quote from: ilpt4u on July 16, 2020, 11:18:40 AM
I-80/294 uses I-294's Mileage and Exits.
Which becomes a really bizarre decision when:
a. I-80/94 uses I-80's Mileage east of there, resetting after 2 miles going east into Indiana and neither Interstate uses I-80's mileage after they split going west (meaning Torrence is exit 161, but no matter which way you go, the next exit number is much lower)
b. I-294 terminates at the east end of the segment
c. I-80 mile markers are used on both sides of it
d. I-80 runs in the natural direction of the concurrency
Agreed. When the Tollway added exit numbers and redid the Tri-State MMs anyway, bringing the I-94 section into statewide I-94 mileage, the Southbound I-294 mileage should either "Zero" at the I-80/294 interchange, or keep "Zero" at the 80/94/294/394 interchange, but the SB I-80 exit should be the last exit with 294's numbering scheme, and the E-W multiplexed 80/294 section should use 80's MMs and exit numbers
It was important to unify I-94's exit numbers and MMs across the state/with IDOT, but somehow not I-80's. There is a logical flaw for how that thought process played out
The Athens Perimeter (GA 10 Loop) used to number in a clockwise direction but for some reason was changed to counterclockwise in 2004. Numbering starts at the US 29/US 78/GA 316 interchange at the southwest end.
Quote from: 1995hoo on July 16, 2020, 11:29:29 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 16, 2020, 11:16:38 AM
Quote from: 1995hoo on July 16, 2020, 11:07:28 AM
Quote from: CardInLex on July 16, 2020, 10:51:46 AM
Out if curiosity, I looked to see if there are any rules mentioned in the MUTCD about this. Couldn't find language that specified what to do... but the sample diagram does show that you start at the southernmost point and proceed clockwise.
As with everything else, it's subject to exceptions. In the case of the Capital Beltway, for example, the standard convention is trumped by I-95 running along the eastern half of the Beltway, which is why Maryland numbered their portion anticlockwise (I-95 mileposts from the state line up to where I-95 leaves the Beltway to head north to Baltimore, and then continuing that numbering around the rest of the Beltway). Virginia had separate exit numbers for a good 20 years or so, but some people apparently found it confusing and eventually Virginia decided to continue Maryland's numbering with the exception of the seven-mile segment of Virginia's Beltway that's used by I-95.
In other words, if a 2di shares pavement with a 3di, the theory is that the 2di's numbering would trump the 3di's because the 2di is the "primary" route, even when the result is something that's likely to be illogical to the average motorist who has never heard of the MUTCD (such as Virginia's Beltway abruptly jumping from Exit 57 to Exit 173 within three miles). Of course, it's also fair to recognize that a local driver who uses the road on a regular basis should know about the inconsistency and be used to it, but I never underestimate the ignorance of the average motorist based on some of the letters I saw in the Washington Post's "Dr. Gridlock" column over the years.
I-465 in Indiana does not give way to I-74 (nor will it to I-69 when finished) in mileage markers or exit numbers. In fact, while I-74 is clearly signed during its concurrency with I-465, I've never once in my life heard anybody refer to the road as 74, either along or in conjunction with 465. Everybody just calls it 465. If you polled people who regularly drive on that section of 465, I'd guess that at least half don't even realize that the road is also 74.
You're sort of making my point for me. I said "the theory" is that the 2di should trump, but I don't think most people out on the road view it that way.
Quote from: ilpt4u on July 16, 2020, 11:18:40 AM
Quote from: 1995hoo on July 16, 2020, 11:07:28 AM
In other words, if a 2di shares pavement with a 3di, the theory is that the 2di's numbering would trump the 3di's because the 2di is the "primary" route, even when the result is something that's likely to be illogical to the average motorist who has never heard of the MUTCD
Some Midwest 3di's challenge your notion about this theory that that 2di's numbering trumps the 3di's when multiplexed
I-80/294 uses I-294's Mileage and Exits. I-74/465 uses I-465's Mileage and Exits. I-41/43/894 uses I-894's Mileage and Exits. I-94/694 uses I-494/694's Mileage and Exits
I-74/275 does have I-74's Mileage and Exits take over the Cincy Beltway Mileage for the short multiplex segment, as a case supporting your theory
See above. Again, you're sort of making my point. Certainly we know various highway departments will ignore MUTCD guidance when the guidance doesn't make sense. For example, on the Beltway in Virginia, VDOT signs the straight-thru movement on the Inner Loop (where I-95 splits off and heads south) as an "exit," even though you're staying on the same highway, because they say that's what the MUTCD requires because you have to "exit" I-95 onto I-495. Halfway around the Beltway from there, however, Maryland does not sign the equivalent thru movement on the Outer Loop (where I-95 splits off and heads north) as an "exit" even though the situation is essentially the same. I personally think Maryland's way of doing it makes more sense because it seems to me most motorists will view the road as "the Beltway" regardless of route number (though for years when the eastern Beltway was posted solely as I-95 and the western Beltway was solely I-495, people kept saying that was "confusing").
Not in Minnesota as I-94 gives up its exit numbers for the combination I-694 and I-494 which retain a full circle of exit numbers. There is no Trumping here lol!
Quote from: US 89 on July 20, 2020, 02:41:42 PM
The Athens Perimeter (GA 10 Loop) used to number in a clockwise direction but for some reason was changed to counterclockwise in 2004. Numbering starts at the US 29/US 78/GA 316 interchange at the southwest end.
I was about to mention the Athens Perimeter. The interchanges were unnumbered until 2000, after which they were numbered clockwise by affixing new sign-width tabs on top of the existing signs (including some older button-copy signs). Then, when GDOT replaced all the signs in 2004, the interchanges were renumbered counterclockwise. Weird.
I hope the Perimeter gets the new-style GDOT signs soon. There's already two on the "outer" (counterclockwise) Perimeter at the Milledge Avenue interchange. A new gantry with the new signs was installed about two years ago, finally replacing the old gantry that magically disappeared about 10 years ago.
Both Az Loop 101 and Loop 202 Counterclockwise
Loop 303 ?