In all of my travels, I look for the good and often come across the depressing.
#1 Cairo, IL: It was a typical gloomy early spring day the day I stopped there. The sun, despite trying to fully reveal itself, cast a wan light. The wind, blowing up from the Gulf made the air feel mild. The town was dead quiet, the only sounds were aluminum cans and other items of litter blowing up the street. Seeing the abandoned and burned out houses and buildings made me feel a sense of loss. All the sense of pride that the residents had in their town seemed to have dissipated a long time ago.
#2 Erie, PA: I had been there twice, and both times it was in the evening.
#3 Cleveland, OH: Truly a depressing city.
New Straitsville, OH, by far left the most depressing impression on me. Been to Erie and Cleveland as well, but neither of those places were half of a downer as that little town in southern Ohio.
Stockton, California. Went through there twice this year and once in 2017 and while the northwest part of town near San Joaquin Delta College and the two malls (Weberstown and Sherwood) and up to Miracle Mile is decent, the downtown area is pretty much either devoid of people or run down, or both. Even the area around Stockton Arena isn't all that much better than the rest of the district.
The portions of town where old US 99 (Wilson Way) and old US 50/Route 4 (Charter Way originally, now Martin Luther King Jr. Boulevard) cross are a bit more lively, but still pretty run down.
Gary, Indiana by far. My home city of Detroit is pretty depressing too but at least it still has a pulse and people who care about it.
East St. Louis, IL. No contest.
Colorado edition: Alamosa.
Chris
Franklin, VA
Weldon and Rocky Mount in North Carolina. They both just seemed like old, run-down, economically-depressed, dying areas. Empty storefronts, dilapidated buildings, etc.
Kermit (TX) was pretty depressing.
Also...
Wait for it...
We've done this before. (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=27819.msg2539981#msg2539981)
I've passed through Death Valley on Amtrak, which is depressed (i.e. lower elevation than its surroundings).
(Death Valley is farther north than I thought.)
Quote from: 1995hoo on December 16, 2020, 11:33:44 AM
Weldon and Rocky Mount in North Carolina. They both just seemed like old, run-down, economically-depressed, dying areas. Empty storefronts, dilapidated buildings, etc.
Around when was this with Rocky Mount? They seem to have made an effort to clean up the downtown area and are still undergoing a bit of local revitalization (along with other economically depressed places in Eastern NC like Goldsboro) although under the hood, all still isn't well.
Personally the most depressing place I've been to is the sort of out-of-the-way, rural bits of the northern Shenandoah Valley. A lot of unincorporated towns and crossroads so no one town in particular. Everything seemed so dumpy and ran down there, traces of former industry, you can tell a lot of stuff there is just remnants of a former golden age. I had visited my grandmother in a nursing home and even in that place, everything kind of felt so dead and depressing. Nobody really seemed happy at all.
Quote from: 1 on December 16, 2020, 11:47:43 AM
I've passed through Death Valley on Amtrak, which is depressed (i.e. lower elevation than its surroundings).
Speaking of the desert probably the most depressing place in California that I can think of is Needles. That's some serious decline and neglect going on in that city.
Edit: I thought that you probably referring to Needles above but I wasn't quite sure you weren't making a geology joke about Death Valley either. I just saw you edit so I assume you probably were thinking of Needles?
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on December 16, 2020, 11:49:35 AM
Speaking of the desert probably the most depressing place in California that I can think of is Needles. That's some serious decline and neglect going on in that city.
I've never been to England.
Cincinnati during winter from about 1987 to about 2005 looked like something out of eastern Europe in the Soviet era.
South Bend, IN
Utica, Thunder Bay, Forest City, MN.
Keiser, West Virginia; Glendive, Montana; Salesville, Ohio.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on December 16, 2020, 01:50:27 PM
Utica ... MN.
Utica, NY is much larger, but probably even more depressing.
Quote from: webny99 on December 16, 2020, 02:46:53 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on December 16, 2020, 01:50:27 PM
Utica ... MN.
Utica, NY is much larger, but probably even more depressing.
A friend of mine from there said the big thing to do is watch buildings be demolished.
From the looks of things, Utica, MN is a ghost town.
Quote from: Rothman on December 16, 2020, 03:11:33 PM
Quote from: webny99 on December 16, 2020, 02:46:53 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on December 16, 2020, 01:50:27 PM
Utica ... MN.
Utica, NY is much larger, but probably even more depressing.
A friend of mine from there said the big thing to do is watch buildings be demolished.
My personal big thing to do there is fuel up on the way to the Adirondacks! :D
Quote from: Rothman on December 16, 2020, 03:11:33 PM
From the looks of things, Utica, MN is a ghost town.
Population 291, so not far off.
Quote from: index on December 16, 2020, 11:49:13 AM
Quote from: 1995hoo on December 16, 2020, 11:33:44 AM
Weldon and Rocky Mount in North Carolina. They both just seemed like old, run-down, economically-depressed, dying areas. Empty storefronts, dilapidated buildings, etc.
Around when was this with Rocky Mount? They seem to have made an effort to clean up the downtown area and are still undergoing a bit of local revitalization (along with other economically depressed places in Eastern NC like Goldsboro) although under the hood, all still isn't well.
Personally the most depressing place I've been to is the sort of out-of-the-way, rural bits of the northern Shenandoah Valley. A lot of unincorporated towns and crossroads so no one town in particular. Everything seemed so dumpy and ran down there, traces of former industry, you can tell a lot of stuff there is just remnants of a former golden age. I had visited my grandmother in a nursing home and even in that place, everything kind of felt so dead and depressing. Nobody really seemed happy at all.
I drove through Rocky Mount about a year ago now. It was very hit and miss. There was new development, but I could also see where there were areas where time had gone by. Weldon, meanwhile, gets overshadowed by the relative glitz (heh) of Roanoke Rapids.
In addition to Franklin, the general vibe of the towns south of Richmond on 301/95 is pretty depressing. Jarratt, Petersburg, Stony Creek...even Emporia is pretty run down once you get away from the bypasses.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on December 16, 2020, 11:49:35 AM
Speaking of the desert
Along our usual route in Mexico, there is a whole string of really depressing "towns" along Carr. Fed. 40.
The largest (and not very depressing) has a population of 423. But
here's one (https://goo.gl/maps/sm5jM38FU2eRdE9n7) with a population of 57. And
here's one (https://goo.gl/maps/MUFBt2QzFcnkoZ1D9) with a population of 73, just named "Kilómetro 64". There's no money in these villages. Because they're on a federal highway, practically every house doubles as a "restaurant" for truckers to stop at and/or a tire re-vulcanization shop. It's hard to see houses that look uninhabitable, missing wall or even a section of the roof, with residents sitting inside. What do they do when the rain comes, when the temp drops to below freezing in the winter?
In July 2014, my traveling companion's front wheel bearing broke along this stretch of road. He and I and a couple of hitchhikers from the back of his pickup started hunting in these villages for a real mechanic–not just a tire re-vulcanization shop–stopping in each village along the way and asking around. Each time, the answer was just "
no, puro vulka" and a suggestion to try the next village down the road. Finally, on the outskirts of a large-ish village (pop. 376), we ended up finding
this mechanic shop (https://goo.gl/maps/htrHbgXGPcDYWJwe7). Rusty car parts piled up in the dirt, inoperable vehicles out back of the building, and a mechanic who'd had a tracheotomy and couldn't sound out vowels. With only one day left on our tourist cards and vehicle permits, it was more than a little stressful.
Now that friend has a wife and two kids and a baby on the way, they live near there, and they do mission work in villages just like those alongside a local pastor.
Quote from: CapeCodder on December 16, 2020, 10:39:09 AM
#3 Cleveland, OH: Truly a depressing city.
It reminds me of the ending of a video posted by local Cleveland comedian Mike Polk said "Cleveland still not Detroit".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIbmT2Rs8vw
I've heard that "Cleveland rocks".
Quote from: Stephane Dumas on December 16, 2020, 04:11:40 PM
Quote from: CapeCodder on December 16, 2020, 10:39:09 AM
#3 Cleveland, OH: Truly a depressing city.
It reminds me of the ending of a video posted by local Cleveland comedian Mike Polk said "Cleveland still not Detroit".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIbmT2Rs8vw
I love those videos. My favorite part was when it showed the Browns' stadium. There was a lot of hype around the Browns that offseason, so Polk sung "this place is no longer haunted by sadness". What happened the next season? The Browns were the most disappointing team in the league. Sums up Cleveland sports.
Welch, WV.
Anyone who has been to the former USSR wins this thread.
Can I just nominate all of Coal Country, PA? It's really hard to pick one town in there, they're all so depressingly sad that it all blends together.
Quote from: hbelkins on December 16, 2020, 05:38:15 PM
Welch, WV.
There and Grundy, VA are my other contenders.
Re: Cleveland, my one visit to downtown was actually quite enjoyable. It is the Rust Belt, for sure, but it's still got cool vibes, and parts of downtown are on the upswing.
Same could be said of parts of downtown Detroit, I guess, but those areas felt oddly empty and out of place, almost like they bulldozed it, started over, and forgot to keep the people.
Quote from: cl94 on December 16, 2020, 05:46:06 PM
Can I just nominate all of Coal Country, PA? It's really hard to pick one town in there, they're all so depressingly sad that it all blends together.
Quote from: hbelkins on December 16, 2020, 05:38:15 PM
Welch, WV.
There and Grundy, VA are my other contenders.
Grundy was the butt of a lot of family jokes when I was growing up, but the last time I was through there, it didn't look as bad as I remembered.
Quote from: cl94 on December 16, 2020, 05:46:06 PM
Can I just nominate all of Coal Country, PA? It's really hard to pick one town in there, they're all so depressingly sad that it all blends together.
I agree. Much more depressing even than Upstate NY for some reason, and I don't think it's home state bias.
Presumably Johnsonburg (https://www.google.com/maps/@41.4914502,-78.6811933,3a,90y,73.84h,95.65t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sHNdo-macPTsj-lCfTUl9Hg!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo2.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3DHNdo-macPTsj-lCfTUl9Hg%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D257.61096%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656!5m1!1e1) is too far west to be considered Coal Country, otherwise that would be my pick.
Quote from: ozarkman417 on December 16, 2020, 05:40:20 PM
Anyone who has been to the former USSR wins this thread.
I've heard good things about Moscow.
Idk why, but Carthage, TX always feels somewhat sad every time I drive past it.
Quote from: ozarkman417 on December 16, 2020, 05:40:20 PM
Anyone who has been to the former USSR wins this thread.
I quite liked St. Petersburg, although I wouldn't choose to live there.
The Monongahela River Valley south of Pittsburgh has several towns and cities that have seen way better days. Homestead (outside of the Waterfront development), Braddock, Duquesne, McKeesport, Clairton, Donora, Monessen and Brownsville meet the criteria. Most of these places were important steelmaking centers at one time. When the steel industry left, so did most of the people. Braddock and Clairton still have working mills, however the towns themselves have hemorrhaged people.
Population loss of the above cities from their peaks to 2010 census:
Homestead - 20,452 (1920) -> 3,165 (2010)
Braddock - 20,879 (1920) -> 2,159 (2010)
Duquesne - 21,396 (1930) -> 5,565 (2010)
McKeesport - 55,355 (1940) -> 19,731 (2010)
Clairton - 19,652 (1950) -> 6,796 (2010)
Donora - 14,131 (1920) -> 4,781 (2010)
Monessen - 20,268 (1930) -> 7,720 (2010)
Brownsville - 8,015 (1940) -> 2,331 (2010)
Quote from: 1995hoo on December 16, 2020, 07:15:52 PM
Quote from: ozarkman417 on December 16, 2020, 05:40:20 PM
Anyone who has been to the former USSR wins this thread.
I quite liked St. Petersburg, although I wouldn't choose to live there.
I lived in Volgograd. Ozark's clueless.
Then as someone who has actually lived in the former USSR, unlike myself who has only gone as far east as Austria, you may at least see where I'm coming from with that statement, as stereotypical it may be. I'm aware that the larger cities in Russia have some unique and visually appealing buildings, like palaces, Orthodox Churches, etc. What they also have is widespread brutalist/Stalinist buildings in much of the other places in those same cities.
Quote from: ozarkman417 on December 16, 2020, 09:30:17 PM
Then as someone who has actually lived in the former USSR, unlike myself who has only gone as far east as Austria, you may at least see where I'm coming from with that statement, as stereotypical it may be. I'm aware that the larger cities in Russia have some unique and visually appealing buildings, like palaces, Orthodox Churches, etc. What they also have is widespread brutalist/Stalinist buildings in much of the other places in those same cities.
I saw plenty of brutalist/Stalinist buildings in Warsaw, but that doesn't mean it was a depressing city. The residents in those brutalist apartment blocks often decorate their windows with flowers and lace, which makes for a fascinating visual appeal. Street vendors selling pastry down below. I saw 'La Traviata' at the national opera there (well, I slept through a lot of it due to jetlag).
East St. Louis by far for me.
Globe, Arizona Everything seemed so old and decaying. but much worse is Desert Center, California. Absolutely nothing there but dead and burnt palm trees
Quote from: kphoger on December 16, 2020, 10:37:18 PM
Quote from: ozarkman417 on December 16, 2020, 09:30:17 PM
Then as someone who has actually lived in the former USSR, unlike myself who has only gone as far east as Austria, you may at least see where I'm coming from with that statement, as stereotypical it may be. I'm aware that the larger cities in Russia have some unique and visually appealing buildings, like palaces, Orthodox Churches, etc. What they also have is widespread brutalist/Stalinist buildings in much of the other places in those same cities.
I saw plenty of brutalist/Stalinist buildings in Warsaw, but that doesn't mean it was a depressing city. The residents in those brutalist apartment blocks often decorate their windows with flowers and lace, which makes for a fascinating visual appeal. Street vendors selling pastry down below. I saw 'La Traviata' at the national opera there (well, I slept through a lot of it due to jetlag).
Easter in Volgograd was the greatest holiday celebration I've ever experienced. More festive than anything I've experienced stateside. Anything but depressing.
And I was there during the Yeltsin era...
I kind of walked into that above, didn't I.
As much as I enjoyed Superior, there was a strong simultaneous mix of hopefulness/pride and depression in that city.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on December 16, 2020, 11:49:35 AM
Quote from: 1 on December 16, 2020, 11:47:43 AM
I've passed through Death Valley on Amtrak, which is depressed (i.e. lower elevation than its surroundings).
Speaking of the desert probably the most depressing place in California that I can think of is Needles. That’s some serious decline and neglect going on in that city.
Edit: I thought that you probably referring to Needles above but I wasn’t quite sure you weren’t making a geology joke about Death Valley either. I just saw you edit so I assume you probably were thinking of Needles?
I was going to post Needles as well. Add Tucamcari NM as another lousy US 66 city.
Rick
As for the most depressing state as a whole, it's gotta be West Virginia, right?
It's too bad since it's so scenic, but I don't see any other state topping it for being neglected and left behind.
Mississippi, maybe? Louisiana? Those at least have some decent-sized cities in Jackson, Baton Rouge, and New Orleans that could potentially keep people in-state.
I could go with any number of small towns here in farm country and more specifically small towns where I have a relative or 2, but I'll go the other way and say Gary, Indiana.
Quote from: CapeCodder on December 16, 2020, 10:39:09 AM
#3 Cleveland, OH: Truly a depressing city.
That one is up there on my list.
Quote from: Rothman on December 16, 2020, 10:58:39 PM
Quote from: kphoger on December 16, 2020, 10:37:18 PM
Quote from: ozarkman417 on December 16, 2020, 09:30:17 PM
Then as someone who has actually lived in the former USSR, unlike myself who has only gone as far east as Austria, you may at least see where I'm coming from with that statement, as stereotypical it may be. I'm aware that the larger cities in Russia have some unique and visually appealing buildings, like palaces, Orthodox Churches, etc. What they also have is widespread brutalist/Stalinist buildings in much of the other places in those same cities.
I saw plenty of brutalist/Stalinist buildings in Warsaw, but that doesn't mean it was a depressing city. The residents in those brutalist apartment blocks often decorate their windows with flowers and lace, which makes for a fascinating visual appeal. Street vendors selling pastry down below. I saw 'La Traviata' at the national opera there (well, I slept through a lot of it due to jetlag).
Easter in Volgograd was the greatest holiday celebration I've ever experienced. More festive than anything I've experienced stateside. Anything but depressing.
And I was there during the Yeltsin era...
And, for those thinking we should talk about ex-USSR places outside of Russia–
this (https://goo.gl/maps/ks8bAej5heM7yPoG7) and
this (https://goo.gl/maps/YV12AsAKp9TTLZ9YA) don't exactly seem "depressing" to me.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on December 17, 2020, 02:09:34 PM
I kind of walked into that above, didn't I.
As much as I enjoyed Superior, there was a strong simultaneous mix of hopefulness/pride and depression in that city.
I ran for City Council in Superior. Lost the election, but ended up participating in their lobbying effort ("Superior Days") and ended up on their Zoning Board of Appeals.
It is an interesting little city precisely for what you describe. Locals love their city, but have thrown up their hands at their economic troubles and alcoholism, especially. When I lived there, some kid in the area (greater Duluth area) ended up dead nearly every weekend from DUI. The community just sort of nodded as if they couldn't do anything about it.
So yeah, lots of pride with an underlying depression/hopelessness.
Quote from: Rothman on December 16, 2020, 05:50:20 PM
Quote from: cl94 on December 16, 2020, 05:46:06 PM
Can I just nominate all of Coal Country, PA? It's really hard to pick one town in there, they're all so depressingly sad that it all blends together.
Quote from: hbelkins on December 16, 2020, 05:38:15 PM
Welch, WV.
There and Grundy, VA are my other contenders.
Grundy was the butt of a lot of family jokes when I was growing up, but the last time I was through there, it didn't look as bad as I remembered.
Much of Grundy has been rebuilt due to a flood plain relocation program.
Gary IN
Duluth sold itself out to become a tourist mecca which cleaned up a lot of the grit along the lakeshore (but don't go north of Superior Street or west of Mesaba :D ), though all the problems with employment, substance abuse, etc. still remain beneath the carefully polished surface. Superior never went that route so all of that remains in the open.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on December 17, 2020, 03:36:16 PM
Duluth sold itself out to become a tourist mecca which cleaned up a lot of the grit along the lakeshore (but don't go north of Superior Street or west of Mesaba :D ), though all the problems with employment, substance abuse, etc. still remain beneath the carefully polished surface. Superior never went that route so all of that remains in the open.
I just miss the House of Donuts, Tacos and Subs. Complete with their bizarre labor/union issues.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on December 17, 2020, 03:36:16 PM
Duluth sold itself out to become a tourist mecca which cleaned up a lot of the grit along the lakeshore (but don't go north of Superior Street or west of Mesaba :D ), though all the problems with employment, substance abuse, etc. still remain beneath the carefully polished surface. Superior never went that route so all of that remains in the open.
I went poking around on Streetview and man does Superior have a lot of bars.
Quote from: GCrites80s on December 19, 2020, 07:18:10 PM
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on December 17, 2020, 03:36:16 PM
Duluth sold itself out to become a tourist mecca which cleaned up a lot of the grit along the lakeshore (but don't go north of Superior Street or west of Mesaba :D ), though all the problems with employment, substance abuse, etc. still remain beneath the carefully polished surface. Superior never went that route so all of that remains in the open.
I went poking around on Streetview and man does Superior have a lot of bars.
Locals say that once it was identified as the city with the most bars per capita in the country. Sailors + railroad workers...
Quote from: ET21 on December 17, 2020, 03:24:41 PM
Gary IN
Worst city in Indiana by far, for at least the last 60 years. My grandmother taught school in Miller Beach, on the east side of the city and was Gary's last viable neighborhood in the '50s and '60s (not sure if it still is), for 30 years before retiring in 1968. And it was going downhill then.
But as far as other dirtbag towns go, I've never stayed overnight in a worse town than Gallup NM. Cheap rooms on old Route 66, but no place to eat at night. We got warned by the motel manager where we stayed that Native American and Mexican-American gangs took over the restaurants and bars after about 9 PM. Fortunately, we were able to find a place to eat before then. This was in 1994. Never again.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on December 16, 2020, 11:49:35 AM
Quote from: 1 on December 16, 2020, 11:47:43 AM
I've passed through Death Valley on Amtrak, which is depressed (i.e. lower elevation than its surroundings).
Speaking of the desert probably the most depressing place in California that I can think of is Needles. That's some serious decline and neglect going on in that city.
Edit: I thought that you probably referring to Needles above but I wasn't quite sure you weren't making a geology joke about Death Valley either. I just saw you edit so I assume you probably were thinking of Needles?
Even as depressing as Needles is, the worst is yet to come for that place. After all, it could become a generally accepted practice among California drivers to hold off on gas buying until the Lake Havasu City exit (AZ Exit 9 on I-40), where gas prices are at least $1.75/gallon lower than Needles.
Quote from: brad2971 on December 19, 2020, 11:43:35 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on December 16, 2020, 11:49:35 AM
Quote from: 1 on December 16, 2020, 11:47:43 AM
I've passed through Death Valley on Amtrak, which is depressed (i.e. lower elevation than its surroundings).
Speaking of the desert probably the most depressing place in California that I can think of is Needles. That's some serious decline and neglect going on in that city.
Edit: I thought that you probably referring to Needles above but I wasn't quite sure you weren't making a geology joke about Death Valley either. I just saw you edit so I assume you probably were thinking of Needles?
Even as depressing as Needles is, the worst is yet to come for that place. After all, it could become a generally accepted practice among California drivers to hold off on gas buying until the Lake Havasu City exit (AZ Exit 9 on I-40), where gas prices are at least $1.75/gallon lower than Needles.
Even driving over the State Line to AZ 95 yields a $1 dollar a gallon savings at minimum. I'm kind of surprised no enterprising casino out of Laughlin hasn't put a gas station on Needles Highway.
Blythe, CA is pretty depressing, too. There is little interesting or picturesque in that town.
I remember spending the night at a hotel on US 95 in Blythe back in 1999, and not being able to fall asleep because someone would go to the ice machine every five minutes.
Da YooPee of Michigan is a pretty steady depression to drive around in, the whole thing just seems so run down and threadbare. Even in a twin-city metro, the contrast between Marinette, WI and Menominee, MI is STARK. IMHO most depressing of all is Ontonagon, MI. That place has been turning into a literal ghost town ever since the Smurfitt-Stone paper mill there shut down and was demoed in the mid-to-late 00s. Then the drive to it on US 45, all the way from the Wisconsin state line, is even more of a downer. And there are smaller mining and other ghost towns scattered all over (it is a great area to drive around in if you are into ghost-towning). Flint, MI has nothing on that area, IMHO.
For Wisconsin, I'd say Ashland is up there in depressing. Elsewhere in Wisconsin, the most depressing drive that I ever remember was on US 12 between Black River Falls and Tomah. Millston, WI may as well not even be there.
:no:
Mike
I live just outside of one of the most depressing cities in Michigan which is Saginaw. It's probably not the most depressing town I've been to because Flint, Pontiac and Detroit are equally as depressing. These four Michigan cities I mentioned are all dying towns that were once thriving automotive towns. Now what's left of them is urban decay. high crime rates and other urban headaches.
I've been to Cairo, Illinois and although that is truly a depressing city I think it's not anymore depressing than what I deal with in these Michigan cities.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on December 16, 2020, 10:55:44 AM
Gary, Indiana by far. My home city of Detroit is pretty depressing too but at least it still has a pulse and people who care about it.
Although Gary is depressing I didn't think it was anymore depressing than say Flint or Pontiac. Your right about Detroit it still does have life to it and for the most part the downtown area is as nice as any other major cities downtown area. It's probably about 3 or 4 of Detroit's 139 square miles that are actually considered nice but the other 136 square miles or so are just dreadful.
Quote from: KeithE4Phx on December 19, 2020, 10:37:28 PM
Quote from: ET21 on December 17, 2020, 03:24:41 PM
Gary IN
Worst city in Indiana by far, for at least the last 60 years. My grandmother taught school in Miller Beach, on the east side of the city and was Gary's last viable neighborhood in the '50s and '60s (not sure if it still is), for 30 years before retiring in 1968. And it was going downhill then.
But as far as other dirtbag towns go, I've never stayed overnight in a worse town than Gallup NM. Cheap rooms on old Route 66, but no place to eat at night. We got warned by the motel manager where we stayed that Native American and Mexican-American gangs took over the restaurants and bars after about 9 PM. Fortunately, we were able to find a place to eat before then. This was in 1994. Never again.
If I can I always try to check out the area online before I stay somewhere but of course there are times where that is hard to do and you just have to stay somewhere for the night. I've had that issue and I think the worst hotel I've ever stayed at was one of those hotels south of Chicago near where I-80/94 enters the state from Indiana. I believe I either stayed at Motel 6 or Red Roof Inn I can't remember now but it wasn't the best of places to say the least. I thought well it's Chicago and the rates are this cheap something's wrong here.
Last time I stayed in the Chicago area I stayed at a Motel 6 in Elk Grove Village out near O'Hare. Well the hotel is now shuttered.
I never realized how high gas prices are in California.
Right now in Needles all stations are at $3.99 a gallon.
But in Bullhead City, AZ the lowest stations are at $1.75 a gallon.
That's a $2.24 a gallon difference.
Hell I could fill up my car twice for what I could spend in Needles compared to Bullhead City.
Quote from: Flint1979 on December 20, 2020, 05:22:25 AM
I never realized how high gas prices are in California.
Right now in Needles all stations are at $3.99 a gallon.
But in Bullhead City, AZ the lowest stations are at $1.75 a gallon.
That's a $2.24 a gallon difference.
Hell I could fill up my car twice for what I could spend in Needles compared to Bullhead City.
Needles isn't really representative of the rest of the state. My local gas station is $2.68 for 87 Octane as of today. Being out there all the way in the Mojave Desert has a huge one way delivery surcharge (California blend gasoline doesn't help) that gets passed onto the customer. Couple that with the typical freeway exit price bump and that's how you get $3.99 a gallon for gas.
No list would be complete without (and I'll attest to it myself; it's a disaster)...
Quote from: Concrete Bob on December 20, 2020, 01:11:54 AM
Blythe, CA is pretty depressing, too. There is little interesting or picturesque in that town.
I remember spending the night at a hotel on US 95 in Blythe back in 1999, and not being able to fall asleep because someone would go to the ice machine every five minutes.
So...Blythe is bad because of...people using the ice machine at a cheap motel... :D
Quote from: Rothman on December 20, 2020, 12:51:00 PM
Quote from: Concrete Bob on December 20, 2020, 01:11:54 AM
Blythe, CA is pretty depressing, too. There is little interesting or picturesque in that town.
I remember spending the night at a hotel on US 95 in Blythe back in 1999, and not being able to fall asleep because someone would go to the ice machine every five minutes.
So...Blythe is bad because of...people using the ice machine at a cheap motel... :D
Blythe is way more bland than it is depressing. There isn't much going on there aside from farming. I would say it has more in common with places like El Centro and Calexico than it does Needles.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on December 20, 2020, 09:30:41 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on December 20, 2020, 05:22:25 AM
I never realized how high gas prices are in California.
Right now in Needles all stations are at $3.99 a gallon.
But in Bullhead City, AZ the lowest stations are at $1.75 a gallon.
That's a $2.24 a gallon difference.
Hell I could fill up my car twice for what I could spend in Needles compared to Bullhead City.
Needles isn't really representative of the rest of the state. My local gas station is $2.68 for 87 Octane as of today. Being out there all the way in the Mojave Desert has a huge one way delivery surcharge (California blend gasoline doesn't help) that gets passed onto the customer. Couple that with the typical freeway exit price bump and that's how you get $3.99 a gallon for gas.
Couldn't either CARB or the CA Energy Commission give Needles and Blythe waivers from their regulations so that gas stations in both cities can get their gas supplies from AZ jobbers/suppliers at a lower cost?
Quote from: brad2971 on December 20, 2020, 01:14:33 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on December 20, 2020, 09:30:41 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on December 20, 2020, 05:22:25 AM
I never realized how high gas prices are in California.
Right now in Needles all stations are at $3.99 a gallon.
But in Bullhead City, AZ the lowest stations are at $1.75 a gallon.
That's a $2.24 a gallon difference.
Hell I could fill up my car twice for what I could spend in Needles compared to Bullhead City.
Needles isn't really representative of the rest of the state. My local gas station is $2.68 for 87 Octane as of today. Being out there all the way in the Mojave Desert has a huge one way delivery surcharge (California blend gasoline doesn't help) that gets passed onto the customer. Couple that with the typical freeway exit price bump and that's how you get $3.99 a gallon for gas.
Couldn't either CARB or the CA Energy Commission give Needles and Blythe waivers from their regulations so that gas stations in both cities can get their gas supplies from AZ jobbers/suppliers at a lower cost?
In theory but I'm not sure about that. What you see in Needles is common in other remote communities and gas stations throughout California. The gas prices are hugely affected when remote terrain and one way freight loads are involved. For comparison sake that's why the Florida Keys has way higher prices than the rest of the state, all one-way freight.
Camden, NJ
Trenton, NJ
Oxford, NC
Kenosha, WI - Drove through there a couple weeks ago down WI-32 Sheridan Rd. Kenosha always has had that "depressing" reputation, but after what happened there this summer, it feels even more depressing.
Quote from: ET21 on December 17, 2020, 03:24:41 PM
Gary IN
Yeah, Gary probably wins for most depressing. One place that doesn't top Gary but I found surprisingly depressing was Anderson. My first several visits were restricted to the IN 9 corridor and it seemed fine, but in the process of clinching highways I went through the core of the city and man it seemed desolate. Felt a lot like being in Gary.
Quote from: CapeCodder on December 16, 2020, 10:39:09 AM
#1 Cairo, IL: It was a typical gloomy early spring day the day I stopped there. The sun, despite trying to fully reveal itself, cast a wan light. The wind, blowing up from the Gulf made the air feel mild. The town was dead quiet, the only sounds were aluminum cans and other items of litter blowing up the street. Seeing the abandoned and burned out houses and buildings made me feel a sense of loss. All the sense of pride that the residents had in their town seemed to have dissipated a long time ago.
Write a novel, man. I'd read it.
As for depressing towns:
East St Louis
Parts of St Louis itself
Parts of Chicago
South Memphis
Some towns in southern Illinois and Missouri are absolutely gutted. Towns that have a four-way suspended beacon at the main intersection, surrounded by boarded up shops and crumbling buildings, are quintessential rural America for me.
Trenton, New Jersey is definitely the most depressing state capital I've ever visited.
Quote from: The Nature Boy on December 20, 2020, 11:00:26 PM
Trenton, New Jersey is definitely the most depressing state capital I've ever visited.
Have you been to TallaNasty?
Quote from: The Nature Boy on December 20, 2020, 11:00:26 PM
Trenton, New Jersey is definitely the most depressing state capital I've ever visited.
You have been to Springfield IL or Jefferson City MO?
Quote from: kevinb1994 on December 20, 2020, 11:07:01 PM
Quote from: The Nature Boy on December 20, 2020, 11:00:26 PM
Trenton, New Jersey is definitely the most depressing state capital I've ever visited.
Have you been to TallaNasty?
Have you been to Trenton? My father was from there. As he says now, "It looks like it's been bombed."
Fun fact: He, a white kid, got integrated into the suburban school along with kids of color in his neighborhood...
Quote from: STLmapboy on December 20, 2020, 10:40:26 PM
Quote from: CapeCodder on December 16, 2020, 10:39:09 AM
#1 Cairo, IL: It was a typical gloomy early spring day the day I stopped there. The sun, despite trying to fully reveal itself, cast a wan light. The wind, blowing up from the Gulf made the air feel mild. The town was dead quiet, the only sounds were aluminum cans and other items of litter blowing up the street. Seeing the abandoned and burned out houses and buildings made me feel a sense of loss. All the sense of pride that the residents had in their town seemed to have dissipated a long time ago.
Write a novel, man. I'd read it.
I had heard of Cairo before (and knew a little bit of its self-destructive history) and googled around and found this:
https://www.marinelog.com/coastal/inland/illinois-awards-40-million-grant-to-cairo-port-project/
https://www.wpsdlocal6.com/news/new-agreement-could-make-cairo-illinois-port-a-model-for-21st-century-container-shipping/article_55429666-f75f-11ea-ad40-8fc3a67d19bf.html
(The project was in the works all the way back to 2018, as this NPR piece on the city's troubles mentions - https://www.npr.org/2018/06/16/618959048/nobody-cares-about-cairo-residents-of-shrinking-river-town-fight-to-bring-it-bac )
Whether this will be enough to reverse a literal century of decline is anyone's guess, but interesting that the state hasn't completely given up on the town and region even after the locals' own racism/prejudice and railroad/road bypasses of the town had all but eroded away at the place in those 100 years.
Baltimore
Quote from: mgk920 on December 20, 2020, 02:10:29 AM
For Wisconsin, I'd say Ashland is up there in depressing.
Even more so since they tore down the ore dock. That was strangely beautiful monument to another era and the shore looks naked without it.
I'm gonna buck the trend of picking on rust belt cities and oil towns and call out vast swaths of suburbia for their endless, mostly empty parking lots, cookie-cutter housing and big box stores that look like warehouses. Everything built cheap, cheap, cheap. Sometimes, the stores have a fancy facade to make it look posh, but inside, it's all cheaply constructed because they know in 20 years it'll get torn down and replaced with something else.
The sterility of 'perfect' lawns, devote of any useful life. The pathetic attempt to make strip malls look 'old'. The intimate fascism of "home owners associations." The fact that 10 years earlier, it was all farm fields and woodlands.
I find it depressing.
Quote from: kevinb1994 on December 20, 2020, 11:07:01 PM
Quote from: The Nature Boy on December 20, 2020, 11:00:26 PM
Trenton, New Jersey is definitely the most depressing state capital I've ever visited.
Have you been to TallaNasty?
Erm, I'm a Gator and I wouldn't even call Tallahassee "nasty". Most of it cleans up quite well, though having the capital and a state university in your backyard helps. There's many other places in Florida that would outrank it, to me (though a great deal of familiarity doesn't bother me as much).
Trenton is kind of dumpy, but sometimes that's interesting to me...but the mere fact that the State Capitol building is boarded up (https://flic.kr/p/2iUfRR9) (as of 2019) was a bit of a shock to me. Government is always massively dysfunctional, but never quite so
disillusioning. It's the perfect metaphor
if everything and everyone else is so fine and dandy around the entirety your state that you could conceivably ignore that sort of fluffy thing...but I'm sure it's not.
Cairo is really high up there, but having spent 10 days there (work is a peach, isn't it?) at least there was a lot of interesting crumbling stuff to see - preferably in daylight - which was both eerie and neat at the same time. It's very post-apocalyptic but you can't help but feel that so much has been left to just become abandoned. The people I worked with were generally friendly; hell, I've met more depressing and annoying people in nicer towns. Off the main drag (US 51) there's still life and vitality, if not increasing property values. There were some interesting sights, and nobody bothered me when I took photos. Coming from someone who spent many decades in suburbia, there's some odd and curious vestiges of its past. It just seems that 20 years from now, there may very well be nothing to speak of.
Quote from: Rothman on December 20, 2020, 11:48:40 PM
Quote from: kevinb1994 on December 20, 2020, 11:07:01 PM
Quote from: The Nature Boy on December 20, 2020, 11:00:26 PM
Trenton, New Jersey is definitely the most depressing state capital I've ever visited.
Have you been to TallaNasty?
Have you been to Trenton? My father was from there. As he says now, "It looks like it's been bombed."
Fun fact: He, a white kid, got integrated into the suburban school along with kids of color in his neighborhood...
Trenton looks like an old industrial city that time has essentially forgotten. It's made more depressing by the fact that it's the seat of government for a relatively prosperous state. It shouldn't look that way but yet it does.
I've never been to Jeff City or Springfield so maybe they're worse but visiting Trenton was such a "wow" experience for me. I never could've imagined that the capital of New Jersey could look like the land that time forgot.
At least Albert Speer's plan for Germania included making the future ruins looking like something from antiquity. We can't even make a decent looking set of ruins anymore...LOL!
Rick
Quote from: nexus73 on December 21, 2020, 06:44:02 PM
At least Albert Speer's plan for Germania included making the future ruins looking like something from antiquity. We can't even make a decent looking set of ruins anymore...LOL!
Rick
To that end, as someone in the ghost town hobby I disagree as I've seen plenty of interesting modern ruins. Most of the intact stuff is located at remote former mining town locales like; New Idria, Bodie, and Vulture City. The closer a place is to civilization the faster it will be weathered by said civilization. It doesn't help modern construction is mostly prefab and really won't last long term. It also definitely in vogue to demolish structures that are considered blight as opposed to ignoring them.
I've been to a lot of small towns in Virginia but Stony Creek, VA seems pretty depressing to me. There are signs of the town's decline everywhere, including an abandoned elementary school along VA 40 BUSINESS in the western part of town that's been mostly reclaimed by nature.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on December 21, 2020, 07:51:00 PM
Quote from: nexus73 on December 21, 2020, 06:44:02 PM
At least Albert Speer's plan for Germania included making the future ruins looking like something from antiquity. We can't even make a decent looking set of ruins anymore...LOL!
Rick
To that end, as someone in the ghost town hobby I disagree as I’ve seen plenty of interesting modern ruins. Most of the intact stuff is located at remote former mining town locales like; New Idria, Bodie, and Vulture City. The closer a place is to civilization the faster it will be weathered by said civilization. It doesn’t help modern construction is mostly prefab and really won’t last long term. It also definitely in vogue to demolish structures that are considered blight as opposed to ignoring them.
For a small town on the verge of going ghost, Shaniko OR comes to mind. 100 years from now the ruins would look pretty good due to the very dry climate. When passing through Shaniko several years ago, I spotted a handful of abandoned cars from the early postwar period. The paint on them was weathered away while the chrome was spotless, rust free and shiny as can be.
Rick
Quote from: triplemultiplex on December 21, 2020, 11:42:17 AM
Quote from: mgk920 on December 20, 2020, 02:10:29 AM
For Wisconsin, I'd say Ashland is up there in depressing.
Even more so since they tore down the ore dock. That was strangely beautiful monument to another era and the shore looks naked without it.
I'm gonna buck the trend of picking on rust belt cities and oil towns and call out vast swaths of suburbia for their endless, mostly empty parking lots, cookie-cutter housing and big box stores that look like warehouses. Everything built cheap, cheap, cheap. Sometimes, the stores have a fancy facade to make it look posh, but inside, it's all cheaply constructed because they know in 20 years it'll get torn down and replaced with something else.
The sterility of 'perfect' lawns, devote of any useful life. The pathetic attempt to make strip malls look 'old'. The intimate fascism of "home owners associations." The fact that 10 years earlier, it was all farm fields and woodlands.
I find it depressing.
I'm thinking that due to a myriad of factors, including plummeting marriage rates, the Baby Boomer and 'Gen X' crowds aging and passing on, the evolving and changing priorities of the Millennial and post-Millennial crowds, even the poor build quality of many of the structures, that over the next few decades the ubiquitous 1970s-1990s era suburban 'McMansion' neighborhoods will become very depressing places, indeed.
Mike
Parts of Sandusky, OH are not the best, especially along OH-4, Monroe St, and 1st St. This might be part of why Cedar Point traffic is not directed to use OH-4 from the Turnpike, although it's quicker to use OH-4 (over US-250) if coming from Toledo and points west along the Turnpike.
Also in Ohio, Toledo has some depressed neighborhoods, especially along OH-2.
The south side of Lansing (MI) has also seen better days, especially along Cedar and Pennsylvania.
Quote from: ftballfan on December 23, 2020, 10:29:39 AM
Parts of Sandusky, OH are not the best, especially along OH-4, Monroe St, and 1st St. This might be part of why Cedar Point traffic is not directed to use OH-4 from the Turnpike, although it's quicker to use OH-4 (over US-250) if coming from Toledo and points west along the Turnpike.
Also in Ohio, Toledo has some depressed neighborhoods, especially along OH-2.
The south side of Lansing (MI) has also seen better days, especially along Cedar and Pennsylvania.
Lansing doesn't even come to mind as one of the more depressing cities in Michigan, I say that as a former resident. There too many part of that city that are active and lively to crack a list that has places like Detroit or Flint as headliners.
Quote from: ftballfan on December 23, 2020, 10:29:39 AM
Parts of Sandusky, OH are not the best, especially along OH-4, Monroe St, and 1st St. This might be part of why Cedar Point traffic is not directed to use OH-4 from the Turnpike, although it's quicker to use OH-4 (over US-250) if coming from Toledo and points west along the Turnpike.
Also in Ohio, Toledo has some depressed neighborhoods, especially along OH-2.
The south side of Lansing (MI) has also seen better days, especially along Cedar and Pennsylvania.
I've considered retiring on Cedar Point. Sandusky does have some suprisingly run down areas (especially compared to other amusement park towns, like Agawam, MA). I wouldn't call it depressing, though. And, New Straitsville is definitely a LOT worse.
Bay City, Michigan is a city that looks beat up in some areas especially on the South End coming in on Broadway (M-13). The downtown looks old and worn out and most of the rest of the city is very old looking. The State Park has a beach but I wouldn't suggest using it because of the water quality, much of the shoreline in this area is mudded with muck. The Saginaw River watershed collects a lot of pollution.
One would think Bay City isn't that bad but it certainly isn't as bad as Saginaw. Midland is the nicer of the three Tri-Cities. There is a Dow plant there and Dow pretty much dominates Midland. It has a nice downtown as well.
pueblo, co.
it just seems like a town that once was something, and now its just sort of dusty and largely irrelevant.
just an opinion.
Center Hill, Florida is kind of depressing (but also kind of cool) considering Market Street essentially is a crumbled ruin. Otter Creek is the only other incorporated community I can think of that looks like a run down ghost town.
Quote from: Rothman on December 23, 2020, 11:16:14 AM
Quote from: ftballfan on December 23, 2020, 10:29:39 AM
Parts of Sandusky, OH are not the best, especially along OH-4, Monroe St, and 1st St. This might be part of why Cedar Point traffic is not directed to use OH-4 from the Turnpike, although it's quicker to use OH-4 (over US-250) if coming from Toledo and points west along the Turnpike.
Also in Ohio, Toledo has some depressed neighborhoods, especially along OH-2.
The south side of Lansing (MI) has also seen better days, especially along Cedar and Pennsylvania.
I've considered retiring on Cedar Point. Sandusky does have some suprisingly run down areas (especially compared to other amusement park towns, like Agawam, MA). I wouldn't call it depressing, though. And, New Straitsville is definitely a LOT worse.
I don't mind New Straitsville. It's honesty in pretty typical condition for towns of that size in Appalachian Ohio. As someone who likes dirt bikes and quads it's sort of neat that it calls itself ATV Friendly City USA. Very few towns in Ohio allow these vehicles to be ridden into town from the trail system and campgrounds to visit local businesses. They also set up an outdoor ring and have pro wrestling in the streets once a year.
Other than that, you can't say it's more or less depressing than Appalachian Ohio villages such as Malaga, Jerusalem, Haydenville, Cumberland and about a zillion others that used to be more relevant when you couldn't just hop in your car and easily drive to the county seat in 12 minutes to do all of your business.
Quote from: GCrites80s on December 23, 2020, 10:18:15 PM
Quote from: Rothman on December 23, 2020, 11:16:14 AM
Quote from: ftballfan on December 23, 2020, 10:29:39 AM
Parts of Sandusky, OH are not the best, especially along OH-4, Monroe St, and 1st St. This might be part of why Cedar Point traffic is not directed to use OH-4 from the Turnpike, although it's quicker to use OH-4 (over US-250) if coming from Toledo and points west along the Turnpike.
Also in Ohio, Toledo has some depressed neighborhoods, especially along OH-2.
The south side of Lansing (MI) has also seen better days, especially along Cedar and Pennsylvania.
I've considered retiring on Cedar Point. Sandusky does have some suprisingly run down areas (especially compared to other amusement park towns, like Agawam, MA). I wouldn't call it depressing, though. And, New Straitsville is definitely a LOT worse.
I don't mind New Straitsville. It's honesty in pretty typical condition for towns of that size in Appalachian Ohio. As someone who likes dirt bikes and quads it's sort of neat that it calls itself ATV Friendly City USA. Very few towns in Ohio allow these vehicles to be ridden into town from the trail system and campgrounds to visit local businesses. They also set up an outdoor ring and have pro wrestling in the streets once a year.
Other than that, you can't say it's more or less depressing than Appalachian Ohio villages such as Malaga, Jerusalem, Haydenville, Cumberland and about a zillion others that used to be more relevant when you couldn't just hop in your car and easily drive to the county seat in 12 minutes to do all of your business.
There aren't any local businesses in New Straitsville to visit.
Speaking of Michigan cities I don't know if it's been mentioned yet but everyone probably knows how depressing Detroit is. What about Highland Park? That has got to be the most depressing city in Michigan at least in the top 3. Benton Harbor and Muskegon Heights seem pretty depressing too. Muskegon itself is kind of depressing too.
For an Up North Michigan city (actually a village) that's depressing look no further than Baldwin. In an area of the state you'd think wasn't poor Lake County is Michigan's poorest county. Honestly if I didn't know that Lake County was Michigan's poorest county I would have thought that it was a county in the U.P. such as Ontonagon or one of those counties. Ontonagon was mentioned previously in this post and I visited it this past summer. To me it didn't seem any different than the rest of the cities in the area but we are talking about a city in the U.P. that has lost half it's population since 1970. Now Ontonagon isn't a big city at all it's population was at 1,494 in 2010 and peaked at 2,432 in 1970, in a 2019 estimate the population was at 1,250 people. The poverty rate is at 11.8% of the population.
For Ontonagon County though it's Michigan's third least populated county with a poverty rate of 14.3% of the population. I think that Newberry and Luce County (Michigan's second least populated county) have a higher rate and Newberry seems depressing too since there really isn't much there. It is on M-123 though which leads north to Tahquamenon Falls State Park and Paradise before turning back to head south at Paradise.
I attempted a top-5 for Upstate NY and here's what I came up with:
1. Utica, NY
2. Niagara Falls, NY (the city, not the park, obviously)
3. Salamanca, NY
4. Auburn, NY
5. Waterloo, NY
There are probably some other good candidates, but none that I've spent enough time in to feel comfortable ranking them.
Quote from: webny99 on December 24, 2020, 10:00:10 AM
I attempted a top-5 for Upstate NY and here's what I came up with:
1. Utica, NY
2. Niagara Falls, NY (the city, not the park, obviously)
3. Salamanca, NY
4. Auburn, NY
5. Waterloo, NY
There are probably some other good candidates, but none that I've spent enough time in to feel comfortable ranking them.
None of those five are in Orleans County.
Quote from: 1 on December 24, 2020, 10:10:27 AM
Quote from: webny99 on December 24, 2020, 10:00:10 AM
I attempted a top-5 for Upstate NY and here's what I came up with:
1. Utica, NY
2. Niagara Falls, NY (the city, not the park, obviously)
3. Salamanca, NY
4. Auburn, NY
5. Waterloo, NY
There are probably some other good candidates, but none that I've spent enough time in to feel comfortable ranking them.
None of those five are in Orleans County.
The only Orleans County towns/cities that I felt were big enough to be included are Medina and Albion. I haven't been around the former enough to know for sure, and the latter isn't quite as depressing as those five; it might still be in the top ten, though. The county as a whole is most depressing because it includes the rural areas as well as the towns/cities.
However, re-thinking about the NY 31 corridor reminded me of Lockport (which is in Niagara County). That might displace one of my other five. I'll have to think about it.
My top four for New York would be:
1) Medina
2) Lyndonville
3) Albion
4) Holley
Quote from: webny99 on December 24, 2020, 10:00:10 AM
I attempted a top-5 for Upstate NY and here's what I came up with:
1. Utica, NY
2. Niagara Falls, NY (the city, not the park, obviously)
3. Salamanca, NY
4. Auburn, NY
5. Waterloo, NY
There are probably some other good candidates, but none that I've spent enough time in to feel comfortable ranking them.
Niagara Falls, NY and Salamanca are probably my two picks as well. Both cities have a giant casino with the rest of the city being a depressing mess. Just driving through Salamanca involves swerving around the pot holes.
One interesting thing about Salamanca is all the gas stations. I know it's because the gas is cheaper on the reserve, but it still felt like way too many considering how quiet the city is.
My Minnesota list would be, in no order: Browns Valley, Virginia, West St. Paul, Crystal.
No NY list is complete without Elmira.
Saginaw is really depressing. Just had the 26th homicide of the year yesterday in a city of under 50,000 people. The city had 9 homicides in 2019, 15 in 2018, 16 in 2017, 11 in 2016 and 8 in 2015. The city's highest homicide rate since 2007 was in 2012, when it hit 30.
Quote from: Rothman on December 24, 2020, 01:16:55 PM
No NY list is complete without Elmira.
Another city I haven't really been to outside of passing by on I-86. But I have not heard many positive things about it.
Quote from: webny99 on December 24, 2020, 02:12:19 PM
Quote from: Rothman on December 24, 2020, 01:16:55 PM
No NY list is complete without Elmira.
Another city I haven't really been to outside of passing by on I-86. But I have not heard many positive things about it.
I do agree with Utica, though. Not so sure about Waterloo.
Quote from: webny99 on December 24, 2020, 02:12:19 PM
Quote from: Rothman on December 24, 2020, 01:16:55 PM
No NY list is complete without Elmira.
Another city I haven't really been to outside of passing by on I-86. But I have not heard many positive things about it.
The airport is one the five most interesting I've experienced, owing to being near the glass capital of the world. It's the only one I know of in the US which has an open-air courtyard in the passenger terminal.
Other than that, it seemed a bit dreary (but rainy days in February have that effect on most places).
Quote from: formulanone on December 24, 2020, 03:13:18 PM
Quote from: webny99 on December 24, 2020, 02:12:19 PM
Quote from: Rothman on December 24, 2020, 01:16:55 PM
No NY list is complete without Elmira.
Another city I haven't really been to outside of passing by on I-86. But I have not heard many positive things about it.
The airport is one the five most interesting I've experienced, owing to being near the glass capital of the world. It's the only one I know of in the US which has an open-air courtyard in the passenger terminal.
Other than that, it seemed a bit dreary (but rainy days in February have that effect on most places).
Airport's actually quite a ways north of the "city."
Quote from: Rothman on December 24, 2020, 03:07:25 PM
Quote from: webny99 on December 24, 2020, 02:12:19 PM
Quote from: Rothman on December 24, 2020, 01:16:55 PM
No NY list is complete without Elmira.
Another city I haven't really been to outside of passing by on I-86. But I have not heard many positive things about it.
I do agree with Utica, though. Not so sure about Waterloo.
It's depressing in the sense that it still looks just like it did 150 years ago, but with way less people and activity. Would be a quaint and charming place if there was a way to keep the downtown thriving.
Quote from: webny99 on December 24, 2020, 03:41:30 PM
Quote from: Rothman on December 24, 2020, 03:07:25 PM
Quote from: webny99 on December 24, 2020, 02:12:19 PM
Quote from: Rothman on December 24, 2020, 01:16:55 PM
No NY list is complete without Elmira.
Another city I haven't really been to outside of passing by on I-86. But I have not heard many positive things about it.
I do agree with Utica, though. Not so sure about Waterloo.
It's depressing in the sense that it still looks just like it did 150 years ago, but with way less people and activity. Would be a quaint and charming place if there was a way to keep the downtown thriving.
In my opinion, it still fascinates with its gloomy senile atmosphere and emptiness. A very quiet place in which you feel somehow renounced from everyone!
Another city in New York that I haven't seen any of you mention is Gloversville in Fulton County. Former industry was glove making and the city has been declining since 1950 and has a pretty significant poverty rate.
Quote from: WilliamBrown on December 25, 2020, 04:14:47 AM
Quote from: webny99 on December 24, 2020, 03:41:30 PM
Quote from: Rothman on December 24, 2020, 03:07:25 PM
Quote from: webny99 on December 24, 2020, 02:12:19 PM
Quote from: Rothman on December 24, 2020, 01:16:55 PM
No NY list is complete without Elmira.
Another city I haven't really been to outside of passing by on I-86. But I have not heard many positive things about it.
I do agree with Utica, though. Not so sure about Waterloo.
It's depressing in the sense that it still looks just like it did 150 years ago, but with way less people and activity. Would be a quaint and charming place if there was a way to keep the downtown thriving.
In my opinion, it still fascinates with its gloomy senile atmosphere and emptiness. A very quiet place in which you feel somehow renounced from everyone.
I looked at Waterloo on Google Street View and it looked like a charming little town. Just from looks alone, I don't think it qualifies as depressing, at least not on the level of a lot of the places mentioned here.
Quote from: The Nature Boy on December 25, 2020, 10:53:50 AM
Quote from: WilliamBrown on December 25, 2020, 04:14:47 AM
Quote from: webny99 on December 24, 2020, 03:41:30 PM
Quote from: Rothman on December 24, 2020, 03:07:25 PM
Quote from: webny99 on December 24, 2020, 02:12:19 PM
Quote from: Rothman on December 24, 2020, 01:16:55 PM
No NY list is complete without Elmira.
Another city I haven't really been to outside of passing by on I-86. But I have not heard many positive things about it.
I do agree with Utica, though. Not so sure about Waterloo.
It's depressing in the sense that it still looks just like it did 150 years ago, but with way less people and activity. Would be a quaint and charming place if there was a way to keep the downtown thriving.
In my opinion, it still fascinates with its gloomy senile atmosphere and emptiness. A very quiet place in which you feel somehow renounced from everyone.
I looked at Waterloo on Google Street View and it looked like a charming little town. Just from looks alone, I don't think it qualifies as depressing, at least not on the level of a lot of the places mentioned here.
Fixed your quote for you.
I agree to a certain extent. But... the fact that you can tell what a booming little place it used to be, but yet it's so dead now, is what makes it depressing. It is different than some of the other places mentioned because it's not as run-down, but it's reminiscent of a bygone era in a way that's almost
more depressing than a run down town/city IMO.
I find Gloversville to be pretty run-down and depressing.
Being originally from Cleveland, I have to defend my old stomping grounds. Cleveland is home to some of the most respected health care facilities in the world (Cleveland Clinic/University Hospitals), one of the best theater districts outside of NYC (Playhouse Square), a whole host of museums, a world famous orchestra and one of the most comprehensive park systems which encircles the entire city.
Yes. The city has had its share of embarrassments in the past, their city and county governments are corrupt, and their winters are terrible, where you can go weeks without seeing the sun.
But in the summer months, with Lake Erie as a huge draw, it's a great place to check out. And they are trying to bring residential living to downtown which has been a slowly successful endeavor.
If you want to nominate a sizable Ohio city as a terrible city, Toledo and Youngstown are more viable candidates.
Quote from: vdeane on December 25, 2020, 12:35:33 PM
I find Gloversville to be pretty run-down and depressing.
Yeah, really the entire Mohawk Valley is depressing, despite being scenic. It's almost West-Virginia-esque.
Besides Utica, Amsterdam and Johnstown are potential candidates, too.
Quote from: webny99 on December 25, 2020, 01:00:07 PM
Quote from: vdeane on December 25, 2020, 12:35:33 PM
I find Gloversville to be pretty run-down and depressing.
Yeah, really the entire Mohawk Valley is depressing, despite being scenic. It's almost West-Virginia-esque.
Besides Utica, Amsterdam and Johnstown are potential candidates, too.
Downtown Amsterdam, sure, but it does have the more livelier commercial strip on top of the hill.
Quote from: webny99 on December 25, 2020, 01:00:07 PM
Quote from: vdeane on December 25, 2020, 12:35:33 PM
I find Gloversville to be pretty run-down and depressing.
Yeah, really the entire Mohawk Valley is depressing, despite being scenic. It's almost West-Virginia-esque.
Besides Utica, Amsterdam and Johnstown are potential candidates, too.
For some reason Gloversville sticks out, though Johnstown is probably similar.
Out of all cities in New York state I think the most depressing city I have been to is Newburgh. I haven't been to Newburgh in a long time but that place was as depressing as it gets. It almost reminded me of Flint or Saginaw in Michigan.
Some others I thought of for California, none still exceed Needles IMO:
- Mendota still has the stain of a 45% unemployment figure in the not too recent past. The prison town back drop doesn't really add any charm either. What really gets it for me was that old slum that used to be on the railroad tracks off of Fresno Slough.
- Corcoran because of the prison backdrop and the sad atmosphere on the shore of a lake (Tulare Lake) killed off in modern times.
I can think of some other cites which fit the above with similar themes that are close but not quite as bad like Dos Palos, Shafter, and Huron.
Quote from: Rothman on December 25, 2020, 01:12:40 PM
Quote from: webny99 on December 25, 2020, 01:00:07 PM
Quote from: vdeane on December 25, 2020, 12:35:33 PM
I find Gloversville to be pretty run-down and depressing.
Yeah, really the entire Mohawk Valley is depressing, despite being scenic. It's almost West-Virginia-esque.
Besides Utica, Amsterdam and Johnstown are potential candidates, too.
Downtown Amsterdam, sure, but it does have the more livelier commercial strip on top of the hill.
I've actually never been up in that direction on NY 30.
Usually just using NY 67 to cut over to the Northway, which involves a grisly few miles. Maybe that's why I have such a bad impression.
You could say that any city that's lost half it's population over the last 70 years and has lots of poverty would be pretty depressing.
Pampa, TX, especially the stretch along US 60. It's run down and exceedingly bland.
Quote from: Flint1979 on December 26, 2020, 05:59:21 PM
You could say that any city that's lost half it's population over the last 70 years and has lots of poverty would be pretty depressing.
That got me thinking, when do you lose enough people that it starts to change into something other than a depressed locale? Most of the Copper Mine towns in the Upper Peninsula have had just as big of not bigger declines. The communities that survived their mining decline more or less have evolved into some quite lively and upbeat places. A similar phenomenon happened with the Gold Rush County in the Sierra Nevada Foothills of California and around the Comstock Lode in Nevada. Even places like Colorado have some really colorful mining communities that might have something like 10-25% of their peak population.
Quote from: Flint1979 on December 26, 2020, 05:59:21 PM
You could say that any city that's lost half it's population over the last 70 years and has lots of poverty would be pretty depressing.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on December 27, 2020, 02:13:33 PM
That got me thinking, when do you lose enough people that it starts to change into something other than a depressed locale? Most of the Copper Mine towns in the Upper Peninsula have had just as big of not bigger declines. The communities that survived their mining decline more or less have evolved into some quite lively and upbeat places. A similar phenomenon happened with the Gold Rush County in the Sierra Nevada Foothills of California and around the Comstock Lode in Nevada. Even places like Colorado have some really colorful mining communities that might have something like 10-25% of their peak population.
Seventy years ago Huntington, West Virginia was a vibrant college town with a base industry of railroading, specialty metal foundries and coal loading facilities (that made it the nation's largest inland port). The population topped out in the 1950 U.S. Census at 86.353. After a steady downhill decline, U.S. Census estimates a population of only 45,110 as of July 2019. Most likely, the true Huntington-Ashland-Ironton metro area has dropped more than 50% in the past 50 years (Putnam County and Lincoln County got added to the MSA count in the 2010 U.S. Census, with Putnam switching over from the Charleston MSA). But the worst part of this downturn occurred after CSX Transportation relocated 1,300 of us mostly to Jacksonville and Baltimore shortly after the Chessie-Seaboard merger in 1986. I don't know how true, but locals reported that small business was down 25% and population dropped almost 10,000 in one year. A couple of decades later, Huntington seemed to have come back from the ashes and thing didn't look so bleak on more recent visits.
^^^
I rarely go downtown, but it seems to me that the Barboursville area and the property surrounding the mall appears to be thriving. There's a relatively new retail center on the hill in the NE quadrant of the Merricks Creek/I-64 interchange.
I can see Putnam and Lincoln being a part of either Charleston or Huntington MSA. In fact, I could see merging those two MSAs since Huntington and Charleston seem to be getting closer together all the time.
South Carolina in a lot of places is like that, especially south of I-26, east of I-20 and west of I-95. Outside of Aiken, there is very little population and industry in that part of the state. Orangeburg is a depressing town. There is not a lot for young people to do at all there. A tiny mall, fast food, and a few other things. It's 45 miles from Columbia, close enough to be in the TV market, but it feels like a world away for those folks, and 70 miles from Charleston.
Places like Allendale, Bamberg, and Hampton still haven't recovered from US 301/601/278 getting bypassed in the 1970s by I-95. Allendale's population has declined 40% in 30 years. People are moving to other parts of the state and other parts of the country. In some of those towns you have to drive to Columbia, Charleston, or Augusta to get more than basic medical care.
Quote from: Sctvhound on December 28, 2020, 11:41:33 AM
South Carolina in a lot of places is like that, especially south of I-26, east of I-20 and west of I-95. Outside of Aiken, there is very little population and industry in that part of the state. Orangeburg is a depressing town. There is not a lot for young people to do at all there. A tiny mall, fast food, and a few other things. It's 45 miles from Columbia, close enough to be in the TV market, but it feels like a world away for those folks, and 70 miles from Charleston.
Places like Allendale, Bamberg, and Hampton still haven't recovered from US 301/601/278 getting bypassed in the 1970s by I-95. Allendale's population has declined 40% in 30 years. People are moving to other parts of the state and other parts of the country. In some of those towns you have to drive to Columbia, Charleston, or Augusta to get more than basic medical care.
The state government is probably neglecting that part of the state intentionally.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on December 27, 2020, 02:13:33 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on December 26, 2020, 05:59:21 PM
You could say that any city that's lost half it's population over the last 70 years and has lots of poverty would be pretty depressing.
That got me thinking, when do you lose enough people that it starts to change into something other than a depressed locale? Most of the Copper Mine towns in the Upper Peninsula have had just as big of not bigger declines. The communities that survived their mining decline more or less have evolved into some quite lively and upbeat places. A similar phenomenon happened with the Gold Rush County in the Sierra Nevada Foothills of California and around the Comstock Lode in Nevada. Even places like Colorado have some really colorful mining communities that might have something like 10-25% of their peak population.
The U.P. only peaked out at 332,000 for the entire peninsula and today it's at 311,000. It's peak happened in 1920 so it was 100 years ago that the U.P. was at it's peak population. I guess it just depends on how places have handled their population loss, some better than others. Ontonagon was a city that came to mind being at half it's peak population, not a very large city and it never was but it has the appearance of a depressed place to me anyway. Houghton didn't really seem like that to me, neither did Hancock or Marquette (which is very close to it's peak population today being only about 2,000 people off of it). I don't think Marquette suffered the same fate as some of these other U.P. cities. I guess the larger the city in the U.P. the better off they are but the more populated places in the U.P. are pretty far and few in between.
Quote from: Sctvhound on December 28, 2020, 11:41:33 AM
South Carolina in a lot of places is like that, especially south of I-26, east of I-20 and west of I-95. Outside of Aiken, there is very little population and industry in that part of the state. Orangeburg is a depressing town. There is not a lot for young people to do at all there. A tiny mall, fast food, and a few other things. It's 45 miles from Columbia, close enough to be in the TV market, but it feels like a world away for those folks, and 70 miles from Charleston.
Places like Allendale, Bamberg, and Hampton still haven't recovered from US 301/601/278 getting bypassed in the 1970s by I-95. Allendale's population has declined 40% in 30 years. People are moving to other parts of the state and other parts of the country. In some of those towns you have to drive to Columbia, Charleston, or Augusta to get more than basic medical care.
Orangeburg has two HBCUs that are located right next to each other. Both seem to be struggling
Quote from: Dirt Roads on December 27, 2020, 03:44:46 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on December 26, 2020, 05:59:21 PM
You could say that any city that's lost half it's population over the last 70 years and has lots of poverty would be pretty depressing.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on December 27, 2020, 02:13:33 PM
That got me thinking, when do you lose enough people that it starts to change into something other than a depressed locale? Most of the Copper Mine towns in the Upper Peninsula have had just as big of not bigger declines. The communities that survived their mining decline more or less have evolved into some quite lively and upbeat places. A similar phenomenon happened with the Gold Rush County in the Sierra Nevada Foothills of California and around the Comstock Lode in Nevada. Even places like Colorado have some really colorful mining communities that might have something like 10-25% of their peak population.
Seventy years ago Huntington, West Virginia was a vibrant college town with a base industry of railroading, specialty metal foundries and coal loading facilities (that made it the nation's largest inland port). The population topped out in the 1950 U.S. Census at 86.353. After a steady downhill decline, U.S. Census estimates a population of only 45,110 as of July 2019. Most likely, the true Huntington-Ashland-Ironton metro area has dropped more than 50% in the past 50 years (Putnam County and Lincoln County got added to the MSA count in the 2010 U.S. Census, with Putnam switching over from the Charleston MSA). But the worst part of this downturn occurred after CSX Transportation relocated 1,300 of us mostly to Jacksonville and Baltimore shortly after the Chessie-Seaboard merger in 1986. I don't know how true, but locals reported that small business was down 25% and population dropped almost 10,000 in one year. A couple of decades later, Huntington seemed to have come back from the ashes and thing didn't look so bleak on more recent visits.
It's funny, so many of the businesses I frequented when I lived there 15+ years ago are no longer there -- a lot of the ramshackle or cheaply done buildings have been torn down and replaced -- but clearly the town is in better shape. The term I want to use is "well-maintained". Where I live now if a building is from the '60s or '70s it's almost certainly been torn down or is in terrible shape. That's not true there. But I was really surprised about how short of a lifespan some of the family businesses last there -- seemingly only one or two generations.
Zhangzhou, China
I've never found much redeeming about Terre Haute, Indiana or St. Joseph, Missouri.
Since I moved to Arizona, the easy answer to this question is Douglas.
Quote from: Konza on January 06, 2021, 04:00:29 AM
I've never found much redeeming about Terre Haute, Indiana or St. Joseph, Missouri.
Since I moved to Arizona, the easy answer to this question is Douglas.
Over something like South Tucson? Miami, Superior, Peridot, San Carlos, and Ajo would also be pretty high up that list for Arizona IMO.
I was driving through Lima, Ohio on Saturday and this was actually the first time I've driven through the city of Lima. I wanted to take OH-65 to OH-109 to M-52 to get back to Saginaw, Michigan instead of taking I-75 to US-23 to I-75. So I drove through Lima and my first impression of the city was that it looks a lot like Saginaw does. Old buildings, run down parts of town, abandoned buildings, boarded up buildings and stuff like that. So I think Lima could qualify for this thread.
Quote from: TheGrassGuy on January 04, 2021, 09:14:33 AM
Zhangzhou, China
China in general is full of apartment complexes, either as its own city or in the outskirts of another major city, that seem to be empty or even abandoned
Quote from: SkyPesos on January 06, 2021, 01:06:10 PM
Quote from: TheGrassGuy on January 04, 2021, 09:14:33 AM
Zhangzhou, China
China in general is full of apartment complexes, either as its own city or in the outskirts of another major city, that seem to be empty or even abandoned
Or never occupied. Time and weather both take their tolls and there will be many truly depressing places there. Demographic changes over the past few decades and their governing structure guarantee that.
Mike
Surprised no one has mentioned this, but for Ontario, Canada, there exists a place called
Hamilton, Ontario
Which looks pretty sad.
Quote from: andrepoiy on January 08, 2021, 10:02:01 PM
Surprised no one has mentioned this, but for Ontario, Canada, there exists a place called
Hamilton, Ontario
Which looks pretty sad.
Yeah, if you want the Rust Belt in Canada, Hamilton is definitely it. It gets lumped in with the Toronto area because Burlington is basically a suburb of both cities, but the Hamilton side of the bay has much different and more depressing vibes.
Clovis, NM. For a city of nearly 40,000 it seemed very dead and run down.
Quote from: US 89 on January 08, 2021, 10:47:06 PM
Clovis, NM. For a city of nearly 40,000 it seemed very dead and run down.
Always got the same vibe from Roswell. Alamogordo isn't exactly the most pleasant feeling place but it definitely has more of a pulse given the nearby military bases.
Anyone giving a "worst cities in New York" list without Newburgh is automatically wrong. Having been to nearly municipality in the state (and all on the state highway system), I would easily rank that as the worst.
Elmira, Niagara Falls, Salamanca, and Utica are also on that list, not in any particular order. Schenectady, Gloversville, and Watertown are honorable mentions. If you want to include villages, you can throw Hudson Falls and Wellsville on the list.
Did anyone mention Butte, MT? Definitely a downer vibe compared to other similar sized cities in the state like Bozeman, Billings and Great Falls. Copper mines and ramshackle houses. Years ago, I read that FBI's Butte office was used to exile problem employees.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1988/08/15/fbi-agents-siberia-lives-on/be4abec3-b888-4414-b906-de1cfa1a64f6/
Quote from: Rick Powell on January 09, 2021, 12:19:31 AM
Did anyone mention Butte, MT? Definitely a downer vibe compared to other similar sized cities in the state like Bozeman, Billings and Great Falls. Copper mines and ramshackle houses. Years ago, I read that FBI's Butte office was used to exile problem employees.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1988/08/15/fbi-agents-siberia-lives-on/be4abec3-b888-4414-b906-de1cfa1a64f6/
Heh. My first visit to Butte in the early 1990s was definitely one where the impression was "Ugliest Place on Earth." However, I was just there a few years ago and thought it didn't look as run down.
Probably a case of very low expectations being easily exceeded, though.
Quote from: cl94 on January 08, 2021, 11:45:08 PM
Anyone giving a "worst cities in New York" list without Newburgh is automatically wrong. Having been to nearly municipality in the state (and all on the state highway system), I would easily rank that as the worst.
Elmira, Niagara Falls, Salamanca, and Utica are also on that list, not in any particular order. Schenectady, Gloversville, and Watertown are honorable mentions. If you want to include villages, you can throw Hudson Falls and Wellsville on the list.
I thought I might of mentioned that before. I remember talking about Newburgh on here and agree that it is probably the worst city in New York. Another one was Gloversville for New York, I wasn't impressed with either city.
Quote from: Konza on January 06, 2021, 04:00:29 AM
I've never found much redeeming about Terre Haute, Indiana or St. Joseph, Missouri.
Since I moved to Arizona, the easy answer to this question is Douglas.
I forgot about St. Joseph, MO. It was always a dreary place to visit. One of my friends said two of the highlights of his visit there was Jesse James's house and the psychiatric museum there. I'll pass.
Quote from: webny99 on January 08, 2021, 10:45:29 PM
Quote from: andrepoiy on January 08, 2021, 10:02:01 PM
Surprised no one has mentioned this, but for Ontario, Canada, there exists a place called
Hamilton, Ontario
Which looks pretty sad.
Yeah, if you want the Rust Belt in Canada, Hamilton is definitely it. It gets lumped in with the Toronto area because Burlington is basically a suburb of both cities, but the Hamilton side of the bay has much different and more depressing vibes.
Probably about 20-25 years ago now but I was in Grand Bend, Ontario and thought it was pretty depressing. It's right on Lake Huron and all I remember is driving on Route 21 and a town called Forest. Took a walk along the beach and got the hell outta there and went to Niagara Falls then crossed back into the US into New York and went to Buffalo. It was my first experience with Buffalo and I thought it was a pretty depressed place too. I think a lot of the depressed cities are in the northern part of the country.
Quote from: Flint1979 on January 09, 2021, 06:31:32 AM
Quote from: webny99 on January 08, 2021, 10:45:29 PM
Quote from: andrepoiy on January 08, 2021, 10:02:01 PM
Surprised no one has mentioned this, but for Ontario, Canada, there exists a place called
Hamilton, Ontario
Which looks pretty sad.
Yeah, if you want the Rust Belt in Canada, Hamilton is definitely it. It gets lumped in with the Toronto area because Burlington is basically a suburb of both cities, but the Hamilton side of the bay has much different and more depressing vibes.
Probably about 20-25 years ago now but I was in Grand Bend, Ontario and thought it was pretty depressing. It's right on Lake Huron and all I remember is driving on Route 21 and a town called Forest. Took a walk along the beach and got the hell outta there and went to Niagara Falls then crossed back into the US into New York and went to Buffalo. It was my first experience with Buffalo and I thought it was a pretty depressed place too. I think a lot of the depressed cities are in the northern part of the country.
Buffalo, NY and Erie, PA are both very sad places. Erie was the hometown of one of my favorite 80's groups: The Stabilizers.
Quote from: Rick Powell on January 09, 2021, 12:19:31 AM
Did anyone mention Butte, MT? Definitely a downer vibe compared to other similar sized cities in the state like Bozeman, Billings and Great Falls. Copper mines and ramshackle houses. Years ago, I read that FBI's Butte office was used to exile problem employees.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1988/08/15/fbi-agents-siberia-lives-on/be4abec3-b888-4414-b906-de1cfa1a64f6/
The way Evel Knievel talked about Butte the wild west never ended there, at least when he was alive. I don't think he exaggerated much.
Quote from: GCrites80s on January 09, 2021, 10:17:59 AM
Quote from: Rick Powell on January 09, 2021, 12:19:31 AM
Did anyone mention Butte, MT? Definitely a downer vibe compared to other similar sized cities in the state like Bozeman, Billings and Great Falls. Copper mines and ramshackle houses. Years ago, I read that FBI's Butte office was used to exile problem employees.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1988/08/15/fbi-agents-siberia-lives-on/be4abec3-b888-4414-b906-de1cfa1a64f6/
The way Evel Knievel talked about Butte the wild west never ended there, at least when he was alive. I don't think he exaggerated much.
It was one of the last major company towns.
Quote from: Flint1979 on January 09, 2021, 06:31:32 AM
Probably about 20-25 years ago now but I was in Grand Bend, Ontario and thought it was pretty depressing. It's right on Lake Huron and all I remember is driving on Route 21 and a town called Forest. Took a walk along the beach and got the hell outta there and went to Niagara Falls then crossed back into the US into New York and went to Buffalo. It was my first experience with Buffalo and I thought it was a pretty depressed place too. I think a lot of the depressed cities are in the northern part of the country.
I guess the Dream Academy song "Life in a northern town" (http://"https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_in_a_Northern_Town") would fit these cities. There's 2 differents music videos of that song
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X5uxQElYu68
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5UXnulANF8g
Quote from: GCrites80s on January 09, 2021, 10:17:59 AM
Quote from: Rick Powell on January 09, 2021, 12:19:31 AM
Did anyone mention Butte, MT? Definitely a downer vibe compared to other similar sized cities in the state like Bozeman, Billings and Great Falls. Copper mines and ramshackle houses. Years ago, I read that FBI's Butte office was used to exile problem employees.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1988/08/15/fbi-agents-siberia-lives-on/be4abec3-b888-4414-b906-de1cfa1a64f6/
The way Evel Knievel talked about Butte the wild west never ended there, at least when he was alive. I don't think he exaggerated much.
I'll see your Butte, Montana and raise you a Havre, Montana. I spent 6 months there on a job and it was such a s-hole. And the place I worked for ran their business as if it was a Hooterville business on Green Acres.
Quote from: thenetwork on January 09, 2021, 01:20:38 PM
Quote from: GCrites80s on January 09, 2021, 10:17:59 AM
Quote from: Rick Powell on January 09, 2021, 12:19:31 AM
Did anyone mention Butte, MT? Definitely a downer vibe compared to other similar sized cities in the state like Bozeman, Billings and Great Falls. Copper mines and ramshackle houses. Years ago, I read that FBI's Butte office was used to exile problem employees.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/politics/1988/08/15/fbi-agents-siberia-lives-on/be4abec3-b888-4414-b906-de1cfa1a64f6/
The way Evel Knievel talked about Butte the wild west never ended there, at least when he was alive. I don't think he exaggerated much.
I'll see your Butte, Montana and raise you a Havre, Montana. I spent 6 months there on a job and it was such a s-hole. And the place I worked for ran their business as if it was a Hooterville business on Green Acres.
I'll see your both of those and raise you a Deer Lodge, Montana. Lived there a year and a half - yikes. Butte was where we'd go for fun. I don't mind Havre (had to go there a lot for my subsequent state job out of Helena) - at least they have a couple good restaurants, but I also never lived there.
Quote from: thenetwork on January 09, 2021, 01:20:38 PM
I'll see your Butte, Montana and raise you a Havre, Montana. I spent 6 months there on a job and it was such a s-hole. And the place I worked for ran their business as if it was a Hooterville business on Green Acres.
Visited Havre last year before things got crazy; aside from a couple arterials, it has some of the worst pavement quality I've encountered for years in any decent-size (at least by Montana standards) city.
At least Butte has its toxic-waste-tourism traffic and the nonstop flow from I-15/I-90, and they've made significant progress on bicycle infrastructure. But some of the close-in neighborhoods are, indeed, quite rundown.
Quote from: cl94 on January 08, 2021, 11:45:08 PM
Anyone giving a "worst cities in New York" list without Newburgh is automatically wrong. Having been to nearly municipality in the state (and all on the state highway system), I would easily rank that as the worst.
The only reason Newburgh isn't on my list is because I've never been there.
From what I've seen on Street View, it would definitely be included if I'd been there.
I feel so bad for New York. There are people over the world that probably think the state is some zeroth-world super-advanced cosmopolitan place because of NYC. Then they find this thread...
Without counting, at least 1/3 of the places mentioned here are in New York?
I' have not been off the beaten path in many places in New York, except for Niagara Falls. The stark difference between each side of the river is quite depressing, and that includes the fact that some swaths of the Ontario edition are pretty meh.
Quote from: SectorZ on January 09, 2021, 02:25:08 PM
I feel so bad for New York. There are people over the world that probably think the state is some zeroth-world super-advanced cosmopolitan place because of NYC. Then they find this thread...
Without counting, at least 1/3 of the places mentioned here are in New York?
Part of that is the fact that we've got at least 4 users from NY contributing to the thread.
Part of it is that much of Upstate NY really is depressing. But there's plenty of beauty too if you know where to look.
On the whole, New York might not even be on my top-5 list of most depressing states.
Quote from: webny99 on January 09, 2021, 03:06:05 PM
Quote from: SectorZ on January 09, 2021, 02:25:08 PM
I feel so bad for New York. There are people over the world that probably think the state is some zeroth-world super-advanced cosmopolitan place because of NYC. Then they find this thread...
Without counting, at least 1/3 of the places mentioned here are in New York?
Part of that is the fact that we've got at least 4 users from NY contributing to the thread.
Part of it is that much of Upstate NY really is depressing. But there's plenty of beauty too if you know where to look.
On the whole, New York might not even be on my top-5 list of most depressing states.
I'd add Gouverneur, NY to that list too. My dad lived there from 2009-2015. The last time I was there was for Thanksgiving '14. We were turning on to Rock Island Road after driving up to the Reservation (cheap smokes) and he muttered "I need to get the fuck out of here." One of the worst McDonalds I've been to was in Malone (cold burgers, limp fries [like they'd been sitting there since October], and strange yokels.) In order to get to Gouverneur, I flew into Ogdensburg from Albany on Cape Air. The weather that day was windy/rainy and the tailwind aided us into arriving 20 minutes early. We drove the back roads into the part of town where he lived. That same day in the span of three hours I heard Paula Cole's "I Don't Wanna Wait" four times: At Logan, at Albany, Ogdensburg, and in the car headed to Gouverneur. I didn't realize that the song still had staying power.
The closest declining area to much of the US population is in western/central NY or most of WV, and the former has more population and reason to go there. This why NY is mentioned so much in this thread.
Quote from: CapeCodder on January 09, 2021, 03:44:13 PM
Quote from: webny99 on January 09, 2021, 03:06:05 PM
Quote from: SectorZ on January 09, 2021, 02:25:08 PM
I feel so bad for New York. There are people over the world that probably think the state is some zeroth-world super-advanced cosmopolitan place because of NYC. Then they find this thread...
Without counting, at least 1/3 of the places mentioned here are in New York?
Part of that is the fact that we've got at least 4 users from NY contributing to the thread.
Part of it is that much of Upstate NY really is depressing. But there's plenty of beauty too if you know where to look.
On the whole, New York might not even be on my top-5 list of most depressing states.
I'd add Gouverneur, NY to that list too. My dad lived there from 2009-2015. The last time I was there was for Thanksgiving '14. We were turning on to Rock Island Road after driving up to the Reservation (cheap smokes) and he muttered "I need to get the fuck out of here." One of the worst McDonalds I've been to was in Malone (cold burgers, limp fries [like they'd been sitting there since October], and strange yokels.) In order to get to Gouverneur, I flew into Ogdensburg from Albany on Cape Air. The weather that day was windy/rainy and the tailwind aided us into arriving 20 minutes early. We drove the back roads into the part of town where he lived. That same day in the span of three hours I heard Paula Cole's "I Don't Wanna Wait" four times: At Logan, at Albany, Ogdensburg, and in the car headed to Gouverneur. I didn't realize that the song still had staying power.
Wrong. It's got the Lifesavers candy memorial.
Quote from: webny99 on January 09, 2021, 02:16:08 PM
Quote from: cl94 on January 08, 2021, 11:45:08 PM
Anyone giving a "worst cities in New York" list without Newburgh is automatically wrong. Having been to nearly municipality in the state (and all on the state highway system), I would easily rank that as the worst.
The only reason Newburgh isn't on my list is because I've never been there.
From what I've seen on Street View, it would definitely be included if I'd been there.
Just take one trip there and you'll put it on this list. Beacon on the other side of the Hudson didn't seem as bad as Newburgh. I couldn't wait to get out of Newburgh when I was there.
Speaking of bad experiences in New York. I took a trip to NYC about 15-16 years ago and that was the last time I ever ate at a Burger King. It was located on the Thruway somewhere between the Tappan Zee Bridge and The Bronx. The place was disgusting and mind you this is at a service plaza on the Thruway every trash can was overfilled with trash, there were trays sitting on the tables dirty and I thought to myself A) I'm not fucking eating here and B) I'm never eating at a Burger King again because I haven't ever had a good experience at one. They are slow, their food tastes like shit and you can smell the place over a mile away. But anyway that was the last straw with BK for me. I know that they probably have some damn good locations but I've never tried to find one.
New York's neighbor over in New Jersey has some dandy cities in it most of which have probably been already mentioned, Atlantic City, Camden, Patterson, Newark, every city along the Hudson River that's as overcrowded as NYC is. On Staten Island there was a neighborhood in the northern part of the borough called Mariners Harbor that I found pretty depressing as well.
Quote from: 1 on January 09, 2021, 03:48:38 PM
The closest declining area to much of the US population is in western/central NY or most of WV, and the former has more population and reason to go there. This why NY is mentioned so much in this thread.
You could also include much of northern and western PA, excluding Pittsburgh. That makes it a contiguous area.
Quote from: Rothman on January 09, 2021, 04:15:24 PM
Quote from: CapeCodder on January 09, 2021, 03:44:13 PM
I'd add Gouverneur, NY to that list too. My dad lived there from 2009-2015. The last time I was there was for Thanksgiving '14. We were turning on to Rock Island Road after driving up to the Reservation (cheap smokes) and he muttered "I need to get the fuck out of here." One of the worst McDonalds I've been to was in Malone (cold burgers, limp fries [like they'd been sitting there since October], and strange yokels.) In order to get to Gouverneur, I flew into Ogdensburg from Albany on Cape Air. The weather that day was windy/rainy and the tailwind aided us into arriving 20 minutes early. We drove the back roads into the part of town where he lived. That same day in the span of three hours I heard Paula Cole's "I Don't Wanna Wait" four times: At Logan, at Albany, Ogdensburg, and in the car headed to Gouverneur. I didn't realize that the song still had staying power.
Wrong. It's got the Lifesavers candy memorial.
Gouverneur is an excellent choice for depressing- I lived in Potsdam for a few years and Gouverneur just didn't seem to have a reason for being. Never mind if you're driving along route 11 to Canton or Potsdam you're not yet close enough to feel like you're getting anywhere. Watertown is up there as well, though Thompson Park somewhat redeems it.
Martinsburg or Wheeling are also pretty depressing; I stopped in both on different trips essentially to say that I did something in West Virginia, and I think I ended up eating bad food at cheap diners on Main Street.
Quote from: Flint1979 on January 09, 2021, 05:02:04 PM
Quote from: webny99 on January 09, 2021, 02:16:08 PM
Quote from: cl94 on January 08, 2021, 11:45:08 PM
Anyone giving a "worst cities in New York" list without Newburgh is automatically wrong. Having been to nearly municipality in the state (and all on the state highway system), I would easily rank that as the worst.
The only reason Newburgh isn't on my list is because I've never been there.
From what I've seen on Street View, it would definitely be included if I'd been there.
Just take one trip there and you'll put it on this list. Beacon on the other side of the Hudson didn't seem as bad as Newburgh. I couldn't wait to get out of Newburgh when I was there.
Beacon really cleaned itself up in the past 20 years or so. My dad talks about it being nearly as bad as Newburgh in the 80s. But Newburgh...yeah, it's still as bad it has always been. Similarly, if I was making a list of "most depressing NY cities in 2000", Troy would definitely be on that list, but it has improved greatly in the past 15 years.
As far as why so much of New York sucks...Upstate NY is Rust Belt and Appalachia. Probably the two most depressing cultural regions of the country. There are pockets of nice (mostly in the eastern part of Upstate), but Central and Western NY have a lot of decay.
Quote from: cl94 on January 10, 2021, 04:14:32 PM
As far as why so much of New York sucks...Upstate NY is Rust Belt and Appalachia. Probably the two most depressing cultural regions of the country. There are pockets of nice (mostly in the eastern part of Upstate), but Central and Western NY have a lot of decay.
I would say the Mohawk Valley and Western NY (west of Batavia) are the most depressing areas. The Finger Lakes region is probably the nicest part of Upstate. The scenery doesn't quite rival the Adirondacks, but it's plenty affluent and a lot less run down than the North Country. Other than Auburn and perhaps Waterloo (as discussed upthread), the area bounded by I-90/I-81/I-86/I-390 isn't bad at all.
Quote from: dkblake on January 10, 2021, 02:54:19 PM
Martinsburg or Wheeling are also pretty depressing; I stopped in both on different trips essentially to say that I did something in West Virginia, and I think I ended up eating bad food at cheap diners on Main Street.
Totally different vibes for me. Wheeling is both a Rust Belt river town and a mountain town. But I don't get that impression of Martinsburg at all. It's more like a DC suburb, or a Shenandoah Valley town in Virginia, to me. Martinsburg doesn't really feel much different than Staunton, Harrisonburg, or Winchester. Plus, it definitely seems to be thriving more than Wheeling. Isn't the biggest shopping-retail area of Wheeling actually out of the valley in Ohio near the western end of I-470?
Quote from: hbelkins on January 10, 2021, 07:16:31 PM
Quote from: dkblake on January 10, 2021, 02:54:19 PM
Martinsburg or Wheeling are also pretty depressing; I stopped in both on different trips essentially to say that I did something in West Virginia, and I think I ended up eating bad food at cheap diners on Main Street.
Totally different vibes for me. Wheeling is both a Rust Belt river town and a mountain town. But I don't get that impression of Martinsburg at all. It's more like a DC suburb, or a Shenandoah Valley town in Virginia, to me. Martinsburg doesn't really feel much different than Staunton, Harrisonburg, or Winchester. Plus, it definitely seems to be thriving more than Wheeling. Isn't the biggest shopping-retail area of Wheeling actually out of the valley in Ohio near the western end of I-470?
Pretty much St. Clairsville. Exit 218 is the exit with the mall and everyhing. I stayed at the Red Roof Inn there about 15 years ago and it seemed kind of like it's own little area not really part of Wheeling or even really St. Clairsville. Downtown Wheeling is like 9-10 miles from there. It just seemed like a development plopped down in the middle of nowhere.
Quote from: Flint1979 on January 10, 2021, 08:06:18 PM
It just seemed like a development plopped down in the middle of nowhere.
So, like Birch Run. Yes, there's a town there. But the development has nothing to do with the town.
Quote from: GaryV on January 11, 2021, 09:09:32 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on January 10, 2021, 08:06:18 PM
It just seemed like a development plopped down in the middle of nowhere.
So, like Birch Run. Yes, there's a town there. But the development has nothing to do with the town.
The development there has to do with I-75 running through the village so yeah basically the same thing but this is Wheeling's main retail area. It'd be like Birch Run being the main retail area for Flint or Saginaw pretty much. Another reason I think is that it's the northbound exit for Frankenmuth as well.
Quote from: Kniwt on January 09, 2021, 01:56:34 PM
Quote from: thenetwork on January 09, 2021, 01:20:38 PM
I'll see your Butte, Montana and raise you a Havre, Montana. I spent 6 months there on a job and it was such a s-hole. And the place I worked for ran their business as if it was a Hooterville business on Green Acres.
Visited Havre last year before things got crazy; aside from a couple arterials, it has some of the worst pavement quality I've encountered for years in any decent-size (at least by Montana standards) city.
At least Butte has its toxic-waste-tourism traffic and the nonstop flow from I-15/I-90, and they've made significant progress on bicycle infrastructure. But some of the close-in neighborhoods are, indeed, quite rundown.
I never could figure out why Havre is used a regularly appearing city on the regional & national maps on the WeatherNation Channel, when Great Falls would be a better choice. They make it sound like Havre is a big,, happening town when it's a fraction of the size of other listed cities on the map like Grand Junction, CO and Farmington, NM.
Sometimes weather observations are placed where they make the most sense to be because of practical concerns, and not necessarily because of human geography. The airport in one town is better sited to get accurate readings, or is more easily accessible to the people running the network, or someone donated a site for a weather station, or whatever.
Back in the Weatherstar 4000 days, TWC always reported the weather in Gage, rather than the nearby and much larger Woodward, for whatever reason. It didn't really matter, though, since Gage served the purpose of "weather station in northwest Oklahoma". Whatever the weather is in Gage is usually the weather in Woodward anyway.
Eastern/southeastern Kentucky's NWS office is in Jackson, at an airport several miles out of town at the top of a mountain which is, I think, the site of an old strip mine. It's reasonably centrally located for the territory it serves, but it certainly isn't the biggest town in the area. Temperature and snowfall measurements are skewed by the altitude there. Eastern Kentucky got its own NWS office as a result of flooding issues; I always thought in response to 1984, but it may have been 1977 or '78.
You see similar reports on weather maps from places like Wilimington, Ohio (instead of Cincinnati or Dayton) or Morristown, Tenn. (instead of Knoxville or Johnson City).
In my work, I deal with the NWS Jackson office frequently. They cover all 10 of my counties. My counterpart in Flemingsburg, however, has to deal with four NWS offices: Jackson, Louisville, Wilmington, and Charleston, WV.
It's a little known fact that Kenner is the armpit of Louisiana.
For other depressing cities/urban areas in this region, I would certainly nominate Shreveport, Monroe, north Baton Rouge, the Westbank of Jefferson Parish, New Orleans East, and virtually every small town/village in Mississippi south of I-20.
Quote from: Urban Prairie Schooner on January 14, 2021, 10:40:57 PM
It's a little known fact that Kenner is the armpit of Louisiana.
For other depressing cities/urban areas in this region, I would certainly nominate Shreveport, Monroe, north Baton Rouge, the Westbank of Jefferson Parish, New Orleans East, and virtually every small town/village in Mississippi south of I-20.
Yeah, north Baton Rouge was pretty bad last I was there a few years ago.
Quote from: Urban Prairie Schooner on January 14, 2021, 10:40:57 PM
It's a little known fact that Kenner is the armpit of Louisiana.
For other depressing cities/urban areas in this region, I would certainly nominate Shreveport, Monroe, north Baton Rouge, the Westbank of Jefferson Parish, New Orleans East, and virtually every small town/village in Mississippi south of I-20.
New Orleans East was depressing. Just a short drive on I-10 through that area really goes to show how much is empty from Katrina still. It was stunning seeing all that for the first time, but even then the eastern half of Chef Hwy and US 11 towards The Rigolets are
more depressing.
At least with Kenner and Shreveport there's some activity...people walking around, life being lived. The most depressing places are void of that.
Spartanburg, South Carolina would be my answer.
Having never been to northwest SC before today and knowing that Greenville and Spartanburg shared an airport, I always figured they were essentially twin cities. I drove through Greenville first and found a fairly interesting city with a neat downtown area that I'd be interested in going back to explore at some point.
I figured Spartanburg would be similar, but I was wrong...it turned out to be kind of a dump (at least the parts I drove through) - just a decayed city with nothing really going on. I have no real interest in returning now that I've clinched I-585 and 85 Business through there.
One other I forgot about was Sioux City, Iowa. I used to always refer to it as "Sewer City". After I moved here for work, I met someone who used to live there who also referred to it as Sewer City.