New York Times: A Little More Remote Work Could Change Rush Hour a Lot -
Peak commute time has long ruled our lives, our cities, our tax dollars. But it doesn't have to. (https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/11/upshot/rush-hour-remote-work.html?smid=fb-share&fbclid=IwAR2w2CatZwbWnBrYJBwgC6Nh2YI43KK804H5BaKDa9op_-DCuS7jzTlEKKc)
QuoteThere is something uniquely awful about that time of day when there is no good way to get around. The car horns sound nastier as downtown traffic snarls. The elbows feel sharper on a jammed subway. The sight of red brake lights is soul-crushing when they lead on a highway all the way to the horizon.
QuoteMere mention of it makes the body tense up: rush hour.
QuoteBut for much of the pandemic, it vanished. Not only did people travel less over the past year, with schools closed, restaurants off-limits, and millions of workers unemployed or at home; they also traveled less in a very particular way. Rush hour peaks flattened, smoothing travel demand around cities across the country into a low-grade continuous flow, a Tuesday morning not so different from a Saturday afternoon.
Quote from: cpzilliacus on June 12, 2021, 07:49:07 AM
New York Times: A Little More Remote Work Could Change Rush Hour a Lot - Peak commute time has long ruled our lives, our cities, our tax dollars. But it doesn't have to. (https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/11/upshot/rush-hour-remote-work.html?smid=fb-share&fbclid=IwAR2w2CatZwbWnBrYJBwgC6Nh2YI43KK804H5BaKDa9op_-DCuS7jzTlEKKc)
QuoteThere is something uniquely awful about that time of day when there is no good way to get around. The car horns sound nastier as downtown traffic snarls. The elbows feel sharper on a jammed subway. The sight of red brake lights is soul-crushing when they lead on a highway all the way to the horizon.
QuoteMere mention of it makes the body tense up: rush hour.
QuoteBut for much of the pandemic, it vanished. Not only did people travel less over the past year, with schools closed, restaurants off-limits, and millions of workers unemployed or at home; they also traveled less in a very particular way. Rush hour peaks flattened, smoothing travel demand around cities across the country into a low-grade continuous flow, a Tuesday morning not so different from a Saturday afternoon.
Good. Took a pandemic to realize how much TDM can help and how little offices are needed.
Quote from: bluecountry on June 12, 2021, 11:15:25 PM
Quote from: cpzilliacus on June 12, 2021, 07:49:07 AM
New York Times: A Little More Remote Work Could Change Rush Hour a Lot - Peak commute time has long ruled our lives, our cities, our tax dollars. But it doesn't have to. (https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/11/upshot/rush-hour-remote-work.html?smid=fb-share&fbclid=IwAR2w2CatZwbWnBrYJBwgC6Nh2YI43KK804H5BaKDa9op_-DCuS7jzTlEKKc)
QuoteThere is something uniquely awful about that time of day when there is no good way to get around. The car horns sound nastier as downtown traffic snarls. The elbows feel sharper on a jammed subway. The sight of red brake lights is soul-crushing when they lead on a highway all the way to the horizon.
QuoteMere mention of it makes the body tense up: rush hour.
QuoteBut for much of the pandemic, it vanished. Not only did people travel less over the past year, with schools closed, restaurants off-limits, and millions of workers unemployed or at home; they also traveled less in a very particular way. Rush hour peaks flattened, smoothing travel demand around cities across the country into a low-grade continuous flow, a Tuesday morning not so different from a Saturday afternoon.
Good. Took a pandemic to realize how much TDM can help and how little offices are needed.
Maybe in your industry but not mine. My local rush is pretty much back to pre-pandemic levels.
^ What are you defining as your "local rush"?
Asking because I'm recalling a recent article I read (WSJ, IIRC) that noted in the 20 largest U.S. metro areas, afternoon periods are actually busier than pre-pandemic (work-from-home folks running errands) while the "traditional" rush hours were still quieter, especially the morning rush. This trend was also noted in several mid-size regions as well.
I think it's interesting that many people are doing mid-day errands with WFH. When NYSDOT did WFH, the policy was/is that you're supposed to keep to your regular hours, with the same rules regarding lunch/breaks as when in the office. How many people actually followed that, however, is another matter.
But yes, it did change things. Pre-pandemic, telecommuting had a four day/pay period maximum, and agencies had to opt in (NYSDOT did not). The next contract with my union isn't finalized, but there are potential changes on that front, and NYSDOT appears to have interest in allowing some form of telecommuting going forward (although I do hope the office will be more populated than it is now with most people on one day/week; it gets lonely when there's nobody around).
It's hard to say how rush hour has been affected here. The morning seems lighter, but that's the most definitive thing I can say. The exit 3 project on the Northway was finished in late 2019, so there's no baseline for comparison for the PM commute (which was always seasonal; winter, early tourist, track, and leaf peeping seasons are all different - not to mention Christmas). Northway traffic seems to be closer to normal, but getting to the grocery store is harder - I don't remember the light east of the SPUI backing up into the SPUI regularly before, but now it does nearly every day. It's also harder to get my preferred parking space at my apartment, as my competitors seem to still be working from home and can more easily "steal" the spot (the trees are nice to look at, but they cause my car to get covered in bird poop unless I restrict myself to a narrow subset of the lot).
Does Captain Obvious work for the NYT now?
It doesn't take much of a genius to figure out that if less people are going in to work, traffic will be lighter.
Quote from: GaryV on June 13, 2021, 06:55:26 AM
Does Captain Obvious work for the NYT now?
It doesn't take much of a genius to figure out that if less people are going in to work, traffic will be lighter.
I think projections that this will have a significant impact on traffic are going to look pretty back in five years.
Quote from: vdeane on June 13, 2021, 12:12:57 AM
I think it's interesting that many people are doing mid-day errands with WFH. When NYSDOT did WFH, the policy was/is that you're supposed to keep to your regular hours, with the same rules regarding lunch/breaks as when in the office. How many people actually followed that, however, is another matter.
If you are going to treat work from home like that, you might as well not work from home. The whole point of working from home is the flexibility it gives people and to judge people by the work that they do and not the time it takes to do it.
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 08:06:59 AM
Quote from: vdeane on June 13, 2021, 12:12:57 AM
I think it's interesting that many people are doing mid-day errands with WFH. When NYSDOT did WFH, the policy was/is that you're supposed to keep to your regular hours, with the same rules regarding lunch/breaks as when in the office. How many people actually followed that, however, is another matter.
If you are going to treat work from home like that, you might as well not work from home. The whole point of working from home is the flexibility it gives people and to judge people by the work that they do and not the time it takes to do it.
It would take another pandemic to move away from "on the clock" the culture. A lot of work is paid for by the hour, and that makes sense as those with fixed salary can be easily abused by piling more and more work on them. Fair pay for fair work is OK with freelance contracts where the amount of work is fixed, not in ongoing operations where things never end.
Quote from: kalvado on June 13, 2021, 08:29:52 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 08:06:59 AM
Quote from: vdeane on June 13, 2021, 12:12:57 AM
I think it's interesting that many people are doing mid-day errands with WFH. When NYSDOT did WFH, the policy was/is that you're supposed to keep to your regular hours, with the same rules regarding lunch/breaks as when in the office. How many people actually followed that, however, is another matter.
If you are going to treat work from home like that, you might as well not work from home. The whole point of working from home is the flexibility it gives people and to judge people by the work that they do and not the time it takes to do it.
It would take another pandemic to move away from "on the clock" the culture. A lot of work is paid for by the hour, and that makes sense as those with fixed salary can be easily abused by piling more and more work on them. Fair pay for fair work is OK with freelance contracts where the amount of work is fixed, not in ongoing operations where things never end.
The type of work that should be judged by the hour will always be done in person. People who can work from home should by and large be salaried.
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:14:55 AM
The type of work that should be judged by the hour will always be done in person. People who can work from home should by and large be salaried.
That depends on what they are doing. For example, call center employees can work at home if they have good telephone and Internet connections.
Another NYT article? Seriously?
This is the most obvious conclusion ever. But after doing online school for over a year, I've had enough of "work from home" or "school from home" for a lifetime. Human interaction, even at its most simple is good and more important than I think many of us realized. I'm not saying WFH doesn't work for some people, but as for me, I'm not a fan of it at all.
Quote from: JoePCool14 on June 13, 2021, 02:21:43 PM
Another NYT article? Seriously?
This is the most obvious conclusion ever. But after doing online school for over a year, I've had enough of "work from home" or "school from home" for a lifetime. Human interaction, even at its most simple is good and more important than I think many of us realized. I'm not saying WFH doesn't work for some people, but as for me, I'm not a fan of it at all.
Well more introverts being able to work at home will reduce traffic. I personally hated online school and don't really like remote things.
I used to think I was a huge introvert. Then I realized how much I missed actually interacting with people. I can't imagine I'm the only one.
Quote from: US 89 on June 13, 2021, 05:42:37 PM
I used to think I was a huge introvert. Then I realized how much I missed actually interacting with people. I can't imagine I'm the only one.
Me too. Even introverts need some social interaction.
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on June 13, 2021, 05:53:45 PM
Quote from: US 89 on June 13, 2021, 05:42:37 PM
I used to think I was a huge introvert. Then I realized how much I missed actually interacting with people. I can't imagine I'm the only one.
Me too. Even introverts need some social interaction.
Things may work differently for different people. I, for one, have some long Zoom meetings - 1 or 2 on Wednesday and 2 on Friday.
It just makes sense to run those from home. If there are things that can be done remotely and planned for those days, that is 1 or 2 days of remote work, and I hope to keep at least part of that arrangement permanently.
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
Totally agree! My social life outside of work is healthy enough that I don't have to use the workplace to socialize with people.
Quote from: kalvado on June 13, 2021, 06:22:01 PM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on June 13, 2021, 05:53:45 PM
Quote from: US 89 on June 13, 2021, 05:42:37 PM
I used to think I was a huge introvert. Then I realized how much I missed actually interacting with people. I can't imagine I'm the only one.
Me too. Even introverts need some social interaction.
Things may work differently for different people. I, for one, have some long Zoom meetings - 1 or 2 on Wednesday and 2 on Friday.
It just makes sense to run those from home. If there are things that can be done remotely and planned for those days, that is 1 or 2 days of remote work, and I hope to keep at least part of that arrangement permanently.
Meanwhile, I find that these meetings are easier at the office - my work desktop has dual monitors, making taking notes far easier, and I can use the office phone to connect audio rather than run the battery down on my cell phone.
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
Quote from: vdeane on June 13, 2021, 09:25:37 PM
Quote from: kalvado on June 13, 2021, 06:22:01 PM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on June 13, 2021, 05:53:45 PM
Quote from: US 89 on June 13, 2021, 05:42:37 PM
I used to think I was a huge introvert. Then I realized how much I missed actually interacting with people. I can't imagine I'm the only one.
Me too. Even introverts need some social interaction.
Things may work differently for different people. I, for one, have some long Zoom meetings - 1 or 2 on Wednesday and 2 on Friday.
It just makes sense to run those from home. If there are things that can be done remotely and planned for those days, that is 1 or 2 days of remote work, and I hope to keep at least part of that arrangement permanently.
Meanwhile, I find that these meetings are easier at the office - my work desktop has dual monitors, making taking notes far easier, and I can use the office phone to connect audio rather than run the battery down on my cell phone.
By now, my home office is on par, if not better, than my work desk. And even 2-person conversation longer than 5 min is easier to do on zoom.
But this is really YMMV thing. However, even if half people get one day of WFH per week, that is 10% of traffic - and it is not a negligible change
Kastle.com does a weekly update of building occupancy. Other sources match the NY and Chicago numbers. Considering all the state's have been open for much higher limits it looks like a lot of remote work will continue.
It will have to because the labor force may have shrunk because of retirement low immigration and I suspect long covid.
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 08:06:59 AM
Quote from: vdeane on June 13, 2021, 12:12:57 AM
I think it's interesting that many people are doing mid-day errands with WFH. When NYSDOT did WFH, the policy was/is that you're supposed to keep to your regular hours, with the same rules regarding lunch/breaks as when in the office. How many people actually followed that, however, is another matter.
If you are going to treat work from home like that, you might as well not work from home. The whole point of working from home is the flexibility it gives people and to judge people by the work that they do and not the time it takes to do it.
That is hardly the whole point. In my case, I have a fairly strict schedule to follow, as certain information is provided to me, or I provide info to others, at specific times of the day. By working at home I can communicate with my team earlier and later than in the office. I'm waking up 1.5 hours later, yet "at work" 30 minutes sooner.
Early on in the pandemic, I realized that this was probably going to be for the long-haul. I bought myself 2 monitors to hook up to my laptop so I would have a home set-up as if I was in the office. It was $210 well spent. I know not everyone had the means to do this, but many people figured if work won't provide them with the tools to work, then they weren't going to bother. These people put themselves in a situation where helping themselves and spending just a few dollars would've been beneficial for the next year (and longer, at this point).
If you are supposed to be working from 8 - 5 or whatever, and you complete your work by 1pm and play hookie the rest of the day, the powers that be are probably taking notice that you aren't putting in a full day's work. This info is available to the powers that be when personnel action needs to be taken: ie: layoffs.
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
Not if one member is an unwilling participant.
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
If you can't work together without being physically in the same room as someone you're a pretty piss-poor team to begin with. Or at least, you're admitting you're worse at teamwork than your average Wikipedian, or Linus Torvalds, and that bar is so low it's a tripping hazard.
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 13, 2021, 10:49:30 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
If you can't work together without being physically in the same room as someone you're a pretty piss-poor team to begin with. Or at least, you're admitting you're worse at teamwork than your average Wikipedian, or Linus Torvalds, and that bar is so low it's a tripping hazard.
Working together in-person with others does tend to make it easier though. I had several group projects this past semester, and the ones where I was able to actually meet with my group at the library at least partially turned out better.
Virtual collaboration can be done, especially if those engaging in it are prepared with dual monitors, good microphones, and good Internet, but again it's just not ideal. It's more of a backup when meeting is not possible.
Quote from: JoePCool14 on June 14, 2021, 05:31:33 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 13, 2021, 10:49:30 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
If you can't work together without being physically in the same room as someone you're a pretty piss-poor team to begin with. Or at least, you're admitting you're worse at teamwork than your average Wikipedian, or Linus Torvalds, and that bar is so low it's a tripping hazard.
Working together in-person with others does tend to make it easier though. I had several group projects this past semester, and the ones where I was able to actually meet with my group at the library at least partially turned out better.
Virtual collaboration can be done, especially if those engaging in it are prepared with dual monitors, good microphones, and good Internet, but again it's just not ideal. It's more of a backup when meeting is not possible.
One collaborative project does not necessitate people being together 8 hours a day, five days a week.
Have no problem with coming into the office when it would be more efficient to get a project done or two. But, people whining about social interaction is starting to grate on me. Go get your own friends instead of forcing me to come into the office so you can satisfy a need for attention.
Given the conditions that they are talking about for my company, I'd rather stay WFH. Even though the commute to the office is only 8-10 minutes.
- Hybrid model (part onsite, part WFH)
- No fixed location in the office - you "reserve" a "hotel" desk.
- Daily app check-in at home before going to work for COVID screening (typical "have you ever coughed" questions and temp check - are they going to give me a thermometer?), and then check in again once you arrive (please plan to arrive early to accommodate)
- Wear a mask whenever you are not in your cubicle
No thank you. I'll collaborate online.
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 08:05:24 AM
Quote from: GaryV on June 13, 2021, 06:55:26 AM
Does Captain Obvious work for the NYT now?
It doesn't take much of a genius to figure out that if less people are going in to work, traffic will be lighter.
I think projections that this will have a significant impact on traffic are going to look pretty back in five years.
...probably all offset by all the delivery drivers, freight trucks, and task-runners who cannot literally work from home.
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 13, 2021, 10:49:30 PM
...that bar is so low it's a tripping hazard.
May I borrow this line? I encounter some people who really need to hear that bit of advice.
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on June 13, 2021, 10:40:14 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
Not if one member is an unwilling participant.
Well then they won't be working for me for long.
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 13, 2021, 10:49:30 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
If you can't work together without being physically in the same room as someone you're a pretty piss-poor team to begin with. Or at least, you're admitting you're worse at teamwork than your average Wikipedian, or Linus Torvalds, and that bar is so low it's a tripping hazard.
I am in an industry that requires creativity and communication throughout the day. We are much better in person. I think it's cute that you know how to do my job.
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 11:19:02 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 13, 2021, 10:49:30 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
If you can't work together without being physically in the same room as someone you're a pretty piss-poor team to begin with. Or at least, you're admitting you're worse at teamwork than your average Wikipedian, or Linus Torvalds, and that bar is so low it's a tripping hazard.
I am in an industry that requires creativity and communication throughout the day. We are much better in person. I think it's cute that you know how to do my job.
Yep, you've got some staff that needs babysitting.
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 11:17:12 AM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on June 13, 2021, 10:40:14 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
Not if one member is an unwilling participant.
Well then they won't be working for me for long.
Good luck with getting your team running in current labor situation, though.
Did you consider making ties mandatory part of office dress code as well?
Things are changing, and more remote may become an expected part of office operations.
Of course, assembly line folks have to be on site - but that not is the job that requires creativity, though.
Quote from: kalvado on June 14, 2021, 11:22:46 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 11:17:12 AM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on June 13, 2021, 10:40:14 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
Not if one member is an unwilling participant.
Well then they won't be working for me for long.
Good luck with getting your team running in current labor situation, though.
Did you consider making ties mandatory part of office dress code as well?
Things are changing, and more remote may become an expected part of office operations.
Of course, assembly line folks have to be on site - but that not is the job that requires creativity, though.
My team is fine. We have no dress code. And I am expecting remote to an exception not the rule.
And if people want to work full remote, they can work elsewhere. The requirement to work almost entirely on-site has not hindered any of the searches we have had recently.
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 11:27:05 AM
Quote from: kalvado on June 14, 2021, 11:22:46 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 11:17:12 AM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on June 13, 2021, 10:40:14 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
Not if one member is an unwilling participant.
Well then they won't be working for me for long.
Good luck with getting your team running in current labor situation, though.
Did you consider making ties mandatory part of office dress code as well?
Things are changing, and more remote may become an expected part of office operations.
Of course, assembly line folks have to be on site - but that not is the job that requires creativity, though.
My team is fine. We have no dress code. And I am expecting remote to an exception not the rule.
And if people want to work full remote, they can work elsewhere. The requirement to work almost entirely on-site has not hindered any of the searches we have had recently.
So, as long as you can hire someone, your team is fine.
We are back into tripping hazard standards again.
Quote from: Rothman on June 14, 2021, 11:30:34 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 11:27:05 AM
Quote from: kalvado on June 14, 2021, 11:22:46 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 11:17:12 AM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on June 13, 2021, 10:40:14 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
Not if one member is an unwilling participant.
Well then they won't be working for me for long.
Good luck with getting your team running in current labor situation, though.
Did you consider making ties mandatory part of office dress code as well?
Things are changing, and more remote may become an expected part of office operations.
Of course, assembly line folks have to be on site - but that not is the job that requires creativity, though.
My team is fine. We have no dress code. And I am expecting remote to an exception not the rule.
And if people want to work full remote, they can work elsewhere. The requirement to work almost entirely on-site has not hindered any of the searches we have had recently.
So, as long as you can hire someone, your team is fine.
We are back into tripping hazard standards again.
No you aren't understanding my point. We largely require people to work here. The vast majority of people who work here, want to work in person. If you don't want to do that, this probably is not the best place for you to be.
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 12:25:38 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 14, 2021, 11:30:34 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 11:27:05 AM
Quote from: kalvado on June 14, 2021, 11:22:46 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 11:17:12 AM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on June 13, 2021, 10:40:14 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
Not if one member is an unwilling participant.
Well then they won't be working for me for long.
Good luck with getting your team running in current labor situation, though.
Did you consider making ties mandatory part of office dress code as well?
Things are changing, and more remote may become an expected part of office operations.
Of course, assembly line folks have to be on site - but that not is the job that requires creativity, though.
My team is fine. We have no dress code. And I am expecting remote to an exception not the rule.
And if people want to work full remote, they can work elsewhere. The requirement to work almost entirely on-site has not hindered any of the searches we have had recently.
So, as long as you can hire someone, your team is fine.
We are back into tripping hazard standards again.
No you aren't understanding my point. We largely require people to work here. The vast majority of people who work here, want to work in person. If you don't want to do that, this probably is not the best place for you to be.
There are certainly in-person only jobs. There are situations. where in-person is not required, but beneficial. Or acceptable.
There are certainly people who prefer one or the other.
It is hard to tell without knowing exactly what this is about.
Point is, everyone may benefit from more flexibility. Once anyone switches to rigid rules - one way or the other, one side or the other - things may backfire at some point. The best course of action is to keep eyes open and look at the situation beyond simple "yes" and "no". ANthing new about that, though?
Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 13, 2021, 10:39:55 PM
Early on in the pandemic, I realized that this was probably going to be for the long-haul. I bought myself 2 monitors to hook up to my laptop so I would have a home set-up as if I was in the office. It was $210 well spent. I know not everyone had the means to do this, but many people figured if work won't provide them with the tools to work, then they weren't going to bother. These people put themselves in a situation where helping themselves and spending just a few dollars would've been beneficial for the next year (and longer, at this point).
In my case, buying monitors wouldn't help. My work computer is a desktop that on WFH days I need to access with a remote connection, either the Pulse Secure remote desktop, back when it still supported my (ancient, used only for this) Windows 7 laptop, or via the VMware Horizon VDI in browser. As in both cases the remote connection is a window, I'd still only have one monitor available for my work computer. Not that I have room for a second monitor on my desk anyways. My desk dates back from the 2000s when such was not common, and between the raised platforms on the sides and the cabinets on top, I only have room for one. I was going to try putting a second in close at an angle when I got my current desktop at home, but when I realized how much more problematic that was than I thought, I abandoned the idea and the monitor I bought became a replacement for the old one rather than a supplement. I'd love to replace the desk, for more reasons than just that, but I'd not only need to figure out where to put all the stuff that's up top, I'd also need to figure out how to assemble the new desk and get the old desk out of my apartment on my own, as I have nobody to help. My combined living room/office doesn't really have a ton of extra space, either.
Newer computers issued at work tend to be laptops for this reason, so maybe it will get easier in the future. That said, my desktop was issued in January 2020, so it might be a while.
Quote from: Rothman on June 14, 2021, 11:22:02 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 11:19:02 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 13, 2021, 10:49:30 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
If you can't work together without being physically in the same room as someone you're a pretty piss-poor team to begin with. Or at least, you're admitting you're worse at teamwork than your average Wikipedian, or Linus Torvalds, and that bar is so low it's a tripping hazard.
I am in an industry that requires creativity and communication throughout the day. We are much better in person. I think it's cute that you know how to do my job.
Yep, you've got some staff that needs babysitting.
Now you're starting to remind me of the manager here who used to talk about "hard planning" and "soft planning". Some jobs are just more spontaneous/collaborative. And it's often easier to just ask someone something rather than send an email.
Getting back to the original article, I think that there will be significant telework for the indefinite future. Teleworking may impact transit more than highway commuting (at the TRB Annual Meeting in January, there were some presenters that predicted that transit has permanently lost about 1/3 of its pre-COVD19 ridership.
Long-range transportation plans should probably include telework as a mode of transportation (and one that has little or no tailpipe emissions associated with it).
Quote from: Rothman on June 14, 2021, 11:22:02 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 11:19:02 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 13, 2021, 10:49:30 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
If you can't work together without being physically in the same room as someone you're a pretty piss-poor team to begin with. Or at least, you're admitting you're worse at teamwork than your average Wikipedian, or Linus Torvalds, and that bar is so low it's a tripping hazard.
I am in an industry that requires creativity and communication throughout the day. We are much better in person. I think it's cute that you know how to do my job.
Yep, you've got some staff that needs babysitting.
Nope. Good lord you are close-mided.
Quote from: vdeane on June 14, 2021, 01:32:47 PMSome jobs are just more spontaneous/collaborative. And it's often easier to just ask someone something rather than send an email.
Yep.
Quote from: formulanone on June 14, 2021, 08:20:23 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 13, 2021, 10:49:30 PM
...that bar is so low it's a tripping hazard.
May I borrow this line? I encounter some people who really need to hear that bit of advice.
Go for it, I shamelessly stole it from elsewhere on the internet anyway. :-D
Quote from: vdeane on June 14, 2021, 01:32:47 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 13, 2021, 10:39:55 PM
Early on in the pandemic, I realized that this was probably going to be for the long-haul. I bought myself 2 monitors to hook up to my laptop so I would have a home set-up as if I was in the office. It was $210 well spent. I know not everyone had the means to do this, but many people figured if work won't provide them with the tools to work, then they weren't going to bother. These people put themselves in a situation where helping themselves and spending just a few dollars would've been beneficial for the next year (and longer, at this point).
In my case, buying monitors wouldn't help. My work computer is a desktop that on WFH days I need to access with a remote connection, either the Pulse Secure remote desktop, back when it still supported my (ancient, used only for this) Windows 7 laptop, or via the VMware Horizon VDI in browser. As in both cases the remote connection is a window, I'd still only have one monitor available for my work computer. Not that I have room for a second monitor on my desk anyways. My desk dates back from the 2000s when such was not common, and between the raised platforms on the sides and the cabinets on top, I only have room for one. I was going to try putting a second in close at an angle when I got my current desktop at home, but when I realized how much more problematic that was than I thought, I abandoned the idea and the monitor I bought became a replacement for the old one rather than a supplement. I'd love to replace the desk, for more reasons than just that, but I'd not only need to figure out where to put all the stuff that's up top, I'd also need to figure out how to assemble the new desk and get the old desk out of my apartment on my own, as I have nobody to help. My combined living room/office doesn't really have a ton of extra space, either.
Newer computers issued at work tend to be laptops for this reason, so maybe it will get easier in the future. That said, my desktop was issued in January 2020, so it might be a while.
Quote from: Rothman on June 14, 2021, 11:22:02 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 11:19:02 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 13, 2021, 10:49:30 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
If you can't work together without being physically in the same room as someone you're a pretty piss-poor team to begin with. Or at least, you're admitting you're worse at teamwork than your average Wikipedian, or Linus Torvalds, and that bar is so low it's a tripping hazard.
I am in an industry that requires creativity and communication throughout the day. We are much better in person. I think it's cute that you know how to do my job.
Yep, you've got some staff that needs babysitting.
Now you're starting to remind me of the manager here who used to talk about "hard planning" and "soft planning". Some jobs are just more spontaneous/collaborative. And it's often easier to just ask someone something rather than send an email.
True unless you are mainly a novel writer, blogger or a host on Twitch and YouTube at least some jobs need to be on site.
Previous comment on delivery drivers. NBC has a story on that last night. Online shopping is also here to stay. It's about a third of non car non grocery retail now.
And the delivery trucks seem to add to the afternoon bump.
Quote from: vdeane on June 14, 2021, 01:32:47 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 13, 2021, 10:39:55 PM
Early on in the pandemic, I realized that this was probably going to be for the long-haul. I bought myself 2 monitors to hook up to my laptop so I would have a home set-up as if I was in the office. It was $210 well spent. I know not everyone had the means to do this, but many people figured if work won't provide them with the tools to work, then they weren't going to bother. These people put themselves in a situation where helping themselves and spending just a few dollars would've been beneficial for the next year (and longer, at this point).
In my case, buying monitors wouldn't help. My work computer is a desktop that on WFH days I need to access with a remote connection, either the Pulse Secure remote desktop, back when it still supported my (ancient, used only for this) Windows 7 laptop, or via the VMware Horizon VDI in browser. As in both cases the remote connection is a window, I'd still only have one monitor available for my work computer. Not that I have room for a second monitor on my desk anyways. My desk dates back from the 2000s when such was not common, and between the raised platforms on the sides and the cabinets on top, I only have room for one. I was going to try putting a second in close at an angle when I got my current desktop at home, but when I realized how much more problematic that was than I thought, I abandoned the idea and the monitor I bought became a replacement for the old one rather than a supplement. I'd love to replace the desk, for more reasons than just that, but I'd not only need to figure out where to put all the stuff that's up top, I'd also need to figure out how to assemble the new desk and get the old desk out of my apartment on my own, as I have nobody to help. My combined living room/office doesn't really have a ton of extra space, either.
Newer computers issued at work tend to be laptops for this reason, so maybe it will get easier in the future. That said, my desktop was issued in January 2020, so it might be a while.
Quote from: Rothman on June 14, 2021, 11:22:02 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 11:19:02 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 13, 2021, 10:49:30 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
If you can't work together without being physically in the same room as someone you're a pretty piss-poor team to begin with. Or at least, you're admitting you're worse at teamwork than your average Wikipedian, or Linus Torvalds, and that bar is so low it's a tripping hazard.
I am in an industry that requires creativity and communication throughout the day. We are much better in person. I think it's cute that you know how to do my job.
Yep, you've got some staff that needs babysitting.
Now you're starting to remind me of the manager here who used to talk about "hard planning" and "soft planning". Some jobs are just more spontaneous/collaborative. And it's often easier to just ask someone something rather than send an email.
There is a way to get the Pulse window to spread across two monitors. It involves setting up a new session link with different parameters than the default.
Too bad we are almost done WFH...
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 02:14:15 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 14, 2021, 11:22:02 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 11:19:02 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 13, 2021, 10:49:30 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
If you can't work together without being physically in the same room as someone you're a pretty piss-poor team to begin with. Or at least, you're admitting you're worse at teamwork than your average Wikipedian, or Linus Torvalds, and that bar is so low it's a tripping hazard.
I am in an industry that requires creativity and communication throughout the day. We are much better in person. I think it's cute that you know how to do my job.
Yep, you've got some staff that needs babysitting.
Nope. Good lord you are close-mided.
Nah. Just calling them as I see 'em. I know management euphemisms when I see them. "We need to be collaborative and cooperative and therefore need to be in-person where it works better" = "Some of you don't work as well remotely and ruin it for the rest of us."
QuoteNah. Just calling them as I see 'em. I know management euphemisms when I see them. "We need to be collaborative and cooperative and therefore need to be in-person where it works better" = "Some of you don't work as well remotely and ruin it for the rest of us."
I agree with you completely Rothman. I probably have worked better at home than in the office because it was much easier for me to deal with the noise once I bought my own headphones and started listening to videos throughout the day.
Quote from: Rothman on June 14, 2021, 05:25:46 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 02:14:15 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 14, 2021, 11:22:02 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 11:19:02 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 13, 2021, 10:49:30 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
If you can't work together without being physically in the same room as someone you're a pretty piss-poor team to begin with. Or at least, you're admitting you're worse at teamwork than your average Wikipedian, or Linus Torvalds, and that bar is so low it's a tripping hazard.
I am in an industry that requires creativity and communication throughout the day. We are much better in person. I think it's cute that you know how to do my job.
Yep, you've got some staff that needs babysitting.
Nope. Good lord you are close-mided.
Nah. Just calling them as I see 'em. I know management euphemisms when I see them. "We need to be collaborative and cooperative and therefore need to be in-person where it works better" = "Some of you don't work as well remotely and ruin it for the rest of us."
Or, more cynically, "I feel insecure about my abilities as a manager if I only have a finished product to judge performance on and can't spy on people to criticize how they're working."
Quote from: Rothman on June 14, 2021, 05:22:52 PM
Quote from: vdeane on June 14, 2021, 01:32:47 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 13, 2021, 10:39:55 PM
Early on in the pandemic, I realized that this was probably going to be for the long-haul. I bought myself 2 monitors to hook up to my laptop so I would have a home set-up as if I was in the office. It was $210 well spent. I know not everyone had the means to do this, but many people figured if work won't provide them with the tools to work, then they weren't going to bother. These people put themselves in a situation where helping themselves and spending just a few dollars would've been beneficial for the next year (and longer, at this point).
In my case, buying monitors wouldn't help. My work computer is a desktop that on WFH days I need to access with a remote connection, either the Pulse Secure remote desktop, back when it still supported my (ancient, used only for this) Windows 7 laptop, or via the VMware Horizon VDI in browser. As in both cases the remote connection is a window, I'd still only have one monitor available for my work computer. Not that I have room for a second monitor on my desk anyways. My desk dates back from the 2000s when such was not common, and between the raised platforms on the sides and the cabinets on top, I only have room for one. I was going to try putting a second in close at an angle when I got my current desktop at home, but when I realized how much more problematic that was than I thought, I abandoned the idea and the monitor I bought became a replacement for the old one rather than a supplement. I'd love to replace the desk, for more reasons than just that, but I'd not only need to figure out where to put all the stuff that's up top, I'd also need to figure out how to assemble the new desk and get the old desk out of my apartment on my own, as I have nobody to help. My combined living room/office doesn't really have a ton of extra space, either.
Newer computers issued at work tend to be laptops for this reason, so maybe it will get easier in the future. That said, my desktop was issued in January 2020, so it might be a while.
Quote from: Rothman on June 14, 2021, 11:22:02 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 11:19:02 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 13, 2021, 10:49:30 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
If you can't work together without being physically in the same room as someone you're a pretty piss-poor team to begin with. Or at least, you're admitting you're worse at teamwork than your average Wikipedian, or Linus Torvalds, and that bar is so low it's a tripping hazard.
I am in an industry that requires creativity and communication throughout the day. We are much better in person. I think it's cute that you know how to do my job.
Yep, you've got some staff that needs babysitting.
Now you're starting to remind me of the manager here who used to talk about "hard planning" and "soft planning". Some jobs are just more spontaneous/collaborative. And it's often easier to just ask someone something rather than send an email.
There is a way to get the Pulse window to spread across two monitors. It involves setting up a new session link with different parameters than the default.
Too bad we are almost done WFH...
Interesting. Too bad they stopped supporting Windows 7; I don't have Windows 10 at home (my main desktop and laptop are both Linux, and the ancient laptop with Windows 7 is dying anyways). Or the space on my desk, for that matter (I really should replace it one of these days...).
Quote from: cpzilliacus on June 13, 2021, 02:00:55 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:14:55 AM
The type of work that should be judged by the hour will always be done in person. People who can work from home should by and large be salaried.
That depends on what they are doing. For example, call center employees can work at home if they have good telephone and Internet connections.
Yep. Even though I can theoretically work from home (and did for seven weeks back in March-May of last year), I'm still expected to answer the phone, respond to e-mails, and such during specific hours. There are also tasks that have to be done by a certain time on a certain day. In short, the reasons for my having fixed work hours didn't magically go away just because I was working from home instead of my office.
And yeah, think about call center agents (with whom I interact occasionally at work). Their shifts are determined by expected call volumes, which don't magically change just because they're working from home instead of the office. A lot of people can't just decide to do their work at whatever hour suits them, for a variety of reasons.
Quote from: JoePCool14 on June 14, 2021, 05:31:33 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 13, 2021, 10:49:30 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 13, 2021, 09:37:42 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 13, 2021, 06:39:27 PM
I have no objection to those who want to be in the office. Just don't drag me in with you just because you want social interaction.
No but I will drag you there because I believe a sense of place benefits teamwork.
If you can't work together without being physically in the same room as someone you're a pretty piss-poor team to begin with. Or at least, you're admitting you're worse at teamwork than your average Wikipedian, or Linus Torvalds, and that bar is so low it's a tripping hazard.
Working together in-person with others does tend to make it easier though. I had several group projects this past semester, and the ones where I was able to actually meet with my group at the library at least partially turned out better.
Virtual collaboration can be done, especially if those engaging in it are prepared with dual monitors, good microphones, and good Internet, but again it's just not ideal. It's more of a backup when meeting is not possible.
So true. Being trained to do a new task without being together in person is
so much harder–at least at my job. It's much easier to just point at something with your finger, read what notes your trainee is writing down to see if there's any confusion, switch places at the keyboard every so often...
Quote from: vdeane on June 14, 2021, 01:32:47 PM
In my case, buying monitors wouldn't help. My work computer is a desktop that on WFH days I need to access with a remote connection, either the Pulse Secure remote desktop, back when it still supported my (ancient, used only for this) Windows 7 laptop, or via the VMware Horizon VDI in browser. As in both cases the remote connection is a window, I'd still only have one monitor available for my work computer. Not that I have room for a second monitor on my desk anyways.
When I worked from home, the CEO of the company delivered all the components to me in a box on my front porch (tower, dual monitors, keyboard, mouse, speakers, cables). Every day, I use two different MFA VPN connections (GlobalProtect and one powered by Citrix), and once or twice a week I launch a virtual desktop.
I have a co-worker who has a similar situation to yours: when working from home, he has to remotely access his work computer. That means that, if there's an issue with his work computer, he has to get in the car and drive to the office to fix it–having to figure out a way to get in the secure building if his access card isn't set up to grant access on that day and the others in his department are also working from home.
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 12:25:38 PM
No you aren't understanding my point. We largely require people to work here. The vast majority of people who work here, want to work in person. If you don't want to do that, this probably is not the best place for you to be.
Your point seems to be that people "want" to work there. Being that you are pretty open to saying "If you don't want to be here, work elsewhere", your staff is probably not very open to telling you the truth if they truly want to work in the office or at home.
And when offices operate like that, chances are the staff isn't very open about other things.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 15, 2021, 12:11:23 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 12:25:38 PM
No you aren't understanding my point. We largely require people to work here. The vast majority of people who work here, want to work in person. If you don't want to do that, this probably is not the best place for you to be.
Your point seems to be that people "want" to work there. Being that you are pretty open to saying "If you don't want to be here, work elsewhere", your staff is probably not very open to telling you the truth if they truly want to work in the office or at home.
And when offices operate like that, chances are the staff isn't very open about other things.
Give me a break. Do you honestly think I say things like "if you don't want to work in person, then find another job?" We are clear however that the expectations are that they work in person. And since we largely returned last fall, we haven't had anyone leave.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 15, 2021, 12:11:23 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 12:25:38 PM
No you aren't understanding my point. We largely require people to work here. The vast majority of people who work here, want to work in person. If you don't want to do that, this probably is not the best place for you to be.
Your point seems to be that people "want" to work there. Being that you are pretty open to saying "If you don't want to be here, work elsewhere", your staff is probably not very open to telling you the truth if they truly want to work in the office or at home.
And when offices operate like that, chances are the staff isn't very open about other things.
At my work, we were offered the choice a year ago about remaining at home or coming back to the office. Every single person came back to the office at the first opportunity.
Quote from: kphoger on June 15, 2021, 01:13:22 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 15, 2021, 12:11:23 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 12:25:38 PM
No you aren't understanding my point. We largely require people to work here. The vast majority of people who work here, want to work in person. If you don't want to do that, this probably is not the best place for you to be.
Your point seems to be that people "want" to work there. Being that you are pretty open to saying "If you don't want to be here, work elsewhere", your staff is probably not very open to telling you the truth if they truly want to work in the office or at home.
And when offices operate like that, chances are the staff isn't very open about other things.
At my work, we were offered the choice a year ago about remaining at home or coming back to the office. Every single person came back to the office at the first opportunity.
Peer pressure increases conformity. No one wanted to be labeled the slacker.
Quote from: Rothman on June 15, 2021, 01:18:05 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 15, 2021, 01:13:22 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 15, 2021, 12:11:23 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 12:25:38 PM
No you aren't understanding my point. We largely require people to work here. The vast majority of people who work here, want to work in person. If you don't want to do that, this probably is not the best place for you to be.
Your point seems to be that people "want" to work there. Being that you are pretty open to saying "If you don't want to be here, work elsewhere", your staff is probably not very open to telling you the truth if they truly want to work in the office or at home.
And when offices operate like that, chances are the staff isn't very open about other things.
At my work, we were offered the choice a year ago about remaining at home or coming back to the office. Every single person came back to the office at the first opportunity.
Peer pressure increases conformity. No one wanted to be labeled the slacker.
I guess you are going to keep coming up with lame excuses instead of realizing that not everyone feels the way you do.
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 15, 2021, 01:21:10 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 15, 2021, 01:18:05 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 15, 2021, 01:13:22 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 15, 2021, 12:11:23 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 12:25:38 PM
No you aren't understanding my point. We largely require people to work here. The vast majority of people who work here, want to work in person. If you don't want to do that, this probably is not the best place for you to be.
Your point seems to be that people "want" to work there. Being that you are pretty open to saying "If you don't want to be here, work elsewhere", your staff is probably not very open to telling you the truth if they truly want to work in the office or at home.
And when offices operate like that, chances are the staff isn't very open about other things.
At my work, we were offered the choice a year ago about remaining at home or coming back to the office. Every single person came back to the office at the first opportunity.
Peer pressure increases conformity. No one wanted to be labeled the slacker.
I guess you are going to keep coming up with lame excuses instead of realizing that not everyone feels the way you do.
Not excuses, just not accepting the assumptions behind the behavior.
Quote from: Rothman on June 15, 2021, 01:18:05 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 15, 2021, 01:13:22 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 15, 2021, 12:11:23 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 12:25:38 PM
No you aren't understanding my point. We largely require people to work here. The vast majority of people who work here, want to work in person. If you don't want to do that, this probably is not the best place for you to be.
Your point seems to be that people "want" to work there. Being that you are pretty open to saying "If you don't want to be here, work elsewhere", your staff is probably not very open to telling you the truth if they truly want to work in the office or at home.
And when offices operate like that, chances are the staff isn't very open about other things.
At my work, we were offered the choice a year ago about remaining at home or coming back to the office. Every single person came back to the office at the first opportunity.
Peer pressure increases conformity. No one wanted to be labeled the slacker.
We were asked by private phone call, without even knowing what our coworkers were choosing.
Any other assumptions you want to make about a situation you're unfamiliar with?
I don't have anything other than empirical evidence for this, but I think the larger the company, the more opportunity and acceptance of remote work. All other things being equal and the work being adaptable to either remote or non remote environments. When I started at my company 11 years ago I was offered 60% remote work mix and I took it. COVID didn't change much for me since I knew how to do it beforehand. The smaller companies we work with seemed to all go back into their offices sooner rather than later, while my regular (40%) office remains closed for another month or 2 till it officially reopens, and we have been bombarded by survey after survey on how we want to work in the future. I don't think they'd be asking if they wanted everyone back in the office.
Quote from: kphoger on June 15, 2021, 01:29:40 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 15, 2021, 01:18:05 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 15, 2021, 01:13:22 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 15, 2021, 12:11:23 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 12:25:38 PM
No you aren't understanding my point. We largely require people to work here. The vast majority of people who work here, want to work in person. If you don't want to do that, this probably is not the best place for you to be.
Your point seems to be that people "want" to work there. Being that you are pretty open to saying "If you don't want to be here, work elsewhere", your staff is probably not very open to telling you the truth if they truly want to work in the office or at home.
And when offices operate like that, chances are the staff isn't very open about other things.
At my work, we were offered the choice a year ago about remaining at home or coming back to the office. Every single person came back to the office at the first opportunity.
Peer pressure increases conformity. No one wanted to be labeled the slacker.
We were asked by private phone call, without even knowing what our coworkers were choosing.
Any other assumptions you want to make about a situation you're unfamiliar with?
Well, if it was by private phone call, there couldn't have been office cultural factors coming into play...
Quote from: Rothman on June 15, 2021, 01:47:22 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 15, 2021, 01:29:40 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 15, 2021, 01:18:05 PM
Quote from: kphoger on June 15, 2021, 01:13:22 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on June 15, 2021, 12:11:23 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on June 14, 2021, 12:25:38 PM
No you aren't understanding my point. We largely require people to work here. The vast majority of people who work here, want to work in person. If you don't want to do that, this probably is not the best place for you to be.
Your point seems to be that people "want" to work there. Being that you are pretty open to saying "If you don't want to be here, work elsewhere", your staff is probably not very open to telling you the truth if they truly want to work in the office or at home.
And when offices operate like that, chances are the staff isn't very open about other things.
At my work, we were offered the choice a year ago about remaining at home or coming back to the office. Every single person came back to the office at the first opportunity.
Peer pressure increases conformity. No one wanted to be labeled the slacker.
We were asked by private phone call, without even knowing what our coworkers were choosing.
Any other assumptions you want to make about a situation you're unfamiliar with?
Well, if it was by private phone call, there couldn't have been office cultural factors coming into play...
I suppose. That's kind of my point: everyone here genuinely wants to work in person, even though working remotely is possible for everyone here. Not from fear of being labeled a slacker, not based on some supposed work culture–but because none of us liked working from home as much as working in person.