AARoads Forum

With the heatwave hitting the northwest this week, I've been thinking about heat in the summertime. More specifically, how everyone all over the US says their heat is the worst (I have a family member who insists Memphis has worse summers than Houston!). I personally think humidity is what makes or breaks heat, but that's just my opinion. What type of heat do y'all think is the worst?

I gotta say that humidity makes it worse, but having only experienced 90 degree temps with high humidity, I can't tell if the top two options are worse. Still, I would probably hate the other two options just as much.

Orlando in the summer, especially after it rains.  That range of temperature usually ranges from 80-90F but the air gets super humid and stagnant being inland.

110F and humid after a monsoon in Phoenix was no joke either but would only wouldn't last more than a day. 

Have any of us actually experienced 115 degree weather, and if you have, what is it like? I haven't experienced much over 100.

The hottest temperature I have ever personally experienced was 107 degrees in Salt Lake City a couple weeks ago. Dew points were down in the 30s, so humidity was not a factor. Highest heat index I've ever experienced was one summer visiting my grandma in northeast Oklahoma. Temperatures were around 100 degrees, but dew points were high enough to result in heat index values around 115.

Personally, I don't think humidity makes all that much of a difference when it starts getting above 100. It seems to me that the real impact of humidity comes when the dry-bulb temperature is in the 80s and 90s. In fact, most of what I remember from that Oklahoma heat wave was how oppressive the nights were. It was impossible to be outside in any sort of comfort at any time of day or night unless you were in a pool. Obviously being outside in the afternoons was brutal, but to be honest I don't think it really felt much worse then than it did in the morning.

The feel of that dry 107, on the other hand, is probably best compared to being baked in an oven. Especially when a breeze came up. At those temperatures there is zero cooling effect with any sort of wind and you just feel like you're being roasted alive. I would take the humid 100 over that any day.

At least if it's humid, you sweat enough to know you're losing water. With a dry enough heat, your sweat evaporates fast enough you may not realize how dehydrated you are until it's too late.

I've noticed that extreme temperatures have become more common lately.

Quote from: Roadgeekteen on June 29, 2021, 01:11:39 AM
Have any of us actually experienced 115 degree weather, and if you have, what is it like? I haven't experienced much over 100.

I've experienced low 110s one summer here in Oklahoma. It was noticeably hotter than the typical 100s, but it didn't feel worse, probably because getting a high RH at that sort of temperature just requires so much moisture than is available with that type of weather pattern.

Our heat is the worst because residential ACs are uncommon and often broken. Our homes are not made to combat heat at all, and our infrastructure can barely keep up.

Quote from: Bruce on June 29, 2021, 04:15:16 AM
Our heat is the worst because residential ACs are uncommon and often broken. Our homes are not made to combat heat at all, and our infrastructure can barely keep up.

Sounds kind of like the inverse of the Texas ice storm disaster this past winter.

My wife experienced 110+° heat at night in Jordan in a home without A/C.  High humidity.  She said she felt like she was being cooked in bed.

When the temperature and humidity match. Was like that in St. Louis and it's like that here on the cape. My AC is broken (I've asked my landlord if he could fix it. Haven't heard back from him.)

Quote from: CapeCodder on June 29, 2021, 05:34:20 AM
When the temperature and humidity match. Was like that in St. Louis and it's like that here on the cape. My AC is broken (I've asked my landlord if he could fix it. Haven't heard back from him.)

Heh.  My father was on Corpus Christi when the humidity was extremely high. Walked outside and his shirt got damp and stuck to him.  Humidity gets high (with high heat) in MA, but not that like that. :D

Quote from: Roadgeekteen on June 29, 2021, 01:11:39 AM
Have any of us actually experienced 115 degree weather, and if you have, what is it like? I haven't experienced much over 100.

Yes, as a regular thing in Phoenix for 13 years.  It's regularly over 100 even where I live now.  You kind of get used to the weather after awhile if you expose yourself to it. 

Quote from: Rothman on June 29, 2021, 05:38:09 AM

Quote from: CapeCodder on June 29, 2021, 05:34:20 AM
When the temperature and humidity match. Was like that in St. Louis and it's like that here on the cape. My AC is broken (I've asked my landlord if he could fix it. Haven't heard back from him.)

Heh.  My father was on Corpus Christi when the humidity was extremely high. Walked outside and his shirt got damp and stuck to him.  Humidity gets high (with high heat) in MA, but not that like that. :D

Humidity is a summer constant here, but incomparable to when I went down to Corpus Christi and rolled down the window at a drive-thru. It felt like there was a dryer vent attached to the window. I remember remarking to my wife, "You know all the humidity we get at home? Here's where they make it all."

As an aside, it's close to impossible for the RH and temperature to match too much above 80° or so. Air that warm can absorb a colossal amount of water vapor, so even the most humid days at 100°F are nowhere near 100% RH.

High humidity and high heat in south Florida the day or two prior to the arrival of a hurricane.  Nothing beats it for oppressiveness.

Quote from: Rothman on June 29, 2021, 05:38:09 AM

Quote from: CapeCodder on June 29, 2021, 05:34:20 AM
When the temperature and humidity match. Was like that in St. Louis and it's like that here on the cape. My AC is broken (I've asked my landlord if he could fix it. Haven't heard back from him.)

Heh.  My father was on Corpus Christi when the humidity was extremely high. Walked outside and his shirt got damp and stuck to him.  Humidity gets high (with high heat) in MA, but not that like that. :D

I lived near the Mississippi and Missouri Rivers. When one or both were in flood, you could feel the very high humidity. Plus factor in the corn/other crops and that added more.

Quote from: Bruce on June 29, 2021, 04:15:16 AM
Our heat is the worst because residential ACs are uncommon and often broken. Our homes are not made to combat heat at all, and our infrastructure can barely keep up.

I lived briefly in Seattle and I moved right around the 4th of July and the temp was 98°.  I lived in an apartment that surrounded a central courtyard and I had a corner unit, so we had absolutely no breeze if we opened the windows.  Obviously no A/C either.  I had to take cold showers right before bed just to be able to sleep.

---

Having lived in climates with all three options, the worst by far is the high humidity.  A 95° day in Kansas City where the air is so thick you can chew it sucks.  When Denver hits 105° very, very occasionally, it doesn't feel that bad in the shade.

It's similar for cold.  I went hiking at -15° this winter out here and it was brisk but not horrible.  I was in New Orleans when it got down to 50° and that cold shot straight into my soul.

Chris

Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 29, 2021, 05:45:27 AM

Quote from: Roadgeekteen on June 29, 2021, 01:11:39 AM
Have any of us actually experienced 115 degree weather, and if you have, what is it like? I haven't experienced much over 100.

Yes, as a regular thing in Phoenix for 13 years.  It's regularly over 100 even where I live now.  You kind of get used to the weather after awhile if you expose yourself to it.

At least in Arizona everything has AC.

Humidity no contest. The mugginess is inescapable while outside. The air feels like sticky soup. The hundreds range can at least be partially avoided in the shade, and fans actually help somewhat.

Quote from: Roadgeekteen on June 29, 2021, 01:19:18 PM

Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 29, 2021, 05:45:27 AM

Quote from: Roadgeekteen on June 29, 2021, 01:11:39 AM
Have any of us actually experienced 115 degree weather, and if you have, what is it like? I haven't experienced much over 100.

Yes, as a regular thing in Phoenix for 13 years.  It's regularly over 100 even where I live now.  You kind of get used to the weather after awhile if you expose yourself to it.

At least in Arizona everything has AC.

One year I lost my central air at my house in Scottsdale during the summer.  I had a home warranty but it took forever to gather all the parts necessary to install the new system.  I usually slept most nights out on my pool on an air mattress while I opened all the windows inside the house.  Given this was a tri-level home even floor had an approximately 5 degree difference.  The hottest it ever got on the middle floor where the family room was located at was 102F.  If I had to spend time inside it was usually down in the basement where it was usually in the low 90s or high 80s after cooling overnight.

Any kind of heat that makes my apartment roast, like 85 or so inside when it's 100 plus outside makes me sticky at night. Although it does help when I have fans going and windows opened so that I can at least push some of the heat out, even though it may slightly backdraft. I've managed to place a heat reflector mat like the one you put inside your car on the top half of my bedroom window so it tacks off a couple of degrees or two, and I draw down the shades, but it's no guarantee that it keeps the heat back

A/C is kind of not an option for me as it really eats up my power bill and I'm trying to keep it as low as I can maintain it, about $35 or so a month. I did have a portable A/C at one point but it bumped my power bill to $185 or so. With heat like this in Missoula, I'm kind of in a no-win situation. It makes me have to roll all four windows of my car down slightly so that I can have the air flow through the cabin which makes it at least bearable to climb in without feeling like a roasted boar.

4 PM is when the sun beats my bedroom and it stays that way for several hours until 10 PM or so, and my part of Missoula doesn't get cooled down until around 11 or midnight, which leaves us very few hours of cooling, then it's right back to sweltering heat again just as 9 AM rolls on the following day. 12 to 10 PM are the peak heating hours I've come to calculate based on where I am in Missoula.

Summed up, the heat is one thing about summer that I'm not gonna miss very much.

I'll take 110 with low humidity and a breeze, over 90 with high humidity and no breeze, any day.

Quote from: kphoger on July 08, 2021, 03:59:42 PM
I'll take 110 with low humidity and a breeze, over 90 with high humidity and no breeze, any day.

If the actual temperature is over 95, breezes don't help.
http://www.zunis.org/at_least_theres_a_breeze.htm (warning: replacement characters littered throughout whenever there's supposed to be a degree symbol)

Quote from: 1 on July 08, 2021, 04:02:13 PM

Quote from: kphoger on July 08, 2021, 03:59:42 PM
I'll take 110 with low humidity and a breeze, over 90 with high humidity and no breeze, any day.

If the actual temperature is over 95, breezes don't help.
http://www.zunis.org/at_least_theres_a_breeze.htm (warning: replacement characters littered throughout whenever there's supposed to be a degree symbol)

I don't need an article to tell me if a breeze helps or not.  I feel better when there's a breeze.  Period.

Humidity is absolutely worse. Chicagoland experienced a relative drought for several weeks, and it started to get hot. At work, we had no trouble keeping up. Rain finally came, and humidity followed. That's when it became miserable.

I'm from the DFW area, with moderate humidity.  I've been to Houston in summer.  Going outside in the morning was like walking into a pool of hot water.  Afternoon didn't feel quite as wet, but it was hotter.  It's definitely worse than what we get (most of the time, we had some days with a 115 degree heat index early this summer because it was raining so much). 

The worst to me is low humidity.  The deserts in west Texas usually don't get extremely dry, but I've been there when it happened.  Temperature of 110 and 2% relative humidity, my eyes were watering, my nose was running, and my throat was dry (just like what happens in the cold), and the bare ground was baking, reflecting the sun's heat, so it was like the sun shining from above and below.  It hurt.  That was  over 15 years ago when I was younger and heat didn't bother me, but it still hurt.  I think it's because I'm accustomed to the semi-humid weather of my homeland and the semi-dry conditions the Texas desert get normally, but that was my first time in very dry heat.

I know that this is going to come across as subjective, but the worst kind of heat is whatever kind I am currently experiencing. And it's the same for cold, too, to be honest. It's one of the reasons I miss Santa Barbara, since the temperature was only rarely outside my comfort zone.

That said, I am currently in College Station TX, and so I would vote for whatever that is, but I'm not sure if it's the second or the third on the list.

Having just suffered through steambaths in the Houston area, I have to go with option 3. Re: option 1, the saying is "but it's only a dry heat".

Quote from: Roadgeekteen on June 29, 2021, 01:11:39 AM
Have any of us actually experienced 115 degree weather, and if you have, what is it like? I haven't experienced much over 100.

Not at length, but I experienced ~120-degree heat in the bottom of Death Valley in mid-summer. Almost no humidity, felt much more comfortable than the near-100% summertime humidity at much lower temps where I live.

Quote from: Roadgeekteen on June 29, 2021, 01:11:39 AM
Have any of us actually experienced 115 degree weather, and if you have, what is it like? I haven't experienced much over 100.

I've experienced this in Vegas a few times. I much prefer their 115 degree, low humidity days to NJ's 95 degree, high humidity days.

I will say it's actually more uncomfortable when I'm out at midnight, and the temp is still 100 degrees. It feels uncomfortable because the mind thinks it should be cooling down a bit by then.

Give me Dallas humidity all day long over Houston or New Orleans.

Little-known fact: Yearly rainfall average in Dallas is 37.1 inches, and in London, England is 27.2 inches.

Quote from: jeffandnicole on September 05, 2021, 02:07:08 AM

Quote from: Roadgeekteen on June 29, 2021, 01:11:39 AM
Have any of us actually experienced 115 degree weather, and if you have, what is it like? I haven't experienced much over 100.

I've experienced this in Vegas a few times. I much prefer their 115 degree, low humidity days to NJ's 95 degree, high humidity days.

I will say it's actually more uncomfortable when I'm out at midnight, and the temp is still 100 degrees. It feels uncomfortable because the mind thinks it should be cooling down a bit by then.

I've experienced it as well.  Southern Utah and Las Vegas in July.  I think it topped out at 116° while I was there.  I think the best way I can describe it is this:  the way I feel after being in 105° weather for five minutes is the way I feel after being in 115° weather for one minute.

Quote from: kphoger on September 05, 2021, 03:11:07 PMSouthern Utah and Las Vegas in July.  I think it topped out at 116° while I was there.  I think the best way I can describe it is this:  the way I feel after being in 105° weather for five minutes is the way I feel after being in 115° weather for one minute.

If you're thinking in terms of minutes, that proves that it's definitely dry heat.  You'd be thinking in terms of seconds if it was humid at that temperature.

Quote from: Roadgeekteen on June 29, 2021, 01:11:39 AM
Have any of us actually experienced 115 degree weather, and if you have, what is it like? I haven't experienced much over 100.

I did I know in Sacramento 115 in some years would be the highest temperature  reached in the Valley it raises concerns over wildfires and your car would feel like an oven.

this is 2021 for chrissakes.

we have the technology. we should never have to experience temperatures over 65 or less than 60.

Quote from: zachary_amaryllis on September 07, 2021, 05:51:49 PM
this is 2021 for chrissakes.

we have the technology. we should never have to experience temperatures over 65 or less than 60.

Make that 75/70 for me.  I guess I now know who to blame the next time I'm shivering in the office because the AC or heat is set way too cold.

Quote from: vdeane on September 07, 2021, 09:29:02 PM

Quote from: zachary_amaryllis on September 07, 2021, 05:51:49 PM
this is 2021 for chrissakes.

we have the technology. we should never have to experience temperatures over 65 or less than 60.

Make that 75/70 for me.  I guess I now know who to blame the next time I'm shivering in the office because the AC or heat is set way too cold.

You and I would not do well together at the office.  I like to keep the thermostat set to Meat Locker.  I tell people:  You can put something on, or I can take something off -- choose wisely.

Quote from: wanderer2575 on September 07, 2021, 09:49:20 PM

Quote from: vdeane on September 07, 2021, 09:29:02 PM

Quote from: zachary_amaryllis on September 07, 2021, 05:51:49 PM
this is 2021 for chrissakes.

we have the technology. we should never have to experience temperatures over 65 or less than 60.

Make that 75/70 for me.  I guess I now know who to blame the next time I'm shivering in the office because the AC or heat is set way too cold.

i'm scared.

my mother often complains that i have the air on too much in my car. there is no 'too much'. i'll sacrifice my 10hp or whatever it is to keep my car frosty inside.

You and I would not do well together at the office.  I like to keep the thermostat set to Meat Locker.  I tell people:  You can put something on, or I can take something off -- choose wisely.

As much as I love Houston, the humidity is what makes the heat so miserable. I have never been west of San Antonio, so I dont know what the dry desert heat is like, but I know that when its sticky and humid, it makes the heat even more oppressive because its not only hot, but it feels heavy...like the heat is weighing you down.  I love when late October hits and it gets cool...I actually loved how cold this past winter was...I was even ok with the winter storm until the power went out.  And even then, it wasn't the cold that bothered me as much as the not having my iPhone, PS4 and lights

High humidity.  There's no relief at night as moisture holds heat much better than dry air, so nighttime lows rarely get below the upper to mid 70's.  I personally can't sleep any hotter than 76.  The main reason that the South was sparsely populated until the last 6 decades or so, was that it was almost unlivable until the advent of air conditioning, especially south Texas and Florida.  People who lived there prior couldn't be very productive in the summertime as heat indexes as high as they get sap the energy out of you, and the shade only helps a little during midday.

Further backing up my opinion on how humidity makes heat worse, this afternoon I was out doing yard work and it actually felt really nice! Today's high was 91 (usually when it gets that hot in Houston, it's miserable), but today the humidity was low due to a "cold" front pushing out the stagnant humidity. I lasted for about as twice as long as I usually do if I'm doing anything outside in the summertime. My family even could sense that the humidity was gone even before going outside!

Quote from: vdeane on September 07, 2021, 09:29:02 PM

Quote from: zachary_amaryllis on September 07, 2021, 05:51:49 PM
this is 2021 for chrissakes.

we have the technology. we should never have to experience temperatures over 65 or less than 60.

Make that 75/70 for me.  I guess I now know who to blame the next time I'm shivering in the office because the AC or heat is set way too cold.

I'm generally comfortable between 55 and 67. I keep the ac at 62/65 at all times and during winter sometimes I don't even turn on a heater. It has to be under 55 usually before I break out a heater. My dog, a Siberian husky mix, get cold before I do

Quote from: CoreySamson on September 08, 2021, 04:40:21 PM
Further backing up my opinion on how humidity makes heat worse, this afternoon I was out doing yard work and it actually felt really nice! Today's high was 91 (usually when it gets that hot in Houston, it's miserable), but today the humidity was low due to a "cold" front pushing out the stagnant humidity. I lasted for about as twice as long as I usually do if I'm doing anything outside in the summertime. My family even could sense that the humidity was gone even before going outside!

You are absolutely right. It has felt pretty great the past few days. I have been enjoying my walks with the dog and we have been able to start taking our long ones again. When it's hot, we usually go around the block once and then we are both done and ready to head back inside. But this week we have gone around the neighborhood every time. I'm noticing it's making him happier too.

I believe the hottest I've ever felt in my lifetime was 122 degrees when I was visiting near Carlsbad in New Mexico back in June 1994, still stands as the hottest temperature in NM state history.

The heat of the sunshine coming out immediately after it stops raining. Sunshine while or after rain, in my opinion, is the single worst weather type. No matter what temperature it is, the air feels disgusting. So humid.

Speaking of 120's, the next summer after 1994 in southern NM, I was in Phoenix the next summer in July 1995, when a powerful heat wave gripped the desert southwest, far more powerful than the globally covered Chicagolan heat wave that occurred just days prior to that.  I was in Phoenix when they reached the city's second highest temperature of 121 degrees, so you could say I experienced 120+ degrees in back-to-back summer.

That desert southwest heat wave went mostly unnoticed by the media and country even though the the temperatures were way more intense, but the one in the Great Lakes region had global coverage, probably due to the higher number of fatalities in Chicago and it being a more globally renowned city than Phoenix.  I believe the respective heat waves were separated by only a week or two apart in July 1995.

Edit:  Just looked it up

7/13/1995 -- 103 high & 83 low at O'Hare Int'l AP (second-highest in its history)
7/25/1995 -- 121 high & 90 low at Sky Harbor Int'l AP (second-highest in its history)

As kind of the opposite version of this question, the coldest I've been recently was in New Orleans when it was 49° and drizzly.  With all the humidity, it chills you to the bone.  I went hiking in -11° weather in Rocky Mountain National Park this past February and was roasting by comparison.

Chris

I live in Palm Springs where it hits 120°F every summer. I'll take that over the 90°F and 90% humidity I experienced daily on Diego Garcia (7°19' S latitude, so it was within the ITCZ (https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/images/703/the-intertropical-convergence-zone#:~:text=The%20Intertropical%20Convergence%20Zone%2C%20or,and%20Southern%20Hemispheres%20come%20together.) from Thanksgiving through March) in the Navy.

When people talk humidity, it's really the dew point that tells you how intense the humidity is.  RH is expressed as a % and only tells you how close to saturation the air is, but the dew point truly indicates how much actual water vapor is in the air.

For example on a typical August Day:

Dallas: temperature of 98 degrees + 75 degree dew point = Heat Index of 111 degrees -- RH would be 48%.
Milwaukee:  temperature of 80 degrees + dew point of 70 degrees = Heat Index of 83 degrees -- RH would be at 63%

Milwaukee has a higher RH, but Dallas has a higher dew point, so the Temperature-HI separation in Dallas is greater than that in Milwaukee.

I should also add that when the dew point reaches 75 degrees, it starts to feel quite uncomfortable at any temperature.  Anything less than 70 degrees is tolerable.  Anything past 80 degrees, which is typical here along the western half of the Gulf Coast, is very uncomfortable.

^
Definitely. The dew point when I was on Diego Garcia was rarely below 80°F from Thanksgiving to the end of March. 90°F temps with an 85°F dew point is a killer. (I was an AG2 working in the weather office. I also did weather balloons.) The dew point in Palm Springs when the temps get above 115°F tend to be under 20°F and may be in single digits. I've even seen negative dew points, though not with temps that high. 115°F is still ungodly hot though.

Phoenix was always more tolerable than Orlando.  The humidity factor brings nothing but misery.

heat that comes out of heated seats in cars.

yeah, that's just what my 300-lb self wants, more heat on my butt etc. while i'm driving.

Heated seats are nice when you have leather seats and the car's been sitting outside in the dead of winter for several hours. But once the seat is a comfortable temperature I usually turn it off, even if the rest of me is still cold.

Here are several examples on a typical August day assuming normal conditions (not a heat wave),

Yuma, AZ:  Temperature of 105 degrees + dew point of 50 degrees = Heat Index of 102 degrees
Waco, TX:  Temperature of 98 degrees + dew point of 72 degrees = Heat Index of 108 degrees
New Orleans, LA:  Temperature of 93 degrees + dew point of 76 degrees = Heat Index of 107 degrees
Key West, FL:  Temperature of 88 degrees + dew point of 82 degrees = Heat Index of 109 degrees
Corpus Christi, TX:  Temperature of 95 degrees + dew point of 79 degrees = Heat Index of 114 degrees

I've noticed that a dew point around 60 degrees is typically the equalizer, where actual air temperature and Heat Index are equal.

I barely use the heated seats in my car (most often by accident since it's next to where I leave my mask). Should've gone for back cooling, which is way more useful in my climate.

Humidity is worse.

The highest dew point ever recorded, 95°F (35°C), was recorded at Dhahran, Saudi Arabia, on July 8, 2003. With an air temperature of 108°F (42°C) the heat index was 178°F (81°C).

Quote from: Road Hog on March 20, 2022, 09:13:08 PM
The highest dew point ever recorded, 95°F (35°C), was recorded at Dhahran, Saudi Arabia, on July 8, 2003. With an air temperature of 108°F (42°C) the heat index was 178°F (81°C).

And yet, that's only 68% relative humidity.

Goes to show you how much water hot air can really hold.

^  Which further illustrates why Relative Humidity isn't indicative of uncomfortableness.  You can have 90% RH on a freezing day and it still feels far more tolerable than a 60% RH on a triple digit temperature.  Even the actual indicator of moisture amount, the Dew Point, if you ask different people from different parts of the world, you will get varying opinions.  Like for a dew point of 70 degrees is very much tolerable for someone like myself who is accustomed to tropical-like climate, yet it will feel like hell for someone from Canada or Europe who will start to feel uncomfortable once the dew point exceeds 60 degrees.

Humidty is much worse than dry heat.  70 degrees and humid feels less comfortable than 110 and dry.