This is a very specific sort of arrangement I'm looking for. I've wanted to compile a list of towns that are like this so this forum post could help me. Think:
- Ashland, VA
- Mt Olive, NC
- Waxhaw, NC
- Calypso, NC
- Lyons, GA
- Tabor City, NC
- Estill, SC
- Salley, SC
- Southern Pines, NC
but NOT something like La Grange, KY, or Tampa, FL with street running tracks, and not just any old town that has a railroad track running through the middle splitting it in half (St Pauls, NC or Star, NC to name two examples of what I'm not looking for with this) To describe it with a diagram, it's something like this:
(https://i.imgur.com/7IQtVKM.png)
I'm being so specific because I asked this question before somewhere else and got responses that were nothing what I was looking for, like a railroad track running behind downtown like in Boone, IA, Belmont, NC, or something like Rainier, OR.
Places like Faison, NC would almost qualify for the list I was looking for if the downtown was along the aforementioned parallel roads in the diagram. Places like Allendale, SC, Landrum, SC, Warsaw, NC, and Mt Holly, NC are kind of grey areas because they have a bit of both going on, like a mix between the bullet list and the arrangement in Faison, NC - a downtown that's on the parallel roads but not exclusively on it.
Feel free to post any situation like Allendale/Landrum/Mt Holly/Warsaw. There doesn't necessarily need to be buildings on both sides, there just has to be part, or all of the downtown situated on the parallel roads. (So something like the bottom half of the diagram works as well.)
This arrangement seems to be super common in NC, sporadic in SC and GA, and nearly nonexistent elsewhere. Supposedly they built the downtowns like this to show the importance of the railroads but I'm curious as to why it seems so geographically limited. I'm curious to know of any examples outside of NC, GA, and SC. If you're confused about anything I said or if something fits or not, post it anyway and I'll see if it fits.
Edit: To clarify it's also got to be like, the centerpiece of downtown, it can't be off to the side or anything
I realize it's in Georgia, but Hapeville is sort of a perfect example.
Morgan, UT looks like the bottom half of that diagram if you consider Commercial Street to be your "downtown" area. It certainly feels more like a historic downtown in that area around 125 North than at the actual city center on the other side of the river.
Quote from: US 89 on July 13, 2021, 01:15:33 AM
I realize it’s in Georgia, but Hapeville is sort of a perfect example.
Morgan, UT looks like the bottom half of that diagram if you consider Commercial Street to be your “downtown” area. It certainly feels more like a historic downtown in that area around 125 North than at the actual city center on the other side of the river.
Yeah, Hapeville is exactly the sort of thing I'm looking for. Here's a list of them I just put together from what I and somebody else found so far: https://www.google.com/maps/d/u/0/edit?mid=1MZgVD1KDR0kaErvtecS8lyzhWJCkK1sS&usp=sharing
Morgan, UT could
almost make it, it just lacks a real city street on the other side.
For my map, if there's no real downtown but there's parallel roads, I'll just count the densest area/road with the most driveways to homes as "downtown". In GA/SC/NC is okay, by the way.
Harris, MN: https://www.google.com/maps/@45.584604,-92.9766977,17z
A former "almost" example example is La Crosse, VA. Track long removed.
More examples:
Robersonvlle NC
Bethel NC
Tarboro NC (streets turned into a one-way pair)
St Matthews SC (interesting as the railroad is below street levels)
Lake City SC
Summerville SC
Blackville SC (RR removed)
Williston SC (RR removed)
Aiken SC (RR removed)
Enfield, NC. You see it from the Auto Train. We drove thru there in May bypassing a backup on I-95. Depressing place, the buildings along both sides of the tracks look abandoned.
Really it's not too uncommon for the plot you describe to be the original layout of any community started as a rail siding. Usually most communities and cities manage to survive their siding origins tend to develop more on one side than the other. Downtown Hanford, California comes to mind though with the former Southern Pacific tracks between 5th and 6th Streets.
Fort Collins, CO
https://goo.gl/maps/8omxf88uoPyFHEU7A
Quote from: 1995hoo on July 13, 2021, 07:37:00 AM
Enfield, NC. You see it from the Auto Train. We drove thru there in May bypassing a backup on I-95. Depressing place, the buildings along both sides of the tracks look abandoned.
Unfortunately a lot of Eastern North Carolina is like that, especially along the I-95 corridor. IIRC, Rocky Mount's downtown used to be dilapidated and run down but they've done a pretty good restoration project, same with Goldsboro. Despite that, the kind of decay we have here isn't nearly as bad as some downtown areas in the Mississippi Delta/Arkansas. Shells of buildings, smashed and boarded-up windows, empty lots, etc.
Quote from: catch22 on July 13, 2021, 08:03:27 AM
Fort Collins, CO
https://goo.gl/maps/8omxf88uoPyFHEU7A (https://goo.gl/maps/8omxf88uoPyFHEU7A)
Not
quite what I had in mind, it's off to the side as opposed to the downtown being built around it. If it was on the area's main street (or main street pair, considering what we're talking about here), it would've counted. On my map that'd get a black pin. Still useful nonetheless since I'm documenting those on my own.
Reading, MA at the location of the train station
Martin, TN
Bradford, TN
Morehead City, North Carolina. The North Carolina Rail Road splits into the middle of US-70 near the community college and runs down the middle of Arundel Avenue all the way to the Port of North Carolina (now Port of Morehead City). That's almost 3-1/4 miles.
Quote from: 1995hoo on July 13, 2021, 07:37:00 AM
Enfield, NC. You see it from the Auto Train. We drove thru there in May bypassing a backup on I-95. Depressing place, the buildings along both sides of the tracks look abandoned.
I worked on a large railroad project north of Enfield back in the mid-1980s. It always felt like downtown was on one side of the tracks, kind of like next door to here in Mebane. But from the perspective of someone riding the train, I understand that perspective. So from that perspective, Mebane NC also fits the bill. So does Thomasville NC, except that the railroad corridor used to be much wider and is now occupied by some parking lots between the two Main Streets.
Meriden and Wallingford, CT are both good examples. Meriden is undergoing a downtown revitalization project with the train station as the centerpiece.
This would describe a lot of the inner Chicago suburbs that are on Metra lines.
A few I can think of:
Berwyn
Riverside
Brookfield
Lagrange
Des Plaines
Mt. Prospect
I'm sure there are more.
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 13, 2021, 09:16:42 AM
This would describe a lot of the inner Chicago suburbs that are on Metra lines.
A few I can think of:
Berwyn
Riverside
Brookfield
Lagrange
Des Plaines
Mt. Prospect
I'm sure there are more.
Downers Grove, Westmont, Wheaton are a few more I know.
Several Texas ones that may or may not fit the criteria:
Buda
Wallis
Louise
Raymondville
Boling-Iago almost works, but the tracks have been removed.
Renton, WA is another one, with a single-track setup running right through.
There's several in West Virginia. Here's a few that I am familiar with:
Hurricane, West Virginia
East Bank, West Virginia
Montgomery, West Virginia
I was just discussing the one in Hurricane on another thread. Putnam Avenue on the north side of the C&O Railway was part of downtown when I was growing up, but after the grade crossing next to the station was closed in the early 1970s, the north side became more residential than business. At one time, Teays Valley Hardware opened a second branch on Putnam Avenue (early 1980s, as I recall) but it didn't last long. This is an unusual situation since the railroad east of the old Hurricane Station starts into a cut and both sections of downtown were overlooking the depressed railroad.
Montgomery was unique in the fact that the south side of the C&O Railway was once occupied by West Virginia Institute of Technology (WV Tech, later WVU Tech), which relocated to Beckley between 2015 and 2017. There's two distinct sections of "railroad tracks down the center". The west end of town has Second Avenue (WV-61) on the south side and Third Avenue on the north side. As you traverse the bend in the river, Third Avenue slides into Fourth Avenue, which runs along the north side through the east end of town. Back in my days, most of the traffic coming across the Montgomery Bridge (Earl Vickers Bridge, unsigned WV-6) dumped onto Fourth Avenue and Third Avenue, which were then much busier than Second Avenue (WV-61).
Looking elsewhere in Georgia: College Park, Buford, Flowery Branch, Norcross, Acworth, Villa Rica, and Douglasville (and almost certainly more) all seem like pretty good examples that aren't on your map. Decatur is similar though their core historic downtown area is a few blocks north of the tracks.
Something I've noticed in my few years living in Georgia but never really given much thought to until now: Georgia has a ton of railroads. Almost every town of note has one and I wouldn't be surprised if every single county had a rail line. That is most definitely not the case in the western US.
Quote from: jp the roadgeek on July 13, 2021, 09:13:17 AM
Meriden and Wallingford, CT are both good examples. Meriden is undergoing a downtown revitalization project with the train station as the centerpiece.
Even though the buildings aren't facing the track (they're centered on Colony Street) I guess that kind of works with the railroad station as the nexus of downtown.
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 13, 2021, 09:16:42 AM
This would describe a lot of the inner Chicago suburbs that are on Metra lines.
A few I can think of:
Berwyn
Riverside
Brookfield
Lagrange
Des Plaines
Mt. Prospect
I'm sure there are more.
All these are good for the list. Cool to see so many of these in one location outside of the South.
Quote from: CoreySamson on July 13, 2021, 10:26:28 AM
Several Texas ones that may or may not fit the criteria:
Buda
Wallis
Louise
Raymondville
Boling-Iago almost works, but the tracks have been removed.
All of those are actually good (Including the last one, really I'm looking for the layout) (sans Raymondville, downtown is centered on Hidalgo Ave rather than 7th and 6th facing the tracks).
Quote from: Henry on July 13, 2021, 10:40:27 AM
Renton, WA is another one, with a single-track setup running right through.
This one looks more like a street runner - if Houser Way S was physically separated from the tracks, it could be included though.
Quote from: Dirt Roads on July 13, 2021, 10:52:17 AM
There's several in West Virginia. Here's a few that I am familiar with:
Hurricane, West Virginia
East Bank, West Virginia
Montgomery, West Virginia
All of these work, so they're on the list I have in the aforementioned link now.
Quote from: US 89 on July 13, 2021, 11:07:45 AM
Looking elsewhere in Georgia: College Park, Buford, Flowery Branch, Norcross, Acworth, Villa Rica, and Douglasville (and almost certainly more) all seem like pretty good examples that aren't on your map. Decatur is similar though their core historic downtown area is a few blocks north of the tracks.
Something I've noticed in my few years living in Georgia but never really given much thought to until now: Georgia has a ton of railroads. Almost every town of note has one and I wouldn't be surprised if every single county had a rail line. That is most definitely not the case in the western US.
All added. That alone partially explains why there's so many of these towns in GA, SC, and NC, but I have to wonder why it isn't absolutely everywhere in any other places. Much like those places, a lot of the towns in this country grew up around railroads but they weren't laid out like that at all. If I had to take a stab in the dark I'd imagine it might've been some sort of law related to how towns were laid out. A similar situation related to how the growth of towns was regulated led to there being tons of square/circular city limits in the south, particularly those three states as well. Might be a good discussion to fork off into the urban planning board.
Quote from: hobsini2 on July 13, 2021, 10:00:59 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 13, 2021, 09:16:42 AM
This would describe a lot of the inner Chicago suburbs that are on Metra lines.
A few I can think of:
Berwyn
Riverside
Brookfield
Lagrange
Des Plaines
Mt. Prospect
I'm sure there are more.
Downers Grove, Westmont, Wheaton are a few more I know.
Yep, and those aren't the only ones either.
Besides Wheaton, I also immediately thought of
Elmhurst (https://goo.gl/maps/kgmrNQKEDvhEogZB7), for example.
You'll likely find several along South Jersey's RiverLine. Palmyra and Burlington jump to mind.
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0778621,-74.8575973,3a,75y,241.14h,96.34t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1s5XvHNy9MzRkQFkt88DAvTg!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3D5XvHNy9MzRkQFkt88DAvTg%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D272.55246%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192
There are a few in Wisconsin near where I grew up
Appleton (https://www.google.com/maps/@44.2595774,-88.4176525,15.37z?hl=en)
Brillion (https://www.google.com/maps/@44.1770239,-88.0646885,429m/data=!3m1!1e3?hl=en) - railroad ROW is visible
Coleman (https://www.google.com/maps/@45.0651906,-88.0335928,17.83z?hl=en)
Columbus (https://www.google.com/maps/@43.3396696,-89.0138785,15.71z?hl=en)
Denmark (https://www.google.com/maps/@44.3469871,-87.8284486,15.79z?hl=en) - now a state trail
Lena (https://www.google.com/maps/@44.9519555,-88.0500453,16.43z?hl=en)
Marinette (https://www.google.com/maps/@45.0981364,-87.6362621,16.15z?hl=en)
Shawano (https://www.google.com/maps/@44.7755603,-88.6096984,15.79z?hl=en) - now a state trail
Superior (https://www.google.com/maps/@46.7271388,-92.1015193,15.58z?hl=en)
Quote from: skluth on July 13, 2021, 04:02:51 PM
There are a few in Wisconsin near where I grew up
Appleton (https://www.google.com/maps/@44.2595774,-88.4176525,15.37z?hl=en)
Brillion (https://www.google.com/maps/@44.1770239,-88.0646885,429m/data=!3m1!1e3?hl=en) - railroad ROW is visible
Coleman (https://www.google.com/maps/@45.0651906,-88.0335928,17.83z?hl=en)
Columbus (https://www.google.com/maps/@43.3396696,-89.0138785,15.71z?hl=en)
Denmark (https://www.google.com/maps/@44.3469871,-87.8284486,15.79z?hl=en) - now a state trail
Lena (https://www.google.com/maps/@44.9519555,-88.0500453,16.43z?hl=en)
Marinette (https://www.google.com/maps/@45.0981364,-87.6362621,16.15z?hl=en)
Shawano (https://www.google.com/maps/@44.7755603,-88.6096984,15.79z?hl=en) - now a state trail
Superior (https://www.google.com/maps/@46.7271388,-92.1015193,15.58z?hl=en)
From what I see, none of those matches what the OP is looking for.
Quote from: kphoger on July 13, 2021, 12:19:19 PM
Quote from: hobsini2 on July 13, 2021, 10:00:59 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 13, 2021, 09:16:42 AM
This would describe a lot of the inner Chicago suburbs that are on Metra lines.
A few I can think of:
Berwyn
Riverside
Brookfield
Lagrange
Des Plaines
Mt. Prospect
I'm sure there are more.
Downers Grove, Westmont, Wheaton are a few more I know.
Yep, and those aren't the only ones either.
Besides Wheaton, I also immediately thought of Elmhurst (https://goo.gl/maps/kgmrNQKEDvhEogZB7), for example.
I we're allowing elevated tracks to count, then Oak Park would qualify.
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 13, 2021, 04:29:08 PM
I we're allowing elevated tracks to count, then Oak Park would qualify.
Yes, sort of. Most businesses front Oak Park Avenue, but there are plenty along North & South Avenues as well. I'm not familiar enough with Oak Park's history to know what it looked like a hundred years ago.
Brewton, Alabama
Here in the KC area, Lee's Summit comes to mind.
Are there any examples of this with tram tracks? Most of the US tram tracks that run in the middle of the road are street running, not on their own trackbed or in a patch of grass.
Most NC examples have been said already, but I know there's right many towns along the CSX A-line (and I-95) that would qualify. Places like Kenly and Benson. Also, looking at the map, its impressive how straight the railroad is throughout most of NC. Seaboard did a bang-up job when they built what is now the A-line
The only thing I can add to this is Celina, TX uses the BNSF Railway through town as its E-W zero numbering point. The tracks pass a couple of blocks east of the town square.
Would Vineland, NJ count? That pattern runs a long distance, it seems, and there's even a perpendicular branch with that same setup for about two blocks.
A lot of Georgia examples were already mentioned, but another example is Commerce GA.
For the OP, you might want to read about the PLSS (Public Land Survey System) if you're unfamiliar with it. A lot of the Midwest and West was surveyed before it was settled (by Americans), so that could possibly contribute to why you don't see the railroad-based town layout as much in those states.
Quote from: fillup420 on July 14, 2021, 06:14:02 PM
Most NC examples have been said already, but I know there's right many towns along the CSX A-line (and I-95) that would qualify. Places like Kenly and Benson. Also, looking at the map, its impressive how straight the railroad is throughout most of NC. Seaboard did a bang-up job when they built what is now the A-line
Pardon, but the A-Line is the former Atlantic Coast Line. The Seaboard is called the S-Line. And yes, the ACL constructed the best engineered railroad speedway on the East Coast.
I worked on the railroad in both Kenly and Benson and didn't consider either one to meet the OP requirements. But looking at the map, perhaps Benson does meet the requirements. Today, the downtown section is along South Wall Street (US-301), but many years ago Market Street was the main drag. But it actually looks as if the section of town that I worked in functions like a portion of downtown spread across both sides of the railroad. Many of those buildings look as old as the surrounding ones.
Other New Jersey examples include
- Jamesburg
- Englewood and Tenafly. Tracks are lightly used, if at all. (but YMMV. One side of the track in the former is a parking lot, but it looks like it may have been a road at one time.)
- Passaic, on Main Ave. (abandoned), with a parking area where the tracks were. There's a picture somewhere of the ceremonial "last train" on the line, complete with a backhoe waiting around to rip up the rails pronto!
Then there's Saratoga St. in Newport, KY, with L&N tracks running down the middle to the bridge over the Ohio River. Although this is often given as an example of street running, photos suggest that the tracks were sectioned off by curbs in the median, albeit with little clearance. This was abandoned in 1987; CSX had just combined Seaboard System operations (which included L&N) and the Chessie System (with C&O). They opted to stick with the C&O bridge. The median is now raised, with grass.
The railroad is long gone and the town is largely abandoned, but there once was a railroad in the middle of the Borough of Centralia, Pennsylvania (I believe that Centralia was the end of the spur line that served the municipality).
Appropriately the line ran in the middle of Railroad Avenue as can be seen on Google Maps here (https://www.google.com/maps/place/40%C2%B048'19.0%22N+76%C2%B020'27.9%22W/@40.80529,-76.3432737,17z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m14!1m7!3m6!1s0x89c58cbefe94c4cf:0xf7be64e7f786ec3!2sCentralia,+PA!3b1!8m2!3d40.8042541!4d-76.3405035!3m5!1s0x0:0x0!7e2!8m2!3d40.8052864!4d-76.341085).
Quote from: catch22 on July 13, 2021, 08:03:27 AM
Fort Collins, CO
https://goo.gl/maps/8omxf88uoPyFHEU7A
it used to be that the tracks were literally the middle of the street, now they've dug them out and there's an island in the middle of the street for the trains.. still neat (i live near there).
you can count on this.. the one time you're late for something, or about to be, there's the train. at least they built a bypass track to eliminate a lot of the back-and-forth across college when they were interchanging bnsf and up cargo along jefferson. that would tie up that intersection for hours sometimes.
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 13, 2021, 09:16:42 AM
This would describe a lot of the inner Chicago suburbs that are on Metra lines.
A few I can think of:
Berwyn
Riverside
Brookfield
Lagrange
Des Plaines
Mt. Prospect.
Quote from: hobsini2 on July 13, 2021, 10:00:59 AM
Downers Grove
Westmont
Wheaton
Quote from: kphoger on July 13, 2021, 12:19:19 PM
Elmhurst (https://goo.gl/maps/kgmrNQKEDvhEogZB7)
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 13, 2021, 04:29:08 PM
Oak Park
Hinsdale
Western Springs
I imagine there are a lot of little railroad towns across the Midwest and Great Plains that have this dual-frontage street setup. Here's one: Sturgeon, Missouri (https://goo.gl/maps/cppxyVGuRifeWm1h8) Of course, many of these small towns don't have much of a downtown anymore; still others never did.
Quote from: paulthemapguy on July 15, 2021, 02:11:08 PM
Hinsdale
I see the streets there, but I don't see many buildings
fronting them.
Pasadena, CA, up until 1994, featured a main line of the ATSF (Santa Fe) railroad running right through the city center on a N-S axis. It literally ran through an alley between commercial buildings on both Colorado Blvd. and the parallel streets flanking that main artery, crossing all of them at grade. Most of the main pre-Amtrak Santa Fe trains utilized this track (the Chief, El Capitan, Grand Canyon Limited, and, most notably, the Super Chief -- although that one was switched to their Riverside/Fullerton line in 1967, skipping Pasadena). That ROW is still there today, although now hosting the Gold Line LR -- but that has been sunk in a trench and subsequently covered; businesses are now located in the former "alley" -- on the LR cap -- where the Santa Fe tracks ran for 100+ years. BTW, the Pasadena Santa Fe depot was 4 blocks south of Colorado Street; boardings and deboardings there were almost always equivalent to that at L.A.'s Union Station, 12 miles to the southwest; a lot of riders preferred not to have to put up with downtown L.A. traffic to get on the train!
Would Needham count?
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.2838201,-71.2430246,15z
laramie, wyoming. a good part of downtown fronts on the tracks, and bonus: there's a cool footbridge that goes up and over the railyard, and is a great place to watch trains if one is so inclined.
The South Chicago branch of Metra is partially covered with roads and homes and businesses on both sides of the tracks, and other places with a road on one side and an alley or private drive on the other side. When I worked for the former ICG RR we occasionally had to replace sections of high rise platforms where an errant car had jumped the tracks and taken out a support; most of the wooden platforms have since been replaced with concrete. Back in the 70s there were local industries being switched as well as commuter trains, but I suspect that most or all of the freight business has vanished by now.
You can drive the StreetView link below to the north and see most of the double street action. It's a pretty narrow rail corridor and the streets are right next to the trains with little buffer, and the stations and center platforms are about as narrow as you will find in the Chicago area.
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.7541438,-87.5549563,3a,75y,347.75h,98.73t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sQ7YCVgfV2-1AvesURQ9J5g!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on July 15, 2021, 04:36:30 PM
Would Needham count?
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.2838201,-71.2430246,15z (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.2838201,-71.2430246,15z)
Nope, the buildings aren't centered around the track.
LaGrange Kentucky.
https://www.google.com/maps/@38.4076317,-85.3783784,3a,75y,50.9h,69.48t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1scS73Gu9_i7hkDCssadw86w!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 (https://www.google.com/maps/@38.4076317,-85.3783784,3a,75y,50.9h,69.48t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1scS73Gu9_i7hkDCssadw86w!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
Quote from: XamotCGC on July 15, 2021, 06:55:06 PM
LaGrange Kentucky.
https://www.google.com/maps/@38.4076317,-85.3783784,3a,75y,50.9h,69.48t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1scS73Gu9_i7hkDCssadw86w!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 (https://www.google.com/maps/@38.4076317,-85.3783784,3a,75y,50.9h,69.48t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1scS73Gu9_i7hkDCssadw86w!2e0!7i16384!8i8192)
That was one I thought of as well, until I saw the OP:
Quote from: index on July 13, 2021, 12:24:50 AM
... but NOT something like La Grange, KY ...
Not sure if this qualifies, but Winter Garden, FL has had its railroad converted into a trail. I don't know the setup when the tracks were in place, but it appears to have been between the two roadbeds. (map) (https://goo.gl/maps/C8ypnAbaN9U3Sqvg6)
Shakopee, Minnesota: This past month's edition of Trains magazine emphasizes railroads in the state of Minnesota. In the back of each edition is a photo gallery, and one of the photos addresses this very topic. It says that "street running is rare in Minnesota", but then shows a Union Pacific train on the Mankato Subdivision running between streets on Second Avenue in Shakopee. As the OP correctly indicates, this is not "street running". While it looks like First Avenue is the main drag downtown, it appears that Second Avenue also meets the downtown requirement specified by the OP.
Quote from: Chris19001 on July 13, 2021, 01:06:08 PM
You'll likely find several along South Jersey's RiverLine. Palmyra and Burlington jump to mind.
As well as the old Atlantic City line, though few of these are downtowns.
Take a look at Maple Shade, NJ, though the "main drag" Main St. is south of there. And if you go east a little on that same trackage, notice Moorestown for something completely different. You'll find that it hugs 3rd St. rather closely, but on alternate sides at a time. There are a few short stretches with a road on both sides of the tracks, though.
Also Sewell, NJ (http://sewell,%20nj). An old station is in the median, though.
Finally, if you're counting roads-on-one-side through downtown, notice how 3rd St. (again!) in Sunbury, PA (https://goo.gl/maps/ima2CwnSD8H2P14m9) essentially runs neck-and-neck with the tracks for about 10 blocks through town.
I'd say Anaheim, California. The tracks actually are on the street through the downtown area.
(https://i.imgur.com/XuxVnlK.jpg)
Jack London Square in Oakland.
Quote from: Occidental Tourist on July 16, 2021, 03:10:24 PM
I'd say Anaheim, California. The tracks actually are on the street through the downtown area.
(https://i.imgur.com/XuxVnlK.jpg)
That's a secondary UP line that parallels I-5 from Norwalk to Santa Ana before curving east onto the street; it used to curve back south east of downtown Anaheim to Santa Ana, but now simply empties out onto the Metrolink (former BNSF) N-S tracks through Anaheim that host both L.A.-Oceanside commute trains and the Amtrak service down to San Diego. Now UP operates to Santa Ana on Metrolink trackage rights before the branch line continues to serve the industrial area in south Santa Ana. Only about 2 trains per day use the Anaheim street-running line; UP generally dispatches those at night to avoid conflicts with both auto traffic and the commuter/Amtrak runs on the Santa Ana/San Diego line.
Quote from: Dirt Roads on July 14, 2021, 09:28:20 PM
Quote from: fillup420 on July 14, 2021, 06:14:02 PM
Most NC examples have been said already, but I know there's right many towns along the CSX A-line (and I-95) that would qualify. Places like Kenly and Benson. Also, looking at the map, its impressive how straight the railroad is throughout most of NC. Seaboard did a bang-up job when they built what is now the A-line
Pardon, but the A-Line is the former Atlantic Coast Line. The Seaboard is called the S-Line. And yes, the ACL constructed the best engineered railroad speedway on the East Coast.
I worked on the railroad in both Kenly and Benson and didn't consider either one to meet the OP requirements. But looking at the map, perhaps Benson does meet the requirements. Today, the downtown section is along South Wall Street (US-301), but many years ago Market Street was the main drag. But it actually looks as if the section of town that I worked in functions like a portion of downtown spread across both sides of the railroad. Many of those buildings look as old as the surrounding ones.
ah yes, youre correct. we've had both Seaboard Air Line and Atlantic Coast Line in this state, which then became the combined Seaboard Coast Line. it can get confusing at times. i grew up in charlotte which was SAL territory originally. Now its all just CSX.
And also, Matthews NC is a good candidate for this thread. the railroad is the center point of downtown, and traffic grinds to a halt when the train comes through.
Norman is a close-but-no-cigar for this thread. The town is centered on the railroad, and there are streets paralleling the tracks on either side downtown, but the buildings are mostly oriented to face Gray and Main streets, which run perpendicular to the tracks. (There are a few buildings facing James Garner, one of the streets paralleling the tracks, but Jones mostly just runs along their sides.)
Oklahoma City may have been a contender for this way, way back in the day; there is a railroad track downtown (the same track as in Norman, in fact) and a street running alongside it (E.K. Gaylord, which was probably called Shields Boulevard at one point). But the track is now an elevated track, and I.M. Pei's plan for downtown OKC demolished a ton of buildings in the area, so it'd require more digging into the history books than I care to do at the moment to say for sure whether there was a street on the other side before the elevated track was built, or which direction the buildings along Shields originally faced.
Quote from: index on July 13, 2021, 12:24:50 AM
but NOT something like La Grange, KY, or Tampa, FL with street running tracks
Quote from: Occidental Tourist on July 16, 2021, 03:10:24 PM
I'd say Anaheim, California. The tracks actually are on the street through the downtown area.
:pan:
Fresno, CA's downtown was and is sandwiched between the UP (former SP) and BNSF (former Santa Fe) main lines, each with major depot facilities (passenger & freight). While the UP/SP line was the first to be built circa 1872, and is and always has been parallel to US/CA 99, the former Santa Fe takes a more convoluted path through the city, including what was a mile or so of street running north of the depot -- but which has been converted into a dedicated ROW alongside its former street location (a good thing, seeing as how it hosts the Amtrak San Joaquin service, with several trains per day in each direction). All trains were limited to 10mph over the street portion; that's now raised to 25-30 -- but the track makes a broad curve west and crosses Blackstone, at which time the engineers "step on it"; it's a straight run through NW Fresno (aka "Fig Garden"), with many of the major arterials now grade separated (my ex's condo was two blocks from the tracks right off Ballard; her office backed up to the BNSF tracks a couple of blocks south of the downtown depot).
Many street-running track segments have been converted into dedicated ROW's in recent years (liability issues?). But there are some track segments that squeeze into ROW's between streets, like the old WP N-S main through Sacramento, squeezed between 19th and 20th Street, that are still active. There are grade crossings at every block from D Street down to Broadway along that stretch; the only separations are the LR line at "R" Street and the US 50/old Biz 80 elevated freeway. Ironically, the old WP passenger depot is now (at least the last time I was anywhere near there) an Old Spaghetti Factory.
Quote from: kphoger on July 20, 2021, 12:45:51 PM
Quote from: index on July 13, 2021, 12:24:50 AM
but NOT something like La Grange, KY, or Tampa, FL with street running tracks
Quote from: Occidental Tourist on July 16, 2021, 03:10:24 PM
I'd say Anaheim, California. The tracks actually are on the street through the downtown area.
:pan:
:bigass:
The only ones I can think of that are in Louisiana are all in Tangipahoa Parish
From north to south:
Amite
Independence
Hammond
Ponchatoula
Commerce, Georgia (https://goo.gl/maps/QbSFaXeSSXS71GHS8). Broad Street southbound, Elm Street northbound. There are so few grade crossings of the railroad that these streets function almost like a Jersey freeway.
Are you still collecting railroad downtowns? I just spotted one in St. Paul, Indiana.
Salt Lake City Utah
Birmingham, AL was founded where 2 rail lines crossed. The land immediately beside the rail lines was reserved for industry, but the town was planned around the rail line. Avenues are numbered counting up both ways from the railroad with a directional suffix.
Not exactly what the OP was looking for, but an interesting study.
Oshkosh, WI was formed in the mid-late 19th century around a network of railroad trackage in their downtown area, it was all removed/relocated between about the 1950s and 1995. The street and terrace running CP/SOO and WC mainline through town was a fairly famous railfanning place throughout the latter part of the 20th century. CN now uses the former CNW route that does north-south through the city's east side.
Mike
Both near me: Laramie, WY and Fort Collins, CO.
Fort collins has tracks down oh ... 6 blocks or so of a street, one block west of US 287. As a train nut, I love it. As a pizza guy, I hated it. They've ... (don't know what the term is) "islanded" them now. You used to be able to change lanes over the tracks.
Laramie has done well embracing their railroady heritage. There's a footbridge downtown, that leads up over the railyard, that one can stand and watch trains on, if so inclined. There's also Depot Park (it's all in the same block or two), and a truly cool museum with cool layouts.
Cheyenne's also done similar.
Reno, NV?
Mike
Bellevue, Iowa (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.258453,-90.4242373,3a,63.7y,342.99h,84.81t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sliuS6094AaKUg0JqeBVPCw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192) is the example that immediately came to mind for me.
I believe Monticello, IN would count, even though the tracks are removed. It was the routing for US 421, IN 39, and US 24, around the downtown 1-way couplets, but does have several businesses and homes on the street, and is part of downtown.