Inspired by discussion I started on the US City Game thread. If you find any improvements or additions to this incomplete list, let me know!
New York-Syracuse
Alaska-Yukon River?
Kansas-Salina (honestly that's probably not great, would Hutchinson be any better?)
Utah-Provo
California- Tough one, Sacramento is sorta central but Fresno I think is a bit more central geographically. (Unless its farther south than I remember)
Colorado- Many people don't realize that Colorado Springs is more geographically central than too-far-north Denver.
Florida-Orlando probably
Georgia-Macon
Virginia-how about Appomattox (Lynchburg or Charlottesville could work)
Nevada- Very hard, as Ely is too far east and Tonopah is too far south. I found a tiny place called Austin that seems pretty central, unfortunately it has a population of under 200.
I'll finish later.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_geographic_centers_of_the_United_States#:~:text=Geographic%20centers%20of%20the%20states%20of%20the%20United,%20%20%20%2016%20more%20rows%20
Illinois' current capital is already close to the geographic center, off by only about 4 miles.
Alabama's geographic center point is a little east of Montevallo.
Calera is the next-closest town to that point; it's slightly larger in size, and already strategically located on I-65.
Didn't we do this one before?
The closest regional center to MN's center is Baxter/Brainerd, but I would go with St. Cloud as more centrally located and better served by transportation for this exercise.
I think if we're going to do this exercise, it should be "closest city to the geographic center that could feasibly be capital", not just "oh, here's a town of 10,000 people that's close". The OP had several good examples (Colorado Springs instead of something like Buena Vista).
Some others:
New Mexico - Albuquerque
Alaska - Fairbanks (much better option than Yukon River)
Minnesota - St. Cloud
Maine - Bangor
North Carolina - Greensboro
Oregon - Bend
Nebraska - Kearney/North Platte
Massachusetts - Worcester
Quote from: JayhawkCO on November 01, 2022, 03:24:16 PM
I think if we're going to do this exercise, it should be "closest city to the geographic center that could feasibly be capital", not just "oh, here's a town of 10,000 people that's close". The OP had several good examples (Colorado Springs instead of something like Buena Vista).
Some others:
New Mexico - Albuquerque
Alaska - Fairbanks (much better option than Yukon River)
Minnesota - St. Cloud
Maine - Bangor
North Carolina - Greensboro
Oregon - Bend
Nebraska - Kearney/North Platte
Massachusetts - Worcester
I agree, because in Indiana, Avon is the geographic center but that's < 20 miles from downtown Indy so there would be no reason to have the capital in Avon.
Wausau (pop. 40k) is at the center of WI geographically, but there's not many people to the north of it, and far more people to the southeast than the southwest. I think Fond du Lac would be more logical as a central location, but it's not near the geographical center.
I think if you were going to select ideal locations for state capitals, you'd take perhaps the midpoint of the geographic and population centers.
Quote from: kirbykart on November 01, 2022, 02:53:46 PM
Inspired by discussion I started on the US City Game thread. If you find any improvements or additions to this incomplete list, let me know!
New York-Syracuse
Alaska-Yukon River?
Kansas-Salina (honestly that's probably not great, would Hutchinson be any better?)
Utah-Provo
California- Tough one, Sacramento is sorta central but Fresno I think is a bit more central geographically. (Unless its farther south than I remember)
Colorado- Many people don't realize that Colorado Springs is more geographically central than too-far-north Denver.
Florida-Orlando probably
Georgia-Macon
Virginia-how about Appomattox (Lynchburg or Charlottesville could work)
Nevada- Very hard, as Ely is too far east and Tonopah is too far south. I found a tiny place called Austin that seems pretty central, unfortunately it has a population of under 200.
I'll finish later.
I would have guessed Merced for the California one.
Where would New Jersey's geographic center be? Six Flags in Jackson?
I guessed that Michigan's geographic center might have been offshore. Per the Wikipedia link, it is near Cadillac.
The capital was moved out of Detroit to a more central location. Marshall and Lansing were both contenders. Lansing won - whether entirely through merit of being closer to a north/south middle or because of other considerations.
Quote from: kirbykart on November 01, 2022, 02:53:46 PM
Kansas-Salina (honestly that's probably not great, would Hutchinson be any better?)
What's wrong with Salina? I mean, other than it being kind of a lousy town..
Washington's geographic center is near Cashmere but the more feasible spot for a capital would be Wenatchee a few miles southeast. Still not large enough to really support all the functions of government, but manageable. Ellensburg (further south) was a candidate for the capital in the 1880s and into 1890, but lost their bid (https://www.historylink.org/File/7549) in a referendum. The fire didn't help.
Of course, since most Washingtonians live west of the Cascades (5.7 million on the I-5 corridor alone), having a capital there makes far more sense. According to The Hill (https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/587666-each-states-population-center-visualized/), Washington's center of population is a lake in the Cascade foothills that is part of Seattle's drinking water source. Head a bit further west and you'd have your pick of Maple Valley, Kent, or SeaTac (a capital in an aerotropolis does sound interesting).
Quote from: kphoger on November 01, 2022, 04:01:07 PM
Quote from: kirbykart on November 01, 2022, 02:53:46 PM
Kansas-Salina (honestly that's probably not great, would Hutchinson be any better?)
What's wrong with Salina? I mean, other than it being kind of a lousy town..
Home of Tony's Pizza!
CT: Berlin (more specifically, East Berlin. New Britain would be a better option.)
RI: (West) Warwick
NH: Plymouth (Ashland is the actual, but Plymouth is the closest significant town)
VT: Montpelier is close enough to Roxbury, the actual location
PA: Bellefonte
DE: Felton
MD: Davidsonville
MN's center of population is in Rogers, which is a third-ring suburb of Minneapolis in northwestern Hennepin County. It's experienced rapid growth in the last 20 years.
Oklahoma's geographic center is in the middle of Kelley Avenue, just south of NE 120th Street, in Oklahoma City. (Route 66 used to run directly over the spot.) The state capitol building is 6.8 miles south of there. Can't get much closer than that.
The center of population is, as you'd expect it to be, between OKC and Tulsa. It's near Sparks, a town of less than 200 people. Chandler isn't too far nearby, if you wanted the capital to at least be a county seat.
Quote from: thspfc on November 01, 2022, 03:32:48 PM
Wausau (pop. 40k) is at the center of WI geographically, but there's not many people to the north of it, and far more people to the southeast than the southwest. I think Fond du Lac would be more logical as a central location, but it's not near the geographical center.
It's technically just south of Marshfield according to the link above, but the center is almost as close to Wisconsin Rapids and Stevens Point. Personally, I'd move the capital to Point as it already has a university, is on the interstate system, and - like Madison - is home to an insurance company (Sentry vs American Family). Maybe this would be enough to complete the US 10 expressway west of Esker.
Casper for Wyoming?
SM-G996U
How about Hawaii? Stay the same? Different island?
Nevada has 42 Assembly districts. 30 are entirely in Clark County, 6 entirely in Washoe County and 6 cover the rest of the state.
The population center is not far northwest of Las Vegas. How about putting the capital at the Nevada Test Site in Mercury?
Madeira makes sense for California. On CA-99 and close to the 41 and 152.
Louisiana's geographic center- near Marksville
Population center- New Roads
It's well known here but just amazing that majority of Louisiana's population is either below I-10/I-12 or just east of the Mississippi River.
iPhone
Colorado's geographic center is west of Colorado Springs, so it would make sense to place the capital there. The population center is near Ken Caryl; you could move it there, Lakewood, Littleton, or keep it in Denver. Anywhere in the southwestern Denver suburbs would work splendidly.
Isn't Wisconsin's geographic center just south of Neillsville?
Mike
What point did the USCensus Bureau determine to be the USA's centroid of population in the 2020 Census?
Mike
Quote from: kirbykart on November 01, 2022, 02:53:46 PM
New York-Syracuse
Utah-Provo
The meaning of "center" eludes you.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on November 01, 2022, 03:24:16 PM
I think if we're going to do this exercise, it should be "closest city to the geographic center that could feasibly be capital", not just "oh, here's a town of 10,000 people that's close". The OP had several good examples (Colorado Springs instead of something like Buena Vista).
Some others:
New Mexico - Albuquerque
Alaska - Fairbanks (much better option than Yukon River)
Minnesota - St. Cloud
Maine - Bangor
North Carolina - Greensboro
Oregon - Bend
Nebraska - Kearney/North Platte
Massachusetts - Worcester
If Carson City can be the capital of NV, then any rinkydink town can be a capital.
Quote from: mgk920 on November 01, 2022, 09:43:06 PM
Isn't Wisconsin's geographic center just south of Neillsville?
Mike
There is a town south of Marshfield, Pittsville, that has signs up claiming to be the geographical center of Wisconsin. At least it did last time I was through there a few years back.
Quote from: bassoon1986 on November 01, 2022, 07:02:46 PM
Louisiana's geographic center- near Marksville
Population center- New Roads
It's well known here but just amazing that majority of Louisiana's population is either below I-10/I-12 or just east of the Mississippi River.
iPhone
Well considering over 60 percent of New York's population is south of The Bronx- Westchester Border, that seems very likely.
Quote from: mgk920 on November 01, 2022, 09:45:32 PM
What point did the USCensus Bureau determine to be the USA's centroid of population in the 2020 Census?
Mike
Hartville, Missouri: https://www.noaa.gov/media-advisory/noaa-and-us-census-bureau-to-celebrate-new-us-center-of-population. It only moved 12 miles from its 2010 center near Plato in Texas County, MO.
Using the geographic centers and going off of Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_geographic_centers_of_the_United_States (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_geographic_centers_of_the_United_States)
* For Iowa, it would probably be a shifted version of Ames. Wondering if this had happened if I-80 might have been built closer to US 30?
* Missouri would be around what Google Maps calls Etterville. (https://goo.gl/maps/S1PnxNVQpQbJjDkVA)
* Nebraska's would be Merna.
Quote from: Rothman on November 01, 2022, 09:49:28 PM
Quote from: kirbykart on November 01, 2022, 02:53:46 PM
New York-Syracuse
...
The meaning of "center" eludes you.
For New York, I think I'd go further south and east. Syracuse works in terms of road connectivity and being a decent-sized city, but you could do better in terms of location. Oneonta, maybe.
Quote from: roadman65 on November 01, 2022, 10:08:14 PM
Quote from: bassoon1986 on November 01, 2022, 07:02:46 PM
Louisiana's geographic center- near Marksville
Population center- New Roads
It's well known here but just amazing that majority of Louisiana's population is either below I-10/I-12 or just east of the Mississippi River.
iPhone
Well considering over 60 percent of New York's population is south of The Bronx- Westchester Border, that seems very likely.
ISTR that New York (state)'s centroid of population was somewhere in the area between Oneonta and Catskill, NY in 2000. Remember that the Buffalo, Rochester and Syracuse metro areas are pretty far north and west and that will tend to balance out the population blop in the NYC area.
Mike
Quote from: brad2971 on November 01, 2022, 10:17:07 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on November 01, 2022, 09:45:32 PM
What point did the USCensus Bureau determine to be the USA's centroid of population in the 2020 Census?
Mike
Hartville, Missouri: https://www.noaa.gov/media-advisory/noaa-and-us-census-bureau-to-celebrate-new-us-center-of-population. It only moved 12 miles from its 2010 center near Plato in Texas County, MO.
Right now, (barring any potential changes to the border between now and then) I'm expecting it to move a similar distance, or less, to the south or even a smidgen to the south-southEAST in 2030.
Mike
Quote from: kphoger on November 01, 2022, 04:01:07 PMQuote from: kirbykart on November 01, 2022, 02:53:46 PMKansas-Salina (honestly that's probably not great, would Hutchinson be any better?)
What's wrong with Salina? I mean, other than it being kind of a lousy town..
Salina is not a good choice since it's actually pretty far away from the geographic center of Kansas, which is at Bushton in Rice County. Hutchinson is more or less equally distant.
The population centroid is in Chase County about three miles from Strong City (US 50/K-177 junction). But--as a general rule--if this is used as the criterion for siting a state capital, then there has to be provision for it to move. The US population centroid has moved all the way from Kent County, Maryland in 1790 to Wright County, Missouri in 2020.
Virginia's would be Dillwyn.
Quote from: J N Winkler on November 01, 2022, 11:10:13 PM
Quote from: kphoger on November 01, 2022, 04:01:07 PMQuote from: kirbykart on November 01, 2022, 02:53:46 PMKansas-Salina (honestly that's probably not great, would Hutchinson be any better?)
What's wrong with Salina? I mean, other than it being kind of a lousy town..
Salina is not a good choice since it's actually pretty far away from the geographic center of Kansas, which is at Bushton in Rice County. Hutchinson is more or less equally distant.
The population centroid is in Chase County about three miles from Strong City (US 50/K-177 junction). But--as a general rule--if this is used as the criterion for siting a state capital, then there has to be provision for it to move. The US population centroid has moved all the way from Kent County, Maryland in 1790 to Wright County, Missouri in 2020.
That's what I meant about Salina not being great; I didn't know how central it was.
Quote from: Rothman on November 01, 2022, 09:49:28 PM
Quote from: kirbykart on November 01, 2022, 02:53:46 PM
New York-Syracuse
Utah-Provo
The meaning of "center" eludes you.
The way the Interstates (and US Highways) are laid out sure makes Syracuse
seem like the center of New York.
This whole thing was to be a pointless hypothetical. I would neither want nor expect any of these changes, just an interesting idea.
(And I like JayhawkCO's interpretation of the prompt!)
West Virginia's geographic center is located near aptly-named Centralia. But that locale has dwindled in population since the world's largest bandsaw sawmill shut down in 1937. Historically, one would look to Braxton County's seat of Sutton as the next best location for a centralized capital, but I suspect that nearby Flatwoods would be a better choice in today's world. It has the local high school, the regional jail, and an outlet mall. Not to mention UFOs.
People in rural areas are more used to driving to get somewhere, so I'm fine with the center being weighted toward high population. I like the idea posted up-thread, to use the midpoint between the population centroid and the geographical center.
Kentucky's would be either Springfield or Lebanon, which are county seats 11 miles apart. The geographical center is in Marion County, near Lebanon, while the population center is in Washington County (the city of Willisburg, near Springfield.)
The biggest towns in that area are Campbellsville and Bardstown, if city size becomes a factor in the selection.
Quote from: kirbykart on November 02, 2022, 07:55:30 AM
Quote from: J N Winkler on November 01, 2022, 11:10:13 PM
Quote from: kphoger on November 01, 2022, 04:01:07 PMQuote from: kirbykart on November 01, 2022, 02:53:46 PMKansas-Salina (honestly that's probably not great, would Hutchinson be any better?)
What's wrong with Salina? I mean, other than it being kind of a lousy town..
Salina is not a good choice since it's actually pretty far away from the geographic center of Kansas, which is at Bushton in Rice County. Hutchinson is more or less equally distant.
The population centroid is in Chase County about three miles from Strong City (US 50/K-177 junction). But--as a general rule--if this is used as the criterion for siting a state capital, then there has to be provision for it to move. The US population centroid has moved all the way from Kent County, Maryland in 1790 to Wright County, Missouri in 2020.
That's what I meant about Salina not being great; I didn't know how central it was.
Quote from: Rothman on November 01, 2022, 09:49:28 PM
Quote from: kirbykart on November 01, 2022, 02:53:46 PM
New York-Syracuse
Utah-Provo
The meaning of "center" eludes you.
The way the Interstates (and US Highways) are laid out sure makes Syracuse seem like the center of New York.
This whole thing was to be a pointless hypothetical. I would neither want nor expect any of these changes, just an interesting idea.
(And I like JayhawkCO's interpretation of the prompt!)
Keep in mind that NY isn't just upstate, and has an odd shape at that. Measuring from a given city to the farthest extremes of the state (NY/QC border at Lake Champlain, NY/PA border at the corner south of Lake Erie, and Montauk Point),
Binghamton is actually more central (although still not the true center) despite being near the NY/PA border!
Quote from: vdeane on November 02, 2022, 12:55:20 PM
Quote from: kirbykart on November 02, 2022, 07:55:30 AM
Quote from: Rothman on November 01, 2022, 09:49:28 PM
The meaning of "center" eludes you.
The way the Interstates (and US Highways) are laid out sure makes Syracuse seem like the center of New York.
...
Keep in mind that NY isn't just upstate, and has an odd shape at that. Measuring from a given city to the farthest extremes of the state (NY/QC border at Lake Champlain, NY/PA border at the corner south of Lake Erie, and Montauk Point), Binghamton is actually more central (although still not the true center) despite being near the NY/PA border!
That's largely thanks to Lake Ontario. I-81 is central
south of Syracuse, and I-90 is central
east of Syracuse, but north and west of Syracuse is a different story. Other than the Rochester area and adjacent lakeshore counties, very little of the would-be northwest "quadrant" formed by I-81 and I-90 is actually a populated part of of New York. Most of it is either the lake, or belongs to Ontario.
So, that's one major factor dragging the center southeastward, and downstate (where 2/3 of the population is) drags it much further. Put it all together and Oneonta makes a lot of sense... and the population center would be even further southeast than that.
Quote from: ibthebigd on November 01, 2022, 05:27:49 PM
Casper for Wyoming?
SM-G996U
Probably. And that would make sense, because it's where the escalators are! (#StupidLogicBasedOnAFunFact)
Quote from: kphoger on November 02, 2022, 10:47:11 AM
I like the idea posted up-thread, to use the midpoint between the population centroid and the geographical center.
Washington's would be on a slope overlooking Salmon La Sac, a collection of campgrounds in the Cascades north of Cle Elum. An alpine state capital would be fun, but pretty hard to access for the first few months of the legislative session.
Quote from: Bruce on November 02, 2022, 05:02:09 PM
Quote from: kphoger on November 02, 2022, 10:47:11 AM
I like the idea posted up-thread, to use the midpoint between the population centroid and the geographical center.
Washington's would be on a slope overlooking Salmon La Sac, a collection of campgrounds in the Cascades north of Cle Elum. An alpine state capital would be fun, but pretty hard to access for the first few months of the legislative session.
Nice!
Michigan's capital is near the center of population in the state of Michigan. The center of population is right near Morrice which is in between flint and Lansing off of I-69. As for geographically the center of the state is in Wexford County near Cadillac. The center of the lower peninsula is in Gratiot County near St Louis.
Quote from: Bruce on November 02, 2022, 05:02:09 PM
Quote from: kphoger on November 02, 2022, 10:47:11 AM
I like the idea posted up-thread, to use the midpoint between the population centroid and the geographical center.
Washington's would be on a slope overlooking Salmon La Sac, a collection of campgrounds in the Cascades north of Cle Elum. An alpine state capital would be fun, but pretty hard to access for the first few months of the legislative session.
At least Washington's is on land. Hawaii's geographic center is actually off shore. Also hard to access for the first few months of the legislative session.
Quote from: webny99 on November 02, 2022, 01:15:57 PM
Quote from: vdeane on November 02, 2022, 12:55:20 PM
Quote from: kirbykart on November 02, 2022, 07:55:30 AM
Quote from: Rothman on November 01, 2022, 09:49:28 PM
The meaning of "center" eludes you.
The way the Interstates (and US Highways) are laid out sure makes Syracuse seem like the center of New York.
...
Keep in mind that NY isn't just upstate, and has an odd shape at that. Measuring from a given city to the farthest extremes of the state (NY/QC border at Lake Champlain, NY/PA border at the corner south of Lake Erie, and Montauk Point), Binghamton is actually more central (although still not the true center) despite being near the NY/PA border!
That's largely thanks to Lake Ontario. I-81 is central south of Syracuse, and I-90 is central east of Syracuse, but north and west of Syracuse is a different story. Other than the Rochester area and adjacent lakeshore counties, very little of the would-be northwest "quadrant" formed by I-81 and I-90 is actually a populated part of of New York. Most of it is either the lake, or belongs to Ontario.
So, that's one major factor dragging the center southeastward, and downstate (where 2/3 of the population is) drags it much further. Put it all together and Oneonta makes a lot of sense... and the population center would be even further southeast than that.
The Wikipedia link in the second post puts it here (https://www.google.com/maps/place/42%C2%B057'13.7%22N+75%C2%B031'36.5%22W/@42.7545896,-77.8890665,6.25z/data=!4m4!3m3!8m2!3d42.9538!4d-75.5268?hl=en), which looks right from my measurements. Yeah, it's closer to Syracuse to Binghamton, but I mainly mentioned Binghamton to prove a point; here are the (very approximate) measurements below (longest in bold):
| Syracuse | Binghamton | Wikipedia Coordinates |
Distance to PA Corner | 198 miles | 196 miles | 225 miles |
Distance to NY/QC/VT Tripoint | 194 miles | 238 miles | 178 miles |
Distance to Montauk Point | 259 miles | 221 miles | 229 miles |
I finished typing that post and realized I was mostly thinking about the population center, but decided it did apply to the geographical center as well. Turns out the population center is much further southeast, near Middletown (https://www.google.com/maps/place/41%C2%B030'27.2%22N+74%C2%B038'42.8%22W/@41.9005553,-75.4906602,8z/data=!4m5!3m4!1s0x0:0xf613f0982f2c8953!8m2!3d41.507548!4d-74.645228) (that was as of 2000; it may have moved since then).
Taking the midpoint of the two centers, as some have suggested, would indeed produce a point near Oneonta (just north of Walton, to be exact).
Quote from: webny99 on November 02, 2022, 10:36:13 PM
I finished typing that post and realized I was mostly thinking about the population center, but decided it did apply to the geographical center as well. Turns out the population center is much further southeast, near Middletown (https://www.google.com/maps/place/41%C2%B030'27.2%22N+74%C2%B038'42.8%22W/@41.9005553,-75.4906602,8z/data=!4m5!3m4!1s0x0:0xf613f0982f2c8953!8m2!3d41.507548!4d-74.645228) (that was as of 2000; it may have moved since then).
Taking the midpoint of the two centers, as some have suggested, would indeed produce a point near Oneonta (just north of Walton, to be exact).
Anybody got the skills and time to calculate this for some/all states?
Indiana's geographic and population centers are fairly close to each other, and by eyeballing it the midpoint looks to be pretty close to I-65 exit 130 (Whitestown Pkwy)
Quote from: dlsterner on November 02, 2022, 09:20:06 PM
Quote from: Bruce on November 02, 2022, 05:02:09 PM
Quote from: kphoger on November 02, 2022, 10:47:11 AM
I like the idea posted up-thread, to use the midpoint between the population centroid and the geographical center.
Washington's would be on a slope overlooking Salmon La Sac, a collection of campgrounds in the Cascades north of Cle Elum. An alpine state capital would be fun, but pretty hard to access for the first few months of the legislative session.
At least Washington's is on land. Hawaii's geographic center is actually off shore. Also hard to access for the first few months of the legislative session.
Simple solution: a grand flotilla.
Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on November 02, 2022, 10:48:57 PM
Quote from: webny99 on November 02, 2022, 10:36:13 PM
Taking the midpoint of the two centers, as some have suggested...
Anybody got the skills and time to calculate this for some/all states?
I did this for Nevada. Obviously the population center is pretty far south of the geographical center (by about 180 miles).
I came up with 38.172954 N, 116.402977 W, which remarkably plots out to a point almost directly on US 6, a couple miles west of its intersection with NV 375, the "Extraterrestrial Highway".
(https://i.imgur.com/psSJRXK.jpg)
So that's Warm Springs, Nevada. Here's a GSV of what you'll find at that US 6/NV 375 intersection, a building that perhaps could be rehabilitated for our Legislature: https://goo.gl/maps/Pre5brbnCZKbZS8Z6 (https://goo.gl/maps/Pre5brbnCZKbZS8Z6)
Quote from: bassoon1986 on November 01, 2022, 07:02:46 PM
Louisiana's geographic center- near Marksville
Population center- New Roads
It's well known here but just amazing that majority of Louisiana's population is either below I-10/I-12 or just east of the Mississippi River.
iPhone
I was gonna say Alexandria just because most N -> S highways lead there, making an obvious X on the highway maps.
Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on November 02, 2022, 10:48:57 PM
Quote from: webny99 on November 02, 2022, 10:36:13 PM
...
Taking the midpoint of the two centers, as some have suggested, would indeed produce a point near Oneonta (just north of Walton, to be exact).
Anybody got the skills and time to calculate this for some/all states?
Indiana's geographic and population centers are fairly close to each other, and by eyeballing it the midpoint looks to be pretty close to I-65 exit 130 (Whitestown Pkwy)
I might make the time, because after seeing the Nevada one that was just posted, I'm interested to see how representative that location looks for each state.
For New York, I think
this (https://goo.gl/maps/stn6zx59XrxMqYdTA) is as good as you're going to get Street View-wise. Not as good as Nevada, but still representative of much of rural NY.
Taking a quick stab at this for Maryland:
-The population center appears to be a point in the Annapolis Junction/Jessup area in the middle of some warehouses just east of the MD 32/US 1 interchange
-The geographic center is given as "4.5 miles northwest of Davidsonville", which roughly works out to US 50/301 near the Patuxent River just east of the US 301/MD 3 interchange
-These 2 points are only about 13.25 miles apart, and the midpoint appears to be in the middle of the Patuxent Research Refuge a couple miles north of Bowie State University
-The State House in Annapolis is only about 15 miles ESE of this point, so Maryland's capital is already pretty close to all 3 of the above points
Arkansas' is easy.
Little Rock.
Quote from: dlsterner on November 02, 2022, 09:20:06 PM
Quote from: Bruce on November 02, 2022, 05:02:09 PM
Quote from: kphoger on November 02, 2022, 10:47:11 AM
I like the idea posted up-thread, to use the midpoint between the population centroid and the geographical center.
Washington's would be on a slope overlooking Salmon La Sac, a collection of campgrounds in the Cascades north of Cle Elum. An alpine state capital would be fun, but pretty hard to access for the first few months of the legislative session.
At least Washington's is on land. Hawaii's geographic center is actually off shore. Also hard to access for the first few months of the legislative session.
Are you really sure that that is a *bad* thing? Some state capitols were placed where they were precisely because they are inconvenient (ie, Juneau, AK).
Mike
Quote from: mgk920 on November 03, 2022, 12:12:28 PM
Some state capitols were placed where they were precisely because they are inconvenient (ie, Juneau, AK).
Just out of idle curiosity, what makes you think that Juneau was chosen because it was inconvenient?
Best I've been able to find (https://www.alaskasnewssource.com/content/news/Ask-Juneau-Why-is-Juneau-the-capital-of-Alaska-478342433.html) says more or less the opposite:
Quote
It's fairly easy to see why Juneau became the capital in 1906 — Anchorage didn't exist yet and Fairbanks was a remote settlement, but Juneau had a thriving mining industry and was only a steamer trip away from Seattle. Additionally, it was not much further up the Panhandle than Sitka, the capital chosen for the territory by its one-time Russian masters.
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on November 03, 2022, 12:43:56 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on November 03, 2022, 12:12:28 PM
Some state capitols were placed where they were precisely because they are inconvenient (ie, Juneau, AK).
Just out of idle curiosity, what makes you think that Juneau was chosen because it was inconvenient?
Best I've been able to find (https://www.alaskasnewssource.com/content/news/Ask-Juneau-Why-is-Juneau-the-capital-of-Alaska-478342433.html) says more or less the opposite:
Quote
It's fairly easy to see why Juneau became the capital in 1906 — Anchorage didn't exist yet and Fairbanks was a remote settlement, but Juneau had a thriving mining industry and was only a steamer trip away from Seattle. Additionally, it was not much further up the Panhandle than Sitka, the capital chosen for the territory by its one-time Russian masters.
I think it's fair to say that Juneau was originally chosen because at the time the panhandle was more populated, but Juneau remained the capital once that was no longer true for security reasons.
California's geographic center is near Redinger Lake, and its population center is right outside of Shafter - about 115.75 miles apart. Almost exactly halfway between (within .5 miles) is the CA-99/CA-198 interchange - so Visalia would be the choice here.
It's actually a pretty strong choice - 140,000 people in the city, so some infrastructure is there, plenty of room to grow; a small airport but with room to expand; in the agricultural heartland, so removed from the major metros (and their real or perceived influence), but with easy freeway/highway connections to all of them (although that would really get the "make CA-99 an Interstate" crowd going).
Quote from: mgk920 on November 03, 2022, 12:12:28 PM
Are you really sure that that is a *bad* thing? Some state capitols were placed where they were precisely because they are inconvenient (ie, Juneau, AK).
Mike
The capital should be easily accessible to most members of the public for practical purposes. As the center of government, it should be expected that the public can visit to meet with their legislator, testify on bills in committee, or visit an institution to resolve issues that can't be solved by a local office.
Quote from: Bruce on November 03, 2022, 01:43:34 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on November 03, 2022, 12:12:28 PM
Are you really sure that that is a *bad* thing? Some state capitols were placed where they were precisely because they are inconvenient (ie, Juneau, AK).
Mike
The capital should be easily accessible to most members of the public for practical purposes. As the center of government, it should be expected that the public can visit to meet with their legislator, testify on bills in committee, or visit an institution to resolve issues that can't be solved by a local office.
Also, in many cases the capitol has civic/cultural institutions (state museums, libraries, archives, etc.) that should be readily available to the majority of the residents.
Quote from: mgk920 on November 03, 2022, 12:12:28 PM
Quote from: dlsterner on November 02, 2022, 09:20:06 PM
Quote from: Bruce on November 02, 2022, 05:02:09 PM
Quote from: kphoger on November 02, 2022, 10:47:11 AM
I like the idea posted up-thread, to use the midpoint between the population centroid and the geographical center.
Washington's would be on a slope overlooking Salmon La Sac, a collection of campgrounds in the Cascades north of Cle Elum. An alpine state capital would be fun, but pretty hard to access for the first few months of the legislative session.
At least Washington's is on land. Hawaii's geographic center is actually off shore. Also hard to access for the first few months of the legislative session.
Are you really sure that that is a *bad* thing? Some state capitols were placed where they were precisely because they are inconvenient (ie, Juneau, AK).
Mike
What? Why would any administrative division want the capital to be inconvenient to get to?
Quote from: DTComposer on November 03, 2022, 02:41:40 PM
Quote from: Bruce on November 03, 2022, 01:43:34 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on November 03, 2022, 12:12:28 PM
Are you really sure that that is a *bad* thing? Some state capitols were placed where they were precisely because they are inconvenient (ie, Juneau, AK).
Mike
The capital should be easily accessible to most members of the public for practical purposes. As the center of government, it should be expected that the public can visit to meet with their legislator, testify on bills in committee, or visit an institution to resolve issues that can't be solved by a local office.
Also, in many cases the capitol has civic/cultural institutions (state museums, libraries, archives, etc.) that should be readily available to the majority of the residents.
The capital is home (or close) to a public university about half the time, often the state's leading university. Home examples include WI, OH, TX, NM, and ID. It may also be in a nearby town like MO, MI, and AZ.
Quote from: skluth on November 03, 2022, 04:37:21 PM
Quote from: DTComposer on November 03, 2022, 02:41:40 PM
Quote from: Bruce on November 03, 2022, 01:43:34 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on November 03, 2022, 12:12:28 PM
Are you really sure that that is a *bad* thing? Some state capitols were placed where they were precisely because they are inconvenient (ie, Juneau, AK).
Mike
The capital should be easily accessible to most members of the public for practical purposes. As the center of government, it should be expected that the public can visit to meet with their legislator, testify on bills in committee, or visit an institution to resolve issues that can't be solved by a local office.
Also, in many cases the capitol has civic/cultural institutions (state museums, libraries, archives, etc.) that should be readily available to the majority of the residents.
The capital is home (or close) to a public university about half the time, often the state's leading university. Home examples include WI, OH, TX, NM, and ID. It may also be in a nearby town like MO, MI, and AZ.
In SD, Pierre has really nothing worth visiting for (the Zesto's!) and no one really wants to live there unless they like fishing. The universities are far from there and it's four hours from anything interesting.
We also have a part-time legislature, so outside the legislative session the politicians are back in their districts, where you can talk with them quite easily (e.g. I see one of my state reps at church).
Quote from: kirbykart on November 03, 2022, 02:47:39 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on November 03, 2022, 12:12:28 PM
Quote from: dlsterner on November 02, 2022, 09:20:06 PM
Quote from: Bruce on November 02, 2022, 05:02:09 PM
Quote from: kphoger on November 02, 2022, 10:47:11 AM
I like the idea posted up-thread, to use the midpoint between the population centroid and the geographical center.
Washington's would be on a slope overlooking Salmon La Sac, a collection of campgrounds in the Cascades north of Cle Elum. An alpine state capital would be fun, but pretty hard to access for the first few months of the legislative session.
At least Washington's is on land. Hawaii's geographic center is actually off shore. Also hard to access for the first few months of the legislative session.
Are you really sure that that is a *bad* thing? Some state capitols were placed where they were precisely because they are inconvenient (ie, Juneau, AK).
Mike
What? Why would any administrative division want the capital to be inconvenient to get to?
So the government can do things in secret and the people have more difficulty finding out what's going on or participating in the discussions.
Quote from: hbelkins on November 04, 2022, 11:55:37 AM
Quote from: kirbykart on November 03, 2022, 02:47:39 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on November 03, 2022, 12:12:28 PM
Quote from: dlsterner on November 02, 2022, 09:20:06 PM
Quote from: Bruce on November 02, 2022, 05:02:09 PM
Quote from: kphoger on November 02, 2022, 10:47:11 AM
I like the idea posted up-thread, to use the midpoint between the population centroid and the geographical center.
Washington's would be on a slope overlooking Salmon La Sac, a collection of campgrounds in the Cascades north of Cle Elum. An alpine state capital would be fun, but pretty hard to access for the first few months of the legislative session.
At least Washington's is on land. Hawaii's geographic center is actually off shore. Also hard to access for the first few months of the legislative session.
Are you really sure that that is a *bad* thing? Some state capitols were placed where they were precisely because they are inconvenient (ie, Juneau, AK).
Mike
What? Why would any administrative division want the capital to be inconvenient to get to?
So the government can do things in secret and the people have more difficulty finding out what's going on or participating in the discussions.
Perhaps in the 18th Century... Heh... :D
Depends who's doing the wanting...
Quote from: Rothman on November 04, 2022, 12:59:35 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on November 04, 2022, 11:55:37 AM
Quote from: kirbykart on November 03, 2022, 02:47:39 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on November 03, 2022, 12:12:28 PM
Quote from: dlsterner on November 02, 2022, 09:20:06 PM
Quote from: Bruce on November 02, 2022, 05:02:09 PM
Quote from: kphoger on November 02, 2022, 10:47:11 AM
I like the idea posted up-thread, to use the midpoint between the population centroid and the geographical center.
Washington's would be on a slope overlooking Salmon La Sac, a collection of campgrounds in the Cascades north of Cle Elum. An alpine state capital would be fun, but pretty hard to access for the first few months of the legislative session.
At least Washington's is on land. Hawaii's geographic center is actually off shore. Also hard to access for the first few months of the legislative session.
Are you really sure that that is a *bad* thing? Some state capitols were placed where they were precisely because they are inconvenient (ie, Juneau, AK).
Mike
What? Why would any administrative division want the capital to be inconvenient to get to?
So the government can do things in secret and the people have more difficulty finding out what's going on or participating in the discussions.
Perhaps in the 18th Century... Heh... :D
You'd be surprised. Frankfort is relatively centrally located both geographically and population-wise, and yet there are lots of complaints that people don't know what's going on in the Capitol and don't have time to organize rallies or protests. And that's with the instantaneous communications and digital transparency we have today.
Quote from: hbelkins on November 04, 2022, 01:55:09 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 04, 2022, 12:59:35 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on November 04, 2022, 11:55:37 AM
Quote from: kirbykart on November 03, 2022, 02:47:39 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on November 03, 2022, 12:12:28 PM
Quote from: dlsterner on November 02, 2022, 09:20:06 PM
Quote from: Bruce on November 02, 2022, 05:02:09 PM
Quote from: kphoger on November 02, 2022, 10:47:11 AM
I like the idea posted up-thread, to use the midpoint between the population centroid and the geographical center.
Washington's would be on a slope overlooking Salmon La Sac, a collection of campgrounds in the Cascades north of Cle Elum. An alpine state capital would be fun, but pretty hard to access for the first few months of the legislative session.
At least Washington's is on land. Hawaii's geographic center is actually off shore. Also hard to access for the first few months of the legislative session.
Are you really sure that that is a *bad* thing? Some state capitols were placed where they were precisely because they are inconvenient (ie, Juneau, AK).
Mike
What? Why would any administrative division want the capital to be inconvenient to get to?
So the government can do things in secret and the people have more difficulty finding out what's going on or participating in the discussions.
Perhaps in the 18th Century... Heh... :D
You'd be surprised. Frankfort is relatively centrally located both geographically and population-wise, and yet there are lots of complaints that people don't know what's going on in the Capitol and don't have time to organize rallies or protests. And that's with the instantaneous communications and digital transparency we have today.
I don't think the lack of transparency is a function of the geographic location of the capital.
Albany's considered a backwater by downstaters and lack of transparency is blamed on slimy politicians' behaviors rather than the distance between NYC and Albany.
Quote from: webny99 on November 03, 2022, 09:12:43 AM
Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on November 02, 2022, 10:48:57 PM
Quote from: webny99 on November 02, 2022, 10:36:13 PM
...
Taking the midpoint of the two centers, as some have suggested, would indeed produce a point near Oneonta (just north of Walton, to be exact).
Anybody got the skills and time to calculate this for some/all states?
Indiana's geographic and population centers are fairly close to each other, and by eyeballing it the midpoint looks to be pretty close to I-65 exit 130 (Whitestown Pkwy)
I might make the time, because after seeing the Nevada one that was just posted, I'm interested to see how representative that location looks for each state.
*sigh* *deep breath*
All right, first some caveats.
1. I had a hard time finding good coordinates for the geographical center of a lot of states. Hopefully the list I used had good data.
2. I used the mean population centroid, not the median population centroid. If you think that was a bad idea, too bad, what's done is done.
3. I did a lot of calculations in Excel for this. Hopefully the math didn't get messed up along the way.
4. If you think any pins are in the wrong location, then by all means, make your own map. I don't think I have the will to do it over again.
Anyway,
here is the map (https://www.google.com/maps/d/u/0/edit?mid=1qGFhxrrJNemk3jt3HkFJPvCC1vZSFHem&usp=sharing). Delaware is my favorite.
And here are my suggestions:
AL – stays in Montgomery, close enough
AK – moves to Anchorage, unless you want it on top of Denali...
AZ – stays in Phoenix
AR – stays in Little Rock
CA – moves to Fresno, CA-99 becomes an Interstate
CO – stays in Denver
CT – stays in Hartford
DE – doesn't get any better than Dover
FL – moves to either Orlando or Tampa, definitely not Tallahassee
GA – moves to Macon
HI – stays in Honolulu. I mean, seriously...
ID – stays in Boise, as good as you're gonna get
IL – moves to Bloomington or Peoria
IN – stays in Indianapolis
IA – stays in Des Moines, close enough
KS – moves to ... I don't know ... Emporia? Manhattan? Nothing's good.
KY – moves to Elizabethtown, or stays in Frankfort. Whatever.
LA – stays in Baton Rouge, close enough
ME – stays in Augusta, close enough
MD – moves to Baltimore, where it should be anyway...
MA – moves to Worcester, and all schoolchildren will pronounce it wrong
MI – moves to ... *groan* ... Saginaw? Or just leave in in Lansing?
MN – moves to St Cloud, and the Northstar Line gets extended
MS – stays in Jackson, close enough
MO – stays in Jefferson City. Whodathunkit?
MT – stays in Helena, because Great Falls is too far north
NE – moves to Grand Island
NV – ??? beats me, this one's terrible
NH – stays in Concord
NJ – stays in Trenton
NM – moves to Albuquerque, obviously
NY – moves to ... uhh ... Binghamton? No... Heck, I don't know.
NC – stays in Raleigh, or maybe moves to Greensboro
ND – stays in Bismarck, because Jamestown is too small
OH – stays in Columbus
OK – stays in Oklahoma City, because Goldsby is too small
OR – moves to Bend, or maybe Eugene
PA – stays in Harrisburg, close enough
RI – stays in Providence, duh
SC – stays in Columbia
SD – stays in Pierre, because what else is there?
TN – stays in Nashville
TX – stays in Austin, close enough
UT– stays in Salt Lake City, unless Provo wants it... and they probably do
VT – stays in Montpelier, close enough
VA – stays in Richmond, or moves to Charlottesville
WA – ??? beats me, this one's terrible ... Yakima? No, that can't be good...
WV – stays in Charleston, close enough
WI – moves to Oshkosh or Fond du Lac
WY – moves to Casper, because Rawlins is too small
Quote from: kphoger on November 04, 2022, 08:45:18 PM
Quote from: webny99 on November 03, 2022, 09:12:43 AM
Quote from: NWI_Irish96 on November 02, 2022, 10:48:57 PM
Quote from: webny99 on November 02, 2022, 10:36:13 PM
...
Taking the midpoint of the two centers, as some have suggested, would indeed produce a point near Oneonta (just north of Walton, to be exact).
Anybody got the skills and time to calculate this for some/all states?
Indiana's geographic and population centers are fairly close to each other, and by eyeballing it the midpoint looks to be pretty close to I-65 exit 130 (Whitestown Pkwy)
I might make the time, because after seeing the Nevada one that was just posted, I'm interested to see how representative that location looks for each state.
*sigh*
All right, first some caveats.
1. I had a hard time finding good coordinates for the geographical center of a lot of states. Hopefully the list I used had good data.
2. I used the mean population centroid, not the median population centroid. If you think that was a bad idea, too bad, what's done is done.
3. I did a lot of calculations in Excel for this. Hopefully the math didn't get messed up along the way.
4. If you think any pins are in the wrong location, then by all means, make your own map. I don't think I have the will to do it over again.
Anyway, here is the map (https://www.google.com/maps/d/u/0/edit?mid=1qGFhxrrJNemk3jt3HkFJPvCC1vZSFHem&usp=sharing). Delaware is my favorite.
And here are my suggestions:
AL – stays in Montgomery, close enough
AK – moves to Anchorage, unless you want it on top of Denali...
AZ – stays in Phoenix
AR – stays in Little Rock
CA – moves to Fresno, CA-99 becomes an Interstate
CO – stays in Denver
CT – stays in Hartford
DE – doesn't get any better than Dover
FL – moves to either Orlando or Tampa, definitely not Tallahassee
GA – moves to Macon
HI – stays in Honolulu. I mean, seriously...
ID – stays in Boise, as good as you're gonna get
IL – moves to Bloomington or Peoria
IN – stays in Indianapolis
IA – stays in Des Moines, close enough
KS – moves to ... I don't know ... Emporia? Manhattan? Nothing's good.
KY – moves to Elizabethtown, or stays in Frankfort. Whatever.
LA – stays in Baton Rouge, close enough
ME – stays in Augusta, close enough
MD – moves to Baltimore, where it should be anyway...
MA – moves to Worcester, and all schoolchildren will pronounce it wrong
MI – moves to ... *groan* ... Saginaw? Or just leave in in Lansing?
MN – moves to St Cloud, and the Northstar Line gets extended
MS – stays in Jackson, close enough
MO – stays in Jefferson City. Whodathunkit?
MT – stays in Helena, because Great Falls is too far north
NE – moves to Grand Island
NV – ??? beats me, this one's terrible
NH – stays in Concord
NJ – stays in Trenton
NM – moves to Albuquerque, obviously
NY – moves to ... uhh ... Binghamton? No... Heck, I don't know.
NC – stays in Raleigh, or maybe moves to Greensboro
ND – stays in Bismarck, because Jamestown is too small
OH – stays in Columbus
OK – stays in Oklahoma City, because Goldsby is too small
OR – moves to Bend, or maybe Eugene
PA – stays in Harrisburg, close enough
RI – stays in Providence, duh
SC – stays in Columbia
SD – stays in Pierre, because what else is there?
TN – stays in Nashville
TX – stays in Austin, close enough
UT– stays in Salt Lake City, unless Provo wants it... and they probably do
VT – stays in Montpelier, close enough
VA – stays in Richmond, or moves to Charlottesville
WA – ??? beats me, this one's terrible ... Yakima? No, that can't be good...
WV – stays in Charleston, close enough
WI – moves to Oshkosh or Fond du Lac
WY – moves to Casper, because Rawlins is too small
There are capitals smaller than Mount Pleasant, Michigan which is probably the closest decently populated city to the center of the Lower Peninsula. Cadillac if you want the center of the state due to how far north and west the Upper Peninsula goes. Or maybe Traverse City. Lansing seems to be in a pretty good location for the capital though.
Quote from: Flint1979 on November 04, 2022, 08:49:29 PM
There are capitals smaller than Mount Pleasant, Michigan which is probably the closest decently populated city to the center of the Lower Peninsula. Cadillac if you want the center of the state due to how far north and west the Upper Peninsula goes. Or maybe Traverse City. Lansing seems to be in a pretty good location for the capital though.
Where there wasn't a clear an obvious choice, I tried to skew the location closer to the state's major population center, which is why I thought maybe Saginaw. Although that isn't all that much better than Lansing. Mt Pleasant is where I'd like it to be, but I still think the population size is a bit small for the capital of such a prominent state.
The only state that has it's capital smack dab in the center of population for the state is South Carolina.
Quote from: kphoger on November 04, 2022, 08:57:27 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on November 04, 2022, 08:49:29 PM
There are capitals smaller than Mount Pleasant, Michigan which is probably the closest decently populated city to the center of the Lower Peninsula. Cadillac if you want the center of the state due to how far north and west the Upper Peninsula goes. Or maybe Traverse City. Lansing seems to be in a pretty good location for the capital though.
Where there wasn't a clear an obvious choice, I tried to skew the location closer to the state's major population center, which is why I thought maybe Saginaw. Although that isn't all that much better than Lansing. Mt Pleasant is where I'd like it to be, but I still think the population size is a bit small for the capital of such a prominent state.
Actually about the top five largest cities in Michigan are all somewhat near I-96. Detroit is the largest of course and I-96 connects it to Lansing (third largest metro in Michigan) to Grand Rapids (second largest city and metro in Michigan), Warren and Sterling Heights are both suburbs of Detroit and are the third and fourth largest cities in the state. It's like most of Michigan's population lives south of US-10.
Quote from: kphoger on November 04, 2022, 08:45:18 PM
OK – stays in Oklahoma City, because Goldsby is too small
:-D
Quote from: kphoger on November 04, 2022, 08:45:18 PM
KS – moves to ... I don't know ... Emporia? Manhattan? Nothing's good.
Maybe in the universe where Goldsby is the capital of Oklahoma, Atwood can be the capital of Kansas.
Quote from: kphoger on November 04, 2022, 08:45:18 PM
NV – ??? beats me, this one's terrible
Tonopah, maybe? Halfway between Las Vegas and Reno? Of course there's hardly anything there right now, but it wouldn't be the first government to move its capital to the middle of nowhere to give the local economy a boost.
Quote from: Flint1979 on November 04, 2022, 09:10:17 PM
Quote from: kphoger on November 04, 2022, 08:57:27 PM
Quote from: Flint1979 on November 04, 2022, 08:49:29 PM
There are capitals smaller than Mount Pleasant, Michigan which is probably the closest decently populated city to the center of the Lower Peninsula. Cadillac if you want the center of the state due to how far north and west the Upper Peninsula goes. Or maybe Traverse City. Lansing seems to be in a pretty good location for the capital though.
Where there wasn't a clear an obvious choice, I tried to skew the location closer to the state's major population center, which is why I thought maybe Saginaw. Although that isn't all that much better than Lansing. Mt Pleasant is where I'd like it to be, but I still think the population size is a bit small for the capital of such a prominent state.
Actually about the top five largest cities in Michigan are all somewhat near I-96. Detroit is the largest of course and I-96 connects it to Lansing (third largest metro in Michigan) to Grand Rapids (second largest city and metro in Michigan), Warren and Sterling Heights are both suburbs of Detroit and are the third and fourth largest cities in the state. It's like most of Michigan's population lives south of US-10.
The more I look at it, the more I like ... Lansing.
Quote from: Scott5114 on November 04, 2022, 10:05:32 PM
Quote from: kphoger on November 04, 2022, 08:45:18 PM
KS – moves to ... I don't know ... Emporia? Manhattan? Nothing's good.
Maybe in the universe where Goldsby is the capital of Oklahoma, Atwood can be the capital of Kansas.
If I consider three options–Salina, Wichita, and leaving it in Topeka–then Wichita actually comes out looking pretty good, even though it's 67 miles from the pin on my map. It's also the 2nd biggest metro area in the state, which is a big plus.
Distances from Kansas City173 – Salina
195 – Wichita (only 22 miles farther)
Distances from Hays203 – Topeka
174 – Wichita (29 miles closer)
Distances from Garden City200 – Salina
206 – Wichita (only 6 miles farther)
Quote from: Scott5114 on November 04, 2022, 10:05:32 PM
Quote from: kphoger on November 04, 2022, 08:45:18 PM
NV – ??? beats me, this one's terrible
Tonopah, maybe? Halfway between Las Vegas and Reno? Of course there's hardly anything there right now, but it wouldn't be the first government to move its capital to the middle of nowhere to give the local economy a boost.
I considered suggesting the capitol be moved inside the 76 station on the south side of Tonopah–maybe between the soda fountain and the restrooms...
Quote from: Flint1979 on November 04, 2022, 09:07:04 PM
The only state that has it's capital smack dab in the center of population for the state is South Carolina.
Did you check out Delaware on my map? The pin is only 0.6 miles from the actual capitol.
Quote from: kphoger on November 05, 2022, 10:44:20 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on November 04, 2022, 09:07:04 PM
The only state that has it's capital smack dab in the center of population for the state is South Carolina.
Did you check out Delaware on my map? The pin is only 0.6 miles from the actual capitol.
Flint1979 said center of population, not the "halfway between" calculation.
Quote from: Quillz on November 01, 2022, 06:30:27 PM
Madera makes sense for California. On CA-99 and close to the 41 and 152.
In terms of a sizable enough population close to the state center (which is near North Fork) Fresno would be a better bet. My wife works for Madera County, they don't have the resources in the city to support being the state capital.
Quote from: 1 on November 05, 2022, 10:59:31 AM
Quote from: kphoger on November 05, 2022, 10:44:20 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on November 04, 2022, 09:07:04 PM
The only state that has it's capital smack dab in the center of population for the state is South Carolina.
Did you check out Delaware on my map? The pin is only 0.6 miles from the actual capitol.
Flint1979 said center of population, not the "halfway between" calculation.
I know. I just thought he might also be interested in that little factoid.
Quote from: kphoger on November 05, 2022, 10:44:20 AM
Quote from: Flint1979 on November 04, 2022, 09:07:04 PM
The only state that has it's capital smack dab in the center of population for the state is South Carolina.
Did you check out Delaware on my map? The pin is only 0.6 miles from the actual capitol.
Yeah that's pretty interesting. Dover is the perfect capital.
Little Rock isn't going anywhere soon as the capital of Arkansas, as it is right in the geographical and transportational center of the state. (The actual geographical center is in Pulaski County but at this rate could be in Little Rock city limits.) The center of population is well to the northwest at this point and may be as far west as between Atkins and Hector in Pope County by now, if not by 2030.
Quote from: Road Hog on November 07, 2022, 02:25:52 AM
Little Rock isn't going anywhere soon as the capital of Arkansas, as it is right in the geographical and transportational center of the state. (The actual geographical center is in Pulaski County but at this rate could be in Little Rock city limits.) The center of population is well to the northwest at this point and may be as far west as between Atkins and Hector in Pope County by now, if not by 2030.
And to think that just a century ago, the population density midpoint was much further east. What used to be the richest part of the state, the agricultural bottomlands to the south and east of US-67, had a great change in fortunes as farmland consolidated into the hands of a precious few. What used to be good for plants turned out not to be good for humans. Now the part of the state that was the poorest became more desirable from a touristic/residential/commercial standpoint with the advent of Wal-Mart and all of the Corps of Engineering lakes that made recreation and water supply possible in the mountainous region to the north and west of US-67. We're probably only about 3 decades from the population center of the U.S. to be in NWA, barring another drought-induced dust bowl making a chunk of the western half of the country uninhabitable.
WA - not at Yakima on that map. In the forest about 10 miles north of Cle Elum. Cle Elum is well known enough within the state to be a landmark. That's where you get stopped if you're trying to cross Snoqualmie Pass westwards but snow's too heavy, avalanche danger too high, etc.
Quote from: kkt on November 14, 2022, 06:05:29 PM
WA - not at Yakima on that map.
I know. I was trying to figure out what city was nearest the map pin, but still a big enough city to justify being the state capital. I still don't know.
Quote from: kphoger on November 14, 2022, 06:36:12 PM
Quote from: kkt on November 14, 2022, 06:05:29 PM
WA - not at Yakima on that map.
I know. I was trying to figure out what city was nearest the map pin, but still a big enough city to justify being the state capital. I still don't know.
Cle Elum is probably as good as you can get.
There's a road marked up there, but even the Forest Service road it branches off of doesn't have Streetview...
Quote from: kphoger on November 14, 2022, 06:36:12 PM
Quote from: kkt on November 14, 2022, 06:05:29 PM
WA - not at Yakima on that map.
I know. I was trying to figure out what city was nearest the map pin, but still a big enough city to justify being the state capital. I still don't know.
Ellensburg would be closer to the center and was suitable enough in the 1880s to make a serious bid (as I mentioned upstream). Today it has a state university and is relatively well located for transportation links, while Yakima is a little out of the way (and requires an extra mountain pass for Seattle drivers via I-90 and I-82).
The trick is balancing the population center with the geographical center when one or both are out of whack. Florida is way out of balance, but Kansas probably does as good as you could expect with Topeka.
Quote from: thspfc on November 01, 2022, 03:32:48 PMFond du Lac
Quote from: kphoger on November 04, 2022, 08:45:18 PM
WI – Fond du Lac
Fondy would be a slow or at least indirect drive for most in the western population centers. Madison actually works relatively well when it comes to connectivity to the rest of the state, save for maybe the La Crosse metro.