From New York Post:
NYC restaurants impose 90-minute time limits on diners: "˜Out of control'QuoteA few weeks ago, Christina Izzo, 33, was out with a couple of friends at Ye's Apothecary, a Szechuan restaurant and speakeasy that opened in NYC's Chinatown last year.
They asked to order some more food – the restaurant serves a menu of $12 to $15 small plates – but were told they couldn't: The clock was ticking and the 90 minutes allotted for their reservation were nearly up.
FULL ARTICLE HERE (https://markholtz.info/2qf)
Geez, I know that NYC is expensive to live and rent business space in, especially when you factor in the "loss factor" (https://markholtz.info/lossfactor), and that the margins tend to be thin in food service. But still, ninety minutes means you are gulping down the meals when they finally get served instead of savoring the food.
I've seen a few articles like this more, regarding time limitations. It's a practical necessity, especially in a city where restaurants are small and turnover is a necessity. Wanna lounge with friends? You better be spending or tipping.
Also, let's talk about Ms. Christina Izzo, the featured 'guest' in the article. She wanted to order more "$12 to $15 small plates". Here's the restaurant's website: https://www.yesapothecary.com/ . Here's their menu: https://www.yesapothecary.com/menu . Well, that's page 1 of the menu. That's also the cheapest options. There's one $12 small plate, and several $14. But the next page shows many more $20+ options. She wanted to overstay her 90 minute time limit to order the cheapest options on the menu.
Also, that time limit... here's the restaurant's reservation page: https://resy.com/cities/ny/yes-apothecary?date=2023-04-09&seats=2 . Click on an available time. Click 'Reserve Now'. A red box immediately appears that states "Please be on time to your reservation, your party will have 90 minutes to dine with us, starting from the time of your reservation". We're dealing with a person where rules don't apply to her. We're dealing with a person where she thinks flashing a Lincoln ordering another small plate will wow the restaurant with profit, when the next scheduled party may be coming in with Franklins.
If you want to overstay your welcome, go to a place with plenty of seating. Go to a diner, or an Applebee's. If you're going to a cozy restaurant that barely fits 40 people, you're not going to impress anyone complaining you couldn't stay and eat another cucumber salad.
As a former restaurant GM, I have no problem with these restrictions as long as they're well advertised and as long as the kitchen keeps up. If I order within the first 15 minutes but I don't get my food for 35-40 minutes, I'm not abiding to your out time.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 09, 2023, 11:54:02 AMI've seen a few articles like this more, regarding time limitations. It's a practical necessity, especially in a city where restaurants are small and turnover is a necessity.
Again, I reiterate what I said earlier...
Quote from: ZLoth on April 09, 2023, 10:06:27 AMI know that NYC is expensive to live and rent business space in, especially when you factor in the "loss factor" (https://markholtz.info/lossfactor), and that the margins tend to be thin in food service.
One YouTube video (https://youtu.be/i3yc0k_SeTE?t=70) had the claim that a 3,000 square foot prime retail space located at 888 Sixth Ave between 31st and 32nd street was $300 per square foot per year. That is $75k per month, so you need plenty of foot traffic. Can someone please tell me the attraction of living in "The Big Apple"?
Quote from: ZLoth on April 09, 2023, 01:45:03 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 09, 2023, 11:54:02 AMI've seen a few articles like this more, regarding time limitations. It's a practical necessity, especially in a city where restaurants are small and turnover is a necessity.
Again, I reiterate what I said earlier...
Quote from: ZLoth on April 09, 2023, 10:06:27 AMI know that NYC is expensive to live and rent business space in, especially when you factor in the "loss factor" (https://markholtz.info/lossfactor), and that the margins tend to be thin in food service.
One YouTube video (https://youtu.be/i3yc0k_SeTE?t=70) had the claim that a 3,000 square foot prime retail space located at 888 Sixth Ave between 31st and 32nd street was $300 per square foot per year. That is $75k per month, so you need plenty of foot traffic. Can someone please tell me the attraction of living in "The Big Apple"?
My daughter lived in Brooklyn for a while and loved it. Lots of fun, food and entertainment if you can afford it and find some friends to enjoy it with. She had a great time.
Then again, living alone there, struggling to scrape by, can be fatally isolating.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on April 09, 2023, 12:40:19 PM
As a former restaurant GM, I have no problem with these restrictions as long as they're well advertised and as long as the kitchen keeps up. If I order within the first 15 minutes but I don't get my food for 35-40 minutes, I'm not abiding to your out time.
Yeah, if you're going to have a clock, it should really start when you get your entree, not when you walk in the door.
I get why they're doing this, but I personally wouldn't dine anywhere where I was being timed. I don't think I really spend 90 minutes in a restaurant normally, but I generally resent someone lording deadlines over me. (I have a mental illness that causes me to not be able to accurately estimate the passage of time, so it's a source of stress.) I'll put up with it if I'm getting paid to do so, but not for a recreational experience where I'm the one paying.
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 09, 2023, 02:06:45 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on April 09, 2023, 12:40:19 PM
As a former restaurant GM, I have no problem with these restrictions as long as they're well advertised and as long as the kitchen keeps up. If I order within the first 15 minutes but I don't get my food for 35-40 minutes, I'm not abiding to your out time.
Yeah, if you're going to have a clock, it should really start when you get your entree, not when you walk in the door.
Part of the reason of the timeclock is to prevent people from walking in the door when they feel like it. If they have a 7pm reservation, be there at 7pm. Not at 7:15 or 7:30. It messes with the server's time. It messes with the time of the next reservation when they do show up promptly, and then get irritated when they can't be seated at their appointed time.
If the restaurant is running behind, sure, that's on them. But that typically isn't the problem at places that have these time limits. Like this restaurant, they have small plates that are short on prep time, and don't take long to eat. I'm sure after a half-hour, this party probably could've ordered another small plate or two and another round of drinks with no problem. But I get the picture that's not what happened here. After 75 minutes of sitting and chatting, the restaurant isn't in the mood to see a party of 4 sit around another 30 minutes ordering another small appetizer. They honestly would rather force a money losing party out than care about their $15.
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 09, 2023, 02:06:45 PM
I get why they're doing this, but I personally wouldn't dine anywhere where I was being timed. I don't think I really spend 90 minutes in a restaurant normally, but I generally resent someone lording deadlines over me. (I have a mental illness that causes me to not be able to accurately estimate the passage of time, so it's a source of stress.) I'll put up with it if I'm getting paid to do so, but not for a recreational experience where I'm the one paying.
Me saying what I said above, I agree with this as well...depending on my overall plans.
If I'm in NYC to see a show at 8:30, and I make reservations at this place at 6, I'm going to want to be out at 7:30pm anyway. This place is perfect - I know I'll get my pre-show dinner and drinks and expect I'll be out of there to be on my way to get to the show. I won't need to worry about my order taking too long. But if I want to go to a place to sit back and relax...this probably isn't the place to be.
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 09, 2023, 02:06:45 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on April 09, 2023, 12:40:19 PM
As a former restaurant GM, I have no problem with these restrictions as long as they're well advertised and as long as the kitchen keeps up. If I order within the first 15 minutes but I don't get my food for 35-40 minutes, I'm not abiding to your out time.
Yeah, if you're going to have a clock, it should really start when you get your entree, not when you walk in the door.
I get why they're doing this, but I personally wouldn't dine anywhere where I was being timed. I don't think I really spend 90 minutes in a restaurant normally, but I generally resent someone lording deadlines over me. (I have a mental illness that causes me to not be able to accurately estimate the passage of time, so it's a source of stress.) I'll put up with it if I'm getting paid to do so, but not for a recreational experience where I'm the one paying.
I ate at an all you can eat sushi place last month that had the restriction. No problem at all for me.
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 09, 2023, 02:06:45 PM
(I have a mental illness that causes me to not be able to accurately estimate the passage of time, so it's a source of stress.)
I'm confused as to why estimating the passage of time is a necessary skill here . . .
Phone? Watch? Just check when you sit down, then you know the exact time you need to be out.
If I'm eating by myself and there are people waiting to be seated, I'm not going to dawdle over my meal. But time limits do send a bad signal to me--it's like being told, "Don't beat your wife."
Quote from: JayhawkCO on April 09, 2023, 12:40:19 PM
If I order within the first 15 minutes but I don't get my food for 35-40 minutes, I'm not abiding to your out time.
I agree with the total times, especially for a little place in a city that thrives on reservations. But for typical fare, I should have an hour to eat from the time my entree is served. I rarely need that much time, except when meeting up with people I haven't seen in a long time, or maybe the two times a year I get to go out with my wife for something other than fast food. We don't like the idea of hogging a table, and usually we have other things to do. I'm okay with off-peak hours at restaurants which usually means I have my choice of tables.
I've noticed that our family and co-workers usually tend to be done and out the door after 45 minutes of receiving our main entrees; salads and appetizers don't count against the clock, and any deserts are "overtime". If the party gets up to 8-12 people, then there's a little stretching because someone either didn't get their meal or something "wasn't right" (thankfully this is getting rarer).
When I eat alone, I'm usually served, paid, up-on-out pretty quickly! Parties larger than 15-20, ugh...I usually dread those and try to be the first out the door, my ambivert scale usually tips deeper into into GTFO territory if I don't know everyone or don't need to make an big impression.
I can't help but feel that this is tacky regardless of how well displayed the limit is.
Quote from: thspfc on April 09, 2023, 02:45:15 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 09, 2023, 02:06:45 PM
(I have a mental illness that causes me to not be able to accurately estimate the passage of time, so it's a source of stress.)
I'm confused as to why estimating the passage of time is a necessary skill here . . .
Phone? Watch? Just check when you sit down, then you know the exact time you need to be out.
I don't want to spend the whole meal checking my phone every five minutes to see what time it is and how much I have left. The pressure of keeping to a schedule is enough to ruin the entire experience for me. If I want the Temporal Sword of Damocles hanging over my head, I'll just work in a corporate environment again, thanks.
(I won't eat anywhere that requires reservations for the same reason. I am not going to pay good money for the privilege of playing time clock grabass with somebody else's manager.)
(https://i.pinimg.com/736x/f5/52/d7/f552d706d0162a8a36f27ef3f471a504--chinese-restaurant-buffets.jpg)
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 09, 2023, 09:49:35 PM
(I won't eat anywhere that requires reservations for the same reason. I am not going to pay good money for the privilege of playing time clock grabass with somebody else's manager.)
Can you explain what you mean here? (Not computing in my brain at 6:42 AM)
Another reason for me to never want to live in NYC, or in Chicago.
I eat so quickly that I could even deal with a 30 minute limit.
Quote from: JoePCool14 on April 10, 2023, 03:54:35 PM
Another reason for me to never want to live in NYC, or in Chicago.
I live 30 miles from Boston, and we have a few here. It's not unique to large cities.
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on April 10, 2023, 04:11:51 PM
I eat so quickly that I could even deal with a 30 minute limit.
Not all restaurants have two golden arches above them....
Technically many McDonald's have dining time limits with signs posted. The employees don't get paid enough to give a shit unless someone is being belligerent.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on April 10, 2023, 08:42:52 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 09, 2023, 09:49:35 PM
(I won't eat anywhere that requires reservations for the same reason. I am not going to pay good money for the privilege of playing time clock grabass with somebody else's manager.)
Can you explain what you mean here? (Not computing in my brain at 6:42 AM)
I don't want to have to make a reservation for, say, 7pm. Because what will inevitably end up happen is 1) I will stress myself out about getting to the reservation on time that I will leave insanely early and get there at 6:42 and have to sit in the lobby killing time for 18 minutes, or 2) I will end up underestimating the time it takes to get there/how long it takes to get ready/whatever and end up still not being at the restaurant at 7pm and then will stress myself out about being late and probably do something like speed to get there.
All of that adds enough stress to the dining activity that stops being an enjoyable experience and becomes a chore, so I won't participate in it. You can find food that's just as good without that level of formality by going to a food truck or some greasy spoon place.
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 07:35:44 PM
I will leave insanely early and get there at 6:42 and have to sit in the lobby killing time for 18 minutes
I went to an Easter brunch yesterday and arrived ten minutes early. They seated us immediately instead of forcing us to wait for ten minutes.
This one had a 1 1/2 hour limit, by the way.
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 07:35:44 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on April 10, 2023, 08:42:52 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 09, 2023, 09:49:35 PM
(I won't eat anywhere that requires reservations for the same reason. I am not going to pay good money for the privilege of playing time clock grabass with somebody else's manager.)
Can you explain what you mean here? (Not computing in my brain at 6:42 AM)
I don't want to have to make a reservation for, say, 7pm. Because what will inevitably end up happen is 1) I will stress myself out about getting to the reservation on time that I will leave insanely early and get there at 6:42 and have to sit in the lobby killing time for 18 minutes, or 2) I will end up underestimating the time it takes to get there/how long it takes to get ready/whatever and end up still not being at the restaurant at 7pm and then will stress myself out about being late and probably do something like speed to get there.
All of that adds enough stress to the dining activity that stops being an enjoyable experience and becomes a chore, so I won't participate in it. You can find food that's just as good without that level of formality by going to a food truck or some greasy spoon place.
Fair enough! I like having a cocktail in the bar if I arrive early at a reservation type place, but, obviously, to each their own. I don't often dine at reservation places, despite me having working in fine dining for most of my career. But it never stresses me out when I do, I suppose.
Quote from: 1 on April 10, 2023, 07:39:18 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 07:35:44 PM
I will leave insanely early and get there at 6:42 and have to sit in the lobby killing time for 18 minutes
I went to an Easter brunch yesterday and arrived ten minutes early. They seated us immediately instead of forcing us to wait for ten minutes.
If there is a table available, you're an idiot if you don't seat the table early. It gives you a lot more flexibility the a) getting in the other reservations and b) possibly being able to accommodate walk-ins.
The fact that some people think this will in any way improve things is impressively stupid.
Quote from: ZLoth on April 09, 2023, 01:45:03 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 09, 2023, 11:54:02 AMI've seen a few articles like this more, regarding time limitations. It's a practical necessity, especially in a city where restaurants are small and turnover is a necessity.
Again, I reiterate what I said earlier...
Quote from: ZLoth on April 09, 2023, 10:06:27 AMI know that NYC is expensive to live and rent business space in, especially when you factor in the "loss factor" (https://markholtz.info/lossfactor), and that the margins tend to be thin in food service.
One YouTube video (https://youtu.be/i3yc0k_SeTE?t=70) had the claim that a 3,000 square foot prime retail space located at 888 Sixth Ave between 31st and 32nd street was $300 per square foot per year. That is $75k per month, so you need plenty of foot traffic. Can someone please tell me the attraction of living in "The Big Apple"?
There isn't one with me anymore. I used to love the big cities and want to live in the big city and be around people and stuff. I grew out of that and haven't spent much time in big cities that last few years. Haven't been to NYC since 2012, haven't been to Chicago since 2021, only one I've spent any time in is Detroit mainly because it's the big city in Michigan and I find myself there often. But really I don't see the attraction of living in a big city anymore, it's expensive as hell, the crime is out of control, it's crowded and noisy and I don't think I'd want to live around that anymore. I'm more of a suburban and rural type of person now and like hanging out in places that aren't very crowded. I ask the same question though what is the attraction of living in NYC?
Quote from: Flint1979 on April 10, 2023, 08:51:56 PM
the crime is out of control
This isn't true for every major city. Yes, the nearest one to you (Detroit) is pretty high. But New York City is quite safe, much safer than the national average, in fact.
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 07:35:44 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on April 10, 2023, 08:42:52 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 09, 2023, 09:49:35 PM
(I won't eat anywhere that requires reservations for the same reason. I am not going to pay good money for the privilege of playing time clock grabass with somebody else's manager.)
Can you explain what you mean here? (Not computing in my brain at 6:42 AM)
I don't want to have to make a reservation for, say, 7pm. Because what will inevitably end up happen is 1) I will stress myself out about getting to the reservation on time that I will leave insanely early and get there at 6:42 and have to sit in the lobby killing time for 18 minutes, or 2) I will end up underestimating the time it takes to get there/how long it takes to get ready/whatever and end up still not being at the restaurant at 7pm and then will stress myself out about being late and probably do something like speed to get there.
All of that adds enough stress to the dining activity that stops being an enjoyable experience and becomes a chore, so I won't participate in it. You can find food that's just as good without that level of formality by going to a food truck or some greasy spoon place.
You are tremendously overthinking it now.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 10, 2023, 09:04:28 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 07:35:44 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on April 10, 2023, 08:42:52 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 09, 2023, 09:49:35 PM
(I won't eat anywhere that requires reservations for the same reason. I am not going to pay good money for the privilege of playing time clock grabass with somebody else's manager.)
Can you explain what you mean here? (Not computing in my brain at 6:42 AM)
I don't want to have to make a reservation for, say, 7pm. Because what will inevitably end up happen is 1) I will stress myself out about getting to the reservation on time that I will leave insanely early and get there at 6:42 and have to sit in the lobby killing time for 18 minutes, or 2) I will end up underestimating the time it takes to get there/how long it takes to get ready/whatever and end up still not being at the restaurant at 7pm and then will stress myself out about being late and probably do something like speed to get there.
All of that adds enough stress to the dining activity that stops being an enjoyable experience and becomes a chore, so I won't participate in it. You can find food that's just as good without that level of formality by going to a food truck or some greasy spoon place.
You are tremendously overthinking it now.
Yes, welcome to the wonderful world of having a mental illness (https://focusmag.uk/time-blindness-adhd-adult-adhd-processing-speed/)!
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 09:15:51 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 10, 2023, 09:04:28 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 07:35:44 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on April 10, 2023, 08:42:52 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 09, 2023, 09:49:35 PM
(I won't eat anywhere that requires reservations for the same reason. I am not going to pay good money for the privilege of playing time clock grabass with somebody else's manager.)
Can you explain what you mean here? (Not computing in my brain at 6:42 AM)
I don't want to have to make a reservation for, say, 7pm. Because what will inevitably end up happen is 1) I will stress myself out about getting to the reservation on time that I will leave insanely early and get there at 6:42 and have to sit in the lobby killing time for 18 minutes, or 2) I will end up underestimating the time it takes to get there/how long it takes to get ready/whatever and end up still not being at the restaurant at 7pm and then will stress myself out about being late and probably do something like speed to get there.
All of that adds enough stress to the dining activity that stops being an enjoyable experience and becomes a chore, so I won't participate in it. You can find food that's just as good without that level of formality by going to a food truck or some greasy spoon place.
You are tremendously overthinking it now.
Yes, welcome to the wonderful world of having a mental illness (https://focusmag.uk/time-blindness-adhd-adult-adhd-processing-speed/)!
Well, break it down this way...you worked in a casino which by its very nature has made many very strict timelines. I'm sure the casino had a fancy restaurant or two which took reservations, so you were always around people going someone with reservations. While the time commitment for a meal can seem a little overwhelming, it's nothing more than just a time. Just like any other doctors appointment or scheduled meeting.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 10, 2023, 11:10:15 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 09:15:51 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 10, 2023, 09:04:28 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 07:35:44 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on April 10, 2023, 08:42:52 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 09, 2023, 09:49:35 PM
(I won't eat anywhere that requires reservations for the same reason. I am not going to pay good money for the privilege of playing time clock grabass with somebody else's manager.)
Can you explain what you mean here? (Not computing in my brain at 6:42 AM)
I don't want to have to make a reservation for, say, 7pm. Because what will inevitably end up happen is 1) I will stress myself out about getting to the reservation on time that I will leave insanely early and get there at 6:42 and have to sit in the lobby killing time for 18 minutes, or 2) I will end up underestimating the time it takes to get there/how long it takes to get ready/whatever and end up still not being at the restaurant at 7pm and then will stress myself out about being late and probably do something like speed to get there.
All of that adds enough stress to the dining activity that stops being an enjoyable experience and becomes a chore, so I won't participate in it. You can find food that's just as good without that level of formality by going to a food truck or some greasy spoon place.
You are tremendously overthinking it now.
Yes, welcome to the wonderful world of having a mental illness (https://focusmag.uk/time-blindness-adhd-adult-adhd-processing-speed/)!
Well, break it down this way...you worked in a casino which by its very nature has made many very strict timelines. I'm sure the casino had a fancy restaurant or two which took reservations, so you were always around people going someone with reservations. While the time commitment for a meal can seem a little overwhelming, it's nothing more than just a time. Just like any other doctors appointment or scheduled meeting.
The stresses of work and healthcare and so on are different, I'd say, from what is supposed to be a leisure activity. I mean, there's a time to work on one's weaknesses and a time to not do that.
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on April 10, 2023, 11:52:43 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 10, 2023, 11:10:15 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 09:15:51 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 10, 2023, 09:04:28 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 07:35:44 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on April 10, 2023, 08:42:52 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 09, 2023, 09:49:35 PM
(I won't eat anywhere that requires reservations for the same reason. I am not going to pay good money for the privilege of playing time clock grabass with somebody else's manager.)
Can you explain what you mean here? (Not computing in my brain at 6:42 AM)
I don't want to have to make a reservation for, say, 7pm. Because what will inevitably end up happen is 1) I will stress myself out about getting to the reservation on time that I will leave insanely early and get there at 6:42 and have to sit in the lobby killing time for 18 minutes, or 2) I will end up underestimating the time it takes to get there/how long it takes to get ready/whatever and end up still not being at the restaurant at 7pm and then will stress myself out about being late and probably do something like speed to get there.
All of that adds enough stress to the dining activity that stops being an enjoyable experience and becomes a chore, so I won't participate in it. You can find food that's just as good without that level of formality by going to a food truck or some greasy spoon place.
You are tremendously overthinking it now.
Yes, welcome to the wonderful world of having a mental illness (https://focusmag.uk/time-blindness-adhd-adult-adhd-processing-speed/)!
Well, break it down this way...you worked in a casino which by its very nature has made many very strict timelines. I'm sure the casino had a fancy restaurant or two which took reservations, so you were always around people going someone with reservations. While the time commitment for a meal can seem a little overwhelming, it's nothing more than just a time. Just like any other doctors appointment or scheduled meeting.
The stresses of work and healthcare and so on are different, I'd say, from what is supposed to be a leisure activity. I mean, there's a time to work on one's weaknesses and a time to not do that.
But again, a dinner reservation is really not all that unusual. If you live in or near a city, it's commonplace.
I could see coffeehouses and cafes enforcing time limits as well. Some of them get very crowded with people who stay around all day.
Good thing I normally take-out and eat in the comforts of my own home.
Quote from: ZLoth on April 09, 2023, 01:45:03 PM
Can someone please tell me the attraction of living in "The Big Apple"?
I can't think of anything attractive about living there full-time residence, but I'm sure it's nice city to visit (in the summer time of course). New York certainly gets extremely cold outside their short summer window.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 10, 2023, 11:10:15 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 09:15:51 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 10, 2023, 09:04:28 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 07:35:44 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on April 10, 2023, 08:42:52 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 09, 2023, 09:49:35 PM
(I won't eat anywhere that requires reservations for the same reason. I am not going to pay good money for the privilege of playing time clock grabass with somebody else's manager.)
Can you explain what you mean here? (Not computing in my brain at 6:42 AM)
I don't want to have to make a reservation for, say, 7pm. Because what will inevitably end up happen is 1) I will stress myself out about getting to the reservation on time that I will leave insanely early and get there at 6:42 and have to sit in the lobby killing time for 18 minutes, or 2) I will end up underestimating the time it takes to get there/how long it takes to get ready/whatever and end up still not being at the restaurant at 7pm and then will stress myself out about being late and probably do something like speed to get there.
All of that adds enough stress to the dining activity that stops being an enjoyable experience and becomes a chore, so I won't participate in it. You can find food that's just as good without that level of formality by going to a food truck or some greasy spoon place.
You are tremendously overthinking it now.
Yes, welcome to the wonderful world of having a mental illness (https://focusmag.uk/time-blindness-adhd-adult-adhd-processing-speed/)!
Well, break it down this way...you worked in a casino which by its very nature has made many very strict timelines. I'm sure the casino had a fancy restaurant or two which took reservations, so you were always around people going someone with reservations. While the time commitment for a meal can seem a little overwhelming, it's nothing more than just a time. Just like any other doctors appointment or scheduled meeting.
Yeah, and I often got in trouble for not being able to follow the strict timelines. I did the best I could because I was paid to do so–I'm not willing to both put up with that
and pay.
Quote from: TheHighwayMan394 on April 10, 2023, 06:51:56 PM
Technically many McDonald's have dining time limits with signs posted.
Thankfully, never encountered one like that, or any other fast food restaurants.
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 11, 2023, 02:33:14 AM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 10, 2023, 11:10:15 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 09:15:51 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 10, 2023, 09:04:28 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 07:35:44 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on April 10, 2023, 08:42:52 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 09, 2023, 09:49:35 PM
(I won't eat anywhere that requires reservations for the same reason. I am not going to pay good money for the privilege of playing time clock grabass with somebody else's manager.)
Can you explain what you mean here? (Not computing in my brain at 6:42 AM)
I don't want to have to make a reservation for, say, 7pm. Because what will inevitably end up happen is 1) I will stress myself out about getting to the reservation on time that I will leave insanely early and get there at 6:42 and have to sit in the lobby killing time for 18 minutes, or 2) I will end up underestimating the time it takes to get there/how long it takes to get ready/whatever and end up still not being at the restaurant at 7pm and then will stress myself out about being late and probably do something like speed to get there.
All of that adds enough stress to the dining activity that stops being an enjoyable experience and becomes a chore, so I won't participate in it. You can find food that's just as good without that level of formality by going to a food truck or some greasy spoon place.
You are tremendously overthinking it now.
Yes, welcome to the wonderful world of having a mental illness (https://focusmag.uk/time-blindness-adhd-adult-adhd-processing-speed/)!
Well, break it down this way...you worked in a casino which by its very nature has made many very strict timelines. I'm sure the casino had a fancy restaurant or two which took reservations, so you were always around people going someone with reservations. While the time commitment for a meal can seem a little overwhelming, it's nothing more than just a time. Just like any other doctors appointment or scheduled meeting.
Yeah, and I often got in trouble for not being able to follow the strict timelines. I did the best I could because I was paid to do so–I'm not willing to both put up with that and pay.
How strict that 90 min really is? especially if the place is in position to make that happen - kitchen keeps up, waiters are keeping an eye on what happens, and you don't have to wait 20 min to make an order?
Even people in original article were not asked to walk away from their dishes, they were denied top off order.
Yes, this is not a great place for a long conversation after meal. But that's probably the extent of restrictions. 60 min lunch, including getting to the place, is pretty common arrangement.
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 11, 2023, 02:33:14 AM
Yeah, and I often got in trouble for not being able to follow the strict timelines. I did the best I could because I was paid to do so–I'm not willing to both put up with that and pay.
" Got in trouble" ? What did the restaurant do? Probably say something like "hey guys, we have a time limit and it's been 90 minutes, so we've gotta ask you to leave" ?
They're not going to kidnap your family because you overstayed the time limit. If they get all bent over about it, then you know to not come back because they're not worth your money.
Quote from: thspfc on April 11, 2023, 08:01:50 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 11, 2023, 02:33:14 AM
Yeah, and I often got in trouble for not being able to follow the strict timelines. I did the best I could because I was paid to do so–I'm not willing to both put up with that and pay.
" Got in trouble" ? What did the restaurant do? Probably say something like "hey guys, we have a time limit and it's been 90 minutes, so we've gotta ask you to leave" ?
They're not going to kidnap your family because you overstayed the time limit. If they get all bent over about it, then you know to not come back because they're not worth your money.
The context here is working at a casino, not eating at a restaurant. He could have lost his job.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 11, 2023, 12:08:05 AM
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on April 10, 2023, 11:52:43 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 10, 2023, 11:10:15 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 09:15:51 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 10, 2023, 09:04:28 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 07:35:44 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on April 10, 2023, 08:42:52 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 09, 2023, 09:49:35 PM
(I won't eat anywhere that requires reservations for the same reason. I am not going to pay good money for the privilege of playing time clock grabass with somebody else's manager.)
Can you explain what you mean here? (Not computing in my brain at 6:42 AM)
I don't want to have to make a reservation for, say, 7pm. Because what will inevitably end up happen is 1) I will stress myself out about getting to the reservation on time that I will leave insanely early and get there at 6:42 and have to sit in the lobby killing time for 18 minutes, or 2) I will end up underestimating the time it takes to get there/how long it takes to get ready/whatever and end up still not being at the restaurant at 7pm and then will stress myself out about being late and probably do something like speed to get there.
All of that adds enough stress to the dining activity that stops being an enjoyable experience and becomes a chore, so I won't participate in it. You can find food that's just as good without that level of formality by going to a food truck or some greasy spoon place.
You are tremendously overthinking it now.
Yes, welcome to the wonderful world of having a mental illness (https://focusmag.uk/time-blindness-adhd-adult-adhd-processing-speed/)!
Well, break it down this way...you worked in a casino which by its very nature has made many very strict timelines. I'm sure the casino had a fancy restaurant or two which took reservations, so you were always around people going someone with reservations. While the time commitment for a meal can seem a little overwhelming, it's nothing more than just a time. Just like any other doctors appointment or scheduled meeting.
The stresses of work and healthcare and so on are different, I'd say, from what is supposed to be a leisure activity. I mean, there's a time to work on one's weaknesses and a time to not do that.
But again, a dinner reservation is really not all that unusual. If you live in or near a city, it's commonplace.
If it's a stressor, it's a stressor, regardless of whether someone else thinks it should be or not.
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on April 11, 2023, 10:00:54 AM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 11, 2023, 12:08:05 AM
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on April 10, 2023, 11:52:43 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 10, 2023, 11:10:15 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 09:15:51 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on April 10, 2023, 09:04:28 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 10, 2023, 07:35:44 PM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on April 10, 2023, 08:42:52 AM
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 09, 2023, 09:49:35 PM
(I won't eat anywhere that requires reservations for the same reason. I am not going to pay good money for the privilege of playing time clock grabass with somebody else's manager.)
Can you explain what you mean here? (Not computing in my brain at 6:42 AM)
I don't want to have to make a reservation for, say, 7pm. Because what will inevitably end up happen is 1) I will stress myself out about getting to the reservation on time that I will leave insanely early and get there at 6:42 and have to sit in the lobby killing time for 18 minutes, or 2) I will end up underestimating the time it takes to get there/how long it takes to get ready/whatever and end up still not being at the restaurant at 7pm and then will stress myself out about being late and probably do something like speed to get there.
All of that adds enough stress to the dining activity that stops being an enjoyable experience and becomes a chore, so I won't participate in it. You can find food that's just as good without that level of formality by going to a food truck or some greasy spoon place.
You are tremendously overthinking it now.
Yes, welcome to the wonderful world of having a mental illness (https://focusmag.uk/time-blindness-adhd-adult-adhd-processing-speed/)!
Well, break it down this way...you worked in a casino which by its very nature has made many very strict timelines. I'm sure the casino had a fancy restaurant or two which took reservations, so you were always around people going someone with reservations. While the time commitment for a meal can seem a little overwhelming, it's nothing more than just a time. Just like any other doctors appointment or scheduled meeting.
The stresses of work and healthcare and so on are different, I'd say, from what is supposed to be a leisure activity. I mean, there's a time to work on one's weaknesses and a time to not do that.
But again, a dinner reservation is really not all that unusual. If you live in or near a city, it's commonplace.
If it's a stressor, it's a stressor, regardless of whether someone else thinks it should be or not.
It can be a stressor, and it's possible to avoid by going to places in less demand where scheduling is more relaxed, or going at less common hours. Manhattan may be a bad place to take your sweet time...
Not wanting to place undue faith in my own ability to track time, I went back to some old GPS logs for some perspective on how long it actually takes to eat dinner. From a visit to a Midwestern city almost seven years ago:
* Lingering over my dinner on Sunday at a sit-down restaurant with a format similar to Applebee's (though I'm sure they'd be offended by the comparison)--car parked at 0125 hours UTC, car no longer parked at 0248 hours UTC (1 hour 23 minutes)
* Parking in a free lot and walking 0.6 mile (12 minutes, per Google) each way to a gourmet burger restaurant in a scenic riverside town where a major bridge project was then in progress, with pauses to look both at that bridge and the one it replaced, admire a collector's mid-1980's JDM RHD Toyota Crown hardtop with inline-six engine with belt-driven supercharger, etc.: car parked at 2234 hours UTC, car no longer parked at 0013 hours UTC (1 hour 39 minutes)
So, even though I consider myself a slow eater, I can turn over a cover within 90 minutes without strain, as long as the service is not unreasonably dilatory, which it was not in either case. This said, I often lodge a drink and meal order at the same time when I am by myself, and I tend not to eat dessert. I can easily see things running to well over two hours with drinks orders taken separately, one member of a multiple-person party needing more time (typically an additional 10-15 minutes) to pick an entrée, dessert plus coffee, and so on.
Quote from: LilianaUwU on April 10, 2023, 08:36:51 PM
The fact that some people think this will in any way improve things is impressively stupid.
Do you think they're making these decisions and then their business is
less profitable?
Quote from: J N Winkler on April 11, 2023, 01:25:21 PM
with pauses to look both at that bridge and the one it replaced, admire a collector's mid-1980's JDM RHD Toyota Crown hardtop with inline-six engine with belt-driven supercharger, etc.
These are worthy and specific distractions.
I just don't know why it has to be a time-clocked rule. If a party is overstaying their welcome, then why can't the staff just politely request that they wrap it up because other guests are waiting? And if that becomes a problem, get the manager involved.
Quote from: kphoger on April 11, 2023, 03:34:26 PM
I just don't know why it has to be a time-clocked rule. If a party is overstaying their welcome, then why can't the staff just politely request that they wrap it up because other guests are waiting? And if that becomes a problem, get the manager involved.
Basically, because that's not how dining culture works in the U.S. (and elsewhere). It's never been an expectation to "eat and leave", so it would be tough to get people to not lounge at least somewhat.
Quote from: kphoger on April 11, 2023, 03:34:26 PM
I just don't know why it has to be a time-clocked rule. If a party is overstaying their welcome, then why can't the staff just politely request that they wrap it up because other guests are waiting? And if that becomes a problem, get the manager involved.
You never told us that before! No, we are going to stay!Giving some upfront timing, likely with padding for cleaning and a bit of a delay for 2 hour reservation spacing, makes things a bit more predictable.
And if reservations are getting full, vendor has to have either overflow capacity ($$$) or be a bit tough on enforcement. Upfront rule makes things easier. I doubt thing would be enforced if there is extra capacity. So it's just about wording, "
guests holding the next reservation are coming" vs "
your time is up".
oh, and by the way
Quotefor this restaurant, parties of two have just 90 minutes, while parties up to six have two hours and larger parties have two and a half hours
Sounds like they reserved table for 2, but came in a bigger group
Quote from: JayhawkCO on April 11, 2023, 03:39:45 PM
Quote from: kphoger on April 11, 2023, 03:34:26 PM
I just don't know why it has to be a time-clocked rule. If a party is overstaying their welcome, then why can't the staff just politely request that they wrap it up because other guests are waiting? And if that becomes a problem, get the manager involved.
Basically, because that's not how dining culture works in the U.S. (and elsewhere). It's never been an expectation to "eat and leave", so it would be tough to get people to not lounge at least somewhat.
That, and people pay after they eat at most eating establishments, so ticking them right off before the bill is very bad for business.
(https://i.imgur.com/2kgBKT6.jpg)
Quote from: kalvado on April 11, 2023, 10:32:57 AM
It can be a stressor, and it's possible to avoid by going to places in less demand where scheduling is more relaxed, or going at less common hours. Manhattan may be a bad place to take your sweet time...
Right, that's what I'm saying. They're welcome to have this rule as much as they want, but I'm not going to go there at all if they do.
Quote from: jgb191 on April 11, 2023, 12:56:07 AM
Good thing I normally take-out and eat in the comforts of my own home.
Quote from: ZLoth on April 09, 2023, 01:45:03 PM
Can someone please tell me the attraction of living in "The Big Apple"?
I can't think of anything attractive about living there full-time residence, but I'm sure it's nice city to visit (in the summer time of course). New York certainly gets extremely cold outside their short summer window.
Spring or fall. Too hot and humid in the summer.
Quote from: Scott5114 on April 12, 2023, 12:56:39 AM
Quote from: kalvado on April 11, 2023, 10:32:57 AM
It can be a stressor, and it's possible to avoid by going to places in less demand where scheduling is more relaxed, or going at less common hours. Manhattan may be a bad place to take your sweet time...
Right, that's what I'm saying. They're welcome to have this rule as much as they want, but I'm not going to go there at all if they do.
Neither do I, honestly speaking. But those places still have enough demand without us.
Somewhat reminds me of Walmart discussions - everyone say "I am not going there at all!" - but once you're in the store, it looks like entire city is shopping there...
As a lot of you all know, I was a restaurant general manager for a long time. There were times when we'd be running long on reservations. Going over 5-10 minutes isn't the end of the world, but anything more substantial than that, I needed to take intervention. There were times where I needed one specific table to open up to alleviate all of my problems. When that happened, if it was a table that was finished with their meal and just visiting, I'd apologize, explain the situation, and offer to buy them a round of drinks if I could move them to another location. This never failed and got me out of a lot of jams, but it's not as easy as some are suggesting where you just ask people to leave because you need the table. I had to a) have another place to move them to and b) cost the company a little bit of cash by comping the drinks.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on April 12, 2023, 09:13:01 AM
As a lot of you all know, I was a restaurant general manager for a long time. There were times when we'd be running long on reservations. Going over 5-10 minutes isn't the end of the world, but anything more substantial than that, I needed to take intervention. There were times where I needed one specific table to open up to alleviate all of my problems. When that happened, if it was a table that was finished with their meal and just visiting, I'd apologize, explain the situation, and offer to buy them a round of drinks if I could move them to another location. This never failed and got me out of a lot of jams, but it's not as easy as some are suggesting where you just ask people to leave because you need the table. I had to a) have another place to move them to and b) cost the company a little bit of cash by comping the drinks.
How long were your reservation allocations, and what was the %% of reservations relative to overall capacity? Those are the factors which affect a lot
Sounds like those NYC places run close to 100% reserved...
Quote from: kalvado on April 12, 2023, 09:31:55 AM
Quote from: JayhawkCO on April 12, 2023, 09:13:01 AM
As a lot of you all know, I was a restaurant general manager for a long time. There were times when we'd be running long on reservations. Going over 5-10 minutes isn't the end of the world, but anything more substantial than that, I needed to take intervention. There were times where I needed one specific table to open up to alleviate all of my problems. When that happened, if it was a table that was finished with their meal and just visiting, I'd apologize, explain the situation, and offer to buy them a round of drinks if I could move them to another location. This never failed and got me out of a lot of jams, but it's not as easy as some are suggesting where you just ask people to leave because you need the table. I had to a) have another place to move them to and b) cost the company a little bit of cash by comping the drinks.
How long were your reservation allocations, and what was the %% of reservations relative to overall capacity? Those are the factors which affect a lot
Sounds like those NYC places run close to 100% reserved...
I was basically 95% reservations. For obvious reasons, no reservations for the bar or patio (except during peak Covid reopening). We had two other tables in the main dining room that were walk-in only. We "allotted" 1h45m minutes for a 2-top (party of two), 2h for a 3 or 4-top, 2h30m for 5-6 top, 2h45m for 7+.
This reminds me of a classic Simpsons episode: