Not sure if a similar thread exists... I've not seen a lot of these but what are some examples of either partially controlled access, or no control of access six lane highways that effectively function as expressway or free-flowing highway routes (not an urban arterial with traffic signals), with at-grade intersections?
One example that comes to mind is US-58 between Suffolk and Chesapeake, VA. This is a major six lane highway that carries over 70,000 AADT with a posted speed limit of 60 mph, with a few minor intersections that have not been closed off / replaced with interchanges. While it effectively functions as a freeway in terms of traffic flow (no traffic signals, 70-75 mph traffic flow), it is not fully controlled access until reaching Suffolk to the west, where it drops to 4 lanes and becomes a freeway.
https://www.google.com/maps/@36.7759095,-76.4468916,263m/data=!3m1!1e3!5m1!1e1?entry=ttu
What other examples exist of similar situations?
In Seattle, SR 99 (Aurora Avenue) between the north end of the new tunnel and Green Lake basically functions like this. It has a median barrier (for the most part), a few slip ramps, tons of RIRO intersections, and high speeds.
In Massachusetts, US 1 north of the freeway section is 6 lanes until the I-95/128 interchange.
Quote from: Bruce on July 21, 2023, 03:22:19 AM
In Seattle, SR 99 (Aurora Avenue) between the north end of the new tunnel and Green Lake basically functions like this. It has a median barrier (for the most part), a few slip ramps, tons of RIRO intersections, and high speeds.
That's only four lanes, once you get off the bridge.
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on July 21, 2023, 03:34:26 AM
In Massachusetts, US 1 north of the freeway section is 6 lanes until the I-95/128 interchange.
I was typing this as you posted:
Five miles of US-1 in Saugus, north of Boston, is six lanes, has no traffic lights, and has grade separated interchanges with major roads, but it also has side streets and lots and lots of driveways accessible to only one side of the highway or the other. That's the only road like that in the Boston area I can think of that doesn't have traffic lights.
There are countless examples of four-lane versions of this, but when roads grow to six lanes, they usually either convert them to full freeway, or keep some of the traffic lights.
It's a very short route, but I'd say VA-289, the Franconia—Springfield Parkway, qualifies. It's six lanes, has a 50-mph speed limit with a lot of people doing 70+, and has two interchanges (three, if you count the one at its western end where it transitions to the four-lane VA-286), two at-grade intersections with traffic lights (three, if you count the one at its eastern end where it transitions to the four-lane Manchester Boulevard with a 35-mph speed limit), and one partial at-grade intersection with no traffic light that's intended to be more of a RIRO for westbound traffic with no general cross-median eastbound access except for emergency vehicles headed to the Inova emergency room located there.
Would most of Santa Clara County's expressway system be in this category? The two key exceptions are the Foothill Expressway and Central Expressway, both of which I recall are primarily 4 lanes.
Almaden Expressway (Santa Clara County Route G8) is like this from Ironwood Drive near to its north terminus at San Jose Avenue.
IL 13 between Marion and Carbondale is along these lines, but doesn't quite fit as there are signals at significant intersections. Access is partially restricted with RIROs, some frontage roads, and even one diamond interchange. Speed limit is 55 and traffic flows at 70+
Also there is still one remaining 4-lane section right at Crab Orchard Lake, but it is already scheduled for its conversion to 6-lane
In town in Marion and Carbondale 13 functions as a typical Urban Boulevard
US 360 between roughly Laburnum Ave & the Mechanicsville Bypass might qualify.
US 30 in Camden / Pennsauken, NJ is 6 lanes from the split with I-676 to the Linden St interchange, and 8 lanes from there to the US 130 concurrency. It has access to side streets, roadside gas stations, and other businesses, but no traffic lights or median crossovers, and NJ treats it as a freeway in terms of mile markers (every 0.2 miles, not every 0.5 miles).
Quote from: pderocco on July 21, 2023, 03:45:44 AM
Quote from: Bruce on July 21, 2023, 03:22:19 AM
In Seattle, SR 99 (Aurora Avenue) between the north end of the new tunnel and Green Lake basically functions like this. It has a median barrier (for the most part), a few slip ramps, tons of RIRO intersections, and high speeds.
That's only four lanes, once you get off the bridge.
It's six lanes from Mercer to Bridge Way, then six lanes again when you add the BAT lanes.
Quote from: Bruce on July 21, 2023, 03:46:51 PM
Quote from: pderocco on July 21, 2023, 03:45:44 AM
Quote from: Bruce on July 21, 2023, 03:22:19 AM
In Seattle, SR 99 (Aurora Avenue) between the north end of the new tunnel and Green Lake basically functions like this. It has a median barrier (for the most part), a few slip ramps, tons of RIRO intersections, and high speeds.
That's only four lanes, once you get off the bridge.
It's six lanes from Mercer to Bridge Way, then six lanes again when you add the BAT lanes.
That's a good example, if you count the bus lanes.
But even then, it shows how hard it is to find examples of this that are more than a couple miles long. That's about four miles.
Quote from: TheStranger on July 21, 2023, 08:49:29 AM
Would most of Santa Clara County's expressway system be in this category? The two key exceptions are the Foothill Expressway and Central Expressway, both of which I recall are primarily 4 lanes.
The bit of G8 Max mentioned could qualify as full freeway, as it has no driveways or perpendicular streets intersecting it. I don't see any other things in that area that meet the criteria, although I might have missed something.
If we're going to strain for examples, there's Friar's Rd in San Diego, from Frazee Rd to River Run Dr., about 1.5 miles. It almost qualifies as full freeway, given the ramp nature of the intersections, but there's one driveway right next to the I-805 overpass which you can make a left turn into.
Quote from: pderocco on July 21, 2023, 06:00:39 PM
Quote from: TheStranger on July 21, 2023, 08:49:29 AM
Would most of Santa Clara County's expressway system be in this category? The two key exceptions are the Foothill Expressway and Central Expressway, both of which I recall are primarily 4 lanes.
The bit of G8 Max mentioned could qualify as full freeway, as it has no driveways or perpendicular streets intersecting it. I don't see any other things in that area that meet the criteria, although I might have missed
Those hellacious right-on/right-offs at Canoas Garden Avenue would be a pretty loose fit for freeway standards. But yes, they're really anything in that segment like a traditional at-grade intersection. I do like the exit from the southbound lanes for Angela Street Auto Plaza.
This is how the Garden State Parkway operated around Interchanges 9, 10 & 11 (actually intersections with traffic lights) and RIROs a number of years ago. 6 lanes and no shoulders, a 55 mph limit long ago that was reduced to 50 mph in the 90's. Today, it's a normal 4 lane freeway with a 65 MPH limit.
NJ 17 in the northern part of NJ operates fairly reasonably like what the OP describes, along with other examples of "Jersey Freeways" throughout the state in which there are no or few traffic lights but have full access to businesses along the right side of the roadway. Traffic can generally move at highway speeds, often supported with 55 mph limits, which compared to other states is probably generously high considering the amount of traffic and parking lot/side road access points that exist.
My instant thought of an example for this thread was US 90 ALT on the SW side of Houston. Between FM 359 in Richmond and I-610, the route is 3 or more lanes each way. Most major intersections on the route are handled with interchanges, and there is a median divider, but there are countless driveways, business entrances, and conflict points (such as a fire station (https://goo.gl/maps/wkeYWshEHqD9rZAJ7)!) on the route. It's about as close to a freeway as you can get without actually being one.
Quote from: sprjus4 on July 21, 2023, 01:55:55 AM
Not sure if a similar thread exists... I've not seen a lot of these but what are some examples of either partially controlled access, or no control of access six lane highways that effectively function as expressway or free-flowing highway routes (not an urban arterial with traffic signals), with at-grade intersections?
So for this thread where is the line being drawn between an expressway with traffic signals versus an urban/suburban arterial?
Due to a RI-RO disqualifying it from being a full freeway, there's SB IL 83 in DuPage County from 31st Street to US 34.
Mannheim Road at O'Hare Airport has six lanes, a 50 MPH speed limit, and a mix of interchanges and at-grade intersections. So yes, it certainly meets those criteria.
There's also NJ 208 in Paramus. New Jersey seems to have a lot of examples.
MO 94 between MO 364 and I-70 got widened from 4 to 6 lanes recently, so I guess that counts for this thread
I thought traffic signals disqualified a route from this list.
I never wanted to set any hard restrictions or qualifiers (besides generally being high speed 6 lanes that's not a full freeway), I just wanted to have an open discussion with different examples of potentials.
As far as traffic signals, I think they're okay as long as it doesn't diminish the routes ability to allow free-flowing traffic most of the time. A signal here and there I think is okay, but if they're every mile or something, continuous, it begins detracting from a road's ability to provide free-flowing traffic. Especially if the signals are at other major roads. Minor cross streets with signals, and interchanges at large intersections, for example, would be okay.
So, I'll float out there a series of higher-speed highways in and around metro Detroit, including:
- Grand River Ave between Novi and Telegraph Rd
- Ford Rd between Telegraph Rd and Miller Rd in Dearborn
- Woodward Ave between McNichols Rd in Detroit and Pontiac
- Mound Rd between Davison St in Detroit and Utica Rd in Utica
- M-59 (Hall Rd) between Utica and I-94
The common design elements with these roadways:
- Wide medians to accommodate R-cut (Michigan Left) turns, so that protected left turns at signals are not required
- Two-phase signals at all signalized intersections. You may two sets of signals (one for the Michigan Left, then the main intersection), but only two phases.
- Wide ROW to accommodate the Michigan Lefts, future freeway conversion, and/or light rail
- Strict signal timing - signals are timed to favor the main roadway; once you hit a green signal you tend to keep it.
- 45 to 55 mph speed limits
Major intersections (like freeways, Telegraph @ 8 Mile) are handled with interchanges, some with an extensive series of ramps.
Quote from: Henry on July 21, 2023, 10:43:16 PM
Mannheim Road at O'Hare Airport has six lanes, a 50 MPH speed limit, and a mix of interchanges and at-grade intersections. So yes, it certainly meets those criteria.
And IL 83 between US 34 and Oakton St. DuPage and Cook Co.
The most infamous six-plus lane expressway (by the California definition; the limited-access roads in the country in comparison are called "expressways" with the exception of Skyway) in the Philippines is EDSA, a ring road around Manila, which contains a mix of intersections, flyovers, and tons of business driveways. While it ostensibly looks like a bypass of the City of Manila, it passes near Makati's CBD and through the heart of Quezon City's Cubao entertainment/hotel district, as well as near the commercial buildup around the SM North EDSA mall and the Ortigas CBD (shared between the three cities of Quezon City/Pasig/Mandaluyong.
The segment through the city of Makati is the closest thing the Philippines has to a jersey freeway: no stoplights or intersections between Tramo Street (Aurora Boulevard) all the way to the Pasig River, but some RIRO junctions, along with multiple interchanges.
North of the Pasig River, the awkward combination of occasional flyovers, actual intersections, and ad-hoc reconfigurations have made it a regular parking lot - which is what made the completion of Skyway in Manila's city limits in late 2020 so important, finally providing an interregional link from south to north that bypassed Cubao, North EDSA and Ortigas in their entirety.
The next ring road, C-5, also has a similar layout (full freeway or being actively built as one between CAVITEX and Bonifacio Global City, but surface expressway up to Quezon City) and similar traffic problems.
NY 104 west of the Genesee River comes to mind.
So does the surface portion of the Sunrise Hwy on Long Island.
Quote from: JREwing78 on July 23, 2023, 08:36:41 PM
So, I'll float out there a series of higher-speed highways in and around metro Detroit, including:
- Grand River Ave between Novi and Telegraph Rd
- Ford Rd between Telegraph Rd and Miller Rd in Dearborn
- Woodward Ave between McNichols Rd in Detroit and Pontiac
- Mound Rd between Davison St in Detroit and Utica Rd in Utica
- M-59 (Hall Rd) between Utica and I-94
All of these are loaded with signals, especially Grand River Avenue and M-59. You can get a decent run on Woodward, Telegraph, and maybe Mound if traffic isn't backed up and the signals are actually in sync (there frequently are at least a couple out of whack). That stretch of Grand River particularly is an exercise in patience.
The one in metro Detroit that comes closest to the OP's intent is the 4.2-mile north-south stretch of M-5 in Novi and Commerce Township. Eight lanes between I-96 and north of Maple, and six lanes for the final .75 mile. Only three traffic signals (at the "mile" roads) and they actually are synchronized in both directions for the posted 55 mph speed limit.
Not quite the same, I suppose - but West Virginia has rural divided non-freeway highway portions of at least US-19 that have 3 lanes in the same direction to allow for climbing lanes.
Quote from: RobbieL2415 on August 29, 2023, 02:57:24 PM
NY 104 west of the Genesee River comes to mind.
So does the surface portion of the Sunrise Hwy on Long Island.
The first example just looks like a freeway to me.
The second example has tons of signals, which wasn't the point of the thread.
Quote from: jakeroot on September 08, 2023, 01:40:06 AM
Quote from: RobbieL2415 on August 29, 2023, 02:57:24 PM
NY 104 west of the Genesee River comes to mind.
So does the surface portion of the Sunrise Hwy on Long Island.
The first example just looks like a freeway to me.
West of the river isn't freeway... although it does appear to be more an urban arterial than an expressway.