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Regional Boards => Northeast => Topic started by: SidS1045 on October 30, 2023, 02:50:52 PM

Title: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: SidS1045 on October 30, 2023, 02:50:52 PM
Recently the signs on North Avenue/Walkers Brook Drive at I-95 in Wakefield and Reading were replaced.  Where paddle signs would have been used before, they were replaced with ground-mounted signs constructed with what looks like a design similar to BGS's on the mainline interstates, although much smaller, on two uprights.  Has MassDOT finally retired the paddle sign design, or was this a one-off?
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: SectorZ on October 30, 2023, 02:53:22 PM
They've been put up on Woburn St in Lowell where it junctions with I-495, so those signs have spread to some other areas I am aware of.
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: Alps on October 30, 2023, 11:25:57 PM
photos plz
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: bob7374 on October 30, 2023, 11:29:20 PM
Here's an example of the new type of guide signage seen along Derby Street in Hingham:
(https://malmeroads.net/mass21c/derbystproj721a.JPG)
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: cockroachking on October 31, 2023, 12:28:50 AM
I passed a similar one approaching the new roundabout with US-7 on MA-23 EB/MA-41 NB in Great Barrington this summer:
(https://i.imgur.com/mcD728h.jpg)
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: Alps on October 31, 2023, 07:26:39 PM
Quote from: bob7374 on October 30, 2023, 11:29:20 PM
Here's an example of the new type of guide signage seen along Derby Street in Hingham:
(https://malmeroads.net/mass21c/derbystproj721a.JPG)
I would call those LGS not BGS. But all of that is just language we use here.
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: storm2k on November 02, 2023, 08:30:26 PM
We need some sort of classification like Mini-BGS. Those look like full on extruded metal signs with metal supports, just smaller.
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: cockroachking on November 02, 2023, 10:16:29 PM
Quote from: storm2k on November 02, 2023, 08:30:26 PM
We need some sort of classification like Mini-BGS. Those look like full on extruded metal signs with metal supports, just smaller.
They are BGS's without the B, if you will.
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: PHLBOS on November 08, 2023, 07:55:40 PM
Quote from: SidS1045 on October 30, 2023, 02:50:52 PM
Has MassDOT finally retired the paddle sign design, or was this a one-off?
Based on what I've seen on recent visits; the paddle-style signs are still used for the ENTERING bookleaf panels as well as green panels where the sign message & lettering can still fit.

The change to the MUTCD standards that now require use of mixed-case lettering on smaller guide signs was likely the reasoning why MassDOT introduced the new style panels & posts.
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: Mergingtraffic on November 21, 2023, 07:39:55 PM
Still an all text paddle sign from 1993 in Salem, MA.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53261452216_2870f818b7_k.jpg)
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: mariethefoxy on November 22, 2023, 07:18:00 AM
Quote from: Mergingtraffic on November 21, 2023, 07:39:55 PM
Still an all text paddle sign from 1993 in Salem, MA.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53261452216_2870f818b7_k.jpg)

oh wow, they were using that older style with the mileages in the sign well into the 90s?
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: PHLBOS on November 27, 2023, 06:52:51 PM
Quote from: mariethefoxy on November 22, 2023, 07:18:00 AM
Quote from: Mergingtraffic on November 21, 2023, 07:39:55 PM
Still an all text paddle sign from 1993 in Salem, MA.
(https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53261452216_2870f818b7_k.jpg)

oh wow, they were using that older style with the mileages in the sign well into the 90s?
Even more interesting was that the long-gone cut-corner predecessor signage for this area had the 114 westbound mileage listed as:
PEABODY 3
DANVERS 4
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: RobbieL2415 on November 30, 2023, 08:11:12 AM
The text-only paddle signs lasted well into the 00s on the Cape. I miss them.
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: 5foot14 on July 17, 2024, 10:53:30 AM
The junctions of 114, 125 and 133 in Andover still has paddle signs that are all text with the mileages...

Andover Paddle Signs GSV (https://maps.app.goo.gl/c13kyjZEJdNo1SFn7)
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: Ted$8roadFan on July 18, 2024, 05:27:40 AM
I've seen these signs for most of my life, but never knew until now that they were called paddle signs, lol. In my experience, they still exist but now use Route shields and a different font, assuming they fit the criteria. I do kinda miss the old school all-text ones, though IIR they weren't as sturdy as the new ones hopefully are.
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: RobbieL2415 on July 18, 2024, 07:10:05 AM
Quote from: Ted$8roadFan on July 18, 2024, 05:27:40 AMI've seen these signs for most of my life, but never knew until now that they were called paddle signs, lol. In my experience, they still exist but now use Route shields and a different font, assuming they fit the criteria. I do kinda miss the old school all-text ones, though IIR they weren't as sturdy as the new ones hopefully are.
Some of those old-style paddle signs were wooden, IIRC
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: Ted$8roadFan on July 18, 2024, 02:18:30 PM
Quote from: RobbieL2415 on July 18, 2024, 07:10:05 AM
Quote from: Ted$8roadFan on July 18, 2024, 05:27:40 AMI've seen these signs for most of my life, but never knew until now that they were called paddle signs, lol. In my experience, they still exist but now use Route shields and a different font, assuming they fit the criteria. I do kinda miss the old school all-text ones, though IIR they weren't as sturdy as the new ones hopefully are.
Some of those old-style paddle signs were wooden, IIRC

Yes, they were. You could tell they were wooden after years of harsh weather had taken their toll.
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: kramie13 on July 22, 2024, 09:51:28 AM
I prefer Mass DOT use trailblazers at intersections, like seen here (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.1109385,-71.243832,3a,41.2y,297.25h,92.91t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sp_glrEsLqPvVOTD4wZoGyA!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3Dp_glrEsLqPvVOTD4wZoGyA%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D306.75247%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205409&entry=ttu).

The state or US route shield inside a green sign looks ugly.
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: Rothman on July 22, 2024, 11:30:55 AM
Quote from: kramie13 on July 22, 2024, 09:51:28 AMI prefer Mass DOT use trailblazers at intersections, like seen here (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.1109385,-71.243832,3a,41.2y,297.25h,92.91t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sp_glrEsLqPvVOTD4wZoGyA!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3Dp_glrEsLqPvVOTD4wZoGyA%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D306.75247%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205409&entry=ttu).

The state or US route shield inside a green sign looks ugly.

Pfft.  Getouttaheah. 

Replacing the paddle signs with trailblazers has been a recent development in MA and MA sucks at them after decades of the paddle.

Try to follow US 202, MA 116 or MA 141 through Holyoke.  Eesh.
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: SectorZ on July 22, 2024, 04:21:46 PM
Quote from: kramie13 on July 22, 2024, 09:51:28 AMI prefer Mass DOT use trailblazers at intersections, like seen here (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.1109385,-71.243832,3a,41.2y,297.25h,92.91t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sp_glrEsLqPvVOTD4wZoGyA!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3Dp_glrEsLqPvVOTD4wZoGyA%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D306.75247%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205409&entry=ttu).

The state or US route shield inside a green sign looks ugly.

At least when a green sign is used you don't have two signs leaning in two different directions partially covering each other like in this example.
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: CapeCodder on July 24, 2024, 05:47:41 AM
Quote from: Rothman on July 22, 2024, 11:30:55 AM
Quote from: kramie13 on July 22, 2024, 09:51:28 AMI prefer Mass DOT use trailblazers at intersections, like seen here (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.1109385,-71.243832,3a,41.2y,297.25h,92.91t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sp_glrEsLqPvVOTD4wZoGyA!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3Dp_glrEsLqPvVOTD4wZoGyA%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D306.75247%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192?coh=205409&entry=ttu).

The state or US route shield inside a green sign looks ugly.

Pfft.  Getouttaheah. 

Replacing the paddle signs with trailblazers has been a recent development in MA and MA sucks at them after decades of the paddle.

Try to follow US 202, MA 116 or MA 141 through Holyoke.  Eesh.

I prefer their old paddles with the number "riding" the arrow i.e --132-->
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: 5foot14 on July 26, 2024, 11:50:12 AM
Quote from: Rothman on July 22, 2024, 11:30:55 AMReplacing the paddle signs with trailblazers has been a recent development in MA and MA sucks at them after decades of the paddle.

Paddle signs are alive and well and the state is not replacing them with trailblazers. It really just depends on the intersection and how much information needs to be conveyed. Trailblazers at minor intersections have been done here forever. They're not a new thing.

What they are doing is implementing their new guide sign standards to replace the paddle sign standard. Basically an extruded aluminum sign, about the size of a paddle sign, that combines both panels into 1 with either 1 or 2 supports. They've been popping up all over and with new sign replacement projects.

Quote from: Rothman on July 22, 2024, 11:30:55 AMTry to follow US 202, MA 116 or MA 141 through Holyoke.  Eesh.

None of those are maintained by MassDOT, except the bridges over the river and canals. YMMV when it comes to town maintenance.
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: Rothman on July 26, 2024, 03:29:27 PM
Quote from: 5foot14 on July 26, 2024, 11:50:12 AM
Quote from: Rothman on July 22, 2024, 11:30:55 AMReplacing the paddle signs with trailblazers has been a recent development in MA and MA sucks at them after decades of the paddle.

Paddle signs are alive and well and the state is not replacing them with trailblazers. It really just depends on the intersection and how much information needs to be conveyed. Trailblazers at minor intersections have been done here forever. They're not a new thing.


Baloney.  I've seen more paddle signs swapped out for trailblazers over the past 20 years or so than the thirty years prior.

QuoteWhat they are doing is implementing their new guide sign standards to replace the paddle sign standard. Basically an extruded aluminum sign, about the size of a paddle sign, that combines both panels into 1 with either 1 or 2 supports. They've been popping up all over and with new sign replacement projects.

Quote from: Rothman on July 22, 2024, 11:30:55 AMTry to follow US 202, MA 116 or MA 141 through Holyoke.  Eesh.

None of those are maintained by MassDOT, except the bridges over the river and canals. YMMV when it comes to town maintenance.

This sounds like a MassDOT/Legislature issue.  Blaming the towns for not maintaining good signage for state highways isn't a good look (MassDOT = "It's their fault and we're not going to do anything about it.").  If that's the stance, start and end State highway designations along with the maintenance swaps.
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: vdeane on July 26, 2024, 09:21:59 PM
Quote from: Rothman on July 26, 2024, 03:29:27 PMThis sounds like a MassDOT/Legislature issue.  Blaming the towns for not maintaining good signage for state highways isn't a good look (MassDOT = "It's their fault and we're not going to do anything about it.").  If that's the stance, start and end State highway designations along with the maintenance swaps.
How is navigating US 11 south through Syracuse these days?
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: Rothman on July 26, 2024, 10:41:44 PM
Quote from: vdeane on July 26, 2024, 09:21:59 PM
Quote from: Rothman on July 26, 2024, 03:29:27 PMThis sounds like a MassDOT/Legislature issue.  Blaming the towns for not maintaining good signage for state highways isn't a good look (MassDOT = "It's their fault and we're not going to do anything about it.").  If that's the stance, start and end State highway designations along with the maintenance swaps.
How is navigating US 11 south through Syracuse these days?

Like I've bemoaned elsewhere on the forum myself, miserable. :D
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: PHLBOS on July 31, 2024, 04:44:03 PM
Quote from: 5foot14 on July 17, 2024, 10:53:30 AMThe junctions of 114, 125 and 133 in Andover still has paddle signs that are all text with the mileages...

Andover Paddle Signs GSV (https://maps.app.goo.gl/c13kyjZEJdNo1SFn7)
Those look to be 80s vintage.

Example of a relatively new Paddle-style LGS at along MA 129 at the I-95 (MA 128) interchange. (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.5264461,-71.0804222,3a,75y,321.06h,75.1t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sX0R8hdG1VopC-RaNALyRhg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192!5m1!1e1?coh=205409&entry=ttu)

Long story short: such are still made.
Title: Re: Massachusetts paddle signs
Post by: bob7374 on July 31, 2024, 10:35:47 PM
Quote from: PHLBOS on July 31, 2024, 04:44:03 PM
Quote from: 5foot14 on July 17, 2024, 10:53:30 AMThe junctions of 114, 125 and 133 in Andover still has paddle signs that are all text with the mileages...

Andover Paddle Signs GSV (https://maps.app.goo.gl/c13kyjZEJdNo1SFn7)
Those look to be 80s vintage.

Example of a relatively new Paddle-style LGS at along MA 129 at the I-95 (MA 128) interchange. (https://www.google.com/maps/@42.5264461,-71.0804222,3a,75y,321.06h,75.1t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sX0R8hdG1VopC-RaNALyRhg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192!5m1!1e1?coh=205409&entry=ttu)

Long story short: such are still made.
Combination of old and new style guide signs just down the road (https://maps.app.goo.gl/e8XTAgBhS562EszNA).