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National Boards => General Highway Talk => Topic started by: Grzrd on September 02, 2010, 02:03:47 PM

Title: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: Grzrd on September 02, 2010, 02:03:47 PM
About 5 years ago, I took my wife and two sons down Shafer Trail Road in Canyonlands N.P.  I fell prey to the "Dad, don't be a wuss!" challenge from the younger ones.  Rented vehicle.  Sketchy brakes.  No personal digital photos at this moment, but here's a link to other photos:

http://www.tripadvisor.com/LocationPhotos-g143016-d144932-Shafer_Trail-Canyonlands_National_Park_Utah.html

That was the most adrenalin-rush/ terrifying drive I have had where I have been behind the wheel.

What other "thrill-seeking" routes are recommended for the faint, and not-so-faint, of heart?
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: agentsteel53 on September 02, 2010, 02:05:23 PM
US-550.

From Silverton to Ouray.

In December.

At night.

In a blizzard.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: J N Winkler on September 02, 2010, 03:07:49 PM
My vote perennially goes to NM 159 at dusk in winter with snowmelt and ice on the road.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: corco on September 02, 2010, 03:52:28 PM
When it's snowing, I honestly prefer those windy back narrow roads. I'm very confident in my own ability to not drive into the ditch- it's the other cars doing something stupid to force me to brake suddenly that I'm worried about. I've driven Idaho 55 through the canyon at night when not plowed while snowing on many many occasions- you just go slow and it's not a big deal. I literally learned to drive on bad roads- most of my driver's ed was during the winter in the Idaho mountains. I've driven tens of thousands of miles (if not one hundred thousand) on bad roads and have never gone off the road due to something within my control. The only time I went off, some asshat pulled out of his driveway right in front of me, leaving me no choice but to slam my brakes. Going off the road was probably the best scenario there- had the pavement been dry I would have rear-ended his sorry ass. My fear in those situations, then, is other cars, not the road.

For me, the worst drives are blizzards on the interstate- I-80 from Laramie to Cheyenne can be downright scary in a blizzard- trucks don't have to go quite as slow on bad roads due to their weight (although the wind usually offsets that and they end up sideways in the ditch anyway), so you get a ton of trucks driving by at ridiculously fast speeds and then morons from out of state (*cough*Texas*cough*California*cough*Colorado(usually TX/CA implants, but there's enough of those now that you have to be scared of Colorado plates)*cough*) who think it's acceptable to go 80 when there's three inches of snow on the road, who you also see in the ditch three miles later- but that makes it uncomfortable for me. If they start to go out of control right in front of me, then I'll have to make unplanned evasive maneuvers (likely involving braking instead of giving the car gas/letting off the gas, which is the only way to maintain traction), and at ~50 MPH in the snow there's a good risk of ending up in the ditch. I'll take the narrow winding mountain road in a blizzard over the interstate in a blizzard 8 days a week. Even if the backroad isn't quite as well plowed as the interstate- it's totally worth the tradeoff for me.

When I'm in bad roads, my priorities are
1) Keep the car on the road
2) Worry about a bunch of crap

On the interstate, I have to do a lot more 2) than on the backroads, where I can devote 99% of my attention to keeping the car on the road.  
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: myosh_tino on September 02, 2010, 04:29:32 PM
Quote from: agentsteel53 on September 02, 2010, 02:05:23 PM
US-550.

From Silverton to Ouray.

In December.

At night.

In a blizzard.
I think that stretch of highway was featured on "Dangerous Drives" on the Speed Channel.  I ran across it by chance and I ended up watching the whole show.  Very scenic highway however seeing how close the drop-off is to the side of the road and the blind curves, I can see how this would be thrillseeking in good weather.  In bad weather (like a blizzard), this drive isn't thrillseeking, it's borderline suicidal.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: agentsteel53 on September 02, 2010, 04:36:18 PM
the road is much more dangerous in good weather.  that's when all the RVs come out.

I saw no cars between Silverton and Ouray.  none.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: myosh_tino on September 02, 2010, 04:41:12 PM
Quote from: agentsteel53 on September 02, 2010, 04:36:18 PM
the road is much more dangerous in good weather.  that's when all the RVs come out.

I saw no cars between Silverton and Ouray.  none.
You make a good point.  In good weather, the tourists are probably gawking at the stunning scenery instead of paying attention to the road... not good!  The TV show I saw featured a motorcycle group, two gasoline tanker trucks driven by a father-and-son tandem, an ambulance driver responding to an emergency and a CDOT maintenance crew doing work on the highway.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: Brandon on September 02, 2010, 05:33:25 PM
Quote from: agentsteel53 on September 02, 2010, 02:05:23 PM
US-550.

From Silverton to Ouray.

In December.

At night.

In a blizzard.

Gotta love the Million Dollar Highway.  :cool:
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: kj3400 on September 03, 2010, 10:34:58 AM
I remember taking CO 83 with a friend from Co. Springs to Parker just outside Denver because I-25 was closed. It was 2 in the morning and there was a blizzard. Driving with a truck w/ trailer in front of you and snow flying towards you, in danger because that truck might stop at any time and you might not be able to see it, is not something I'm likely to forget soon. We followed that truck for at least 10-15 miles.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: hbelkins on September 04, 2010, 12:26:55 AM
My brother just drove the Mount Washington Auto Road in New Hampshire. He said it was the scariest road he had ever been on, even moreso than the Moki Dugway.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: Ian on September 04, 2010, 07:32:43 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on September 04, 2010, 12:26:55 AM
My brother just drove the Mount Washington Auto Road in New Hampshire. He said it was the scariest road he had ever been on, even moreso than the Moki Dugway.

It's a frightening ride, but at the same time, it's pretty neat.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: Hot Rod Hootenanny on September 05, 2010, 01:58:03 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on September 04, 2010, 12:26:55 AM
My brother just drove the Mount Washington Auto Road in New Hampshire. He said it was the scariest road he had ever been on, even moreso than the Moki Dugway.

When I did my roadtrip through New England 10 years ago, I stopped at Mt. Washington, looked at it from the base and decided I would pay for someone else to drive me to the top.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: mightyace on September 07, 2010, 04:23:27 PM
If I ever go to Mount Washington, I'm taking the train!

http://www.thecog.com/

Pikes Peak, CO is the other mountain in the US with both a road and a cog railway up it.  (http://www.cograilway.com/)  I hear the road up that is a bit tricky as well.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: thenetwork on September 07, 2010, 11:54:30 PM
If you ever are in the neighborhood of I-70 and Idaho Springs west of Denver, there is a road connecting Idaho Springs with Central City (where the casinos are) called "Oh My God Road".  That road took a little white knuckling to conquer.   X-(

Another test of nerves is off of US 50 between Grand Junction and Delta, CO called "Lands End Road" which links the Grand Valley to the Grand Mesa.   ;-)
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: J N Winkler on September 08, 2010, 04:01:23 AM
I don't understand why the Million Dollar Highway portion of US 550 gets all the press.  I have just spent fifteen minutes looking at various bits of it in Google Street View and all I see are lengths of two-lane highway, generally paved to a good standard, with centerline, 12' lanes, shoulder stripes, 2' full paved shoulders giving way to reasonably level gravel, and the occasional climbing lane.  I did see a few 30 MPH speed limit signs but that is pretty unexceptional for mountain pass roads in Colorado.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: Chris on September 08, 2010, 05:59:37 AM
Swiss Mountain Passes.

For example: Splügen Pass:

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcommondatastorage.googleapis.com%2Fstatic.panoramio.com%2Fphotos%2Foriginal%2F11083328.jpg&hash=4a0b45d4a146330f2c999a649e750178eb0a7027)
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: thenetwork on September 08, 2010, 09:31:27 AM
Quote from: J N Winkler on September 08, 2010, 04:01:23 AM
I don't understand why the Million Dollar Highway portion of US 550 gets all the press.  I have just spent fifteen minutes looking at various bits of it in Google Street View and all I see are lengths of two-lane highway, generally paved to a good standard, with centerline, 12' lanes, shoulder stripes, 2' full paved shoulders giving way to reasonably level gravel, and the occasional climbing lane.  I did see a few 30 MPH speed limit signs but that is pretty unexceptional for mountain pass roads in Colorado.

I just drove it this past weekend, and while many parts of it are truly enjoyable and easy to negotiate (in good weather), there are some areas (especially between Ouray & Silverton) where the road is narrow with nary a shoulder on either side -- due to a rock wall on the left and a 200+ foot drop on the right with no guardrails and nowhere to build up a shoulder, literally. 

Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: Grzrd on September 08, 2010, 10:22:23 AM
Quote from: mightyace on September 07, 2010, 04:23:27 PM
If I ever go to Mount Washington, I'm taking the train!

http://www.thecog.com/

Pikes Peak, CO is the other mountain in the US with both a road and a cog railway up it.  (http://www.cograilway.com/)  I hear the road up that is a bit tricky as well.
Don't overlook the venerable Lookout Mountain Incline! Short, but steep (72.7% grade at top): http://www.ridetheincline.com/

Road to top of Mount Evans in CO (IIRC CO's highest peak) is also daunting for those of us who hail from east of the Mississippi.  On same trip I drove Shafer Trail Rd., I had the following notion to start off family trip with the WOW moment: Fly from ATL, then drive rental directly from Denver to top of Mount Evans.  From 1500 ft. to 14,000+ ft in a matter of hours.  Not a good idea.  Started getting lightheaded and sick-in-stomach at top.  Had to drive down IMMEDIATELY to get thicker air.  I later tried to use that experience as an excuse to not do Shafer Trail Road; however, my younger son would have none of it: "Dad, this is a downhill drive."

BTW, it is possible (and more sensible) to access Shafer Trail Road from closer to Moab for a relatively level drive through some of the mid-canyon area of Canyonlands and avoid the canyon-wall climb part of the road. 
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: mightyace on September 08, 2010, 10:42:10 AM
Quote from: Grzrd on September 08, 2010, 10:22:23 AM
Don't overlook the venerable Lookout Mountain Incline! Short, but steep (72.7% grade at top): http://www.ridetheincline.com/

Two comments:
1) The Lookout Mountain Incline is a different type of "railroad" called a funicular railroad.  They usually have two cars on a cable powered by a stationary engine.  The cars counterweight each other.  One goes up while the other goes down and they meet in the middle.  They can run much steeper grades than traditional or cog railroads.  There are many examples of this type including 2 in Pittsburgh; 1 at Horseshoe Curve near Altoona; Los Angeles; Shorewood, WI; etc.

2) But mainly, the cog railway reminded me that the highway alternatives at Pike Peak, like Mount Washington, is hazardous.  By comparison, the roads up Lookout Mountain are rather tame.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: J N Winkler on September 08, 2010, 11:24:24 AM
Quote from: thenetwork on September 08, 2010, 09:31:27 AMI just drove it this past weekend, and while many parts of it are truly enjoyable and easy to negotiate (in good weather), there are some areas (especially between Ouray & Silverton) where the road is narrow with nary a shoulder on either side -- due to a rock wall on the left and a 200+ foot drop on the right with no guardrails and nowhere to build up a shoulder, literally.

I looked only at the bits between Ouray and Silverton, because those are supposed to be the worst parts of the Million Dollar Highway, and every segment I looked at--with the sole exception of an uphill length with climbing lane--had a shoulder on both sides.  Admittedly it was not wide (two feet at most, I would say), but it was there.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: agentsteel53 on September 08, 2010, 11:26:42 AM
Quote from: J N Winkler on September 08, 2010, 11:24:24 AM


I looked only at the bits between Ouray and Silverton, because those are supposed to be the worst parts of the Million Dollar Highway, and every segment I looked at--with the sole exception of an uphill length with climbing lane--had a shoulder on both sides.  Admittedly it was not wide (two feet at most, I would say), but it was there.

there is, however, no guardrail in a lot of places ... and a cliff drop past those two feet.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: agentsteel53 on September 08, 2010, 11:35:45 AM
Quote from: Grzrd on September 08, 2010, 10:22:23 AM
Don't overlook the venerable Lookout Mountain Incline! Short, but steep (72.7% grade at top): http://www.ridetheincline.com/


is that just the railroad, or is the automobile road just as steep??  72.7% sounds like it's just physically impossible to drive up!  

I think the most I've ever driven is about 43% on a road in Iceland that, if not for its utter obscurity, would count as a thrillseeking drive.  I had to keep the car in 4WD, low gearing the whole way up, doing about 3mph at 3400 RPM.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: mightyace on September 08, 2010, 11:40:38 AM
Quote from: agentsteel53 on September 08, 2010, 11:35:45 AM
Quote from: Grzrd on September 08, 2010, 10:22:23 AM
Don't overlook the venerable Lookout Mountain Incline! Short, but steep (72.7% grade at top): http://www.ridetheincline.com/


is that just the railroad, or is the automobile road just as steep??  72.7% sounds like it's just physically impossible to drive up!  

Just the railroad.  The automobile road grades are rather moderate.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: Grzrd on September 08, 2010, 11:51:16 AM
Quote from: agentsteel53 on September 08, 2010, 11:35:45 AM
I think the most I've ever driven is about 43% on a road in Iceland that, if not for its utter obscurity, would count as a thrillseeking drive.  I had to keep the car in 4WD, low gearing the whole way up, doing about 3mph at 3400 RPM.
I thoroughly welcome obscurity!  :sombrero:
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: texaskdog on May 21, 2014, 11:59:40 AM
Quote from: thenetwork on September 07, 2010, 11:54:30 PM
If you ever are in the neighborhood of I-70 and Idaho Springs west of Denver, there is a road connecting Idaho Springs with Central City (where the casinos are) called "Oh My God Road".  That road took a little white knuckling to conquer.   X-(

Another test of nerves is off of US 50 between Grand Junction and Delta, CO called "Lands End Road" which links the Grand Valley to the Grand Mesa.   ;-)

I dont remember this road being a challenge at all.

Mount Evans has been the worst, followed by Moki Dugway.  I'd have to think beyond that.  Mount Washburn in Yellowstone was another good one.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: oscar on May 21, 2014, 12:47:04 PM
Quote from: agentsteel53 on September 08, 2010, 11:26:42 AM
Quote from: J N Winkler on September 08, 2010, 11:24:24 AM
I looked only at the bits between Ouray and Silverton, because those are supposed to be the worst parts of the Million Dollar Highway, and every segment I looked at--with the sole exception of an uphill length with climbing lane--had a shoulder on both sides.  Admittedly it was not wide (two feet at most, I would say), but it was there.

there is, however, no guardrail in a lot of places ... and a cliff drop past those two feet.

When I drove it in 1996 or 1998, you could also see wrecked cars that slid down the cliff.   Don't know if the wrecks got removed since then, but I hope not -- useful both as a warning and to enhance the thrill.

Three more candidates:

-- On Maui, parts of the Piilani Highway (CR 31) between Kaupo and Kipahulu/Oheo Gulch (http://www.hawaiihighways.com/photos-Piilani-Hwy.htm).  Mostly a one-lane road carved into the side of a cliff, with pebbles sometimes pelting your roof from above (something all the tourists going with the top down in their white rental convertibles must not have been warned about), and not enough guardrails to keep you out of the ocean.  You also have to share the road with wide tour buses, best not to go counter-clockwise in the afternoon when all the tour buses are going clockwise on their way back to central Maui after the stop at tourist-trap Oheo Gulch.

-- On the opposite corner of Maui, the county-owned part of the Kahekili Highway through Kahahuloa village (http://www.hawaiihighways.com/photos-Kahekili-Hwy.htm).  Just as narrow and twisty as the Piilani Highway segment above, with better pavement but no lane striping and few guardrails to help keep you on the road.

-- FM 170 between Presidio TX and the west entrance to Big Bend National Park.  A real roller-coaster.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: J N Winkler on May 21, 2014, 12:48:20 PM
Notwithstanding comments from Agentsteel53 and Thenetwork upthread, back in 2010 I dismissed the idea that US 550 could be nerve-wracking to drive.  In 2012, however, I drove the full length between Durango and Ridgway, including the portion between Silverton and Ouray that passes through the Uncompahgre Gorge and includes the corniche sections described above:

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.sabre-roads.org.uk%2Fwiki%2Fimages%2F1%2F11%2FIMG_1294.JPG&hash=99138d7ced2debf51f97baf38dca8dba15e95eae)

I still feel, though, that US 550--through visually stunning--was a much easier drive than is normally advertised.  This is largely because it is so sinuous that operating speeds are fairly low (generally no greater than 35 MPH), and therefore in a speed range where the typical motorist is prepared to accept much more lateral acceleration (and thus more variation from the hands-off speed for any given curve) than is the case at higher speeds.  The roads that are nerve-wracking to drive, though not necessarily thrilling, tend to be ones which combine fairly sharp curves with very high operating speeds.  As an example, a curve with a 70-MPH advisory speed on a freeway with a 75-MPH speed limit is a much bigger deal than a curve with a 35-MPH advisory speed on a 40-MPH road.

On the same trip I took US 160 across the Wolf Creek Pass and left those 10 miles feeling much more tense and amped-up than after the 82 miles on US 550 between Durango and Ridgway.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: texaskdog on May 21, 2014, 01:51:20 PM
http://bit.ly/QRPv1R  the worst I've ever seen (hope it works)
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: corco on May 21, 2014, 02:38:38 PM
I agree with Winkler whole-heartedly on that. Mountain roads aren't that scary when the typical operating speed is low- they're far scarier when you can get up to a high speed on straightaways.

I don't have any street view or photos, unfortunately, but the Salmon River Rd east of Riggins, Idaho gets my vote. If there ever were a roadmeet in the mountains of Idaho for some reason, I would include it on the tour because it's a great road with some cool bridges further down. That said, it's a paved, one lane road for the first several miles with a healthy amount of traffic and blind curves, but enough straightaway that cars routinely get up to 50 MPH (despite the 25 MPH posted speed limit) with no guardrails. I've been involved in several near head-on collisions over the years as both a driver and a passenger driving down that road, just because people take the blind curves way too fast and there's usually not room for two cars to pass each other. I don't know of too many instances where people have actually had fatal collisions on the road, probably because there's not quite enough traffic for that, but I do know that there are a massive amount of very close calls, which makes it kind of a nail biting drive.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: hotdogPi on May 21, 2014, 02:40:37 PM
Quote from: texaskdog on May 21, 2014, 01:51:20 PM
http://bit.ly/QRPv1R  the worst I've ever seen (hope it works)

Connecting to the iTunes store
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: agentsteel53 on May 21, 2014, 03:18:18 PM
yeah itunes is the worst ... something ... I've ever seen, that's for sure.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: jeffandnicole on May 21, 2014, 03:26:26 PM
Here's my most thrillseeking/interesting drive:

http://goo.gl/maps/lXSA8

Going up Mauna Kea on the Big Island, Hawai'i.  The Visitor Information Station is about at 9,000 feet, and they advise that if you want to continue up, hang out there for a half-hour or so to get a bit acclimated with the altitude.  After that, it's a dirt road for about 5 miles or so.  The final few miles are paved, and the summit is a bit above 14,000 feet. 

Of course, there's no guard rail.  While on the dirt road, I felt myself slip slightly a few times.  I made to the top.  Sighed a huge sigh of relief.  Got out, looked up, and instantly got dizzy because of the lack of oxygen at the summit!  After I sat down for a little bit, I started to drive back down. Got back to the visitors station and mentioned to one of the rangers my trip to the summit.  He mentioned that the dirt road hasn't been graded in a month as the grader was broken!

Technically, this was probably against my rental agreement as well.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: texaskdog on May 21, 2014, 03:38:23 PM
It was a road in the himalayas with one lane carved in the side of a mountain

The IRT show drove on some bad roads but they didn't seem all that bad on the show
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: oscar on May 21, 2014, 05:07:21 PM
Quote from: jeffandnicole on May 21, 2014, 03:26:26 PM
Here's my most thrillseeking/interesting drive:

Going up Mauna Kea on the Big Island, Hawai'i.  The Visitor Information Station is about at 9,000 feet, and they advise that if you want to continue up, hang out there for a half-hour or so to get a bit acclimated with the altitude.  After that, it's a dirt road for about 5 miles or so.  The final few miles are paved, and the summit is a bit above 14,000 feet.

See some photos from my first two trips on that road (and Tim Reichard's later trip of his own), at http://www.hawaiihighways.com/photos-observatories-roads.htm  (I also went up at least once more on a later trip, but those photos haven't yet gotten out of my huge backlog.  The backlogged photos from my 2009 trip in the winter include one of a sign forbidding non-emergency cellphone use near the summit, to avoid interference with all the gizmos atop the summit.) 

The road tops out at 13,780' (confirmed by observatory personnel).  The summit is at 13,796 feet, but you have to hike down from the road then back up, not pleasant even when the summit isn't snow-covered.

QuoteOf course, there's no guard rail.  While on the dirt road, I felt myself slip slightly a few times.  I made to the top.  Sighed a huge sigh of relief.  Got out, looked up, and instantly got dizzy because of the lack of oxygen at the summit!  After I sat down for a little bit, I started to drive back down. Got back to the visitors station and mentioned to one of the rangers my trip to the summit.  He mentioned that the dirt road hasn't been graded in a month as the grader was broken!

Technically, this was probably against my rental agreement as well.

Only one rental agency will let you take its 4x4s up Mauna Kea (Harper's, the same company that rents vehicles to visiting astronomers).

I didn't find the drive particularly tricky, though it probably was better-groomed the three or four times I went there.  The 15% unpaved grade did force me to descend in second gear, low range to avoid brake failure.  (The Big Island has a 25% grade road where you must use first gear, low range, both to avoid brake failure and also to power your way back out of the valley.  See http://www.hawaiihighways.com/photos-Waipio-Valley.htm for more.)
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: Alps on May 21, 2014, 08:23:52 PM
Try driving the Saw Mill River Parkway at 70 MPH at night.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: kennyshark on May 22, 2014, 12:46:26 PM
For sheer catharsis, try U.S. 441 (Newfound Gap Road) thru Great Smoky Mountains National Park after dark to Gatlinburg, TN after the following scenario:

- You've lost your rental car keys on the Clingman's Dome trail.
- Hitching a ride back to the ranger station near the Gatlinburg entrance.
- You see the last trolley to Gatlinburg.
- Local locksmith drives you back to Clingman's Dome.
- A Good Samaritan has left the rental car keys on the front seat.
Title: Re: Thrillseeking Drives
Post by: wphiii on May 22, 2014, 01:41:47 PM
Quote from: kennyshark on May 22, 2014, 12:46:26 PM
For sheer catharsis, try U.S. 441 (Newfound Gap Road) thru Great Smoky Mountains National Park after dark to Gatlinburg, TN after the following scenario:

- You've lost your rental car keys on the Clingman's Dome trail.
- Hitching a ride back to the ranger station near the Gatlinburg entrance.
- You see the last trolley to Gatlinburg.
- Local locksmith drives you back to Clingman's Dome.
- A Good Samaritan has left the rental car keys on the front seat.

441 is always sheer catharsis after the dumpster fire that is Gatlinburg.