From CNBC:
Why it's so expensive to be single in the U.S.QuoteThere's a good chance there are singles in your area. Nearly half of adults in the U.S. are currently single.
The 117.6 million unmarried, divorced or widowed Americans older than 18 account for 46% of the population, according to U.S. Census Bureau data.
That number has been growing slowly but steadily since the 1960s. As more adults are finding themselves single or remaining unmarried for longer, many are feeling crushed by the total weight of living expenses, which have also continued to grow in recent years.
FULL ARTICLE HERE (https://markholtz.info/2st)
Because 2 people make more money than 1 - they really had to write an article explaining that?
So...housing, since there's only one of you to pay rent or a mortgage, and taxes, which they say is due to the 2017 tax reform which allegedly did away with the marriage penalty (something I find dubious -- penalty may have been reduced long before that).
I had a solution to the problem when I owned a home and was single. I just rented out the extra space and it more than made up for the dual-income deficit. My wife did the exact same thing before we met with her house.
Likewise, a lot of people is super expensive rental situations just bite the bullet and room share. It certainly would make that $3,550 average rent solution for a studio in NYC more tolerable.
Economy of scale in simple examples.
Quote from: GaryV on November 07, 2023, 06:58:06 AM
Because 2 people make more money than 1 - they really had to write an article explaining that?
:cheers:
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 07, 2023, 08:23:19 AM
I had a solution to the problem when I owned a home and was single. I just rented out the extra space and it more than made up for the dual-income deficit. My wife did the exact same thing before we met with her house.
Likewise, a lot of people is super expensive rental situations just bite the bullet and room share. It certainly would make that $3,550 average rent solution for a studio in NYC more tolerable.
I've done that too, for a few years. In fact, for a while, I shared a two-bedroom apartment with two other people and just slept in a part of the living room that I'd sectioned off by hanging a bedsheet from the ceiling with pushpins.
But it's worth saying that a married couple is less likely to have roommates living with them, especially as their family grows with children. My wife and I had a series of roommates for a while, till our family size necessitated our taking over that space for ourselves. But I don't think I know a single married couple who has a roommate not related to them in some way, or at the very least a longtime friend.
Quote from: kphoger on November 07, 2023, 09:36:22 AM
But it's worth saying that a married couple is less likely to have roommates living with them, especially as their family grows with children. My wife and I had a series of roommates for a while, till our family size necessitated our taking over that space for ourselves. But I don't think I know a single married couple who has a roommate not related to them in some way, or at the very least a longtime friend.
We're on our second and are giving up once he finally moves out. We've collectively with the two of them had problems with rent being late or not paid at all; dishes being broken; food being taken and not always replenished; our stuff being moved around; you name it.
QuoteWhy it's so expensive to be single in the U.S.
Freedom isn't free.
"Two paychecks are better than one" was a first-verse lyric in "Going through the Big D and Don't Mean Dallas" by Mark Chesnutt.
There are better reasons to get married.
Good points, but I think the gist of the article is that, for a variety of reasons, the single population is growing and will continue to do so.
Quote from: Ted$8roadFan on November 10, 2023, 06:22:52 AM
Good points, but I think the gist of the article is that, for a variety of reasons, the single population is growing and will continue to do so.
In other news, total US credit card debt is over $ 1 trillion, is growing, and will continue to do so.
Quote from: elsmere241 on November 07, 2023, 10:35:31 AM
Quote from: kphoger on November 07, 2023, 09:36:22 AM
But it's worth saying that a married couple is less likely to have roommates living with them, especially as their family grows with children. My wife and I had a series of roommates for a while, till our family size necessitated our taking over that space for ourselves. But I don't think I know a single married couple who has a roommate not related to them in some way, or at the very least a longtime friend.
We're on our second and are giving up once he finally moves out. We've collectively with the two of them had problems with rent being late or not paid at all; dishes being broken; food being taken and not always replenished; our stuff being moved around; you name it.
Sounds like you need to do some better vetting.
My wife and I had three different friends live with us for a spell. One lived with us for three years while she was in dental school. I, personally, would never rent out to a stranger, but having friends who you know and trust live with you isn't that big of a deal. Now we just assume none of our friends want to crash with us due to a toddler's presence.
I'm reminded of Judge Judy's mantra that she would live in a closet before living with a roommate.
Quote from: JayhawkCO on November 10, 2023, 12:36:27 PM
I, personally, would never rent out to a stranger, but having friends who you know and trust live with you isn't that big of a deal.
Renting to strangers can work out.
I used to find roommates by posting in the common area at local colleges. The first roommate I found that way was taking grad classes at a Christian university—pretty drama-free—and we ended up being groomsmen in each other's weddings several years later. The first roommate my wife and I had as a married couple (with a toddler, by the way) was a foreign Wichita State student from Saudi Arabia; my wife became like a "mom" to him, we took care of him when he came down with swine flu, and we have a standing invitation to visit his family in Saudi Arabia if we ever want.
It doesn't
always work out, though. We did have to tell one to move out.
Quote from: kalvado on November 10, 2023, 07:42:01 AM
Quote from: Ted$8roadFan on November 10, 2023, 06:22:52 AM
Good points, but I think the gist of the article is that, for a variety of reasons, the single population is growing and will continue to do so.
In other news, total US credit card debt is over $ 1 trillion, is growing, and will continue to do so.
If it was exactly $1 trillion (which it isn't, it's "over"), and if there are (according to internet search) about 332 million people in the US (lets call that 1/3 of a billion), that means the average credit card debt is about $3000. I've had balances that high after large purchases, but I've also paid my balance every month --- as a result, I still have not paid a cent in credit card interest in 35 years.
I would be interested in knowing what the total monthly interest charge is for the entire US population.
Quote from: tmoore952 on November 11, 2023, 12:24:25 AM
Quote from: kalvado on November 10, 2023, 07:42:01 AM
Quote from: Ted$8roadFan on November 10, 2023, 06:22:52 AM
Good points, but I think the gist of the article is that, for a variety of reasons, the single population is growing and will continue to do so.
In other news, total US credit card debt is over $ 1 trillion, is growing, and will continue to do so.
If it was exactly $1 trillion (which it isn't, it's "over"), and if there are (according to internet search) about 332 million people in the US (lets call that 1/3 of a billion), that means the average credit card debt is about $3000. I've had balances that high after large purchases, but I've also paid my balance every month --- as a result, I still have not paid a cent in credit card interest in 35 years.
I would be interested in knowing what the total monthly interest charge is for the entire US population.
I'm not so sure the average debt is a good way to assess it. A decent number of people don't carry debt at all -- middle and upper classes.
$3000 is a lot of debt anyway, given interest charges. Makes me wonder if the debt number includes balances paid off every month.
Quote from: tmoore952 on November 11, 2023, 12:24:25 AM
Quote from: kalvado on November 10, 2023, 07:42:01 AM
Quote from: Ted$8roadFan on November 10, 2023, 06:22:52 AM
Good points, but I think the gist of the article is that, for a variety of reasons, the single population is growing and will continue to do so.
In other news, total US credit card debt is over $ 1 trillion, is growing, and will continue to do so.
If it was exactly $1 trillion (which it isn't, it's "over"), and if there are (according to internet search) about 332 million people in the US (lets call that 1/3 of a billion), that means the average credit card debt is about $3000. I've had balances that high after large purchases, but I've also paid my balance every month --- as a result, I still have not paid a cent in credit card interest in 35 years.
I would be interested in knowing what the total monthly interest charge is for the entire US population.
And you can probably cut about 20% off of that population since kids don't have credit cards.
So the avg debt would be higher.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on November 11, 2023, 12:47:18 AM
Quote from: tmoore952 on November 11, 2023, 12:24:25 AM
Quote from: kalvado on November 10, 2023, 07:42:01 AM
Quote from: Ted$8roadFan on November 10, 2023, 06:22:52 AM
Good points, but I think the gist of the article is that, for a variety of reasons, the single population is growing and will continue to do so.
In other news, total US credit card debt is over $ 1 trillion, is growing, and will continue to do so.
If it was exactly $1 trillion (which it isn't, it's "over"), and if there are (according to internet search) about 332 million people in the US (lets call that 1/3 of a billion), that means the average credit card debt is about $3000. I've had balances that high after large purchases, but I've also paid my balance every month --- as a result, I still have not paid a cent in credit card interest in 35 years.
I would be interested in knowing what the total monthly interest charge is for the entire US population.
And you can probably cut about 20% off of that population since kids don't have credit cards.
So the avg debt would be higher.
Heh, my dad had me as a "co-signer" on one of his credit cards when I was two. If it sounds shady you are on the right track.
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 12:38:30 AM
Quote from: tmoore952 on November 11, 2023, 12:24:25 AM
Quote from: kalvado on November 10, 2023, 07:42:01 AM
Quote from: Ted$8roadFan on November 10, 2023, 06:22:52 AM
Good points, but I think the gist of the article is that, for a variety of reasons, the single population is growing and will continue to do so.
In other news, total US credit card debt is over $ 1 trillion, is growing, and will continue to do so.
If it was exactly $1 trillion (which it isn't, it's "over"), and if there are (according to internet search) about 332 million people in the US (lets call that 1/3 of a billion), that means the average credit card debt is about $3000. I've had balances that high after large purchases, but I've also paid my balance every month --- as a result, I still have not paid a cent in credit card interest in 35 years.
I would be interested in knowing what the total monthly interest charge is for the entire US population.
I'm not so sure the average debt is a good way to assess it. A decent number of people don't carry debt at all -- middle and upper classes.
$3000 is a lot of debt anyway, given interest charges. Makes me wonder if the debt number includes balances paid off every month.
Most certainly it does. My credit rating report has balance paid off monthly as my average credit card balance.
However US GDP is a bit shy of $2T monthly. Assuming half of that gets funneled through Visa isnt very realistic. At the very least, rents and mortgages are unlikely to go onto credit cards.
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 12:38:30 AMI'm not so sure the average debt is a good way to assess it. A decent number of people don't carry debt at all -- middle and upper classes.
$3000 is a lot of debt anyway, given interest charges. Makes me wonder if the debt number includes balances paid off every month.
Can we make sure we are talking about long-term (over one month debt) verses short-term (one month or less) here? Some utility services bill you at the beginning of month for the service rendered during the month and due at the end of the month. That, technically, is debt.
$3,000 also isn't a lot of debt depending on how you look at it. Ask someone who holds a home mortgage, but at least the property taxes and the mortgage interest is deductable provided you itemize. What really is the killer is the interest rate. 3.25% fixed on a home mortgage isn't that much, especially when you look back from 1980-1985 and the average mortgage rate was almost always above 12½% expect for the summer of 1980 where it hit 12%, and peaked at 18½% in October, 1981. From 1985-1990, the interest rate was almost always above 10%. That makes the current 30 year fixed at 7.5% and 15 year fixed at 6.81% (Per Freddie Mac (https://markholtz.info/freddiemac)) look like bargains.
Quote from: tmoore952 on November 11, 2023, 12:24:25 AM
Quote from: kalvado on November 10, 2023, 07:42:01 AM
Quote from: Ted$8roadFan on November 10, 2023, 06:22:52 AM
Good points, but I think the gist of the article is that, for a variety of reasons, the single population is growing and will continue to do so.
In other news, total US credit card debt is over $ 1 trillion, is growing, and will continue to do so.
If it was exactly $1 trillion (which it isn't, it's "over"), and if there are (according to internet search) about 332 million people in the US (lets call that 1/3 of a billion), that means the average credit card debt is about $3000. I've had balances that high after large purchases, but I've also paid my balance every month --- as a result, I still have not paid a cent in credit card interest in 35 years.
I would be interested in knowing what the total monthly interest charge is for the entire US population.
Quoting my own post.
I acknowledge my average number is low, given that kids don't have credit cards.
Also not clear is whether the person whose bill was due the day before the $1 trillion estimate is made (and has already paid it off) is counted the same as the person whose bill is due the day after the $1 trillion estimate is made (and hasn't paid it off). As with a lot of stats, the details are very important for a complete understanding.
Because of my last paragraph, I also think that paid-off debt is included -- especially if it is also assumed that credit card due dates are spread (more or less) uniformly throughout any given month. In other words, there is no one day that is better than any other for making a total estimate.
My goal was to bound the average debt at the low end. Wasn't trying to give an authoritative answer, as there isn't enough info to do that.
Quote from: ZLoth on November 11, 2023, 12:48:16 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 12:38:30 AMI'm not so sure the average debt is a good way to assess it. A decent number of people don't carry debt at all -- middle and upper classes.
$3000 is a lot of debt anyway, given interest charges. Makes me wonder if the debt number includes balances paid off every month.
Can we make sure we are talking about long-term (over one month debt) verses short-term (one month or less) here? Some utility services bill you at the beginning of month for the service rendered during the month and due at the end of the month. That, technically, is debt.
$3,000 also isn't a lot of debt depending on how you look at it. Ask someone who holds a home mortgage, but at least the property taxes and the mortgage interest is deductable provided you itemize. What really is the killer is the interest rate. 3.25% fixed on a home mortgage isn't that much, especially when you look back from 1980-1985 and the average mortgage rate was almost always above 12½% expect for the summer of 1980 where it hit 12%, and peaked at 18½% in October, 1981. From 1985-1990, the interest rate was almost always above 10%. That makes the current 30 year fixed at 7.5% and 15 year fixed at 6.81% (Per Freddie Mac (https://markholtz.info/freddiemac)) look like bargains.
Given credit card interest rates, carrying $3,000 of debt from month-to-month on an average 20% rate would be debilitating for most households in the United States, given the skew of distribution of household income.
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 01:41:27 PMGiven credit card interest rates, carrying $3,000 of revolving credit card debt from month-to-month on an average 20% rate would be debilitating for most households in the United States, given the skew of distribution of household income.
There, corrected it for you.
Having said that, if you are carrying credit card debt from month-to-month, you are best off to shop around. While 13% interest rate through a credit union isn't great, it is certainly better than the 20% rate. Also, going through the expenses and asking what is absolutely needed and cutting out the "nice to have" luxuries to reduce the balance owed helps. And, of course, paying more than the minimum due.
Quote from: ZLoth on November 11, 2023, 02:09:36 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 01:41:27 PMGiven credit card interest rates, carrying $3,000 of revolving credit card debt from month-to-month on an average 20% rate would be debilitating for most households in the United States, given the skew of distribution of household income.
There, corrected it for you.
Having said that, if you are carrying credit card debt from month-to-month, you are best off to shop around. While 13% interest rate through a credit union isn't great, it is certainly better than the 20% rate. Also, going through the expenses and asking what is absolutely needed and cutting out the "nice to have" luxuries to reduce the balance owed helps. And, of course, paying more than the minimum due.
That's all nice and dandy, but if you're relying on a credit card, chances are your credit score is being hit and you can't qualify for better rates and limits.
Quote from: tmoore952 on November 11, 2023, 01:32:31 PM
Quote from: tmoore952 on November 11, 2023, 12:24:25 AM
Quote from: kalvado on November 10, 2023, 07:42:01 AM
Quote from: Ted$8roadFan on November 10, 2023, 06:22:52 AM
Good points, but I think the gist of the article is that, for a variety of reasons, the single population is growing and will continue to do so.
In other news, total US credit card debt is over $ 1 trillion, is growing, and will continue to do so.
If it was exactly $1 trillion (which it isn't, it's "over"), and if there are (according to internet search) about 332 million people in the US (lets call that 1/3 of a billion), that means the average credit card debt is about $3000. I've had balances that high after large purchases, but I've also paid my balance every month --- as a result, I still have not paid a cent in credit card interest in 35 years.
I would be interested in knowing what the total monthly interest charge is for the entire US population.
Quoting my own post.
I acknowledge my average number is low, given that kids don't have credit cards.
Also not clear is whether the person whose bill was due the day before the $1 trillion estimate is made (and has already paid it off) is counted the same as the person whose bill is due the day after the $1 trillion estimate is made (and hasn't paid it off). As with a lot of stats, the details are very important for a complete understanding.
Because of my last paragraph, I also think that paid-off debt is included -- especially if it is also assumed that credit card due dates are spread (more or less) uniformly throughout any given month. In other words, there is no one day that is better than any other for making a total estimate.
My goal was to bound the average debt at the low end. Wasn't trying to give an authoritative answer, as there isn't enough info to do that.
Total household debt in US is over $17B, and mostly mortgage as you can guess.
The example of credit card debt was to show that people do make less than financially sound decisions, such as carrying credit card debt or staying single. But, as it was mentioned above, freedom in not free.
Why is staying single a bad financial decision? I cover my rent and living expenses just fine, without the expenses of a 2nd person
Quote from: ilpt4u on November 11, 2023, 04:47:38 PM
Why is staying single a bad financial decision? I cover my rent and living expenses just fine, without the expenses of a 2nd person
As the article says, married people are even better off, nowadays.
Get married. Make babies.
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 06:09:53 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on November 11, 2023, 04:47:38 PM
Why is staying single a bad financial decision? I cover my rent and living expenses just fine, without the expenses of a 2nd person
As the article says, married people are even better off, nowadays.
Get married. Make babies.
With each kid though you are chipping into that advantage. The jump in health care for just me and my wife versus a family plan alone was startling. That doesn't even start getting into things like daycare costs.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 11, 2023, 06:15:18 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 06:09:53 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on November 11, 2023, 04:47:38 PM
Why is staying single a bad financial decision? I cover my rent and living expenses just fine, without the expenses of a 2nd person
As the article says, married people are even better off, nowadays.
Get married. Make babies.
With each kid though you are chipping into that advantage. The jump in health care for just me and my wife versus a family plan alone was startling. That doesn't even start getting into things like daycare costs.
Eh, just live in poverty and have one of the parents stay home. That's how we did it.
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 06:16:05 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 11, 2023, 06:15:18 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 06:09:53 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on November 11, 2023, 04:47:38 PM
Why is staying single a bad financial decision? I cover my rent and living expenses just fine, without the expenses of a 2nd person
As the article says, married people are even better off, nowadays.
Get married. Make babies.
With each kid though you are chipping into that advantage. The jump in health care for just me and my wife versus a family plan alone was startling. That doesn't even start getting into things like daycare costs.
Eh, just live in poverty and have one of the parents stay home. That's how we did it.
I don't think my wife or I could tolerate being the one who does that. Fortunately we are financially in a position where we can pay for the two line items I noted above. Problem is that both of us now are in our early 40s and that window for at least one kid is closing. I guess that's the calculus though, neither of us was willing to impoverish ourselves to have a kid.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 11, 2023, 06:19:15 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 06:16:05 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 11, 2023, 06:15:18 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 06:09:53 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on November 11, 2023, 04:47:38 PM
Why is staying single a bad financial decision? I cover my rent and living expenses just fine, without the expenses of a 2nd person
As the article says, married people are even better off, nowadays.
Get married. Make babies.
With each kid though you are chipping into that advantage. The jump in health care for just me and my wife versus a family plan alone was startling. That doesn't even start getting into things like daycare costs.
Eh, just live in poverty and have one of the parents stay home. That's how we did it.
I don't think my wife or I could tolerate being the one who does that. Fortunately we are financially in a position where we can pay for the two line items I noted above. Problem is that both of us now are in our early 40s and that window for at least one kid is closing. I guess that's the calculus though, neither of us was willing to impoverish ourselves to have a kid.
We all make our own choices.
Quote from: Rothman on November 10, 2023, 01:10:56 PM
I'm reminded of Judge Judy's mantra that she would live in a closet before living with a roommate.
Because of her job, she probably sees disproportionately more roommate arrangements that don't work out.
Quote from: kkt on November 11, 2023, 07:33:58 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 10, 2023, 01:10:56 PM
I'm reminded of Judge Judy's mantra that she would live in a closet before living with a roommate.
Because of her job, she probably sees disproportionately more roommate arrangements that don't work out.
As a television celebrity?
^^^
As a glorified television arbitrator.
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 07:04:03 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 11, 2023, 06:19:15 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 06:16:05 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 11, 2023, 06:15:18 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 06:09:53 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on November 11, 2023, 04:47:38 PM
Why is staying single a bad financial decision? I cover my rent and living expenses just fine, without the expenses of a 2nd person
As the article says, married people are even better off, nowadays.
Get married. Make babies.
With each kid though you are chipping into that advantage. The jump in health care for just me and my wife versus a family plan alone was startling. That doesn't even start getting into things like daycare costs.
Eh, just live in poverty and have one of the parents stay home. That's how we did it.
I don't think my wife or I could tolerate being the one who does that. Fortunately we are financially in a position where we can pay for the two line items I noted above. Problem is that both of us now are in our early 40s and that window for at least one kid is closing. I guess that's the calculus though, neither of us was willing to impoverish ourselves to have a kid.
We all make our own choices.
There have been forces at work outside of "choice" that have dictated why we don't have at least one child after getting married. Unfortunately, those forces are biological and something we can only do so much to control.
That said, I don't regret waiting on having kids. I'd much rather have things play out like they have and at least have financial stability before considering kids. We are both vested in our pensions and have a home we can afford. The only thing that isn't ideal now for children is our age.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 11, 2023, 10:49:43 PM
^^^
As a glorified television arbitrator.
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 07:04:03 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 11, 2023, 06:19:15 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 06:16:05 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 11, 2023, 06:15:18 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 06:09:53 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on November 11, 2023, 04:47:38 PM
Why is staying single a bad financial decision? I cover my rent and living expenses just fine, without the expenses of a 2nd person
As the article says, married people are even better off, nowadays.
Get married. Make babies.
With each kid though you are chipping into that advantage. The jump in health care for just me and my wife versus a family plan alone was startling. That doesn't even start getting into things like daycare costs.
Eh, just live in poverty and have one of the parents stay home. That's how we did it.
I don't think my wife or I could tolerate being the one who does that. Fortunately we are financially in a position where we can pay for the two line items I noted above. Problem is that both of us now are in our early 40s and that window for at least one kid is closing. I guess that's the calculus though, neither of us was willing to impoverish ourselves to have a kid.
We all make our own choices.
There have been forces at work outside of "choice" that have dictated why we don't have at least one child after getting married. Unfortunately, those forces are biological and something we can only do so much to control.
That said, I don't regret waiting on having kids. I'd much rather have things play out like they have and at least have financial stability before considering kids. We are both vested in our pensions and have a home we can afford. The only thing that isn't ideal now for children is our age.
Well, sure. So, we all make our own choices based upon all the variables in our lives.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 11, 2023, 06:15:18 PM
With each kid though you are chipping into that advantage. The jump in health care for just me and my wife versus a family plan alone was startling. That doesn't even start getting into things like daycare costs.
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 06:16:05 PM
Eh, just live in poverty and have one of the parents stay home. That's how we did it.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 11, 2023, 06:19:15 PM
I don't think my wife or I could tolerate being the one who does that. Fortunately we are financially in a position where we can pay for the two line items I noted above. Problem is that both of us now are in our early 40s and that window for at least one kid is closing. I guess that's the calculus though, neither of us was willing to impoverish ourselves to have a kid.
My wife stays home, but she also works from home. During the day, she operates a licensed home daycare and homeschools our boys. Outside of work hours, she also does direct sales for Scentsy. So, in that sense, we have the best of both worlds: she can stay home (as she has always wanted to do), and she also earns income. Plus, the
daycare pays
us, not the other way around. But. Her total income is still not nearly what it would be if she had a full-time traditional job. Our kids are on state aid health insurance, my wife and I aren't insured at all, and we just recently (at over age forty) earned our way out of the food stamp program.
But, when we were first married, we decided to wait a year to have kids—until we had saved up some money and could afford it. A year came and went, we had no savings and couldn't afford it. So we just decided to have a baby anyway and just trust that God would take care of us. No real 'plan'. Here we are, three kids later. Both of us would rather have a family than be rich, so overall we're pretty happy with our life.
If either of us hypothetically would be in a position to be a stay at home parent long term it probably would be me. My career field is dying and I have less than a decade to become fully vested in my pension. My wife is in a booming career field and has a four degree behind her. Right now I make more money and have more prospects, but I anticipate that to change in the next decade.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 13, 2023, 11:11:31 AM
If either of us hypothetically would be in a position to be a stay at home parent long term it probably would be me. My career field is dying and I have less than a decade to become fully vested in my pension. My wife is in a booming career field and has a four degree behind. Right now I make more money and have more prospects, but I anticipate that to change in the next decade.
Security is dying??
Quote from: kalvado on November 13, 2023, 11:24:24 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 13, 2023, 11:11:31 AM
If either of us hypothetically would be in a position to be a stay at home parent long term it probably would be me. My career field is dying and I have less than a decade to become fully vested in my pension. My wife is in a booming career field and has a four degree behind. Right now I make more money and have more prospects, but I anticipate that to change in the next decade.
Security is dying??
A very slow death, yes. There tends to be peaks and valleys, but the overall trajectory is downward. "Safety" everything on the other hand is booming and probably where I would need to go if something ever happened to my current career field.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 13, 2023, 11:11:31 AM
My wife ... has a four degree behind.
Now, that's one description of a woman's derrière that I've never heard before...
Quote from: kphoger on November 13, 2023, 11:50:11 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 13, 2023, 11:11:31 AM
My wife ... has a four degree behind.
Now, that's one description of a woman's derrière that I've never heard before...
I don't dislike it though. I might try it out on her to tonight and see what reaction it gets.
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 13, 2023, 11:52:26 AM
Quote from: kphoger on November 13, 2023, 11:50:11 AM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 13, 2023, 11:11:31 AM
My wife ... has a four degree behind.
Now, that's one description of a woman's derrière that I've never heard before...
I don't dislike it though. I might try it out on her to tonight and see what reaction it gets.
One has to wonder what each "it" refers to in that reply...
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 06:16:05 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on November 11, 2023, 06:15:18 PM
Quote from: Rothman on November 11, 2023, 06:09:53 PM
Quote from: ilpt4u on November 11, 2023, 04:47:38 PM
Why is staying single a bad financial decision? I cover my rent and living expenses just fine, without the expenses of a 2nd person
As the article says, married people are even better off, nowadays.
Get married. Make babies.
With each kid though you are chipping into that advantage. The jump in health care for just me and my wife versus a family plan alone was startling. That doesn't even start getting into things like daycare costs.
Eh, just live in poverty and have one of the parents stay home. That's how we did it.
There are huge risks with doing that, though, particularly for the parent who stays home. My mom stayed home with me and my brother for a decade. She went back to work in a field that was much lower paying in order to have a better work/family balance (because someone has to be the primary parent to deal with kids and doctors appointments, school activities, etc.) My dad first became ill at age 43 and died at 52. Fortunately he had a pension because otherwise we would have been so, so screwed because there were periods of time he medically could not work.
Ideally, if you were to poll people who identify as the "primary parent" (which the majority of the time is the mom) they/we would prefer to be able to work in a professional field part-time because we are still working on evenings and weekends on the house and kids. However, US society is not set up this way. Most fields that require advanced degrees also require working 40+ hours a week and there is no option for less except for zero. Lots of fields that have flexibility pay like crap, like service jobs and day care jobs.
Regarding health care, because I have chronic health issues, I max out my HSA annually and spend it. Health care is not cheap, especially when you have regular appointments for physical and mental therapies.
My wife then re-entered her field when the kids were self-sufficient and she is now a professor. So, because she managed it, everyone can. :D
Quote from: Laura on November 21, 2023, 02:05:25 PM
Most fields that require advanced degrees also require working 40+ hours a week and there is no option for less except for zero. Lots of fields that have flexibility pay like crap, like service jobs and day care jobs.
And even then, a lot of so-called "flexible" jobs like fast food places will push back on you for treating them like a second job if it is one for you.
I pay 46% of my income on rent and I'm okay with that as I have no debt and a really nice apartment. But mentioned to my girlfriend together we pay $3200/month for two small apartments and once she is ready we'll both have a lot more. Living alone is so expensive!
Quote from: Rothman on November 10, 2023, 01:10:56 PM
I'm reminded of Judge Judy's mantra that she would live in a closet before living with a roommate.
Yes, I had a friend ask me about moving in together. Not no but hell no.
I know. It may be a closet, but it's MY closet.