AARoads Forum

National Boards => General Highway Talk => Topic started by: SteveG1988 on November 24, 2010, 11:06:07 AM

Title: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: SteveG1988 on November 24, 2010, 11:06:07 AM
Interstate 295 south of NJ38 is a prime example, prior to the widening it had three lanes. and after the 1990s/early 2000s it still had three lanes, but the median shrunk with new shoulders. Does anybody know of any other roads that had this happen?
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: vdeane on November 24, 2010, 11:17:30 AM
I-90 between Weedsport and Syracuse.  Those left shoulders (which can carry an entire lane of traffic, and do when the other side is being worked on) are huge!
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: Truvelo on November 24, 2010, 11:21:34 AM
There are numerous examples of two lane roads which have had shoulders added. Alternatively, there's also examples of where the road has been realigned and the new alignment is wider than the original.
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: realjd on November 24, 2010, 01:54:33 PM
US-1 between Florida City and Key Largo is currently being reconstructed. It used to be a 2-lane road with minimal shoulders. They're rebuilding it to be a 2-lane road with a crash barrier down the middle, and the northbound shoulder is being constructed wide enough to carry a second lane of traffic in the event of a hurricane evacuation.
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: Alps on November 24, 2010, 05:09:02 PM
Looks like that may be happening on the Cross-Westchester (I-287), still under construction.
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: Brandon on November 24, 2010, 05:09:25 PM
In 1997, I-80 was widened in Illinois without adding lanes between milepost 137 and 145.  The left shoulder was widened and jersey barriers were put up, but no lanes were added.  :banghead:
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: hbelkins on November 24, 2010, 10:06:04 PM
This has been done in a number of spots along I-64 between Huntington and Charleston.
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: xcellntbuy on November 24, 2010, 11:06:50 PM
This is becoming common in many construction areas in Florida.  Often, underpasses and bridges are widened to a potential third (or more) lane.  Many sections of the Florida's Turnpike have this scenario.  Eventually, the Florida's Turnpike will be widened from four to six lanes from Boynton Beach (Exit 86) to Jupiter (Exit 116).  The widening has already been largely completed from Exit 75 (Boca Raton) to Boynton and is also heavily in progress to expand the Turnpike from six to eight lanes between Exit 66 (Atlantic Blvd.) to Exit 53 (Griffin Road).

Back in 2002, I noticed that Interstate 95 between Daytona Beach and Jacksonville had all of the overpasses widened through the 80-mile stretch.  When I returned to New York this Fall, the entire Interstate was six lanes for that whole section.  The long term plan for Florida is expand Interstate 95 to a minimum of six lanes wherever there are currently only four lanes.

Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: Bryant5493 on November 24, 2010, 11:43:33 PM
The grass median on Georgia State Route 166 (Arthur Langford, Jr. Parkway) between I-285 and just west of I-75/85 near downtown Atlanta was removed three or four years ago, to provide room for a lefthand shoulder. A jersey barrier was installed to keep the highway divided. The right shoulder was/is currently non-existent.


Be well,

Bryant
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: Mergingtraffic on November 26, 2010, 11:42:25 AM
In CT, the state widens surface roads at intersections or shopping centers.  They widen it enough for a turn lane but restripe it with a huge shoulder.  Doesn't make sense, if you got the room and even brought out the line painting truck...why not just add a turn lane.  I hate that.
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: BigMattFromTexas on November 26, 2010, 02:01:59 PM
This happens all the time in East Texas where they add shoulders to the sides, cause of the forest. They did that in Texas 21.
BigMatt
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: NE2 on November 26, 2010, 02:44:42 PM
Quote from: doofy103 on November 26, 2010, 11:42:25 AM
In CT, the state widens surface roads at intersections or shopping centers.  They widen it enough for a turn lane but restripe it with a huge shoulder.  Doesn't make sense, if you got the room and even brought out the line painting truck...why not just add a turn lane.  I hate that.
Is it legal to pass on the shoulder in Connecticut?
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: Mergingtraffic on November 27, 2010, 01:25:36 PM
Quote from: NE2 on November 26, 2010, 02:44:42 PM
Quote from: doofy103 on November 26, 2010, 11:42:25 AM
In CT, the state widens surface roads at intersections or shopping centers.  They widen it enough for a turn lane but restripe it with a huge shoulder.  Doesn't make sense, if you got the room and even brought out the line painting truck...why not just add a turn lane.  I hate that.
Is it legal to pass on the shoulder in Connecticut?

I always thought it was.  I see cops do it. 
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: froggie on November 27, 2010, 04:26:44 PM
Doesn't necessarily mean it's legal.
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: SteveG1988 on November 27, 2010, 09:10:56 PM
I saw that, wide shoulder near a shopping center. On NJ38 in Lumberton NJ they built a walmart back in 2003,

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=lumberton+NJ&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-a&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Lumberton,+Burlington,+New+Jersey&gl=us&ei=k7nxTKKPHYa8lQfnxNyWDQ&oi=geocode_result&ved=0CBwQ8gEwAA&ll=39.979093,-74.767113&spn=0.038607,0.104628&t=h&z=14&layer=c&cbll=39.97914,-74.767231&panoid=im3pc9_mta2JBq_JVSP5Cw&cbp=12,149.8,,0,5

There are signs that say "keep off shoulder" where a right turn lane would be, it is fairly dangerous not to have one in my opinion.
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: Ian on November 27, 2010, 09:13:28 PM
Quote from: doofy103 on November 27, 2010, 01:25:36 PM
Quote from: NE2 on November 26, 2010, 02:44:42 PM
Quote from: doofy103 on November 26, 2010, 11:42:25 AM
In CT, the state widens surface roads at intersections or shopping centers.  They widen it enough for a turn lane but restripe it with a huge shoulder.  Doesn't make sense, if you got the room and even brought out the line painting truck...why not just add a turn lane.  I hate that.
Is it legal to pass on the shoulder in Connecticut?

I always thought it was.  I see cops do it. 

I always thought shoulder running was illegal, no matter where you are (unless there are signs saying its legal, say, during rush hour. Just like I-95 through the Boston area).
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: NE2 on November 28, 2010, 03:47:03 AM
In Ontario at least it's legal: http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/dandv/driver/handbook/section2.7.5.shtml
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: vdeane on November 28, 2010, 07:23:54 AM
I've always seen people pass on the shoulder when people are making left turns.  Even if not legal, it's pretty standard here in upstate NY.
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: SteveG1988 on November 28, 2010, 08:18:06 AM
In NJ there are massive signs that say "Keep Right Pass Left" on the interstates. Nobody follows the law.
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: US71 on November 28, 2010, 09:05:40 AM
Arkansas often does it the other way: add lanes, but don't widen... usually to add a continuous Left Turn Lane
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: NE2 on November 28, 2010, 09:35:04 AM
Quote from: SteveG1988 on November 28, 2010, 08:18:06 AM
In NJ there are massive signs that say "Keep Right Pass Left" on the interstates. Nobody follows the law.
What does this have to do with the topic? You usually turn left from the left lane.
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: Mergingtraffic on November 28, 2010, 12:24:02 PM
In CT, shoulder running, ie; Ma-128 in Boston is illegal, but CT widenes the shoulder for left turns to intersections or shopping centers.  Which is totally stupid.   Why not just  restripe it with a left-turn lane.  It seems CT will do anything instead of adding left-turn lanes.
They even put in new traffic signals with a left-arrow phase at the beginning of the green light cycle rather than adding a left-turn lane. (so, when a car misses the arrow, traffic backs up behind him)
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: AZDude on November 28, 2010, 01:13:27 PM
Quote from: NE2 on November 28, 2010, 09:35:04 AM
Quote from: SteveG1988 on November 28, 2010, 08:18:06 AM
In NJ there are massive signs that say "Keep Right Pass Left" on the interstates. Nobody follows the law.
What does this have to do with the topic? You usually turn left from the left lane.
He means that although something may be illegal, people will do it anyway.
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: Ian on November 28, 2010, 01:29:58 PM
Quote from: deanej on November 28, 2010, 07:23:54 AM
I've always seen people pass on the shoulder when people are making left turns.  Even if not legal, it's pretty standard here in upstate NY.

Well I'd assume that's legal. I just meant using the shoulder as another lane or to pass a slow driver.
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: NE2 on November 28, 2010, 01:42:29 PM
Not necessarily. For example, in Washington, you're supposed to stay on the roadway (http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=46.61.115), and the shoulder's not part of it (http://apps.leg.wa.gov/RCW/default.aspx?cite=46.04.500).
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: SteveG1988 on November 28, 2010, 05:31:59 PM
On NJ Freeways, you are legally required to drive on the right hand lane of a four lane road, and only use the left lane to pass. Nobody follows the laws, and it is never enforced
Title: Re: Roads that are widened, but no lanes added.
Post by: J N Winkler on November 29, 2010, 04:11:22 AM
Everything from shoulder stripe to shoulder stripe which is open for ordinary vehicular travel is called the "traveled way" and the shoulder is not part of it.  I think it is probably an UVC provision, which most states follow, that the shoulder may be used only for stopping in emergencies.  Therefore using the shoulder to pass a vehicle which has stopped or slowed down to turn left is illegal unless provided for in state law.  KRETP is a separate requirement typically applying to certain classes of multilane highway.  I am not sure whether it is in the UVC, and in most states that do have KRETP requirements, it is generally treated as a recommendation for good driving practice rather than something that is enforced.  There are many practical difficulties in determining whether KRETP has been violated though, predictably enough, there are nuts on rec.autos.driving who believe that violators should be drawn and quartered.