On a recent trip through South Bend, I took a look at progress on the US 31 project. This is a 20 mile freeway upgrade project that goes from US 20 in South Bend south to US 30 in Plymouth. Of that length, 15 miles are being built on a new terrain, and from US 30 north for five miles will use the existing roadway. The new road is planned to be open in 2014.
Among the problems are peat deposits that require removal of a substantial amount of material. This is an article from a contractor, ES Wagner (http://www.eswagner.com/projects/detail.aspx?id=2977252a-3682-45f2-84a8-3b6283750847). Other questions are answered on the INDOT FAQ page (http://us31plysb.com/faq.html). Some of the project can already be seen in Google Maps (http://maps.google.com/maps?q=lakeville,+IN&hl=en&ll=41.524516,-86.273232&spn=0.067472,0.1684&sll=41.511534,-86.262932&sspn=0.067485,0.1684&vpsrc=6&hnear=Lakeville,+St+Joseph,+Indiana&t=h&z=13) east of Lakeville and Lapaz.
Remaining contracts to be let:
- 02/08/2012 Jackson Road over US 31, various roads over US 20
- 03/07/2012 Connecting existing highway to new highway (half mile north of US 6) and new US 6 interchange
- 04/04/2012 Kern Road interchange
- 10/11/2012 7th Road Interchange, resurface existing US 31
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2F1stRdAtUS31.jpg&hash=0ef7019cd2514ef22d8fa335b6e418f7316e712a)
1st Road overpass
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31FromTyler.jpg&hash=25b992aa078c2bfd308e19e35223626d5b4718a0)
Looking north from Tyler Rd.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FSR4-US31.jpg&hash=8cf837d933ee0d6e312a1f35b11f7ed4323e6e43)
Pierce Rd - SR 4 extension to new US 31
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31OldUS31.jpg&hash=8513e85b80aedfc5556b8646cc97480732052d0e)
New US 31 crossing existing US 31
Thanks and it will only be a matter of time for Interstate 67 from Indy to Michigan. I have feeling once the folks get a feel of a upgraded US-31 in Hamilton County, Kokomo and Plymouth-South Bend. They will want more and put the public opinion behind I-67.
I-67 would be very nice, but there is still quite a distance to upgrade there. The state will put #1 priority on completing I-69 - I support that, but actually the South Bend-Elkhart area is a lot bigger than Evansville metro. The best I think we can hope for in the near term after the three active US 31 projects are complete is maybe the elimination of the remaining stoplights. I think there will be seven left: Peru north of US 24, Peru BR 31 (south), SR 218 north of Grissom, SR 18, Tipton County Division Rd., SR 28, and 236th St. in Hamilton County. Knocking out one or two a year would be great.
Is it known when construction will start on Kern Road and when it will be closed?
I checked out progress on US 31 this past weekend.
They are finally paving the part that was graded two years ago. Pictures are below. They are clearing trees and brush at Kern Rd. and look close to doing demolition on a number of houses. The construction contract for the section that goes from Kern Road back to existing US 31 has been let. This is directly north of a section approaching completion.
Another contract that has been let goes from US 6 south to the existing US 31. At US 6, utilities are being relocated, but no signes of actual construction yet.
After those two sections are done, there will be two remaining areas left: work right around US 20 and the upgrade of existing US 31 from US 30 north to where the new terrain road is tying in south of Lapaz.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31_SB_2012_3.jpg&hash=75163a2b078d086a629e59ac8a2cba4c1c029d3f)
Getting close to paving around Tyler Rd. in Lapaz
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31_SB_2012_1.jpg&hash=b3153f138455e035efb3aae3d255b7c806a68d4f)
Asphalt paving as seen from Lake Trail east of Lakeville
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31_SB_2012_4.jpg&hash=c95f5cb3e627a05d5415326b768339bd6a1595b0)
SR 4 extension and interchange
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31_SB_2012_2.jpg&hash=85e7fd3897f529a88e339538e0c3713712afb066)
PCCP pavement as seen from New Road
Google map centered on SR 4 interchange (https://maps.google.com/?ll=41.538522,-86.247826&spn=0.06296,0.169086&t=h&z=13)
There is a newer subdivision just south of Kern Road that looks like it is in the middle of a future ROW
Quote from: ARMOURERERIC on May 28, 2012, 08:41:43 PM
There is a newer subdivision just south of Kern Road that looks like it is in the middle of a future ROW
From what I saw, the newer subdivision (Lafayette Falls?) will remain - it is west of the new interchange - unless there is another subdivision hidden south of Kern Rd. All the houses with the "STATE OF INDIANA" placards in the windows looked older.
I assume this is the subdivision you are talking about: Google Street View of Lafayette Falls entrance (https://maps.google.com/?ll=41.608448,-86.265249&spn=0.000032,0.021136&t=h&z=16&layer=c&cbll=41.608452,-86.265462&panoid=23Xsz2ACApr1lDTL6GG3KQ&cbp=12,200.88,,0,3.11)
http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/sbt-part-of-kern-road-to-close-starting-monday-20120726,0,6453293.story
Kern Road between U.S. 31 and Locust Road will close to all traffic beginning Monday, the Indiana Department of Transportation has announced.The closure, which will continue through the end of November, is part of the new road and bridge construction project for the new U.S. 31.
It almost seems as if they are using asphalt with a continuously-reinforced concrete pavement on top, which is similar to the new highway pavement design and construction in Kentucky.
It would be my hope that once US 31 is relocated, that the existing facility can be narrowed down to two lanes. A bike path, north to south from South Bend to Indianapolis, would be a gem.
There is already a trail from Rochester south through Peru and almost to Kokomo, with plans for it to reach Downtown Kokomo eventually. Find a way to connect Rochester and Plymouth and that South Bend to Indy trail is already more than halfway there.
Quote from: Sherman Cahal on July 27, 2012, 10:52:16 AM
It would be my hope that once US 31 is relocated, that the existing facility can be narrowed down to two lanes. A bike path, north to south from South Bend to Indianapolis, would be a gem.
I doubt it because only sections in the Kokomo and South Bend areas are new terrain - and they carry sufficient local traffic that they won't need to be narrowed, IMO. From near Lapaz south to Plymouth is being upgraded to freeway. It is not new road.
As for the SR 25 upgrade, most of the old road where it runs parallel to the new one is being completely removed rather than serving as a frontage road.
The section of existing US 31 from north of Plymouth (where Old 31 splits off) all the way to South Bend involves the Michigan Road, one of Indiana's oldest highways (built in the 1830s). The southbound lanes map to the original Michigan Road alignment as far as I can tell all the way. I'm worried about what the counties will do if/when Indiana cedes Old 31 to them. I work with a group that last year got the Michigan Road named a State Historic Byway -- it runs from Madison to Michigan City. We are trying to honor the road's place in state history and encourage heritage tourism along the route. So it's important to us that this road remain driveable. Enough of it has already been disrupted, such as about 5 miles of it that are buried under I-74 in Shelby County. -Jim
Wouldn't it be better for historic purposes if the southbound lanes became a trail that allows horse-drawn buggies?
Historically, the minute the road was improved beyond its original state -- 100 ft ROW with trees cut down and the stumps ground out in the middle 30 feet -- its historic environment was lost. We're just trying to preserve the original route so cars can drive it and reach all the towns along the route.
I would think that the construction of the new terrain route around Lakeville and Lapaz and removal of the connection from the old to the new would restore the road closer to what it was.
Have you proposed signing the historic route to INDOT or any counties? If they don't have funding, it seems like the kind of thing the Lilly Foundation might be willing to give a grant for - especially because you got the historic byway designation. Do you know who funded all the Lincoln Highway markers in the state?
Do you know when was Michigan Road widened from US 6 northward? I would guess it has been that way for at least 60 years.
I'm actually President of the Historic Michigan Road Association, and one of our first goals is to sign the route. We need to seek funding, and we need to work with INDOT and then also where INDOT doesn't have jurisdiction the counties and towns. It is going to be a heck of a project to sign all 270 miles of the road.
The LH markers were kind of a hodgepodge. Last time I drove the route the signs didn't even match county to county. Given how they were placed in some places I wouldn't be surprised to learn that permission was not always sought.
I'm under the impression that the 4-laning of 31 from SB south happened in the early 70s sometime.
Quote from: mobilene on July 28, 2012, 07:56:38 PM
I'm under the impression that the 4-laning of 31 from SB south happened in the early 70s sometime.
I just looked at my 1959 Indiana highway map, and US 31 (Michigan Rd.) was marked as divided from US 6 northward. I think I have a 1956 map somewhere and will check that. US 31 from Keystone north to SR 47 (present day 236th St.) was also divided then. Kokomo and Indy also had divided sections. US 31 went thru downtown Peru and downtown Plymouth back then.
I know that US 31 from Plymouth south to Peru (or thereabouts) was made divided in the 1970s, but I don't think any of that is Michigan Road.
Update: The 1952 and 1957 official highway maps show US 31 as divided from Lakeville northward.
The 73/74 map still showed US 31 as two lanes from Plymouth to SR 16.
FWIW
A local TV station in South Bend did a video tour of the South Bend - Plymouth section of U.S. 31.
http://www.wsbt.com/videogallery/71558015/News/A-look-at-the-road-yet-traveled (http://www.wsbt.com/videogallery/71558015/News/A-look-at-the-road-yet-traveled)
Wow, that story was pretty well done.
Seeing that video, I noticed a few signs that are already on the new highway such as one mileage sign with the distances to US 20, South Bend and Benton Harbor (Niles has been mentioned as a control city at the current interchange with 31 and 20, though Benton Harbor is a control at Cleveland Road and US 31.) Also, in the distance of one shot was a sign bridge for I presume Kern Road and US 20 with controls of Michigan City and Elkhart (it looks like it at least.) Are there any sign plans online that anyone knows of?
I see US 31 is being posted for only 65, while comparable Interstate freeways get posted for 70. Of course, a stretch of comparable freeway in Wisconsin (WIS 26) was posted for 55 for nearly a year (they finally raised it to 65 a couple weeks ago), so it could be worse.
Seems a bit ridiculous though when US 30 (side roads, driveways, and all) merits posting for 60 for much of its length.
I think only Interstates have 70 MPH speed limits in Indiana. Other freeways are 60 or 65.
^ I thought it was interstates could be 70, four lane roads could only go up to 60?
Four-lane, non-interstate freeways can go up to 65 MPH, and I think the US 20/US 31 bypass around South Bend is an example (if not the only) of that. Also on that note, there are very few freeways in Indiana that aren't interstates, so the examples are very few. Four lane highways that are not freeways can go up only to 60 miles per hour. Only interstates can go up to 70.
Quote from: tdindy88 on August 03, 2012, 09:44:38 PM
Seeing that video, I noticed a few signs that are already on the new highway such as one mileage sign with the distances to US 20, South Bend and Benton Harbor (Niles has been mentioned as a control city at the current interchange with 31 and 20, though Benton Harbor is a control at Cleveland Road and US 31.) Also, in the distance of one shot was a sign bridge for I presume Kern Road and US 20 with controls of Michigan City and Elkhart (it looks like it at least.) Are there any sign plans online that anyone knows of?
Very difficult to find. One contract is 30128 and the CIB for that contract has some (all for Kern Rd.). South Bend's US 31, like Hamilton County's has no exit number tabs, but Kokomo's US 31 signs do. Weird.
I suppose you can find contract numbers if you go through the CIBs.
BTW, the speed limit on this section is 60, just like the Fort-Port (US 24) freeway. Kokomo's US 31 originally showed 65 MPH signs, but the current ones show 60 MPH.
Quote from: tdindy88 on August 03, 2012, 11:01:18 PM
Four-lane, non-interstate freeways can go up to 65 MPH, and I think the US 20/US 31 bypass around South Bend is an example (if not the only) of that. Also on that note, there are very few freeways in Indiana that aren't interstates, so the examples are very few. Four lane highways that are not freeways can go up only to 60 miles per hour. Only interstates can go up to 70.
This. Like what you said, the St. Joseph Valley Parkway (U.S. 20/31) is one of the only two highways that are freeway standard, but not Interstates. There is the Vincennes Bypass (U.S. 41/50/150), but I can't confirm or deny if it carries a 65 MPH speed limit.
I see U.S. 31 carrying a 65 MPH speed limit, with gradual reductions to 55 as it draws closer to its junction to I-465.
EDIT: As the WSBT package shows, it looks like expressway sections of U.S. 31 will carry 65 MPH speed limits.
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 10, 2012, 12:06:11 AM
St. Joseph Valley Parkway (U.S. 20/31) is one of the only two highways that are freeway standard, but not Interstates
Actually, there are others:
- SR 62 in Evansville
- SR 265 (future I-265)
- SR 641 in Terre Haute
- SR 912 (Cline Avenue) in NW Indiana
- US 24 east of Fort Wayne also has a freeway section that will soon be extended
- supposedly US 31 in Kokomo will be open from SR 22 to SR 26 this year
...and you could say Keystone Parkway
Depending on what your definition of "is" is, you could also say:
- SR 49 in Valparaiso which has 4.5 miles of fully controlled access with three interchanges and several overpasses
- SR 67 (Muncie Bypass) which has 4.2 miles of fully controlled access with three interchanges and at least a couple of overpasses
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 10, 2012, 12:06:11 AM
There is the Vincennes Bypass (U.S. 41/50/150), but I can't confirm or deny if it carries a 65 MPH speed limit.
Vincennes US 41 freeway has a 60 MPH speed limit.
Quote from: nwi_navigator_1181 on August 10, 2012, 12:06:11 AM
I see U.S. 31 carrying a 65 MPH speed limit, with gradual reductions to 55 as it draws closer to its junction to I-465.
Every Indy freeway (and NW Indiana and Fort Wayne urban freeway for that matter) is 55 MPH so I doubt that US 31 in Hamilton County will be any different.
Quote from: mukade on August 10, 2012, 09:14:05 PM
Every Indy freeway (and NW Indiana and Fort Wayne urban freeway for that matter) is 55 MPH so I doubt that US 31 in Hamilton County will be any different.
Fort Wayne is 65 MPH, plus I-69 North in Indianapolis/Fishers is 65 MPH.
In Northwest Indiana:
The Tollroad (I-90 & 80/90) is 70MPH from IL/IN line to IN/OH Line except between MM-20 to 25 where it is 55MPH or below.
On I-65 it is 65MPH from its Northern Terminus to MM-257 where it bumps to 65MPH and then at MM-252 it goes upto 70MPH.
On I-94 the 70MPH zone starts at MM-17 and proceeds Eastward to the IN/MI Line
Quote from: wh15395 on August 10, 2012, 10:39:46 PM
Fort Wayne is 65 MPH, plus I-69 North in Indianapolis/Fishers is 65 MPH.
Yep, Fort Wayne is 65 and even 70 south of Jefferson. I-69 from 96th south was 55 as I remember the flags.
To the point, US 31 in Hamilton County will be 55 MPH. See Frequently Asked Questions (http://us31hamiltoncounty.in.gov/faq.html#5).
Quote
What will the speed limit be?
The improved US 31 Hamilton County is being designed for a 55 mph speed limit.
There will be 11 interchanges in 13 miles on US 31 with one of them from 151st to Range Line being a monster. That would not lend itself to high speeds. Also, if Kokomo US 31 isn't 65 MPH (as those plans show 60 MPH), there is no way the much more congested Hamilton County section would be. One huge difference with I-69 compared to US 31 is that the 10th interchange on I-69 past I-465 is probably at Daleville or Muncie.
Was in the area over the weekend and they have started doing some work at US 6.
While describing difficult situations, I am not sure all these stories are 100% true. I read in Kokomo, the owners of a furniture store that became a victim to the construction said it was the best thing that happened to them as they got a new, better location. Also, I have a hard time believing the state gave 10% of a property's value as the one homeowner implied in the linked article.
U.S. 31 project leaves many living in uncertainty (http://www.ibj.com/u-s--31-project-leaves-many-living-in-uncertainty/PARAMS/article/36050) (IBJ)
I know some people who are getting quite the sweet deal to get bought out of land which will become I-40 west of Barstow. they held out for a while, and Caltrans kept upping the offer, until they accepted.
INDOT's facebook page has some good photos:
http://www.facebook.com/INDOTNorthwest/photos
US 6 will close between US31 and Lilac Road from September 17-22 as part of the project.
Not part of the US 31 project but nearby, IN 331 will be closed in Mishawaka between IN 933 and 12th Street from September 17-28 as part of the Capital Avenue project.
Sign assembly going up near Roosevelt Rd. overpass (I think). Courtesy of the INDOT Northwest FB page:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi46.tinypic.com%2F2agnnzr.jpg&hash=8a4c382f3d3a89f2740d9fb3440833aa4a34b190)
Quote from: theline on October 11, 2012, 05:08:52 PM
Sign assembly going up near Roosevelt Rd. overpass (I think). Courtesy of the INDOT Northwest FB page:
Yes, that's exactly where it is. I was able to see that sign assembly while traveling NB on the existing 31 where the new and old roads cross just south of Roosevelt.
I see the present cloverleaf between US 31 and US 20 will not be upgraded according to the plans. Somehow both old and new US 31 will come together south of the cloverleaf, probably the same way how they transformed the new I-69 at I-64 near Evansville where it used to be a two lane road north of there. Now the original roadway is dead end and traffic must use a new diamond interchange with a cross road just north of I-64 on I-69.
A map can be seen here (http://www.us31plysb.com/assets/maps/Kern_Road_to_US_20.pdf).
The decision to keep the cloverleaf was made some time ago. This is consistent with keeping the current US 24/I-469 interchange. The opted to build more miles of roads and avoid rebuilding interchanges that are generally functional.
And it saves money I presume. I guess we should be lucky that they are rebuilding the interchange at I-465 and US 31.
Quote from: mukade on October 28, 2012, 12:24:24 AM
A map can be seen here (http://www.us31plysb.com/assets/maps/Kern_Road_to_US_20.pdf).
The decision to keep the cloverleaf was made some time ago. This is consistent with keeping the current US 24/I-469 interchange. The opted to build more miles of roads and avoid rebuilding interchanges that are generally functional.
Quote from: tdindy88 on October 28, 2012, 07:48:38 PM
And it saves money I presume. I guess we should be lucky that they are rebuilding the interchange at I-465 and US 31.
Not only does it save money, it's also proof that not every new freeway needs an Interstate shield attached to it.
http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/sbt-oneday-closure-set-along-us-6-20121211,0,3238785.story
QuoteThe Indiana Department of Transportation has announced the one-day closure of U.S. 6 between U.S. 31 and Lilac Road beginning at 6:30 a.m. Wednesday and continuing through 7 p.m. that day, weather permitting.
The closure is necessary to ensure driver safety while crews set beams for the new U.S. 31 overpass, according to a news release.
A detour will take eastbound traffic south on U.S. 31, east on U.S. 30, north on Indiana 331, north on Indiana 106, and back to U.S. 6.
Westbound traffic will travel from U.S. 6, south on Indiana 106, south on Indiana 331, west on U.S. 30, north on U.S. 31 and back to U.S. 6.
South of US 6 where the wye interchange is with US 31 and Old US 31, is that interchange going to come down? I imagine that not that coming from points south of Old US 31 interchange will need to use the present US 31 (soon to be old US 31) and the small amount that does could use US 6.
However, those heading south on the new freeway to Plymouth will have to exit at US 6 and head west to Old US 31. If not stay on US 31 to US 30 or to Lincolnway.
Quote from: roadman65 on December 19, 2012, 06:12:13 PM
South of US 6 where the wye interchange is with US 31 and Old US 31, is that interchange going to come down? I imagine that not that coming from points south of Old US 31 interchange will need to use the present US 31 (soon to be old US 31) and the small amount that does could use US 6.
However, those heading south on the new freeway to Plymouth will have to exit at US 6 and head west to Old US 31. If not stay on US 31 to US 30 or to Lincolnway.
There will be another exit between US-6 and US-30. This one will be at 7th Road, which will be extended west from its current end at Linden Trail. See the exit near the right edge of this PDF: http://www.us31plysb.com/assets/maps/US_30_to_7th_Road.pdf (http://www.us31plysb.com/assets/maps/US_30_to_7th_Road.pdf)
I'm unclear whether there are plans to extend 7th Road west to old-old US 31, but I would presume so.
Taking a look at the maps from the project's website, it looks as if the Old US 31 will continue as a four-lane highway past that interchange to the intersection of 4A Road and Maple Road, at which point US 31 will continue as Maple Road south to 5A Road where the road ends. Nothing mentions the wye interchange further north, implying that it may very well stay. On that note it seems to make more sense to route the Old US 31 onto Michigan Road itself and forget the part to the southeast of that interchange. I don't see any homes or businesses along the current stretch of US 31 and 4A Road (that can't be accessed by other roads) that would make that stretch of 31 necessary. Take out the interchange and curve Michigan Road north into the future Old US 31 route.
Old 31 will probably be maintained, at least in rudimentary form, for access to the INDOT maintenance facility at 4A and Maple Roads. I agree that there will be little reason for anyone else to use the 1-plus mile section of old highway.
Quote from: roadman65 on December 19, 2012, 06:12:13 PM
South of US 6 where the wye interchange is with US 31 and Old US 31, is that interchange going to come down? I imagine that not that coming from points south of Old US 31 interchange will need to use the present US 31 (soon to be old US 31) and the small amount that does could use US 6.
However, those heading south on the new freeway to Plymouth will have to exit at US 6 and head west to Old US 31. If not stay on US 31 to US 30 or to Lincolnway.
To summarize most of what has already been said. Coming southbound on what will soon be "Old" 31, the exit for Michigan Rd/Plymouth will still exist. I imagine the BGS for thru traffic will be changed to read "Maple Rd" I also think the existing road is getting cut down from 4 to 2 lanes from that point south. As Old 31 approaches 4A Rd, it will get curved a bit to smoothly transition to Maple Rd. That leaves about 1/4 mile of Old 31 south of 4A Rd that will not carry traffic.
I know that at some point there was input from the residents along Michigan Rd that they did not want an exit from New 31 onto Michigan Rd but maybe INDOT wasn't going to have one anyway.
The following article describe's new governor Mike Pence's view on a full US 31 upgrade from Indy to South Bend.
Quote
The most recent boost of enthusiasm stems from an address by Pence to the U.S. 31 Coalition at
a luncheon on Jan. 15 in Indianapolis. The governor, Hannon said, pledged his support for the
ongoing upgrades and improvements, down the road, for the U.S. 31 segments not impacted by
the current work...
U.S. 31 upgrade to Indy: "˜Going gangbusters' (http://us31coalition.com/images/US_31_Upgrade_to_Indy.pdf) (Elkhart Truth and US 31 Coalition)
More US 31 news in the Kokomo Tribune & Indy Star today. The completion of the full US 31 corridor from Indianapolis to South Bend is a priority of the governor's.
http://www.indystar.com/article/20130210/NEWS05/302100346/Gov-Pence-prioritizes-3-road-projects-How-will-they-paid-
http://kokomotribune.com/local/x1303546110/Completing-U-S-31-a-priority
Quote
http://kokomotribune.com/local/x1303546110/Completing-U-S-31-a-priority
Once completed Bagwell said there will be only two railroad crossings that could slow traffic between Indianapolis and South Bend. One is the railroad crossing in Tipton County between Ind. 28 and Division Road and the second is in Lakeville.
There is no railroad crossing in Lakeville. There is one south of Plymouth between 13th and 14th roads.
I'm updating this after looking at the some recently released specs on the signs for the new US 31 freeway from Plymouth to South Bend. I don't remember if it has been mentioned elsewhere, but there will be exit tabs at the exits for the highway. Control cities along the freeway are South Bend and Plymouth. Going north for U.S. 30, the control cities on the mileage signs are South Bend, Niles and Benton Harbor and going south are Plymouth and Kokomo, with no mention of Indianapolis except at the US 20/31 interchange. Here's a rundown of each exit and their destinations listed.
-Exit 225 A-B: US 30, Warsaw/Plymouth (nothing new except new modern signage here)
-Exit 233: US 6, Walkerton/Bremen (no mention of Lapaz at all)
-Exit 239: SR 4, North Liberty/LaPorte (with smaller signs for Potato Creek SP and Lakeville)
-Exit 245: Kern Rd.
-Exit 246 A-B: US 20, Michigan City/Elkhart (nothing new there)
Signage around the US 20/US 31 interchange looks about the same as it does now in terms of destinations, only that the US 31 signage is being updated. Also, the signage around the Kern Road interchange looks a little different from the rest of the highway, with the first letter being a bit bigger than the rest of the word. I don't know specific fonts but it's a little different from the rest.
Took a drive yesterday on the roads crossing the new construction, and I noticed BGSs erected for the SR-4 exit. I was too far away to get a decent picture with my phone. I'll have to go back with a real camera or take a walk down the road.
From the April 10 letting's apparent results, it looks like Rieth Riley won the contract that ties in the new road to the old. See http://www.in.gov/dot/div/contracts/letting/archive/2013/apr03/apparent04-10-13.pdf (http://www.in.gov/dot/div/contracts/letting/archive/2013/apr03/apparent04-10-13.pdf).
Back to the sign plans, they don't show 7th Road interchange which is due to be let 10/9/2013. Presumably, that will be exit 228, but I still wonder if these numbers are correct. They seem to be consistent with the Kokomo US 31 exit numbers which don't seem to be consistent with the Hamilton County ones. The Hamiltion County exit numbers seem to reflect US 31 following I-465 while the others seem to be based on US 31 going through Indy on Meridian St.
Here are some of the actual INDOT drawings to supplement the description in a previous post:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31-US30-Dwg-1.jpg&hash=0065065c0596bde8359f25b9c3453b914d1d0c25) (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31-US6-Dwg-1.jpg&hash=36960a5918a998c2e70c0625682b953c627df4c5)
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31-SR4-Dwg-1.jpg&hash=34882a4582ac68749fb00bbc3e0ceb4d007946c0) (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31-KernRd-Dwg-1.jpg&hash=2450c781a2487a052f1af6f23ea2d2ea0bc5ef2e)
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31-US20-Dwg-1.jpg&hash=f2e8d66f2d5e58585ef6cadb784194e1242d5ebd) (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31-US20-Dwg-2.jpg&hash=cc3c4aa371c717822491212383a9c15979085c27)
^^ With the mis-sized lower case letters on rhe exit 245 and 246 A_B signs?
Quote from: Big John on April 13, 2013, 01:28:55 PM
^^ With the mis-sized lower case letters on rhe exit 245 and 246 A_B signs?
Yes, that looks brutal. Hopefully that gets corrected.
I just started to wonder about this, but once the freeway sections and signs are up, showing the new exit numbers along US 31, will they put up exit tabs at the interchanges with US 24 in Peru and SR 25 in Rochester? Any idea what exit numbers those would be?
Quote from: tdindy88 on April 13, 2013, 07:28:48 PM
I just started to wonder about this, but once the freeway sections and signs are up, showing the new exit numbers along US 31, will they put up exit tabs at the interchanges with US 24 in Peru and SR 25 in Rochester? Any idea what exit numbers those would be?
My guess is that it would be less likely at US 24 and SR 25, but somewhat more likely (eventually) on St. Joseph Valley Parkway section because there are more exits in a shorter distance.
Makes sense in the grand scheme of things, but it does open up the idea of putting exit numbers along the bypass to the east of the US 31 interchange, using I presume the mile markers along US 20.
Will old US 31 become SR 931 like in Kokomo?
I think current US 31 mainly goes back to the county, and a little bit to the city. A block or two north of Kern Road will be removed.
Quote from: tdindy88 on April 14, 2013, 12:33:36 PM
Makes sense in the grand scheme of things, but it does open up the idea of putting exit numbers along the bypass to the east of the US 31 interchange, using I presume the mile markers along US 20.
I was driving the concurrent US 20/31 section of the SJVP recently and noticed that the mile markers for the section use mileages for US 20. There are no exit numbers. That made me wonder if the mile markers might be revised when 31 is complete. It also brings into question whether exit numbers will be applied for the section. I always felt that there should be exit numbers to help travelers find the right exit. There are several ramps marked "South Bend" with nothing to distinguish them otherwise.
Quote from: mukade on April 14, 2013, 06:06:13 PM
I think current US 31 mainly goes back to the county, and a little bit to the city. A block or two north of Kern Road will be removed.
Yes, it is all going back to local jurisdictions.
http://www.wndu.com/home/headlines/Stretch-of-US-6-to-Close-for-New-US-31-Project-209161291.html
MARSHALL COUNTY, Ind. — The Indiana Department of Transportation (INDOT) announces the closure of U.S. 6 between U.S. 31 and Lilac Road beginning Monday, June 3rd through early September 2013. The closure is necessary to ensure driver safety while crews work on the U.S. 31/U.S. 6 interchange for the new U.S. 31 project.
A detour will take eastbound traffic south on U.S. 31, east on U.S. 30, north on S.R. 331, and back to U.S. 6. Westbound traffic will travel south on S.R. 331, west on U.S. 30, north on U.S. 31, and back to U.S. 6.
INDOT reminds drivers to use caution and consider worker safety when driving through a construction zone. For the latest road closures and news from INDOT, like us at www.Facebook.com/INDOTNorthwest and follow us at www.Twitter.com/INDOTNorthwest.
So will this entire corridor be complete and opened by next year?
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 29, 2013, 10:16:08 AM
So will this entire corridor be complete and opened by next year?
The latest info I've seen says that Kokomo will open Fall 2013, SB-Plymouth will open Fall 2014, and Hamilton County will open Fall 2015.
Beams for the Fellows St. overpass over the existing St. Joseph Valley Parkway (US 20) will be erected next week. This is part of the US 31 South Bend project, to provide access for residents south of the SJVP who are losing access via US 31. Traffic will be disrupted on the SJVP, between the Ironwood and Michigan St. exits, off-and-on during the week. See here for details: http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/sbt-periodic-us-20-bypass-closures-planned-20130529,0,1119654.story (http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/sbt-periodic-us-20-bypass-closures-planned-20130529,0,1119654.story)
Quote from: theline on May 29, 2013, 07:44:09 PM
Beams for the Fellows St. overpass over the existing St. Joseph Valley Parkway (US 20) will be erected next week. This is part of the US 31 South Bend project, to provide access for residents south of the SJVP who are losing access via US 31. Traffic will be disrupted on the SJVP, between the Ironwood and Michigan St. exits, off-and-on during the week. See here for details: http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/sbt-periodic-us-20-bypass-closures-planned-20130529,0,1119654.story (http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/sbt-periodic-us-20-bypass-closures-planned-20130529,0,1119654.story)
This is happening today. Good day to avoid this part of US 20.
Quote from: cabiness42 on May 29, 2013, 10:34:58 AM
Quote from: silverback1065 on May 29, 2013, 10:16:08 AM
So will this entire corridor be complete and opened by next year?
The latest info I've seen says that Kokomo will open Fall 2013, SB-Plymouth will open Fall 2014, and Hamilton County will open Fall 2015.
It looks like the South Bend to Plymouth section will be just like the Kokomo one in that almost the entire road except the tie-ins will be done a year before opening. Even the signs are erected on the unopened highway in both Kokomo and south of South Bend. As you would expect, the opposite is the case in Hamilton County where the existing road is being upgraded rather than re-routed. As a small section is completed, it opens.
The tie-ins are coming along nicely in Kokomo and look like they will done late this year as planned. Southbound lane PCCP pavement has been laid on the north side of town.
Article in the SB Tribune that basically says everything is on schedule: http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/local/article_2670d8ac-e8f8-11e2-8467-0019bb30f31a.html
Video of dirt being moved at Kern Rd: http://www.southbendtribune.com/multimedia/videos/video_74445b88-e8c3-11e2-974d-0019bb30f31a.html
Here's a cheesy INDOT construction safety video that was filmed on this new stretch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u71EZ3ZvYFs&sns=em
Short story about construction along with a couple aerial photos.
http://www.southbendtribune.com/about/newsletters/article_6d575aa6-0663-11e3-9e46-001a4bcf6878.html
^^ Interesting photos, but the reporter wrote inaccurate captions for both.
Photo 1: "This view looks south at a new U.S. 31 interchange between U.S. 20 and U.S. 6." U.S. 20 is nowhere near this picture. I believe this is a south-facing view of the new U.S. 31-U.S. 6 intersection, many miles south of U.S. 20.
Photo 2: "the new U.S. 31 returns to the old route near Roosevelt Road." Actually, the new road passes over the old route near Roosevelt, and does not return to the old alignment for many miles, south of U.S. 6.
Photo 1 is a picture of the SR 4 interchange, which is indeed between US 20 & US 6 (neither of which are shown in the photo). I'd say the reporter was overly vague, labelling general project limits instead of the actual location of the picture, but not inaccurate.
http://www.in.gov/activecalendar/EventList.aspx?view=EventDetails&eventidn=123932&information_id=187511&type=&syndicate=syndicate
QuoteSOUTH BEND, Ind. — The Indiana Department of Transportation (INDOT) announces ramp and lane restrictions in addition to a single, 20 minute complete closure of U.S. 31 just south of the U.S. 20 Bypass on Thursday, September 5th. Crews will be removing the overhead signage on U.S. 31 just south of the U.S. 20 Bypass access point.
Beginning around 7 a.m. Thursday, September 5th, between Johnson Road and the U.S. 20 Bypass, the northbound right lane of U.S. 31 will close, along with two U.S. 20 Bypass ramps: the ramp from eastbound U.S. 20 to southbound U.S. 31 and the ramp from northbound U.S. 31 to eastbound U.S. 20 (map attached).
Sometime between 10 a.m. and 2 p.m. crews will use cranes to remove the signage over U.S. 31 in this area, forcing a complete closure of U.S. 31 for about 20 minutes, between Johnson Road and the U.S. 20 Bypass.
To avoid delays drivers are encouraged to avoid this stretch of U.S. 31 entirely on Thursday, September 5th.
New photos of the northern end of the construction have been posted on the official site. They're rather small, but interesting.
Aerial photos: http://us31plysb.com/2013aerialsnorth.html (http://us31plysb.com/2013aerialsnorth.html)
On the ground: http://us31plysb.com/ConstructionPhotos2013.html (http://us31plysb.com/ConstructionPhotos2013.html)
The contract for the new 7th Road interchange will be awarded to Primco, which built significant parts of the US 31 Kokomo and Hoosier Heartland (SR 25) projects: http://www.in.gov/dot/div/contracts/letting/archive/2013/oct09/OFFICIAL100913.pdf (http://www.in.gov/dot/div/contracts/letting/archive/2013/oct09/OFFICIAL100913.pdf).
That interchange should be the final contract in the South Bend to Plymouth upgrade.
^ And it is the final contract for the South Bend-Plymouth upgrade, per the press release issued today: http://www.us31plysb.com/assets/LastUS31contractawarded.pdf (http://www.us31plysb.com/assets/LastUS31contractawarded.pdf)
There are several interesting quotes regarding this project and others:
Quote"This is an exciting time for Northern Indiana with the recent completion of the Hoosier Heartland between Lafayette and Fort Wayne and plans to open the new U.S. 31 in Kokomo to Thanksgiving travelers," said Governor Mike Pence. "We are finishing what we started by having the three new U.S. 31 sections fully under contract."
When the final Hamilton County section opens to traffic in 2015, a total of 32 stoplights will have been removed from U.S. 31 between Indianapolis and South Bend, saving drivers a half hour of travel time. . . .
Before the Thanksgiving travel holiday, 13 miles of new U.S. 31 freeway will open with five new interchanges just east of Kokomo. The $155 million project circumvents 15 traffic signals and more than 130 access points along the existing U.S. 31 in Kokomo. The 20-mile U.S. 31 corridor between U.S. 30 in Plymouth and the U.S. 20 bypass in South Bend includes 15 miles of new highway alignment and four new interchanges. The $225 million section is scheduled to open to traffic by the end of 2014.
The $342 million U.S. 31 Hamilton County project upgrades 13 miles of existing U.S. 31 between I-465 in Carmel and State Road 38 near Westfield, including nine new interchanges. . . .
INDOT earlier this year announced a separate project to build a new U.S. 31 interchange at State Road 28 near the 800,000-square-foot Chrysler Tipton Transmission Plant. Construction of the estimated $17 million interchange is scheduled to begin in 2015.
Quote
The 20-mile U.S. 31 corridor between U.S. 30 in Plymouth and the U.S. 20 bypass in South Bend includes 15 miles of new highway alignment and four new interchanges. The $225 million section is scheduled to open to traffic by the end of 2014.
As the new US 31 freeway already comes up to the existing one near US 20 and south of LaPaz. I hope it will not be another November opening for this project (as Kokomo was). I understand the 7th Road interchange will probably take the whole construction season.
There's still much to be done, especially at both spots where the freeway ties into the existing road. They certainly will not open up the new freeway at the north end until Jackson Road and Fellows Street are complete to not leave the Gilmer Park neighborhood isolated from the rest of South Bend. Though the bridges for both Jackson and Fellows are substantially done, much needs to be done of the approaches. I don't know if INDOT would open the freeway before the Johnson Road overpass is done. Construction has yet to start on it.
As for the 7th Road interchange, I hope they don't wait to open the freeway until it's completed. Before completion of the interchange, access to Plymouth from the north would still be available as it is today from old 31, leading south from US 6.
The Fellows Street overpass is now open. Fellows now continues smoothly south from Ireland Road to Jackson Road. Construction of the Jackson Road overpass, crossing new/old 31, is moving along. Still significant work on the approaches though.
In related work, the city of South Bend has extended Barbie Street west from Michigan Street to Lafayette. They are improving Barbie, Follows, and Lafayette to provide some relief to the overtaxed Ireland-Michigan intersection.
Quote from: mukade on November 08, 2013, 06:34:38 AM
Quote
The 20-mile U.S. 31 corridor between U.S. 30 in Plymouth and the U.S. 20 bypass in South Bend includes 15 miles of new highway alignment and four new interchanges. The $225 million section is scheduled to open to traffic by the end of 2014.
As the new US 31 freeway already comes up to the existing one near US 20 and south of LaPaz. I hope it will not be another November opening for this project (as Kokomo was). I understand the 7th Road interchange will probably take the whole construction season.
I think you can expect this project to open in November 2014.
Good news: INDOT has announced that the new road may open as early as mid-July. This comes as a surprise, since they had long predicted a late-year opening. While they are building the tie-ins to the existing road at each end, there no doubt comes a time that it's easier to route the traffic to the new pavement rather than maintaining the connection to the old. I wonder if the 7th Road interchange will be ready for traffic that soon, but that might not be a show-stopper.
Here is the story from WNDU-TV: http://www.wndu.com/home/headlines/New-US-31-SB-to-Plymouth-to-open-mid-to-late-July---255690451.html (http://www.wndu.com/home/headlines/New-US-31-SB-to-Plymouth-to-open-mid-to-late-July---255690451.html)
The report says lane restrictions in the northern construction zone will go into effect tomorrow, April 21, but I had to drive through there single file a week ago. Avoid the area if you're in a hurry.
I was through there twice last weekend and I find this report surprising based on my wholly uneducated quick look as I drove past the two tie-in ends.
On the southern end it appeared nothing had been done since last Fall. Not surprising given the severe winter. The northern end looked much further along.
The report didn't mention the southern end. I wonder if they would consider opening the rest of the highway if only the US 6 to southern tie in is not complete?
The video showed the interchange with US 20 as exit 246. The US 30 interchange is now exit 225.
Quote from: mukade on April 21, 2014, 06:52:58 AM
The video showed the interchange with US 20 as exit 246. The US 30 interchange is now exit 225.
Last weekend the new sign for the Northbound US 30 exit was up, partially hidden right behind the existing sign. I did not see a new sign Southbound - imagine it might be up by now.
Quote from: ysuindy on April 21, 2014, 06:46:22 AM
I was through there twice last weekend and I find this report surprising based on my wholly uneducated quick look as I drove past the two tie-in ends.
On the southern end it appeared nothing had been done since last Fall. Not surprising given the severe winter. The northern end looked much further along.
The report didn't mention the southern end. I wonder if they would consider opening the rest of the highway if only the US 6 to southern tie in is not complete?
I went through over the weekend as well and I would agree that the southern junction has a long way to go and having it open by July seems very optimistic.
I have not been by there in months, but...
1) If you would have seen the southern US 31/SR 931 tie in (in Kokomo) a month before it opened, you can see how fast they can move as long as the weather holds. The old carriageway was still being used less than a month before the new roadway was open to traffic.
2) They could use US 6 to the new freeway while they complete the tie-in, couldn't they?
With a son at Notre Dame, I've been through Kokomo and South Bend quite a bit since August. I agree they got a lot done in the last month before opening at the South tie-in. I never thought they were going to make it. But I don't see the tie-in near Plymouth being anywhere near what the south Kokomo tie-in was last August. Two weeks ago it looked exactly like it would have three months ago when you last saw it (well except for there was no snow now).
While I haven't checked out the interchange at Route 6, I don't see why they couldn't it open the new road to US 6 if everything else is done except the south tie-in. It would still be a big benefit - probably would need to adjust the left turn lane at current 31.
I'm headed up that way again this weekend. I'll be interested to see what has changed at each end over the past two week. I would be thrilled with a mid-July opening. I would like nothing more than my trip home to move my son out in May to be the last time I get to go through the speed trap that is Lakeville.
Work really moving now at the north end. From the project website:
US 31 between Kern Road and US 20 is now one lane in each direction, as crews work to connect the lanes of the New US 31 to existing US 31 over the coming months.
From now through most of the summer, US 31 will be restricted to one lane in each direction, and traffic merging onto US 31 from US 20 will now yield to through traffic. INDOT is working to alleviate any traffic delays and congestion by adjusting traffic signals in the area to facilitate north-south traffic flow.
Despite adjustments, traffic volume in the area may lead to back-ups on US 31 and on the US 20 Bypass exit ramp for traffic accessing southbound US 31. Drivers are encouraged to find alternative routes to avoid delays.
Johnson Road is now closed at US 31 for new bridge construction st. Access to and from Johnson Road at US 31 will be closed permanently at this time.
The Jackson Road bridge over US 31 and Main Street between US 31 and Jackson Road are now open.
Next month INDOT is opening the new road to bicyclists for one day in a unique event: http://www.southbendtribune.com/life/travel/outdoor/bike-on-new-us-before-cars-do/article_b172704a-dac0-11e3-809a-0017a43b2370.html (http://www.southbendtribune.com/life/travel/outdoor/bike-on-new-us-before-cars-do/article_b172704a-dac0-11e3-809a-0017a43b2370.html)
Quote
Before it opens to cars and semis, a stretch of the newly built U.S. 31 will open up to bicyclists for one morning, on June 14, to cap off Michiana Bike to Work Week.
This organized ride is called "Bike 31: One and Done" for good reason.
It will be the only time the public will be permitted on the new highway before it's open.
Construction of the north tie-in to the existing road is progressing well. The existing west carriageway has been demolished to accommodate grading of the tie-in.
QuoteInDOT hopes to open most of the new U.S. 31 to cars between South Bend and Plymouth by July or August, with some lane restrictions, he [Matt Deitchley, InDOT spokesman] said. The state hopes to have all lanes fully open by the year's end.
Both directions of traffic now occupy the east carriageway in the area of the north tie-in. My guess is that all traffic will be switched over new west lanes and continuing down the new road, as soon as the west lanes are ready. That accounts for the July-to-August opening date.
QuoteInDOT hopes to open most of the new U.S. 31 to cars between South Bend and Plymouth by July or August, with some lane restrictions, he [Matt Deitchley, InDOT spokesman] said. The state hopes to have all lanes fully open by the year's end.
Both directions of traffic now occupy the east carriageway in the area of the north tie-in. My guess is that all traffic will be switched over new west lanes and continuing down the new road, as soon as the west lanes are ready. That accounts for the July-to-August opening date.
[/quote]
That makes a lot of sense and something that would seem doable, especially at the North end. Last week there still didn't seem like much was being done at the South end.
I've also realized since my "they will never make it" post earlier that the tie-ins will not look like those in Kokomo with ramps to take the old road over the new to complete the tie-in.
^^ Yeah, at the north end, the old road will veer under the new freeway to tie in with Main Street. This underpass has already been built and is open. In fact, I drove it recently.
At the south end, the old road will not be tied into the new. No overpasses will be needed, so the switchover will be rather easy. I've not been down there since the season began, so I can't report on progress there.
Quote from: theline on May 14, 2014, 09:17:49 PM
Next month INDOT is opening the new road to bicyclists for one day in a unique event: http://www.southbendtribune.com/life/travel/outdoor/bike-on-new-us-before-cars-do/article_b172704a-dac0-11e3-809a-0017a43b2370.html (http://www.southbendtribune.com/life/travel/outdoor/bike-on-new-us-before-cars-do/article_b172704a-dac0-11e3-809a-0017a43b2370.html)
Quote
Before it opens to cars and semis, a stretch of the newly built U.S. 31 will open up to bicyclists for one morning, on June 14, to cap off Michiana Bike to Work Week.
This organized ride is called "Bike 31: One and Done" for good reason.
It will be the only time the public will be permitted on the new highway before it's open.
The bicycle event on the new road occurred today. You can read the details here: http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/hundreds-of-cyclists-check-out-new-stretch-of-u-s/article_77bc6022-f3f2-11e3-85e5-0017a43b2370.html (http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/hundreds-of-cyclists-check-out-new-stretch-of-u-s/article_77bc6022-f3f2-11e3-85e5-0017a43b2370.html)
Click on the link in the article to view a photo gallery. You can see the participants, as well as some views of the road and signage. I was amused by the two riders on penny farthings (old-fashioned high-wheeler bikes).
I went to South Bend yesterday, and it is again difficult to see how the new road will be open by the end of July. At the southern end, a bridge over a creek has been completely removed so that alone seems to be a big challenge. I was also surprised that they are only now starting to lay concrete for the US 6 interchange ramps. The new overpass at the southern tie-in also would need to be at a certain point before the road opened, but I think that is possible. Finally, the Kern Road interchange and widening still has a long way to go.
The new interchange at 7th Road is still a long way from being done, but that has nothing to do with the new route from LaPaz to South Bend opening up. I would guess this would open up Thanksgiving week which is the normal INDOT MO.
All that said, the northbound carriageway at the south tie-in is shaped and not too far from being paved, and the north tie-in has really come a long way since I was there last fall. When I looked at I-69 in 2012 and US 31 in Kokomo in 2013, I never would have guessed they would do so much in so short a time, but in both those cases, the weather cooperated. I would guess it wouldn't be too hard to see how the new road might be in use by the end of August. I doubt that the project would be fully completed until next Spring. Even the Kokomo US 31 and SR 25 projects are still getting finishing touches now.
Article in today's SB Tribune: http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/local/u-s-coming-along/article_c8d0fda6-f6cc-11e3-9381-001a4bcf6878.html
Not a lot there, but it does specifically state "the fall" for the opening. So I guess INDOT's previous target of "July or August" is no longer the target.
The Tribune article also links to two interesting graphics, a reasonably detailed "map" of the project and a photo of north end construction seen from the also-under-construction Johnson Road overpass.
I still think the disparity between target dates can be explained by what is being targeted. The July/August target has always gone with the phrase "switching traffic to the new lanes." I take that to mean switching traffic to the new route, perhaps with just two lanes open around the north and south tie-ins, while construction continues. The fall target is associated with the highway being "open," which I take to mean all lanes open and traffic fully flowing. Some details may still remain until 2015, similar to what we've seen with other recent projects.
Traveled past the south tie-in and US6 interchange sites yesterday. South tie-in does not have any pavement yet anywhere in sight and looks a long way from being done. From what I can see, the US 6 interchange looks mostly complete.
I sent a Twitter message to the INDOT Northwest District in about when the road would open.
Here is the response - obviously light on details in 140 characters.
@INDOTNorthwest
@ysuindy @INDOT_ECentral US 31 between Plymouth and SB will be open to traffic by end of August.
I will be up there August 24 to move my son in for the school year. It would be nice if the new road was at least partially open.
I was just reading on the website's FAQ page that they were able to give away the former (will be former) US 31 to Marshall County and Lapaz and South Bend but not able to do so within St. Joseph County outside of South Bend and that that stretch will still be under INDOT control. Anyone heard anything about this and whether it means this will be a new highway?
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 16, 2014, 05:53:57 PM
I was just reading on the website's FAQ page that they were able to give away the former (will be former) US 31 to Marshall County and Lapaz and South Bend but not able to do so within St. Joseph County outside of South Bend and that that stretch will still be under INDOT control. Anyone heard anything about this and whether it means this will be a new highway?
it will likely go unsigned like us 52 in west lafayette (from the new bypass to the wabash river bridge)
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 16, 2014, 05:53:57 PM
I was just reading on the website's FAQ page that they were able to give away the former (will be former) US 31 to Marshall County and Lapaz and South Bend but not able to do so within St. Joseph County outside of South Bend and that that stretch will still be under INDOT control. Anyone heard anything about this and whether it means this will be a new highway?
Since Indiana does discontinuous segments of the same number, it would most likely be another 931, though as was noted above may not get signed.
wont this be an island sr? I don't think it will connect to anything on either end, or even cross another sr for that matter.
I don't know if there will be direct access to Old 31 from the Kern Rd. interchange, but if not, it would be only a couple hundred feet away.
The road will still intersect 4 in Lakeville.
If the southern end is the Marshall/St. Joseph line, then no, it wouldn't connect to anything at that end. It would be 2 miles away from US 6.
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 18, 2014, 09:33:08 AM
I don't know if there will be direct access to Old 31 from the Kern Rd. interchange, but if not, it would be only a couple hundred feet away.
The road will still intersect 4 in Lakeville.
If the southern end is the Marshall/St. Joseph line, then no, it wouldn't connect to anything at that end. It would be 2 miles away from US 6.
They should sign it as 931, but I doubt it will be signed at all.
Quote from: mukade on November 12, 2011, 11:12:15 PM
On a recent trip through South Bend, I took a look at progress on the US 31 project. This is a 20 mile freeway upgrade project that goes from US 20 in South Bend south to US 30 in Plymouth. Of that length, 15 miles are being built on a new terrain, and from US 30 north for five miles will use the existing roadway. The new road is planned to be open in 2014.
Among the problems are peat deposits that require removal of a substantial amount of material. This is an article from a contractor, ES Wagner (http://www.eswagner.com/projects/detail.aspx?id=2977252a-3682-45f2-84a8-3b6283750847). Other questions are answered on the INDOT FAQ page (http://us31plysb.com/faq.html). Some of the project can already be seen in Google Maps (http://maps.google.com/maps?q=lakeville,+IN&hl=en&ll=41.524516,-86.273232&spn=0.067472,0.1684&sll=41.511534,-86.262932&sspn=0.067485,0.1684&vpsrc=6&hnear=Lakeville,+St+Joseph,+Indiana&t=h&z=13) east of Lakeville and Lapaz.
Remaining contracts to be let:
- 02/08/2012 Jackson Road over US 31, various roads over US 20
- 03/07/2012 Connecting existing highway to new highway (half mile north of US 6) and new US 6 interchange
- 04/04/2012 Kern Road interchange
- 10/11/2012 7th Road Interchange, resurface existing US 31
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2F1stRdAtUS31.jpg&hash=0ef7019cd2514ef22d8fa335b6e418f7316e712a)
1st Road overpass
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31FromTyler.jpg&hash=25b992aa078c2bfd308e19e35223626d5b4718a0)
Looking north from Tyler Rd.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FSR4-US31.jpg&hash=8cf837d933ee0d6e312a1f35b11f7ed4323e6e43)
Pierce Rd - SR 4 extension to new US 31
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31OldUS31.jpg&hash=8513e85b80aedfc5556b8646cc97480732052d0e)
New US 31 crossing existing US 31
Why is good farm land being destroyed?
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on July 18, 2014, 01:59:33 PM
Quote from: mukade on November 12, 2011, 11:12:15 PM
On a recent trip through South Bend, I took a look at progress on the US 31 project. This is a 20 mile freeway upgrade project that goes from US 20 in South Bend south to US 30 in Plymouth. Of that length, 15 miles are being built on a new terrain, and from US 30 north for five miles will use the existing roadway. The new road is planned to be open in 2014.
Among the problems are peat deposits that require removal of a substantial amount of material. This is an article from a contractor, ES Wagner (http://www.eswagner.com/projects/detail.aspx?id=2977252a-3682-45f2-84a8-3b6283750847). Other questions are answered on the INDOT FAQ page (http://us31plysb.com/faq.html). Some of the project can already be seen in Google Maps (http://maps.google.com/maps?q=lakeville,+IN&hl=en&ll=41.524516,-86.273232&spn=0.067472,0.1684&sll=41.511534,-86.262932&sspn=0.067485,0.1684&vpsrc=6&hnear=Lakeville,+St+Joseph,+Indiana&t=h&z=13) east of Lakeville and Lapaz.
Remaining contracts to be let:
- 02/08/2012 Jackson Road over US 31, various roads over US 20
- 03/07/2012 Connecting existing highway to new highway (half mile north of US 6) and new US 6 interchange
- 04/04/2012 Kern Road interchange
- 10/11/2012 7th Road Interchange, resurface existing US 31
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2F1stRdAtUS31.jpg&hash=0ef7019cd2514ef22d8fa335b6e418f7316e712a)
1st Road overpass
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31FromTyler.jpg&hash=25b992aa078c2bfd308e19e35223626d5b4718a0)
Looking north from Tyler Rd.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FSR4-US31.jpg&hash=8cf837d933ee0d6e312a1f35b11f7ed4323e6e43)
Pierce Rd - SR 4 extension to new US 31
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31OldUS31.jpg&hash=8513e85b80aedfc5556b8646cc97480732052d0e)
New US 31 crossing existing US 31
Why is good farm land being destroyed?
To make way for a new highway.
I'm beginning to think that he doesn't want any new roads built. First the I-69 bridges and now this.
Of course, I'm one of those who thinks that US 31 was fine as it was as a four-lane surface route and a freeway wasn't needed.
Quote from: hbelkins on July 18, 2014, 03:18:42 PM
I'm beginning to think that he doesn't want any new roads built. First the I-69 bridges and now this.
Of course, I'm one of those who thinks that US 31 was fine as it was as a four-lane surface route and a freeway wasn't needed.
It is most definitely needed. A lot of accidents involving cars slowing to make left turns getting rear-ended.
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 18, 2014, 03:30:42 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on July 18, 2014, 03:18:42 PM
I'm beginning to think that he doesn't want any new roads built. First the I-69 bridges and now this.
Of course, I'm one of those who thinks that US 31 was fine as it was as a four-lane surface route and a freeway wasn't needed.
It is most definitely needed. A lot of accidents involving cars slowing to make left turns getting rear-ended.
That's why you build turning lanes or a mountable median.
Quote from: hbelkins on July 18, 2014, 08:06:52 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 18, 2014, 03:30:42 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on July 18, 2014, 03:18:42 PM
I'm beginning to think that he doesn't want any new roads built. First the I-69 bridges and now this.
Of course, I'm one of those who thinks that US 31 was fine as it was as a four-lane surface route and a freeway wasn't needed.
It is most definitely needed. A lot of accidents involving cars slowing to make left turns getting rear-ended.
That's why you build turning lanes or a mountable median.
US 31 needs to be an interstate from Indianapolis to traverse city Michigan, with the amount of traffic it gets, it is embarrassing that it has taken this long for that process to happen. The road carries a lot of truck traffic, as well as local and tourist traffic. I-67 in southern indiana is completely useless
There's also the whole driving through towns such as Lapaz and Lakeville with the speed traps that are in them.
Quote from: hbelkins on July 18, 2014, 08:06:52 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 18, 2014, 03:30:42 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on July 18, 2014, 03:18:42 PM
I'm beginning to think that he doesn't want any new roads built. First the I-69 bridges and now this.
Of course, I'm one of those who thinks that US 31 was fine as it was as a four-lane surface route and a freeway wasn't needed.
It is most definitely needed. A lot of accidents involving cars slowing to make left turns getting rear-ended.
That's why you build turning lanes or a mountable median.
Adding a 5th lane would have cost quite a few houses, plus I'm not sure a left turn lane is really feasible with the way property entrances are spaced. Risk of cars going opposite directions entering the turn lane at some point.
How much have you actually traveled this stretch of road???
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on July 18, 2014, 01:59:33 PM
Quote from: mukade on November 12, 2011, 11:12:15 PM
On a recent trip through South Bend, I took a look at progress on the US 31 project. This is a 20 mile freeway upgrade project that goes from US 20 in South Bend south to US 30 in Plymouth. Of that length, 15 miles are being built on a new terrain, and from US 30 north for five miles will use the existing roadway. The new road is planned to be open in 2014.
Among the problems are peat deposits that require removal of a substantial amount of material. This is an article from a contractor, ES Wagner (http://www.eswagner.com/projects/detail.aspx?id=2977252a-3682-45f2-84a8-3b6283750847). Other questions are answered on the INDOT FAQ page (http://us31plysb.com/faq.html). Some of the project can already be seen in Google Maps (http://maps.google.com/maps?q=lakeville,+IN&hl=en&ll=41.524516,-86.273232&spn=0.067472,0.1684&sll=41.511534,-86.262932&sspn=0.067485,0.1684&vpsrc=6&hnear=Lakeville,+St+Joseph,+Indiana&t=h&z=13) east of Lakeville and Lapaz.
Remaining contracts to be let:
- 02/08/2012 Jackson Road over US 31, various roads over US 20
- 03/07/2012 Connecting existing highway to new highway (half mile north of US 6) and new US 6 interchange
- 04/04/2012 Kern Road interchange
- 10/11/2012 7th Road Interchange, resurface existing US 31
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2F1stRdAtUS31.jpg&hash=0ef7019cd2514ef22d8fa335b6e418f7316e712a)
1st Road overpass
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31FromTyler.jpg&hash=25b992aa078c2bfd308e19e35223626d5b4718a0)
Looking north from Tyler Rd.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FSR4-US31.jpg&hash=8cf837d933ee0d6e312a1f35b11f7ed4323e6e43)
Pierce Rd - SR 4 extension to new US 31
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31OldUS31.jpg&hash=8513e85b80aedfc5556b8646cc97480732052d0e)
New US 31 crossing existing US 31
Why is good farm land being destroyed?
Because it's hard to find bad farmland to destroy in the area!
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 20, 2014, 09:45:59 AM
How much have you actually traveled this stretch of road???
I drove the entire length from the end of former IN 431 to South Bend several years ago.
Quote from: Terry Shea on July 20, 2014, 09:58:55 AM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on July 18, 2014, 01:59:33 PM
Quote from: mukade on November 12, 2011, 11:12:15 PM
On a recent trip through South Bend, I took a look at progress on the US 31 project. This is a 20 mile freeway upgrade project that goes from US 20 in South Bend south to US 30 in Plymouth. Of that length, 15 miles are being built on a new terrain, and from US 30 north for five miles will use the existing roadway. The new road is planned to be open in 2014.
Among the problems are peat deposits that require removal of a substantial amount of material. This is an article from a contractor, ES Wagner (http://www.eswagner.com/projects/detail.aspx?id=2977252a-3682-45f2-84a8-3b6283750847). Other questions are answered on the INDOT FAQ page (http://us31plysb.com/faq.html). Some of the project can already be seen in Google Maps (http://maps.google.com/maps?q=lakeville,+IN&hl=en&ll=41.524516,-86.273232&spn=0.067472,0.1684&sll=41.511534,-86.262932&sspn=0.067485,0.1684&vpsrc=6&hnear=Lakeville,+St+Joseph,+Indiana&t=h&z=13) east of Lakeville and Lapaz.
Remaining contracts to be let:
- 02/08/2012 Jackson Road over US 31, various roads over US 20
- 03/07/2012 Connecting existing highway to new highway (half mile north of US 6) and new US 6 interchange
- 04/04/2012 Kern Road interchange
- 10/11/2012 7th Road Interchange, resurface existing US 31
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2F1stRdAtUS31.jpg&hash=0ef7019cd2514ef22d8fa335b6e418f7316e712a)
1st Road overpass
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31FromTyler.jpg&hash=25b992aa078c2bfd308e19e35223626d5b4718a0)
Looking north from Tyler Rd.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FSR4-US31.jpg&hash=8cf837d933ee0d6e312a1f35b11f7ed4323e6e43)
Pierce Rd - SR 4 extension to new US 31
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31OldUS31.jpg&hash=8513e85b80aedfc5556b8646cc97480732052d0e)
New US 31 crossing existing US 31
Why is good farm land being destroyed?
Because it's hard to find bad farmland to destroy in the area!
Not a traffic light in sight. Looks like an adequate road to me.
Quote from: hbelkins on July 20, 2014, 03:22:47 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 20, 2014, 09:45:59 AM
How much have you actually traveled this stretch of road???
I drove the entire length from the end of former IN 431 to South Bend several years ago.
I've driven lots of roads in Kentucky one time, and I wouldn't pretend that I know better than you what road improvements are and aren't best for Kentucky.
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on July 20, 2014, 07:04:30 PM
Not a traffic light in sight. Looks like an adequate road to me.
Current traffic lights:
Johnson Rd.
Kern Rd.
New Rd. has only a blinking yellow but is a dangerous intersection and would probably have needed a traffic light soon.
SR 4
US 6
Plus many, many houses and businesses directly accessed from the road, which leads to cars slowing to make turns in front of faster moving cars. Union-North schools are on this road, and there are frequent problems at the beginning and end of school days. There need to be separate routes for local and thru traffic, which is what we are not going to have.
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 21, 2014, 08:04:22 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on July 20, 2014, 03:22:47 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 20, 2014, 09:45:59 AM
How much have you actually traveled this stretch of road???
I drove the entire length from the end of former IN 431 to South Bend several years ago.
I've driven lots of roads in Kentucky one time, and I wouldn't pretend that I know better than you what road improvements are and aren't best for Kentucky.
I see the same arguments for US 23 in southwestern Virginia and eastern Kentucky. "Needs to be an Interstate. Extend I-26." And for southern Ohio. "Make it I-73." And Corridor D. "Turn it into a western extension of I-68."
In general, four-lane surface routes don't need to be upgraded to Interstates along their whole length. Bypass Kokomo, fine, I can see wanting to get rid of a bunch of traffic lights, but does traffic move so poorly on the rest of the route that it has to be a full freeway?
Let's upgrade all of the US 41/IN 63 corridor next.
Quote from: hbelkins on July 21, 2014, 12:07:55 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 21, 2014, 08:04:22 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on July 20, 2014, 03:22:47 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 20, 2014, 09:45:59 AM
How much have you actually traveled this stretch of road???
I drove the entire length from the end of former IN 431 to South Bend several years ago.
I've driven lots of roads in Kentucky one time, and I wouldn't pretend that I know better than you what road improvements are and aren't best for Kentucky.
I see the same arguments for US 23 in southwestern Virginia and eastern Kentucky. "Needs to be an Interstate. Extend I-26." And for southern Ohio. "Make it I-73." And Corridor D. "Turn it into a western extension of I-68."
In general, four-lane surface routes don't need to be upgraded to Interstates along their whole length. Bypass Kokomo, fine, I can see wanting to get rid of a bunch of traffic lights, but does traffic move so poorly on the rest of the route that it has to be a full freeway?
Let's upgrade all of the US 41/IN 63 corridor next.
We're not talking about the entire length of US 31. We're talking about the portion from US 20 to US 30. That portion needs to be a freeway. The portion between US 30 and US 24 does not need to be a freeway, and thus, US 31 does not need to be an interstate. I know others have suggested that, and that may be causing your reaction, but the particular portion of US 31 that this particular thread is about most definitely needs upgrading.
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 21, 2014, 12:22:32 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on July 21, 2014, 12:07:55 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 21, 2014, 08:04:22 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on July 20, 2014, 03:22:47 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 20, 2014, 09:45:59 AM
How much have you actually traveled this stretch of road???
I drove the entire length from the end of former IN 431 to South Bend several years ago.
I see the same arguments for US 23 in southwestern Virginia and eastern Kentucky. "Needs to be an Interstate. Extend I-26." And for southern Ohio. "Make it I-73." And Corridor D. "Turn it into a western extension of I-68."
In general, four-lane surface routes don't need to be upgraded to Interstates along their whole length. Bypass Kokomo, fine, I can see wanting to get rid of a bunch of traffic lights, but does traffic move so poorly on the rest of the route that it has to be a full freeway?
Let's upgrade all of the US 41/IN 63 corridor next.
We're not talking about the entire length of US 31. We're talking about the portion from US 20 to US 30. That portion needs to be a freeway. The portion between US 30 and US 24 does not need to be a freeway, and thus, US 31 does not need to be an interstate. I know others have suggested that, and that may be causing your reaction, but the particular portion of US 31 that this particular thread is about most definitely needs upgrading.
I've driven lots of roads in Kentucky one time, and I wouldn't pretend that I know better than you what road improvements are and aren't best for Kentucky.
As a South Bend resident, I've got to agree with cabiness here. The problem is way too many private drives on a high-speed, heavily-trafficked highway. Adding a center turn lane might have helped, but the land acquisition would have been a nightmare. Going with new terrain was the only reasonable choice. If you're going new terrain anyway, building to interstate standards makes a lot sense, considering the traffic level.
(Edited to fix the quotes. I had managed to mangle them somehow.)
Quote from: hbelkins on July 21, 2014, 12:07:55 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 21, 2014, 08:04:22 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on July 20, 2014, 03:22:47 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 20, 2014, 09:45:59 AM
How much have you actually traveled this stretch of road???
I drove the entire length from the end of former IN 431 to South Bend several years ago.
I've driven lots of roads in Kentucky one time, and I wouldn't pretend that I know better than you what road improvements are and aren't best for Kentucky.
I see the same arguments for US 23 in southwestern Virginia and eastern Kentucky. "Needs to be an Interstate. Extend I-26." And for southern Ohio. "Make it I-73." And Corridor D. "Turn it into a western extension of I-68."
In general, four-lane surface routes don't need to be upgraded to Interstates along their whole length. Bypass Kokomo, fine, I can see wanting to get rid of a bunch of traffic lights, but does traffic move so poorly on the rest of the route that it has to be a full freeway?
Let's upgrade all of the US 41/IN 63 corridor next.
I think this has come up heretofore, why isn't SR 63 US 41 or ALT US 41?
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on July 21, 2014, 02:10:19 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on July 21, 2014, 12:07:55 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 21, 2014, 08:04:22 AM
Quote from: hbelkins on July 20, 2014, 03:22:47 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 20, 2014, 09:45:59 AM
How much have you actually traveled this stretch of road???
I drove the entire length from the end of former IN 431 to South Bend several years ago.
I've driven lots of roads in Kentucky one time, and I wouldn't pretend that I know better than you what road improvements are and aren't best for Kentucky.
I see the same arguments for US 23 in southwestern Virginia and eastern Kentucky. "Needs to be an Interstate. Extend I-26." And for southern Ohio. "Make it I-73." And Corridor D. "Turn it into a western extension of I-68."
In general, four-lane surface routes don't need to be upgraded to Interstates along their whole length. Bypass Kokomo, fine, I can see wanting to get rid of a bunch of traffic lights, but does traffic move so poorly on the rest of the route that it has to be a full freeway?
Let's upgrade all of the US 41/IN 63 corridor next.
I think this has come up heretofore, why isn't SR 63 US 41 or ALT US 41?
InDOT doesn't do Alts.
Seems like I saw a map with US 31E and US 31W in IN. Maybe they could do that.
And old map maybe, there's been no suffixed routes like that in years. Indiana just doesn't do things like they do in Tennessee or Kentucky, end of story.
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on July 21, 2014, 02:34:41 PM
Seems like I saw a map with US 31E and US 31W in IN. Maybe they could do that.
Yeah, US 31 used to split at Sellersburg with 31E following the current routing of 31 through Jeffersonville and over the Clark bridge. 31W followed what until recently was 311 through New Albany and across the K&I bridge (which no longer carries cars).
However, as this applies to US 41 and SR 63, I don't see any usage of Alt or E/W being an option. Really AASHTO needs to decide that US 41 needs to be rerouted onto SR 63 and then INDOT would need to create a new designation for old 41 (SR 141?)
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 21, 2014, 03:04:38 PM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on July 21, 2014, 02:34:41 PM
Seems like I saw a map with US 31E and US 31W in IN. Maybe they could do that.
Yeah, US 31 used to split at Sellersburg with 31E following the current routing of 31 through Jeffersonville and over the Clark bridge. 31W followed what until recently was 311 through New Albany and across the K&I bridge (which no longer carries cars).
However, as this applies to US 41 and SR 63, I don't see any usage of Alt or E/W being an option. Really AASHTO needs to decide that US 41 needs to be rerouted onto SR 63 and then INDOT would need to create a new designation for old 41 (SR 141?)
indot would just swap 63 and 41 in that case, but what they would love to do is put 41 on 63 and decommission old 41
US 41 is far more scenic then SR 63.
WSBT reporting the new road will be open "by the end of August" with some lane restrictions at the north and south ends. The lane restrictions will be lifted by the end of the year.
http://www.wsbt.com/news/local/indot-new-us-31-just-weeks-from-opening/27075220
August 24 is my target :) My next trip up to South Bend.
Quote from: hbelkins on July 18, 2014, 08:06:52 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 18, 2014, 03:30:42 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on July 18, 2014, 03:18:42 PM
I'm beginning to think that he doesn't want any new roads built. First the I-69 bridges and now this.
Of course, I'm one of those who thinks that US 31 was fine as it was as a four-lane surface route and a freeway wasn't needed.
It is most definitely needed. A lot of accidents involving cars slowing to make left turns getting rear-ended.
That's why you build turning lanes or a mountable median.
Come to New Mexico. They (NM state DOT) can't even accomplish that (center turn lanes or mountable medians) Would say Indiana has one of the best DOT's I've seen, in terms of foresight and quality of work. Excellent thread throughout.
Quote from: DJStephens on July 26, 2014, 05:50:37 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on July 18, 2014, 08:06:52 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on July 18, 2014, 03:30:42 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on July 18, 2014, 03:18:42 PM
I'm beginning to think that he doesn't want any new roads built. First the I-69 bridges and now this.
Of course, I'm one of those who thinks that US 31 was fine as it was as a four-lane surface route and a freeway wasn't needed.
It is most definitely needed. A lot of accidents involving cars slowing to make left turns getting rear-ended.
That's why you build turning lanes or a mountable median.
Come to New Mexico. They (NM state DOT) can't even accomplish that (center turn lanes or mountable medians) Would say Indiana has one of the best DOT's I've seen, in terms of foresight and quality of work. Excellent thread throughout.
I agree, INDOT does a good job, the only thing they do that angers me is the constant rerouting and decommissioning of their routes, but that's not a huge deal.
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on July 21, 2014, 08:37:04 PM
US 41 is far more scenic then SR 63.
Scenery is irrelevant to US Route versus state route designations. If US routes were assigned and routed on scenery, there would be a lot more in the more mountainous western states.
Quote from: silverback1065 on July 21, 2014, 07:19:59 PM
ndot would just swap 63 and 41 in that case, but what they would love to do is put 41 on 63 and decommission old 41
I don't think (current) US 41 is the kind of road INDOT wants to get rid of. INDOT wants to get rid of surface street state roads inside of cities or built-up areas. I don't know why INDOT never moved the US 41 designation to SR 63, though. The Hoosier Heartland is may be another example where US 24 should follow the better route (in favor of SR 25) even though it would make it longer.
Quote from: Revive 755 on July 27, 2014, 12:04:24 AM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on July 21, 2014, 08:37:04 PM
US 41 is far more scenic then SR 63.
Scenery is irrelevant to US Route versus state route designations. If US routes were assigned and routed on scenery, there would be a lot more in the more mountainous western states.
In this particular instance, I would suggest that SR 63 is a prettier route anyway overall, but I can't agree more that it has no bearing on the conversation.
And finally back on topic:
Quote from: ysuindy on July 22, 2014, 03:33:56 PM
WSBT reporting the new road will be open "by the end of August" with some lane restrictions at the north and south ends. The lane restrictions will be lifted by the end of the year.
http://www.wsbt.com/news/local/indot-new-us-31-just-weeks-from-opening/27075220
August 24 is my target :) My next trip up to South Bend.
It seems hard to see how the August target will be achieved, but September certainly should be easily achievable. I saw a lot of progress yesterday from my last visit to South bend, but both tie-ins have no pavement laid whatsoever. The bridge at the south end that is being rebuilt is getting close - a month or so ago, there was no bridge at all. The signage that is up (which is a lot) all have exit numbers on them now from US 30 up to US 20.
Quote from: mukade on July 27, 2014, 08:23:30 AM
I don't think (current) US 41 is the kind of road INDOT wants to get rid of. INDOT wants to get rid of surface street state roads inside of cities or built-up areas. I don't know why INDOT never moved the US 41 designation to SR 63, though. The Hoosier Heartland is may be another example where US 24 should follow the better route (in favor of SR 25) even though it would make it longer.
I've always imagined that INDOT doesn't care at all about US vs. state designation. To them, they're both the same: a highway they have to maintain. I think that "civilians" might have a sense that US highway > state highway. But to INDOT, I think that distinction is not so important to them.
Quote from: mobilene on July 28, 2014, 09:58:13 AM
Quote from: mukade on July 27, 2014, 08:23:30 AM
I don't think (current) US 41 is the kind of road INDOT wants to get rid of. INDOT wants to get rid of surface street state roads inside of cities or built-up areas. I don't know why INDOT never moved the US 41 designation to SR 63, though. The Hoosier Heartland is may be another example where US 24 should follow the better route (in favor of SR 25) even though it would make it longer.
I've always imagined that INDOT doesn't care at all about US vs. state designation. To them, they're both the same: a highway they have to maintain. I think that "civilians" might have a sense that US highway > state highway. But to INDOT, I think that distinction is not so important to them.
It will be interesting if INDOT ever tries to make a US highway become discontinuous because of a city. So far, all of the weird cuts have been on state roads.
I doubt they will, you can't just mess with a U.S. highway that may span the entire country, imagine eliminating a small part of US 30, 40 or 50 and making it a discontinuously route for one town. At least with state highways you can keep in in-state and not worry about other state's reaction to it. However, I do see truncations for ENDS of U.S. highways like what's been done with US 35, 136 and 421. Thinking of that, I wonder if US 231 may get truncated west of I-65 someday, that certainly seems possible.
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 28, 2014, 09:20:42 PM
I doubt they will, you can't just mess with a U.S. highway that may span the entire country, imagine eliminating a small part of US 30, 40 or 50 and making it a discontinuously route for one town. At least with state highways you can keep in in-state and not worry about other state's reaction to it. However, I do see truncations for ENDS of U.S. highways like what's been done with US 35, 136 and 421. Thinking of that, I wonder if US 231 may get truncated west of I-65 someday, that certainly seems possible.
I doubt it as well, but INDOT could shed some useless US highways (like US 421, US 35, and US 136) and then do what they have been doing with some state roads. US 31 thru Columbus could go if US 31 followed I-65 there. Similarly, US 6 could avoid Portage by following SR 49 t to I-94. Roads like US 30 in Dyer leave few options being at a state line.
Quote from: mukade on July 28, 2014, 10:17:13 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 28, 2014, 09:20:42 PM
I doubt they will, you can't just mess with a U.S. highway that may span the entire country, imagine eliminating a small part of US 30, 40 or 50 and making it a discontinuously route for one town. At least with state highways you can keep in in-state and not worry about other state's reaction to it. However, I do see truncations for ENDS of U.S. highways like what's been done with US 35, 136 and 421. Thinking of that, I wonder if US 231 may get truncated west of I-65 someday, that certainly seems possible.
I doubt it as well, but INDOT could shed some useless US highways (like US 421, US 35, and US 136) and then do what they have been doing with some state roads. US 31 thru Columbus could go if US 31 followed I-65 there. Similarly, US 6 could avoid Portage by following SR 49 t to I-94. Roads like US 30 in Dyer leave few options being at a state line.
US highways are harder to reroute, I thought they had to be approved by AASHTO or some other agency, is that true?
Quote from: Revive 755 on July 27, 2014, 12:04:24 AM
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on July 21, 2014, 08:37:04 PM
US 41 is far more scenic then SR 63.
Scenery is irrelevant to US Route versus state route designations. If US routes were assigned and routed on scenery, there would be a lot more in the more mountainous western states.
I never said anything of the sort. I only mentioned that US 41 is more scenic than SR 63.
Quote from: tdindy88 on July 28, 2014, 09:20:42 PM
I doubt they will, you can't just mess with a U.S. highway that may span the entire country, imagine eliminating a small part of US 30, 40 or 50 and making it a discontinuously route for one town. At least with state highways you can keep in in-state and not worry about other state's reaction to it. However, I do see truncations for ENDS of U.S. highways like what's been done with US 35, 136 and 421. Thinking of that, I wonder if US 231 may get truncated west of I-65 someday, that certainly seems possible.
Well US 40 runs along I-70 for a good piece in KS and MO.
Another Tweet from INDOT with a picture
https://twitter.com/INDOTNorthwest/status/496334845149069312
New US 31 btwn SB & Plymouth is closer than ever to opening! Traffic expected on whole stretch by end of this month.
EDIT - add my question and their response
@ysuindy @INDOTNorthwest Great news. Full traffic on all 4 lanes this month or will there still be some work to do?
INDOT Northwest @INDOTNorthwest @ysuindy There will be lane restrictions on the north & south ends thru the end of the year. But traffic will be travelling the full length.
I think an I-67 would be very nice. And this might belong in the fictional highways forum but I-67 has been discussed in this thread so I thought I would give a scenario for a future I-67 corridor. I-67 follows US 31 from Indianapolis to South Bend, then it turns sharp east and follows US 20 briefly, then it turns sharp north and follows US 131 into Michigan passing through Portage & Kalamazoo and at least getting to Grand Rapids, then MAYBE continue even more northward and having its northern terminus just a little southeast of Traverse City. What do you guys think?
Quote from: adventurernumber1 on August 07, 2014, 12:34:48 AM
I think an I-67 would be very nice. And this might belong in the fictional highways forum but I-67 has been discussed in this thread so I thought I would give a scenario for a future I-67 corridor. I-67 follows US 31 from Indianapolis to South Bend, then it turns sharp east and follows US 20 briefly, then it turns sharp north and follows US 131 into Michigan passing through Portage & Kalamazoo and at least getting to Grand Rapids, then MAYBE continue even more northward and having its northern terminus just a little southeast of Traverse City. What do you guys think?
There are still two stretches of US 31 in Indiana that will not be to insterstate standard: from Westfield north to the south side of Kokomo, and from the north side of Kokomo to Plymouth. As neat as the idea of an I-67 would be, six-laning I-65 and I-70 would go much farther to improve safety and travel times than would finishing off the rural sections of US 31. I would hate to see money go to converting the rest of US 31 before more important projects are finished just to get an interstate.
Oh, and good luck at getting Michigan to ever finish the connection of US 31 to I-94 just east of St. Joseph.
For Kentucky to even consider it is a long shot. Just to upgrade the Owensboro bypass, the brand-new section of US 60 east of the city and the Ohio River approach would cost at a minimum $177 million. That's just to do interchange improvements, some new overpasses and to close off some side roads and entrances.
Quote from: adventurernumber1 on August 07, 2014, 12:34:48 AM
I think an I-67 would be very nice. And this might belong in the fictional highways forum but I-67 has been discussed in this thread so I thought I would give a scenario for a future I-67 corridor. I-67 follows US 31 from Indianapolis to South Bend, then it turns sharp east and follows US 20 briefly, then it turns sharp north and follows US 131 into Michigan passing through Portage & Kalamazoo and at least getting to Grand Rapids, then MAYBE continue even more northward and having its northern terminus just a little southeast of Traverse City. What do you guys think?
I'd rather it follow 31 that whole way up to traverse city
Getting back to the subject for a moment: I drove past the north end of the project yesterday, and I saw that the asphalt base has been laid for the west carriageway. I presume that means they are close to pouring concrete there. Once the concrete is ready there and on the east carriageway at the south end of the project, INDOT should be able to shift traffic (with some lane restrictions) to the new road. They look to be close to their end-of-August goal.
Back to unrelated nonsense, I also drove about 50 miles on the Indiana Toll Road, and I was pleased to find that the concessionaire has repaved the patches that were in need. It was a much-improved ride over what I've come to expect since they took over from the commission. It was a surprise, considering the financial difficulties for the concessionaire.
Quote from: theline on August 11, 2014, 06:44:25 PM
Getting back to the subject for a moment: I drove past the north end of the project yesterday, and I saw that the asphalt base has been laid for the west carriageway. I presume that means they are close to pouring concrete there. Once the concrete is ready there and on the east carriageway at the south end of the project, INDOT should be able to shift traffic (with some lane restrictions) to the new road. They look to be close to their end-of-August goal.
Back to unrelated nonsense, I also drove about 50 miles on the Indiana Toll Road, and I was pleased to find that the concessionaire has repaved the patches that were in need. It was a much-improved ride over what I've come to expect since they took over from the commission. It was a surprise, considering the financial difficulties for the concessionaire.
i heard that they were going bankrupt, is that not true anymore?
https://twitter.com/cindywardwsbt/status/501369938649825280
Quote#BREAKING The new U.S. 31 between South Bend and Plymouth will open this Thursday.
I will be checking it out Sunday as I deliver the son to Notre Dame:
South Bend Tribune article
http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/local/new-u-s-opens-thursday/article_010db251-2fff-532c-940e-343c09af7745.html
SOUTH BEND – The new pathway of U.S. 31 from South Bend to Plymouth will open to traffic on Thursday, according to the Indiana Department of Transportation.
The new 20 miles of roadway between South Bend and Plymouth will still have restrictions near both cities for the rest of the year, as construction continues, according to a release. Three interchanges, including those at Kern Road, Indiana 4 and U.S. 6, will also open Thursday.
For South Bend drivers, the new U.S. 31 begins just south of the Jackson Road bridge. Once the new road opens, drivers will not be able to access the old U.S. 31 from this location. If necessary, drivers can use the Kern Road interchange to access the old U.S. 31 and nearby neighborhoods, according to the release.
A fourth interchange, located at 7th Road in Plymouth, is under construction and will open by the end of 2014, according to the release.
In November of last year, the first new stretch of the U.S. 31 realignment project opened around Kokomo. Next year, the portion just north of Indianapolis will open, according to the release. The project will ultimately remove 32 traffic signals about about 30 minutes of driving time between South Bend and Indianapolis, according to INDOT.
And an updated press release from INDOT on the project home page
http://www.us31plysb.com/128
A ribbon-cutting is planned for 2:30 PM on Wednesday
, next week: http://www.us31plysb.com/ (http://www.us31plysb.com/)
QuoteSave the date!
New US 31 ribbon cutting set for Wednesday, Aug. 27
You are invited to join Governor Mike Pence, U.S. Representative Jackie Walorski and other dignitaries at 2:30 p.m. on Wednesday, Aug. 27, as they officially cut the ribbon on the New US 31 Plymouth to South Bend freeway.
Edit to clarify the date of the ribbon cutting.
anyone know if the old alignment (the part that couldn't be transferred) will be signed as a state road? Also, why is the ribbon cutting after the opening of the road?
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 18, 2014, 05:32:30 PM
anyone know if the old alignment (the part that couldn't be transferred) will be signed as a state road? Also, why is the ribbon cutting after the opening of the road?
I'm sure they needed to get the politicians schedules aligned. I'm glad they aren't delaying the opening for this to be scheduled. After all, neither one of them was in office when this project started.
Here is a more detailed story from the South Bend Tribune, with a photo array. The first photo is the most interesting, showing asphalt with striping. I had assumed the entire route would be concrete, though maybe that will still happen. The other photos look like the writer emptied out the file photos on this, since they all look like they are from an earlier phase of construction. The two maps are informative though.
http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/new-u-s-from-south-bend-to-plymouth-set-to/article_6252433f-de47-5c4a-ab5c-9bcb3daf4877.html (http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/new-u-s-from-south-bend-to-plymouth-set-to/article_6252433f-de47-5c4a-ab5c-9bcb3daf4877.html)
I'll try to get out there after work on Thursday and report back.
Here's a related story about impact on the two small towns bypassed by the new road, Lakeville and Lapaz: http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/lakeville-lapaz-face-future-without-u-s/article_3063c37e-bf6a-5389-a2f1-2a224e1d635b.html (http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/lakeville-lapaz-face-future-without-u-s/article_3063c37e-bf6a-5389-a2f1-2a224e1d635b.html)
Quote
Denny Hardy, owner of Jack's Bar and Grill in Lakeville, thinks his restaurant will continue to see business, no matter if U.S. 31 traffic is going past his front door or looping outside of town.
"Most of our customers here are regulars," Hardy said. "We get maybe just a few people a week that stop in when they're passing through."
Quote
However, Bob Feitz, a lifetime Lakeville resident and president of the Lakeville Economic Development Board, said that the new U.S. 31 pathway could be a problem for Lakeville if there's no signage along the new road to show travelers what Lakeville has to offer.
"I think there will be an impact," Feitz said. "Whether it's good or bad, well that depends on who you are. For some, it will be quieter and they will be happier. For those who have a business, it depends. If you have a filling station or a restaurant, it could hurt."
I think the impact will be mostly positive, for the reasons cited by Hardy. Few businesses in these towns depend on travelers. The exceptions are mostly the cluster of gas stations and fast food restaurants at the intersection of US 6 and (old) 31. They are close enough to the new road and there's enough traffic on 6 that they will likely survive.
Quote from: theline on August 19, 2014, 10:50:52 AM
Here is a more detailed story from the South Bend Tribune, with a photo array. The first photo is the most interesting, showing asphalt with striping. I had assumed the entire route would be concrete, though maybe that will still happen. The other photos look like the writer emptied out the file photos on this, since they all look like they are from an earlier phase of construction. The two maps are informative though.
http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/new-u-s-from-south-bend-to-plymouth-set-to/article_6252433f-de47-5c4a-ab5c-9bcb3daf4877.html (http://www.southbendtribune.com/news/new-u-s-from-south-bend-to-plymouth-set-to/article_6252433f-de47-5c4a-ab5c-9bcb3daf4877.html)
I'll try to get out there after work on Thursday and report back.
My daughter drove from South bend to Argos on Sunday and said that the south end tie-in is also asphalt pavement. If I remember right, at least one other part in the middle is also asphalt as the route went over a boggy area.
Posted by INDOT on their Facebook page:
QuoteCrews will begin shifting traffic to the new alignment of U.S. 31 sometime after 9 a.m. If you're in the area you may be slowed or stopped as crews move barricades, allowing drivers onto the new lanes.
Your best bet is to avoid access points for the new U.S. 31 until after 1 p.m., when the traffic shift is expected to be complete.
Look, this is dangerous work, shifting traffic of this volume at five access points, across a 20+ mile stretch, all at the same time. It takes time. Please slow down and stay alert for the safety of both our workers and for the drivers.
And its open - posted around 9:05 on INDOT Northwest Twitter page - with a Vine attached
https://twitter.com/INDOTNorthwest/status/502441402115297280
WNDU traveled old 31 on Wednesday and new 31 on Thursday. Their test showed a time savings of 13 minutes.
http://www.wndu.com/home/headlines/Travel-time-test-run-on-new-US-31-272247061.html
No Hoosier I know of refers to highways like Route 4 or Route 6. For my part, I hope on taking a trip up to Michigan over Labor Day so I'll be checking out this new stretch a week from now.
Mrs. theline and I drove the new route on the first evening it was open. She asked if we got a special award for being "first nighters." Alas, no.
Some observations:
- Most of the signage has been installed, though the BGSes on the southbound side for the US-6 exit are almost all missing. There isn't even a temporary sign mentioning what route is at that exit.
- We saw no blue services signs at any exit yet. Presumably they will follow.
- Heading south from the north end, the first speed limit sign was posted as 60 MPH. The limit increased to 65 just south of the Kern Road exit, and it remained there for the rest of the route.
- The Kern Road SPUI is currently controlled with stop signs. I don't know when, but they will be replaced with signals.
- On the northbound side next to the Kern Road exit ramp is a BGS announcing that the US-20 exit is 1-1/2 miles away. It's a very odd placement for the sign and may be confusing. An overhead would have been much preferable.
- The temporary two-lane portion at the south end of the project was surprisingly long, consisting of almost the entire portion north of US-30 to the point where the new alignment splits from the old.
- So much remains to be done with the 7th Road exit that it hard to believe that it will be open this year. We shall see if they meet the goal.
Mrs. theline took some photos. After I get a chance to upload them, I'll post a link. We had dinner at Christo's in Plymouth, at SR-17 and US-30. We recommend it enthusiastically. The menu is extensive, the food delicious, and the prices reasonable.
I've posted to Imgur 62 photos taken by mrs. theline during our opening night drive south on the new road. It was a rainy evening and she's not a great photographer (I'm no better), so excuse the quality. Here are some samples:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FZLqBQZ3.jpg&hash=deca87766029b820b6cbb1e62b27ef3eee478822)
It seems that the lane now occupied by mainline traffic will become "exit only."
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FP9hdkxS.jpg&hash=bb25eaee95ae56a74dbc2244c4becccf47583a5f)
Sign is just south of Kern Rd. The limit increases to 65 a bit south of there.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FJkNqJ73.jpg&hash=8089965e9ffaa27cf8cf514f78f46b79a67e0809)
This is the bottom half of the BGS announcing that the US-6 exit is one-half mile ahead. The top half of the sign here is missing. We saw no signs anywhere indicating that route 6 was at this exit, though we may have missed the sign at the one-mile mark. Except for this exit, signage was mostly complete.
You can find all 62 images at my Imgur page: http://theline51.imgur.com/ (http://theline51.imgur.com/) Enjoy!
I went up Saturday during slightly better weather. I would say that this new road really made the trip feel shorter (I drove ~90 miles). There are a lot of signs on this stretch that US 31 Kokomo and I-69 did not get (mileage, auxiliary, etc.). These are some of my pictures:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31-Kern-1.jpg&hash=129b9d37fc5f06174c449d4bb32f2637e25457d7)
Northbound approaching Kern Road
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31-Kern-2.jpg&hash=d6f3a5b447250546758669242fe381b2ba383652)
Westbound Kern Road at US 31 - the traffic lights are still not in
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31-Kern-3.jpg&hash=64beef2509205759615de1cd4eb72618b4c4c399)
Southbound ramp to Kern Road
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31-NorthTie-in-1.jpg&hash=fa7eec6c3e32e5ba752ccb4cbd8400eab5156e23)
Northbound approaching US 20
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31-NorthTie-in-2.jpg&hash=7164cfc993f3e46aecae37ca9cd66623c3a9e6f8)
Northbound at the north end - off to the right you can see some of the old pavement has already been removed
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31-SouthTie-in-1.jpg&hash=a548f1071b11d799a7767405c35e629d455494ad)
Northbound at the south tie-in
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fhighwayexplorer.com%2FPhotos%2FTemp%2FUS31-US6-1.jpg&hash=8934fdcde3eca5e48b057378bb351bd35023da9e)
Northbound at US 6
I went through today on a round trip to Notre Dame. No pictures but some observations:
The line - I also saw no reference of US 6 travelling southbound except the strange Walksrton 1/2 mile sign.
The bridge over the old highway identified the road below as Old US 31
The old road pavement at the north end has been substantially removed. I'm not sure when they transitioned traffic of this stretch, but if it was this week they got a lot accomplished.
Single lane traffic at the south end was 4 1/2 miles .
I don't see how the 7th Road interchange gets done by year end. The steel beams for the bridge are set only across the now closed southbound lanes. It seems as if only minimal grading of the exit ramps has been completed.
I was struck by the overgrown weeds in the median for the first five miles or so at the south end. Of course much of this part of the project has been done for a few years.
For the most part the new section, much like the Kokomo bypass, is a pretty boring drive. Not that there's anything wrong with that.
Quote from: ysuindy on August 24, 2014, 09:42:14 PM
Single lane traffic at the south end was 4 1/2 miles .
I was really struck by how long that lane restriction lasted. That's going to be a big-time bottleneck when traffic is heavy, like on Notre Dame game days.
Quote
For the most part the new section, much like the Kokomo bypass, is a pretty boring drive. Not that there's anything wrong with that.
To each his own, I guess. The mrs. pointed out how pretty the semi-rolling farmland, punctuated with trees, can be. I agreed. Of course, anybody driving from Indy has seen plenty of farmland by the time you reach Plymouth.
One more observation: there is a short causeway near Lakeville. Such structures usually get a sign indicating the name of the waterway. This road is no exception, though INDOT was hard-pressed to come up with a name. The sign reads "Peat Area."
so is the old alignment signed as anything? or is it just old us 31? i think they should call it michigan road. and sign the part that still is owned by indot as sr 931
Quote from: theline on August 25, 2014, 06:54:48 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on August 24, 2014, 09:42:14 PM
Single lane traffic at the south end was 4 1/2 miles .
I was really struck by how long that lane restriction lasted. That's going to be a big-time bottleneck when traffic is heavy, like on Notre Dame game days.
Quote
For the most part the new section, much like the Kokomo bypass, is a pretty boring drive. Not that there's anything wrong with that.
To each his own, I guess. The mrs. pointed out how pretty the semi-rolling farmland, punctuated with trees, can be. I agreed. Of course, anybody driving from Indy has seen plenty of farmland by the time you reach Plymouth.
One more observation: there is a short causeway near Lakeville. Such structures usually get a sign indicating the name of the waterway. This road is no exception, though INDOT was hard-pressed to come up with a name. The sign reads "Peat Area."
I will be curious on how the single lane aspect works Saturday before and after the game. I'm more concerned about getting stuck at the north end than the south end. Typically things are thinned out down around US 6 and Plymouth - we will see how it works.
I can say I've never seen a "Peat Area" signed on a highway before.
Yes - by the time I've reached Plymouth I have seen about 90 minutes of farmland and I know I have 90 more minutes of it on my way home. But both bypasses are preferred to the traffic signals, cars jumping from lane to lane, narrow road in Lakeville, traffic turning and speed traps.
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 25, 2014, 07:29:09 PM
so is the old alignment signed as anything? or is it just old us 31? i think they should call it michigan road. and sign the part that still is owned by indot as sr 931
There was nothing marked at the Kern Road exit as to how the old road might be signed. Trying to figure out how to avoid the squeeze at the South Bend end of the connection after the Notre Dame game Saturday. I might try to take one of the other North-South roads down to Kern and cut over to pick up the new road South of the single lane section. If I do, I will try to get a look and see if there is any updated signage.
Excellent pics, imho. what is the reason for the "extended" pier cap in the sixth picture, is that for future widening, or is it to provide for some sort of non standard interchange (not a diamond) at that location, a SPUI for instance? Notice also that the INDOT uses the standard "font" for its signs. The quality of the overall project looks very good from these pictures.
That interchange (Kern Rd.) is a SPUI. Admittedly, I've never seen a SPUI with stop signs instead of stoplights before but I know that's only temporary.
Quote from: DJStephens on August 26, 2014, 07:14:47 PM
Excellent pics, imho. what is the reason for the "extended" pier cap in the sixth picture, is that for future widening, or is it to provide for some sort of non standard interchange (not a diamond) at that location, a SPUI for instance? Notice also that the INDOT uses the standard "font" for its signs. The quality of the overall project looks very good from these pictures.
that interchange is a SPUI. It's not done yet though, still missing the traffic lights and some signs i believe
Quote from: ysuindy on August 25, 2014, 09:21:52 PM
There was nothing marked at the Kern Road exit as to how the old road might be signed. Trying to figure out how to avoid the squeeze at the South Bend end of the connection after the Notre Dame game Saturday. I might try to take one of the other North-South roads down to Kern and cut over to pick up the new road South of the single lane section. If I do, I will try to get a look and see if there is any updated signage.
The least traveled through southbound road after a game is Twyckenham. Eddy to the west and Ironwood to the east get much more traffic. If you can make your way to Twyckenham, take it all the way south. Once you get past Ewing, it starts winding a bit and by the time it ends at Ridgedale, you're only a short block east of Miami. Miami then gets you down to Kern.
As I previously stated, this would make a great I-67!
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 27, 2014, 07:43:49 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on August 25, 2014, 09:21:52 PM
There was nothing marked at the Kern Road exit as to how the old road might be signed. Trying to figure out how to avoid the squeeze at the South Bend end of the connection after the Notre Dame game Saturday. I might try to take one of the other North-South roads down to Kern and cut over to pick up the new road South of the single lane section. If I do, I will try to get a look and see if there is any updated signage.
The least traveled through southbound road after a game is Twyckenham. Eddy to the west and Ironwood to the east get much more traffic. If you can make your way to Twyckenham, take it all the way south. Once you get past Ewing, it starts winding a bit and by the time it ends at Ridgedale, you're only a short block east of Miami. Miami then gets you down to Kern.
Thanks. I typically park on the street in the neighborhood south of Angela, west of Notre Dame Avenue. Usually along Peashway or Napoleon. Looks like my key is getting across Eddy / South Bend Avenue to Twyckenham.
Quote from: Henry on August 27, 2014, 10:51:43 AM
As I previously stated, this would make a great I-67!
you will likely get your wish in like 30 yrs.
Quote from: ysuindy on August 27, 2014, 02:56:59 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 27, 2014, 07:43:49 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on August 25, 2014, 09:21:52 PM
There was nothing marked at the Kern Road exit as to how the old road might be signed. Trying to figure out how to avoid the squeeze at the South Bend end of the connection after the Notre Dame game Saturday. I might try to take one of the other North-South roads down to Kern and cut over to pick up the new road South of the single lane section. If I do, I will try to get a look and see if there is any updated signage.
The least traveled through southbound road after a game is Twyckenham. Eddy to the west and Ironwood to the east get much more traffic. If you can make your way to Twyckenham, take it all the way south. Once you get past Ewing, it starts winding a bit and by the time it ends at Ridgedale, you're only a short block east of Miami. Miami then gets you down to Kern.
Thanks. I typically park on the street in the neighborhood south of Angela, west of Notre Dame Avenue. Usually along Peashway or Napoleon. Looks like my key is getting across Eddy / South Bend Avenue to Twyckenham.
I almost always park east of Eddy, so I haven't driven out of that neighborhood after a game in a long time. If you can go south on St. Louis, that turns into Northside Blvd south of Jefferson. Northside actually passes along the river under Eddy St., so you never have to cross Eddy. At the Farmer's market, you can turn left on Beyer and it's just one block over to Mishawaka Ave. That gets you over to Twyckenham right at Adams High/IUSB. Like I said, this is all dependent on being allowed to go south on St. Louis. Otherwise you're better off just going on over to Michigan to go south and then cutting directly over to Miami along Monroe/Lincolnway.
Just found this from a South Bend TV station about the future of Old US 31.
http://www.wsbt.com/news/local/several-counties-cities-look-to-rename-old-us-31/27759332
According to the article, the stretch in Marshall County will be Michigan Road and in St. Joseph County will be 931, it doesn't say if it's State Road 931, but it would be the first I heard about another stretch of 931. I'm not honestly sure why the whole thing couldn't be Michigan Road, it matches up with the road's alignment down to Plymouth and up into South Bend.
Quote from: tdindy88 on August 27, 2014, 07:15:28 PM
Just found this from a South Bend TV station about the future of Old US 31.
http://www.wsbt.com/news/local/several-counties-cities-look-to-rename-old-us-31/27759332
According to the article, the stretch in Marshall County will be Michigan Road and in St. Joseph County will be 931, it doesn't say if it's State Road 931, but it would be the first I heard about another stretch of 931. I'm not honestly sure why the whole thing couldn't be Michigan Road, it matches up with the road's alignment down to Plymouth and up into South Bend.
It should be all michigan road due to the old highway going that way. It will be signed as SR 931 in st joseph county, the video says the signs will be placed soon.
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 27, 2014, 07:10:49 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on August 27, 2014, 02:56:59 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 27, 2014, 07:43:49 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on August 25, 2014, 09:21:52 PM
There was nothing marked at the Kern Road exit as to how the old road might be signed. Trying to figure out how to avoid the squeeze at the South Bend end of the connection after the Notre Dame game Saturday. I might try to take one of the other North-South roads down to Kern and cut over to pick up the new road South of the single lane section. If I do, I will try to get a look and see if there is any updated signage.
The least traveled through southbound road after a game is Twyckenham. Eddy to the west and Ironwood to the east get much more traffic. If you can make your way to Twyckenham, take it all the way south. Once you get past Ewing, it starts winding a bit and by the time it ends at Ridgedale, you're only a short block east of Miami. Miami then gets you down to Kern.
Thanks. I typically park on the street in the neighborhood south of Angela, west of Notre Dame Avenue. Usually along Peashway or Napoleon. Looks like my key is getting across Eddy / South Bend Avenue to Twyckenham.
I almost always park east of Eddy, so I haven't driven out of that neighborhood after a game in a long time. If you can go south on St. Louis, that turns into Northside Blvd south of Jefferson. Northside actually passes along the river under Eddy St., so you never have to cross Eddy. At the Farmer's market, you can turn left on Beyer and it's just one block over to Mishawaka Ave. That gets you over to Twyckenham right at Adams High/IUSB. Like I said, this is all dependent on being allowed to go south on St. Louis. Otherwise you're better off just going on over to Michigan to go south and then cutting directly over to Miami along Monroe/Lincolnway.
Is SR 23 still signed through south bend? for some reason google maps isnt showing sr 23 at all
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 27, 2014, 10:39:07 PM
Is SR 23 still signed through south bend? for some reason google maps isnt showing sr 23 at all
I know it was still signed in July when I was last there, and I haven't seen news to indicate that anything was changing. I'm sure INDOT wouldn't mind giving up SR 23 north of the bypass, but I doubt the county and city would be willing to take it.
It's probably another error by Google then
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 27, 2014, 05:51:32 PM
Quote from: Henry on August 27, 2014, 10:51:43 AM
As I previously stated, this would make a great I-67!
you will likely get your wish in like 30 yrs.
Of course, they'll have to remove the last remaining at-grades, which I'm sure there are very few of now.
The problem is is that those 2 gaps won't be filled anytime soon. There's really not a huge need to even do so. The next interchange is sr 28 after all of this gets done.
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 27, 2014, 07:10:49 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on August 27, 2014, 02:56:59 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 27, 2014, 07:43:49 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on August 25, 2014, 09:21:52 PM
There was nothing marked at the Kern Road exit as to how the old road might be signed. Trying to figure out how to avoid the squeeze at the South Bend end of the connection after the Notre Dame game Saturday. I might try to take one of the other North-South roads down to Kern and cut over to pick up the new road South of the single lane section. If I do, I will try to get a look and see if there is any updated signage.
The least traveled through southbound road after a game is Twyckenham. Eddy to the west and Ironwood to the east get much more traffic. If you can make your way to Twyckenham, take it all the way south. Once you get past Ewing, it starts winding a bit and by the time it ends at Ridgedale, you're only a short block east of Miami. Miami then gets you down to Kern.
Thanks. I typically park on the street in the neighborhood south of Angela, west of Notre Dame Avenue. Usually along Peashway or Napoleon. Looks like my key is getting across Eddy / South Bend Avenue to Twyckenham.
I almost always park east of Eddy, so I haven't driven out of that neighborhood after a game in a long time. If you can go south on St. Louis, that turns into Northside Blvd south of Jefferson. Northside actually passes along the river under Eddy St., so you never have to cross Eddy. At the Farmer's market, you can turn left on Beyer and it's just one block over to Mishawaka Ave. That gets you over to Twyckenham right at Adams High/IUSB. Like I said, this is all dependent on being allowed to go south on St. Louis. Otherwise you're better off just going on over to Michigan to go south and then cutting directly over to Miami along Monroe/Lincolnway.
Thanks - I see exactly what you mean and we now have a plan. We have gone south of Howard before after the games, so I think that will be ok. We would use that to get to one of the bridges back across to Michigan.
I will attempt to give it a try Saturday evening and see what happens.
Quote from: silverback1065 on August 28, 2014, 10:15:59 AM
The problem is is that those 2 gaps won't be filled anytime soon. There's really not a huge need to even do so. The next interchange is sr 28 after all of this gets done.
I can see everything south of Peru getting filled in, but converting the Plymouth-Peru section provides very little benefit compared to the cost. I get the desire to be able to designate the road I-67, but there is much more benefit in spending money on 6-laning I-65 and I-70 than in converting the rest of US 31.
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.430816,-86.311384,3a,75y,90t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sYCSZwl636pDpjRWtI6UTtw!2e0 What is going to happen to this overpass now that US 31 is permanently closed south of 3A road? I noticed that 3A road does not at all connect to Michigan Road either, but dead ends about 200 feet to the west of the now abandoned US 31.
I remember somebody once said that there was talk about using this interchange to connect with 3A Road, but is not this interchange now too elaborate for a very lightly used local road?
US 31 from US 20 down to the south tie-in is now in Google Maps and shown as a freeway (yea, they got it right). The part from the tie-in down to US 30 is the same as before, but that's OK until the project is completed. Now, it would be nice for them to show the Kokomo US 31 bypass as a freeway as it should be - they do have US 24 in Allen County correct now also.
Even more amazing, Google Maps actually fixed
some of the problems in Lafayette. SR 26 no longer is shown as going from US 231 to I-65. SR 25 is no longer shown as going down I-65 and concurrent with SR 38. State roads 126, 443, and 526 are no longer shown. These Lafayette errors still exist, though:
- SR 43 is shown south of I-65 into Lafayette. This was decommissioned in 2013.
- SR 25 is shown east of US 231 to old US 231. That is now US 52 and SR 25 ends at the US 231 bypass.
- US 52 is not shown along its new route from the bypass to Sagamore Parkway (mainly Teal Road) as it should be.
It would be great to see it all correct. I submitted corrections at least twice only for them to be rejected.
INDOT doesn't mark the US 31 Kokomo bypass as a freeway either, nor the US 24 Fort Wayne to Ohio segment. And since I didn't attend the Indiana State Fair I don't know yet how the 2015 map will show the Plymouth-to-South Bend stretch of US 31. But I'd guess that it would be similar to the Kokomo segment.
I also just noticed that SR 4 hasn't been extended from old US 31 to the current highway.
I agree they don't show it that way, but it is a freeway both by objective measures and how the INDOT/Mitch Daniels advertised all the US 31 upgrades as being "interstate quality". And they are that, indeed.
FWIW, Rand McNally shows both South Bend and Kokomo sections as freeway.
Quote from: mukade on August 30, 2014, 09:04:00 PM
US 31 from US 20 down to the south tie-in is now in Google Maps and shown as a freeway (yea, they got it right). The part from the tie-in down to US 30 is the same as before, but that's OK until the project is completed. Now, it would be nice for them to show the Kokomo US 31 bypass as a freeway as it should be - they do have US 24 in Allen County correct now also.
Even more amazing, Google Maps actually fixed some of the problems in Lafayette. SR 26 no longer is shown as going from US 231 to I-65. SR 25 is no longer shown as going down I-65 and concurrent with SR 38. State roads 126, 443, and 526 are no longer shown. These Lafayette errors still exist, though:
- SR 43 is shown south of I-65 into Lafayette. This was decommissioned in 2013.
- SR 25 is shown east of US 231 to old US 231. That is now US 52 and SR 25 ends at the US 231 bypass.
- US 52 is not shown along its new route from the bypass to Sagamore Parkway (mainly Teal Road) as it should be.
It would be great to see it all correct. I submitted corrections at least twice only for them to be rejected.
I swear Google maps really pisses me off sometimes, I've done the same, and they finally accepted my changes to us 52, showing the right route, but now I see it disappeared! They insist on their wrong map, it is going to be an ordeal getting them to realize sr 4 and the new sr 931.
I'm kind of curious behind the orange route (on the map around Lafayette) that follows Sagamore Parkway north from Teal Road to South Street and then east to I-65. There aren't any route markers along that route but it's marked differently from local streets to indicate that it is still a highway. As for the NEW SR 931, I've seen very little from anything, other than that news article about desiginating the former stretch of US 31 from Plymouth to South Bend as 931. I don't think I've seen anything from INDOT and certainly Wikipedia doesn't have it, at least they (probably due to someone here) have acknowledged that SR 4 was extended.
As for the Indiana state maps, the South Bend bypass (US 20/31) and SR 912 are shown as freeways, I see no reason why the Kokomo bypass and Plymouth-to-South Bend parts of 31 along with US 24 from I-469 to Ohio be marked as freeways. It works fine on the Ohio state maps, with freeway parts of US 33 shown along with expressway segments, among other examples. I don't want to see something like Rand McNally's view of the Muncie bypass, SR 37 around Bloomington (yet) or US 41 around Princeton marked as freeways as well, that's a little too far for me.
Quote from: tdindy88 on August 30, 2014, 11:20:21 PM
I'm kind of curious behind the orange route (on the map around Lafayette) that follows Sagamore Parkway north from Teal Road to South Street and then east to I-65. There aren't any route markers along that route but it's marked differently from local streets to indicate that it is still a highway. As for the NEW SR 931, I've seen very little from anything, other than that news article about desiginating the former stretch of US 31 from Plymouth to South Bend as 931. I don't think I've seen anything from INDOT and certainly Wikipedia doesn't have it, at least they (probably due to someone here) have acknowledged that SR 4 was extended.
I personally don't mind the way non-INDOT highways are shown in Lafayette except you wonder why old SR 26/South St. qualifies when Sagamore Parkway and SR 38 which are as wide and modern don't. Anything subjective dauses disagreement.
SR 4 was extended over a year ago (and was even signed) so that definitely be shown in Google maps, but it is not. I'd like to see the INDOT SR 931 press release as well because the sign on new US 31 in South Bend over the supposed new SR 931 says "Old US 31".
Quote
As for the Indiana state maps, the South Bend bypass (US 20/31) and SR 912 are shown as freeways, I see no reason why the Kokomo bypass and Plymouth-to-South Bend parts of 31 along with US 24 from I-469 to Ohio be marked as freeways. It works fine on the Ohio state maps, with freeway parts of US 33 shown along with expressway segments, among other examples. I don't want to see something like Rand McNally's view of the Muncie bypass, SR 37 around Bloomington (yet) or US 41 around Princeton marked as freeways as well, that's a little too far for me.
I like any map to show reality so what is shown by Rand McNally in Bloomington or Valaraiso are fine by me. To me, the line is crossed when one single interchange or overpass makes a road a freeway. Friars Road in San Diego is (and has been) shown as a freeway for the longest time, but it is not by most standards so the problem is certainly not confined to the Indiana map. At least what Rand McNally shows in Indiana as freeways are almost all real freeways (maybe SR 25 is an exception) even if it they are short. For the Muncie Bypass which is not shown as a freeway, you could have a very strong argument that it is a freeway from McGalliard Rd. to CR 150E. The biggest slight/oversight in Indiana is the Lloyd Expressway (SR 62->SR 66) that is a freeway with several interchanges and will be extended when the US 41 interchange upgrade has been completed. It will be over four miles of fully controlled access then.
For the longest time, SR 912 was not shown as a freeway in the INDOT map or in the Rand McNally atlas. I lobbied both for changes for years - I am not sure if that had any impact, but both eventually changed their maps.
The 2014 map of Rand McNally shows the new completed US 31 Plymouth to South Bend freeway, but it was not open at time of print.
Also the same edition shows IN 931 as an undivided road as it never changed when the US 31 bypass opened.
Quote from: roadman65 on August 31, 2014, 02:01:21 PM
The 2014 map of Rand McNally shows the new completed US 31 Plymouth to South Bend freeway, but it was not open at time of print.
Also the same edition shows IN 931 as an undivided road as it never changed when the US 31 bypass opened.
The roads that are yellow with red line borders in the Rand McNally maps signify multi-lane roads, not necessarily divided highways. SR 931 (the one that actually exists and the one that may soon exist) are both multi-lane roads. They are now shown in gray due to their minor status, but were both shown as multi-lane highways in 2013 and previous versions.
Quote from: ysuindy on August 28, 2014, 12:07:54 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 27, 2014, 07:10:49 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on August 27, 2014, 02:56:59 PM
Quote from: cabiness42 on August 27, 2014, 07:43:49 AM
Quote from: ysuindy on August 25, 2014, 09:21:52 PM
There was nothing marked at the Kern Road exit as to how the old road might be signed. Trying to figure out how to avoid the squeeze at the South Bend end of the connection after the Notre Dame game Saturday. I might try to take one of the other North-South roads down to Kern and cut over to pick up the new road South of the single lane section. If I do, I will try to get a look and see if there is any updated signage.
The least traveled through southbound road after a game is Twyckenham. Eddy to the west and Ironwood to the east get much more traffic. If you can make your way to Twyckenham, take it all the way south. Once you get past Ewing, it starts winding a bit and by the time it ends at Ridgedale, you're only a short block east of Miami. Miami then gets you down to Kern.
Thanks. I typically park on the street in the neighborhood south of Angela, west of Notre Dame Avenue. Usually along Peashway or Napoleon. Looks like my key is getting across Eddy / South Bend Avenue to Twyckenham.
I almost always park east of Eddy, so I haven't driven out of that neighborhood after a game in a long time. If you can go south on St. Louis, that turns into Northside Blvd south of Jefferson. Northside actually passes along the river under Eddy St., so you never have to cross Eddy. At the Farmer's market, you can turn left on Beyer and it's just one block over to Mishawaka Ave. That gets you over to Twyckenham right at Adams High/IUSB. Like I said, this is all dependent on being allowed to go south on St. Louis. Otherwise you're better off just going on over to Michigan to go south and then cutting directly over to Miami along Monroe/Lincolnway.
Thanks - I see exactly what you mean and we now have a plan. We have gone south of Howard before after the games, so I think that will be ok. We would use that to get to one of the bridges back across to Michigan.
I will attempt to give it a try Saturday evening and see what happens.
No traffic issues at all Saturday up and back to the Notre Dame - Rice game.
We hit the south end at US 30 about 10:30 a.m (3:30 game) and no backups there or at the north end.
The game ended about 7:00 and we reached our car at the corner of Peashway and Lawrence in about 30 minutes. I roughly followed cabiness42's directions - St.Louis was closed for construction before we could get to Northside, but we eventually got there. As we went under Eddy Street, I noticed traffic was light so I crossed the river on Sample, turned left on Lincolnway and then right on Miami.
We were getting on 31 at the Kern Road interchange 18 minutes after leaving Peashway /Lawrence and it took us another 17 minutes to get to US 30. No issues at all. Perhaps we were ahead of the game traffic from the University lots.
We stopped to eat in Plymouth and ND fans returning from the game overwhelmed the Arby's there (I should know better - I don't think there is a "fast" Arby's anywhere). Spoke with a few people who came through South Bend on 931 and they indicated no issues at all coming down 931.
I'm staying over after the Michigan game next weekend - have a hotel out along the Toll Road near LaPorte - so my challenge next week post game will be getting out in that direction. Will just need to see how things flow. I plan to go check in before the game to try to figure out different options for getting back.
Quote from: tdindy88 on August 30, 2014, 11:20:21 PM
As for the Indiana state maps, the South Bend bypass (US 20/31) and SR 912 are shown as freeways, I see no reason why the Kokomo bypass and Plymouth-to-South Bend parts of 31 along with US 24 from I-469 to Ohio be marked as freeways.
Both US 31 Kokomo and US 24 Fort to Port are now shown as freeways in the 2015 "Roadway Map".
Alas, the South Bend to Plymouth stretch is still shown as under construction. Hamilton County segment is also now shown that way with all the exits marked. Also no exit numbers for US 31, but I guess we have to take baby steps.
I drove this stretch for the first time in a month over the weekend.
I am still struggling with the idea that the project will be done by year-end, although I'm thinking that "done" and "not having restrictions" are two different things.
On the north tie-in, the future northbound lanes look to be completely graded, but I see no indication that the concrete pouring process will be starting soon. No base put down yet.
On the south tie-in, traffic underneath the new bridge for the 7th Road interchange has been shifted to the old southbound lanes. It appears as if they are finally going to start construction on the portion of the bridge over the northbound lanes, but there remains no tangible evidence of construction over there.
They have started pouring concrete on the entrance / exit ramps on the West side of the 7th Road bridge (southbound exit to 7th, entrance from 7th). The entrance / exit ramps on the East side of the bridge still appeared to need grading.
I cannot see how the interchange is fully operational by December 31. Perhaps they will have no lane restrictions on 31, which is what the project website says.
As for the south end tie-in, to my uneducated eye at 60 mph, it looks like it is not as far advanced as the north end as far as grading and paving to tie in the new southbound lanes to the previously existing lanes.
Thanks for that update. I am taking my first trip on the new road this Friday.
is the old section signed as sr 931?
I traveled this way last week and was still driving on the northbound lanes at the south end, so that switchover must have been very recent. I'd be okay if the 7th Road interchange wasn't fully completed this year, as long as there are four lanes of traffic at both the north and south ends, the odds and ends can wait until early next year.
A few observations/suggestions:
1) I did not see any SR 931 references up in St. Joseph County, of course I didn't travel that roadway either so I can't say it isn't signed at all.
2) I do not like the orange "guide signs" being used at the exits, especially around the US 6 exit, not to mention a good part of the Kokomo bypass. I really hope these are only temporary. I know a few of these signs have been damaged but the highway's been open only a month or so, how can there be signs damaged already. I haven't seen any sign damage along any of I-65 and I-69 in northern Indiana, so why here?
3) Although it probably won't happen, I wish that the destination and mileage signage along US 31 were similar to that of SR 37 from Indianapolis to Bedford. Signs on that highway are a little bigger and to me reflective of a major four-lane highway that US 31 is, instead there are those smaller mixed-case smaller signs that would work fine on small two-lane roads, but personally not to me on a highway that some would like to see become an interstate. Exit numbers at the US 24 and SR 25 interchanges couldn't hurt either....why not?
Quote from: tdindy88 on October 06, 2014, 08:16:54 PM
I traveled this way last week and was still driving on the northbound lanes at the south end, so that switchover must have been very recent. I'd be okay if the 7th Road interchange wasn't fully completed this year, as long as there are four lanes of traffic at both the north and south ends, the odds and ends can wait until early next year.
A few observations/suggestions:
1) I did not see any SR 931 references up in St. Joseph County, of course I didn't travel that roadway either so I can't say it isn't signed at all.
2) I do not like the orange "guide signs" being used at the exits, especially around the US 6 exit, not to mention a good part of the Kokomo bypass. I really hope these are only temporary. I know a few of these signs have been damaged but the highway's been open only a month or so, how can there be signs damaged already. I haven't seen any sign damage along any of I-65 and I-69 in northern Indiana, so why here?
3) Although it probably won't happen, I wish that the destination and mileage signage along US 31 were similar to that of SR 37 from Indianapolis to Bedford. Signs on that highway are a little bigger and to me reflective of a major four-lane highway that US 31 is, instead there are those smaller mixed-case smaller signs that would work fine on small two-lane roads, but personally not to me on a highway that some would like to see become an interstate. Exit numbers at the US 24 and SR 25 interchanges couldn't hurt either....why not?
The orange signs are temporary, and yes there are a lot of damaged signs still out there around the state. One in particular that I can remember is 65 around 109th ave, all 3 of the signs were gone the last time I went through there, there's also a few at 465 and 421. I don't know why it's taking so long to fix though!
As for the signage, I said the same thing about sr 25 for lafayette to logansport, but I drove through there months later, and it appears that the signs were changed to larger ones. Not sure if I was remembering incorrectly or what, but the same could be happening to 31 you never know...
Quote from: tdindy88 on October 06, 2014, 08:16:54 PM
I traveled this way last week and was still driving on the northbound lanes at the south end, so that switchover must have been very recent. I'd be okay if the 7th Road interchange wasn't fully completed this year, as long as there are four lanes of traffic at both the north and south ends, the odds and ends can wait until early next year.
A few observations/suggestions:
1) I did not see any SR 931 references up in St. Joseph County, of course I didn't travel that roadway either so I can't say it isn't signed at all.
2) I do not like the orange "guide signs" being used at the exits, especially around the US 6 exit, not to mention a good part of the Kokomo bypass. I really hope these are only temporary. I know a few of these signs have been damaged but the highway's been open only a month or so, how can there be signs damaged already. I haven't seen any sign damage along any of I-65 and I-69 in northern Indiana, so why here?
3) Although it probably won't happen, I wish that the destination and mileage signage along US 31 were similar to that of SR 37 from Indianapolis to Bedford. Signs on that highway are a little bigger and to me reflective of a major four-lane highway that US 31 is, instead there are those smaller mixed-case smaller signs that would work fine on small two-lane roads, but personally not to me on a highway that some would like to see become an interstate. Exit numbers at the US 24 and SR 25 interchanges couldn't hurt either....why not?
1) the relinquishment agreement was settled much too late for that signage to be included with the rest of the work on US 31. If it happens it'll be separate work, but likely by INDOT forces so it may take some time.
2) There are blow-downs all over the state (Kokomo area was bad, as well as the southern part of I-69). The winter was pretty rough, so some combination of frozen ground + high winds + sun-warmed posts may have caused unusual damage, but it was so bad that INDOT is reviewing their post mounting standards.
3) From what I've seen the signage on the new US 31 is compliant with the current MUTCD - can't say I've driven SR 37 south of Indy recently to know what the difference is, but if they're all caps then they are outdated. Probably a fair time to mention that there is no centralized sign design for INDOT, and due to various factors the consultants designing the signs don't always know what they're doing. The couple of people at INDOT that do know what the signs should look like can't / don't review everything, combine that with changing standards and lagging replacements and signage will look different from route to route.
I'd like to guess that whenever the signs are due to be replaced at the other interchanges along US 31 INDOT would add exit numbers, but I wouldn't hold my breath.
One question, how good is local street connectivity between the 'old' US 31 road and the streets to the north of US 20? As the area develops to the south, is the old road a good major city street continuation of Michigan St towards downtown?
Mike
Quote from: mgk920 on October 07, 2014, 09:41:46 AM
One question, how good is local street connectivity between the 'old' US 31 road and the streets to the north of US 20? As the area develops to the south, is the old road a good major city street continuation of Michigan St towards downtown?
Mike
If you are traveling northbound on Old US 31, you have to briefly turn west onto Kern Rd. and then take the entrance ramp to the New NB US 31 in order to continue on to Michigan Street.
Here's a few examples of the signage I was talking about with SR 37.
(https://www.aaroads.com/midwest/indiana032/in-037_sb_at_in-144.jpg)
(https://www.aaroads.com/midwest/indiana032/in-037_sb_at_whiteland_rd.jpg)
(https://www.aaroads.com/midwest/indiana032/in-037_sb_after_old_sr-37_01.jpg)
Mind you I am only talking about the non-freeway parts of US 31, I know the freeway segments are up to MUTCD standards.
Some of these are button-copy and given that most of this will become interstate the signs will go away (with interstate-style signage replacing it.) I also seem to remember signs like this along parts of US 41 in Southwestern Indiana and SR 3 around New Castle to Muncie. This is fairly common on Ohio expressways. I realize that signage along that route probably won't be changing, not unless there is a full interstate conversion for the rest of 31, but it's just a thought of mine.
It's good to see that INDOT is looking at how they mount their signs, it's just a little ridiculous how their newer signs are seeing this damage but not much of their older signs, again I'm looking at I-65 and I-69 north of the city, that's similar terrain to US 31. The only damaged signs I'll excuse along US 31 would be at the US 35/SR 22 exit that was damaged by the tornado a few days before the highway opened, INDOT obviously couldn't have seen that coming.
Quote from: trafficsignal on October 07, 2014, 09:38:04 AM
2) There are blow-downs all over the state (Kokomo area was bad, as well as the southern part of I-69). The winter was pretty rough, so some combination of frozen ground + high winds + sun-warmed posts may have caused unusual damage, but it was so bad that INDOT is reviewing their post mounting standards.
Similarly, nearly every ground-mounted BGS at the new US 24/35 & SR 25 & SR 29 interchange has blown down at least once since installation. Something is wrong with what they're doing lately, it seems. Never noticed so many problems before.
Not out of knowledge, but just a guess - all these are newer ground installations. Those are now much bigger due to the MUTCD requirement of 20"/15" letter heights for ground mounted destinations. Either INDOT's standards for larger signs are not sufficient or the signs were outside the standards and incorrectly designed.
I drove it southbound over the weekend. It was nice to zoom right through rather than having to slow down in Lakeville and LaPaz, but I suppose that was the whole point of building this.
But the whole time I was on it my car felt uncertain on the pavement. I felt a lot of ... how do I even describe this? ... skittishness in my tires as I rolled. It was an enormously windy day, too, and so I was fighting it to stay in my lane. That skittishness ended the minute I exited the new road back onto the old.
Quite a bit of progress within the last week at the North tie-in. Asphalt has been set down on the entirety of the new northbound lanes. I can most assuredly buy this tie-in will be complete by the end of the year. Seems as if they will have this done before Thanksgiving, although I admittedly don't know what else needs done, especially with a quick look at 45 mph.
All of the exit signs for the US 6 exit have been replaced, both directions. Last weekend the orange signs were still up. I cannot recall what other signs were down.
Hard to see much obvious progress at the South tie-in. I'm sure its being made, but my novice eye behind the wheel doesn't see all that much different over the past few weeks. This project looks to go well in to 2015 to my untrained and uneducated eye.
Is INDOT still trying to pursue the I-67 designation for US 31 from Indianapolis north or is this new freeway just going to be a nice US 31 all the way north to I-196 .....?
Quote from: I94RoadRunner on October 22, 2014, 12:32:01 AM
Is INDOT still trying to pursue the I-67 designation for US 31 from Indianapolis north or is this new freeway just going to be a nice US 31 all the way north to I-196 .....?
When was INDOT ever pursuing an I-67 designation here?
Quote from: NE2 on October 22, 2014, 01:15:43 AM
Quote from: I94RoadRunner on October 22, 2014, 12:32:01 AM
Is INDOT still trying to pursue the I-67 designation for US 31 from Indianapolis north or is this new freeway just going to be a nice US 31 all the way north to I-196 .....?
When was INDOT ever pursuing an I-67 designation here?
Idk if INDOT actually made a proposal, but I personally think an I-67 would be a great idea, and I've even made a verbal proposal for it on the forum before, somewhere in a thread I can't remember.
EDIT: Oh, silly me, it's on
this thread, LOL. I just found it, and it is on page 6 if anyone wants to see.
Quote from: NE2 on October 22, 2014, 01:15:43 AM
Quote from: I94RoadRunner on October 22, 2014, 12:32:01 AM
Is INDOT still trying to pursue the I-67 designation for US 31 from Indianapolis north or is this new freeway just going to be a nice US 31 all the way north to I-196 .....?
When was INDOT ever pursuing an I-67 designation here?
I agree, I don't they ever were, why does it need to be signed as an interstate anyway? What's wrong with US 31?
I'm in favor of signing as many limited-access freeways as possible as interstates.
I'm not in favor of converting every four-lane surface arterial into a limited-access freeway.
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 22, 2014, 05:28:11 PM
Quote from: NE2 on October 22, 2014, 01:15:43 AM
Quote from: I94RoadRunner on October 22, 2014, 12:32:01 AM
Is INDOT still trying to pursue the I-67 designation for US 31 from Indianapolis north or is this new freeway just going to be a nice US 31 all the way north to I-196 .....?
When was INDOT ever pursuing an I-67 designation here?
I agree, I don't they ever were, why does it need to be signed as an interstate anyway? What's wrong with US 31?
If they go ahead and convert the rest of the road to interstate-standard, then they should definitely go ahead and apply to have it signed as I-67. However, I'm 100% against actually making that conversion until after the entire lengths of I-65 and I-70 are expanded to six lanes. That will have a bigger impact on traffic than upgrading 31 between Peru and Plymouth where you can already just set your cruise on 70 and not have to touch it.
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 22, 2014, 05:28:11 PM
Quote from: NE2 on October 22, 2014, 01:15:43 AM
Quote from: I94RoadRunner on October 22, 2014, 12:32:01 AM
Is INDOT still trying to pursue the I-67 designation for US 31 from Indianapolis north or is this new freeway just going to be a nice US 31 all the way north to I-196 .....?
When was INDOT ever pursuing an I-67 designation here?
I agree, I don't they ever were, why does it need to be signed as an interstate anyway? What's wrong with US 31?
Absolutely nothing. US-31 is just as good a number for it.
Nothing is wrong with this highway staying US 31. I just recall that there was talk some time ago of making US 31 into a new I-67 corridor and wondered if that was still the case or not .....?
Quote from: I94RoadRunner on October 24, 2014, 03:36:55 AM
Nothing is wrong with this highway staying US 31. I just recall that there was talk some time ago of making US 31 into a new I-67 corridor and wondered if that was still the case or not .....?
The governor has stated that it should be a priority to convert the rest of the road to limited access. Nobody with the state has ever said anything about an I-67 (or any other interstate) designation but that seems to be a natural consequence.
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 24, 2014, 07:50:44 AM
Quote from: I94RoadRunner on October 24, 2014, 03:36:55 AM
Nothing is wrong with this highway staying US 31. I just recall that there was talk some time ago of making US 31 into a new I-67 corridor and wondered if that was still the case or not .....?
The governor has stated that it should be a priority to convert the rest of the road to limited access. Nobody with the state has ever said anything about an I-67 (or any other interstate) designation but that seems to be a natural consequence.
I hope it's at the lowest priority, upgrading the whole thing can wait a while until they finish more important roads
INDOT apparently applied to AASHTO quite awhile ago for US 31 to be added as I-67, however it was rejected because Michigan did not agree. The preferred route for what Indiana wanted for I-67 was US 31 north to Elkhart, then connecting to US 131 and into Michigan along US 131. An alternate was to continue north along US 31 to I-196 and then to US 131 and north. Michigan surprisingly enough did not want to add I-67 though so it never got approved. Furthermore, if Michigan does not want to add I-67, I do not see any real need for I-67 in Indiana since it would only connect Indianapolis to Kokomo and Elkhart. US 31 has worked for many years so far and will in the future as well.
Quote from: I94RoadRunner on October 24, 2014, 05:57:54 PM
INDOT apparently applied to AASHTO quite awhile ago for US 31 to be added as I-67, however it was rejected because Michigan did not agree. The preferred route for what Indiana wanted for I-67 was US 31 north to Elkhart, then connecting to US 131 and into Michigan along US 131. An alternate was to continue north along US 31 to I-196 and then to US 131 and north. Michigan surprisingly enough did not want to add I-67 though so it never got approved. Furthermore, if Michigan does not want to add I-67, I do not see any real need for I-67 in Indiana since it would only connect Indianapolis to Kokomo and Elkhart. US 31 has worked for many years so far and will in the future as well.
i-67 should follow us 31 the whole way in michigan. michigan is one of the few states to keep the highway as it was when it is turned into a freeway (us 23,131,127,31)
Doing a bit more research on I-67, Kentucky is pressing for I-67 to also go south out of Indianapolis running tandem with I-69 and then cutting off at US 231 to connect Owensboro, KY and then Bowling Green ending at I-65. I would be surprised if this happened in my lifetime though .....
Quote from: I94RoadRunner on October 25, 2014, 08:05:58 PM
Doing a bit more research on I-67, Kentucky is pressing for I-67 to also go south out of Indianapolis running tandem with I-69 and then cutting off at US 231 to connect Owensboro, KY and then Bowling Green ending at I-65. I would be surprised if this happened in my lifetime though .....
Kentucky isn't pressing for it. The mayor of Owensboro is. There's a difference. KYTC sees it as unnecessary, which it is.
Quote from: I94RoadRunner on October 24, 2014, 03:36:55 AM
Nothing is wrong with this highway staying US 31. I just recall that there was talk some time ago of making US 31 into a new I-67 corridor and wondered if that was still the case or not .....?
Doesn't Indiana require freeways to have an interstate number before they can be posted at 70 mph?
Yes, the improved segments of US 31 have a speed limit of 65 (except for the new urban freeway south of SR 38, which is 55), while the rural unimproved US 31 divided highway has a speed limit of 60. The new improvements are built to interstate speed standards, so 70 mph is a feasible safe speed.
Quote from: I94RoadRunner on October 25, 2014, 08:05:58 PM
Doing a bit more research on I-67, Kentucky is pressing for I-67 to also go south out of Indianapolis running tandem with I-69 and then cutting off at US 231 to connect Owensboro, KY and then Bowling Green ending at I-65. I would be surprised if this happened in my lifetime though .....
that's never going to happen 67 south of 465 is useless
Quote from: I94RoadRunner on October 24, 2014, 05:57:54 PM
INDOT apparently applied to AASHTO quite awhile ago for US 31 to be added as I-67, however it was rejected because Michigan did not agree. The preferred route for what Indiana wanted for I-67 was US 31 north to Elkhart, then connecting to US 131 and into Michigan along US 131. An alternate was to continue north along US 31 to I-196 and then to US 131 and north. Michigan surprisingly enough did not want to add I-67 though so it never got approved. Furthermore, if Michigan does not want to add I-67, I do not see any real need for I-67 in Indiana since it would only connect Indianapolis to Kokomo and Elkhart. US 31 has worked for many years so far and will in the future as well.
How exactly would I-67 get from US 31 to US 131?
This was by overtaking I-196 northward to US 131 in downtown Grand Rapids. I-67 was thought in this alternative to go north along US 131 replacing the hidden I-296 and then northward back and back to I-75 south of Vanderbilt. Michigan does at this point has shelved the US 131 freeway north of Manton, therefore the furthest north I-67 could go would be Grand Rapids.
Also, there is apparently a new lawsuit filed recently regarding the section of US 31 near Benton Harbor trying to prevent the freeway from ever going any further north of Napier Ave. Obviously this would stop I-67 from going into Michigan in the first place should this be true. I have researched this and have not found anything yet however will post information if I do find anything.
Maybe an good alternative is to widen Napier Ave to 6 lanes between US 31 and I-94 and just be done with it. There really is no need for the freeway to be finished if Napier is built to handle the traffic. Probably better than fighting all of the environmentalists standing in the way .....?
Quote from: cabiness42 on October 26, 2014, 01:30:54 PM
Quote from: I94RoadRunner on October 24, 2014, 05:57:54 PM
INDOT apparently applied to AASHTO quite awhile ago for US 31 to be added as I-67, however it was rejected because Michigan did not agree. The preferred route for what Indiana wanted for I-67 was US 31 north to Elkhart, then connecting to US 131 and into Michigan along US 131. An alternate was to continue north along US 31 to I-196 and then to US 131 and north. Michigan surprisingly enough did not want to add I-67 though so it never got approved. Furthermore, if Michigan does not want to add I-67, I do not see any real need for I-67 in Indiana since it would only connect Indianapolis to Kokomo and Elkhart. US 31 has worked for many years so far and will in the future as well.
How exactly would I-67 get from US 31 to US 131?
Only thing I could think of is an extension of US 20's freeway and upgrading SR 13 to a freeway, or just having it multiplex with the toll road and upgrading the tiny piece of 131 in Indiana. Since Michigan never has money to do anything meaningful to their roads, I doubt they would ever upgrade their portions to make that work. And for Indiana to do the two upgrades I mentioned would be crazy, and unnecessary.
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 26, 2014, 11:06:55 AM
that's never going to happen 67 south of 465 is useless
I don't get it, SR "67" is a decent divided highway that connects Indianapolis with Mooresville and Martinsville and provides a nice alternative route to SR 37 from Martinsville to I-465.....oh you meant I-67. :)
Quote from: ysuindy on October 17, 2014, 10:31:22 PM
Quite a bit of progress within the last week at the North tie-in. Asphalt has been set down on the entirety of the new northbound lanes. I can most assuredly buy this tie-in will be complete by the end of the year. Seems as if they will have this done before Thanksgiving, although I admittedly don't know what else needs done, especially with a quick look at 45 mph.
All of the exit signs for the US 6 exit have been replaced, both directions. Last weekend the orange signs were still up. I cannot recall what other signs were down.
Hard to see much obvious progress at the South tie-in. I'm sure its being made, but my novice eye behind the wheel doesn't see all that much different over the past few weeks. This project looks to go well in to 2015 to my untrained and uneducated eye.
I just drove the route again on Saturday (10/24). I'd agree with ysuindy that all lanes should be open on the north tie-in before the end of the year. That's where traffic is heaviest, so this is really good news. As for the south end, we saw that some work was being done on Saturday, but we doubt that all lanes will be open this year. The new Plymouth exit (7th Road?) looks to be a long way from completion. I'd say it will be far into the 2015 season before it's done.
I noticed one signage error, though I didn't get a picture. While northbound on old 31, just south of the US 6 intersection, I saw the advance signs that looked like this:
West East
US US US
6 6 31
<-- --> -->
US 31 is about 1/2 mile to the east at that point, so I think there should have been a "TO" banner above the US 31 shield. Maybe this signage is temporary.
Quote from: theline on October 27, 2014, 12:37:56 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on October 17, 2014, 10:31:22 PM
Quite a bit of progress within the last week at the North tie-in. Asphalt has been set down on the entirety of the new northbound lanes. I can most assuredly buy this tie-in will be complete by the end of the year. Seems as if they will have this done before Thanksgiving, although I admittedly don't know what else needs done, especially with a quick look at 45 mph.
All of the exit signs for the US 6 exit have been replaced, both directions. Last weekend the orange signs were still up. I cannot recall what other signs were down.
Hard to see much obvious progress at the South tie-in. I'm sure its being made, but my novice eye behind the wheel doesn't see all that much different over the past few weeks. This project looks to go well in to 2015 to my untrained and uneducated eye.
I just drove the route again on Saturday (10/24). I'd agree with ysuindy that all lanes should be open on the north tie-in before the end of the year. That's where traffic is heaviest, so this is really good news. As for the south end, we saw that some work was being done on Saturday, but we doubt that all lanes will be open this year. The new Plymouth exit (7th Road?) looks to be a long way from completion. I'd say it will be far into the 2015 season before it's done.
I noticed one signage error, though I didn't get a picture. While northbound on old 31, just south of the US 6 intersection, I saw the advance signs that looked like this:
West East
US US US
6 6 31
<-- --> -->
US 31 is about 1/2 mile to the east at that point, so I think there should have been a "TO" banner above the US 31 shield. Maybe this signage is temporary.
Sounds like it's just the old signs and they added a right arrow sign below the 31, replacing the old straight arrow.
^^ I'll bet you've got it. They still should add a "TO" banner, and perhaps they will.
Quote from: tdindy88 on October 26, 2014, 07:40:42 PM
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 26, 2014, 11:06:55 AM
that's never going to happen 67 south of 465 is useless
I don't get it, SR "67" is a decent divided highway that connects Indianapolis with Mooresville and Martinsville and provides a nice alternative route to SR 37 from Martinsville to I-465.....oh you meant I-67. :)
I would not really say useless but rather unnecessary. I-65 and I-69 will be sufficient. Owensboro could get an I-x65 or an I-x69 to connect to the interstate system. Oh wait, that is what I-169 is for along the Audubon Pkwy. Maybe once it gets signed then Owensboro will shut up about I-67 .....?
Quote from: I94RoadRunner on October 24, 2014, 05:57:54 PM
INDOT apparently applied to AASHTO quite awhile ago for US 31 to be added as I-67, however it was rejected because Michigan did not agree. The preferred route for what Indiana wanted for I-67 was US 31 north to Elkhart, then connecting to US 131 and into Michigan along US 131. An alternate was to continue north along US 31 to I-196 and then to US 131 and north. Michigan surprisingly enough did not want to add I-67 though so it never got approved. Furthermore, if Michigan does not want to add I-67, I do not see any real need for I-67 in Indiana since it would only connect Indianapolis to Kokomo and Elkhart. US 31 has worked for many years so far and will in the future as well.
Saves the I-67 designation for the US 219 corridor as a shunt from I-68, grid placement be damned...
Is this US 31 upgrade being done in lieu of the long proposed, but never built, "Indiana North-South Toll Road"?
Quote from: 02 Park Ave on October 28, 2014, 11:35:21 AM
Is this US 31 upgrade being done in lieu of the long proposed, but never built, "Indiana North-South Toll Road"?
I've never heard of such a thing.
Quote from: 02 Park Ave on October 28, 2014, 11:35:21 AM
Is this US 31 upgrade being done in lieu of the long proposed, but never built, "Indiana North-South Toll Road"?
me neither! do you have any info on this?
My recollection is that the Indiana North-South Toll Road was a proposal from the pre-Interstate System days, when many DOTs were drawing up plans for numerous toll roads that were abandoned when the Interstate System was adopted. I vaguely recall seeing a map with the north-south road roughly paralleling US 41 from Gary to Evansville.
That's so far in the past that the US 31 upgrade can hardly be considered a "replacement," any more that a Lexus is a replacement for a Model T. Well, they're both cars.
Quote from: MikeSantNY78 on October 28, 2014, 10:23:03 AM
Quote from: I94RoadRunner on October 24, 2014, 05:57:54 PM
INDOT apparently applied to AASHTO quite awhile ago for US 31 to be added as I-67, however it was rejected because Michigan did not agree. The preferred route for what Indiana wanted for I-67 was US 31 north to Elkhart, then connecting to US 131 and into Michigan along US 131. An alternate was to continue north along US 31 to I-196 and then to US 131 and north. Michigan surprisingly enough did not want to add I-67 though so it never got approved. Furthermore, if Michigan does not want to add I-67, I do not see any real need for I-67 in Indiana since it would only connect Indianapolis to Kokomo and Elkhart. US 31 has worked for many years so far and will in the future as well.
Saves the I-67 designation for the US 219 corridor as a shunt from I-68, grid placement be damned...
US 219 possibly could be an interstate as far north as I-86, however from Salamanca north would not be possible the way the new US 219 north/I-86 interchange is planned to only be a diamond interchange and the Seneca Indians will never allow it to be upgraded.
Is there any way the moderator of this post can place all the recent posts about this into another thread? They have nothing to do with the subject at hand.
Quote from: theline on October 28, 2014, 05:59:08 PM
My recollection is that the Indiana North-South Toll Road was a proposal from the pre-Interstate System days, when many DOTs were drawing up plans for numerous toll roads that were abandoned when the Interstate System was adopted. I vaguely recall seeing a map with the north-south road roughly paralleling US 41 from Gary to Evansville.
Is it this map from an archived copy of Mike Natale's toll roads website on Archive.org?
http://web.archive.org/web/20010210013003/www.contrib.andrew.cmu.edu/~mn2n/tollun.html
^^ That's not the map I saw, though it does include the northern part of the route I saw on another map. The map I saw extended the proposed road down to Evansville. Maybe I'll get motivated now to find that map.
Back to the original topic - I went to South Bend and back this weekend for the first time in five weeks.
My thoughts from my quick, uneducated looks at I drove through.
I think they are nearly complete on the north tie-in. The new northbound lanes have been striped. A few pieces of equipment left. I imagine there is some work left, but I suspect they will have this opened prior to Thanksgiving.
There was a lot of progress at the south end. The tie-in from the new road to the old in the south bound lanes seems to have most of the asphalt down. The bridge being reconstructed just south of the tie-in still looks to have some work, but I can easily see this portion being done "by year-end."
The 7th Road interchange has also progressed. The steel beams for the overpass are in place. Grading of the northbound exit / entrance ramps looks complete or close to it, but no concrete poured. Two way traffic remains in the southbound lanes.
I do not see how the interchange is open before December 31, 2014, but I could see two lanes of traffic in each direction by December 31 or shortly thereafter.
The Lake Effect bomb that dropped 12 inches of snow had the South Bend airport last week had no accumulating snow at the south tie-in and it looked like less than 4 inches around Ireland Road and the north tie-in. Hopefully the early on-set of cold weather does not delay construction.
I will be through there the next two weekends and will be checking progress.
I will be through next weekend as well, though it will be dark so I won't be able to see much.
http://www.wsbt.com/video-and-photos/new-us-31-causing-drivers-to-speed-through-side-roads/29667890
people unhappy with changes around 31
Quote from: silverback1065 on November 19, 2014, 07:34:42 PM
http://www.wsbt.com/video-and-photos/new-us-31-causing-drivers-to-speed-through-side-roads/29667890
people unhappy with changes around 31
Kern Road has been a major road for years, always with heavy traffic and people traveling well over the speed limit. People just want to find an excuse to complain about the new highway.
^^ As a South Bend resident, I'd agree that traffic has always moved significantly faster than the limit along Kern. Fifteen to 20 over is excessive though. I'm not surprised that traffic is heavier on Kern now that drivers must use it coming and going from 31, when they formerly had their choice of other side streets like Roosevelt Road. I believe that the police can get the speeds under control with some continued enforcement. If they can get the speeds down, many drivers will seek other routes to the east such as the St. Joseph Valley Parkway or Jackson Road, accessed via Main St.
The report could have pointed out that several alternate routes, like Johnson Road, are still cut off as construction continues. When those are open, much of the local traffic congesting Kern will find an alternate.
Update from my Sunday November 30 trip back from South Bend
At the north tie in traffic the new northbound lanes are open. There remains a small stretch of single lane traffic in the southbound lanes , a few hundred yards at most.
At the south tie in, the southbound lanes are open. There is a single lane traffic each way under the 3A bridge.
Further South all traffic remains in the southbound lanes at the 7A interchange
I will be back in three weeks and will post any updates
I made the trip to South Bend the weekend before Christmas (and forgot to post) and again today.
There are two lanes of traffic in each direction open throughout the zone. Construction is not complete on the 7A interchange as well as an overpass at the North end. Before Christmas there was a small stretch of one lane traffic southbound at the North end in the middle of the interchange with the St Joseph Parkway /Bypass.
I traveled the route again on Saturday, and noted that the two lanes remain open in both directions throughout the route. I suspect they will remain open until some closures become necessary as construction resumes in earnest in the spring. As mentioned by ysindy, the remaining major items are the 7A
Road interchange and the Johnson Road overpass. I noticed additional signs up, including a supplemental sign noting that the US 6 exit should be taken for Lapaz.
A couple of updates from trip to South Bend on Wednesday:
The 7A Road Interchange appears complete, but is not yet open. The exit is signed as "Plymouth Veterans Parkway". The one mile and half mile signs in each direction make it appear the exit is open, but the last sign has an orange "closed" across it and there are barrels across the exit ramps.
This story gives the information on 7A being renamed Veterans Parkway and connecting with Michigan Road (the original 31).
Based on what I saw Wednesday, I would suspect the exit is being held up for work elsewhere on Veterans Parkway.
Traffic was down to one lane northbound at the bridge over the Yellow River, just south of Veterans Parkway - it seems they have been working on or around this bridge for a long time.
There were no barrels or other impediments on 31 at the Johnson Road overpass, but it does not appear the overpass is open.
What I did not get a chance to do was drive any portion of old 31 to see if it is signed as any state route.
WNDU reporting Veterans Parkway is open
https://twitter.com/TriciaHarteWNDU (https://twitter.com/TriciaHarteWNDU)
i cant find it, is it on google yet?
I don't see Veterans Parkway either. The original name for the road was 7th Road. The old parts of the that road, east of 31 and west of Michigan Road, are shown.
Veterans Parkway and the new interchange are open. As I went through there yesterday morning, there was a lineup of cars on the road looking a lot like a ribbon-cutting ceremony was about to take place. When i came back down US 31 today, it was all open so I took Veterans Parkway from US 31 west to old US 31. The road is not straight - it has a few curves, and has nice wide shoulders. It ends at a roundabout on old 31 that is pretty close to the US 30/SR 17 interchange so it gets you to services in Plymouth efficiently.
The control cities at the interchange are Kokomo and South Bend.
I drove by the new Veterans Parkway exit on Saturday. The BGSs look very odd to me, because they have a horizontal line running all the way across them, separating "Veterans Parkway" from "Plymouth." This usage looks odd, at least in Indiana, dividing the name of the road from the name of the city. This reminds of signs using horizontal lines to separate different attractions from each other. That's not the meaning here, of course.
Google doesn't have it, it's on OSM, whoever is a beast at Map Maker should add it, I'm not good at drawing interchanges on that site.
https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=15/41.3680/-86.2956
Quote from: silverback1065 on October 06, 2015, 06:08:14 PM
Google doesn't have it, it's on OSM, whoever is a beast at Map Maker should add it, I'm not good at drawing interchanges on that site.
https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=15/41.3680/-86.2956
The OSM map only shows a small part of the new road.
Google Map now has most of the new road, but not the US 31 interchange. I assume that will be on there soon. For some reason the new road is marked as 7th Rd. instead of Veterans Parkway, though.
Quote from: tdindy88 on October 06, 2014, 08:16:54 PM
1) I did not see any SR 931 references up in St. Joseph County, of course I didn't travel that roadway either so I can't say it isn't signed at all.
Reviving this old quote to add my update about SR 931 signs. I drove the NB segment of old 31 in St. Joseph County from Pierce Road to Kern Road on Monday, and I saw no SR 931 reassurance signs. I did see an END SR 931 sign north of Roosevelt Road, presumably at the South Bend city limit. The city limit has never been marked (to my recollection) so I'm a little fuzzy on where it is.
Quote from: theline on October 08, 2015, 03:44:12 PM
Quote from: tdindy88 on October 06, 2014, 08:16:54 PM
1) I did not see any SR 931 references up in St. Joseph County, of course I didn't travel that roadway either so I can't say it isn't signed at all.
Reviving this old quote to add my update about SR 931 signs. I drove the NB segment of old 31 in St. Joseph County from Pierce Road to Kern Road on Monday, and I saw no SR 931 reassurance signs. I did see an END SR 931 sign north of Roosevelt Road, presumably at the South Bend city limit. The city limit has never been marked (to my recollection) so I'm a little fuzzy on where it is.
The southern city limit does stretch down Old 31 to just north of Roosevelt Rd.
The interchange for Veterans Parkway (7th road, as Google calls it) is now on Google Maps. Can somebody more familiar with the area explain the need for this interchange? Seems redundant with the interchange for 30 being only 2 miles south and with the tie-in to Michigan road less than a mile north of the US-30 / Michigan Rd. interchange. Is it just to take pressure off 30? Give people coming from the north bit of a shortcut to Plymouth? Would it really save that much time over 30? It doesn't look like there is much north of the Veterans tie-in so you'd have to pass by 30 anyways to get to downtown Plymouth. Seems like what Plymouth really needs a better southern entry option but I'm guessing that wasn't pursued because it wasn't within the project limits. Again, I'm not really familiar with the area and the traffic patterns up there. It just seems a little excessive to have a brand new interchange for a road that's less than 4 miles long, most of which wasn't even there before.
^^ I have no facts to back me up, but my conjecture is the that it's intended to ease Plymouth's loss of access from the north via the old, old US-31, which branched off former 31 less than a mile south of the US-6 intersection. Plymouth is a rather significant city (population over 10,000 and a county seat) and Veterans Parkway provides a direct northern access. US-30 doesn't provide direct access to the bulk of the city. Plymouth isn't even mentioned on the exit signs at off 31 at US-30.
Found a few media stories that indicated opening up an economic corridor - I haven't driven Veterans Parkway, but I suspect they believe they can attract some industry along the road with access to direct to 31.
I drove up Michigan Road in early September from Plymouth - there appeared to be some light industry along Michigan Road just south of the Veterans Parkway roundabout. It will be interesting to watch if / how things develop along that corridor.
Along that approach, I wonder if that interchange will see any commercial development - gas station, fast food, etc. The US 6 old US 31 intersection has McDonalds, Arbys, the world's slowest Burger King, two gas stations and a produce stand.
That really seems like the Veterans Parkway exit would be a ripe spot for development that appeals to both travelers and locals. It's close enough to Plymouth that businesses can draw patrons from the city. There's now a fairly long undeveloped stretch between Michigan and Ireland in South Bend and the McDonald's in Argos. Time will tell.
Quote from: bmeiser on October 09, 2015, 09:54:55 AM
The interchange for Veterans Parkway (7th road, as Google calls it) is now on Google Maps. Can somebody more familiar with the area explain the need for this interchange? Seems redundant with the interchange for 30 being only 2 miles south and with the tie-in to Michigan road less than a mile north of the US-30 / Michigan Rd. interchange. Is it just to take pressure off 30? Give people coming from the north bit of a shortcut to Plymouth? Would it really save that much time over 30? It doesn't look like there is much north of the Veterans tie-in so you'd have to pass by 30 anyways to get to downtown Plymouth. Seems like what Plymouth really needs a better southern entry option but I'm guessing that wasn't pursued because it wasn't within the project limits. Again, I'm not really familiar with the area and the traffic patterns up there. It just seems a little excessive to have a brand new interchange for a road that's less than 4 miles long, most of which wasn't even there before.
I grew up in this county and I can give some perspective. First of all, for people who live in the Lake of the Woods area, 7th Rd/Ply-Gos Trail was their main access point to US 31 South. With the removal off all access points between US 6 and US 30, this meant adding 5-10 minutes of drive time to access US 31 South without this interchange. It's also better access to the industrial area on Michigan Rd. Otherwise you have to down to 30 (which juts south right at 31) or access Michigan Rd from US 6.
I traveled up this way yesterday as part of a trip to hopefully include US 31 coverage for AARoads and noticed that the signage at the SR 4 exit has changed. The last time I was there the control cities were North Liberty and LaPorte with Lakeville given a supplemental sign. Now it's North Liberty and Lakeville with LaPorte given the supplemental sign. As with the Kokomo segment it seems that most of the signs along that highway have been fixed (I knew a few were gone when I was last there.)
I am still perplexed about the signing coverage along this highway as compared to the rest of US 31 and other newer projects. This segment has plenty of mileage signs and even signs at the roadway crossings. Why can't the new I-69 have that? It's an interstate for crying out loud.
Quote from: tdindy88 on March 01, 2016, 10:04:56 AM
I traveled up this way yesterday as part of a trip to hopefully include US 31 coverage for AARoads and noticed that the signage at the SR 4 exit has changed. The last time I was there the control cities were North Liberty and LaPorte with Lakeville given a supplemental sign. Now it's North Liberty and Lakeville with LaPorte given the supplemental sign. As with the Kokomo segment it seems that most of the signs along that highway have been fixed (I knew a few were gone when I was last there.)
I am still perplexed about the signing coverage along this highway as compared to the rest of US 31 and other newer projects. This segment has plenty of mileage signs and even signs at the roadway crossings. Why can't the new I-69 have that? It's an interstate for crying out loud.
It has taken several years for all the Kokomo signage to get up. Perhaps I 69 is on a similar pace. For example, the blue services signage and the notice of no unmotorized vehicles on ramps were just put up last fall.
I was up at Notre Dame today and drove the old road back to US 6 on my way home.
There was a Start 931 sign southbound (and End 931 sign northbound) at what we presume to be the South Bend city limits just north of Roosevelt.
There is a End 931 sign southbound (and Start 931 sign northbound) at the Marshall - St. Joseph County line in front of Laville High School. I saw no other 931 signs on the drive.
I did notice the old Phillips 66 between South Bend and Lakeville has closed (it may have closed before the new road open - I can't remember). The other business casualty I noticed was the world's worst Burger King on the southwest corner of US 6 and old 31 in LaPaz. There may well be business closures in Lakeville and LaPaz, but I never paid that much attention to what was there as I was too busy watching my speed so as to not make acquaintance with the local constables.
Also drove the old road from Argos to Rochester to help break up the monotony of the ride...
The old road is closed south of US 6 - they are demolishing the overpass that carried Michigan Road from Plymouth (old old 31) over the stretch that originally bypassed Plymouth in the 70's (old 31).
Quote from: ysuindy on April 16, 2016, 08:06:55 PM
I was up at Notre Dame today and drove the old road back to US 6 on my way home.
There was a Start 931 sign southbound (and End 931 sign northbound) at what we presume to be the South Bend city limits just north of Roosevelt.
There is a End 931 sign southbound (and Start 931 sign northbound) at the Marshall - St. Joseph County line in front of Laville High School. I saw no other 931 signs on the drive.
I did notice the old Phillips 66 between South Bend and Lakeville has closed (it may have closed before the new road open - I can't remember). The other business casualty I noticed was the world's worst Burger King on the southwest corner of US 6 and old 31 in LaPaz. There may well be business closures in Lakeville and LaPaz, but I never paid that much attention to what was there as I was too busy watching my speed so as to not make acquaintance with the local constables.
Also drove the old road from Argos to Rochester to help break up the monotony of the ride...
The old road is closed south of US 6 - they are demolishing the overpass that carried Michigan Road from Plymouth (old old 31) over the stretch that originally bypassed Plymouth in the 70's (old 31).
interesting, so there were no shields at the junction with SR 4? Also is the interchange with Kern Rd correct? It looks like whoever drew it didn't finish the spui design.
Quote from: ysuindy on April 16, 2016, 08:06:55 PM
I was up at Notre Dame today and drove the old road back to US 6 on my way home.
There was a Start 931 sign southbound (and End 931 sign northbound) at what we presume to be the South Bend city limits just north of Roosevelt.
There is a End 931 sign southbound (and Start 931 sign northbound) at the Marshall - St. Joseph County line in front of Laville High School. I saw no other 931 signs on the drive.
I did notice the old Phillips 66 between South Bend and Lakeville has closed (it may have closed before the new road open - I can't remember). The other business casualty I noticed was the world's worst Burger King on the southwest corner of US 6 and old 31 in LaPaz. There may well be business closures in Lakeville and LaPaz, but I never paid that much attention to what was there as I was too busy watching my speed so as to not make acquaintance with the local constables.
Also drove the old road from Argos to Rochester to help break up the monotony of the ride...
The old road is closed south of US 6 - they are demolishing the overpass that carried Michigan Road from Plymouth (old old 31) over the stretch that originally bypassed Plymouth in the 70's (old 31).
Yes, the city boundary on 931 is just north of Roosevelt Rd. I haven't driven 931 since the new 31 opened. I need to do that next time I'm up that way.
Quote from: silverback1065 on April 17, 2016, 04:10:14 PM
Quote from: ysuindy on April 16, 2016, 08:06:55 PM
I was up at Notre Dame today and drove the old road back to US 6 on my way home.
There was a Start 931 sign southbound (and End 931 sign northbound) at what we presume to be the South Bend city limits just north of Roosevelt.
There is a End 931 sign southbound (and Start 931 sign northbound) at the Marshall - St. Joseph County line in front of Laville High School. I saw no other 931 signs on the drive.
I did notice the old Phillips 66 between South Bend and Lakeville has closed (it may have closed before the new road open - I can't remember). The other business casualty I noticed was the world's worst Burger King on the southwest corner of US 6 and old 31 in LaPaz. There may well be business closures in Lakeville and LaPaz, but I never paid that much attention to what was there as I was too busy watching my speed so as to not make acquaintance with the local constables.
Also drove the old road from Argos to Rochester to help break up the monotony of the ride...
The old road is closed south of US 6 - they are demolishing the overpass that carried Michigan Road from Plymouth (old old 31) over the stretch that originally bypassed Plymouth in the 70's (old 31).
interesting, so there were no shields at the junction with SR 4? Also is the interchange with Kern Rd correct? It looks like whoever drew it didn't finish the spui design.
I did not notice any shields at the SR 4 junction - however I did catch the light green, so I may have missed one.