My dad said there was a traffic light in either WB or EB I-376 in Pittsburgh between 279 and 579, but that it was removed. Where exactly was this, and does anyone have any pictures?
EDIT: My original question is answered, but apparently the discussion continues. :P
Before I-376 was completed, that part of it used Fort Pitt Blvd. between Liberty Bridge and 279. That's what your father's remembering.
I think there was a light on the ramp from I-279 south to I-376 east.
Yeah, it was that ramp. (When was it made 376? My dad was born in 1962, so he doesn't even remember that far back.) Was it the part where the ramp from 279 merges with the ramp from Grant St? The mainline merge forms a third lane, so a light there wouldn't make much sense.
OK, I don't know why my son didn't just ask me to find out for him. (Apparently he must've thought I wasn't up to the task. Tsk-tsk. You have much to learn, my son. When the student is ready, the teacher will appear. And other clichés like that there.)
For many years, when driving from southbound I-279 to eastbound I-376 (crossing "the point," just before the Fort Pitt Bridge), one encountered a handfull of signal lights (I forget how many). IOW, there wasn't a direct, freeway-to-freeway connection between the two highways in that direction.
After only 42 years, PennDOT finally corrected this configuration with a project that wrapped up in Dec 02 (I think). A direct, single-lane ramp was constructed at that time. It was part of a larger reconstuction of some deteriorated and troublesome ramps, I believe.
Correct. Traffic from the Ft. Duquesne Bridge heading to eastbound 376 has to use Ft. Pitt Blvd, which prior to it's reconstruction didn't have a separated (by jersey barrier) "connector" lane that didn't have to stop at the lights. It was quite the pain in the ass.
Ft. Pitt Blvd (which is elevated) was completely rebuilt in the early '00's (the old structure was so bad that the third, far right lane was permanently closed)... and they were able to make the far right lane a more "direct connection", and it IS a hell of a lot nicer. (The other 2 lanes have to contend with 3 traffic signals)
And technically, I-376 does currently have traffic signals... At the mouths of the tunnels.
True, true...
Quote from: Mr_Northside on July 16, 2012, 12:56:14 PM
And technically, I-376 does currently have traffic signals... At the mouths of the tunnels.
Technically also, I-95 & I-495 do on the Woodrow Wilson Bridge near Alexandria, VA in almost the same manner.
At least those on I-376 are more so lane control signals as those on the drawbridges are not and actually will stop traffic.
Quote from: roadman65 on December 15, 2012, 01:49:17 PM
Quote from: Mr_Northside on July 16, 2012, 12:56:14 PM
And technically, I-376 does currently have traffic signals... At the mouths of the tunnels.
Technically also, I-95 & I-495 do on the Woodrow Wilson Bridge near Alexandria, VA in almost the same manner.
At least those on I-376 are more so lane control signals as those on the drawbridges are not and actually will stop traffic.
The signals on 376 stop traffic as well. I got caught at the one on eastern portal of the Squirrel Hill Tunnel last Summer.
Quote from: PAHighways on December 21, 2012, 10:12:22 PM
Quote from: roadman65 on December 15, 2012, 01:49:17 PM
Quote from: Mr_Northside on July 16, 2012, 12:56:14 PM
And technically, I-376 does currently have traffic signals... At the mouths of the tunnels.
Technically also, I-95 & I-495 do on the Woodrow Wilson Bridge near Alexandria, VA in almost the same manner.
At least those on I-376 are more so lane control signals as those on the drawbridges are not and actually will stop traffic.
The signals on 376 stop traffic as well. I got caught at the one on eastern portal of the Squirrel Hill Tunnel last Summer.
Yes, they're used to hold traffic when they need to turn back an overheight truck.
Quote from: empirestate on December 22, 2012, 11:50:54 AM
Quote from: PAHighways on December 21, 2012, 10:12:22 PM
Quote from: roadman65 on December 15, 2012, 01:49:17 PM
Quote from: Mr_Northside on July 16, 2012, 12:56:14 PM
And technically, I-376 does currently have traffic signals... At the mouths of the tunnels.
Technically also, I-95 & I-495 do on the Woodrow Wilson Bridge near Alexandria, VA in almost the same manner.
At least those on I-376 are more so lane control signals as those on the drawbridges are not and actually will stop traffic.
The signals on 376 stop traffic as well. I got caught at the one on eastern portal of the Squirrel Hill Tunnel last Summer.
Yes, they're used to hold traffic when they need to turn back an overheight truck.
That and if there is an accident, breakdown, etc.
That's an eerie resemblance to I-676 in Philly, at the foot of the Ben Franklin Bridge!
That's SR 2005, because PennDOT considers 676 as only running between 76 and 95.
Quote from: PAHighways on December 22, 2012, 02:01:00 PM
That's SR 2005, because PennDOT considers 676 as only running between 76 and 95.
Shouldn't it be SR 0030?
Quote from: Steve on December 23, 2012, 01:06:40 AM
Quote from: PAHighways on December 22, 2012, 02:01:00 PM
That's SR 2005, because PennDOT considers 676 as only running between 76 and 95.
Shouldn't it be SR 0030?
PennDOT only recognizes US 30 as running from the Montgomery County line to the Schuylkill Expressway.
I guess they figure there is no point to sign that little section of 6th Street as 0030 since the ramp to 6th is 8061 and the ramp onto the Ben Franklin has no SR being under the jurisdiction of DRPA.
PennDOT considers SR 0676 to run to I-95. But I-676 clearly goes over the BFB per signage and maps.
Quote from: NE2 on December 23, 2012, 05:13:51 AM
PennDOT considers SR 0676 to run to I-95. But I-676 clearly goes over the BFB per signage and maps.
I thought the FHWA considered the PA side of I-676 to be the same as PA's definition of it.
I remember having this discussion before, and I don't remember the conclusion.
DRPA and NJDOT consider the Ben Franklin as part of 676, and while PennDOT does not, they still sign it that way to keep continuity with those agencies.
The FHWA's route log indicates it as two routes: 2.15 miles in PA which is the distance between 76 and 95, and 4.75 miles in NJ (state line on the Ben Franklin to 76).
Quote from: PAHighways on December 23, 2012, 01:10:11 PM
DRPA and NJDOT consider the Ben Franklin as part of 676, and while PennDOT does not, they still sign it that way to keep continuity with those agencies.
Really? PennDOT has a definition for Interstate Traffic Route 676 that ends at I-95?
Quote from: NE2 on December 23, 2012, 10:38:55 PM
Quote from: PAHighways on December 23, 2012, 01:10:11 PM
DRPA and NJDOT consider the Ben Franklin as part of 676, and while PennDOT does not, they still sign it that way to keep continuity with those agencies.
Really? PennDOT has a definition for Interstate Traffic Route 676 that ends at I-95?
Yes
Quote from: PAHighways on December 23, 2012, 11:23:43 PM
Really? PennDOT has a definition for Interstate Traffic Route 676 that ends at I-95?
Yes
[/quote]
Then why do the maps show Interstate Traffic Route 676 on the BFB?
Quote from: NE2 on December 24, 2012, 01:01:48 AM
Then why do the maps show Interstate Traffic Route 676 on the BFB?
To maintain a continuity, for drivers, between the two shores of the Delaware.
Quote from: PAHighways on December 24, 2012, 02:48:35 AM
Quote from: NE2 on December 24, 2012, 01:01:48 AM
Then why do the maps show Interstate Traffic Route 676 on the BFB?
To maintain a continuity, for drivers, between the two shores of the Delaware.
How is that not what a Traffic Route does?
Quote from: NE2 on December 24, 2012, 05:12:33 AM
Quote from: PAHighways on December 24, 2012, 02:48:35 AM
Quote from: NE2 on December 24, 2012, 01:01:48 AM
Then why do the maps show Interstate Traffic Route 676 on the BFB?
To maintain a continuity, for drivers, between the two shores of the Delaware.
How is that not what a Traffic Route does?
I didn't say it isn't, just not the one PennDOT uses internally.
So there's an 'internal Traffic Route', which is different from that shown on signs and maps? What's the point?
That's just the way things are done in the northeast.
Quote from: qguy on July 14, 2012, 07:34:09 PM
OK, I don't know why my son didn't just ask me to find out for him. (Apparently he must've thought I wasn't up to the task. Tsk-tsk. You have much to learn, my son. When the student is ready, the teacher will appear. And other clichés like that there.)
For many years, when driving from southbound I-279 to eastbound I-376 (crossing "the point," just before the Fort Pitt Bridge), one encountered a handfull of signal lights (I forget how many). IOW, there wasn't a direct, freeway-to-freeway connection between the two highways in that direction.
After only 42 years, PennDOT finally corrected this configuration with a project that wrapped up in Dec 02 (I think). A direct, single-lane ramp was constructed at that time. It was part of a larger reconstuction of some deteriorated and troublesome ramps, I believe.
Jumping in late...but:
http://www.gribblenation.com/swparoads/connector/
back when i used to update pages
Quote from: deanej on December 24, 2012, 11:58:29 AM
That's just the way things are done in the northeast.
I doubt this. There's the state route, 0676, which goes to I-95, and the traffic route, I-676, which goes over the bridge. There's no reason or evidence for a third "internal traffic route".
Quote from: NE2 on December 24, 2012, 12:29:59 PM
Quote from: deanej on December 24, 2012, 11:58:29 AM
That's just the way things are done in the northeast.
I doubt this. There's the state route, 0676, which goes to I-95, and the traffic route, I-676, which goes over the bridge. There's no reason or evidence for a third "internal traffic route".
Huh? SR 0676 is the state route and Interstate route. Those coincide. The signed route, which people here seem to call "touring route" in general, differs from the legislated route. That's hardly unique.
PennDOT calls it a traffic route.
Quote from: NE2 on December 24, 2012, 12:29:59 PM
Quote from: deanej on December 24, 2012, 11:58:29 AM
That's just the way things are done in the northeast.
I doubt this. There's the state route, 0676, which goes to I-95, and the traffic route, I-676, which goes over the bridge. There's no reason or evidence for a third "internal traffic route".
The "internal traffic route" is the "state route". NY is the same way - we have the official definitions, and then we have the signed routes, which are often different.
Quote from: deanej on December 25, 2012, 12:14:38 AM
Quote from: NE2 on December 24, 2012, 12:29:59 PM
Quote from: deanej on December 24, 2012, 11:58:29 AM
That's just the way things are done in the northeast.
I doubt this. There's the state route, 0676, which goes to I-95, and the traffic route, I-676, which goes over the bridge. There's no reason or evidence for a third "internal traffic route".
The "internal traffic route" is the "state route". NY is the same way - we have the official definitions, and then we have the signed routes, which are often different.
The most notable example being how NY 15 overlapped I-390 and NY 17...but also it didn't.
NY 17 itself is another interesting example; it's still listed as starting at the PA border in the official logs, but if you ask region 6, they'll tell you that NY 17 is gone over the portions that are I-86, and the NY 17 signage is being phased out.
The two that come to mind most readily are NY 324 and NY 12E, since I discovered them when browsing CHM. NY 590 might do this now too; we'll have to see if it still being listed as going to Culver in the next traffic data report (signage ends at Titus).
Quote from: deanej on December 25, 2012, 10:03:25 AM
The two that come to mind most readily are NY 324 and NY 12E, since I discovered them when browsing CHM. NY 590 might do this now too; we'll have to see if it still being listed as going to Culver in the next traffic data report (signage ends at Titus).
You mean, NY 324's unsigned extension over the GI bridges, and NY 12E supposedly stopping short of Watertown?
The evidence can be found in the Vidlog which uses the Straight Line Diagrams and identifies Segment 014 and 015, past the Ben Franklin interchange, as both SR 0676 and I-676. If it was considered a ramp or connector, it would just be labeled with the SR.
Quote from: PAHighways on December 25, 2012, 11:15:22 AM
The evidence can be found in the Vidlog [...]
Which shows the SR 0291 portion of Broad Street as PA 291, not PA 611. And SR 0003 as PA 3 all the way to Broad (rather than SR 3010, which has no traffic route number in the videolog).
Quote from: NE2 on December 25, 2012, 12:28:26 PM
Quote from: PAHighways on December 25, 2012, 11:15:22 AM
The evidence can be found in the Vidlog [...]
Which shows the SR 0291 portion of Broad Street as PA 291, not PA 611. And SR 0003 as PA 3 all the way to Broad (rather than SR 3010, which has no traffic route number in the videolog).
That proves that what PennDOT catalogs roads as can differ from what is posted, in a few rare cases.
Anyway, back to the topic:
Quote from: CanesFan27 on December 24, 2012, 12:12:46 PM
Jumping in late...but:
http://www.gribblenation.com/swparoads/connector/
back when i used to update pages
Good work! I especially like the shields. :D
I just had a look at the SLD (http://ftp://ftp.dot.state.pa.us/public/Bureaus/BOMO/RM/RITS/Annual%20Electronic%20SLDs%20by%20County/District%206/Philadelphia%20Co.pdf) (didn't realize they were online) and don't see any traffic routes, only one field for state route number.
Well that was quick.
Quote from: empirestate on December 25, 2012, 10:49:48 AM
Quote from: deanej on December 25, 2012, 10:03:25 AM
The two that come to mind most readily are NY 324 and NY 12E, since I discovered them when browsing CHM. NY 590 might do this now too; we'll have to see if it still being listed as going to Culver in the next traffic data report (signage ends at Titus).
You mean, NY 324's unsigned extension over the GI bridges, and NY 12E supposedly stopping short of Watertown?
Even more than that. For NY 324, signage indicates it follows Grand Island Blvd until the bridge, but the route officially begins a multiplex with I-190 near NY 325. Signage has NY 12E ending at NY 12F in Paddy Hill, but it officially follows a Jefferson CR to NY 12.