Looks like this is actually happening, so time to make a separate thread. I'm working on organizing a road meet for fall in St. Lawrence County, NY.
Date/Time/Location: Saturday, November 4, 2012, at the Village Diner (http://www.villagediner.com/) in Downtown Potsdam at 10 AM
RSVP: Either by replying to this thread, PMing me, and/or on Facebook (https://www.facebook.com/events/488485951184747/)
Approximate Map of Tour: http://goo.gl/maps/AlpLV
Tour Stops:
-NY 345 bridge in Madrid
-Old, underwater alignment of NY 37 east of Waddington
-Closed suspension bridge near the Eisenhower lock
-View of the international span of the Seaway International Bridge
-Abandoned bridge in Raymondville
-Old one-lane bridge (7' clearance; there are a few others like this as well) in Norwood
-Old gorge bridge in Parishville
-NY 56 S Curve (old alignment)
Drive-by Sights:
-Clinch NY 345 and NY 131
-Tunnel under the Eisenhower lock
-NY 37 divided highway
-Old one-lane bridge (and railroad bridge) on CR 45 near the border
-Wood bridge in Norwood
-Old bridge in West Stockholm
-Back road Adirondack driving; don't try to make a call here, there's no cell service
-NY 56 new alignment in South Colton
-US 11 reconstruction in Canton
Post-Meet Activity: Dinner somewhere, probably Mama Lucia's, Sergi's, or Little Italy
Meet photo location: Yaleville Bridge (Norwood)
I don't mind doing it on a Sunday, it's a day trip for me anyway.
Saturday makes it a maybe for me, but Sunday makes it a definite no.
Just posted a bunch of info; note the 11am time (it took cu2010 and I about four hours to scout everything out, it would probably be slightly longer with meet stops instead of a quick stop and then driving on, and it would be good to finish everything while it's still light out). I settled on November 3. I'm gonna say RSVP by 10/27 even though I don't think we need to do reservations given the interest level and whatnot just so I have an idea of how many will be there. cu2010 might bring some stuff to give away if he can make it though I won't make promises for him.
I would have said yes but just found out I have an obligation that day.
Since my previous tentative plan for achieving this is shot, my attendance is doubtful. But I'll keep you posted. We'll see how crazy I'm feeling mid-october. :P
Doubtful. About the only roadgeeky things I could accomplish on this trip would be to clinch I-81, possibly clinch I-87, and some of the Syracuse-area interstates. Too far north and west for me to make a foray into New Hampshire to collect counties.
Can't make this one, too far of a drive from middle TN and November is a BIG diecast toy show month for me, I have one every weekend that month.
Well, if anyone has a problem specifically with 11/3 (which doesn't seem to be any of the people here... I remember Steve saying his only free weekends were 9/22 and 11/17), the next best weekend for me is 10/20. It's tighter for me though; I'd have to be back to Clarkson by around 5:30, so I probably wouldn't be able to do a post-meet dinner. There would be a hockey game in Cheel Arena though (Golden Knights vs. Holy Cross), which I would likely be working for WCKN, because I need the money and also because I need to train someone to replace me. No RSVPs yet, so not too late to change.
10/20 is on the back of the Richmond meet. There was already rumbling about the Birmingham meet being back to back weekends with Richmond. Of course, I wouldn't expect B-ham and P-dam to draw the same crowd at all.
Indeed they wouldn't; even Richmond might not, given how far Potsdam is off the beaten track. That said, since nobody has expressed a preference either way, and I like the idea of being able to set aside the whole day for the meet, I'll stick with November 3.
This one is game time for me. Being November, the weather is an issue. If its nice and sunny, I'd be interested. If it's sleeting and nasty, I'll be staying at home.
If the past few North Country winters have been any indication, the weather for the first weekend of November should be fine.
Then again, if the past few North Country winters have been any indication, it could snow any day now! :pan:
Last year around that time it was sunny with a high of 60 degrees.
Two years ago it was rain with a high of 40...
My guess would be partly-mostly cloudy with a high around 40-50; that seems to be typical late October/early November weather here.
Ok, I'll see when it gets closer. The way that my work schedule pans out I have five days off in the vicinity of this meet, so I am somewhat inclined to go further afield if the weather is nice.
Further, the meet location doesn't seem that unique to me. I kind of want to spend some time on roads that are unlike the ones that I drive a lot, I've never been, but this area doesn't seem that different from southern Ontario.
Just thinking aloud.
The main roads north of Potsdam probably are similar to southern Ontario, though driving in NY vs. Ontario always feels different to me for some reason. I'm guessing the Adirondack portion south of Potsdam is different though. Not sure how southern Ontario is for old one-lane bridges with only 7' clearance either.
Trust me- having been to southern Ontario, this area is MUCH different.
This is a very diverse county in terms of topography, and the tour route we've assembled shows that. On one end, towards the beginning of the tour, you have the relatively flat lands of the St. Lawrence River Valley, and the scenic river views associated with it. On the other, you have the majestic hills and forests of the northern Adirondacks and the twisty turny back roads going up and down and all around. In between, rolling hills and fairly boring farmland...which we'll mostly just be zipping past. :)
I was mostly referring to said rolling farmland when I posted, and the scenery on ON 138 is a lot like it (as are the 400 series highways in eastern Ontario).
Lots of picture opportunities, very diverse terrain; you'll wonder if you're even in the same county.
We'll see, right now I am dreaming of driving either the Katy or Central Expressways in Texas, if I can find a cheap flight out of Buffalo might try to do that instead.
I don't know if anyone was confused about how to RSVP or not, but it's to this thread (I updated the first post to reflect that). I don't have a Facebook account, so no Facebook event.
Quote from: deanej on September 02, 2012, 05:38:46 PM
I don't know if anyone was confused about how to RSVP or not, but it's to this thread (I updated the first post to reflect that). I don't have a Facebook account, so no Facebook event.
Maybe someone else here can do that?
If someone creates one, I'll link to it from the first post.
There's also Google+, but my roadgeeks circle is mostly people who would be unlikely to attend, and I don't feel like creating an event there for only one person or creating a "PM me your Google+ profile so I can add you" system.
G+? You mean people actually use that?
(Actually, I have an account there but I never use it. I just don't see the point yet.)
I think it's mostly tech geeks who don't like Facebook.
I was wondering, is 11 AM a bit early for the meet? I don't think I've ever seen one that early (aside from Steve's 8:30 morning session at Ottawa and maybe one that did the tour first then dinner), and it only took three and a half hours for cu2010 and I to scout everything out, so given that the route is a little bit shorter for the meet and stops I'm estimating that the tour would take four hours, which would end a bit early for a dinner post-meet activity. Maybe 11:30? Noon is probably pushing it given the November 3 date though.
Quote from: deanej on September 08, 2012, 01:11:08 PM
I was wondering, is 11 AM a bit early for the meet? I don't think I've ever seen one that early (aside from Steve's 8:30 morning session at Ottawa and maybe one that did the tour first then dinner), and it only took three and a half hours for cu2010 and I to scout everything out, so given that the route is a little bit shorter for the meet and stops I'm estimating that the tour would take four hours, which would end a bit early for a dinner post-meet activity. Maybe 11:30? Noon is probably pushing it given the November 3 date though.
No, I've been to meets that started at 11.
Quote from: deanej on September 08, 2012, 01:11:08 PM
I was wondering, is 11 AM a bit early for the meet? I don't think I've ever seen one that early (aside from Steve's 8:30 morning session at Ottawa and maybe one that did the tour first then dinner), and it only took three and a half hours for cu2010 and I to scout everything out, so given that the route is a little bit shorter for the meet and stops I'm estimating that the tour would take four hours, which would end a bit early for a dinner post-meet activity. Maybe 11:30? Noon is probably pushing it given the November 3 date though.
Whenever I have hosted a meet (which both so far have been in autumn), I've aimed to start at 11 (or as close to when my venue opens as possible). It gives time for my group to settle in before other patrons arrive for noon college football kickoffs. If I allow two hours for dining, I'm left with about four hours of daylight, and I generally like to keep my tours to 2-2.5 hours. Of course, since you're farther east, your window of daylight is much shorter. I guess it depends on how comfortable you are with encroaching darkness.
Well, the sunset calendars say 5:48, though I was guessing an hour for lunch rather than two.
Quote from: deanej on September 11, 2012, 05:25:31 PM
Well, the sunset calendars say 5:48, though I was guessing an hour for lunch rather than two.
2 hours for lunch is reasonable assuming the restaurant knows in advance to provide separate checks.
Quote from: Steve on September 11, 2012, 08:23:03 PM
2 hours for lunch is reasonable assuming the restaurant knows in advance to provide separate checks.
or the people attending know in advance to bring enough small bills to make change up to $20 or whatever is a reasonable per-head lunch amount.
Quote from: agentsteel53 on September 11, 2012, 08:28:37 PM
Quote from: Steve on September 11, 2012, 08:23:03 PM
2 hours for lunch is reasonable assuming the restaurant knows in advance to provide separate checks.
or the people attending know in advance to bring enough small bills to make change up to $20 or whatever is a reasonable per-head lunch amount.
this has never happened
Quote from: Steve on September 11, 2012, 08:41:50 PM
Quote from: agentsteel53 on September 11, 2012, 08:28:37 PM
Quote from: Steve on September 11, 2012, 08:23:03 PM
2 hours for lunch is reasonable assuming the restaurant knows in advance to provide separate checks.
or the people attending know in advance to bring enough small bills to make change up to $20 or whatever is a reasonable per-head lunch amount.
this has never happened
Steve's referring to a specific instance that happened at the 2010 SEPA meet.
As for lunch, 2 hours is generally the standard. Gives time for eating and socializing (and map exchanges, if they occur) and then getting everyone sorted out into the tour vehicles.
I didn't know there was a history to it. I just know that as a customer, "everyone throw some cash in the middle" is a lot more efficient than separate checks. and I have friends who are waiters/waitresses, and unanimously, they never relish having to do separate checks.
Quote from: hbelkins on September 12, 2012, 11:24:54 PM
Quote from: Steve on September 11, 2012, 08:41:50 PM
Quote from: agentsteel53 on September 11, 2012, 08:28:37 PM
Quote from: Steve on September 11, 2012, 08:23:03 PM
2 hours for lunch is reasonable assuming the restaurant knows in advance to provide separate checks.
or the people attending know in advance to bring enough small bills to make change up to $20 or whatever is a reasonable per-head lunch amount.
this has never happened
Steve's referring to a specific instance that happened at the 2010 SEPA meet.
As for lunch, 2 hours is generally the standard. Gives time for eating and socializing (and map exchanges, if they occur) and then getting everyone sorted out into the tour vehicles.
It also happened at the Central NJ meet.
At the rate we're going this might turn out to be a one-car tour, though hopefully I'll be proven wrong on that one.
My attendance at both Birmingham and Richmond may now be in jeopardy. If that happens, I may try to attend this one as a consolation prize, unless someone schedules a meet elsewhere that would allow me to collect new counties. (I'd get no new counties on this trip unless I elected to detour via Long Island to pick up Suffolk and Nassau, NY).
Quote from: deanej on September 13, 2012, 02:20:37 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on September 12, 2012, 11:24:54 PM
Quote from: Steve on September 11, 2012, 08:41:50 PM
Quote from: agentsteel53 on September 11, 2012, 08:28:37 PM
Quote from: Steve on September 11, 2012, 08:23:03 PM
2 hours for lunch is reasonable assuming the restaurant knows in advance to provide separate checks.
or the people attending know in advance to bring enough small bills to make change up to $20 or whatever is a reasonable per-head lunch amount.
this has never happened
Steve's referring to a specific instance that happened at the 2010 SEPA meet.
As for lunch, 2 hours is generally the standard. Gives time for eating and socializing (and map exchanges, if they occur) and then getting everyone sorted out into the tour vehicles.
It also happened at the Central NJ meet.
At the rate we're going this might turn out to be a one-car tour, though hopefully I'll be proven wrong on that one.
Not the end of the world. Ottawa I ended up as 5 people, so we all packed into one car. We had a great time.
Never thought it was going to be big in the first place. It's a little far from the interstates and late into the year to attract big crowds. Haven't gotten anyone to fully commit yet, though it's still a month and a half away so I understand if people want/need to wait until the meet gets closer to do so (I've done the same thing).
Still 50/50 myself, you know, work. Though it'd be kinda hard to do the tour without me since I, you know, essentially put the tour together. :pan:
In addition, after further research, one of the sights listed as "drive-by" really should become "stop, get out, and snap the cameras away"...
FWIW, I wouldn't be completely opposed to postponing until spring when there's less going on, and the weather's better...
Quote from: deanej on September 14, 2012, 11:28:55 AMHaven't gotten anyone to fully commit yet
As I said above, it's a day trip for me, so it doesn't require much planning. ;) Thus, I'm like 85% likely to participate.
It seems Doug is not going, which was going to be part of my strategy. I'll see if I can make it work or not.
Quote from: agentsteel53 on September 12, 2012, 11:43:25 PM
I didn't know there was a history to it. I just know that as a customer, "everyone throw some cash in the middle" is a lot more efficient than separate checks. and I have friends who are waiters/waitresses, and unanimously, they never relish having to do separate checks.
This is easy to do with a few people and is sometimes done for after-meet dinners. But it's difficult to get it to work out right when you have 20 people, especially since inevitably someone will not have cash and want to pay with credit.
There's also a social comfort aspect to it. "Everyone throw some cash in the middle" is great with friends, but inevitably at a large meet you have people who have never met before and so some people will want to do their own thing and not be comfortable paying as a group. Especially when you consider how many of us are on the spectrum or at least have a lot of individuality.
I would imagine this is a fairly basic social skill.
it's fine to be eccentric, but if you're notified reasonably in advance, and you say "I refuse to bring cash"... you're just being an ass.
and, honestly, if you cannot trust the people at your table to be reasonable in paying for a $20 dinner... you should probably seek better company.
^ Really?
If your friend really despises splitting up checques, she may have chosen the wrong line of work.
Quote from: cu2010 on September 14, 2012, 02:56:03 PM
Still 50/50 myself, you know, work. Though it'd be kinda hard to do the tour without me since I, you know, essentially put the tour together. :pan:
That's why I was taking notes on everything.
Quote
In addition, after further research, one of the sights listed as "drive-by" really should become "stop, get out, and snap the cameras away"...
Which one? I have no problem with converting it, and I don't even know which one yet.
The Yaleville bridge (the one off of the useless CR 48A)- built in 1892! Second-oldest bridge on the tour (even older than the closed Massena Center bridge), and the oldest "untouched" one (since the NY345 bridge, originally built in 1882, saw major refurbishment in 2008). There's a spot where we can easily pull off the road, park, get out, and take pictures.
Five of the bridges on the tour are more than 100 years old...so if you love old bridges, I strongly recommend doing whatever it takes to make the trip. :)
Ah, that was the one that I marked "can park if want to - left south side".
Quote from: Steve on September 14, 2012, 07:13:12 PM
It seems Doug is not going, which was going to be part of my strategy. I'll see if I can make it work or not.
I wouldn't count myself completely out, but playing in an adult kickball league on Saturday afternoons this fall may affect and hinder my attendance to the St. Law meet. It will really come down to whether or not I want to miss out on the game or not.
I'm going to re-advertise this as I've just had someone PM me saying that they have to decide within the next week whether to take off for work or not on 11/3 and they were wondering how many have RSVPed. I've also created a Facebook event page.
https://www.facebook.com/events/488485951184747/
Looks like I'm out- have fun without me.
10 day reminder for the meet. If the weather forecast is a concern for anyone: I have good news: the weather is in (http://www.wunderground.com/cgi-bin/findweather/getForecast?query=zmw:13699.1.99999&hourly=1&yday=307&weekday=Saturday)!
I'm planning to print off tour directions/notes for everyone next Thursday or Friday, so RSVP to make sure I make enough! I might also upload the PDF to the Northeast Roads Facebook group as well.
I'm considering adding the abandoned Raymondville bridge as a stop. I've never seen it myself, but my understanding is that it's easier to find from River Rd. than NY 56 (and less of a hike). It's not out of the way from the existing tour either.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5orgDulWu78 (at 2:09)
http://www.bing.com/maps/?v=2&cp=rg5z5y8rjj48&lvl=19.43&dir=6.31&sty=b&form=LMLTCC&style=o
You know the deal with me- last-minute switch to Sunday and I'm in, otherwise, it's a no.
Given that, and that right now it's just myself and Dr. Frankenstein, I'll make the following proposal:
Move to Sunday 11/4 if:
-Nobody who is not available for Sunday RSVPs (by Monday?).
-Dr. Frankenstein doesn't have a problem with the move
-The weather forecast for 11/4 (which should appear tonight sometime) isn't bad (though the 15 day forecast (http://www.myforecast.com/bin/expanded_forecast_15day.m?city=24507&zip_code=13699&metric=false) looks fine)
Move it to Saturday the 24th and I'm in :P Oh well.
I won't even be in St. Lawrence county on 11/24.
That said...
Rochester mini-meet?
Quote from: deanej on October 26, 2012, 10:08:08 AM
I won't even be in St. Lawrence county on 11/24.
That said...
Rochester mini-meet?
I won't say no to
propositions suggestions
We're officially Sunday 11/4 now. The Facebook page is a little screwed up thanks to daylight savings; it automatically moved everything backwards an hour because of it, and it's not letting me change the time back!
Update with the NY 56 S curve: the new alignment just opened. As such, it should be possible to stop and walk on the old alignment, hopefully with the old bridge still in place.
http://northcountrynow.com/news/colton-s-curve-bridge-opens-traffic-department-transportation-says-070272
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg37.imageshack.us%2Fimg37%2F2194%2Fstlawrencecountygroupph.jpg&hash=49625b93bdffe0acbd2c3e99f55f8bece46458fe) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/37/stlawrencecountygroupph.jpg/)
Meet photo on the Jones Road bridge in Hopkinton
Left to right: Carl Tessier, Valerie Deane, Jessica Labrie
Not pictured: cu2010
We met up at the Village Diner (after Carl's adventure with Potsdam's methods of street signing) and by consensus decided to just start with the tour since everyone had snacked earlier and it was crowded. We went up NY 345 and took a look at the stone arch bridge in Madrid. We continued on to NY 37 to view the old alignment that goes underwater, now a parking area. From there, it was further down NY 37 and on NY 131, passing by the St. Lawrence Intake Dam and taking a quick detour through the tunnel under the Eisenhower lock. Clinching NY 131, we continued east on NY 37 down the divided highway. Fortunately, cu2010 decided to go down NY 37 onto the St. Regis Reservation in neighboring Franklin county, because the CR 45 bridge was closed and we could see it from the road. We turned around and went past the border station onto a local road for a look at the south channel span of the Seaway International Bridge (north channel: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GXz3E1M3INA (starts at 5:43; past toll booth at 7:36); south channel: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xadzp19Uz44). We went down to the CR 42A abandoned suspension bridge via dirt roads and too a few photos of the decaying bridge (the asphalt deck is now very thin with many holes). We went back to NY 37 and headed west to NY 56 and south to NY 310, where we made a quick jog to River Road and headed south to the abandoned bridge in Raymondville (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5orgDulWu78 at 2:09; from the other side). We made our way back to NY 56 and onto CR 48A to stop at the Yaleville one lane bridge. From there, we meandered back to NY 56 and turned onto Dry Bridge Road, which had a one-lane wooden bridge over railroad tracks. We went down county and town roads to West Stockholm, which has yet another one lane bridge. We continued down town and county roads to Parishville to look at the old gorge bridge, now a pedestrian bridge used mainly by college students to go cliff jumping (also, as noted by the sign, the first bridge built by white men in Parishville; yes, the sign really did say that!). At this point we decided to make an impromptu trip down to the Jones Road bridge. This bridge is on a gravel/rock road that sees very little traffic in the Adirondacks. After a look at the scenic creek and taking the meet photo, we doubled back to Parishville (that road has many large rocks in it and is not maintained after Nov. 1) and headed down back roads in the Adirondacks to NY 56, noting that a yellow yield sign got replaced with a stop sign before the meet, and that there was snow on the ground. Once at NY 56, we headed north past what was the S curve, though the grading on the edges was too steep to walk the old alignment. We turned onto NY 68 in Colton, and took it and CR 29 and CR 27 to Canton (the bridge on NY 68 is still out and CR 27 has a bridge with a cosmetic arch on top). Passing through the recently reconstructed US 11 in downtown, we stopped at a covered pedestrian bridge used by SUNY Canton students. From there it was back to Potsdam via US 11 and dinner at Sergi's.
Also: there is a possibility of a second St. Lawrence county meet focusing on Ogdensburg and Gouverneur next April.
It was a very nice and interesting meet despite the small attendance, in a region that is, albeit somewhat isolated, gorgeous.
After dinner, Jessica and I continued to Watertown for some shopping. We then came back to Ottawa via I-81/ON 137/ON 401/ON 416. I left her home at 10:30 PM and got back home at 1:30 AM (got slowed down by some impromptu railfanning; in hindsight, it wasn't such a good idea, now I'm sleep deprived.)