Announced this morning. (http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/_/id/8369070/notre-dame-sports-football-hockey-acc)
But it's a partial membership: All sports EXCEPT football. In football they've committed to play five games a year against ACC opponents and have to play all 14 league teams once within each three-year period.
Real surprise. The ACC has always been adamantly against partial members of the sort the Big East has long had (and that often seemed to contribute to that league's destabilization).
The bigger news may be that the ACC also voted to increase the buyout cost if a team wishes to leave the league. It's now going to be a cool $50 million.
I had been adamant that Virginia Tech was going to be going to the Big 12 or Big 10(if Penn State ends up getting kicked out but that's OT). Now I think just the money coming to the conference from ND's presence is enough to convince me that VT, FSU, Clemson, and Miami should stay for the time-being.
It turns out the buyout price will not be a fixed figure: It will be triple the conference's annual operating budget, which means that as of now the amount would be somewhat more than $50 million. It's likely to go up.
Lot of talk already about an unbalanced 15-team basketball league and the possibility of adding a second "non-football" member to round it out.
I am indifferent, even though I graduated from one of the ACC charter universities (Maryland).
It bothers me (a lot) that "revenue" college sports are little more than minor leagues for the NFL and the NBA.
Quote from: cpzilliacus on September 12, 2012, 11:42:40 AM
I am indifferent, even though I graduated from one of the ACC charter universities (Maryland).
It bothers me (a lot) that "revenue" college sports are little more than minor leagues for the NFL and the NBA.
I graduated from two ACC universities (undergrad at Virginia, as my username indicates, and a J.D. from Duke). You folks at Maryland might be interested in all the rumors that Georgetown might become the second "non-football" member.
anybody think ND should just join a conference in football as well - I think it is ridiculous what lucrative offers they get as an independent and they should not need to be.
Notre Dame must be forced to join a conference or be ineligible for bowl games. It's not fair that they get special privileges, like an automatic BCS bid if they're ranked within the top 8. They're no longer a national power, and they're getting weaker every year.
Quote from: 1995hoo on September 12, 2012, 12:01:00 PM
Quote from: cpzilliacus on September 12, 2012, 11:42:40 AM
I am indifferent, even though I graduated from one of the ACC charter universities (Maryland).
It bothers me (a lot) that "revenue" college sports are little more than minor leagues for the NFL and the NBA.
I graduated from two ACC universities (undergrad at Virginia, as my username indicates, and a J.D. from Duke). You folks at Maryland might be interested in all the rumors that Georgetown might become the second "non-football" member.
I would be fine with going back to the "old" ACC (no teams north of College Park) - though I like having Virginia Tech in the conference.
What would be really nice is a new alignment of geographical conferences. Take the existing major conference teams (since you know they won't give that up), and just start trading them. The rule should be that departure fee is waived if you bring an equal team back the other way. It would be meta-fantasy football. Instead of trading players, you trade teams.
Quote from: bugo on September 12, 2012, 01:13:06 PM
Notre Dame must be forced to join a conference or be ineligible for bowl games. It's not fair that they get special privileges, like an automatic BCS bid if they're ranked within the top 8. They're no longer a national power, and they're getting weaker every year.
Not anymore, Notre Dame is #1 in the BCS now.
Since all this conference shifting is being done solely for the purpose of money, i would suggest that the NCAA and all college sports be stripped of tax-exempt status...and athletes get paid.....schools can no longer pretend that athletics is part of the university experience made up of student-athletes...when we ALL know they are a feeder system for the pros....
Quote from: ctsignguy on November 24, 2012, 08:18:24 AM
Since all this conference shifting is being done solely for the purpose of money, i would suggest that the NCAA and all college sports be stripped of tax-exempt status...and athletes get paid.....schools can no longer pretend that athletics is part of the university experience made up of student-athletes...when we ALL know they are a feeder system for the pros....
I don't entirely disagree with this... When it comes to football & basketball, it does act as a feeder system for the pros... but many college athletes have no chance of making it (and I think a lot realize it), and it
is part of the university experience for them. Just saying it isn't as simple as all that.
Also, the notion of getting paid; it seems most athletes usually get full scholarships. That's not exactly chopped liver these days.
But scholarships only go toward tuition, room & board and books. There's little left, if anything, after that. Plus, a lot of athletes have limited hours they can work, if they're able to work. I'm in favor of giving student-athletes a stipend that would put some spending money in their pockets to put gas in their cars or go out to the movies.
That's fascinating, because I always thought that Notre Dame really belongs in the Big Ten, not the ACC. And, why should they be allowed to keep their independent status in football?? So that they can continue to play Southern Cal every year??
Quote from: Anthony_JK on November 24, 2012, 10:52:19 PM
That's fascinating, because I always thought that Notre Dame really belongs in the Big Ten, not the ACC. And, why should they be allowed to keep their independent status in football?? So that they can continue to play Southern Cal every year??
Notre Dame has some issues with being in the Big Ten, primarily that they are not an AAU university. Maryland and Rutgers area. People often forget that these conferences are not just about athletics, but also academics. That's why Nebraska joined the Big Ten. They wanted into the Committee on Institutional Cooperation (CIC). The CIC includes all the Big Ten schools plus the former Big Ten member University of Chicago. Together, they have a bigger library than the Ivy League, and are a research powerhouse. Notre Dame does not yet have its academics at a level comparable with the Big Ten schools (plus U Chicago).
Quote from: golden eagle on November 24, 2012, 10:35:23 PM
But scholarships only go toward tuition, room & board and books. There's little left, if anything, after that. Plus, a lot of athletes have limited hours they can work, if they're able to work. I'm in favor of giving student-athletes a stipend that would put some spending money in their pockets to put gas in their cars or go out to the movies.
It is really a myth that student athletes live poorly. A full scholarship covers "only" tuition, room & board, and books, yes. But, the point is that the easy availability of student loans and outright grants. Any student actually with such a poor background that he (or she) cannot receive parental "walking around money" will receive the same financial aid as any other student, but, with no college bills to pay, can use it all for "extras".
Further, while the amounts quoted from TV contracts seem huge, remember that football and basketball have to pay for everything. NCAA requires at least seven full-scholarship mens and ten full-scholarship womens sports to be in Division I. Most schools actually don't make money off sports directly. They exist so people that never darkened the door of any college can think of good ole state U as "we".
And, also remember you cannot just pay the football team. Title IX would require them to pay everybody on every team.
^^
Sometimes I wonder if it wouldn't be better all around if the universities in North America would drop intercollegiate athletics and go with the model in other parts of the World where it is private local sports clubs that compete against each other in whatever sport, with promotion/relegation between their skill levels all the way up to first division.
Mike
Quote from: Brandon on November 25, 2012, 08:28:24 AM
Quote from: Anthony_JK on November 24, 2012, 10:52:19 PM
That's fascinating, because I always thought that Notre Dame really belongs in the Big Ten, not the ACC. And, why should they be allowed to keep their independent status in football?? So that they can continue to play Southern Cal every year??
Notre Dame has some issues with being in the Big Ten, primarily that they are not an AAU university. Maryland and Rutgers area. People often forget that these conferences are not just about athletics, but also academics. That's why Nebraska joined the Big Ten. They wanted into the Committee on Institutional Cooperation (CIC). The CIC includes all the Big Ten schools plus the former Big Ten member University of Chicago. Together, they have a bigger library than the Ivy League, and are a research powerhouse. Notre Dame does not yet have its academics at a level comparable with the Big Ten schools (plus U Chicago).
Academics is not even .01% of the reason ND is not in the Big Ten. Notre Dame's academics are more than comparable with Big Ten schools, which include non-AAU member Nebraska.
Notre Dame wants to continue to play games in all regions of the country, something that full membership in the Big Ten would not allow.
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 28, 2012, 09:40:56 AM
Quote from: Brandon on November 25, 2012, 08:28:24 AM
Quote from: Anthony_JK on November 24, 2012, 10:52:19 PM
That's fascinating, because I always thought that Notre Dame really belongs in the Big Ten, not the ACC. And, why should they be allowed to keep their independent status in football?? So that they can continue to play Southern Cal every year??
Notre Dame has some issues with being in the Big Ten, primarily that they are not an AAU university. Maryland and Rutgers area. People often forget that these conferences are not just about athletics, but also academics. That's why Nebraska joined the Big Ten. They wanted into the Committee on Institutional Cooperation (CIC). The CIC includes all the Big Ten schools plus the former Big Ten member University of Chicago. Together, they have a bigger library than the Ivy League, and are a research powerhouse. Notre Dame does not yet have its academics at a level comparable with the Big Ten schools (plus U Chicago).
Academics is not even .01% of the reason ND is not in the Big Ten. Notre Dame's academics are more than comparable with Big Ten schools, which include non-AAU member Nebraska.
Notre Dame wants to continue to play games in all regions of the country, something that full membership in the Big Ten would not allow.
Academics are a major part of it, and why Nebraska, then an AAU university, got accepted into the Big Ten. Nebraska is in a dispute with the AAU over how it handles its university hospital (funny enough, they're opposition is from the University of Michigan on this - hypocritical skunks that the UofM are). There's two parts to the Big Ten, unlike other conferences. There's the athletic side, the side you see on TV, called the Big Ten. Then there's the academic side, the Committee on Institutional Cooperation (CIC). The CIC is all the Big Ten schools plus former Big Ten member University of Chicago. Put together, the CIC is bigger than the Ivy League academically with more book volumes, more phDs, and more research dollars. Yes, Virginia, it is academic, not athletic, and Notre Dame, good as it is, isn't quite up to par. Sorry ND fanboys.
Quote from: Brandon on December 28, 2012, 09:58:49 AM
Quote from: cabiness42 on December 28, 2012, 09:40:56 AM
Quote from: Brandon on November 25, 2012, 08:28:24 AM
Quote from: Anthony_JK on November 24, 2012, 10:52:19 PM
That's fascinating, because I always thought that Notre Dame really belongs in the Big Ten, not the ACC. And, why should they be allowed to keep their independent status in football?? So that they can continue to play Southern Cal every year??
Notre Dame has some issues with being in the Big Ten, primarily that they are not an AAU university. Maryland and Rutgers area. People often forget that these conferences are not just about athletics, but also academics. That's why Nebraska joined the Big Ten. They wanted into the Committee on Institutional Cooperation (CIC). The CIC includes all the Big Ten schools plus the former Big Ten member University of Chicago. Together, they have a bigger library than the Ivy League, and are a research powerhouse. Notre Dame does not yet have its academics at a level comparable with the Big Ten schools (plus U Chicago).
Academics is not even .01% of the reason ND is not in the Big Ten. Notre Dame's academics are more than comparable with Big Ten schools, which include non-AAU member Nebraska.
Notre Dame wants to continue to play games in all regions of the country, something that full membership in the Big Ten would not allow.
Academics are a major part of it, and why Nebraska, then an AAU university, got accepted into the Big Ten. Nebraska is in a dispute with the AAU over how it handles its university hospital (funny enough, they're opposition is from the University of Michigan on this - hypocritical skunks that the UofM are). There's two parts to the Big Ten, unlike other conferences. There's the athletic side, the side you see on TV, called the Big Ten. Then there's the academic side, the Committee on Institutional Cooperation (CIC). The CIC is all the Big Ten schools plus former Big Ten member University of Chicago. Put together, the CIC is bigger than the Ivy League academically with more book volumes, more phDs, and more research dollars. Yes, Virginia, it is academic, not athletic, and Notre Dame, good as it is, isn't quite up to par. Sorry ND fanboys.
Notre Dame is not in the Big Ten because they choose not to be, and that is the only reason. If ND called up the Big Ten today and said they wanted to join as a full member, it would take the Big Ten about 20 minutes to get a vote together and it would be 13-1 in favor. Notre Dame is consistently a Top 20 school in the US News Rankings and their degrees are held in just as high regard as any Big Ten degree in virtually every field.
Notre Dame is not in the AAU (for that matter ZERO Catholic universities are, not even Georgetown or BC) because the AAU heavily weighs medical schools, which ND does not have, and gives virtually zero weight to theology programs, which ND excels in. Maybe in the world of academia AAU membership means something, but outside of that little bubble nobody is giving jobs to grads from Stonybrook or UC-Irvine over grads from Notre Dame because of academic reputation.
Notre Dame not being in a conference has nothing to do with academics. They don't want to lose their NBC television contract. It all comes down to money.
I saw on ESPN today that Brian Kelly interviewed with the Eagles. This has been a good few weeks for Notre Lame haters like myself!
^^
'Like™'
:nod:
An aside, the more that I see stuff like that, the more that I wish that the USA operated under the European private sports club system....
Mike
Quote from: realjd on January 11, 2013, 06:51:19 PM
Notre Dame not being in a conference has nothing to do with academics. They don't want to lose their NBC television contract. It all comes down to money.
I saw on ESPN today that Brian Kelly interviewed with the Eagles. This has been a good few weeks for Notre Lame haters like myself!
Not so fast, it was reported today that he was staying at Notre Dame (http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/8838466/brian-kelly-remain-coach-notre-dame-fighting-irish). Notre Dame's deal with the ACC, however, might be dependent on whether Maryland has to pay the approximately $52 million exit fee (http://articles.washingtonpost.com/2012-11-27/sports/35508403_1_exit-fee-loh-acc-commissioner-john-swofford) that the ACC has sued them for. If Maryland wins, I believe Florida State and Clemson are gone immediately making Notre Dame wonder if it should move elsewhere since the monetary value from the ACC football-wise at that point is mostly gone.
Quotenobody is giving jobs to grads from UC-Irvine over grads from Notre Dame because of academic reputation.
That would definitely be your midwest bias kicking in- in Indiana I'm sure that's not the case, but everywhere I've lived recently (AZ, MT, ID, WA, WY- definitely AZ, ID, WA...honestly haven't discussed Irvine in Wyoming or Montana) has found Irvine to be a very, very prestigious school while Notre Dame is pretty much "some Catholic school back east with a good football program"
Quote from: 74/171FAN on January 12, 2013, 07:30:32 PM
Quote from: realjd on January 11, 2013, 06:51:19 PM
Notre Dame not being in a conference has nothing to do with academics. They don't want to lose their NBC television contract. It all comes down to money.
I saw on ESPN today that Brian Kelly interviewed with the Eagles. This has been a good few weeks for Notre Lame haters like myself!
Not so fast, it was reported today that he was staying at Notre Dame (http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/8838466/brian-kelly-remain-coach-notre-dame-fighting-irish). Notre Dame's deal with the ACC, however, might be dependent on whether Maryland has to pay the approximately $52 million exit fee (http://articles.washingtonpost.com/2012-11-27/sports/35508403_1_exit-fee-loh-acc-commissioner-john-swofford) that the ACC has sued them for. If Maryland wins, I believe Florida State and Clemson are gone immediately making Notre Dame wonder if it should move elsewhere since the monetary value from the ACC football-wise at that point is mostly gone.
Nick Saban said the same thing about staying at the Dolphins. Urban Meyer said the same thing about staying retired. Coaches always deny it until the deal is official. I'm not saying that Brian Kelly is definitely leaving, only that the article refuting it isn't necessarily proof that he is staying.
Quote from: corco on January 12, 2013, 07:59:51 PM
Quotenobody is giving jobs to grads from UC-Irvine over grads from Notre Dame because of academic reputation.
That would definitely be your midwest bias kicking in- in Indiana I'm sure that's not the case, but everywhere I've lived recently (AZ, MT, ID, WA, WY- definitely AZ, ID, WA...honestly haven't discussed Irvine in Wyoming or Montana) has found Irvine to be a very, very prestigious school while Notre Dame is pretty much "some Catholic school back east with a good football program"
For the record, Notre Dame has two alumni clubs in Montana, while UC Irvine has zero. Even Ohio State has an alumni club out in Big Sky country.
(Also for the record, I'm sure there are plenty of other schools with alumni chapters in Montana)