N.Y. Times: Deaths Rise for Drivers, Bikers and Walkers on City Streets (http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/27/nyregion/in-reversal-new-york-city-traffic-fatalities-rise.html)
QuoteFor years, the New York City Transportation Department has held a trump card in the roiling debate over its many roadway interventions: When officials said the measures, like pedestrian plazas and bike lanes, had made streets safer, the numbers appeared to back them up.
QuoteBut the release last week of the Mayor's Management Report, a twice-yearly collection of city measures, revealed a disquieting figure. Traffic fatalities from July 2011 through June 2012 were up 23 percent from the previous year – to 291, from 236. It was the first increase since 2007, when there were 310 traffic fatalities,
QuoteThough overall crashes fell slightly for the second straight year, 176 cyclists or pedestrians were killed in crashes, up from 158 the previous year. The other 115 deaths were motorists or their passengers, a sharp rise from the 78 drivers and passengers killed the year before.
That news isn't surprising to me, the way people walk and bike around the city. Maybe it's just me, but I feel like those two groups especially have gotten much more unruly than they were, say, 15-20 years ago. Pedestrians routinely just walk on out into traffic without looking, or they wait for the walk sign in the middle of the street rather than at the curb, or they're simply buried in their iPhones.
Cyclists, meanwhile, show horrible compliance with traffic signals, stop signs and one-ways, and frequently bring themselves into conflict with large groups of pedestrians without any effort to yield the right-of-way. I do believe that the increase in bike lanes and whatnot has resulted in more opportunities for conflict between bikes and pedestrians or bikes and vehicles.
As for motor vehicle casualties, I don't know that I've noticed a striking trend, but I could be convinced that there has been an increase in drivers simply following no particular rules at all. I've seen more than a few instances of egregiously hazardous driving, particularly on expressways and parkways.
One hypothesis would be that this simply reflects an increase in the number of people walking and biking, especially after dark. There was a time where you didn't want to be out by yourself at night in New York City. Now that's not as much a concern as it used to be and so guess, what? More people out and about in the dark to have a driver not see them.
But there is of course also the matter of uptick in stupidity: people biking after dark in traffic with no lights or reflectors or anything of the sort on them or their bike, people playing with their phones as they cross the street (or as they're driving), etc.
Quote from: Duke87 on September 27, 2012, 06:44:23 PM
One hypothesis would be that this simply reflects an increase in the number of people walking and biking, especially after dark. There was a time where you didn't want to be out by yourself at night in New York City. Now that's not as much a concern as it used to be and so guess, what? More people out and about in the dark to have a driver not see them.
But there is of course also the matter of uptick in stupidity: people biking after dark in traffic with no lights or reflectors or anything of the sort on them or their bike, people playing with their phones as they cross the street (or as they're driving), etc.
I also think that many drivers still feel that they have no obligation to yield to pedestrians in a crosswalk (this has long been the law in places like California and England, but not always elsewhere).
It's the law in the District of Columbia, but is widely ignored there.
I have not driven in New York City for a long time, so I don't know the status of these things there.
And then people are listening to music on their iPods or iPhones or similar devices, and not paying attention to traffic while walking or biking.
Quote from: cpzilliacus on September 28, 2012, 10:11:21 AM
I also think that many drivers still feel that they have no obligation to yield to pedestrians in a crosswalk (this has long been the law in places like California and England, but not always elsewhere).
It's the law in the District of Columbia, but is widely ignored there.
I have not driven in New York City for a long time, so I don't know the status of these things there.
Which is the law? Obligation to yield, or no obligation to yield? Are there really states whose law doesn't require motorists to yield to pedestrians in crosswalks. I find that hard to believe. Code references, please?
Quote from: cpzilliacus on September 28, 2012, 10:11:21 AM
Quote from: Duke87 on September 27, 2012, 06:44:23 PM
One hypothesis would be that this simply reflects an increase in the number of people walking and biking, especially after dark. There was a time where you didn't want to be out by yourself at night in New York City. Now that's not as much a concern as it used to be and so guess, what? More people out and about in the dark to have a driver not see them.
But there is of course also the matter of uptick in stupidity: people biking after dark in traffic with no lights or reflectors or anything of the sort on them or their bike, people playing with their phones as they cross the street (or as they're driving), etc.
I also think that many drivers still feel that they have no obligation to yield to pedestrians in a crosswalk (this has long been the law in places like California and England, but not always elsewhere).
....
On the other hand, there are plenty of pedestrians who seem to misinterpret "yield to pedestrians" and think that they can walk whenever they please, regardless of the "Don't Walk" signal and the fact that the cars have a green light. I can think of a time in downtown DC when a morbidly obese woman slowly waddled out against the "Don't Walk" light as I was approaching and intersection and, when I blew the horn, she started pointing at the "Yield to Peds" thing in the middle of the road and yelling racially-tinged profanities. While as a driver you're not entitled simply to plow into a pedestrian in that situation, it's not your obligation to yield, either.
Quote from: 1995hoo on September 28, 2012, 02:16:01 PM
Quote from: cpzilliacus on September 28, 2012, 10:11:21 AM
Quote from: Duke87 on September 27, 2012, 06:44:23 PM
One hypothesis would be that this simply reflects an increase in the number of people walking and biking, especially after dark. There was a time where you didn't want to be out by yourself at night in New York City. Now that's not as much a concern as it used to be and so guess, what? More people out and about in the dark to have a driver not see them.
But there is of course also the matter of uptick in stupidity: people biking after dark in traffic with no lights or reflectors or anything of the sort on them or their bike, people playing with their phones as they cross the street (or as they're driving), etc.
I also think that many drivers still feel that they have no obligation to yield to pedestrians in a crosswalk (this has long been the law in places like California and England, but not always elsewhere).
....
On the other hand, there are plenty of pedestrians who seem to misinterpret "yield to pedestrians" and think that they can walk whenever they please, regardless of the "Don't Walk" signal and the fact that the cars have a green light. I can think of a time in downtown DC when a morbidly obese woman slowly waddled out against the "Don't Walk" light as I was approaching and intersection and, when I blew the horn, she started pointing at the "Yield to Peds" thing in the middle of the road and yelling racially-tinged profanities. While as a driver you're not entitled simply to plow into a pedestrian in that situation, it's not your obligation to yield, either.
Wow. Yeah. Don't you just feel like yelling at pointing at the big red flashing hand?
However, I kind of doubt the increase in deaths is due to people of that caliber. Maybe I'm wrong.
Quote from: cpzilliacus on September 28, 2012, 10:11:21 AM
Quote from: Duke87 on September 27, 2012, 06:44:23 PM
One hypothesis would be that this simply reflects an increase in the number of people walking and biking, especially after dark. There was a time where you didn't want to be out by yourself at night in New York City. Now that's not as much a concern as it used to be and so guess, what? More people out and about in the dark to have a driver not see them.
But there is of course also the matter of uptick in stupidity: people biking after dark in traffic with no lights or reflectors or anything of the sort on them or their bike, people playing with their phones as they cross the street (or as they're driving), etc.
I also think that many drivers still feel that they have no obligation to yield to pedestrians in a crosswalk (this has long been the law in places like California and England, but not always elsewhere).
It's the law in the District of Columbia, but is widely ignored there.
There are lots of traffic laws that in New York City that are widely ignored and rarely enforced. Yielding to pedestrians is one of them - of course, the environment in New York City is such that often if turning traffic always properly yielded to pedestrians, cars could sit there all day without getting a chance to turn, because there are just that many people walking around. The right of way in New York City belongs to the person who most strongly asserts their claim to it. The laws about who's supposed to go first are just guidelines.
And you can jaywalk or cut people off all you want, ain't no cop writing you a ticket for it. Same goes for speeding (if you can manage it), the cops don't even have radar. But god help you if you illegally park. NYPD has plenty of meter maids and they write tickets mercilessly. The most common offense for motor vehicle citations issued by NYPD other than illegal parking is having excessively tinted windows (go figure).
Quote from: Duke87 on September 28, 2012, 07:50:53 PM
Quote from: cpzilliacus on September 28, 2012, 10:11:21 AM
Quote from: Duke87 on September 27, 2012, 06:44:23 PM
One hypothesis would be that this simply reflects an increase in the number of people walking and biking, especially after dark. There was a time where you didn't want to be out by yourself at night in New York City. Now that's not as much a concern as it used to be and so guess, what? More people out and about in the dark to have a driver not see them.
But there is of course also the matter of uptick in stupidity: people biking after dark in traffic with no lights or reflectors or anything of the sort on them or their bike, people playing with their phones as they cross the street (or as they're driving), etc.
I also think that many drivers still feel that they have no obligation to yield to pedestrians in a crosswalk (this has long been the law in places like California and England, but not always elsewhere).
It's the law in the District of Columbia, but is widely ignored there.
There are lots of traffic laws that in New York City that are widely ignored and rarely enforced. Yielding to pedestrians is one of them - of course, the environment in New York City is such that often if turning traffic always properly yielded to pedestrians, cars could sit there all day without getting a chance to turn, because there are just that many people walking around. The right of way in New York City belongs to the person who most strongly asserts their claim to it. The laws about who's supposed to go first are just guidelines.
And you can jaywalk or cut people off all you want, ain't no cop writing you a ticket for it. Same goes for speeding (if you can manage it), the cops don't even have radar. But god help you if you illegally park. NYPD has plenty of meter maids and they write tickets mercilessly. The most common offense for motor vehicle citations issued by NYPD other than illegal parking is having excessively tinted windows (go figure).
I wondered about speeding, since I've gone 40-45 on some of the avenues to catch up to the front of the green wave. But they don't ticket for jaywalking? I know Giuliani stepped up enforcement of that, at least around the city in general. (I don't think it was ever enforced on most of the numbered Manhattan streets.)
Quote from: Duke87 on September 28, 2012, 07:50:53 PM
Quote from: cpzilliacus on September 28, 2012, 10:11:21 AM
I also think that many drivers still feel that they have no obligation to yield to pedestrians in a crosswalk (this has long been the law in places like California and England, but not always elsewhere).
There are lots of traffic laws that in New York City that are widely ignored and rarely enforced. Yielding to pedestrians is one of them - of course, the environment in New York City is such that often if turning traffic always properly yielded to pedestrians, cars could sit there all day without getting a chance to turn, because there are just that many people walking around. The right of way in New York City belongs to the person who most strongly asserts their claim to it. The laws about who's supposed to go first are just guidelines.
Actually, I regard yielding to pedestrians in crosswalks as fairly universal in NYC, if a bit grudgingly so (even more grudgingly in the boroughs). It's certainly more prevalent than it is elsewhere (South Florida, anyone?), but I agree with your assessment of it being the result of assertion and resignation between the factions. There are just too many pedestrians in NYC to ignore; often, only a severe misanthrope could realistically refuse to yield to them. But there's also a flexible definition of yielding–squeezing through a small gap between bunches of pedestrians counts as yielding in New York, whereas in other parts of the country you pretty much wait for everyone to cross all the way before proceeding.
Motorists yielding to each other, however, is another matter entirely.