So, this will be the official thread for all MA Route 2 improvements. From Crosby's Corner to the Concord Rotary, if anyone has any pictures that they would like to post, they can do so here.
It's also a place to talk about what should be done. Particularly with the route 2, 3, and 16 intersection at Alewife Brook Parkway. Any suggestions and updates regarding Alewife and Fresh Pond Parkway would be welcome. I know that the Alewife intersection was slated for an improvement in 2015 through the TIGER grant, but I'm not sure if anything is going to come about that (This is Massachusetts after all). I still see the ARRA signs on the islands posted.
I spoke with officials from MADOT at a forum in Lowell a while back and I hope to post the interview ASAP, and the Crosby's Corner project is apparently underway. I drove past there recently, and the commonwealth has already posted signs noting that the homes along Route 2 have been taken by eminent domain. Hopefully I can snap those pics the next time I down there.
Here's a link to a pic I took today of the latest Crosby's Corner Construction. Only one. I have more fortunately.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jdm312/ (http://www.flickr.com/photos/jdm312/)
Here are some more Route 2/Crosby's Corner pics in my stream. Enjoy!
http://www.flickr.com/photos/jdm312/
I-695. Bam. Thread over.
I was out there for the first time in many months yesterday. Wow! Lots and lots of ROW cleared, some minimal grading, and many sections of drainpipe all about. If you live in these parts it really is one of those "I'll only believe it when I see it" forever-just-over-the-horizon projects, and now I've seen it with my own eyes and believe. Now if they could just get rid of the rest of those damn lights...
http://www.concordma.gov/pages/ConcordMA_PublicWorks/Crosbys_corner
Quote from: Steve on June 10, 2013, 07:29:17 PM
http://www.concordma.gov/pages/ConcordMA_PublicWorks/Crosbys_corner
Good to know, I will be driving along MA 2 early Saturday afternoon so I'll get a chance to see the construction up close & personal... as long as the slow-down isn't a gridlock situation by then.
Quote from: PHLBOS on June 10, 2013, 08:32:14 PM
Quote from: Steve on June 10, 2013, 07:29:17 PM
http://www.concordma.gov/pages/ConcordMA_PublicWorks/Crosbys_corner
Good to know, I will be driving along MA 2 early Saturday afternoon so I'll get a chance to see the construction up close & personal... as long as the slow-down isn't a gridlock situation by then.
That doesn't sound particularly pleasant. If I were up there, I'd try to avoid the area during weekends (10 AM-8 PM) and commute periods.
Quote from: Steve on June 11, 2013, 05:42:26 PM
Quote from: PHLBOS on June 10, 2013, 08:32:14 PM
Quote from: Steve on June 10, 2013, 07:29:17 PM
http://www.concordma.gov/pages/ConcordMA_PublicWorks/Crosbys_corner
Good to know, I will be driving along MA 2 early Saturday afternoon so I'll get a chance to see the construction up close & personal... as long as the slow-down isn't a gridlock situation by then.
That doesn't sound particularly pleasant. If I were up there, I'd try to avoid the area during weekends (10 AM-8 PM) and commute periods.
That's why, prior to heading out in that area, one either can check for current conditions at
http://boston.cbslocal.com/traffic/ (http://boston.cbslocal.com/traffic/)
Or listen (as I mentioned to HB in his road trip thread) to traffic reports every 10 minutes on either on the 3s WBZ (AM 1030) or on the 1s on Sirrius/XM 132.
Judging from the map and hearing traffic reports in the not-too-distant past. While conditions on MA 2 doesn't get reported as frequently as the other highways in the area; if there's a
major slowdown (i.e. gridlock) in that area due to construction, I'm sure it would get reported.
Note: when I first checked (5:30 PM, June 13) the conditions map on the web-link, most of the majors were shown in red due to rain-related slowdowns & rush-hour traffic. MA 2 in the construction area shows up as a pale green (40-45 mph range). Although further west (vicinity of the MA 62 jct.), MA 2 West is shown in red (0-15 mph) for a stretch; but that's not related to the construction project.
Quote from: PHLBOS on June 13, 2013, 05:35:50 PM
Quote from: Steve on June 11, 2013, 05:42:26 PM
Quote from: PHLBOS on June 10, 2013, 08:32:14 PM
Quote from: Steve on June 10, 2013, 07:29:17 PM
http://www.concordma.gov/pages/ConcordMA_PublicWorks/Crosbys_corner
Good to know, I will be driving along MA 2 early Saturday afternoon so I'll get a chance to see the construction up close & personal... as long as the slow-down isn't a gridlock situation by then.
That doesn't sound particularly pleasant. If I were up there, I'd try to avoid the area during weekends (10 AM-8 PM) and commute periods.
That's why, prior to heading out in that area, one either can check for current conditions at
http://boston.cbslocal.com/traffic/ (http://boston.cbslocal.com/traffic/)
Or listen (as I mentioned to HB in his road trip thread) to traffic reports every 10 minutes on either on the 3s WBZ (AM 1030) or on the 1s on Sirrius/XM 132.
Judging from the map and hearing traffic reports in the not-too-distant past. While conditions on MA 2 doesn't get reported as frequently as the other highways in the area; if there's a major slowdown (i.e. gridlock) in that area due to construction, I'm sure it would get reported.
Yeah... good luck with that. My experience in Boston and NYC is that typical slowdown spots aren't mentioned. After the first 2-3 weeks of construction, they won't keep saying every day "remember that there's road work outside Concord, allow extra time," but the delays will still be there. 15-20 minute delays are very possible without being reported - I just sat through one today that skipped 1010 AM and the FM stations I was listening to.
Quote from: Steve on June 13, 2013, 09:27:00 PMYeah... good luck with that. My experience in Boston and NYC is that typical slowdown spots aren't mentioned. After the first 2-3 weeks of construction, they won't keep saying every day "remember that there's road work outside Concord, allow extra time," but the delays will still be there. 15-20 minute delays are very possible without being reported - I just sat through one today that skipped 1010 AM and the FM stations I was listening to.
Slowdowns due to construction not always being reported, you're right.
Gridlock conditions (red zones on the earlier web-linked map) due to such construction will more likely (not necessarily guarantee) get reported.
Also, although I reside in the Philly area; not only am I originally a native of the Greater Boston area, I still make the trek up to the Bay State quite often (to visit family) several times a year... usually on holiday weekends. That said, the usual, major problem areas
do get reported on a more frequent basis. Other areas, outside of an abnormal event, not so much.
BTW, I will be more than happy to post a brief trip report sometime next week to confirm any findings.
Quote from: Steve on June 13, 2013, 09:27:00 PM
Yeah... good luck with that. My experience in Boston and NYC is that typical slowdown spots aren't mentioned.
Presuming you have the right kind of smartphone (I run it on my old Samsung tablet (Android OS)), this works pretty well: Inrix Traffic App (http://www.inrixtraffic.com/)
Trip Update/Report: I drove through the construction area this past Saturday (6/15) at around 4 PM. There wasn't any construction activity taking place and the mainline MA 2 corridor hasn't really been impacted by the construction as of yet. The majority of the construction work limits is presently alongside and away from the existing roadway. One can see the early stages of newly placed embankment for the future mainline MA 2 just south of the eastbound lanes.
Long story short: I was able to pass through at or even slightly above the posted 45 mph speed limit (which is the normal posted limit for the area as opposed to a Work Zone limit). I was also fortunate enough not to even encounter a red light at the intersection.
Somehow, MA 2 got downgraded on Google Maps. West of 128, it's not a freeway anymore; it's just light orange. Even with the exit numbers. Not only that, but it's white in Concord.
I am wondering if they have plans to eliminate the at grade intersections near Fitchburg? One of them is partially signalized, as I read on Wikipedia and saw on GSV. Also if the super two near Athol is ever going to be widened to full freeway as well?
Quote from: roadman65 on August 11, 2013, 09:20:42 PM
I am wondering if they have plans to eliminate the at grade intersections near Fitchburg? One of them is partially signalized, as I read on Wikipedia and saw on GSV. Also if the super two near Athol is ever going to be widened to full freeway as well?
Not sure about Fitchburg, but given the recent bridge replacements out in Phillipston and Orange, I highly doubt that any widening past Exit-19 is realistic for the time being. With that said, I was out there two weeks ago to see my chick up in Brattleboro and there was some minor shoulder widening between Orange and Athol. It was choppy at best, but it made a world a difference from the many times I would travel out there from school.
The partially-signalized intersection near Fitchburg is, as far as I can tell, not actually signal-controlled. The signal over the WB lanes has been converted to a flasher, and the one over the EB lanes is a perpetual green. Since the intersection I'd a minor RIRO. This works fine.
A message board on Route 2 eastbound at Crosby Corner today (5/17/15) stated that on Thursday 5/21 a traffic shift will take place. It looks to me that eastbound traffic will shift to the road which will eventually be the eastbound service road, allowing the west end tie in of the main line to be constructed which is on a higher elevation.
The latest traffic shift (6/19/15) has some big changes. Westbound traffic is now running over the new bridge but using what will be the future eastbound roadway, no more traffic signal westbound! However Route 2 eastbound roadway (future service road) now has a traffic light at the future service rd/ Rt 2A intersection!! I hope everyone can get handle this temporary alignment before there's a bad accident. Rt 2A to westbound 2 traffic uses a portion of old 2 east up the hill with a 180 turn which gets them headed west. You really need to see this to get the layout.
Quote from: ne11931 on June 22, 2015, 09:12:37 PM
You beat me to the punch. I drove that stretch of Route 2 (both directions) this past Saturday (6/20) and encountered the described-changes.
Quote from: 1 on August 10, 2013, 12:26:41 PM
Somehow, MA 2 got downgraded on Google Maps. West of 128, it's not a freeway anymore; it's just light orange. Even with the exit numbers. Not only that, but it's white in Concord.
It never was. The alignment that exists EAST of Rte. 128 (upgraded mid sixties) should have been continued westward to just west of Reformatory circle in the mid seventies. They (MassHighway) did finally erect jersey barriers in the middle of the undivided four lane cross section of Rt. 2 in Lincoln / Concord perhaps twenty years ago. But they did not remove any of the signalized crossings. Or the rotary near the jail. Wonder how many have been killed in head on and in or other collisions along this antiquated highway in the last forty years? Amazing that actually something is finally being done to this section at all.
I noticed the other day that the off ramp from 2 West to 2A--Cambridge Turnpike is now signed as exit 50. The nearest numbered exits are 43 at Rt 111 in Acton and 52 at Rt 95 in Lexington. All signalized intersections are not numbered.
Quote from: ne11931 on July 01, 2015, 07:20:04 PM
I noticed the other day that the off ramp from 2 West to 2A--Cambridge Turnpike is now signed as exit 50. The nearest numbered exits are 43 at Rt 111 in Acton and 52 at Rt 95 in Lexington. All signalized intersections are not numbered.
Those numbers likely date back from an old plan to upgrade MA 2 into a full-blown expressway. Those particular numbers won't be around for long when MA converts to mile-marker-based exit/interchange numbering in the next few years.
Quote from: PHLBOS on July 02, 2015, 09:04:05 AM
Quote from: ne11931 on July 01, 2015, 07:20:04 PM
I noticed the other day that the off ramp from 2 West to 2A--Cambridge Turnpike is now signed as exit 50. The nearest numbered exits are 43 at Rt 111 in Acton and 52 at Rt 95 in Lexington. All signalized intersections are not numbered.
Those numbers likely date back from an old plan to upgrade MA 2 into a full-blown expressway. Those particular numbers won't be around for long when MA converts to mile-marker-based exit/interchange numbering in the next few years.
Given that the I-95 exit is, somewhat ironically, at mile 128, the future exit number for Crosby's corner would probably be 124.
Quote from: bob7374 on July 02, 2015, 10:17:40 AM
Quote from: PHLBOS on July 02, 2015, 09:04:05 AM
Quote from: ne11931 on July 01, 2015, 07:20:04 PM
I noticed the other day that the off ramp from 2 West to 2A--Cambridge Turnpike is now signed as exit 50. The nearest numbered exits are 43 at Rt 111 in Acton and 52 at Rt 95 in Lexington. All signalized intersections are not numbered.
Those numbers likely date back from an old plan to upgrade MA 2 into a full-blown expressway. Those particular numbers won't be around for long when MA converts to mile-marker-based exit/interchange numbering in the next few years.
Given that the I-95 exit is, somewhat ironically, at mile 128, the future exit number for Crosby's corner would probably be 124.
I'm not seeing the irony.
Quote from: Pete from Boston on July 02, 2015, 12:22:39 PM
Quote from: bob7374 on July 02, 2015, 10:17:40 AM
Quote from: PHLBOS on July 02, 2015, 09:04:05 AM
Quote from: ne11931 on July 01, 2015, 07:20:04 PM
I noticed the other day that the off ramp from 2 West to 2A--Cambridge Turnpike is now signed as exit 50. The nearest numbered exits are 43 at Rt 111 in Acton and 52 at Rt 95 in Lexington. All signalized intersections are not numbered.
Those numbers likely date back from an old plan to upgrade MA 2 into a full-blown expressway. Those particular numbers won't be around for long when MA converts to mile-marker-based exit/interchange numbering in the next few years.
Given that the I-95 exit is, somewhat ironically, at mile 128, the future exit number for Crosby's corner would probably be 124.
I'm not seeing the irony.
MA 2's mile 128 is at MA 128 (0 is at the New York border). However, it is a misuse of the word "ironically".
Quote from: 1 on July 02, 2015, 12:25:36 PM
Quote from: Pete from Boston on July 02, 2015, 12:22:39 PM
Quote from: bob7374 on July 02, 2015, 10:17:40 AM
Quote from: PHLBOS on July 02, 2015, 09:04:05 AM
Quote from: ne11931 on July 01, 2015, 07:20:04 PM
I noticed the other day that the off ramp from 2 West to 2A--Cambridge Turnpike is now signed as exit 50. The nearest numbered exits are 43 at Rt 111 in Acton and 52 at Rt 95 in Lexington. All signalized intersections are not numbered.
Those numbers likely date back from an old plan to upgrade MA 2 into a full-blown expressway. Those particular numbers won't be around for long when MA converts to mile-marker-based exit/interchange numbering in the next few years.
Given that the I-95 exit is, somewhat ironically, at mile 128, the future exit number for Crosby's corner would probably be 124.
I'm not seeing the irony.
MA 2's mile 128 is at MA 128 (0 is at the New York border). However, it is a misuse of the word "ironically".
I know the milepost, I was just making a little nudge about the Alanisism.
I believe the irony here is that 128 digits will be making a return to the main signage (BGS') at this interchange; as many here know, the FHWA has long since banned the erection of MA 128 shields on BGS' & D6/D8 signs along the I-95 portion of the Yankee Division Highway. Granted, this time as an exit/interchange number as opposed to the route number but nonetheless.
Ok, that I'll concede has some irony to it.
Is there an official written FHWA "ban" on signing 128 overhead?
Quote from: Pete from Boston on July 02, 2015, 04:37:48 PMIs there an official written FHWA "ban" on signing 128 overhead?
Roadman could probably answer that question better than I; it might be in the form of a letter/memorandum. He was the one that told me and others here that such actions were indeed in response to the Feds.
However, such a prohibition (more of an omission, in reality)
is indeed listed in the state signing standards for secondary highways; see page 7 (http://www.massdot.state.ma.us/Portals/8/docs/traffic/GuideSign/d6_d8_policy.pdf).
Quote from: Guide Sign Policy for Secondary State Highways 2005 EditionOn signs for the entrance ramps along the Route I-95/S.R. 128 overlap between Canton and Peabody, only the I-95 route sign and destinations shall be displayed.
Quote from: Pete from Boston on July 02, 2015, 04:37:48 PM
Ok, that I'll concede has some irony to it.
Is there an official written FHWA "ban" on signing 128 overhead?
FHWA first provided the direction regarding eliminating the 128 designation from BGS and LGS panels along I-95 to MassHighway in writing in the early 1990s. The request was included in memorandums regarding their review comments on multiple sign replacement projects along I-95/128 that MassHighway submitted to FHWA for approval at the time. However, they stopped short of requiring total elimination of the 128 designation on the I-95 section (IMO, a HUGE blunder on their part), and allowed 128 route marker assemblies to remain in place.
I'll dig through my archives when I get a chance and see if I can find one of those memos.
Quote from: roadman on July 03, 2015, 07:37:51 AM
Quote from: Pete from Boston on July 02, 2015, 04:37:48 PM
Ok, that I'll concede has some irony to it.
Is there an official written FHWA "ban" on signing 128 overhead?
FHWA first provided the direction regarding eliminating the 128 designation from BGS and LGS panels along I-95 to MassHighway in writing in the early 1990s. The request was included in memorandums regarding their review comments on multiple sign replacement projects along I-95/128 that MassHighway submitted to FHWA for approval at the time. However, they stopped short of requiring total elimination of the 128 designation on the I-95 section (IMO, a HUGE blunder on their part), and allowed 128 route marker assemblies to remain in place.
I'll dig through my archives when I get a chance and see if I can find one of those memos.
I don't see how FHWA can require MA to de-designate a state highway. For that matter, I don't even see how they can require MA to un-sign it. Granted, 128/95 is a unique case, but the most I can really see being required at a Federal level is that the Interstate must be listed first and no smaller than the state route. Surprised MA didn't challenge on this.
Quote from: ne11931 on June 22, 2015, 09:12:37 PM
The latest traffic shift (6/19/15) has some big changes. Westbound traffic is now running over the new bridge but using what will be the future eastbound roadway, no more traffic signal westbound! However Route 2 eastbound roadway (future service road) now has a traffic light at the future service rd/ Rt 2A intersection!! I hope everyone can get handle this temporary alignment before there's a bad accident. Rt 2A to westbound 2 traffic uses a portion of old 2 east up the hill with a 180 turn which gets them headed west. You really need to see this to get the layout.
Right know from the former Rt 2/2A/Cambridge Turnpike intersection you follow old 2 East to get to 2 West and old 2 West to get to 2 East.
It could be interesting this summer with the Concord-Lexington tourists trying to use GPS .
Quote from: Alps on July 05, 2015, 09:01:08 PMI don't even see how they can require MA to un-sign it. Granted, 128/95 is a unique case, but the most I can really see being required at a Federal level is that the Interstate must be listed first and no smaller than the state route. Surprised MA didn't challenge on this.
2-word answer for such:
Federal dollars; especially back when Interstates had an automatic 90-10 federal/state spending mix.
We've told the Federal government where to stick it before and prevailed. I guess it's a pick-your battles scenario, but it's still petty of FHWA to leverage funding against local details like this.
Quote from: Pete from Boston on July 06, 2015, 12:04:04 PM
We've told the Federal government where to stick it before and prevailed. I guess it's a pick-your battles scenario, but it's still petty of FHWA to leverage funding against local details like this.
Not to derail the thread here, but MA (namely the Sargent Administration) brought such on themselves when they decided
not to build any of the missing pieces of I-95, a major East-Coast Interstate, inside 128.
Quote from: PHLBOS on July 06, 2015, 12:58:01 PM
Quote from: Pete from Boston on July 06, 2015, 12:04:04 PM
We've told the Federal government where to stick it before and prevailed. I guess it's a pick-your battles scenario, but it's still petty of FHWA to leverage funding against local details like this.
Not to derail the thread here, but MA (namely the Sargent Administration) brought such on themselves when they decided not to build any of the missing pieces of I-95, a major East-Coast Interstate, inside 128.
The people in the rights-of-way involved made that decision. Government rules by the consent of the governed, who didn't.
Quote from: Pete from Boston on July 06, 2015, 01:27:15 PM
Quote from: PHLBOS on July 06, 2015, 12:58:01 PM
Not to derail the thread here, but MA (namely the Sargent Administration) brought such on themselves when they decided not to build any of the missing pieces of I-95, a major East-Coast Interstate, inside 128.
The people in the rights-of-way involved made that decision.
Then it's their (NIMBY) fault as well. :)
Truth be told, the eminent domain process for the
much of the unbuilt portions of I-95 was
already in full swing when the Sargent Administration declared its moratorium on all highway projects inside of 128. The piece in Saugus already had the road embankment put in place (where it would remain for decades) and many homes were
already demolished along the Southwest Corridor's path (now occupied by the relocated MBTA Orange Line).
Quote from: PHLBOS on July 02, 2015, 09:04:05 AM
Quote from: ne11931 on July 01, 2015, 07:20:04 PM
I noticed the other day that the off ramp from 2 West to 2A--Cambridge Turnpike is now signed as exit 50. The nearest numbered exits are 43 at Rt 111 in Acton and 52 at Rt 95 in Lexington. All signalized intersections are not numbered.
Those numbers likely date back from an old plan to upgrade MA 2 into a full-blown expressway. Those particular numbers won't be around for long when MA converts to mile-marker-based exit/interchange numbering in the next few years.
Here's a photo of the above mentioned exit 50 sign:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.gribblenation.net%2Fmass21%2Fma2concord715e.jpg&hash=48e93d2fb0a971e00d02b540db7ec31bcd2d5ba2)
I took a few other photos of the construction area on my Misc. Mass Photos Page:
http://www.gribblenation.net/mass21/miscsigns.html (http://www.gribblenation.net/mass21/miscsigns.html)
September 17 Crosby Corner update. Westbound Route 2 traffic has been shifted to the final West alignment, eastbound still follows future East service road although looks like it will change very soon. Route 2A to 2 West has changed to what looks like the final alignment from that temporary " horseshoe " type ramp.
It's interesting to note that evening rush hour backups are gone at Crosby but the backup at the next traffic light, Route 126 are more than double what they were before.
Quote from: ne11931 on September 17, 2015, 09:02:07 PM
It's interesting to note that evening rush hour backups are gone at Crosby but the backup at the next traffic light, Route 126 are more than double what they were before.
Hopefully that backup serves as a "nudge" for them to continue the conversion from signaled interchanges to free-flowing to make MA 2 a complete highway.
Quote from: southshore720 on September 19, 2015, 11:20:54 AM
Quote from: ne11931 on September 17, 2015, 09:02:07 PM
It's interesting to note that evening rush hour backups are gone at Crosby but the backup at the next traffic light, Route 126 are more than double what they were before.
Hopefully that backup serves as a "nudge" for them to continue the conversion from signaled interchanges to free-flowing to make MA 2 a complete highway.
There has been resistance from Concord in the past.I think a tunnel the length of the town with no exits would make them happy.The backups in West Concord and Concord that develop because of people trying to get through the rotary approach gridlock at times. I imagine some of those multi million dollar homes with lines of cars sitting in front of them are losing some value.
Quote from: bob7374 on July 06, 2015, 04:47:31 PM
Quote from: PHLBOS on July 02, 2015, 09:04:05 AM
Quote from: ne11931 on July 01, 2015, 07:20:04 PM
I noticed the other day that the off ramp from 2 West to 2A--Cambridge Turnpike is now signed as exit 50. The nearest numbered exits are 43 at Rt 111 in Acton and 52 at Rt 95 in Lexington. All signalized intersections are not numbered.
Those numbers likely date back from an old plan to upgrade MA 2 into a full-blown expressway. Those particular numbers won't be around for long when MA converts to mile-marker-based exit/interchange numbering in the next few years.
Here's a photo of the above mentioned exit 50 sign:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.gribblenation.net%2Fmass21%2Fma2concord715e.jpg&hash=48e93d2fb0a971e00d02b540db7ec31bcd2d5ba2)
I took a few other photos of the construction area on my Misc. Mass Photos Page:
http://www.gribblenation.net/mass21/miscsigns.html (http://www.gribblenation.net/mass21/miscsigns.html)
I'm not sure if they'll start with mile based numbering. It seems like it's a new trend to them, although PA has had them for over 15 years here in the Northeast.
Quote from: noelbotevera on September 20, 2015, 11:06:16 AMI'm not sure if they'll start with mile based numbering. It seems like it's a new trend to them, although PA has had them for over 15 years here in the Northeast.
MassDOT just recently issued a bid invitation for exit number conversions and recent I-90 sign replacement drawings (a separate contract) now show mileage-based interchange numbers on them so that change
is indeed coming to the Bay State.
Indeed, by the end of 2016 many roads should have mileage based numbers, and by the end of 2017 most roads will have them. The Mass Pike should be the first road to get them, as they are the first road to have mileage based numbers written into current re-signing plans which should have construction begin soon.
September 25 Crosby Corner update. Eastbound Route 2 has been moved to its final alignment, this means there are no longer any traffic signals on the main line. All the intersecting roads and driveways no longer have direct access,they use service roads. The work left to be done appears to be mostly on the service roads and of course landscaping.
Hell freezes over, I'm assuming, once the landscaping is done.
Quote from: AMLNet49 on September 22, 2015, 02:54:11 PM
Indeed, by the end of 2016 many roads should have mileage based numbers, and by the end of 2017 most roads will have them. The Mass Pike should be the first road to get them, as they are the first road to have mileage based numbers written into current re-signing plans which should have construction begin soon.
This being a
really long thread, I didn't read all of it, so I don't know if anyone already mentioned that there was a time in the past, perhaps back in the 70s, when some freeways (certainly 128) had
both consecutive numbers and mile numbers at each ramp. As I recall, they increased in opposite direction on 128. I think the idea was to let people get used to the mile numbers (which actually said "MILE" before them), and then take down the consecutive numbers. They eventually took the mile numbers back down instead.
Quote from: pderocco on October 09, 2015, 01:57:27 AMThis being a really long thread, I didn't read all of it, so I don't know if anyone already mentioned that there was a time in the past, perhaps back in the 70s, when some freeways (certainly 128) had both consecutive numbers and mile numbers at each ramp. As I recall, they increased in opposite direction on 128. I think the idea was to let people get used to the mile numbers (which actually said "MILE" before them), and then take down the consecutive numbers. They eventually took the mile numbers back down instead.
I-93 north of Boston had both mile numbers and exit number tabs from the 1970s until 1986-87 when the exit number changed to its current numbers.
Scroll down to see 1977 vintage photo showing the dual mile/exit number tabs (http://www.alpsroads.net/roads/ma/i-93/6.html)
I-295 in RI at the time also had similar.
128 never had mile number/exit number tabs regardless of its past exit numbering system(s).
Not sure why MA decided to nuke the dual milage tabs and just go to mile based in the 80s.
Quote from: noelbotevera on October 09, 2015, 04:57:59 PM
Not sure why MA decided to nuke the dual milage tabs and just go to mile based in the 80s.
The dual-mileage/exit tab was only an experimental/trial basis; which explains why just a handful of Interstate highways (I-95 in ME just south of the Maine Turnpike had such as well) in New England had them. FHWA and/or MUTCD either dropped such requirements (if any) or never officially adopted such on a permanent basis.
The reason why MA didn't adopt mile-marker based exit numbering earlier was simply, they didn't have to. Plus, MA had already changed exit numbers on several of its highways during the 70s (mainly ones that used the
Exit 25 = Route 128 philosophy; I-93, 95 (Canton and south), MA 3 & 24).
At present, I-93 north of Boston has had its interchanges renumbered
three times since it was built. It first had the
Exit 25 = Route 128 approach then it switched to Exit 1 = Northeast Expressway/Central Artery (originally I-95, current US 1) in the early 70s (such had the dual mile/exit tabs) and it again switched to its current sequential numbering circa 1986-87.
IMHO, I-93 should've switched to mile-marker exit numbering immediately after the O'Neill Tunnel (part of the Big Dig) was fully opened to traffic due to the new tunnel having less interchanges than the old Central Artery.
Quote from: noelbotevera on October 09, 2015, 04:57:59 PM
Not sure why MA decided to nuke the dual milage tabs and just go to mile based in the 80s.The dual-mileage/exit tab was only an experimental/trial basis; which explains why just a handful of Interstate highways (I-95 in ME just south of the Maine Turnpike had such as well) in New England had them. FHWA and/or MUTCD either dropped such requirements (if any) or never officially adopted such on a permanent basis.
The dual posting (sequenital and milepost) exit tabs were referenced in the 1971 MUTCD as an option. From Section 2F-20:
QuoteConsistent with the AASHO action to adopt the consecutive numbering system for the Interstate System and with the Federal requirement
for a milepost numbering system, the two systems may be combined by displaying an auxiliary panel with a single line
legend "MILE (number)-EXIT (number) " in conjunction with the advance guide, exit clirection and overhead gore signs. For the
ground-mounted EXIT gore sign that already displays a consecutive number, the auxiliary panel will read only "MILE (number)"
This language was removed from the 1978 MUTCD.
Quote from: massroadpatriot on November 11, 2012, 12:32:56 AM
So, this will be the official thread for all MA Route 2 improvements. From Crosby's Corner to the Concord Rotary, if anyone has any pictures that they would like to post, they can do so here.
It's also a place to talk about what should be done. Particularly with the route 2, 3, and 16 intersection at Alewife Brook Parkway. Any suggestions and updates regarding Alewife and Fresh Pond Parkway would be welcome. I know that the Alewife intersection was slated for an improvement in 2015 through the TIGER grant, but I'm not sure if anything is going to come about that (This is Massachusetts after all). I still see the ARRA signs on the islands posted.
The project at the Alewife intersection is in its final stages. I can't see much change although the Mass DOT project description states elimination of a merge and additional room for vehicles to queue.Curbing has been realigned, drainage redone but for 3.8 million you aren't going to do much to help that huge bottleneck.
I remember back in the early 80's after the Alewife station was built and the rotary eliminated it was widely publicized that the intersection was temporary and would be replaced because they knew it was inadequate.
Will the brand new Exit 50 be renumbered or will it be a sequential outlier in the new mileage-number contract? Because when I reviewed the MA-2 section of the contract, it skipped this exit in the plans. I feel like it would be awkward to have one sequential exit amidst the rest of the mileage numbers.
Quote from: ne11931 on November 12, 2015, 08:59:30 PM
Quote from: massroadpatriot on November 11, 2012, 12:32:56 AM
So, this will be the official thread for all MA Route 2 improvements. From Crosby's Corner to the Concord Rotary, if anyone has any pictures that they would like to post, they can do so here.
It's also a place to talk about what should be done. Particularly with the route 2, 3, and 16 intersection at Alewife Brook Parkway. Any suggestions and updates regarding Alewife and Fresh Pond Parkway would be welcome. I know that the Alewife intersection was slated for an improvement in 2015 through the TIGER grant, but I'm not sure if anything is going to come about that (This is Massachusetts after all). I still see the ARRA signs on the islands posted.
The project at the Alewife intersection is in its final stages. I can't see much change although the Mass DOT project description states elimination of a merge and additional room for vehicles to queue.Curbing has been realigned, drainage redone but for 3.8 million you aren't going to do much to help that huge bottleneck.
I remember back in the early 80's after the Alewife station was built and the rotary eliminated it was widely publicized that the intersection was temporary and would be replaced because they knew it was inadequate.
I drive through this intersection frequently and the improvements will at least eliminate some of the guessing (one lane or two?) that has caused a lot of friction in some of the movements to date.
One disappointment is that traffic leaving Alewife Station for Route 2 still faces a difficult merge with traffic coming from Alewife Brook Parkway north/eastbound. I'm hoping there's still some final detail that will improve this. It was my understanding this was a project goal.
Footings are in place presumably for new traffic signals, but could be for guide signs. We'll see.
You really can't eliminate the bottleneck here because a major expressway ends at a parkway/boulevard with traffic lights. All the flyovers in the world are just going to funnel cars more quickly to the stoplights at Mass. Ave. and Cambridgepark Drive, presumably backing up onto those same ramps (much as it backs up to the Alewife "rotary" (people still call it that) today. The long-awaited Crosby's Corner light elimination, for comparison, has just pushed the backups elsewhere.
Quote from: ne11931 on November 12, 2015, 08:59:30 PM
Quote from: massroadpatriot on November 11, 2012, 12:32:56 AM
So, this will be the official thread for all MA Route 2 improvements. From Crosby's Corner to the Concord Rotary, if anyone has any pictures that they would like to post, they can do so here.
It's also a place to talk about what should be done. Particularly with the route 2, 3, and 16 intersection at Alewife Brook Parkway. Any suggestions and updates regarding Alewife and Fresh Pond Parkway would be welcome. I know that the Alewife intersection was slated for an improvement in 2015 through the TIGER grant, but I'm not sure if anything is going to come about that (This is Massachusetts after all). I still see the ARRA signs on the islands posted.
The project at the Alewife intersection is in its final stages. I can't see much change although the Mass DOT project description states elimination of a merge and additional room for vehicles to queue.Curbing has been realigned, drainage redone but for 3.8 million you aren't going to do much to help that huge bottleneck.
I remember back in the early 80's after the Alewife station was built and the rotary eliminated it was widely publicized that the intersection was temporary and would be replaced because they knew it was inadequate.
Major changes at first blush: longer division of 3S-2W ramp from the 2W mainline, hence the more room to queue. Alewife station exit now adds a lane onto 3N, hence the elimination of a merge. Not much else except some general geometric improvements.
[/quote]
Major changes at first blush: longer division of 3S-2W ramp from the 2W mainline, hence the more room to queue. Alewife station exit now adds a lane onto 3N, hence the elimination of a merge. Not much else except some general geometric improvements.
[/quote]
Are you saying the Alewife exit has been widened from one lane to two to add a turn lane to 3N/16E ?
Quote from: ne11931 on November 14, 2015, 11:42:44 AM
Quote from: Alps on November 13, 2015, 11:30:32 PM
Major changes at first blush: longer division of 3S-2W ramp from the 2W mainline, hence the more room to queue. Alewife station exit now adds a lane onto 3N, hence the elimination of a merge. Not much else except some general geometric improvements.
Are you saying the Alewife exit has been widened from one lane to two to add a turn lane to 3N/16E ?
http://arlingtonma.gov/home/showdocument?id=25508
It takes the current "sometimes one lane, but often two" scenario and makes it firmly two.
That document confirms what I thought I'd heard, that the road from Alewife Station will get its own, albeit short lane, hopefully improving the merge.
Quote from: Alps on November 14, 2015, 12:49:26 PM
Quote from: ne11931 on November 14, 2015, 11:42:44 AM
Quote from: Alps on November 13, 2015, 11:30:32 PM
Major changes at first blush: longer division of 3S-2W ramp from the 2W mainline, hence the more room to queue. Alewife station exit now adds a lane onto 3N, hence the elimination of a merge. Not much else except some general geometric improvements.
Are you saying the Alewife exit has been widened from one lane to two to add a turn lane to 3N/16E ?
http://arlingtonma.gov/home/showdocument?id=25508
Thanks, I wish I knew about that document before.
Quote from: AMLNet49 on November 13, 2015, 01:15:40 AM
Will the brand new Exit 50 be renumbered or will it be a sequential outlier in the new mileage-number contract? Because when I reviewed the MA-2 section of the contract, it skipped this exit in the plans. I feel like it would be awkward to have one sequential exit amidst the rest of the mileage numbers.
The new signs are up today, they are Exit 50 signs. The contractor was probably instructed to somehow provide a mileage exit number when needed.
Quote from: ne11931 on November 19, 2015, 09:24:21 PM
Quote from: AMLNet49 on November 13, 2015, 01:15:40 AM
Will the brand new Exit 50 be renumbered or will it be a sequential outlier in the new mileage-number contract? Because when I reviewed the MA-2 section of the contract, it skipped this exit in the plans. I feel like it would be awkward to have one sequential exit amidst the rest of the mileage numbers.
The new signs are up today, they are Exit 50 signs. The contractor was probably instructed to somehow provide a mileage exit number when needed.
The Crosby's Corner exit is at mile 124.8, which means it will probably be Exit 124, since the I-95/128 exit 3.7 miles to the east at mile 128.5 and will be numbered 128.
Quote from: ne11931 on November 19, 2015, 09:24:21 PM
Quote from: AMLNet49 on November 13, 2015, 01:15:40 AM
Will the brand new Exit 50 be renumbered or will it be a sequential outlier in the new mileage-number contract? Because when I reviewed the MA-2 section of the contract, it skipped this exit in the plans. I feel like it would be awkward to have one sequential exit amidst the rest of the mileage numbers.
The new signs are up today, they are Exit 50 signs. The contractor was probably instructed to somehow provide a mileage exit number when needed.
More likely would be that it will added to the mile marker sign contract as a change order.
While this is more of an improvement to the highway going over it, I guess it involves improvements to Route 2. The junction with I-495 in Littleton appears to be more or less done, with the northbound c/d ramp in use and northbound 495 shifted back to the right. Outside of some landscaping and cleanup, it looks done.
Drove Route 2 through the Crosby's Corner interchange yesterday. All the BGSes on the mainline are now in. However, the eastbound ground mounted signs need some serious clearing and grubbing. They also need to remove the temporary signs on the mainline, as they are no longer necessary.
Quote from: roadman on December 16, 2015, 10:02:27 AM
Drove Route 2 through the Crosby's Corner interchange yesterday. All the BGSes on the mainline are now in. However, the eastbound ground mounted signs need some serious clearing and grubbing. They also need to remove the temporary signs on the mainline, as they are no longer necessary.
GSV hasn't updated yet and I haven't driven through there in a while; are there exit tabs on the BGSs or is the new number just on the gore point sign?
Quote from: AMLNet49 on December 17, 2015, 01:04:47 PM
Quote from: roadman on December 16, 2015, 10:02:27 AM
Drove Route 2 through the Crosby's Corner interchange yesterday. All the BGSes on the mainline are now in. However, the eastbound ground mounted signs need some serious clearing and grubbing. They also need to remove the temporary signs on the mainline, as they are no longer necessary.
GSV hasn't updated yet and I haven't driven through there in a while; are there exit tabs on the BGSs or is the new number just on the gore point sign?
All the new BGSes for Route 2A have Exit 50 tabs, and the new ground mount signs also reference Exit 50.
Quote from: roadman on December 17, 2015, 02:26:13 PM
Quote from: AMLNet49 on December 17, 2015, 01:04:47 PM
Quote from: roadman on December 16, 2015, 10:02:27 AM
Drove Route 2 through the Crosby's Corner interchange yesterday. All the BGSes on the mainline are now in. However, the eastbound ground mounted signs need some serious clearing and grubbing. They also need to remove the temporary signs on the mainline, as they are no longer necessary.
GSV hasn't updated yet and I haven't driven through there in a while; are there exit tabs on the BGSs or is the new number just on the gore point sign?
All the new BGSes for Route 2A have Exit 50 tabs, and the new ground mount signs also reference Exit 50.
Finally got a chance to drive through there yesterday (4/2) here's the westbound BGS for the MA 2A exit:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.gribblenation.net%2Fmass21%2Fma2signs4216a.JPG&hash=d59cfc66b656b23a36f373ddeebf1c70cbb99081)
All the photos I took, both westbound and eastbound back to I-95/128 are available here:
http://www.gribblenation.net/mass21/miscsigns.html#mass2 (http://www.gribblenation.net/mass21/miscsigns.html#mass2)
Outside the stated scope of this thread, but it looks like they are down to just very basic tidying up at the Routes 2/128/95 interchange rebuild project. They did a nice job, only took about two years.
Quote from: Pete from Boston on August 01, 2016, 01:49:46 PM
Outside the stated scope of this thread, but it looks like they are down to just very basic tidying up at the Routes 2/128/95 interchange rebuild project. They did a nice job, only took about two years.
I agree they did do a nice job. The only thing I wish they had addressed was that driveway on Route 2 westbound in to a tree nursery - landscape business. It occurs right where it goes from three
lanes to two and the 95 south to 2 westbound ramp merges. I cringe when I see trucks slow way down to make that turn.
Quote from: ne11931 on August 01, 2016, 09:30:25 PM
Quote from: Pete from Boston on August 01, 2016, 01:49:46 PM
Outside the stated scope of this thread, but it looks like they are down to just very basic tidying up at the Routes 2/128/95 interchange rebuild project. They did a nice job, only took about two years.
I agree they did do a nice job. The only thing I wish they had addressed was that driveway on Route 2 westbound in to a tree nursery - landscape business. It occurs right where it goes from three
lanes to two and the 95 south to 2 westbound ramp merges. I cringe when I see trucks slow way down to make that turn.
MassDOT had posted some photos on Flickr about that interchange. https://www.flickr.com/photos/massdot/sets/72157650800347207/with/28748407892/
And, just when you thought the new Crosby's Corner interchange was substantially completed:
http://blog.mass.gov/transportation/massdot-highway/lincolnconcord-route-2crosbys-corner-lane-closures/
Regarding the Rte. 2 / 95 / 128 cloverleaf reconstruction - did they narrow the Rte. 2 mainline? It certainly appears that a new bridge was constructed in the median, between the E and W mainlines. No pictures on the Flickr link of the finished product. Still the same cloverleaf, essentially? Remember that cloverleaf in the early 80's - it had severe rust on the girders, and spalling concrete, even back then.
The interchange is basically the same. No C/D roads were added. The westbound lanes of the new bridge were built in the gap between the old spans, while the eastbound span was demolished and rebuilt in-place. Functionally, all lanes and shoulders were reconstructed into one large bridge that overlaps where the eastbound span was. No lane reductions were made.