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Non-Road Boards => Off-Topic => Topic started by: TheStranger on November 29, 2012, 11:56:46 AM

Title: Municipal exclaves
Post by: TheStranger on November 29, 2012, 11:56:46 AM
Here's something that fascinated me today while looking at a map of Pittsburgh:

https://maps.google.com/maps?q=Pittsburgh,+PA&hl=en&ll=40.475289,-79.94545&spn=0.099633,0.152092&sll=40.471633,-79.871292&sspn=0.099638,0.152092&hnear=Pittsburgh,+Allegheny,+Pennsylvania&t=m&z=13

The UPMC St. Margaret hospital along Freeport Road on the north shore is within city limits...but except by boat, there is no way one can go there from any other part of Pittsburgh without entering another jurisdiction.

Any other examples of this?  I can think of one notable California instance: San Ysidro, part of the city of San Diego since the 1960s despite the fact there is no way to travel there from the rest of San Diego (except through San Diego Bay) without first going through multiple suburbs not part of that city.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: corco on November 29, 2012, 12:01:29 PM
Here's some Buckeye, Arizona magic
http://goo.gl/maps/lMweq
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: TheStranger on November 29, 2012, 12:17:44 PM
Quote from: corco on November 29, 2012, 12:01:29 PM
Here's some Buckeye, Arizona magic
http://goo.gl/maps/lMweq


Wikipedia's map of the city conveys how scattershot it all is on a larger scale:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Maricopa_County_Incorporated_and_Planning_areas_Buckeye_highlighted.svg
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: DTComposer on November 29, 2012, 12:18:01 PM
Santa Barbara did this when they annexed the airport. The strip isn't shown on this map, but it goes south into the ocean from downtown, turns west, then turns north.

http://goo.gl/maps/DR7ft
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: deathtopumpkins on November 29, 2012, 12:28:00 PM
Boston comes pretty close with the neighborhoods of Allston and Brighton (which were formerly the town of Brighton). They're entirely separated from the rest of Boston by the town of Brookline, except for a small strip of land running from the south edge of Comm Ave to the bank of the Charles.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: 1995hoo on November 29, 2012, 12:37:11 PM
I'm going to interpret "municipal" loosely to include counties, not just cities or towns.

Fairfax County, Virginia, has an exclave within the City of Fairfax; the courthouse, county jail, and a few other government facilities are located there. Fairfax City is itself an enclave totally surrounded by Fairfax County. Google doesn't show the borders, but the area in question is the darker grey area surrounded by Main Street, Chain Bridge Road, and Judicial Drive (note that the lighter grey areas along Main Street are not part of the exclave): http://goo.gl/maps/Hu6z0

Also there's the famous Baarle-Hertog, Belgium, which consists of a bunch of exclaves that are mostly surrounded by the Netherlands and disconnected from Belgium proper, but to make it more complicated, the Netherlands then has its own exclaves within the Belgian exclaves. Screwy stuff! http://goo.gl/maps/QfBKE –Wikipedia's description might be more helpful than the map! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baarle-Hertog)
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: J N Winkler on November 29, 2012, 01:06:51 PM
New Iberia Parish, Louisiana is in two disjoint parts.  I think there may be one other parish in Louisiana which is also in multiple disjoint pieces.

In Kansas municipalities are not allowed to form exclaves.  In the case of Wichita this has resulted in some neighborhoods which are disjoint from the rest of the city on superficial inspection, but are connected to the rest of the city by rights-of-way which are within the city limits while the abutting properties are not.  In one case the corridor of linkage simplifies to a single point--the intersection of Maize Road and 37th Street North.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: cpzilliacus on November 29, 2012, 01:17:40 PM
Not sure that it qualifies as an exclave, but on the "Virginia" side of the Potomac River across the Arlington Memorial Bridge is Columbia Island (https://maps.google.com/maps?q=columbia+island,+washington,+dc&hl=en&safe=off&hnear=Columbia+Island&gl=us&t=m&z=15).  Even though it is on the "other" side of the river, it is part of the District of Columbia, not Virginia (the actual border between D.C. and Virginia runs in the Boundary Channel, to the west of Columbia Island.

To add to the fun, the island is entirely owned by the National Park Service, which does not usually post signs when leaving or entering a state, and many people incorrectly assume that the island is part of Virginia.

Well upstream, in  the nontidal part of the Potomac above the Great Falls, is privately-owned Selden Island (https://maps.google.com/maps?q=van+deventer+island&hl=en&ll=39.078508,-77.453356&spn=0.037246,0.077162&safe=off&hnear=Van+Deventer+Island&gl=us&t=h&z=14).  Its only road access is via a small bridge from Loudoun County, Virginia, but the island is part of unincorporated Montgomery County, Maryland.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: lamsalfl on November 29, 2012, 01:34:30 PM
St. Martin Parish is split, not Iberia Parish.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: 1995hoo on November 29, 2012, 01:39:57 PM
Quote from: cpzilliacus on November 29, 2012, 01:17:40 PM
Not sure that it qualifies as an exclave, but on the "Virginia" side of the Potomac River across the Arlington Memorial Bridge is Columbia Island (https://maps.google.com/maps?q=columbia+island,+washington,+dc&hl=en&safe=off&hnear=Columbia+Island&gl=us&t=m&z=15).  Even though it is on the "other" side of the river, it is part of the District of Columbia, not Virginia (the actual border between D.C. and Virginia runs in the Boundary Channel, to the west of Columbia Island.

To add to the fun, the island is entirely owned by the National Park Service, which does not usually post signs when leaving or entering a state, and many people incorrectly assume that the island is part of Virginia.

Well upstream, in  the nontidal part of the Potomac above the Great Falls, is privately-owned Selden Island (https://maps.google.com/maps?q=van+deventer+island&hl=en&ll=39.078508,-77.453356&spn=0.037246,0.077162&safe=off&hnear=Van+Deventer+Island&gl=us&t=h&z=14).  Its only road access is via a small bridge from Loudoun County, Virginia, but the island is part of unincorporated Montgomery County, Maryland.

I think Columbia Island probably does not qualify as an exclave because the entire river, up to the high-water mark on the Virginia shore, is within the District of Columbia and in this case that means the boundary is at the high-water mark of Boundary Channel, which separates Columbia Island from Virginia. In other words, you can drive to Columbia Island without leaving the District of Columbia by simply driving over Memorial Bridge (although if you go to the marina, you cannot get back to the main portion of the District by car without entering Virginia because you have to turn right onto the GW Parkway.....but you could get back by foot or bike without entering Virginia, so it's not an exclave).
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: Dr Frankenstein on November 29, 2012, 01:44:21 PM
Buckeye: What the hell?
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: cpzilliacus on November 29, 2012, 01:48:15 PM
Quote from: 1995hoo on November 29, 2012, 01:39:57 PM
I think Columbia Island probably does not qualify as an exclave because the entire river, up to the high-water mark on the Virginia shore, is within the District of Columbia and in this case that means the boundary is at the high-water mark of Boundary Channel, which separates Columbia Island from Virginia. In other words, you can drive to Columbia Island without leaving the District of Columbia by simply driving over Memorial Bridge (although if you go to the marina, you cannot get back to the main portion of the District by car without entering Virginia because you have to turn right onto the GW Parkway.....but you could get back by foot or bike without entering Virginia, so it's not an exclave).

Then  there's the matter of T. Roosevelt Island (https://maps.google.com/maps?q=teddy+roosevelt+island&hl=en&safe=off&hnear=Theodore+Roosevelt+Island&gl=us&t=m&z=15), a short distance to the north of Columbia Island.

It is crossed by the Theodore Roosevelt Bridge (I-66 and U.S. 50), but there is no access from that bridge to the island.

Like Columbia Island, it is owned by the National Park Service (and part of the District of Columbia).

The only access to the island is by way of a pedestrian bridge from a parking lot located in Virginia on the northbound side of the George Washington Memorial Parkway.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: Anthony_JK on November 29, 2012, 02:01:19 PM
Quote from: J N Winkler on November 29, 2012, 01:06:51 PM
New Iberia Parish, Louisiana is in two disjoint parts.  I think there may be one other parish in Louisiana which is also in multiple disjoint pieces.

Ahhhh....no such parish exists. The CITY of New Iberia is the parish seat of IBERIA Parish, which is one entity.

St. Martin Parish, OTOH, is broken up into its Upper and Lower partitions.  The latter is unoccupied, and located within the Atchafalaya River Basin.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: J N Winkler on November 29, 2012, 02:09:57 PM
Sorry, yes--it was St. Martin Parish I was thinking of.  (Should have checked before posting . . .)
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: deathtopumpkins on November 29, 2012, 02:16:31 PM
Quote from: 1995hoo on November 29, 2012, 12:37:11 PMAlso there's the famous Baarle-Hertog, Belgium, which consists of a bunch of exclaves that are mostly surrounded by the Netherlands and disconnected from Belgium proper, but to make it more complicated, the Netherlands then has its own exclaves within the Belgian exclaves. Screwy stuff! http://goo.gl/maps/QfBKE –Wikipedia's description might be more helpful than the map! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baarle-Hertog)

Even screwier are the en/exclaves along the Indo-Bangladeshi border: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indo-Bangladesh_enclaves
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9a/Cooch-behar-enclaves-schematisch.png

There's even an Indian enclave within a Bangladeshi enclave within an Indian enclave within Bangladesh. Talk about trippy.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/21/Dahala_Khagrabari.png
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: TheStranger on November 29, 2012, 02:44:33 PM
Quote from: deathtopumpkins on November 29, 2012, 02:16:31 PM


There's even an Indian enclave within a Bangladeshi enclave within an Indian enclave within Bangladesh. Talk about trippy.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/21/Dahala_Khagrabari.png

And according to Wikipedia...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dahala_Khagrabari

QuoteCuriously, the owner of this enclave is a Bangladeshi farmer who lives in the enclave surrounding Dahala Kahagrabari.[1]

So to recap...

a Bangladeshi-owned Indian enclave within a Bangladeshi enclave within an Indian enclave within Bangladesh.

Wow.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: 1995hoo on November 29, 2012, 02:50:02 PM
Wow. I knew from some Indian history courses I took 20 years ago in college that the partition of India and Pakistan was complicated, but I had no idea it was that complex.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: Road Hog on November 29, 2012, 09:22:54 PM
Quote from: J N Winkler on November 29, 2012, 01:06:51 PM
New Iberia Parish, Louisiana is in two disjoint parts.  I think there may be one other parish in Louisiana which is also in multiple disjoint pieces.

In Kansas municipalities are not allowed to form exclaves.  In the case of Wichita this has resulted in some neighborhoods which are disjoint from the rest of the city on superficial inspection, but are connected to the rest of the city by rights-of-way which are within the city limits while the abutting properties are not.  In one case the corridor of linkage simplifies to a single point--the intersection of Maize Road and 37th Street North.

The same thing happens in Texas. All incorporated areas must be contiguous. It's resulted in some curiosities. For instance, Lake Ray Hubbard, which is about 15 miles east of downtown Dallas, is entirely incorporated by the City of Dallas.

In some places the city limits reach out like tentacles along highway rights-of-way for many miles outside the city center. Sometimes neighboring cities can't agree on where their meeting point should be and end up in court. More often than not it's over traffic ticket jurisdiction and the resultant revenue.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: NE2 on November 29, 2012, 09:37:37 PM
Florida statutes require an annexed area to be "contiguous to the municipality's boundaries at the time the annexation proceeding is begun and reasonably compact": http://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/2012/171.043
Enclaves of unincorporated land definitely exist. And noncontiguous pieces separated by only a road are also allowed: http://edocs.ci.orlando.fl.us/asv/paperlessagenda.nsf/6acecff5f30ecb0d85256bd0005abae0/3201fe97f475922e852577260053ea16?OpenDocument
(Note the sentence "If annexed, the property will not create an enclave." I don't know if this is required by any law or is just good policy.)

Also see this pathological doozy (verified against multiple sources): http://www.openstreetmap.org/?way=72790507
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: CentralCAroadgeek on November 29, 2012, 09:45:11 PM
Should San Francisco International Airport (SFO) count as one? It's located in unincorporated San Mateo County, but it's owned by the City and County of San Francisco. SFO even follows the City's bans, such as the one on styrofoam products.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: NE2 on November 29, 2012, 09:49:37 PM
Quote from: CentralCAroadgeek on November 29, 2012, 09:45:11 PM
Should San Francisco International Airport (SFO) count as one?
No, just as the Los Angeles Aqueduct is not part of LA.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: Takumi on November 29, 2012, 10:33:22 PM
Virginia Beach and Mecklenburg County both have small sections only accessible through North Carolina.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: kphoger on November 29, 2012, 10:37:31 PM
Found this little nugget (http://goo.gl/maps/IqHS6) and this one (http://goo.gl/maps/5HAlM) while doing a Google Maps search of Wichita.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: Duke87 on November 29, 2012, 11:31:36 PM
This office building in Greenwich, CT (https://maps.google.com/maps?q=blue+sky+studios&hl=en&sll=41.097303,-73.715987&sspn=0.016753,0.030727&t=h&hq=blue+sky+studios&z=15) can only be accessed through New York. The CT portion I-684 also counts, I suppose.

Similarly, this area in Stamford, CT (https://maps.google.com/maps?q=stamford,+ct&hl=en&ll=41.138654,-73.621016&spn=0.033484,0.061455&sll=40.921147,-73.613244&sspn=1.075016,1.966553&hnear=Stamford,+Fairfield,+Connecticut&t=m&z=14) can only be reached from the rest of town by driving through New York state or Greenwich. The road leading there through Greenwich (Farms Rd and Taconic Rd north of it) is actually maintained by the City of Stamford.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: vdeane on November 29, 2012, 11:36:19 PM
Quote from: deathtopumpkins on November 29, 2012, 02:16:31 PM
Quote from: 1995hoo on November 29, 2012, 12:37:11 PMAlso there's the famous Baarle-Hertog, Belgium, which consists of a bunch of exclaves that are mostly surrounded by the Netherlands and disconnected from Belgium proper, but to make it more complicated, the Netherlands then has its own exclaves within the Belgian exclaves. Screwy stuff! http://goo.gl/maps/QfBKE –Wikipedia's description might be more helpful than the map! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baarle-Hertog)

Even screwier are the en/exclaves along the Indo-Bangladeshi border: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indo-Bangladesh_enclaves
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/9a/Cooch-behar-enclaves-schematisch.png

There's even an Indian enclave within a Bangladeshi enclave within an Indian enclave within Bangladesh. Talk about trippy.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/21/Dahala_Khagrabari.png
I've read that they were working to get rid of those, and Google doesn't show them.  Does that mean they're gone, or is Google being lazy?
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: NE2 on November 29, 2012, 11:37:35 PM
There's a big difference between lacking direct road access and lacking a land connection entirely (e.g. the Kentucky Bend).
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: mgk920 on November 30, 2012, 11:55:29 AM
One must leave the City of Chicago when traveling between ORD (which is in the City of Chicago) and the rest of the City of Chicago.  The ORD grounds are connected to the rest of the city via a narrow, half-block wide corridor that runs about halfway between I-190 and Irving Park Rd (IL 19).

Enclaves and exclaves are very common in states where annexation is possible, including here in Wisconsin.  Appleton has several such exclaves, including some that are completely separate from the rest of the city, while surrounding about 15 non-city enclaves, including a couple of fairly sizable ones, one of which includes an exclave of another incorporated city (a small piece of the City of Menasha, WI).

:spin:

Mike
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: Alps on November 30, 2012, 05:47:34 PM
There's a spot in Bergen County, NJ where one of the townships is in three pieces thanks to others incorporating pieces of it. South Hackensack.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: flowmotion on December 01, 2012, 03:43:00 AM
Quote from: TheStranger on November 29, 2012, 11:56:46 AM
Here's something that fascinated me today while looking at a map of Pittsburgh:

https://maps.google.com/maps?q=Pittsburgh,+PA&hl=en&ll=40.475289,-79.94545&spn=0.099633,0.152092&sll=40.471633,-79.871292&sspn=0.099638,0.152092&hnear=Pittsburgh,+Allegheny,+Pennsylvania&t=m&z=13

Does anyone know the story behind this? It appears that Pittsburgh was allowed to annex this land; there must have been some political deal.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: txstateends on December 01, 2012, 11:30:45 AM
Maybe this counts (?).  Carter Lake, IA is currently on the west shore of the Missouri River, "away" from the rest of Iowa.  This is due to an 1877 flood, which redirected the river from west of the area to east of the area.  Carter Lake was allowed to remain part of Iowa after 2 Supreme Court decisions in 1892 and 1972.  Even though no part of the town is currently on the east side of the Missouri River, anyone on the Iowa side wanting to go there has to make their way to I-480 and cross over from Council Bluffs to Omaha, then go north from I-480 up side streets to get to Carter Lake--no bridge exists directly across from the rest of Iowa.

There are other geographic settings that have been displaced in this way along rivers before, but I think this is the only US city to be shifted like that.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: kphoger on December 01, 2012, 01:14:53 PM
Quote from: txstateends on December 01, 2012, 11:30:45 AM
There are other geographic settings that have been displaced in this way along rivers before, but I think this is the only US city to be shifted like that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaskaskia,_Illinois (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaskaskia,_Illinois)
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: Mr_Northside on December 01, 2012, 01:43:16 PM
Quote from: flowmotion on December 01, 2012, 03:43:00 AM
Quote from: TheStranger on November 29, 2012, 11:56:46 AM
Here's something that fascinated me today while looking at a map of Pittsburgh:

https://maps.google.com/maps?q=Pittsburgh,+PA&hl=en&ll=40.475289,-79.94545&spn=0.099633,0.152092&sll=40.471633,-79.871292&sspn=0.099638,0.152092&hnear=Pittsburgh,+Allegheny,+Pennsylvania&t=m&z=13

Does anyone know the story behind this? It appears that Pittsburgh was allowed to annex this land; there must have been some political deal.

I'm not entirely sure, but I think it *might* have something to do with the the water supply area next to Rt. 28.  I think it might be owned/ran by the Pittsburgh Water & Sewer authority.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: The Great Zo on December 01, 2012, 02:52:00 PM
Point Roberts, Washington (http://goo.gl/maps/JPPdV) is inaccessible without going through Canada. That's pseudo-municipal (technically unincorporated) and international.

The Twelve Mile Circle (http://www.howderfamily.com/blog/) blog covers all kinds of stuff like this. There was a good article about the Strip Annexation (http://www.howderfamily.com/blog/strip-annexation-arizona/) issues in Arizona (Buckeye, Gilbert).
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: Doctor Whom on December 04, 2012, 05:23:53 PM
Quote from: CentralCAroadgeek on November 29, 2012, 09:45:11 PMIt's located in unincorporated San Mateo County, but it's owned by the City and County of San Francisco.
Title is not jurisdiction.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: cpzilliacus on December 04, 2012, 06:40:37 PM
Quote from: Doctor Whom on December 04, 2012, 05:23:53 PM
Quote from: CentralCAroadgeek on November 29, 2012, 09:45:11 PMIt's located in unincorporated San Mateo County, but it's owned by the City and County of San Francisco.
Title is not jurisdiction.

Agreed.  As large as the land area of the City of Los Angeles is, consider how much more massive it would be if its watershed properties in Inyo County were part of the city.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: The High Plains Traveler on December 04, 2012, 06:54:21 PM
Crystal MN, a suburb of Minneapolis, has an exclave within the adjoining city of New Hope.

Expanding this to a county, the city of Glendale CO is completely surrounded by the city and county of Denver. Since those are coextensive, Glendale is an exclave of Arapahoe County.
Title: Re: Municipal exclaves
Post by: DandyDan on December 06, 2012, 06:05:51 AM
Quote from: txstateends on December 01, 2012, 11:30:45 AM
Maybe this counts (?).  Carter Lake, IA is currently on the west shore of the Missouri River, "away" from the rest of Iowa.  This is due to an 1877 flood, which redirected the river from west of the area to east of the area.  Carter Lake was allowed to remain part of Iowa after 2 Supreme Court decisions in 1892 and 1972.  Even though no part of the town is currently on the east side of the Missouri River, anyone on the Iowa side wanting to go there has to make their way to I-480 and cross over from Council Bluffs to Omaha, then go north from I-480 up side streets to get to Carter Lake--no bridge exists directly across from the rest of Iowa.

There are other geographic settings that have been displaced in this way along rivers before, but I think this is the only US city to be shifted like that.

I don't think it counts, although functionally, Carter Lake is an exclave of Iowa.  I read somewhere that what is now Carter Lake was technically part of Council Bluffs once, probably before the Supreme Court made its decision.

Actually, if you want to take the shortest route from Council Bluffs to downtown Carter Lake, you have to go through Carter Lake twice.  Abbott Drive, which is basically the road from downtown Omaha to Eppley Airfield, goes through Carter Lake on the way there, but Abbott Drive in Carter Lake doesn't connect to any other street in Carter Lake.  I believe they have a restaurant, a hotel, and a piece of public art which connects to the Carter Lake portion of Abbott Drive (which is Iowa Highway 165, Iowa's shortest state highway).  You have to reenter Omaha and then turn left (west) at either Avenue H or Locust Street to get to the main portion of Carter Lake.  One other thing I don't think people in Omaha knew in general, unless they went to the Anchor Inn, is that Freedom Park Drive used to go through Carter Lake and wasn't connected to either Abbott Drive or the Locust Street-Avenue H combo, but then last year's Missouri River flood killed that road for good.  Freedom Park Drive is closed the moment it enters Carter Lake now.  Carter Lake is just plain weird.