I was driving along Utah SR-12 today and discovered the section where the highway runs along a narrow (and high) ridge between two deep canyons. The road is narrow and completely lacks guiderail. The lack of guiderail is typical for the western US, but it can still make for a harrowing driving experience.
Here is the google maps view of SR-12
http://goo.gl/maps/F2D1c (http://goo.gl/maps/F2D1c)
Any others?
That looks safe. :-o
UT 12 is a fantastic road to drive. Going northbound along the knife-edge ridge, there's an upward grade where the driver's POV has nothing but road and sky. It's like the incline of a roller coaster, and for a moment you have doubts that there's anything on the other side.
We drove the road in dry conditions (snow would be completely different) and we all lived.
Trivia: Boulder was the last city in the US to stop receiving mail exclusively by horse. (This was 1941.)
Reminds me of part of HI 378, although I can't pinpoint where it does that on both sides.
http://goo.gl/maps/KK4E5 Don't look down!
Quote from: kurumi on March 24, 2013, 12:01:34 PM
UT 12 is a fantastic road to drive. Going northbound along the knife-edge ridge, there's an upward grade where the driver's POV has nothing but road and sky. It's like the incline of a roller coaster, and for a moment you have doubts that there's anything on the other side.
We drove the road in dry conditions (snow would be completely different) and we all lived.
Trivia: Boulder was the last city in the US to stop receiving mail exclusively by horse. (This was 1941.)
I drove over this at dusk last night. I was happy it wasn't windy, and crawled across the divide. I have a fair amount of mountain driving experience but I think this was the most white knuckled I have been while driving in a while. I submitted over Boulder Mountain (El. 9800 ft) in the pitch dark. It is eerie being on a mountain like that at night. By moonlight you can see the valley below and there isn't a single light shinning at night. I just about jumped for joy when I finally saw the lights of the village of Torrey across the Valley floor. I literally jumped when the gas station pump didn't ask for my zip code when I inserted my credit card to buy gas. The gas bar was closed, and generally my Canadian credit card is useless for pay at the pump transactions. I didn't have enough gas to make it to the hotel I had booked for the night.
Reminds me a bit of the Sunrise Park Road in Mt. Rainier National Park. Wide enough lanes, but steep drop from the edge of the pavement with no guard rail. Safe enough, really -- how often to you run into the guard rail when there is a guard rail? -- but a little disconcerting.
http://goo.gl/maps/ASLgV (http://goo.gl/maps/ASLgV)
I-68 at night in the mountains of West Virginia and Maryland, especially when a cloud deck is low enough to cause dense fog at the higher elevations, but everything is clear at slightly lower levels.
Quote from: cpzilliacus on March 24, 2013, 08:25:04 PM
I-68 at night in the mountains of West Virginia and Maryland, especially when a cloud deck is low enough to cause dense fog at the higher elevations, but everything is clear at slightly lower levels.
Not just at night. I was on I-68 at around 8-9 a.m. once, with the sun still low on the horizon. Brilliant sunlight through heavy fog meant not being able to see more than 20 feet ahead, while squinting or using sunglasses due to the brightness.
The most difficult road I've ever driven is the summer-only Canol Road (YT 6), from the Alaska Highway in southern Yukon to the YT/NT border. About 280 miles of unpaved, narrow, pothole-strewn "highway", whose minimal maintenance is limited to occasional re-grading of the very worst sections, sticking orange flags in the potholes most likely to destroy wheels and suspensions, and also marking soft shoulders with more orange flags.
Since its AADT is in the dozens, the Canol Road isn't a high maintenance priority to the Yukon government. It was built during World War II for a pipeline serving oil wells in the Northwest Territories, but the pipeline is no longer in use.
I'm working on a photo collection to show how awful the road is, which I'll post in the forum when done.
The road to Cape Enrage, NB, is pretty bad, a lot of steep curves and high cliffs.
Having driven UT-12, I wholheartedly agree that it's a beautiful drive. Interestingly enough, even though I was fairly young in my driving years, I don't remember it being all that harrowing.
Quote from: oscar on March 24, 2013, 10:49:17 PM
The most difficult road I've ever driven is the summer-only Canol Road (YT 6), from the Alaska Highway in southern Yukon to the YT/NT border. About 280 miles of unpaved, narrow, pothole-strewn "highway", whose minimal maintenance is limited to occasional re-grading of the very worst sections, sticking orange flags in the potholes most likely to destroy wheels and suspensions, and also marking soft shoulders with more orange flags.
Since its AADT is in the dozens, the Canol Road isn't a high maintenance priority to the Yukon government. It was built during World War II for a pipeline serving oil wells in the Northwest Territories, but the pipeline is no longer in use.
I'm working on a photo collection to show how awful the road is, which I'll post in the forum when done.
CA-173 and AZ-88 are very narrow dirt roads. AZ-88 has proper guardrails along the cliff wall, but has much more traffic. I've always wondered what happens when two cars meet head-on. one might have to back up as much as a mile and a half to a point where they can pass. CA-173 is so rutted that I had to ride with one set of wheels on the high center, and one set of wheels about 6 inches from the cliff edge.
I've driven lots of random two-track roads in places like Iceland, but none of them were highways in the sense that they were a primary through route.
Interstate 405 gets an honorable mention for the northbound section between I-10 and US-101. the innermost lane is maybe 9.5 feet wide, and is filled with drainage debris, and who knows what else. the traffic is maniacal.
similarly, the Grapevine (I-5) during inclement weather. SoCal drivers will not slow down for rain, even when they see, every mile or so, a police car parked by the side of the road, a huge break in the fence, and a CHP officer looking over the side.
Quote from: oscar on March 24, 2013, 10:49:17 PM
The most difficult road I've ever driven is the summer-only Canol Road (YT 6), from the Alaska Highway in southern Yukon to the YT/NT border. About 280 miles of unpaved, narrow, pothole-strewn "highway", whose minimal maintenance is limited to occasional re-grading of the very worst sections, sticking orange flags in the potholes most likely to destroy wheels and suspensions, and also marking soft shoulders with more orange flags.
Since its AADT is in the dozens, the Canol Road isn't a high maintenance priority to the Yukon government. It was built during World War II for a pipeline serving oil wells in the Northwest Territories, but the pipeline is no longer in use.
I'm working on a photo collection to show how awful the road is, which I'll post in the forum when done.
what vehicle did you use to drive that? if you tell me a Corolla or something, I will build a shrine to you in my backyard.
Before TN 128 near Savannah was aligned to it's current position in 2001, it used to be along winding roads leading directly into the city. My father, who lived in Savannah, knew the course of the road (or so he tells us) and whipped around the tight curves at 50 miles per hour. Mom and I made no comments, until we looked at an open spot in the wooded area and saw the Tennessee River lying right next to the road with no guardrails whatsoever. This is when Mom demanded that Dad slow down. He actually complied and went to a more manageable 35 mph. The road exists (as Clifton Road), but TN 128 is on safer terrain and was placed five miles east of the city. I couldn't get a street view, but this (https://maps.google.com/?ll=35.301003,-88.182138&spn=0.005026,0.009645&t=h&z=17) is the area where it was located.
Quote from: agentsteel53 on March 25, 2013, 12:17:44 PM
Quote from: oscar on March 24, 2013, 10:49:17 PM
The most difficult road I've ever driven is the summer-only Canol Road (YT 6), from the Alaska Highway in southern Yukon to the YT/NT border. About 280 miles of unpaved, narrow, pothole-strewn "highway", whose minimal maintenance is limited to occasional re-grading of the very worst sections, sticking orange flags in the potholes most likely to destroy wheels and suspensions, and also marking soft shoulders with more orange flags.
Since its AADT is in the dozens, the Canol Road isn't a high maintenance priority to the Yukon government. It was built during World War II for a pipeline serving oil wells in the Northwest Territories, but the pipeline is no longer in use.
I'm working on a photo collection to show how awful the road is, which I'll post in the forum when done.
what vehicle did you use to drive that? if you tell me a Corolla or something, I will build a shrine to you in my backyard.
Same Nissan Titan pickup truck I used to do the Dalton and Dempster.
My instinct would be that the road would chew up and spit out an ordinary passenger car. All the few other cars I saw on the road (except a few km around Ross River village, near the all-season Campbell Highway and the only community on Canol Road) were SUVs or pickups. But near the north end are two places with the remains of several old passenger cars and other equipment used in the pipeline project (kept around by the Yukon government as historical relics). Maybe the road was actually maintained back in the 1940s, and those cars wouldn't have made it that far on the present-day road.
Quote from: agentsteel53 on March 25, 2013, 12:11:52 PM
CA-173 and AZ-88 are very narrow dirt roads. AZ-88 has proper guardrails along the cliff wall, but has much more traffic. I've always wondered what happens when two cars meet head-on. one might have to back up as much as a mile and a half to a point where they can pass. CA-173 is so rutted that I had to ride with one set of wheels on the high center, and one set of wheels about 6 inches from the cliff edge.
You'll probably be happy to know that CA 173's been permanently closed to vehicles then: http://sv08data.dot.ca.gov/memos/files/comalert/021511.pdf
The most 'white knuckled' that I ever remember being on a road in clear, dry weather was northbound on the narrow-median section of the Taconic Parkway at night during a roadtrip about 12 or so years ago. Very little room, totally dark and maniacal soove drivers all around.
Mike
Not the worst road I have driven, but an Honorable Mention goes to the road from Redway to Shelter Cove, CA. Many have never seen this beautiful, unspoiled part of California.
Quote from: deathtopumpkins on March 26, 2013, 12:30:42 AM
Quote from: agentsteel53 on March 25, 2013, 12:11:52 PM
CA-173 and AZ-88 are very narrow dirt roads. AZ-88 has proper guardrails along the cliff wall, but has much more traffic. I've always wondered what happens when two cars meet head-on. one might have to back up as much as a mile and a half to a point where they can pass. CA-173 is so rutted that I had to ride with one set of wheels on the high center, and one set of wheels about 6 inches from the cliff edge.
You'll probably be happy to know that CA 173's been permanently closed to vehicles then: http://sv08data.dot.ca.gov/memos/files/comalert/021511.pdf
Are there any plans (or, perhaps more to the point, funding) to pave Ca. 173 and re-open it?
One that I've driven is the US 6/202 eastern approach to the Bear Mountain Bridge west of Peekskill, NY. Starts out as a steep climb in a wooded area, then it's a bunch of twist and turns along the eastern Palisades until you finally get to the bridge. Surprised the Merritt Parkway hasn't made this list yet.
Quote from: djsinco on March 26, 2013, 02:48:26 AM
Not the worst road I have driven, but an Honorable Mention goes to the road from Redway to Shelter Cove, CA. Many have never seen this beautiful, unspoiled part of California.
definitely a great road. there are a lot of awesome winding roads in that corner of the world. if you go the other way from Garberville, and head to Zenia, you will have some similar one-lane winding roads, and in downtown Zenia there is a set of 1929 white guide signs!
Quote from: jp the roadgeek on March 26, 2013, 07:41:47 AM
One that I've driven is the US 6/202 eastern approach to the Bear Mountain Bridge west of Peekskill, NY. Starts out as a steep climb in a wooded area, then it's a bunch of twist and turns along the eastern Palisades until you finally get to the bridge. Surprised the Merritt Parkway hasn't made this list yet.
I drove that going eastbound on US 6 in the dark a few years ago. Definitely interesting.
Creel to Batopilas, Chihuahua (http://goo.gl/maps/Ajt5S), in the winter of 2001/2. My dad and I did this road by bus.
At Creel, the bus was actually a Suburban, and they strapped everyone's luggage to the roof; the first part was a two-lane paved state highway, but we saw some piles of rubble from landslides. At one point, the Suburban stopped, they had everyone get out and take their luggage off the top, and the vehicle drove away. We all went inside for some homemade blue corn tortillas etc. for breakfast, and my dad and I really hoped another bus would come.
It did, and we reloaded. That bus was a decades-old one recycled from the USA. Some miles down the road, we stopped at a crossroads, and took the gravel road from there to Batopilas. The bus was full, so some guys rode on top with the luggage. It was a mountain road with barely enough room for two vehicles to pass; at some points, the driver slowed to a crawl and let one set of tires ride the loose gravel at the edge of the dropoff (no guardrails) so an oncoming vehicle could squeeze by on the inside.
Halfway down that road, we came upon an ancient International Scout that had broken down. Our driver hooked it to the bus's rear bumper with a chain, and the owner and his son rode in the Scout. On uphills, we towed it; on downhills, it coasted behind us as the chain fell off; at the bottom of hills, the driver had to stop and reattach the chain. Repeat. Eventually we reached the owner's house and dropped the Scout off.
The gravel road is a sinuous maze of switchbacks and mountainsides, with an occasional one-lane wood-decked bridge. It's not for the queasy traveler, and in fact I helped one local mother throw a baggie of her daughter's vomit out the window. All in all, the 85-mile trip took 5½ hours. A week later, on New Year's Day, we went back north again, starting before dawn. The driver was truly a master of the road, and instilled great confidence.
I really wish I had pictures, but I had left our camera on the bus seat back in Chihuahua City. If I ever do this again, I would love to be one of the guys on the roof.
Mount Evans was way worse than driving up UT-12, Trail Ridge Road also, and then Fall River Road in RMNP, Texas 170 also. UT-12 is not in my top 5 scary roads.
The Cross-Bronx Expressway, when traffic was at a halt. The local entrepreneurs would descend to the depressed roadway, and all manner of products would be offered for sale. Some obviously stolen, some illegal, but always harrowing.
Quote from: AsphaltPlanet on March 24, 2013, 01:50:03 AM
I was driving along Utah SR-12 today and discovered the section where the highway runs along a narrow (and high) ridge between two deep canyons. The road is narrow and completely lacks guiderail. The lack of guiderail is typical for the western US, but it can still make for a harrowing driving experience.
Here is the google maps view of SR-12
http://goo.gl/maps/F2D1c (http://goo.gl/maps/F2D1c)
Any others?
Awesome! Did this one on a motorcycle. It was daylight and good weather. What a view. I love it out there.
Quote from: texaskdog on March 26, 2013, 12:15:10 PM
Mount Evans was way worse than driving up UT-12, Trail Ridge Road also, and then Fall River Road in RMNP, Texas 170 also. UT-12 is not in my top 5 scary roads.
Rode all above except Fall River Road which sounds like a real challenge even in a 4x4, on my heavy,cruiser style motorcycle. Evans, 14,265 ft, was a challenge as the turns were so sharpe I wasn't sure I could go fast enough to keep the bike up. In all it was enjoyable. I could not get over the number of bicycles on the road plus a jogger. Did Texas 170, AKA River Road, from Study Butte/Terlingua to Candelaria and back in the fall on motorcycle. Except for the heat I didn't find it bad. The far western part was boring.
Quote from: djsinco on March 26, 2013, 01:02:38 PM
The Cross-Bronx Expressway, when traffic was at a halt. The local entrepreneurs would descend to the depressed roadway, and all manner of products would be offered for sale Some obviously stolen, some illegal, but always harrowing.
Now that is harrowing!!!
I think I'd rather take my chances at night on any of the above roads, maybe even in snow.
Still waiting for a mention of the Moki Dugway.
Camino del Muerte (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yungas_Road) in Bolivia
Quote from: national highway 1 on March 26, 2013, 07:21:12 PM
Camino del Muerte (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yungas_Road) in Bolivia
You've been on that?? :crazy:
Quote from: hbelkins on March 26, 2013, 03:29:53 PM
Still waiting for a mention of the Moki Dugway.
Not really "harrowing". Especially compared to the Camino del Muerte, which will be very hard to top.
I was hoping this thread would be about harrowing highways we'd actually been on (for the record, mine was a state highway, even though it was gravel).
EDIT: Well, actually, it does not appear on the SCT list of state highways (http://dgst.sct.gob.mx/fileadmin/Viales_2011/08_CHIHUAHUA.pdf). I'm certain that I saw some mileposts with Chihuahua state shields on them. At one point, I could even have told you what number was on the shields.
Define harrowing? Harrowing can be driving through the Loop at rush hour with pedestrians, bicycles, taxis, and buses everywhere and all within mere inches (or less) of you. In many ways, I'd rather be on a mountain road like KP's than be in the Loop during rush hour.
Quote from: cpzilliacus on March 26, 2013, 04:59:24 AM
Quote from: deathtopumpkins on March 26, 2013, 12:30:42 AM
Quote from: agentsteel53 on March 25, 2013, 12:11:52 PM
CA-173 and AZ-88 are very narrow dirt roads. AZ-88 has proper guardrails along the cliff wall, but has much more traffic. I've always wondered what happens when two cars meet head-on. one might have to back up as much as a mile and a half to a point where they can pass. CA-173 is so rutted that I had to ride with one set of wheels on the high center, and one set of wheels about 6 inches from the cliff edge.
You'll probably be happy to know that CA 173's been permanently closed to vehicles then: http://sv08data.dot.ca.gov/memos/files/comalert/021511.pdf
Are there any plans (or, perhaps more to the point, funding) to pave Ca. 173 and re-open it?
Not that I know of. That document says the closure is permanent, and I don't really see the need for it anyway, since traffic heading west from Lake Arrowhead would probably continue using CA 18 and CA 138 rather than CA 173 even if it were paved.
Quote from: djsinco on March 26, 2013, 01:02:38 PM
The Cross-Bronx Expressway, when traffic was at a halt. The local entrepreneurs would descend to the depressed roadway, and all manner of products would be offered for sale Some obviously stolen, some illegal, but always harrowing.
I dunno, I find that a lot of the NYC-area highways are most harrowing when they're moving at full speed.
FDR Drive is more fun than harrowing, but Grand Central Parkway fits the adjective when it's moving. I think it's my preference for Manhattan vs. outer borough driving.
Quote from: hbelkins on March 26, 2013, 03:29:53 PM
Still waiting for a mention of the Moki Dugway.
I thought it was mentioned, guess not. That is a good one. Last June I did it on my cruiser motorcycle, southbound=down hill. Not too bad, just used lower gears. I even stopped to take a picture. Awesome view. Can't wait to go north bound.
(//)
Moki scared my fiancee, worse than trail ridge road but not as bad as mount evans or fall river. I did fall river in a rental car but one time I did have to back up to retake a switchback. It is one way which helps.
I never thought of Trail Ridge Road as being all that bad, though it may be different to people who are not acclimated to the elevation. a similar one is US-212 through Beartooth Pass: both get over 11000 feet.
how good a dirt road is Fall River? decent level grading, or Jeep trail?
speaking of Jeep trails, there's always Black Bear Road... but I've never driven it.
Never thought of Beartooth, 212, as being one but yes for someone who hasn't driven on mountain roads may have a problem. It is awesome though. First time up in 1974 in a VW, so impressed I put it on my list to do again. Finally in 2009 came down on my motorcycle. It was thrilling. Anyone who hasn't driven it should.
I remember being quite winded when I walked around to take photos on Beartooth, but the drive itself was fine. I don't think there are cliffs on either side of the road - and if they are, the twelve-foot-high snowbanks will prevent anyone from falling off.
Trail Ridge only has one tight narrow area that is not that bad, never really "scary" Fall River is not very high, just a lot of tight turns, but I did it in a rental car.
Quote from: texaskdog on March 27, 2013, 10:33:11 AMI did it in a rental car.
I assume 2wd, low clearance, like a Corolla or the like?
CA-168 has a nice stretch several miles east of Big Pine. There's a narrow one lane stretch through a ridge that is a nice place to come across an oncoming camper or trailer coming around a curve. I know the highway caught me by surprise the first time I was through there..
Quote from: agentsteel53 on March 27, 2013, 10:37:20 AM
Quote from: texaskdog on March 27, 2013, 10:33:11 AMI did it in a rental car.
I assume 2wd, low clearance, like a Corolla or the like?
I think it was a Cruze. You don't need a special vehicle at all to do this. I do remember about a third of the way through thinking it was a stupid idea though I don't think there was any great danger of not making it.
Shoot, if we're into jeep roads, then I'll throw out my Colorado ones again:
Ophir Road (http://goo.gl/maps/741O4)
(Here is Ophir Pass (http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_dPKKA5YXXsY/SmaFo7ZpMfI/AAAAAAAAYhI/ptPDz_SnUPk/s400/dsc02181.jpg))
Tomboy Road & Camp Bird Road (http://goo.gl/maps/saOyc)
(Here are Tomboy Road (http://mw2.google.com/mw-panoramio/photos/medium/78065343.jpg) and Camp Bird Road (http://www.jeep-cj.com/gallery/files/1/6/7/1/shelf_road_to_camp_bird.jpg))
Both in a rental Jeep Wrangler. Images are not mine.
Quote from: kphoger on March 27, 2013, 02:20:39 PM
Shoot, if we're into jeep roads, then I'll throw out my Colorado ones again:
Ophir Road (http://goo.gl/maps/741O4)
(Here is Ophir Pass (http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_dPKKA5YXXsY/SmaFo7ZpMfI/AAAAAAAAYhI/ptPDz_SnUPk/s400/dsc02181.jpg))
Tomboy Road & Camp Bird Road (http://goo.gl/maps/saOyc)
(Here are Tomboy Road (http://mw2.google.com/mw-panoramio/photos/medium/78065343.jpg) and Camp Bird Road (http://www.jeep-cj.com/gallery/files/1/6/7/1/shelf_road_to_camp_bird.jpg))
Both in a rental Jeep Wrangler. Images are not mine.
now that's a scary road! (Ophir Pass)
It wasn't really all that scary at all, as it was very level. I guess not encountering any oncoming vehicles helped, though.
Tomboy Road was much more harrowing, since there was more traffic. Two cars on a one-lane road passing each other with a mountain on one side and a long, steep slope on the other side can definitely be harrowing.
Quote from: Chris19001 on March 27, 2013, 01:21:25 PM
CA-168 has a nice stretch several miles east of Big Pine. There's a narrow one lane stretch through a ridge that is a nice place to come across an oncoming camper or trailer coming around a curve. I know the highway caught me by surprise the first time I was through there.
I did that stretch last month. It's striped with two lanes, wide enough so I wouldn't call it "one-lane". But all the curves make passing difficult, especially when (as I was) you're stuck behind a slow truck hauling hay.
I didn't find it too "harrowing", especially on the same trip I did the northern half of steep and unpaved Saline Valley Road in Death Valley NP, one of the more difficult roads I've ever driven. But it is true that I had the option of doing that stretch of CA 168 again a few days later, and opted instead for the gentler US 6 through the same mountain range.
I liked US-14a in the Bighorns, but don't recall it being that bad.
I just remembered this one: US-18 between Oglala and Pine Ridge, SD. one and a half lanes, some of the least smooth gravel I've ever driven on, and absolutely no markings for some sudden lane shifts preceding immediate dropoffs. it's one of those perpetual "construction" zones that doesn't actually seem to ever get built.
this has led to at least one fatal accident:
http://www.indianz.com/News/2011/000035.asp
my guess is the driver failed to see an unmarked lane shift coming and pitched into the open hole. I'm astonished this hasn't led to some major lawsuit. the accident happened November of 2010, and in July of 2011 when I drove the road, it remained completely unsigned.
Quote from: agentsteel53 on March 28, 2013, 09:18:06 AM
I just remembered this one: US-18 between Oglala and Pine Ridge, SD. one and a half lanes, some of the least smooth gravel I've ever driven on, and absolutely no markings for some sudden lane shifts preceding immediate dropoffs. it's one of those perpetual "construction" zones that doesn't actually seem to ever get built.
this has led to at least one fatal accident:
http://www.indianz.com/News/2011/000035.asp
my guess is the driver failed to see an unmarked lane shift coming and pitched into the open hole. I'm astonished this hasn't led to some major lawsuit. the accident happened November of 2010, and in July of 2011 when I drove the road, it remained completely unsigned.
Poorest county in the nation
Bronx River Parkway at night (Westchester Section). 2 lanes that are about as wide as 1 lane, no visibility and crazy s curves with 20 mph limits and stop lights. makes the Merritt look like a Texas freeway.
I'd say the road to Hana on Maui. A lot of one way bridges the locals are known to attempt to pass people on. Also on the big island of Hawaii, HI-19 north of Hilo. A lot of the road hugs coastal cliffs.
And the saddle road, which bisects the big island. A lot of rental car contracts are voided driving on it.
Quote from: OCGuy81 on April 01, 2013, 12:07:43 AM
And the saddle road, which bisects the big island. A lot of rental car contracts are voided driving on it.
Most of it has been replaced with a nice new road, 2-lane but posted at 50 or 55 mph. Another section to open later this year will bypass the dreadful westernmost 10 miles, not only with a better road but also a more direct route to Kailua-Kona.
QuoteMost of it has been replaced with a nice new road, 2-lane but posted at 50 or 55 mph. Another section to open later this year will bypass the dreadful westernmost 10 miles, not only with a better road but also a more direct route to Kailua-Kona.
Good to know! It's been a long while since I've been to the big island. I'll have to try taking 200 next time I'm there.