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National Boards => General Highway Talk => Traffic Control => Topic started by: agentsteel53 on April 25, 2013, 05:49:32 PM

Title: unusual "stop before right turn" sign
Post by: agentsteel53 on April 25, 2013, 05:49:32 PM
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.ebayimg.com%2Ft%2FVintage-porcelain-stop-sign-with-white-and-black-colors-30-x-12-inches-%2F00%2Fs%2FNTc2WDEyMzc%3D%2Fz%2FI4QAAMXQsmFReZ5%7E%2F%24%2528KGrHqV%2C%21l0FFznYis42BReZ5%2B%21rtw%7E%7E60_57.JPG&hash=c64ad1d65f9a5a5918a4e6bb953c3f4f683e56b7)

anyone know where this would have been used?  it looks like there is an excess of whitespace which implies another word would have been placed in there.  any idea what that word is?  or is it just an odd layout for a common sign?
Title: Re: unusual "stop before right turn" sign
Post by: Alps on April 25, 2013, 06:39:34 PM
Red circle in the blank space?
Title: Re: unusual "stop before right turn" sign
Post by: agentsteel53 on April 25, 2013, 06:48:14 PM
good call.  that seems likely.
Title: Re: unusual "stop before right turn" sign
Post by: Billy F 1988 on April 25, 2013, 07:15:42 PM
I had never seen this be used in Montana. Maybe this was applied in places like NYC, LA, Miami, something to that effect. I bet this was in the early days of "right on red" where drivers stopped before going there. Nowadays, it's all too common, though some prohibit right-on-reds, and some don't.
Title: Re: unusual "stop before right turn" sign
Post by: NE2 on April 25, 2013, 07:17:11 PM
Quote from: Billy F 1988 on April 25, 2013, 07:15:42 PM
I bet this was in the early days of "right on red" where drivers stopped before going there.
what
Title: Re: unusual "stop before right turn" sign
Post by: Henry on April 25, 2013, 07:54:08 PM
Quote from: Billy F 1988 on April 25, 2013, 07:15:42 PM
I had never seen this be used in Montana. Maybe this was applied in places like NYC, LA, Miami, something to that effect. I bet this was in the early days of "right on red" where drivers stopped before going there. Nowadays, it's all too common, though some prohibit right-on-reds, and some don't.
I think you're right. Although I do wonder why they couldn't just stack the words on each other like they normally would nowadays.

STOP
BEFORE TURNING
RIGHT ON RED LIGHT
Title: Re: unusual "stop before right turn" sign
Post by: agentsteel53 on April 25, 2013, 07:57:12 PM
first time I've ever seen a sign like this.  no idea where it was used, but having a red ball painted into the layout seems to make sense.
Title: Re: unusual "stop before right turn" sign
Post by: J N Winkler on April 26, 2013, 01:03:15 AM
Wasn't RTOR not introduced until the 1970's?  If so, then why does this sign have the old, unrounded BPR typefaces?
Title: Re: unusual "stop before right turn" sign
Post by: kkt on April 26, 2013, 10:19:29 AM
Quote from: J N Winkler on April 26, 2013, 01:03:15 AM
Wasn't RTOR not introduced until the 1970's?  If so, then why does this sign have the old, unrounded BPR typefaces?

I remember that being the law in California by the late 1960s.
Title: Re: unusual "stop before right turn" sign
Post by: agentsteel53 on April 26, 2013, 11:10:55 AM
Quote from: J N Winkler on April 26, 2013, 01:03:15 AM
Wasn't RTOR not introduced until the 1970's?  If so, then why does this sign have the old, unrounded BPR typefaces?

my estimate, is that the sign is 40s or so.  maybe 50s. 

I had no idea that RTOR came so late to the ballgame.
Title: Re: unusual "stop before right turn" sign
Post by: 1995hoo on April 26, 2013, 01:40:20 PM
I read somewhere that RTOR was common out West but didn't appear in the East until the oil shocks in the 1970s. For rather obvious reasons (obvious if you look below my avatar), I don't remember whether that's true.
Title: Re: unusual "stop before right turn" sign
Post by: SidS1045 on April 26, 2013, 02:13:19 PM
Quote from: Billy F 1988 on April 25, 2013, 07:15:42 PM
Maybe this was applied in places like NYC...

Not likely.  NYC has prohibited RTOR since the 1930's.
Title: Re: unusual "stop before right turn" sign
Post by: Kacie Jane on April 26, 2013, 02:58:32 PM
Quote from: SidS1045 on April 26, 2013, 02:13:19 PM
Quote from: Billy F 1988 on April 25, 2013, 07:15:42 PM
Maybe this was applied in places like NYC...

Not likely.  NYC has prohibited RTOR since the 1930's.

Unless otherwise posted.  This would be the otherwise posted.

But yeah, more likely, this was posted at the advent of RTOR being legal, to remind people that you could.

ETA: If you look on page 1 of this PDF (http://www.nyc.gov/html/dot/downloads/pdf/ssi09_projects/ssi09_rightonred.pdf), you'll see a modern-day version of this sign posted in NYC.
Title: Re: unusual "stop before right turn" sign
Post by: 1995hoo on April 26, 2013, 03:32:18 PM
Or just copy the URL from Wikipedia (the article is quite flawed, but the picture is fine):

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fcommons%2Fthumb%2F1%2F10%2FRightonred.JPG%2F220px-Rightonred.JPG&hash=9f4c6bf42d1fd46cb3e1691a31b6451327edec20)
Title: Re: unusual "stop before right turn" sign
Post by: Kacie Jane on April 26, 2013, 03:38:20 PM
Well, fine, be that way. :P

In actuality, I did a Google image search, and came across that pic.  But what I liked about the photo in the PDF is that you can see where it's posted, it's not just a closeup of the sign, so you don't have to trust the caption (or make out and recognize the "Dept of Traffic" on the bottom) to know it's a NYC sign.