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National Boards => General Highway Talk => Topic started by: Lyon Wonder on May 20, 2013, 03:15:05 AM

Title: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: Lyon Wonder on May 20, 2013, 03:15:05 AM
Though extremely rare, there have been instances where an at-grade railroad crossing was placed on a limited-access highway instead of the usual overpass or underpass. The most well-known example was the crossing for the Columbia Terminal Railroad on US-63 just north of Columbia, MO. That railroad crossing was replaced in 2011 with a brand-new overpass. 

At one point there was even a railroad crossing on an Interstate.  A segment of I-94 (then also designated US-12) built in 1959 north of Albion, MI had an at-grade crossing that included railroad crossing signals that supposedly had to activated by a train crew manually.  My guess is the track crossing I-94 was a branch line and not part of the railroad's mainline.

In any case this at-grade crossing isn't present on modern-day I-94 since the branch line was abandoned in 1968 and the crossing paved over some time afterwards. 

http://www.albionmich.com/history/histor_notebook/080727.shtml (http://www.albionmich.com/history/histor_notebook/080727.shtml)

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.albionmich.com%2Fhistory%2Fhistor_notebook%2Fimages_08%2FRailroadI-94Crossing.jpg&hash=2425445399d2248d46a174663ad48418cfd29a1c)

Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: froggie on May 20, 2013, 03:28:30 AM
I-94 wasn't the only example.  Prior to the line abandonment (also ca. 1968), the Washington and Old Dominion railway crossed then I-95 (today's I-395) at-grade in the Shirlington area of Arlington County, VA.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: cpzilliacus on May 20, 2013, 03:28:45 AM
Quote from: Lyon Wonder on May 20, 2013, 03:15:05 AM
Though extremely rare, there have been instances where an at-grade railroad crossing was placed on a limited-access highway instead of the usual overpass or underpass. The most well-known example was the crossing for the Columbia Terminal Railroad on US-63 just north of Columbia, MO. That railroad crossing was replaced in 2011 with a brand-new overpass.

In Saint-Hyacinthe, Québec, there's one on A-20 ("A" means Autoroute (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autoroutes_of_Quebec)).

It was discussed in this thread (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=8458.0).
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: roadman65 on May 20, 2013, 06:27:38 AM
Quote from: Lyon Wonder on May 20, 2013, 03:15:05 AM
Though extremely rare, there have been instances where an at-grade railroad crossing was placed on a limited-access highway instead of the usual overpass or underpass. The most well-known example was the crossing for the Columbia Terminal Railroad on US-63 just north of Columbia, MO. That railroad crossing was replaced in 2011 with a brand-new overpass. 

At one point there was even a railroad crossing on an Interstate.  A segment of I-94 (then also designated US-12) built in 1959 north of Albion, MI had an at-grade crossing that included railroad crossing signals that supposedly had to activated by a train crew manually.  My guess is the track crossing I-94 was a branch line and not part of the railroad's mainline.

In any case this at-grade crossing isn't present on modern-day I-94 since the branch line was abandoned in 1968 and the crossing paved over some time afterwards. 

http://www.albionmich.com/history/histor_notebook/080727.shtml (http://www.albionmich.com/history/histor_notebook/080727.shtml)

(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.albionmich.com%2Fhistory%2Fhistor_notebook%2Fimages_08%2FRailroadI-94Crossing.jpg&hash=2425445399d2248d46a174663ad48418cfd29a1c)


Good find!  And yes, like the previous reply, there is a thread dedicated to this and when you link on it you will find things to support your topic.  I am not saying this because it was my thread, but because you will find other replies there of similar things to your find.   Check it out!
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: 1995hoo on May 20, 2013, 07:49:18 AM
Quote from: froggie on May 20, 2013, 03:28:30 AM
I-94 wasn't the only example.  Prior to the line abandonment (also ca. 1968), the Washington and Old Dominion railway crossed then I-95 (today's I-395) at-grade in the Shirlington area of Arlington County, VA.


See this prior thread about traffic lights on Interstates. froggie commented about the same W&OD crossing and I posted a photo of it. The road looks very different now, but the buildings are still there with fewer trees. (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=5177.msg114549#msg114549)
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: Brian556 on May 20, 2013, 09:56:44 AM
There was one on I-35 somewhere in Central Texas. An overpass was not built because the line was to be abandoned soon after the highway was built.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: sp_redelectric on May 20, 2013, 10:27:11 AM
Not an interstate but a freeway section of Oregon 22, there is an at-grade railroad crossing at Exit 9 (Aumsville) that involves a crossing over the mainline lanes in each direction, plus the westbound on-ramp.  (The eastbound off-ramp starts after the railroad crossing.)

This is the Willamette Valley Railroad between Woodburn and Stayton and is operated daily (one train in each direction) with no plans to abandon it...however it isn't exactly a busy railroad, either.

http://maps.google.com/maps?q=Aumsville,+OR&hl=en&ll=44.854397,-122.868658&spn=0.00377,0.004013&sll=37.6,-95.665&sspn=48.142505,65.742188&hnear=Aumsville,+Marion,+Oregon&t=h&z=18
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: vdeane on May 20, 2013, 12:31:34 PM
I-87 had one on the northway.  Future I-790 in Rome has one (though it has to be removed before I-790 can be moved) on the NY 49 freeway.  The freeway part of NY 840 has one as well.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: lepidopteran on May 20, 2013, 12:31:45 PM
I notice that the grade-crossing pictured has "1 track" below the crossbuck.  Typically, that plaque is only present for 2 or more tracks,  and the MUTCD only says it's needed for 2+ tracks.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: lepidopteran on May 20, 2013, 12:40:30 PM
I remember a grade-crossing on the US-23 freeway in Michigan, in the Ida area about 10 miles north of the Ohio border.  It had regular traffic signals on a span-wire.  The crossing was paved over by the late 1970s.

There's also one on US-322 in Hummelstown, PA, between Harrisburg and Hershey.  It had an "Exempt" plaque last time I went through there a few years ago.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: deathtopumpkins on May 20, 2013, 01:55:38 PM
Quote from: lepidopteran on May 20, 2013, 12:31:45 PM
I notice that the grade-crossing pictured has "1 track" below the crossbuck.  Typically, that plaque is only present for 2 or more tracks,  and the MUTCD only says it's needed for 2+ tracks.

Maybe there used to be 2 tracks and rather than remove the sign when one track was taken out of service, they just replaced the number?




Also, not an interstate, but there's the classic example of the Atlantic City Connector: http://goo.gl/maps/ojpSq
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: roadman on May 20, 2013, 02:29:38 PM
Quote from: lepidopteran on May 20, 2013, 12:31:45 PM
I notice that the grade-crossing pictured has "1 track" below the crossbuck.  Typically, that plaque is only present for 2 or more tracks,  and the MUTCD only says it's needed for 2+ tracks.

Grade crossing signals and related traffic control devices weren't added to the MUTCD until the 1971 edition (prior to 1971, the Assoication of American Railroads (AAR) maintained "recommended" specifications for railroads to use).  The "Stop on Red Signal" plates, plus the white on black crossbucks, place these signals as being installed prior to 1971.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: Big John on May 20, 2013, 03:01:54 PM
Quote from: lepidopteran on May 20, 2013, 12:31:45 PM
I notice that the grade-crossing pictured has "1 track" below the crossbuck.  Typically, that plaque is only present for 2 or more tracks,  and the MUTCD only says it's needed for 2+ tracks.

I noticed such signs in Charlotte NC and the terrain did not look like it held multiple tracks. http://goo.gl/maps/GUchc
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: cpzilliacus on May 20, 2013, 04:23:12 PM
Quote from: 1995hoo on May 20, 2013, 07:49:18 AM
Quote from: froggie on May 20, 2013, 03:28:30 AM
I-94 wasn't the only example.  Prior to the line abandonment (also ca. 1968), the Washington and Old Dominion railway crossed then I-95 (today's I-395) at-grade in the Shirlington area of Arlington County, VA.


See this prior thread about traffic lights on Interstates. froggie commented about the same W&OD crossing and I posted a photo of it. The road looks very different now, but the buildings are still there with fewer trees. (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=5177.msg114549#msg114549)

At the point that the W&OD still operated, I am not sure if Shirley Highway was signed as I-95. 

I think it might still have  been Va. 350 back then.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: NE2 on May 20, 2013, 05:45:05 PM
Quote from: cpzilliacus on May 20, 2013, 04:23:12 PM
At the point that the W&OD still operated, I am not sure if Shirley Highway was signed as I-95. 

I think it might still have  been Va. 350 back then.
http://www.vahighways.com/route-log/va341-360.htm#va350
"In Dec 1964 (CTB), VA 350 from VA 7 north to US 1 was renumbered as part of I-95."
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: 1995hoo on May 20, 2013, 05:51:39 PM
Quote from: cpzilliacus on May 20, 2013, 04:23:12 PM
Quote from: 1995hoo on May 20, 2013, 07:49:18 AM
Quote from: froggie on May 20, 2013, 03:28:30 AM
I-94 wasn't the only example.  Prior to the line abandonment (also ca. 1968), the Washington and Old Dominion railway crossed then I-95 (today's I-395) at-grade in the Shirlington area of Arlington County, VA.


See this prior thread about traffic lights on Interstates. froggie commented about the same W&OD crossing and I posted a photo of it. The road looks very different now, but the buildings are still there with fewer trees. (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=5177.msg114549#msg114549)

At the point that the W&OD still operated, I am not sure if Shirley Highway was signed as I-95. 

I think it might still have  been Va. 350 back then.

I don't remember because I was not born yet (I hit 40 next week). NE2's citation is as good as any I've seen, though I suppose "renumbered" isn't necessarily the same as having signs posted in a prompt fashion.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: JREwing78 on May 20, 2013, 10:10:26 PM
Quote from: Lyon Wonder on May 20, 2013, 03:15:05 AM
At one point there was even a railroad crossing on an Interstate.  A segment of I-94 (then also designated US-12) built in 1959 north of Albion, MI had an at-grade crossing that included railroad crossing signals that supposedly had to activated by a train crew manually.  My guess is the track crossing I-94 was a branch line and not part of the railroad's mainline.

Nice find! I lived in the area most of my life and have driven through here countless times. I never knew such a crossing existed.

I can name at least two such crossings in Wisconsin:
US-151 on the east side of Waupun
US-141 north of Lena, and again north of Pound
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: Big John on May 20, 2013, 10:56:04 PM
Quote from: JREwing78 on May 20, 2013, 10:10:26 PM
Quote from: Lyon Wonder on May 20, 2013, 03:15:05 AM
At one point there was even a railroad crossing on an Interstate.  A segment of I-94 (then also designated US-12) built in 1959 north of Albion, MI had an at-grade crossing that included railroad crossing signals that supposedly had to activated by a train crew manually.  My guess is the track crossing I-94 was a branch line and not part of the railroad's mainline.

Nice find! I lived in the area most of my life and have driven through here countless times. I never knew such a crossing existed.

I can name at least two such crossings in Wisconsin:
US-151 on the east side of Waupun
US-141 north of Lena, and again north of Pound
add US 151 around Beaver Dam.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: lordsutch on May 21, 2013, 01:32:35 AM
There used to be one on the MS 6 (now US 278) Oxford bypass on the abandoned ICRR line to Water Valley, but the railroad's been abandoned since.  Technically this is legally designated as a future Interstate, although I don't think the future Interstate designation was in effect while the railroad was operational.

Besides, the chances of it ever becoming an Interstate are about zero, since I'm fairly sure it was a drafting error by a congressional staffer rather than anything anyone seriously pursued.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: Mapmikey on May 21, 2013, 06:52:22 AM
Quote
At the point that the W&OD still operated, I am not sure if Shirley Highway was signed as I-95. 

I think it might still have  been Va. 350 back then.
I don't remember because I was not born yet (I hit 40 next week). NE2's citation is as good as any I've seen, though I suppose "renumbered" isn't necessarily the same as having signs posted in a prompt fashion.

The full reference for changing to VA 350 to I-95 in this area did not mention the rail crossing.  The renumbering was done in conjunction with VDOT taking over the entirety of the Pentagon Road Network established in the 1940s.

To read about the changeover, it is on page 21 of the pdf at http://www.virginiadot.org/meetings/minutes_pdf/CTB-12-1964-01.pdf (http://www.virginiadot.org/meetings/minutes_pdf/CTB-12-1964-01.pdf)


Mapmikey
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: Anthony_JK on May 21, 2013, 07:37:31 AM
Quote from: lordsutch on May 21, 2013, 01:32:35 AM
There used to be one on the MS 6 (now US 278) Oxford bypass on the abandoned ICRR line to Water Valley, but the railroad's been abandoned since.  Technically this is legally designated as a future Interstate, although I don't think the future Interstate designation was in effect while the railroad was operational.

Besides, the chances of it ever becoming an Interstate are about zero, since I'm fairly sure it was a drafting error by a congressional staffer rather than anything anyone seriously pursued.

Perhaps part of a proposed I-14 or I-16, maybe??
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: hbelkins on May 21, 2013, 09:00:06 AM
Funny how these threads go off the original intent, which was about interstates. But if we're talking non-interstate freeways, US 22 at Lewistown, Pa. has one.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: rte66man on May 21, 2013, 10:00:24 AM
Quote from: Lyon Wonder on May 20, 2013, 03:15:05 AM
Though extremely rare, there have been instances where an at-grade railroad crossing was placed on a limited-access highway instead of the usual overpass or underpass. The most well-known example was the crossing for the Columbia Terminal Railroad on US-63 just north of Columbia, MO. That railroad crossing was replaced in 2011 with a brand-new overpass. 

At one point there was even a railroad crossing on an Interstate.  A segment of I-94 (then also designated US-12) built in 1959 north of Albion, MI had an at-grade crossing that included railroad crossing signals that supposedly had to activated by a train crew manually.  My guess is the track crossing I-94 was a branch line and not part of the railroad's mainline.

In any case this at-grade crossing isn't present on modern-day I-94 since the branch line was abandoned in 1968 and the crossing paved over some time afterwards. 


Up to about 1980, there was an at-grade crossing of I-44 in west Tulsa where the old Tulsa-Sapulpa line crossed.  When the I244/I44 interchange t Southwest Blvd was rebuilt, they added an overpass:
http://goo.gl/maps/6dafK

rte66man
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: aridawn on May 31, 2013, 12:19:39 AM
Quote from: rte66man on May 21, 2013, 10:00:24 AM
Quote from: Lyon Wonder on May 20, 2013, 03:15:05 AM
Though extremely rare, there have been instances where an at-grade railroad crossing was placed on a limited-access highway instead of the usual overpass or underpass. The most well-known example was the crossing for the Columbia Terminal Railroad on US-63 just north of Columbia, MO. That railroad crossing was replaced in 2011 with a brand-new overpass. 

At one point there was even a railroad crossing on an Interstate.  A segment of I-94 (then also designated US-12) built in 1959 north of Albion, MI had an at-grade crossing that included railroad crossing signals that supposedly had to activated by a train crew manually.  My guess is the track crossing I-94 was a branch line and not part of the railroad's mainline.

In any case this at-grade crossing isn't present on modern-day I-94 since the branch line was abandoned in 1968 and the crossing paved over some time afterwards. 


Up to about 1980, there was an at-grade crossing of I-44 in west Tulsa where the old Tulsa-Sapulpa line crossed.  When the I244/I44 interchange t Southwest Blvd was rebuilt, they added an overpass:
http://goo.gl/maps/6dafK

rte66man

There is Two that I remember.  One was across ON-401 between Pickering and Whitby.http://maps.google.ca/maps?hl=en&ll=43.826048,-79.096665&spn=0.002961,0.006233&t=h&z=18 (http://maps.google.ca/maps?hl=en&ll=43.826048,-79.096665&spn=0.002961,0.006233&t=h&z=18) Another one I remember was on ON-401 as well in Bowmanville.http://maps.google.ca/maps?hl=en&ll=43.896145,-78.682451&spn=0.002957,0.006233&t=h&z=18 (http://maps.google.ca/maps?hl=en&ll=43.896145,-78.682451&spn=0.002957,0.006233&t=h&z=18)  These were both removed and replaced in the early 1980's.  The Overpass in Bowmanville was later removed in 2009/10 construction season. 
There still is another at-grade in the Province of New Brunswick, in the city of Moncton. http://maps.google.ca/maps?hl=en&ll=46.122184,-64.689882&spn=0.011378,0.024934&t=h&z=16 (http://maps.google.ca/maps?hl=en&ll=46.122184,-64.689882&spn=0.011378,0.024934&t=h&z=16). This at-grade is still in use.  It crosses TCH-2 and NB-15.  The line is owned by CNRail and is also used by Via Rails The Ocean.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: bugo on May 31, 2013, 03:23:02 AM
Quote from: rte66man on May 21, 2013, 10:00:24 AM
Up to about 1980, there was an at-grade crossing of I-44 in west Tulsa where the old Tulsa-Sapulpa line crossed.  When the I244/I44 interchange t Southwest Blvd was rebuilt, they added an overpass:
http://goo.gl/maps/6dafK

Was there an at grade at 38th (the road that parallels the railroad track)?

There used to be a crossing on the WB lanes of the BA (Broken Arrow Expressway, US 64/OK 51) for a spur that ran from the tracks in the middle of the BA to the state fairgrounds.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: ghYHZ on May 31, 2013, 05:09:27 AM
Quote from: aridawn on May 31, 2013, 12:19:39 AM
There still is another at-grade in the Province of New Brunswick, in the city of Moncton. http://maps.google.ca/maps?hl=en&ll=46.122184,-64.689882&spn=0.011378,0.024934&t=h&z=16 (http://maps.google.ca/maps?hl=en&ll=46.122184,-64.689882&spn=0.011378,0.024934&t=h&z=16). This at-grade is still in use.  It crosses TCH-2 and NB-15.  The line is owned by CNRail and is also used by Via Rails The Ocean.

These are seldom used industrial spurs. The only time I ever had to stop was in early morning and that was just for a locomotive and a boxcar. VIA Rail's "Ocean"  passenger train does not use this track.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: bandit957 on August 01, 2013, 11:06:50 PM
I thought for sure there used to be one on I-65 in northern Indiana, but it's gone now.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: Joe The Dragon on August 02, 2013, 12:53:20 AM
There is one kind of at the end / after the end of I-65.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: bugo on August 02, 2013, 07:50:14 AM
This isn't the same thing, but the ramps to and from US 71 from I-540 east in Fort Smith have grade crossings at the end of the ramps.  These ramps are part of the interstate, and are mainline US 71.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: Jordanah1 on August 02, 2013, 11:30:36 AM
Although not a freeway by any means, there are two crossing on US 141 in northeastern Wisconsin, which is an expressway.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: agentsteel53 on August 02, 2013, 11:35:35 AM
does I-680 at I-29 in Council Bluffs, IA count?  the railroad crossing is just to the east of the interchange, which is the only one of four directions that isn't a signed interstate.  but it may physically be on the land belonging to the interchange.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: bugo on August 02, 2013, 06:55:14 PM
Quote from: agentsteel53 on August 02, 2013, 11:35:35 AM
does I-680 at I-29 in Council Bluffs, IA count?  the railroad crossing is just to the east of the interchange, which is the only one of four directions that isn't a signed interstate.  but it may physically be on the land belonging to the interchange.

Are there any yellow round "RXR" signs on the mainline of EB I-680?  The mainline follows the cloverleaf ramp.

EDIT: There are: http://goo.gl/maps/vu8JK

Are these the only round RXR signs on an Interstate mainline?
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: DandyDan on August 04, 2013, 04:48:49 PM
Quote from: agentsteel53 on August 02, 2013, 11:35:35 AM
does I-680 at I-29 in Council Bluffs, IA count?  the railroad crossing is just to the east of the interchange, which is the only one of four directions that isn't a signed interstate.  but it may physically be on the land belonging to the interchange.

I believe technically, the interchange ends just west of the railroad crossing.  I'm not sure how you look it up.  I do think there is something of a pavement change in the transition from Interstate to what's now county road (it used to be unsigned Iowa 988 east to Crescent), but it's been a long time since I've been there to notice.
Title: Re: At grade railroad crossing on interstate
Post by: oscar on August 04, 2013, 05:35:23 PM
FWIW, Alaska's paper Interstate A-4 (state route AK 3) has 15 Alaska Railroad crossings, but then it's mostly two lanes and non-freeway.