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Author Topic: Is "rush hour" declining?  (Read 6483 times)

jakeroot

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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #25 on: October 25, 2017, 10:25:36 PM »

Another side-topic here;

Are there any areas or suburbs that would be worse to commute to than downtown?

From the south end of the Seattle metro, it usually takes longer to get to Bellevue than Seattle. This is mostly due to a lack of roads between the south end and Bellevue (very hilly), and the main road (the 405) being very busy most of the day. WSDOT plans to add express lanes in the next decade, so that should help speed things up.
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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #26 on: October 25, 2017, 10:44:50 PM »

Another side-topic here;

Are there any areas or suburbs that would be worse to commute to than downtown?

From the south end of the Seattle metro, it usually takes longer to get to Bellevue than Seattle. This is mostly due to a lack of roads between the south end and Bellevue (very hilly), and the main road (the 405) being very busy most of the day. WSDOT plans to add express lanes in the next decade, so that should help speed things up.

Isn't rush hour backwards on the WA 520 bridge over Lake Washington because of Microsoft headquarters?

(BTW, this is my 500th post, so I'm now a US Highway).
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jakeroot

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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #27 on: October 26, 2017, 12:49:25 AM »

Another side-topic here;

Are there any areas or suburbs that would be worse to commute to than downtown?

From the south end of the Seattle metro, it usually takes longer to get to Bellevue than Seattle. This is mostly due to a lack of roads between the south end and Bellevue (very hilly), and the main road (the 405) being very busy most of the day. WSDOT plans to add express lanes in the next decade, so that should help speed things up.

Isn't rush hour backwards on the WA 520 bridge over Lake Washington because of Microsoft headquarters?

Between the 5 and the 405, traffic is generally heavy heading west (towards Seattle), but it's not catastrophic like other area freeways (vastly improved since the new bridge opened). East of the 405, the 520 can be busy heading into Redmond (towards the Microsoft campus) but it's usually not too bad. A lot of Microsoft employees (mostly the "low level" types) take some form of public transit to work.

(BTW, this is my 500th post, so I'm now a US Highway).

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jeffandnicole

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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #28 on: October 26, 2017, 08:12:13 AM »

Another side-topic here;

Are there any areas or suburbs that would be worse to commute to than downtown?

I personally think commuting to Henrietta (from any origin except south of the thruway) would be worse than going to downtown Rochester. Way more congestion, especially on I-590 and I-390.

I-295 in NJ is all suburb-to-suburb commuting, with traffic delays of over 10 miles quite normal, varying between interchanges 23 & 40.   Approaching US 1 (Exit 67) congestion is normally expected also, with no downtown within 30 miles.


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Brandon

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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #29 on: October 26, 2017, 11:13:25 AM »

Here is what traffic is like driving the main thoroughfare of Detroit on a Saturday afternoon.  It's quicker to take Woodward downtown than hopping on the freeway (at least until you hit the Davison).


Damn, I love MDOT's signaling along the boulevards.  :bigass:

Other states should take note and repeat.
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jakeroot

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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #30 on: October 26, 2017, 02:41:31 PM »

Here is what traffic is like driving the main thoroughfare of Detroit on a Saturday afternoon.  It's quicker to take Woodward downtown than hopping on the freeway (at least until you hit the Davison).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRWyx0NtpSQ&t=50s

Damn, I love MDOT's signaling along the boulevards.

Other states should take note and repeat.

I would love to see MDOT-style boulevards in my neck of the woods, but there's never enough ROW to accommodate the required width.

An MDOT-style boulevard would be lovely along this stretch of Hwy 161 in Pierce County, Washington (a very important N/S arterial), but there's absolutely no way to squeeze it in: https://goo.gl/7XtaeQ

They would be wise to eliminate left turns at intersections, replace them with U-turn points, and remove the vast amount of split phased cross streets, but I don't see that happening soon.
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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #31 on: October 26, 2017, 04:29:40 PM »

Another side-topic here;

Are there any areas or suburbs that would be worse to commute to than downtown?

I personally think commuting to Henrietta (from any origin except south of the thruway) would be worse than going to downtown Rochester. Way more congestion, especially on I-590 and I-390.

These days, Orange County in general vis-à-vis downtown L.A.  Both are work-related commute destinations (particularly, within OC, the triangle of I-5/I-405/CA 55) and from recent experience are functionally identical to one another in terms of congestion and commute times.  And in OC, the attractant "downtown" is spread all over that large triangle, with virtually every exit from every freeway jammed in the mornings and late afternoons.  And -- don't forget -- the OC toll road system has "injected" one of their arms (CA 261) directly into the midst of the congested area as a (purportedly) more efficient way to connect the OC business center with the marginally more affordable "Inland Empire" housing.  Whether this area (primarily Irvine but containing parts of several other adjacent cities) could still be classified as a "suburb" may be a debatable point; while spread out over 20-something square miles, it does share many features with classic downtown areas:  corporate HQ's and "campuses", high-rise housing, a multitude of hotels and restaurants, and other amenities normally associated with city centers (and damn few gas stations!).  While greater L.A. is itself famously diffused, central OC, at least for the last 15 years or so, has served as an "alternate downtown" to an extent not seen previously.   
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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #32 on: October 26, 2017, 06:08:05 PM »

Here is what traffic is like driving the main thoroughfare of Detroit on a Saturday afternoon.  It's quicker to take Woodward downtown than hopping on the freeway (at least until you hit the Davison).


Damn, I love MDOT's signaling along the boulevards.  :bigass:

Other states should take note and repeat.

I love that boulevard concept in general. And not having to stop at 94 of 104 total lights...wow.
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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #33 on: October 26, 2017, 06:12:53 PM »

Here is what traffic is like driving the main thoroughfare of Detroit on a Saturday afternoon.  It's quicker to take Woodward downtown than hopping on the freeway (at least until you hit the Davison).


Damn, I love MDOT's signaling along the boulevards.  :bigass:

Other states should take note and repeat.

I love that boulevard concept in general. And not having to stop at 94 of 104 total lights...wow.

93. The light at 7:27 (video time, not driving time) was red, and they counted it as green.
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kkt

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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #34 on: October 26, 2017, 07:35:00 PM »

Here is what traffic is like driving the main thoroughfare of Detroit on a Saturday afternoon.  It's quicker to take Woodward downtown than hopping on the freeway (at least until you hit the Davison).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PRWyx0NtpSQ&t=50s

Damn, I love MDOT's signaling along the boulevards.

Other states should take note and repeat.

It would be lovely, but I think the cross streets have to be evenly spaced for the timed signals to work out.

Quote
I would love to see MDOT-style boulevards in my neck of the woods, but there's never enough ROW to accommodate the required width.

An MDOT-style boulevard would be lovely along this stretch of Hwy 161 in Pierce County, Washington (a very important N/S arterial), but there's absolutely no way to squeeze it in: https://goo.gl/7XtaeQ

Yes, as you say not enough ROW and cross-streets are unevenly spaced as well.  I hope for a parallel freeway bypassing Puyallup, South Hill, and Graham, but not holding my breath.  As is so often the case, no one thinks about setting aside right of way for a freeway/boulevard until it's no longer cheap and easy.


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jeffandnicole

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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #35 on: October 26, 2017, 08:46:49 PM »

Here is what traffic is like driving the main thoroughfare of Detroit on a Saturday afternoon.  It's quicker to take Woodward downtown than hopping on the freeway (at least until you hit the Davison).


Damn, I love MDOT's signaling along the boulevards.  :bigass:

Other states should take note and repeat.

I love that boulevard concept in general. And not having to stop at 94 of 104 total lights...wow.

That is impressive.  However, consider this: That averages to be one traffic light every 1/4 mile.  That's a lot of traffic lights to constantly pay attention to.  If someone driving straight thru at whatever speed this person was driving at for 26 miles, then it's wonderful.  But I'm sure very few are driving that entire stretch.  For someone that turns onto the road at any point during that stretch, how does that affect their ability to get thru the lights?
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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #36 on: October 26, 2017, 09:37:55 PM »

^ The average driver should, in theory, miss the first light after they turn onto the road. Then the "flow" or thru traffic should catch up to them just after that next light turns green, and then they should be in sync for the rest of their journey. That's in a perfect world though. I'm not sure how it actually plays out on the road mentioned.
That would on straight roads with good drivers and no stores or pedestrians?
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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #37 on: October 26, 2017, 10:37:46 PM »

I've driven the entire length of the Grand Concourse in The Bronx without ever stopping because of benefitting from the synchronized signals.
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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #38 on: October 27, 2017, 12:52:33 AM »

That is impressive.  However, consider this: That averages to be one traffic light every 1/4 mile.  That's a lot of traffic lights to constantly pay attention to.  If someone driving straight thru at whatever speed this person was driving at for 26 miles, then it's wonderful.  But I'm sure very few are driving that entire stretch.  For someone that turns onto the road at any point during that stretch, how does that affect their ability to get thru the lights?

I’ll take Woodward whenever I’m heading down to Detroit.  Driving it in the middle of the day is one thing, but something different entirely late at night.  Cruising down a nearly deserted 8-lane boulevard and hitting an endless string of green lights… each light triggering green just as you approach it… it’s almost mesmerizing.  After 30 minutes of this you realize you haven’t tapped the breaks or let your foot off the gas…it’s just enjoyable.  Woodward is a straight shot from Detroit and for me it’s faster than taking the Lodge or I-75.
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Otto Yamamoto

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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #39 on: October 27, 2017, 12:58:30 AM »

I've driven the entire length of the Grand Concourse in The Bronx without ever stopping because of benefitting from the synchronized signals.
I've done likewise on 2/3 Aves in Manhattan

P00I

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Brandon

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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #40 on: October 27, 2017, 05:46:40 AM »

That is impressive.  However, consider this: That averages to be one traffic light every 1/4 mile.  That's a lot of traffic lights to constantly pay attention to.  If someone driving straight thru at whatever speed this person was driving at for 26 miles, then it's wonderful.  But I'm sure very few are driving that entire stretch.  For someone that turns onto the road at any point during that stretch, how does that affect their ability to get thru the lights?

The signals on the boulevards are timed so that one can cruise through at the speed limit (or near it) without stopping.  The limit on thee boulevards is typically 45 mph, and the signals are timed for it.  The locals all know this, and usually are on them between 40 and 50 mph so that they'll make the signals.

If you turn onto the road at any point, you'll get the first signal red, followed by a bunch of greens.
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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #41 on: October 27, 2017, 08:15:40 AM »

That is impressive.  However, consider this: That averages to be one traffic light every 1/4 mile.  That's a lot of traffic lights to constantly pay attention to.  If someone driving straight thru at whatever speed this person was driving at for 26 miles, then it's wonderful.  But I'm sure very few are driving that entire stretch.  For someone that turns onto the road at any point during that stretch, how does that affect their ability to get thru the lights?

The signals on the boulevards are timed so that one can cruise through at the speed limit (or near it) without stopping.  The limit on thee boulevards is typically 45 mph, and the signals are timed for it.  The locals all know this, and usually are on them between 40 and 50 mph so that they'll make the signals.

If you turn onto the road at any point, you'll get the first signal red, followed by a bunch of greens.

In regards to how many people actually drive this full stretch: If you watch the video, no later than about 20 seconds into the video the other nearby cars at the beginning of the video have turned off the Blvd.  As cars come on, cars come off.  It didn't take long for the cars that entered the blvd to exit it.  It's great for those that are on it that they may not have to stop at many lights, but hardly anyone is going more than a few miles, much less 26 miles.
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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #42 on: October 27, 2017, 08:29:43 AM »


In regards to how many people actually drive this full stretch: If you watch the video, no later than about 20 seconds into the video the other nearby cars at the beginning of the video have turned off the Blvd.  As cars come on, cars come off.  It didn't take long for the cars that entered the blvd to exit it.  It's great for those that are on it that they may not have to stop at many lights, but hardly anyone is going more than a few miles, much less 26 miles.
A billion here, a billion there, and pretty soon you're talking about real money..
If "a few miles" means 5 miles, at 1/4 mile spacing that is 20 lights in total. Assuming average of 30 seconds per light, that is 10 minutes added to the trip - and some acceleration/deceleration on top of that. So 7 minute trip (5 miles at 45 MPH) could extend to 17 or 20 minutes if lights were not timed...
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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #43 on: October 27, 2017, 08:54:54 AM »

Do you think rush hour, in the traditional sense, is becoming less noticeable/significant over time?

There are several factors working towards this end, including more working from home, more flexible contracts, and an ageing population.

An off-shoot of this topic: which days seem to have the worst rush hour traffic?
Here's my estimate for my area, best to worst: Friday, Monday, Wednesday, Tuesday, Thursday.
Maybe I just get bad luck. But Thursdays seem extra bad for some reason :rolleyes:
Not on the Lexington Ave line.

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Ditto for probably any NYC subway line.  The level of crowding is atrocious at this point.  While it's worst at rush hour, it's pretty bad around the clock, even on weekends.
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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #44 on: October 28, 2017, 12:05:51 AM »

In the greater Bay Area, rush hour is not only persisting, it's actually expanding; whereas four years ago you'd find some freeways (such as I-880) to be cleared out in both directions by about 9:30 a.m, with congestion building up again about 3 p.m. -- now you're lucky not to run into residual traffic as late as 10:30-11 a.m. -- and the afternoon equivalent seems to build up about 2:30 p.m. these days.  The latter has been a greater Los Angeles phenomenon for decades, as the larger warehouse/distribution/fulfillment centers invariably have a shift change at 2:30 p.m. (3 daily shifts for around-the-clock operation); while the Bay area doesn't feature the massive distribution facilities found in SoCal (although the Valley region centered around Stockton appears to be on its way toward this status), the trend of more and more firms toward employee "flex time" is likely contributing to the midday congestion increase.

I was actually explaining to my girlfriend about San Francisco's housing bubble--it's making Bay Area traffic much worse.  Because of the insane cost of real estate, it is financially impossible for anyone with a middle-class or lower-class job to live in San Francisco or the Silicon Valley.  That means that the people providing all of the services other than those provided by rich people have to come from farther away, forcing high commute times for anyone who isn't obscenely wealthy, which is to say, the overwhelming majority of people.  If the closest a hotel maid can live to a fancy San Francisco hotel is Brentwood, she now has to commute all the way from Brentwood each day to get to work.  As the cost of living increases in the urban core, the cost of living also increases in the immediate vicinity, causing a ripple effect that pushes the lower and middle classes farther away.  And commute distances will just continue to increase...
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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #45 on: October 28, 2017, 04:59:36 PM »

In the greater Bay Area, rush hour is not only persisting, it's actually expanding; whereas four years ago you'd find some freeways (such as I-880) to be cleared out in both directions by about 9:30 a.m, with congestion building up again about 3 p.m. -- now you're lucky not to run into residual traffic as late as 10:30-11 a.m. -- and the afternoon equivalent seems to build up about 2:30 p.m. these days.  The latter has been a greater Los Angeles phenomenon for decades, as the larger warehouse/distribution/fulfillment centers invariably have a shift change at 2:30 p.m. (3 daily shifts for around-the-clock operation); while the Bay area doesn't feature the massive distribution facilities found in SoCal (although the Valley region centered around Stockton appears to be on its way toward this status), the trend of more and more firms toward employee "flex time" is likely contributing to the midday congestion increase.

I was actually explaining to my girlfriend about San Francisco's housing bubble--it's making Bay Area traffic much worse.  Because of the insane cost of real estate, it is financially impossible for anyone with a middle-class or lower-class job to live in San Francisco or the Silicon Valley.  That means that the people providing all of the services other than those provided by rich people have to come from farther away, forcing high commute times for anyone who isn't obscenely wealthy, which is to say, the overwhelming majority of people.  If the closest a hotel maid can live to a fancy San Francisco hotel is Brentwood, she now has to commute all the way from Brentwood each day to get to work.  As the cost of living increases in the urban core, the cost of living also increases in the immediate vicinity, causing a ripple effect that pushes the lower and middle classes farther away.  And commute distances will just continue to increase...

Funny you should mention Brentwood.  When I was driving from SJ to Alameda (and return) the other day, I saw multiple billboards on I-880 advertising Brentwood developments as the closest-in under $500K new housing stock to be had in the area.  Now, from experience, I'd probably put Fairfield/Cordelia in much that same price category -- but that requires the "gauntlet" of either the I-80 or I-680 bridges to get to that area (sometimes it's not so much the toll as the time!), while Brentwood is a "straight shot" out CA 4 and somewhat less so (but still doable) via I-580 and Vasco Road.  It's interesting in that Discovery Bay, actually east of Brentwood (and actually closer to Stockton than even Walnut Creek) was developed first as a "second home" community with amenities tied to the San Joaquin Delta (boat docks, parks, and with some water channels right up to one's back yard) -- geared toward recreational use; the average housing stock there dates from the early-to-mid '80's.  But it still features a large number of homes (not those with their own docks, which are naturally pricier) in the $300-400K category for about 2K sf (my GF's cousins in Stockton were looking at some of these a few months ago).  Brentwood, technically, is "infill" between Discovery Bay and Antioch; most of the current development is going on just west of the east end of the CA 4 freeway extension.  But the fact is that there's an eastern "arc" around the Bay Area that essentially delineates the $500K/home E/W dividing line.  And everything immediately east of that arc is quickly being gobbled up by new arrivals or Bay residents looking to get out of apartments or condos.  Again from past experience, I'd expect Brentwood's median price to hit at least $650-700K by 2022 if not sooner.  That'll drive the sub-$75K/year workers farther east to the I-5 or CA 99 corridor housing areas (Lathrop, Ripon, etc.) -- which eventually will have the effect of extending the rush hour earlier and later (maybe 4:30 am and 8 p.m!).
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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #46 on: October 31, 2017, 06:33:09 PM »

S.F.-based KCBS (AM 740) radio in my home region has been discussing this very issue over the past week, with the consensus being that on many of the area freeways (I-80, I-580, I-880, and US 101 being singled out) the congestion has indeed spread to midday, with the resultant backup starting around 5-5:30 a.m. and continuing until at least 7:30-8 p.m. M-F.  I would concur, as just in the past couple of weeks I've had the need to utilize many of these (and other) freeways, and have seen a consistent pattern of a couple of miles of relatively free (45-50 mph and up) travel interspersed with stop-and-go segments on at least I-880 and I-580; I've pretty much given up on US 101 from CA 87 north to Palo Alto during daytime hours during the week (and my alternate, Central Expressway, is seeing increasingly more of the overflow).  And Sunday we went south on US 101 to visit friends in Hollister (late afternoon SB); the NB direction was congested to stop-and-go level from CA 85 all the way down to CA 25, where we got off 101.  It cleared out by the time we returned between 8 and 9 p.m., with only a slight glitch because of a "fender-bender" in Morgan Hill.  So even weekends aren't immune from the problems -- in this case, likely folks returning from weekend jaunts to both the Monterey Peninsula and Gilroy (it's garlic-harvest time around there).  Just another week in Northern California's Traffic Central!   
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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #47 on: November 02, 2017, 12:44:51 PM »

S.F.-based KCBS (AM 740) radio in my home region has been discussing this very issue over the past week, with the consensus being that on many of the area freeways (I-80, I-580, I-880, and US 101 being singled out) the congestion has indeed spread to midday, with the resultant backup starting around 5-5:30 a.m. and continuing until at least 7:30-8 p.m. M-F.  I would concur, as just in the past couple of weeks I've had the need to utilize many of these (and other) freeways, and have seen a consistent pattern of a couple of miles of relatively free (45-50 mph and up) travel interspersed with stop-and-go segments on at least I-880 and I-580; I've pretty much given up on US 101 from CA 87 north to Palo Alto during daytime hours during the week (and my alternate, Central Expressway, is seeing increasingly more of the overflow).  And Sunday we went south on US 101 to visit friends in Hollister (late afternoon SB); the NB direction was congested to stop-and-go level from CA 85 all the way down to CA 25, where we got off 101.  It cleared out by the time we returned between 8 and 9 p.m., with only a slight glitch because of a "fender-bender" in Morgan Hill.  So even weekends aren't immune from the problems -- in this case, likely folks returning from weekend jaunts to both the Monterey Peninsula and Gilroy (it's garlic-harvest time around there).  Just another week in Northern California's Traffic Central!   

Try Solano County on the weekends we sometimes have I-80 jammed on both directions due to tour buses from San Francisco and Sacramento using I-80 either to go to Napa or Bay Area Tour buses going to Sacramento, Lake Tahoe, Reno and Downtown Davis for various events in those areas. Or Sacramento area buses using I-80 west to San Francisco.  I even heard of I-205 mentioned as a bay area freeway too in some reports even though its technically in the San Joaquin Valley.
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bing101

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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #48 on: November 02, 2017, 12:51:28 PM »

Another side-topic here;

Are there any areas or suburbs that would be worse to commute to than downtown?

I personally think commuting to Henrietta (from any origin except south of the thruway) would be worse than going to downtown Rochester. Way more congestion, especially on I-590 and I-390.

CA-12 Suisun City eastbound from cordelia interchange its the place where lots of people exit from Sacramento and San Francisco but the commuters have to encounter at grade intersections from a busy freeway interchange in the county near Jelly Belly factory but its also where some of Solano County's housing is located for  Sacramento Valley and Bay Area commuters.
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sparker

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Re: Is "rush hour" declining?
« Reply #49 on: November 02, 2017, 04:15:53 PM »

S.F.-based KCBS (AM 740) radio in my home region has been discussing this very issue over the past week, with the consensus being that on many of the area freeways (I-80, I-580, I-880, and US 101 being singled out) the congestion has indeed spread to midday, with the resultant backup starting around 5-5:30 a.m. and continuing until at least 7:30-8 p.m. M-F.  I would concur, as just in the past couple of weeks I've had the need to utilize many of these (and other) freeways, and have seen a consistent pattern of a couple of miles of relatively free (45-50 mph and up) travel interspersed with stop-and-go segments on at least I-880 and I-580; I've pretty much given up on US 101 from CA 87 north to Palo Alto during daytime hours during the week (and my alternate, Central Expressway, is seeing increasingly more of the overflow).  And Sunday we went south on US 101 to visit friends in Hollister (late afternoon SB); the NB direction was congested to stop-and-go level from CA 85 all the way down to CA 25, where we got off 101.  It cleared out by the time we returned between 8 and 9 p.m., with only a slight glitch because of a "fender-bender" in Morgan Hill.  So even weekends aren't immune from the problems -- in this case, likely folks returning from weekend jaunts to both the Monterey Peninsula and Gilroy (it's garlic-harvest time around there).  Just another week in Northern California's Traffic Central!   

Try Solano County on the weekends we sometimes have I-80 jammed on both directions due to tour buses from San Francisco and Sacramento using I-80 either to go to Napa or Bay Area Tour buses going to Sacramento, Lake Tahoe, Reno and Downtown Davis for various events in those areas. Or Sacramento area buses using I-80 west to San Francisco.  I even heard of I-205 mentioned as a bay area freeway too in some reports even though its technically in the San Joaquin Valley.

Wow -- I think this is the first time I've heard of congestion attributed to large amounts of tour buses going back & forth along a stretch of highway!  I know there must be some Napa Valley tour lines originating in the Sacramento area -- but it would be something of a stretch to imagine that those would in and of themselves result in congestion (unless a number of them were caravanning at slow speeds and "hogging" one of the lanes -- which I have personally witnessed over Donner Summit).  Nevertheless, I do agree with Bing's assessment of the overall increase of traffic along I-80 in Solano County; quite a bit of housing has been built around the perimeter of Travis AFB, and one could safely assume that the pricing of such is considerably less than the Bay Area median.  And areas like Vacaville can do, as mentioned previously, "double duty" as exurbs of both the Bay and Sacramento.  Except for the Yolo Bypass (and whatever zoning regulations that come into play), there's little to prevent Fairfield from merging with Vacaville (around the south side of the hills), and eventually Vacaville merging with Dixon (which is also experiencing heavy growth), and then on to the edges of Davis (which might be a bit reluctant to massively increase its own housing stock due to the influence of UCD).  I'm guessing -- with a bit of a heavy heart -- that one will be able to see housing stock adjacent to or near any point along I-80 from Davis to west of Vacaville by 2030 at the latest.  As an adjunct to such development, the Amtrak Capitol Corridor service along the UP line to the south might establish a station stop at Dixon or even Elmira to serve the commuting population (that'd help the situation -- but if history is correct, only marginally).     
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