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Author Topic: The poorest town in every state  (Read 3519 times)

ET21

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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #25 on: August 14, 2018, 08:55:06 AM »

I'm shocked Illinois's isn't Cairo.
So am I. I drove through Cairo about 4 years ago and thought to myself well I'm at the dead bottom of Illinois in land and I guess cities too lol.

I thought it was Hopkins Park.
Illinois has some strange cities like that. I'd guess at one of the Southland suburbs of Chicago like Harvey, Ford Heights, Markham, Dixmoor or one of those cities but one of the St. Louis suburbs is a pretty good candidate too. Hopkins Park is strange, lots of poverty there and it's in the middle of nowhere.

A piece was just ran recently on the news of how Dixmoor's corruption is completely throwing their budget in the tank... Quite sad as maybe surrounding communities are also feeling the influence of this as well
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jon daly

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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #26 on: August 14, 2018, 09:30:53 AM »

Speaking of college towns, I wouldn't think of Willimantic as a college town per se, but it is the home of Eastern Connecticut State University; my alma mater.
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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #27 on: August 14, 2018, 10:10:58 AM »

Yeah, I wouldn’t have thought Brigham City UT would be on this list. I most certainly would have expected it to be on the Ute reservation in northeast UT, or someplace like Blanding, along the US 191 corridor south of Moab.

"Median Annual Household Income"

That appears to be all they looked at.
Is there a better metric?

I’d think per-capita income would be better to use than median household income, especially in a place like Utah with large families, which may skew the results.

If we go by per capita, the poorest place in Utah is Whiterocks (on the Ute reservation). If we’re going to be pedantic and not count it because it’s a CDP, then the poorest incorporated city is Hildale. That’s where household income is misleading, because that’s a polygamous town, and the amount of people living under one roof is going to be much larger than a typical household.
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jon daly

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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #28 on: August 14, 2018, 10:13:49 AM »

The problem I have with income as a measure of rich/poor is that it doesn't account for expenses. We're debt-ridden and I have a 100+ mile round-trip commute. So I have a decent job, but I'd consider myself on the fringe of middle-class respectability.
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Flint1979

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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #29 on: August 14, 2018, 01:26:17 PM »

I'm shocked Illinois's isn't Cairo.
So am I. I drove through Cairo about 4 years ago and thought to myself well I'm at the dead bottom of Illinois in land and I guess cities too lol.

I thought it was Hopkins Park.
Illinois has some strange cities like that. I'd guess at one of the Southland suburbs of Chicago like Harvey, Ford Heights, Markham, Dixmoor or one of those cities but one of the St. Louis suburbs is a pretty good candidate too. Hopkins Park is strange, lots of poverty there and it's in the middle of nowhere.

A piece was just ran recently on the news of how Dixmoor's corruption is completely throwing their budget in the tank... Quite sad as maybe surrounding communities are also feeling the influence of this as well
To me that whole area south of Chicago city limits is pretty rough and I wouldn't doubt it's pretty poor too. I'm kind of surprised Illinois wasn't Cairo too.
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ET21

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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #30 on: August 14, 2018, 02:47:21 PM »

I'm shocked Illinois's isn't Cairo.
So am I. I drove through Cairo about 4 years ago and thought to myself well I'm at the dead bottom of Illinois in land and I guess cities too lol.

I thought it was Hopkins Park.
Illinois has some strange cities like that. I'd guess at one of the Southland suburbs of Chicago like Harvey, Ford Heights, Markham, Dixmoor or one of those cities but one of the St. Louis suburbs is a pretty good candidate too. Hopkins Park is strange, lots of poverty there and it's in the middle of nowhere.

A piece was just ran recently on the news of how Dixmoor's corruption is completely throwing their budget in the tank... Quite sad as maybe surrounding communities are also feeling the influence of this as well
To me that whole area south of Chicago city limits is pretty rough and I wouldn't doubt it's pretty poor too. I'm kind of surprised Illinois wasn't Cairo too.

Yeah anything east of Cicero and south of 294 is not the greatest.... Furthest I go is Midlothian or Crestwood
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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #31 on: August 14, 2018, 03:52:17 PM »

Webster MA just got hit by a small EF1 tornado last week. A blog did a satirical before and after to see if people could tell the difference. That whole French/Thames River valley from Webster down to Long Island Sound (I-395 for the most part), with fellow poorest 'town' Willimantic CT close to that corridor, has seen better days.
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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #32 on: August 14, 2018, 04:38:52 PM »

^ It's the Last Green Valley.  But I think western RI near the CT border is even greener. It seems like a lot of the land there is state forests. In some ways that's good for the ecology of the Northeast. I'm thinking of moving up route 12 from Mystic.
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Flint1979

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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #33 on: August 15, 2018, 12:06:34 PM »

I'm shocked Illinois's isn't Cairo.
So am I. I drove through Cairo about 4 years ago and thought to myself well I'm at the dead bottom of Illinois in land and I guess cities too lol.

I thought it was Hopkins Park.
Illinois has some strange cities like that. I'd guess at one of the Southland suburbs of Chicago like Harvey, Ford Heights, Markham, Dixmoor or one of those cities but one of the St. Louis suburbs is a pretty good candidate too. Hopkins Park is strange, lots of poverty there and it's in the middle of nowhere.

A piece was just ran recently on the news of how Dixmoor's corruption is completely throwing their budget in the tank... Quite sad as maybe surrounding communities are also feeling the influence of this as well
To me that whole area south of Chicago city limits is pretty rough and I wouldn't doubt it's pretty poor too. I'm kind of surprised Illinois wasn't Cairo too.

Yeah anything east of Cicero and south of 294 is not the greatest.... Furthest I go is Midlothian or Crestwood
I always thought that Comiskey Park was in an ok area, not the greatest but not the worst and once you started venturing south of there is when it starts getting rough. I think Chicago's worst neighborhood is Fuller Park but we all know how bad Englewood is and West Englewood and those neighborhoods. Fuller Park was one of the worst neighborhoods I saw anytime I was in Chicago. And Fuller Park is in the shadows of Comiskey as well as Wentworth Gardens.

About 17-18 years ago I was traveling through Chicago on my way home from Milwaukee and there was a traffic jam on I-94 south of Milwaukee so I decided to start taking another route and went through a lot of the northern suburbs of Chicago along like Sheridan Road, Green Bay Road and over in that area. I went through Glencoe, Winnetka, Evanston, Northside of Chicago and got on Lake Shore Drive at it's northern terminus and followed that through downtown and onto the Southside. Once I got to the Southside I should have got back on the Dan Ryan but didn't I continued to follow Lake Shore all the way to Jackson Park. Then it started to get a little ugly, I was stopped at a traffic light I can't remember what street I was on exactly or the cross street but there was a guy laying on the ground right in the middle of the intersection passed out and I knew the type of neighborhood I was in. Nothing happened to me though and I got out safely and after about a minute or two of driving some more I saw a sign that said, "I-94 Detroit" and said to myself hell yeah I'm outta here.
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cjk374

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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #34 on: August 15, 2018, 09:01:28 PM »

Ville Platte, LA ain't near as bad off as many towns in the delta region of the state (northeast Louisiana).
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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #35 on: August 16, 2018, 08:47:56 AM »

I was just looking up the history of Hopkins Park, IL..  Quite interesting.  Apparently freed slaves inhabited the area right after the civil war, hoping to farm the land, but the only reason this particular land was unfarmed was because nothing really grows in the sandy soil of that area.  The white settlers basically eschewed this small area.
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Beltway

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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #36 on: August 16, 2018, 01:27:42 PM »

Hillsville, VA?  Seem like a nice small town with decent quality of life in a mountainous area. 

The recently built US-58 bypass has enhanced that by providing a route for thru traffic and relegating the old highway to local use.
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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #37 on: August 16, 2018, 08:32:38 PM »

Orleans strikes me as the poorest county, at least upstate, but I have no hard evidence, and I'm not sure what town I'd pick if I hard to narrow it down that far.
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MantyMadTown

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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #38 on: August 16, 2018, 10:45:28 PM »

Whitewater??? Whitewater's a college town, and they don't seem very poor. I was thinking for Wisconsin it would either be on the Menominee reservation or one of the middle of nowhere towns up north or in the central part of the state.
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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #39 on: August 16, 2018, 10:46:51 PM »

Whitewater??? Whitewater's a college town, and they don't seem very poor. I was thinking for Wisconsin it would either be on the Menominee reservation or one of the middle of nowhere towns up north or in the central part of the state.

College town = many people with 0 income.
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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #40 on: August 16, 2018, 10:52:56 PM »

Whitewater??? Whitewater's a college town, and they don't seem very poor. I was thinking for Wisconsin it would either be on the Menominee reservation or one of the middle of nowhere towns up north or in the central part of the state.

College town = many people with 0 income.

That seems to skew the data. I'm guessing most of these people (read: college students) with 0 income get all their support from scholarships, student loans, financial aid, and their parents. So they don't technically make any money, but they don't need any extra support. Doesn't seem like a good indicator of poverty. A better example would be family income, since the data skews around college students.
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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #41 on: August 17, 2018, 01:00:50 AM »

Here in CA, Clearlake's numbers are likely skewed due to the significant numbers of retirees there; most "income" outside of retirement benefits goes unreported.  Back about 2013, a statewide survey that utilized the three statistical averages -- mean, median, and mode -- showed McFarland, along CA 99 between Bakersfield and Delano, to have both the lowest mean and median household income; Alpaugh, about 20 miles northwest to the west of CA 43, had the lowest modal average.  The southern San Joaquin Valley has been the state's "poverty central" since the late '50's, when large-scale corporate farming ("agribusiness") commenced purchasing individual farms and plots; most of that land has been converted to cotton, almond, and stone fruit farming (Rainier cherries, once almost exclusively grown in Washington and Oregon, are now among the most profitable annual cash crops in Tulare and Kings Counties; they need to be picked before the average daily high exceeds 85 degrees -- at least according to a cherry farmer I know up in Loomis -- or else they're cherry stew!).  However, those profits are scattered up the literal "food chain"; very little stays with Valley workers.
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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #42 on: August 17, 2018, 01:36:24 AM »

Here in CA, Clearlake's numbers are likely skewed due to the significant numbers of retirees there; most "income" outside of retirement benefits goes unreported.  Back about 2013, a statewide survey that utilized the three statistical averages -- mean, median, and mode -- showed McFarland, along CA 99 between Bakersfield and Delano, to have both the lowest mean and median household income; Alpaugh, about 20 miles northwest to the west of CA 43, had the lowest modal average.  The southern San Joaquin Valley has been the state's "poverty central" since the late '50's, when large-scale corporate farming ("agribusiness") commenced purchasing individual farms and plots; most of that land has been converted to cotton, almond, and stone fruit farming (Rainier cherries, once almost exclusively grown in Washington and Oregon, are now among the most profitable annual cash crops in Tulare and Kings Counties; they need to be picked before the average daily high exceeds 85 degrees -- at least according to a cherry farmer I know up in Loomis -- or else they're cherry stew!).  However, those profits are scattered up the literal "food chain"; very little stays with Valley workers.

Wasn’t Mendota pretty high on the list this past decade with the 40% plus unemployment rate or was the prison pushing the income upward?

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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #43 on: August 17, 2018, 02:13:12 AM »

Here in CA, Clearlake's numbers are likely skewed due to the significant numbers of retirees there; most "income" outside of retirement benefits goes unreported.  Back about 2013, a statewide survey that utilized the three statistical averages -- mean, median, and mode -- showed McFarland, along CA 99 between Bakersfield and Delano, to have both the lowest mean and median household income; Alpaugh, about 20 miles northwest to the west of CA 43, had the lowest modal average.  The southern San Joaquin Valley has been the state's "poverty central" since the late '50's, when large-scale corporate farming ("agribusiness") commenced purchasing individual farms and plots; most of that land has been converted to cotton, almond, and stone fruit farming (Rainier cherries, once almost exclusively grown in Washington and Oregon, are now among the most profitable annual cash crops in Tulare and Kings Counties; they need to be picked before the average daily high exceeds 85 degrees -- at least according to a cherry farmer I know up in Loomis -- or else they're cherry stew!).  However, those profits are scattered up the literal "food chain"; very little stays with Valley workers.

Wasn’t Mendota pretty high on the list this past decade with the 40% plus unemployment rate or was the prison pushing the income upward?

It appears that the more remote the prison town, the more likely it is that the paid prison employees will reside in or near that town (which makes sense).  Avenal and Susanville, long remote "poverty pockets", were literally rocketed into middle class when the nearby prisons opened.  Mendota and Corcoran, on the other hand, did witness a mean income hike that got them out of the bottom poverty tier -- but a lot of the personnel in those locations elected (probably with family input) to endure a medium-length commute in order to reside in a city with more amenities (Fresno, Hanford, Visalia, etc.), which correspondingly reduced the fiscal benefits to the city where the prison is located. 
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Beltway

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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #44 on: August 17, 2018, 07:30:18 AM »

Whitewater??? Whitewater's a college town, and they don't seem very poor. I was thinking for Wisconsin it would either be on the Menominee reservation or one of the middle of nowhere towns up north or in the central part of the state.
College town = many people with 0 income.

Wouldn't students be counted in their home town and not in their college town?
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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #45 on: August 17, 2018, 10:19:09 AM »

Whitewater??? Whitewater's a college town, and they don't seem very poor. I was thinking for Wisconsin it would either be on the Menominee reservation or one of the middle of nowhere towns up north or in the central part of the state.
College town = many people with 0 income.

Wouldn't students be counted in their home town and not in their college town?

That's what I thought. College students usually don't claim permanent residency in their college towns unless they've actually moved there and are living off campus.
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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #46 on: August 17, 2018, 10:44:15 AM »

They got East Cleveland right.  The city doesn't even have enough money to maintain their traffic signals, let alone their streets, utilities,...
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Flint1979

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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #47 on: August 17, 2018, 01:42:50 PM »

They got East Cleveland right.  The city doesn't even have enough money to maintain their traffic signals, let alone their streets, utilities,...
Indeed. East Cleveland is one of the biggest shitholes I have ever driven through.
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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #48 on: August 17, 2018, 11:56:02 PM »

Here in CA, Clearlake's numbers are likely skewed due to the significant numbers of retirees there; most "income" outside of retirement benefits goes unreported.  Back about 2013, a statewide survey that utilized the three statistical averages -- mean, median, and mode -- showed McFarland, along CA 99 between Bakersfield and Delano, to have both the lowest mean and median household income; Alpaugh, about 20 miles northwest to the west of CA 43, had the lowest modal average.  The southern San Joaquin Valley has been the state's "poverty central" since the late '50's, when large-scale corporate farming ("agribusiness") commenced purchasing individual farms and plots; most of that land has been converted to cotton, almond, and stone fruit farming (Rainier cherries, once almost exclusively grown in Washington and Oregon, are now among the most profitable annual cash crops in Tulare and Kings Counties; they need to be picked before the average daily high exceeds 85 degrees -- at least according to a cherry farmer I know up in Loomis -- or else they're cherry stew!).  However, those profits are scattered up the literal "food chain"; very little stays with Valley workers.

Wasn’t Mendota pretty high on the list this past decade with the 40% plus unemployment rate or was the prison pushing the income upward?

It appears that the more remote the prison town, the more likely it is that the paid prison employees will reside in or near that town (which makes sense).  Avenal and Susanville, long remote "poverty pockets", were literally rocketed into middle class when the nearby prisons opened.  Mendota and Corcoran, on the other hand, did witness a mean income hike that got them out of the bottom poverty tier -- but a lot of the personnel in those locations elected (probably with family input) to endure a medium-length commute in order to reside in a city with more amenities (Fresno, Hanford, Visalia, etc.), which correspondingly reduced the fiscal benefits to the city where the prison is located.

Seems that the Corcoran prison even had a positive boost for Huron.  I'd speculate Huron might just be as bad or worse than Mendota is.  I never would have thought in a million years Clearlake would have a lower median income level.

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Re: The poorest town in every state
« Reply #49 on: August 18, 2018, 01:41:11 AM »

Seems that the Corcoran prison even had a positive boost for Huron.  I'd speculate Huron might just be as bad or worse than Mendota is.  I never would have thought in a million years Clearlake would have a lower median income level.

Clearlake, along with much of Lake County in general, is just plain weird.  Lots of really rundown mobile home parks mixed with ramshackle houses.  Most of the better housing is down in Hidden Valley or strung along the lakefront near Kelseyville.  Successive summers with major wildfires have precipitated an exodus of sorts from the area; those so inclined with the means to relocate elswhere have done so or are in the process; this has created sort of a "plateau" regarding property values -- while like with most of CA they're naturally increasing, Lake County is becoming more and more a buyers' market in relation to adjoining areas.  According to the media reports I've come across, the "diaspora" is heading toward either the Russian River Valley (Ukiah and vicinity) or south to the I-80 corridor -- anywhere but in the dry brush (but recently all those areas have featured significant blazes as well -- I guess when it comes to CA, it's out of the frying pan..................!).  And the remaining Lake County population's mean income will likely show something of a decline as a result of the more affluent taking a hike -- at least until property values dip to the point where the losses are stemmed by newcomers looking for a bargain (hope they can get insurance!).  But the trailer (er, mobile home)* park folks will likely hang in there likely because they have little choice in the matter. 

*for a really funny discourse on the interchangeability of the terms "trailer" and "mobile home", read Donald Westlake's hilarious novel Bank Shot.  Don't bother with the 1974 film version; they fucked up that one royally!
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