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Author Topic: Misbehaving during standardized tests  (Read 2530 times)

kphoger

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Re: Misbehaving during standardized tests
« Reply #100 on: January 24, 2019, 02:40:57 PM »

non-standardized tests (i.e. those drawn up and proctored by the teachers themselves, which makes up the vast majority of them) were marked up in red pen and returned same as any other homework. How is learning even possible without the ability to know what you got wrong? (If I put that the 16th president was Abraham Omaha and never get feedback that I was wrong, I'm apt to keep thinking well of good old President Omaha.) This has cumulative effects in some subjects—if you fail to comprehend certain math topics, you have no hope of understanding more advanced topics that rely on those.

When you say "marked up", do you mean the correct answer was written in?  Or just that the question was marked as wrong?



Perhaps some of the reason why Teachers "cheat" while grading papers

My dad had a professor in seminary who was known to take everyone's essays, stack them up, throw the stack down a stairway, and then grade them based on where they landed.  Having a longer paper, therefore, improved one's chance of getting a good grade.  Students were known to write several pages of original material, then copy-and-paste that a few times.
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Scott5114

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Re: Misbehaving during standardized tests
« Reply #101 on: January 25, 2019, 02:45:17 AM »

non-standardized tests (i.e. those drawn up and proctored by the teachers themselves, which makes up the vast majority of them) were marked up in red pen and returned same as any other homework. How is learning even possible without the ability to know what you got wrong? (If I put that the 16th president was Abraham Omaha and never get feedback that I was wrong, I'm apt to keep thinking well of good old President Omaha.) This has cumulative effects in some subjects—if you fail to comprehend certain math topics, you have no hope of understanding more advanced topics that rely on those.

When you say "marked up", do you mean the correct answer was written in?  Or just that the question was marked as wrong?

It depended on the type of assignment and the teacher:

  • Some particularly lazy teachers would just mark an X, but at least this let you look up the correct answer yourself if you wanted to take the initiative to do so. At the very least, you could approach the teacher and say "Why did I get question so-and-so wrong" and force them to justify it. If it was a marginal case, sometimes you could lawyer them into partial credit.
  • If it was multiple choice (the most common form of tests that I remember taking) the correct answer would usually be circled.
  • If it was fill in the blank or anything like that with short, definite answers, the correct one would often be written in.
  • Math teachers were generally insistent that you'd show your work; this meant that they could sometimes pick out what you did wrong and would circle the step that you got wrong. Some that taught more advanced math or science would even give you partial credit for demonstrating that you knew the process they were actually testing on, if you only got the wrong answer because you whiffed basic addition or something like that along the way.
  • Writing assignments (creative writing and essays) were generally graded with standard proofreading marks and the number of points deducted written in the margin. Some teachers would write brief remarks like "Unclear, does this refer to Caesar or Antony?" or "Contradicts what was stated in 4th paragraph" or stuff like that. I even had one English teacher that seemed to do running Roger Ebert-style commentary in the margins. I enjoyed that class because I got a good feel of her particularly dark sense of humor and writing things that she found enjoyable was a fun challenge.
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Roadgeekteen

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Re: Misbehaving during standardized tests
« Reply #102 on: January 25, 2019, 08:51:48 AM »

non-standardized tests (i.e. those drawn up and proctored by the teachers themselves, which makes up the vast majority of them) were marked up in red pen and returned same as any other homework. How is learning even possible without the ability to know what you got wrong? (If I put that the 16th president was Abraham Omaha and never get feedback that I was wrong, I'm apt to keep thinking well of good old President Omaha.) This has cumulative effects in some subjects—if you fail to comprehend certain math topics, you have no hope of understanding more advanced topics that rely on those.

When you say "marked up", do you mean the correct answer was written in?  Or just that the question was marked as wrong?

It depended on the type of assignment and the teacher:

  • Some particularly lazy teachers would just mark an X, but at least this let you look up the correct answer yourself if you wanted to take the initiative to do so. At the very least, you could approach the teacher and say "Why did I get question so-and-so wrong" and force them to justify it. If it was a marginal case, sometimes you could lawyer them into partial credit.
  • If it was multiple choice (the most common form of tests that I remember taking) the correct answer would usually be circled.
  • If it was fill in the blank or anything like that with short, definite answers, the correct one would often be written in.
  • Math teachers were generally insistent that you'd show your work; this meant that they could sometimes pick out what you did wrong and would circle the step that you got wrong. Some that taught more advanced math or science would even give you partial credit for demonstrating that you knew the process they were actually testing on, if you only got the wrong answer because you whiffed basic addition or something like that along the way.
  • Writing assignments (creative writing and essays) were generally graded with standard proofreading marks and the number of points deducted written in the margin. Some teachers would write brief remarks like "Unclear, does this refer to Caesar or Antony?" or "Contradicts what was stated in 4th paragraph" or stuff like that. I even had one English teacher that seemed to do running Roger Ebert-style commentary in the margins. I enjoyed that class because I got a good feel of her particularly dark sense of humor and writing things that she found enjoyable was a fun challenge.
Almost all teachers give partial credit. Sometimes the work is worth more than the answer.
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Ben114

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Re: Misbehaving during standardized tests
« Reply #103 on: January 26, 2019, 07:45:00 PM »

In Massachusetts, Lexington and almost anywhere within 2 towns teaches students correctly.
and private schools
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GCrites80s

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Re: Misbehaving during standardized tests
« Reply #104 on: January 29, 2019, 08:31:07 PM »

When I was in the 12th grade, the entire school was taking some standardized test (don't remember which one) and that's when the school decided to bring in the drug-sniffing dogs to sniff the lockers and the cars in the student lot. Two kids got busted: a teacher's kid and a buddy of mine that is now a cop.
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Roadgeekteen

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Re: Misbehaving during standardized tests
« Reply #105 on: January 29, 2019, 09:13:15 PM »

When I was in the 12th grade, the entire school was taking some standardized test (don't remember which one) and that's when the school decided to bring in the drug-sniffing dogs to sniff the lockers and the cars in the student lot. Two kids got busted: a teacher's kid and a buddy of mine that is now a cop.
Why would drugs be a concern with standardized tests?
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MNHighwayMan

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Re: Misbehaving during standardized tests
« Reply #106 on: January 29, 2019, 09:14:33 PM »

When I was in the 12th grade, the entire school was taking some standardized test (don't remember which one) and that's when the school decided to bring in the drug-sniffing dogs to sniff the lockers and the cars in the student lot. Two kids got busted: a teacher's kid and a buddy of mine that is now a cop.
Why would drugs be a concern with standardized tests?

Can't be having average scores weighed down by the pot-smoking hippies.
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abefroman329

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Re: Misbehaving during standardized tests
« Reply #107 on: January 29, 2019, 09:22:02 PM »

When I was in the 12th grade, the entire school was taking some standardized test (don't remember which one) and that's when the school decided to bring in the drug-sniffing dogs to sniff the lockers and the cars in the student lot. Two kids got busted: a teacher's kid and a buddy of mine that is now a cop.
Why would drugs be a concern with standardized tests?
I think the idea was that it was one of the few times when all of the students were in class and the cops could do this.

God knows how they got probable cause to search the entire school and the parking lot, other than some bootlicking principal.
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TheHighwayMan394

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Re: Misbehaving during standardized tests
« Reply #108 on: January 30, 2019, 01:39:20 AM »

When I was in the 12th grade, the entire school was taking some standardized test (don't remember which one) and that's when the school decided to bring in the drug-sniffing dogs to sniff the lockers and the cars in the student lot. Two kids got busted: a teacher's kid and a buddy of mine that is now a cop.
Why would drugs be a concern with standardized tests?
God knows how they got probable cause to search the entire school and the parking lot, other than some bootlicking principal.

My impression is schools have generally felt they need little legal cause to abuse intimidate protect students, basically “you have no privacy/search protection rights on school grounds”.
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Roadgeekteen

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Re: Misbehaving during standardized tests
« Reply #109 on: January 30, 2019, 10:48:05 AM »

When I was in the 12th grade, the entire school was taking some standardized test (don't remember which one) and that's when the school decided to bring in the drug-sniffing dogs to sniff the lockers and the cars in the student lot. Two kids got busted: a teacher's kid and a buddy of mine that is now a cop.
Why would drugs be a concern with standardized tests?
God knows how they got probable cause to search the entire school and the parking lot, other than some bootlicking principal.

My impression is schools have generally felt they need little legal cause to abuse intimidate protect students, basically “you have no privacy/search protection rights on school grounds”.
From the sound of it this does not seem to threaten students.
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MNHighwayMan

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Re: Misbehaving during standardized tests
« Reply #110 on: January 30, 2019, 11:11:27 AM »

From the sound of it this does not seem to threaten students.

I had a couple of classmates who died from snorting too much marijuana.

WHY WON'T YOU THINK OF THE CHILDREN!?
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abefroman329

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Re: Misbehaving during standardized tests
« Reply #111 on: January 30, 2019, 11:50:46 AM »

From the sound of it this does not seem to threaten students.

I had a couple of classmates who died from snorting too much marijuana.

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kphoger

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Re: Misbehaving during standardized tests
« Reply #112 on: January 30, 2019, 01:31:09 PM »

Question:  If you drive to my house, park in my driveway, and bring your luggage into my living room... then the police want to search your car and your luggage... do you still have to give consent, or is it my decision because everything is on my property?
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Re: Misbehaving during standardized tests
« Reply #113 on: January 30, 2019, 02:01:23 PM »

Nobody does that these days. It wouldn't be worth failing the test/coming back to retake it and if anyone did make that happen they'd probably get crucified.
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abefroman329

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Re: Misbehaving during standardized tests
« Reply #114 on: January 30, 2019, 02:11:27 PM »

Question:  If you drive to my house, park in my driveway, and bring your luggage into my living room... then the police want to search your car and your luggage... do you still have to give consent, or is it my decision because everything is on my property?
IANAL
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kphoger

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Re: Misbehaving during standardized tests
« Reply #115 on: January 30, 2019, 03:37:17 PM »

Question:  If you drive to my house, park in my driveway, and bring your luggage into my living room... then the police want to search your car and your luggage... do you still have to give consent, or is it my decision because everything is on my property?
IANAL

The reason I asked is that's basically what students do when they come to school:  leave their car in the parking lot, put their backpack in the locker...
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Scott5114

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Re: Misbehaving during standardized tests
« Reply #116 on: January 30, 2019, 04:49:57 PM »

From personal experience, I can say that you would have to give consent, because the offending luggage is in your house. I had a situation where I had a roommate that was staying with me on-and-off but not on the lease (she had problems with her parents that led to her intermittently not having a place to stay otherwise). At some point, Norman PD had reason to think she had marijuana, so I woke up to the sound of the police officers in my living room. They tried to get me, as the leaseholder, to consent to searching the bedroom she was staying in, trying the "if you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear" tactic, and I pushed back by pointing out that I had been asleep during whatever events had transpired that caused them to be in my apartment, so until I understood that, I couldn't consider the search reasonable, and if they felt otherwise to go get a warrant. They declined to do so and left.

Keeping in mind, as hinted to above, legally schools are considered to have the authority to do whatever they want to students; most legal rights, including constitutional ones, are nullified on school grounds. So sayeth the Supreme Court.
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kphoger

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Re: Misbehaving during standardized tests
« Reply #117 on: January 30, 2019, 04:54:23 PM »

I was really asking the reverse:  would the police have legally needed your roommates permission anyway?
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