Unsafe right turn lane that crosses ramp lanes

[Ned Weasel]

I'm almost more concerned with the driveway entrance immediately to the west of it.  How far out of their way do cars traveling on eastbound FL 530 usually go in order to turn around and find their way into that right turn?  How many of them say "Eff that!" and illegally turn left into that driveway?

That's illegal because of the striped off area (assuming crossing one is actually illegal in Florida), but nothing prohibits making a left at the church entrance, left onto the onramp, and then right at the driveway.

(PS: it's CR 530, and only according to the state, not the county.)

You know, I was thinking about this some more, and I realized that the designer of these intersections clearly didn't intend a left turn in either of those two situations (with or without the diagonally striped area).  While turning a vehicle to the left is physically possible at both of those intersections, I think such a maneuver can only be theoretically analyzed as a U-turn immediately followed by a right lane change and right exit.  This is because both of those right turns function as ramps that diverge from the roadway, as indicated by both the non-perpendicular geometry and the continuous solid line that encloses each exit lane.  Furthermore, the exit ramp that leads to the church driveway contains a neutral area, and I was not aware that it was legal to use a neutral area as part of a pathway for travel, although (upon looking this up right now) I can't readily find anything saying it isn't.

Those are just some additional thoughts on the subject.  I think if the designer intends for a left turn to be allowed in either of those situations, he or she should design both the pavement markings and roadway geometry to make this apparent.

[kendancy66]

We had something similar to that situation on Telegraph Road (VA-241) in Alexandria, Virginia, just north of the Capital Beltway (I-95/495) for many years, actually for longer than I can remember. Traffic coming north on Telegraph wanting to turn right onto Pershing Avenue had to cross over another lane that entered on the right from the Beltway exit ramps (the ramps from both sides of the Beltway combined into a single ramp). It meant you turned right in front of some very fast-moving traffic and it wasn't at all safe. I do not remember whether the exit ramp traffic had a "yield" sign, either, because their lane became a thru lane. Even if they did, it didn't matter: People didn't yield. The point Brian556 makes about the situation seen in the OP applied, too–there was no warning sign for people unfamiliar with the area.

I guess VDOT recognized the hazard because as part of the Wilson Bridge reconstruction over the past 10 years they redesigned that spot. Traffic making the right turn now has to turn right about half a mile or so earlier and take a new ramp that flies up and over the Beltway.

Historic Aerials view from 2002, prior to construction, is here: http://www.historicaerials.com/aerials.php?scale=8E-06&lat=38.8024613661915&lon=-77.0754152548827&year=2002  Pershing Avenue is the horizontally-oriented street on the right side about halfway up the image. It's a little hard to see, but what happened was that traffic exiting the Beltway had their own right-turn lane onto Pershing cut across the ramp traffic and turned on the other side of the little grassy island there.

Satellite view (zoomed out a bit more) from sometime within the past two years: http://goo.gl/maps/OoW5M  Notice how the right turn from Telegraph is gone. You now use the flyover seen at the bottom of the picture and you come out at the traffic light to the right of the Holiday Inn located next to the exit ramps there. Previously to reach that light you went right on Pershing and right again at the next light.

From 1995-1996, That right turn was part of my daily commute to office on Eisenhower.  I came from Kings Highway, turned right on Telegraph, and then turned right at Pershing.  One question you had was concerning placement of YIELD sign.  There was a YIELD sign for traffic on the ramp, but like you said it was ignored, because the ramp became the right lane on Telegraph. I believe that a STOP sign might have made it safer for turning from Telegraph, but could have caused congestion on ramp also.  People coming off the ramp were most likely were not expecting the people approaching on Telegraph to want to turn right on Pershing.  What I would do is approach with caution and look for space between cars where I could cut in.  It seemed that a lot of the traffic coming off that ramp wanted to turn right there, so they not going too fast.  If I saw that the car had right turn signal I would try to get in from of them.   I also watched for people going fast, and assumed that they were not turning right there, and try to let those cars go by first.  I would have used Eisenhower connector instead to get to work, had that option been there at the time.