I've no problem with the politics of this, but does it comply with the MUTCD?

[Alps]

Green bike lanes to attempt to mitigate shitty design (e.g. bike lane to right of right turn lane).

The entirety of Broadway being painted I believe blue for several blocks, or red, or something like that. A particular agency considered making a particular HOV lane a different color in the NYC area (I can't go into details for various reasons, so don't ask), but decided the maintenance of paint would be too much, and pigmented pavement is unproven under heavy traffic loads.

[The High Plains Traveler]

...then you have engineering students painting street center stripes green for St. Patrick's Day.

[empirestate]

The entirety of Broadway being painted I believe blue for several blocks, or red, or something like that. A particular agency considered making a particular HOV lane a different color in the NYC area (I can't go into details for various reasons, so don't ask), but decided the maintenance of paint would be too much, and pigmented pavement is unproven under heavy traffic loads.

The pedestrianized parts of Broadway are variously blue or some kind of weird blue/white/black/purple swirly mix:
http://goo.gl/maps/D6IOQ

Also: http://goo.gl/maps/mhOCy (but step just one click to the right to see it pre-pedestrianization!)

And dedicated bus lanes, a form of HOV I suppose, are a dull red:
http://goo.gl/maps/jZ7dB

And yes, the green bike lanes as well:
http://goo.gl/maps/SgSsE

[Kacie Jane]

and/or just delete everything except the first post and then re-open it with a strong warning.

To be fair, we did perform the miracle of making it a page and a half before we got into the politics of it.  Plenty of on-topic stuff here.

[6a]

 

and/or just delete everything except the first post and then re-open it with a strong warning.

To be fair, we did perform the miracle of making it a page and a half before we got into the politics of it.  Plenty of on-topic stuff here.

No way I 'm going to read all this shit.  Let me guess, whatever the other person thought is wrong and you should be ashamed of yourself for taking away the rights of those who feel differently.

[vtk]

between two adjacent intersections both of which have signals[/url]

I'm trying to think of an instance where there are two which are inconveniently far apart... maybe on US-395 between towns, or something? 

though I don't recall any town where the most extreme intersection is signalized.  usually the first few side streets on the outskirts of town have STOP signs for the side roads.

South Bloomfield, OH has traffic lights at the extreme ends of US 23's passage through the town.  On the north end, the next intersection along US 23 (with a public road) is also signalized, and it's a half-mile up the road.  Crossing between those points would be illegal, right?  A few more miles to the north, at OH 762, signs prohibit pedestrians crossing any of the 4 sides of the intersection.  How's that for a clusterf***?

Topic: I've no problem with the politics of this, but does it comply with the MUTCD?

The more I think about it, the more uncomfortable I am with people's sexual habits–gay or straight–being incorporated into a traffic device.  It wouldn't be socially couth for me to have a bumper sticker that said "I have sex with my wife," so why is it OK to have a gay pride flag bumper sticker?

OK, let's say I decided to make a bumper sticker that says "I have sex with my wife" (or a straight pride flag sticker); that should be my right.  Or let's say I decided to fly an actual flag outside my home; that should be my right.

If I saw a bumper sticker on a car that says "I have sex with my wife" I'd want to give the owner a high-five.  It doesn't matter if the owner is a man or a woman.  You could replace "wife" with "husband" and I'd have the same reaction.  Because married couples don't always have decent sex lives (with each other).  It's like when that foot-fetish video surfaced that an NFL coach took of his wife, and I was like "A man married for so many years has an interesting sex life with his wife? Good for him!"  And yes it's your right to display "straight pride" stuff, though it seems to me sometimes people say "straight pride" when they really mean "gay bashing" – do you really need to express pride at being in a majority?

Anyway, I think this kind of recognition of a minority enclave neighborhood is cool.  It doesn't always have to be expressed in a modified traffic control device, but it sounds to me like they didn't mess up too badly in this case. 



Yes, I totally jumped on the bandwagon and added a rainbow to my avatar.  I assume that trend is a result of this thread...

[roadfro]

Wonder if the various colors of paint will meet reflectivity standards? Or how long it will hold up under constant vehicular traffic?

The only aspect of the crosswalk that would need to meet reflectivity standards would be the longitudinal white lines surrounding the rainbow coloring, as that is what legally establishes the crosswalk. The rainbow paint colors are not part of the traffic control device, and aren't necessarily governed by the MUTCD unless they interfere with the contrast of white lines or appear to too closely resemble some other traffic control device.

The more interesting question is how long the colors will last under vehicular traffic. Being a solid paint application, it will definitely wear down quicker within the typical wheel path and possibly become not so aesthetically pleasing after a short time.

Appreciating the symbolism of what the rainbow represents, I don't think I would have chosen this application which would wear out to the point of needing frequent reapplication to maintain the look--especially given the initial cost. The street name sign example shown previously would have been more cost effective long term and easier to do on a larger scale--this crosswalk method, however, provides a bold impact and statement, which I assume is what the city may have felt was more meaningful or desired.

[cpzilliacus]

Wonder if the various colors of paint will meet reflectivity standards? Or how long it will hold up under constant vehicular traffic?

That is a very good question. 

I don't think it's going to last very long (though at least they don't get all that much rain in West Hollywood).

[cpzilliacus]

And for that matter, what are some other examples of "novelty" pavement marking like this? I mentioned lilac-themed crosswalks in Rochester and some green or red-white-blue centerlines; what else? 

Various purple paint schemes on the pavement leading to E-ZPass (Only) lanes, though they don't seem to be consistent at all.

[agentsteel53]

Boston's Freedom Trail is marked with a red stripe, and I seem to recall that at some point the centerline of a road open to motor vehicles is red, white and blue.

(this info is from personal experience when I was a kid - i.e. early 90s.  it may not be accurate, or the case anymore.  someone please verify?)

[kphoger]

That's why a rainbow crosswalk, to me, is more than just advocating equal rights.  To me, it is advocating moral equality, and that is a realm I firmly believe the government should stay out of.

In a way, that's exactly the point. The rainbow symbol celebrates people's right to practice diverse lifestyles without oversight of government (along with other societal judgements). So, by employing the rainbow, the government of West Hollywood is indeed affirming its duty as a government to be permissive of these lifestyles. It is akin to displaying any of the various symbols of liberty and freedom we see so frequently at public and private locations around the nation.

That there's an element of sex is unquestionable, just as there's an element of sex in any celebration of parenthood, or of religious family principles. But we don't consider them explicitly when we celebrate these things, and they are not what the rainbow symbolizes. When we advocate for second amendment rights, we're referring to our right to protect ourselves with weapons; the second amendment isn't about the pathological details of how a bullet creates injury or death. And when we go to a wedding in a church, we don't feel the need to explain to the children present what the newlywed couple is now anatomically permitted to do in the church's eyes.

So if you ever need to explain the rainbow to children (who will probably be more interested in it as just a bunch of pretty colors anyhow), just say that it means people have the right to live their lives as the people they are, as long as it doesn't hurt anyone.

A hundred thanks for this well-spoken reply.  Your reply alone has done more to change my feelings towards the rainbow crosswalk than every other post on here put together.  In fact, I keep marvelling at the reasonableness of your remarks.  If you just put that together off the cuff, then I am awed; if you took a long time to carefully construct the argument, then I am humbly grateful for your consideration.  I can now appreciate the rainbow flag/crosswalk/bumper sticker/whatever.  Not only am I no longer upset by it (as opposed to my ho-hum, noncommittal attitude towards it before this thread), but I can now appreciate it as a symbol of noble democratic values.  Again, I thank you.

And for that matter, what are some other examples of "novelty" pavement marking like this? I mentioned lilac-themed crosswalks in Rochester and some green or red-white-blue centerlines; what else? 

I recall reading an article about the whole surface of a highway being a different color to alert drivers of a reduced speed limit.  It was somewhere on the Arabian peninsula, but I'm unable to hunt down the article on Google based on my shoddy memory right now.  The colorant may also have been added to the paving material, rather than applied on top.  Does anyone remember this?

The only aspect of the crosswalk that would need to meet reflectivity standards would be the longitudinal white lines surrounding the rainbow coloring, as that is what legally establishes the crosswalk. The rainbow paint colors are not part of the traffic control device, and aren't necessarily governed by the MUTCD unless they interfere with the contrast of white lines or appear to too closely resemble some other traffic control device.

The color contrast was called into question further upthread, but I don't think it was really discussed, what with the heated debate over freedom, sexuality, and what it means to be human [ ].  I would like to hear from the more engineer-ish folks on here what their take is on the color contrast aspect of the crosswalk.

[Duke87]

and I seem to recall that at some point the centerline of a road open to motor vehicles is red, white and blue.

Bristol, Rhode Island, along the route of the nation's oldest 4th of July parade.

The color contrast was called into question further upthread, but I don't think it was really discussed, what with the heated debate over freedom, sexuality, and what it means to be human [ ].  I would like to hear from the more engineer-ish folks on here what their take is on the color contrast aspect of the crosswalk.

We're talking really bright colors on black pavement. Even if the adjacent colors in the rainbow don't contrast well with each other (the very nature of a rainbow is that each color fades into the next, after all), the rainbow as a whole will contrast perfectly well with the pavement on either side - which is what matters from a functional standpoint.

[Darkchylde]

Actually, what I'd tend to worry about in this circumstance is all that paint ending up wet. Slick paint = handling nightmare. Luckily, this is in Southern California...

[kphoger]

and I seem to recall that at some point the centerline of a road open to motor vehicles is red, white and blue.

Bristol, Rhode Island, along the route of the nation's oldest 4th of July parade.

The color contrast was called into question further upthread, but I don't think it was really discussed, what with the heated debate over freedom, sexuality, and what it means to be human [ ].  I would like to hear from the more engineer-ish folks on here what their take is on the color contrast aspect of the crosswalk.

We're talking really bright colors on black pavement. Even if the adjacent colors in the rainbow don't contrast well with each other (the very nature of a rainbow is that each color fades into the next, after all), the rainbow as a whole will contrast perfectly well with the pavement on either side - which is what matters from a functional standpoint.

I agree that it contrasts well with the pavement.  But are there specific criteria that are used to determine if it contrasts enough, or is this something that's just generally not called into question?  Also, I was actually thinking more of the contrast between the rainbow and the white lines.  To my eyes, it contrasts less with the white, simply because I naturally view the entire painted portion as one whole.

[Alps]

and I seem to recall that at some point the centerline of a road open to motor vehicles is red, white and blue.

Bristol, Rhode Island, along the route of the nation's oldest 4th of July parade.

The color contrast was called into question further upthread, but I don't think it was really discussed, what with the heated debate over freedom, sexuality, and what it means to be human [ ].  I would like to hear from the more engineer-ish folks on here what their take is on the color contrast aspect of the crosswalk.

We're talking really bright colors on black pavement. Even if the adjacent colors in the rainbow don't contrast well with each other (the very nature of a rainbow is that each color fades into the next, after all), the rainbow as a whole will contrast perfectly well with the pavement on either side - which is what matters from a functional standpoint.

I agree that it contrasts well with the pavement.  But are there specific criteria that are used to determine if it contrasts enough, or is this something that's just generally not called into question?  Also, I was actually thinking more of the contrast between the rainbow and the white lines.  To my eyes, it contrasts less with the white, simply because I naturally view the entire painted portion as one whole.

The white lines itself are the primary concern. As long as those remain clear and reflective to denote the crosswalk, the colors in the middle should not do anything to lessen the appearance of "something's going across the road here that looks crosswalkish."

[empirestate]

A hundred thanks for this well-spoken reply.  Your reply alone has done more to change my feelings towards the rainbow crosswalk than every other post on here put together.  In fact, I keep marvelling at the reasonableness of your remarks.  If you just put that together off the cuff, then I am awed; if you took a long time to carefully construct the argument, then I am humbly grateful for your consideration.  I can now appreciate the rainbow flag/crosswalk/bumper sticker/whatever.  Not only am I no longer upset by it (as opposed to my ho-hum, noncommittal attitude towards it before this thread), but I can now appreciate it as a symbol of noble democratic values.  Again, I thank you.

I am very gratified–your humble servant.

[TXtoNJ]

is Chancellor Street in the gay district, or is it an unrelated rainbow?

If you knew Philly, the pizza place in the background would have answered that question for you.

[Zmapper]

Actually, what I'd tend to worry about in this circumstance is all that paint ending up wet. Slick paint = handling nightmare. Luckily, this is in Southern California...

I find the green-painted bike box here to have adequate traction during wet conditions. I don't know about the sidewalk in question here, but the stuff used for green bike lanes typically is done with a special thermoplastic that has extra traction built in.

[vtk]

The rainbow has absolutely nothing to do with sex, it has to do with pride and anti-discrimination.

That's not entirely true:

The original gay-pride flag was hand-dyed by Gilbert Baker. ... The flag consisted of eight stripes; Baker assigned specific meaning to each of the colours:

hot pink: sexuality
red: life
orange: healing
yellow: sunlight
green: nature
turquoise: magic/art
indigo/blue: serenity/harmony
violet: spirit

After the ... assassination of ... Harvey Milk, demand for the rainbow flag greatly increased. To meet demand, the Paramount Flag Company began selling a version of the flag using stock rainbow fabric consisting of seven stripes of red, orange, yellow, green, turquoise, blue, and violet. As Baker ramped up production of his version of the flag, he too dropped the hot pink stripe because of the unavailability of hot-pink fabric.

In 1979 the flag was modified again. When hung vertically from the lamp posts of San Francisco's Market Street, the center stripe was obscured by the post itself. Changing the flag design to one with an even number of stripes was the easiest way to rectify this, so the turquoise stripe was dropped, which resulted in a six stripe version of the flag – red, orange, yellow, green, blue, and violet.

Due to mundane practical reasons, the sex stripe is no longer part of the pride flag – but it used to be!