AARoads Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

New rules for political content in signatures and user profiles. See this thread for details.

Author Topic: WV Turnpike: 30 more years of tolls  (Read 5328 times)

SP Cook

  • *
  • Online Online

  • Posts: 1943
  • Last Login: Today at 09:07:21 AM
WV Turnpike: 30 more years of tolls
« on: September 05, 2013, 06:21:29 AM »

http://wvmetronews.com/2013/09/05/governors-blue-ribbon-commission-presents-proposals/

Governor presents three proposals for highway funding.

- Raise and then continue tolls on the WV Turnpike, which was actually paid off in 1987 and under the ginned up accounting of that "temporary" toll continuance at that time pays off again in 2020, for 30 more years (meaning forever).

- Raise DMV fees.

- Change the sales tax on auto parts and services from the ordinary general tax to a road tax.

Logged

cpzilliacus

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 10295
  • Age: 60
  • Location: Maryland
  • Last Login: September 17, 2019, 10:13:00 PM
Re: WV Turnpike: 30 more years of tolls
« Reply #1 on: September 08, 2013, 06:29:00 PM »

TOLLROADSnews: WV financing commission proposes following Ohio, Pennsylvania into debt-based spending on non-toll roads

Quote
An advisory commission on highway financing in West Virginia is recommending that the state follow the example of Ohio and Pennsylvania and use prospective future Turnpike revenues as the basis for greatly expanded borrowing on behalf of non-revenue generating roads. The advisory commission - described as a "Blue Ribbon Commission on Highways" - is recommending a new highway financing plan the centerpiece of which would have the West Virginia Parkways Authority (WVPA) raise an extra $1 billion in debt secured to the toll revenues of the West Virginia Turnpike.

Quote
Present WVPA debt totals $76.7m and interest expense of only $4.3m/yr - an average interest rate of 5.6%.

Quote
The commission has not yet laid out how it would expect the $1 billion of new debt to be serviced but back-of-the-envelop calculations suggest that kind of borrowing for projects generating zero new revenues for the Parkway would have to cost it an absolute minimum of $56m/year in extra interest expense. More likely the Authority's borrowing costs would be higher because of the greater risk to lenders of the huge debt - so $70m a year is more likely. Retiring the bonds over 25 years would cost $40m/year so this borrowing would cost the Parkways Authority an extra $110m/year in debt service.

Quote
Traffic on the Turnpike is not growing. Toll transactions peaked in 2004 at 35.41m, dropped to 33.61m in 2009 and have now recovered to 35.06m. Truck traffic which generates half the revenue peaked in 2006 at 8.44m, dropped to 7.10m in 2009 and is now back to 7.52m.
Logged
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

froggie

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 10755
  • Location: Greensboro, VT
  • Last Login: September 17, 2019, 08:07:59 PM
    • Froggie's Place
Re: WV Turnpike: 30 more years of tolls
« Reply #2 on: September 10, 2013, 03:58:46 AM »

Yeah, cause we see how well that's working for Pennsylvania...delayed projects and overestimated revenues...
Logged

thenetwork

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 2345
  • Age: 2015
  • Location: Grand Junction, Colorado
  • Last Login: September 17, 2019, 05:45:52 PM
Re: WV Turnpike: 30 more years of tolls
« Reply #3 on: September 10, 2013, 08:49:35 AM »

IMHO, most "locals" near the WV Turnpike aren't affected by the tolls, seeing that you only pay *if* you pass through a toll barrier -- they don't toll exits (exception being US 19 in Beckley) -- so shunpiking is relatively easy, and the locals know where to get on and off the Turnpike to avoid paying the "out-of-towner fees".

Logged

seicer

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 1287
  • Last Login: Today at 07:09:07 AM
Re: WV Turnpike: 30 more years of tolls
« Reply #4 on: September 10, 2013, 10:42:19 AM »

I haven't found a good way to shunpike the upper two tolls. One involves a winding Paint Creek Road that adds 30-40 minutes, the other is winding two-lane roads (Paint Creek and WV 61) that adds 1 hour.
Logged

Henry

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 5016
  • Age: 49
  • Location: Chicago, IL/Seattle, WA
  • Last Login: September 17, 2019, 08:39:49 PM
    • Henry Watson's Online Freeway
Re: WV Turnpike: 30 more years of tolls
« Reply #5 on: September 10, 2013, 01:21:08 PM »

So by then I'll be too old to drive (80 years old in 2050)... :no:
Logged
Go Cubs Go! Go Cubs Go! Hey Chicago, what do you say? The Cubs are gonna win today!

SP Cook

  • *
  • Online Online

  • Posts: 1943
  • Last Login: Today at 09:07:21 AM
Re: WV Turnpike: 30 more years of tolls
« Reply #6 on: September 10, 2013, 07:13:58 PM »

There is no effective "shunpike" for any of the toll locations, IMHO.  The elimination of the "side tolls" (except for US 19) was a part of the 1987 toll extension.  I would look for the legislature to exact some more concessions for the executive as a part of this toll extension.  Probably demand more serious business practices, a commitment to a deep EZ-Pass discount (the current proposal only PROMISES one), and perhaps other things.

The DMV fee increase will also be controversial with the legislature.  While WV has high property taxes on vehicles (which go to the county school board), the DMV fees are fairly small (car registration is $30/year, DL is $13/5 years).  The legislature, at the governor's request, bit the election year bullet and raised these, only to have the gov veto the bill on live TV, saying he opposed "tax increases".  Some legislators feel they were left holding the bag.

 
Logged

cpzilliacus

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 10295
  • Age: 60
  • Location: Maryland
  • Last Login: September 17, 2019, 10:13:00 PM
Re: WV Turnpike: 30 more years of tolls
« Reply #7 on: September 10, 2013, 08:52:37 PM »

Yeah, cause we see how well that's working for Pennsylvania...delayed projects and overestimated revenues...

Though I don't think West Virginia has the burden of not one, but two large and expensive transit systems like Pennsylvania does - that are supposed to be subsidized out of Turnpike revenues.
Logged
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

froggie

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 10755
  • Location: Greensboro, VT
  • Last Login: September 17, 2019, 08:07:59 PM
    • Froggie's Place
Re: WV Turnpike: 30 more years of tolls
« Reply #8 on: September 11, 2013, 04:21:01 AM »

That doesn't really matter to the basic principle.  Bottom line is the Pennsylvania Legislature bit off more than they could chew, especially when FHWA put the konk on the plan to toll I-80, which was integral to Act 44 revenue.
Logged

cpzilliacus

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 10295
  • Age: 60
  • Location: Maryland
  • Last Login: September 17, 2019, 10:13:00 PM
Re: WV Turnpike: 30 more years of tolls
« Reply #9 on: September 11, 2013, 05:38:22 AM »

That doesn't really matter to the basic principle.  Bottom line is the Pennsylvania Legislature bit off more than they could chew, especially when FHWA put the konk on the plan to toll I-80, which was integral to Act 44 revenue.

If the Act 44 payments continue, the Turnpike will eventually become insolvent. 

Not sure when that happens, but at some point, bond markets are not going to purchase Pennsylvania Turnpike Commission  bonds, when  the proceeds of those bond payments are sent to SEPTA and the Port Authority of Allegheny County to pay employees and to PennDOT to fund non-Turnpike projects.

I don't know if it is possible for an agency  of state government to end up in receivership or bankruptcy court, but that is where the PTC is headed if the Act 44 payments do not go away.

Regarding I-80, the federal government could not approve the transfer of the highway to the PTC for the purpose of raising money for PennDOT and transit agencies far from the I-80 corridor.  But if someone in Harrisburg had been thinking strategically, they would have tolled I-80 with  the idea that the I-80 revenues stay in the  I-80 corridor.  That would not have produced the flood of cash that the Act 44 promoters were expecting for diversion to transit subsidies and non-I-80 highway projects, but it would have provided a fair amount of relief to the PennDOT budget anyway, since PennDOT would no longer have had to fund any repairs or maintenance or reconstruction of I-80.
Logged
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

hbelkins

  • *
  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 13427
  • It is well, it is well, with my soul.

  • Age: 57
  • Location: Kentucky
  • Last Login: September 17, 2019, 12:29:12 PM
    • Millennium Highway
Re: WV Turnpike: 30 more years of tolls
« Reply #10 on: September 11, 2013, 12:09:59 PM »

I haven't found a good way to shunpike the upper two tolls. One involves a winding Paint Creek Road that adds 30-40 minutes, the other is winding two-lane roads (Paint Creek and WV 61) that adds 1 hour.

There is no effective "shunpike" for any of the toll locations, IMHO.

It's a bit of a pain in the butt to shunpike the Cabin Creek toll plaza. Doing so involves getting off at the US 60/WV 61 exit, then going south on WV 61 and then using CR 79/3.

It's easier to bypass the Mossy toll booth. There is a road (CR 23) that runs parallel to the turnpike. Just get off at Mossy and get back on at Pax, or vice versa.

Here's how that road looked in 2007. It's narrow but some improvements had been recently made, probably because of shunpiking.



I drove parallel routes all the way from Charleston to Beckley back in 2007, except for the part where there is no parallel road and you have to use the turnpike.

Photos are at http://www.millenniumhwy.net/WV_turnpike_toll_bypass/WV_turnpike_toll_bypass.html
Logged

seicer

  • *
  • Offline Offline

  • Posts: 1287
  • Last Login: Today at 07:09:07 AM
Re: WV Turnpike: 30 more years of tolls
« Reply #11 on: September 11, 2013, 01:16:53 PM »

Looks like they cleaned the road quite a bit. The last time I was on that stretch, for the small waterfalls in that valley, it was down to one lane and had significant growth on both "shoulders."
Logged

SP Cook

  • *
  • Online Online

  • Posts: 1943
  • Last Login: Today at 09:07:21 AM
Re: WV Turnpike: 30 more years of tolls
« Reply #12 on: September 11, 2013, 06:12:59 PM »

Logged

 


Opinions expressed here on belong solely to the poster and do not represent or reflect the opinions or beliefs of AARoads, its creators and/or associates.