New Jersey Turnpike

[jeffandnicole]

Regarding the proposed 2020 capital plan, next to each project is a schedule without an actual date, only a number of months. Does this indicate the number of months from when this plan was released, for example, one project says 6 months for designing and planning while construction states 18 months. Does this mean it will be completed sometime in 2022? I imagine we will start seeing these projects pop up during this decade ahead.

No...they are proposed length of time of construction. These were only public hearings. The toll increase still needs to be voted on and approved. After that, assuming the full toll increase is granted, then they can formulate a timeline of when projects will start being funded, designed, and constructed.

[storm2k]

Regarding the proposed 2020 capital plan, next to each project is a schedule without an actual date, only a number of months. Does this indicate the number of months from when this plan was released, for example, one project says 6 months for designing and planning while construction states 18 months. Does this mean it will be completed sometime in 2022? I imagine we will start seeing these projects pop up during this decade ahead.

No...they are proposed length of time of construction. These were only public hearings. The toll increase still needs to be voted on and approved. After that, assuming the full toll increase is granted, then they can formulate a timeline of when projects will start being funded, designed, and constructed.

The interesting thing to me is going to be if it gets rubber stamped this time. Usually these increases are rubber stamped, but in light of the pandemic I wonder if that will still be the case. I wonder if some NJ legislators are going to try to dip into toll revenue more to fund NJDOT projects via some kind of toll sharing scheme.

[odditude]

Regarding the proposed 2020 capital plan, next to each project is a schedule without an actual date, only a number of months. Does this indicate the number of months from when this plan was released, for example, one project says 6 months for designing and planning while construction states 18 months. Does this mean it will be completed sometime in 2022? I imagine we will start seeing these projects pop up during this decade ahead.

i would expect the times listed are the duration from start date, which for each job would be dependent on 1) approval for funding, 2) successful bidding of the project, and then 3) scheduling project kickoff.

[storm2k]

NJ.com: New toll hike, $24B construction plan approved by Turnpike board despite calls to delay

Despite calls from drivers and a leading state senator to delay action during a telephone public hearing, the board voted 7 to 0 to approve the toll increase and the $24 billion capital plan that included $16 billion to widen sections of the Turnpike and Garden State Parkway, permanently implement cashless toll payment and to replace a bridge between New Jersey and Pennsylvania.

The rest is the usual mix of nonsense, including calls from clueless people to spend money on other infrastructure and transit projects, even though the tolls keep the state from having to use gas tax money to maintain one of its most important highways.

[D-Dey65]

I just read a zipper on the turnpike's official website claiming that they're resuming cash tolls.

https://www.njta.com/

I never even knew they stopped taking them.

[Roadgeekteen]

I've never liked using Wilmington as a control city southbound, as the turnpike sort of doesn't go to Wilmington, and you have to backtrack to get there.

[roadman65]

I've never liked using Wilmington as a control city southbound, as the turnpike sort of doesn't go to Wilmington, and you have to backtrack to get there.

Close enough though.

I see it not a problem.  Heck I have seen worse control cities on some freeways.

[cpzilliacus]

I've never liked using Wilmington as a control city southbound, as the turnpike sort of doesn't go to Wilmington, and you have to backtrack to get there.

I prefer the Illinois approach in this case - IMO, the control city on the New Jersey Turnpike southbound south of Exit 6 should just be "Delaware" or maybe "Delaware and Maryland."

[cpzilliacus]

The rest is the usual mix of nonsense, including calls from clueless people to spend money on other infrastructure and transit projects, even though the tolls keep the state from having to use gas tax money to maintain one of its most important highways.

This is a standard tactic from the Sierra Club and other anti-highway/anti-auto groups.

Of course, this ignores:

(1)  NJTA already diverts money every year to NJDOT for non-Turnpike/non-Parkway projects.  See this which describes diversion in fiscal years 2018 and 2019.

(2) Revenue bonds sold by NJTA to raise dollars for capital projects on the Turnpike and Parkway are sold to people that expect to get their money  back with interest.   Transit in the U.S. does not collect enough revenue to fund any of its capital spending - all of it comes from sources other than the farebox.

(3) As you mention above, the NJTA does not normally get motor fuel tax revenue to operate or maintain its infrastructure.  Transit already does.  So in that sense,  it is a good thing that the NJTA frees up large sums of tax money that would otherwise have to be spent to maintain and operate the Turnpike and Parkway (if they were "free" roads).

(4) Objections to the NJTA proposed capital spending are not about transit patronage or air quality - they are about efforts to practice social engineering, in this instance, to "get people out of their cars," and has been remarkably unsuccessful since this sort of thing became popular in the 1960's and early 1970's.   

[jeffandnicole]

I just read a zipper on the turnpike's official website claiming that they're resuming cash tolls.

https://www.njta.com/

I never even knew they stopped taking them.

It was probably mixed in with all the other news, but the suspension of cash tolls was publicized in the news and on nearly every VMS sign on the Turnpike.

[bluecountry]

I've never liked using Wilmington as a control city southbound, as the turnpike sort of doesn't go to Wilmington, and you have to backtrack to get there.

I agree.

I hate Trenton and Camden being used as well.
IMO when entering the NJTP headed southbound before the PATP the control city need to be Philadelphia.
South of exit 6 it needs to be Wilmington/Baltimore-Washington.

[storm2k]

I've never liked using Wilmington as a control city southbound, as the turnpike sort of doesn't go to Wilmington, and you have to backtrack to get there.

I hate Trenton and Camden being used as well.
IMO when entering the NJTP headed southbound before the PATP the control city need to be Philadelphia.
South of exit 6 it needs to be Wilmington/Baltimore-Washington.

I agree.

Wilmington doesn't make as much sense now that the 95 connection is official and the direct route to Wilmington south of Philadelphia. However, it does meet with 495 and 95 once you're over the Del Mem Br, so it makes sense.

As for Trenton and Camden, it's been the Turnpike's MO since its earliest days to consider those as control cities. Trenton is the state capital so it's an important destination. Plus, there is no direct route to there from the North Jersey/NYC area other than Rt 1, which is not a great express route at this point. Camden is still a big city in NJ so that will forever stay there. I take more issue with the refusal to use Newark as a control city going NB. I would use New Brunswick, Newark/New York, and then New York, but that's just me. Ignoring Newark isn't just a NJTA thing. NJDOT is notorious for that as well. 78 and 22 both go directly through the city, and 78 is a main route to the airport there from the west, but those pretty much use New York except in a few instances (pullthrus at exit 29 that seem to have just withstood various replace in kind contracts for signs at this point, the signs for 22 EB being changed on 287, even though several of those were replaced NB with New York as the control city again with the Chimney Rock Rd service road project). Newark is the state's biggest city and still an important business, transit, and intermodal cargo hub in the state. It should be highlighted as a control city. I am fine with Newark/New York being the control cities.

[RobbieL2415]

I've never liked using Wilmington as a control city southbound, as the turnpike sort of doesn't go to Wilmington, and you have to backtrack to get there.

I agree. It should be Baltimore.

[bluecountry]

I've never liked using Wilmington as a control city southbound, as the turnpike sort of doesn't go to Wilmington, and you have to backtrack to get there.

I agree. It should be Baltimore.

Wilmington
Baltimore-Washington

Kinda like on the Capital Beltway it has:
Alexandria
Richmond

[roadman65]

How is NJTA collecting tolls if the pay by plate thing is in effect?  If no one to collect that means the camera is there, but without entry ticket (which collector uses to calculate fare), how can they tell where the motorist came from when entering?

[storm2k]

How is NJTA collecting tolls if the pay by plate thing is in effect?  If no one to collect that means the camera is there, but without entry ticket (which collector uses to calculate fare), how can they tell where the motorist came from when entering?

I assume they were using LPRs to figure out where the car entered and where it exited. Same tech they use to send you a violation if you don't have EZPass and go thru the EZPass only lane.

[jeffandnicole]

How is NJTA collecting tolls if the pay by plate thing is in effect?  If no one to collect that means the camera is there, but without entry ticket (which collector uses to calculate fare), how can they tell where the motorist came from when entering?

I assume they were using LPRs to figure out where the car entered and where it exited. Same tech they use to send you a violation if you don't have EZPass and go thru the EZPass only lane.

There are no cameras on entry, so no way to identify a vehicle.

Here's the underside of Interchange 1 on entry: 3 overhead transponder readers, with loop detectors in the ground.  If you spin it around you'll notice laser height detectors as well.  But, no cameras.  Traditional lanes for EZ Pass and tickets are generally set up the same way.  https://goo.gl/maps/6h6zudt5wjoGLtv98

I imagine it may be on the honor system for someone to identify where they entered the Turnpike.  I don't recall reading a story how they're working the invoicing or what the invoices will look like.

[CtrlAltDel]

I prefer the Illinois approach in this case - IMO, the control city on the New Jersey Turnpike southbound south of Exit 6 should just be "Delaware" or maybe "Delaware and Maryland."

You just gave half the board an aneurysm, but I agree. Sometimes the state name is the way to go.

[SignBridge]

I agree that sometimes a state name might make more sense than a city name, but it is not permitted by the MUTCD. Interstate highway signs are supposed to show the next control city on the route as the destination; whether it makes sense or not.........

For many years there was a great sign on the approach road to the NJTP from the Lincoln Tunnel. It said New Jersey Turnpike South, Pa.-Del.-Md.. How I miss that sign.........

[thenetwork]

I agree that sometimes a state name might make more sense than a city name, but it is not permitted by the MUTCD. Interstate highway signs are supposed to show the next control city on the route as the destination; whether it makes sense or not.........

Tell that to Colorado DOT.  Nearly every BGS that had Green River (UT) as a control city has now been changed to just Utah.

[KEVIN_224]

@SIGNBRIDGE:

November 28, 2015

[Tonytone]

I wonder if the 3-3-3-3 set up all the way to the Delaware memorial bridge would stop all congestion in the area as well as making that the main route to take over I-95.


iPhone

[Alps]

I wonder if the 3-3-3-3 set up all the way to the Delaware memorial bridge would stop all congestion in the area as well as making that the main route to take over I-95.


iPhone

only if you made two more delaware memorial bridges and added 3 lanes each way to the i-95 merge

[Tonytone]

I wonder if the 3-3-3-3 set up all the way to the Delaware memorial bridge would stop all congestion in the area as well as making that the main route to take over I-95.


iPhone

only if you made two more delaware memorial bridges and added 3 lanes each way to the i-95 merge

D'oh I definitely forgot you would need to add more bridges, but im sure they could make that work by merging it into 3-3 a mile or so before the bridge.


iPhone

[fmendes]

the nj turnpike authority has anounced a plan to raise tolls on GSP and nj tpke and in that plan includes numerous widening of njtpke rehabilitation of bridges in mixing bowl and completion of interchanges along GSP and most of all CASHLESS tolling ON NJ TPKE a big improvment from its 1950s ticket system which has been in use since the turnpike opened in 1951 the plans are on https://www.njta.com/media/5179/proposed-2020-capital-improvement-program.pdf