US 121 and US 460/Corridor Q

[WillWeaverRVA]

but how often is Google Maps Satellite View updated?

Google Earth (the desktop application) shows the dates of each satellite image. You can also access historic and sometimes more recent satellite views than what is the default in Google Maps.

Google Earth has started to acquire imagery from Airbus, which is much more recent in many cases. I've already seen tons of satellite images from March or April 2025, in some cases they were only 10 days old.

However in the case of the Coalfields Expressway near Elkhorn City, the current satellite image is from 10/19/2015, so it's almost 10 years old.

Dang. Well, thanks for clarifying that for me.

[Beltway]

Well the two sections of KY 3174 (as shown in Travel Mapping (west and east)) are what is currently open (and clinched by myself).  I am unsure what else needs to be stated here.

So according to those links the center section is not open.

[hbelkins]

The portion between KY 195 and KY 80 is not yet open. My colleague in Pikeville tells me that the opening is likely to be delayed from late this year until sometime next year.

[Beltway]

The portion between KY 195 and KY 80 is not yet open. My colleague in Pikeville tells me that the opening is likely to be delayed from late this year until sometime next year.

OK so that brings me up to date on my questions.

This is on the final segment in Virginia.

Feb. 14, 2025 extract:
Construction is underway for Route 460/121 - Poplar Creek Phase B (Buchanan County) and includes a new four-lane roadway and a bridge over the railroad and the Levisa Fork. The bridge will be 175-feet tall, making it the second tallest bridge in Virginia. Route 460/121 Poplar Creek B completes Corridor Q in Virginia. The project is approximately two miles long.
The project is valued at approximately $207 million (preliminary engineering, right of way, project oversight and construction).
Route 460/121 Poplar Creek Phase B construction began in 2023.
Status: Under construction
Estimated start date: 2023
Estimated completion date: 2027
https://www.vdot.virginia.gov/projects/bristol-district/corridor-q-route-460121-poplar-creek-phase-b-buchanan-county/

[WillWeaverRVA]

So, based on relevant documents that have been uploaded to the AASHTO route numbering archive, VDOT and KYTC have submitted requests for renumbering routes involved in the Corridor Q/Coalfields Expressway project.

- Current KY 3174 and VA 460 will be renumbered to US 460.
- Current US 460 (between Grundy and US 23) will be renumbered to US 460 ALT.

[Bitmapped]

So, based on relevant documents that have been uploaded to the AASHTO route numbering archive, VDOT and KYTC have submitted requests for renumbering routes involved in the Corridor Q/Coalfields Expressway project.

- Current KY 3174 and VA 460 will be renumbered to US 460.
- Current US 460 (between Grundy and US 23) will be renumbered to US 460 ALT.

I'm not a fan of US 460 ALT here. The two routes serve essentially the same corridor and the new route is a significant improvement over the existing US 460. Just move US 460 and redesignate the old route as a state route number.

[sprjus4]

So, based on relevant documents that have been uploaded to the AASHTO route numbering archive, VDOT and KYTC have submitted requests for renumbering routes involved in the Corridor Q/Coalfields Expressway project.

- Current KY 3174 and VA 460 will be renumbered to US 460.
- Current US 460 (between Grundy and US 23) will be renumbered to US 460 ALT.

I'm not a fan of US 460 ALT here. The two routes serve essentially the same corridor and the new route is a significant improvement over the existing US 460. Just move US 460 and redesignate the old route as a state route number.

Not in Virginia, but North Carolina already does something similar with US-64 and US-264 in the eastern part of the state. The old highway is designated as Alt US-64 and Alt US-264, while the newer freeways (that parallel the old roadway and serve the same towns) are the mainline. Alt doesn't imply it has to go on a completely different route, such as Alt US-58.

[Mapmikey]

So, based on relevant documents that have been uploaded to the AASHTO route numbering archive, VDOT and KYTC have submitted requests for renumbering routes involved in the Corridor Q/Coalfields Expressway project.

- Current KY 3174 and VA 460 will be renumbered to US 460.
- Current US 460 (between Grundy and US 23) will be renumbered to US 460 ALT.

I'm not a fan of US 460 ALT here. The two routes serve essentially the same corridor and the new route is a significant improvement over the existing US 460. Just move US 460 and redesignate the old route as a state route number.

Not in Virginia, but North Carolina already does something similar with US-64 and US-264 in the eastern part of the state. The old highway is designated as Alt US-64 and Alt US-264, while the newer freeways (that parallel the old roadway and serve the same towns) are the mainline. Alt doesn't imply it has to go on a completely different route, such as Alt US-58.

Virginia tried the same thing with US 360 when it was moved in 1982.

[sprjus4]

It seems to be having Alt US-360 and US-360 mainline would make more sense then two routes numbered "360" with no other identifier.

It's obviously been confused: https://maps.app.goo.gl/k3V4Swt7cLPP5gz89

[Mapmikey]

It seems to be having Alt US-360 and US-360 mainline would make more sense then two routes numbered "360" with no other identifier.

It's obviously been confused: https://maps.app.goo.gl/k3V4Swt7cLPP5gz89

Virginia could just post it as VA 360 ALT. Then could just erroneously post it as US 360 ALT like they do with both VA 220 ALT and VA 258 ALT.

[hbelkins]

Cheaper signage. Just slap an "Alternate" banner on the existing US 460 signs and be done with it, instead of coming up with a new number and putting up all-new signs. Makes sense from an economic standpoint.

[Bitmapped]

Has anyone seen what plans are for KY/VA 80 once the new US 460 is complete?

Virginia's maps show its part of the old VA 80 renumbered as SR 768 with VA 80 tying into to (and ending at, as signed in the field) VA 460. That leaves a dangling standalone piece of KY 80 from Elkhorn City to the Virginia line, and the standalone part from Elkhorn City to the current US 460, and then a pointless 39-mile multiplex with US 460 going back to Prestonsburg.

To my mind, if KYTC and VDOT get US 460 ALT, it would make sense to:
- Renumber KY 80 from downtown Elkhorn City to a random 4-digit state route number
- Extend KY 197 over existing KY 80 up to US 460 ALT
- Truncate KY 80's eastern end to Prestonsburg

Unless Kentucky is really insistent on having KY 80 span the width of the state, there's no reason to keep the section east of Prestonsburg numbered as it is.

[Beltway]

I'm not a fan of US 460 ALT here. The two routes serve essentially the same corridor and the new route is a significant improvement over the existing US 460. Just move US 460 and redesignate the old route as a state route number.

Business routes are commonly used in such a situation, but given the rural nature of that route, it is not really a "business" route.

The old route is almost 30 miles long and serves two states. Perhaps ALT US-460 is the way to go.

[WillWeaverRVA]

I'm not a fan of US 460 ALT here. The two routes serve essentially the same corridor and the new route is a significant improvement over the existing US 460. Just move US 460 and redesignate the old route as a state route number.

Business routes are commonly used in such a situation, but given the rural nature of that route, it is not really a "business" route.

The old route is almost 30 miles long and serves two states. Perhaps ALT US-460 is the way to go.

The only quibble is that there was recently a US 460 Business designated for an old alignment of US 460 in Grundy that serves some businesses. I guess it would become US 460 ALT Business? Realistically it could just be secondary...

[sprjus4]

I'm not a fan of US 460 ALT here. The two routes serve essentially the same corridor and the new route is a significant improvement over the existing US 460. Just move US 460 and redesignate the old route as a state route number.

Business routes are commonly used in such a situation, but given the rural nature of that route, it is not really a "business" route.

The old route is almost 30 miles long and serves two states. Perhaps ALT US-460 is the way to go.

The only quibble is that there was recently a US 460 Business designated for an old alignment of US 460 in Grundy that serves some businesses. I guess it would become US 460 ALT Business? Realistically it could just be secondary...

Referencing my North Carolina example earlier, Wilson NC has a similar situation. Alt US-264 follows the arterial bypass (remember US-264 is on the freeway) while Business US-264 goes through town.

Business US-264 does not actually connect with the main US-264, so maybe just connecting with the Alt Route is good enough. I'm not sure if there's official rules or guidance addressing a situation like this.

[NE2]

I'm not a fan of US 460 ALT here. The two routes serve essentially the same corridor and the new route is a significant improvement over the existing US 460. Just move US 460 and redesignate the old route as a state route number.

Business routes are commonly used in such a situation, but given the rural nature of that route, it is not really a "business" route.

The old route is almost 30 miles long and serves two states. Perhaps ALT US-460 is the way to go.

The only quibble is that there was recently a US 460 Business designated for an old alignment of US 460 in Grundy that serves some businesses. I guess it would become US 460 ALT Business? Realistically it could just be secondary...

US 460 will still pass thru Grundy.

[Beltway]

The old route is almost 30 miles long and serves two states. Perhaps ALT US-460 is the way to go.

The only quibble is that there was recently a US 460 Business designated for an old alignment of US 460 in Grundy that serves some businesses. I guess it would become US 460 ALT Business? Realistically it could just be secondary...

The new highway Corridor Q will junction US-460 over a mile west of Grundy.

So ALT US-460 would begin west of Grundy, and would not impact the designation in Grundy.

[WillWeaverRVA]

I'm not a fan of US 460 ALT here. The two routes serve essentially the same corridor and the new route is a significant improvement over the existing US 460. Just move US 460 and redesignate the old route as a state route number.

Business routes are commonly used in such a situation, but given the rural nature of that route, it is not really a "business" route.

The old route is almost 30 miles long and serves two states. Perhaps ALT US-460 is the way to go.

The only quibble is that there was recently a US 460 Business designated for an old alignment of US 460 in Grundy that serves some businesses. I guess it would become US 460 ALT Business? Realistically it could just be secondary...

US 460 will still pass thru Grundy.

Whoops, I misread where the split will happen. Thanks.

[Rothman]

I see no problem with the KY 80 concurrency in KY which has existed for 40 years or more now.

[Bitmapped]

I see no problem with the KY 80 concurrency in KY which has existed for 40 years or more now.

Does KY 80 just become concurrent with the new US 460 for the entire stretch east of Pikeville in that case? The old alignment at least had independent mileage for the last several miles through Elkhorn City, and more before the construction of Fishtrap Lake which resulted in US 460's earlier relocation. If KY 80 is overlaid on new US 460 the entire way, it won't.

[hbelkins]

I see no problem with the KY 80 concurrency in KY which has existed for 40 years or more now.

Does KY 80 just become concurrent with the new US 460 for the entire stretch east of Pikeville in that case? The old alignment at least had independent mileage for the last several miles through Elkhorn City, and more before the construction of Fishtrap Lake which resulted in US 460's earlier relocation. If KY 80 is overlaid on new US 460 the entire way, it won't.

KY 80 will probably remain concurrent with the "new" Alternate 460 from Shelbiana to Belcher, where the routes diverge.

Unrelated, VDOT is just now getting around to petitioning AASHTO for the Business 460 designation through the commercial stretch between Blacksburg and Christiansburg that was bypassed 20 years ago by the freeway?

[74/171FAN]

Unrelated, VDOT is just now getting around to petitioning AASHTO for the Business 460 designation through the commercial stretch between Blacksburg and Christiansburg that was bypassed 20 years ago by the freeway?

Yeah, if I did not know that, how did I end up at Virginia Tech for four years?

In all seriousness, all of Virginia's requests unrelated to the new section of Corridor Q have existed for a while.