How would you rate your state capital?

Started by Zeffy, June 03, 2014, 02:09:28 PM

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hbelkins

I've always been a bit skeptical about using murder rates as a judge of the safety of anywhere, simply because if you are in an area with a small population and you have a couple of murders, that's going to skew the rate upwards. Let two people get killed in a year in a small town and it jacks the rate up a lot higher than it might be in, say, a larger city where, say, 20 people get killed. The reality is probably that the smaller town is safer, but the statistics might show otherwise.
Government would be tolerable if not for politicians and bureaucrats.


formulanone


Quote from: agentsteel53 on June 04, 2014, 01:15:27 PM
Quote from: Zeffy on June 04, 2014, 11:47:33 AMrule #1 of urban cities is do not establish eye contact with anyone and don't stop moving unless you have to.

I've taken photos in some pretty terrible neighborhoods (hey, it's where the old signs are) and I've never had any trouble with a friendly small wave and nod of acknowledgement.  the residents are people, not wild animals.  I'm okay with being perceived as eccentric but harmless.  the worst that's ever happened to me is I've been offered drugs.

Yeah, pretty much this...I've had much more problems with suburban folk with nothing better to do than to harass you, and virtually no problems within inner cities. There's a big difference between strolling though a city and not making a scene, blending in with the area, keeping your wits about you, and intentionally making yourself a mark or running off at the mouth.

Violent Crime typically does not happen to the rare passerby, it many cases it haunts and finds those who habitually co-exist with those of a violent nature or live recklessly.

Zeffy

Quote from: formulanone on June 04, 2014, 02:21:30 PM
Quote from: agentsteel53 on June 04, 2014, 01:15:27 PM
I've taken photos in some pretty terrible neighborhoods (hey, it's where the old signs are) and I've never had any trouble with a friendly small wave and nod of acknowledgement.  the residents are people, not wild animals.  I'm okay with being perceived as eccentric but harmless.  the worst that's ever happened to me is I've been offered drugs.

Yeah, pretty much this...I've had much more problems with suburban folk with nothing better to do than to harass you, and virtually no problems within inner cities. There's a big difference between strolling though a city and not making a scene, blending in with the area, keeping your wits about you, and intentionally making yourself a mark or running off at the mouth.

Violent Crime typically does not happen to the rare passerby, it many cases it haunts and finds those who habitually co-exist with those of a violent nature or live recklessly.

Well, I would agree with you, but one of my 11 visits to Trenton a group of (thugs) men who were sitting on a porch started pointing at me, not really getting violent but as I strolled by their houses not paying attention to them, one of them remarked "look at that <censored> just walking through our turf like nothing's wrong", while another said "man leave that <censored> alone he's probably just visiting with his family, I ain't got no beef with him, he ain't wearing colors, he ain't acting tough, besides that kid doesn't even look like he's a threat". I guess that was reassuring. I didn't turn to acknowledge them or say anything, I just minded my own business and moved on. That was my only bad experience in Trenton, and, to be fair, I did wander a bit out of the downtown area.
Life would be boring if we didn't take an offramp every once in a while

A weird combination of a weather geek, roadgeek, car enthusiast and furry mixed with many anxiety related disorders

agentsteel53

Quote from: Zeffy on June 04, 2014, 02:47:12 PM
Well, I would agree with you, but one of my 11 visits to Trenton a group of (thugs) men who were sitting on a porch started pointing at me, not really getting violent but as I strolled by their houses not paying attention to them, one of them remarked "look at that <censored> just walking through our turf like nothing's wrong", while another said "man leave that <censored> alone he's probably just visiting with his family, I ain't got no beef with him, he ain't wearing colors, he ain't acting tough, besides that kid doesn't even look like he's a threat". I guess that was reassuring. I didn't turn to acknowledge them or say anything, I just minded my own business and moved on. That was my only bad experience in Trenton, and, to be fair, I did wander a bit out of the downtown area.

the second one has the attitude of 99% of people.

that last 1% is sociopathic and is gonna show up regardless of race, environment, upbringing, etc. 
live from sunny San Diego.

http://shields.aaroads.com

jake@aaroads.com

J N Winkler

Quote from: hbelkins on June 04, 2014, 01:47:48 PMI've always been a bit skeptical about using murder rates as a judge of the safety of anywhere, simply because if you are in an area with a small population and you have a couple of murders, that's going to skew the rate upwards. Let two people get killed in a year in a small town and it jacks the rate up a lot higher than it might be in, say, a larger city where, say, 20 people get killed. The reality is probably that the smaller town is safer, but the statistics might show otherwise.

This is why it is helpful to look at total homicides over a number of years.  The Wichita Eagle chose a 25-year period in its latest foray into database journalism, which is where my numbers come from.  As it happens, the Wichita road meet in July 2013 started and ended in the ZIP code that had 1 homicide per 2445 persons, but featured multiple stops in the part of the city that had 1 homicide per 79 persons.  More refined analysis showed that many of the deaths in this latter part of town happened at certain premises near arterial intersections which have had bars (or poolrooms with liquor availability) in operation for much of the 25-year period.  Nearly all of those places are now boarded up, and with the exception of 13th and Grove, I don't think any of them was on our driving route.  We did drive along a part of Ninth Street which used to have a reputation as an open-air emporium for illegal stuff.
"It is necessary to spend a hundred lire now to save a thousand lire later."--Piero Puricelli, explaining the need for a first-class road system to Benito Mussolini

DTComposer

I'm enjoying reading these, but have a couple of thoughts:

-First, on safety/crime, since these have quantifiable numbers available from law enforcement sources, couldn't we just decide what numbers/statistics go into this and have a subjective rather than objective score? Subjective opinions could go into perception, aesthetics, etc.

-Also, since we have the opportunity for 50 (or more) different people creating these rankings, isn't it disingenuous to stack them up against each other? For example, on significance, Trenton is given a 9 based on that events during the American Revolution, without reference to anything since, but Sacramento is given a 4, based on events that fueled the Gold Rush and Western migration, but because "nothing" has happened since. Seems to me those scores should be the same or similar based on those statements.

That said, it's a fun exercise, and I'll come up with a second opinion on Sacramento.


empirestate

Quote from: Zeffy on June 04, 2014, 11:47:33 AM
Of course, in regards to Trenton, as mentioned before, they have launched a website (http://www.trenton250.org) to gather inputs on residents and visitors to Trenton to improve the city. It's a great first step to show the people that the city cares about how it's perceived and what goes on in the city.

As said before, my rating system is always open to changes and suggestions by people.

I only meant to suggest that, if safety is the main focus of your question (and that's perfectly fine if it is), maybe consider rolling "aesthetics", "perception" and the rest into the "safety" section as sub-categories. Just going by your own answers for Trenton, that seemed to be your inclination. But it could also be that Trenton in particular has such safety issues that they pervade other aspects of evaluating the city, which is also cool.

Zeffy

#57
Okay, so, after thinking about the rating system a bit, I would like to know if the following changes make this list less safety oriented and more about the overall feelings of the capital city in it's current shape. As much as I love history, I feel like this will give a lot of cities an advantage over one another, so I've removed it entirely. Here's the changes...


  • Location (0-10 points) -
  • Aesthetics (0-10 points) -
  • Opportunities (0-10 points) -

    • Public School System (0-5 points)
    • Employment Opportunities (0-5 points)
  • Safety (0-10 points) -

    • Blight1 (0-5 points) -
    • Crime2 (0-5 points) -
  • Public Perception (0-10 points) -
  • Landmarks (0-10 points) -
  • Tourism (0-10 points) -
  • Transportation Network (0-10 points)
  • Environment (0-10 points)
  • Future (0-10 points) -

1  Refers to the % of abandoned properties, or property values in general
2  Encompasses both violent and non-violent (property) crimes

My intention was to not focus solely on safety. I want to focus on all the aspects of our state capitals, and I believe this list is a much closer step to that vision.

Also, for everyone who submitted data before, I am perfectly fine with you not wanting to edit it, I should've probably considered this before I posted. Still, if you wouldn't mind, it would be great!
Life would be boring if we didn't take an offramp every once in a while

A weird combination of a weather geek, roadgeek, car enthusiast and furry mixed with many anxiety related disorders

Pete from Boston


Quote from: formulanone on June 04, 2014, 02:21:30 PM

Quote from: agentsteel53 on June 04, 2014, 01:15:27 PM
Quote from: Zeffy on June 04, 2014, 11:47:33 AMrule #1 of urban cities is do not establish eye contact with anyone and don't stop moving unless you have to.

I've taken photos in some pretty terrible neighborhoods (hey, it's where the old signs are) and I've never had any trouble with a friendly small wave and nod of acknowledgement.  the residents are people, not wild animals.  I'm okay with being perceived as eccentric but harmless.  the worst that's ever happened to me is I've been offered drugs.

Yeah, pretty much this...I've had much more problems with suburban folk with nothing better to do than to harass you, and virtually no problems within inner cities. There's a big difference between strolling though a city and not making a scene, blending in with the area, keeping your wits about you, and intentionally making yourself a mark or running off at the mouth.

Violent Crime typically does not happen to the rare passerby, it many cases it haunts and finds those who habitually co-exist with those of a violent nature or live recklessly.

I've had my share of generally skittish, paranoid, troubled, or just plain defensive people come up and demand to know what I was doing taking pictures that might or might not have included them.

I've had about the same number of people attempt to pose or ask to have their picture taken. 

Takes all kinds, as they say. 

Zeffy

My new ratings for Trenton...

TRENTON


  • Location (0-10 points) - 6 - Decently placed along the Delaware River, and basically the center point of New Jersey.
  • Aesthetics (0-10 points) - 4 - You have a mix of colonial-era architecture with modern era office buildings. Oh, and then you have Arm and Hammer Park.   
  • Opportunities (0-10 points) - 4

    • Public School System (0-5 points) - 2. Trenton's public school system isn't anything to be proud of. Low graduation rates and a faltering budget means the school system is struggling badly.
    • Employment Opportunities (0-5 points) - 2. - If you like New Jersey government, you can work in Trenton, otherwise... there's not much.
  • Safety (0-10 points) - 5

    • Blight1 (0-5 points) - 3 - Vacant buildings that are more concentrated in some areas compared to the others, but otherwise property values are fluctuate too much across the city.
    • Crime2 (0-5 points) - 2 - Nighttime in Trenton is a badtime in Trenton.
  • Public Perception (0-10 points) - 5 - Most are ashamed of it being New Jersey's capital, while others still find it one of the most historic places in the US.
  • Landmarks (0-10 points) - 7 - The Trenton Battle Monument is still relatively well maintained, the Trenton Makes bridge is still standing strong, and you can't forget about the Capitol building either.
  • Tourism (0-10 points) - 6 - Lots of New Jersey history the family can learn about, or they can enjoy a Trenton Thunder game at Arm & Hammer Park. Either way, not too bad for people stopping by.
  • Transportation Network (0-10 points) - 7 - Trenton is associated with the infamous gap in I-95, even though it's really not in Trenton, but still, the combination of NJ 29, US 1, I-195 and I-295 serve the city well and prevent any real traffic. The NJ Turnpike while not in Trenton still serves many people through Exit 7a.
  • Environment (0-10 points) - 6 - It's New Jersey, which can mean horrible winters and very hot summers. Air pollution is a little bit hazy, but nothing too bad. The snow removal effort in Trenton is decent enough to give this a 6.
  • Future (0-10 points) - 10 - Trenton has been down ever since the riots in the 1960s, but there's a lot being done to improve life in the capital city. Trenton continues to serve as an excellent venue for events in the city, and with more steps being taken to reduce the crime rate in Trenton and improve the life of current and future residents, the future may certainly be bright for Trenton.

FINAL SCORE: 60
Life would be boring if we didn't take an offramp every once in a while

A weird combination of a weather geek, roadgeek, car enthusiast and furry mixed with many anxiety related disorders

Scott5114

OKLAHOMA CITY:

  • Location (0-10 points) - 10, centrally located geographically, as well being the largest city in the state. It's only 90 minutes from the Tulsa, second-largest city in the state, and the third-largest city is functionally one of its suburbs. About the only place that would make more sense is Stroud or thereabouts if you placed importance on wanting it to be midway between Tulsa and OKC.
  • Aesthetics (0-10 points) - 6, not an eyesore, but there's little that's architecturally unique
  • Opportunities (0-10 points) - 7

    • Public School System (0-5 points) - 2, education in Oklahoma perennially faces budget shortfalls and Legislative monkeying with the curriculum, and OKC public schools have to deal with this too
    • Employment Opportunities (0-5 points) - 5, headquarters of several major companies: Chesapeake Energy, Devon Energy, Hobby Lobby, Sonic Drive-In. Chesapeake and Devon have a reputation for being an excellent place to work (maybe not quite on the order of Google, but close). Oklahoma City tends to be less affected by economic downturns than other US cities. While not in Oklahoma City proper, aside from the exception of Remington Park, the casino gaming industry has a strong presence in the metro area.
  • Safety (0-10 points) - 7

    • Blight1 (0-5 points) - 4, very little blight; the city actively works to redevelop areas declared "blighted"
    • Crime2 (0-5 points) - 3, murder rate is around 14 per 100,000. Most crimes reported in Oklahoma City are burglaries and other thefts.
  • Public Perception (0-10 points) - 4, Oklahoma City's reputation is tied to that of Oklahoma; most people see the state as backward, behind the times, full of stupid rednecks, etc.
  • Landmarks (0-10 points) - 7, plenty of things to see and do
  • Tourism (0-10 points) - 8, with the MAPS Projects and its sequels, Oklahoma City has aggressively worked to make itself, especially its downtown area, more appealing to the outsider. This was triggered by Oklahoma City being passed over in favor of Indianapolis for a major airline facility due to the latter's more vibrant downtown. As a result, downtown Oklahoma City has been extensively redeveloped, resulting the Bricktown entertainment district, which includes the canal, the Bricktown Ballpark, etc.
  • Transportation Network (0-10 points) - 8, freeways available just about everywhere that you'd want to go, ODOT does a good job at keeping ahead of demand, so even at rush hour things never come to a complete standstill, even if they do slow down some. About the only improvement that could be made is a freeway along the NW Expressway corridor. However, the car is pretty much the only transportation option in town; your only transit opportunity is the bus service, which sucks (no Sunday service). Only passenger rail destination is Amtrak to Fort Worth. Not many facilities for biking, but biking in Oklahoma City weather is probably ill-advised anyway (see below). Will Rogers World Airport is good, and cheap airfare to several major cities is available. There are several minor general aviation airports as well (chiefly Wiley Post in northwest Oklahoma City, but Max Westheimer in nearby Norman is an option).
  • Environment (0-10 points) - 2, Oklahoma City has some of the worst weather in the country. It is generally either uncomfortably hot or cold, heat is usually accompanied by humidity (last time I checked today, it was 93°F with 47% relative humidity). Severe storms are frequent. Wind is often excessive, to the point where even if the temperature is comfortable, some outdoor activities are hampered. The Oklahoma City area is usually visited by a tornado at least once per year, although tornado preparedness is at an all-time high, as many new houses are being designed to withstand weaker tornadoes, and storm shelters and safe rooms are increasingly common. Snow is not very frequent, but when it happens, the city basically shuts down until it melts. Total closure of the freeway system is not uncommon. At least your boss usually forgives you if you call in.
  • Future (0-10 points) - 9. Due to its aggressive self-improvement plans, its strong employment situation, and low cost of living, Oklahoma City is likely to remain an attractive option to visitors and potential residents in the near future.
  • Intuitive to memorize by six year olds shackled by brain-dead curricula - 10 (we are the freebie, kids love us)

TOTAL: 68
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

agentsteel53

Quote from: Scott5114 on June 04, 2014, 05:47:56 PM
Intuitive to memorize by six year olds shackled by brain-dead curricula - 10 (we are the freebie, kids love us)


I never trusted my intuition on this one.  the only other freebie is Indianapolis; everywhere else, assuming X City or another variant is either a very bad pothole (New York, Kansas), or some obscure town that no one outside of it has heard of (California, Oregon, etc).  hell, Kansas City isn't even the capital of Missouri!
live from sunny San Diego.

http://shields.aaroads.com

jake@aaroads.com

getemngo

Quote from: Zeffy on June 04, 2014, 02:47:12 PM
one of them remarked "look at that <censored> just walking through our turf like nothing's wrong", while another said "man leave that <censored> alone he's probably just visiting with his family, I ain't got no beef with him, he ain't wearing colors, he ain't acting tough, besides that kid doesn't even look like he's a threat".

They didn't call you a hep cat, did they?  :-o
~ Sam from Michigan

mefailenglish

Quote from: roadman65 on June 04, 2014, 09:26:39 AM
Tallahassee

2/10- Location- Given where it is at being in the Panhandle of the State, and not at all on the main peninsula, it is way off center.
Well, when Florida was first established, the two main population areas were St Augustine and Pensacola.  Tally is about halfway between them.

Now the population center is much farther down the peninsula, but would you really want to move the capital into the Orlando area?  Isn't that enough of a mess as is?

I left Tallahassee almost 15 years ago and have only passed through a couple of times since then, so I'll let someone else finish it up if they want.

Zeffy

Quote from: getemngo on June 04, 2014, 07:42:18 PM
They didn't call you a hep cat, did they?  :-o

Yes, but I've never actually cared what someone called me. Words don't hurt me. I've been called every deragatory term there is and never cared. If you don't like what I do / look like, too fucking bad.
Life would be boring if we didn't take an offramp every once in a while

A weird combination of a weather geek, roadgeek, car enthusiast and furry mixed with many anxiety related disorders

Pete from Boston


Quote from: getemngo on June 04, 2014, 07:42:18 PM
Quote from: Zeffy on June 04, 2014, 02:47:12 PM
one of them remarked "look at that <censored> just walking through our turf like nothing's wrong", while another said "man leave that <censored> alone he's probably just visiting with his family, I ain't got no beef with him, he ain't wearing colors, he ain't acting tough, besides that kid doesn't even look like he's a threat".

They didn't call you a hep cat, did they?  :-o

Hep cat?  You mean while smoking a jazz cigarette?   

NWI_Irish96

Indianapolis Revised

Quote from: Zeffy on June 04, 2014, 04:04:26 PM


  • Location (10) -
  • Aesthetics (8) -
  • Opportunities (6) -

    • Public School System (3)
    • Employment Opportunities (3)
  • Safety (3) -

    • Blight1 (2) -
    • Crime2 (1) -
  • Public Perception (4) -
  • Landmarks (7) -
  • Tourism (7) -
  • Transportation Network (5)
  • Environment (5)
  • Future (7) -

1  Refers to the % of abandoned properties, or property values in general
2  Encompasses both violent and non-violent (property) crimes


Total = 62 points
Indiana: counties 100%, highways 100%
Illinois: counties 100%, highways 61%
Michigan: counties 100%, highways 56%
Wisconsin: counties 86%, highways 23%

MikeTheActuary

I'm going to disagree with the rating of Hartford earlier in the thread.


  • Location (0-10 points) - 8  It's a small state, so location isn't that critical.  Hartford is in the middle-ish of the state geographically, but not on a population-center basis.
  • Aesthetics (0-10 points) - 5  The skyline is OK for a city its size, although it is marred by the former "mount trash" along I-91 to the north.  The Capitol, the Colt Building, Bushnell Park, and the remnants of Nook Farm are all OK.  Thankfully, the "Butt Ugly Building" along I-84 was torn down a few years ago.  However, you don't have to go very far to find blight.
  • Opportunities (0-10 points) -

    • Public School System (0-5 points) - 0 While there is a network of charter schools to help parents that care get their kids out of Hartford Public Schools...really, if you have school-aged children, you either live in a suburb, or you plan to send them to private school.
    • Employment Opportunities (0-5 points) - 3 Picking 3 mostly because I don't know what to put here.  It's a mixed bag.  There's decent opportunities fueled by the insurance industry, aerospace tech, and the state government...but since so many other answers here are based on "Hartford proper" as opposed to "Hartford metro", it should be noted that many of those opportunities are either in the suburbs, or are at risk of moving to the suburbs.  A few of the towers downtown have low occupancy rates.
  • Safety (0-10 points) -

    • Blight (0-5 points) - 1 There are a few pockets holding their own, but they are few and far between
    • Crime (0-5 points) - 1 The best that can be said is that it's not Baltimore, Memphis, or Bridgeport.
  • Public Perception (0-10 points) - 2  There are a few pro-Hartford advocates in Hartford, but a common theme among residents of the surrounding area is to avoid Hartford when possible.
  • Landmarks (0-10 points) - 7 Decent for a city its size: Travelers Tower, Connecticut Science Center, Connecticut State Capitol, Colt Building, The Old State House....
  • Tourism (0-10 points) - 3 This rating suffers because I'm answering for Hartford proper.  You've got the Connecticut Science Center (if you have kids), the Mark Twain House and the Harriet Beecher Stowe House...and that's about it.  Non-scary hotel options within the city limits are limited to a few places downtown.
  • Transportation Network (0-10 points) - 2  A lack of 4-lane surface thoroughfares and an underbuilt freeway system plague the City of Hartford.  Parking downtown is an issue, but not as bad as it once was.  The local bus system is decent, however.
  • Environment (0-10 points) - 7, assuming your preference is more for cool weather than warm.   Hartford has all four seasons, with a humidity kicker.  Winters can be long and snowy.  Summers are generally less oppressive than points further south, but air conditioners will get used.  Certain weather conditions can trigger air quality alerts, but it's not that bad.   Snow removal is pretty good but-for that one storm every few years that dumps snow at too great a rate for the plows to keep up.   There is a hurricane risk, but the infrastructure in the city itself is fairly robust.  Hartford mostly had power back faster (if it was lost at all) after both "Snowtober" and Irene as compared to nearby towns.
  • Future (0-10 points) - 4  Hartford has a long history of making bad decisions.  However, there are some signs of improvement for the future, including the development of the Main Street entertainment district, near the new Convention Center and Science Center.   There's the potential for filling in / cleaning up blight on the north side of I-84 with the stadium that will apparently be built for the just-announced move of AA Rock Cats from New Britain to Hartford.  And, the "Riverfront Recapture" project and the slow development of regional trails along the Connecticut River are promising.   Offsetting those reasons for optimism are recent examples of the city reversing course / deëmphasis on some plans to improve livability (e.g., just try shopping for groceries in town), ongoing challenges with city finances, etc.

Total: 41

However, as is the case in many different surveys, it should be noted that Hartford suffers because Connecticut is different than other parts of the country, with the entire state being incorporated into one of 169 towns.   Hartford's never been able to annex surrounding areas, and in fact has had parts of its former self split off to form new, neighboring towns.

So, when you compare Hartford to other cities, on a "within city limits basis", there's a bit of an unfair comparison.   For apples-apples, you almost have to look at Hartford versus "downtown and inner neighborhoods" of other cities, or you have to compare metro area to metro area.

If rating the Hartford metro area...it'd score about a 60 on this scale.

gonealookin

Carson City, NV

  • Location (0-10 points) - 3.  Nevada doesn't have any good choices.  Not having it in Las Vegas forces the ~75% of the politicians who come from there to spend time each term in another part of the state, which is a good thing, at the cost of all those Nevadans being about 6 hours drive away.  In Northern Nevada, Reno would be better.
  • Aesthetics (0-10 points) - 2.  Considering how close it is to some gorgeous scenery, it's a remarkably drab, scruffy desert town.  The capitol grounds and the older residential area just to the west of it are OK; otherwise it's trailer parks and Walmart.
  • Opportunities (0-10 points) -

    • Public School System (0-5 points) - 3.  Average.
    • Employment Opportunities (0-5 points) - 1.  None outside of government.  It might have had some potential as a college town but Reno was selected as the location of the public university.
  • Safety (0-10 points) -

    • Blight (0-5 points) - 3.  During the recession there were several holes in shopping centers but most of them have been re-occupied.  There's still a derelict former Kmart at the north end of town.  Also, trailer parks as mentioned above.
    • Crime (0-5 points) - 4.  Typical small-city problems of alcohol and meth leading to things like burglary and sexual assault, but in general no major issues.
  • Public Perception (0-10 points) - 2.  I've never spoken to anyone who said they wished they lived in Carson City.
  • Landmarks (0-10 points) - 2.  That seems like the minimum score for a state capital.  There's a small railroad museum.  The few casinos are dumpy.
  • Tourism (0-10 points) - 3.  There are inexpensive motels which provide an alternative to the overpriced places up the hill at Lake Tahoe, but nobody would vacation in Carson City itself.  Check out the capitol and surrounding government center, have lunch, get back on the road.
  • Transportation Network (0-10 points) - 5.  Access to Reno (and its airport) improved when that Blood Alley stretch of US 395 was bypassed a few years ago.  Construction of the freeway bypass of Carson City itself is proceeding slowly, in phases, with 2017 looking likely for completion, and that will alleviate congestion on the two streets where it's a bit of a nuisance.
  • Environment (0-10 points) - 8.  Clean air in a dry desert town with mountains nearby.  The altitude helps keep the summer heat from becoming too oppressive, but there are enough mild days in the winter to keep it from being icebound.
  • Future (0-10 points) - 3.  That freeway bypass is going to take some business away from the south end of town, and refugees from California are much more likely to go to Reno, or possibly Douglas County to the south, for the foreseeable future.
Total score:  39.  Certainly the worst in the west, and I'd think bottom 5 in the country, though comparisons to larger cities are difficult.  There's just nothing to recommend about it.  Reno has a few of the same drawbacks but is by and large a decent place; go there instead.

golden eagle

#69

JACKSON, MS


-Location (0-10 points) Centrally located, with straight shots to surrounding big cities. Location: 9
-Aesthetics (0-10 points) Horrible! I've been on dirt roads in the Delta that's better than some of these streets. But we just passed a 1-cent sales tax earlier this year to help alleviate this. Aesthetics: 3
-Opportunities (0-10 points)   
◦Public School System (0-5 points) White flight (and subsequent "other" flight) has done a lot of damage. Still some good schools in the system, though. Public schools: 4
◦Employment Opportunities (0-5 points) Really good when it comes to health-related employment. Someone decent in other fields. I'll score it a 4.
-Safety (0-10 points) - How crazy do things tend to get in your capital city?
◦Blight1 (0-5 points) - Lots of inner city blight, but it's slowly getting better. I'll give it a 3.
◦Crime2 (0-5 points) - Lots of violent crime. I don't feel scared, but do watch where you are. I'll be brutal and give it a 1.
-Public Perception (0-10 points) -Many outsiders feel we don't stand a chance. Go on any TV station's Facebook page and any story about us, people will spin it to something negative. Despite this, 5.
-Landmarks (0-10 points) - Does your capital have any famous landmarks that distinguish it from other cities? Not really. I'll give it a 3.
-Tourism (0-10 points) - Needs improvement here, but it's OK. This gets a 5.
-Transportation Network (0-10 points) - It's pretty easy getting around. While great to have, this city isn't married to interstates. City bus system could better. A 7 in my book.
-Environment (0-10 points) Very humid summers, but the air is relatively good. We don't deal with a lot of snow. Whatever falls usually melts in no time. We were all caught off guard when Katrina struck here. Overall, a 8.
-Future (0-10 points) I really believe we will. There are things that are slowly coming together here. Really need to work on the crime situation. Since I'm an optimist, I'll score the future as a 10.


Overall score: 62

kkt

I'm going to disagree with the location score for Sacramento above.  I think it's a 10.  It's near the center of California's land mass both north to south and east to west.  It's at the intersection of a transcontinental east-west route, and a lower-48 north-south route, and a second all-season route to the east besides.  It's also a port, with good water navigation to hinterlands north and south as well as to the sea.  Where else could you put the capital with these advantages?  Maybe Stockton, because it's closer to the center of population, but doesn't have even one all-season route going east, and is getting pretty far from Redding and Red Bluff.

formulanone


Quote from: mefailenglish on June 04, 2014, 11:06:58 PM
Quote from: roadman65 on June 04, 2014, 09:26:39 AM
Tallahassee

2/10- Location- Given where it is at being in the Panhandle of the State, and not at all on the main peninsula, it is way off center.
Now the population center is much farther down the peninsula, but would you really want to move the capital into the Orlando area?  Isn't that enough of a mess as is?

If Florida's capital was at the geographic middle, then New Port Ritchie would be about right. But realistically, if it were in the population "center", in would probably wind up somewhere around Okeechobee or Sebring. State capitals don't really move anymore.

empirestate

Well, I'll contribute what I can for Albany...


  • Location (8) - Smack at the junction of water-level routes from New York Harbor to the great lakes–all six of them.  :-D Also convenient to New England, but perhaps a little far east for true centrality. Syracuse better fits that benchmark. Still, for the time it was founded the location shows pretty good foresight (cf. Juneau).
  • Aesthetics (6) - Lots of history in its housing stock, but much of it lost. Empire State Plaza, while it's a very brutalist aesthetic, is at least among the more successful examples. Riverside location allows for some expansive views, such as they are. I've given an extra bonus point to nice residential neighborhoods that I assume exist in parts of the city.
  • Opportunities (8) - Just going by law of averages on the school system. I have no direct knowledge of the district, but it's in a city and therefore must be lousy. Then again, if you took those same kids and teleported them into a suburban school building, would they do any better, in which case is the city school system actually to blame? Opportunity-wise, this will be high for any capital because of state government, but the opportunity level differs for transplants and city natives, because the latter is dependent on educational opportunity. So I'll give it a 5, assuming this is from the viewpoint of an already-educated transplant looking to settle in the city.

    • Public School System (3)
    • Employment Opportunities (5)
  • Safety (5) - Again, not a lot of direct knowledge, but there's less apparent blight in Albany than in Troy, Rensselaer or Schenectady, and there seems to be a reasonable stock of 20th-century housing still extant. Crime is commensurate with a small- to mid-sized Upstate New York city.

    • Blight1 (3)
    • Crime2 (2)
  • Public Perception (4) - Mostly ho-hum. Enough of a humdrum perception that it was worth a joke on "The Simpsons". Cities like Schenectady and Cohoes have much worse perceptions, and of course suburbs have better ones. I will opine, however, that reality greatly exceeds perception.
  • Landmarks (6) - The Capitol and Empire State Plaza, SUNY headquarters and the SUNYA campus, and let's not forget the Circle Stack Interchange. But not a city-wide spread of known landmarks, considering the city's age.
  • Tourism (10) - Unlike Landmarks, I take this category to apply to tourism opportunities accessible from the city, not just in it. So: Berkshires, Adirondacks, Lake George, Saratoga, Hudson Valley, Catskills, all within easy reach. Overnight destinations like New York City, Montreal, Boston, Niagara Falls can all be reached from Albany.
  • Transportation Network (8) - It's a hub of Interstates, rail, and water. Some traffic issues and not much of an airport–which I might actually see as a good thing, given the overall annoyance of large air hubs.
  • Environment (7) - Sort of guessing here. You can be the rivers are cleaner than they were fifty years ago but still not perfect. It's far enough from major population centers that air quality isn't affected as much. The climate is what it is for the Northeast; snow will be less than places on the lakes like Syracuse or Buffalo, but topography makes flooding a greater concern. Summers are highly tolerable, and autumns outstanding.
  • Future (7) - A cautiously optimistic score. Like all core cities in the state, it's restricted to how much it can directly reap the benefit of its very viable metro area. But at the same time, core cities in general are seeing a modest resurgence nationwide.

Total: 69 - Probably about as high as any capital city will score, barring a few outliers (like Boise, apparently).

golden eagle

Quote from: formulanone on June 06, 2014, 07:55:30 AM

Quote from: mefailenglish on June 04, 2014, 11:06:58 PM
Quote from: roadman65 on June 04, 2014, 09:26:39 AM
Tallahassee

2/10- Location- Given where it is at being in the Panhandle of the State, and not at all on the main peninsula, it is way off center.
Now the population center is much farther down the peninsula, but would you really want to move the capital into the Orlando area?  Isn't that enough of a mess as is?



If Florida's capital was at the geographic middle, then New Port Ritchie would be about right. But realistically, if it were in the population "center", in would probably wind up somewhere around Okeechobee or Sebring. State capitals don't really move anymore.

It seems like Orlando is more centrally located; thus, it would make more logical sense. It seems better to reach Orlando from other areas of the state easier than Tallahassee.

Zeffy

Sorry about not responding for a few days. Thursday night I became violently ill when I projectile vomited my entire dinner up for no reason at all. The next day I was feeling shitty to not really check the forum except for using my phone, and Saturday I was just being lazy.  :bigass:

Anyway, thank you for submitting your opinions on your capitals! I'll incorporate them into my spreadsheet later today when I wake up.
Life would be boring if we didn't take an offramp every once in a while

A weird combination of a weather geek, roadgeek, car enthusiast and furry mixed with many anxiety related disorders



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