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Author Topic: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas  (Read 28272 times)

Scott5114

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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #25 on: February 06, 2015, 07:49:10 PM »

Quote
It would be a dream come true for a 4 lane divided all the way to Harrison, but 412 across the State would be miraculous,well at least to US 67.

It might be a more realistic dream to have US-412 completely upgraded to an Interstate quality facility between Tulsa and Springdale. Obviously the gaps between the Cherokee Turnpike and Springdale Bypass will get more difficult to fill as more development goes up along the corridor. It might be a little forward thinking for OK DOT and AHTD to acquire ROW for the corridor.

Hey, if Missouri could make US-60 four lanes all the way from Springfield to Illinois, then Arkansas can manage US-412 to Harrison.

Interestingly enough, when I went through there in 2012 the most mountainous sections of road had a couple of handpainted signs on adjoining properties reading "MoDOT SUCKS". Unfortunately, it didn't have any other context as to why MoDOT sucked in this particular case. Guess you can't please everyone, even with an expressway...
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Bobby5280

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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #26 on: February 06, 2015, 10:54:05 PM »

Just a guess: maybe the land owners along that stretch of US-60 are saying MoDOT sucks because tax dollars were going into a road rather than into more ag subsidies that would benefit them specifically. Or perhaps they want us to go back to riding on horseback or in horse-drawn carriages.
:-P

Quote from: bugo
I've done that drive many times, and the only real improvements that need to be made are a Siloam Springs bypass and a 70 MPH speed limit west of Inola.

That might be good for now, but what about 10-20 years in the future? NW Arkansas is one of the fastest growing regions in the United States. It's pretty much a guarantee traffic levels along the US-412 corridor between Tulsa and Springdale are going to rise a lot in the years ahead.

If a divided highway with at grade insections is "good enough" for now what's wrong with upgrading the road to where it has enough ROW to build a freeway in the future? Either build an expressway with a median wide enough to hold a freeway or add enough ROW to one side or another. That would prevent commercial and residential development from overrunning the corridor as the region grows. When traffic levels make it necessary to build the freeway or toll road no property would have to be bulldozed to make room for it. That could save many millions of dollars.

How much extra did it cost TX DOT to build US-287 between Fort Worth and Amarillo with that large median along so much of the route? If it was ever fully improved into an Interstate highway (I-32 has been the designation kicked around) not many buildings would have to be removed to make room for it.

Quote from: kphoger
Hey, if Missouri could make US-60 four lanes all the way from Springfield to Illinois, then Arkansas can manage US-412 to Harrison.

What are the traffic counts between Springdale and Harrison versus that of the traffic level between Springdale and Tulsa? I think a fully Interstate quality link between Tulsa and Springdale is a more pressing concern.
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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #27 on: February 07, 2015, 10:37:16 AM »

^^  I haven't driven US-412 in Oklahoma for several years now, but what's wrong with its median such that it couldn't be upgraded to a freeway in the future?  I see a grassy median all the way from Tulsa to West Siloam Springs, then also from Siloam Springs to Tontitown.
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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #28 on: February 07, 2015, 11:05:21 AM »

Quote
It would be a dream come true for a 4 lane divided all the way to Harrison, but 412 across the State would be miraculous,well at least to US 67.

It might be a more realistic dream to have US-412 completely upgraded to an Interstate quality facility between Tulsa and Springdale. Obviously the gaps between the Cherokee Turnpike and Springdale Bypass will get more difficult to fill as more development goes up along the corridor. It might be a little forward thinking for OK DOT and AHTD to acquire ROW for the corridor.
Fictional territory, I know, but wasn't there sporadic talk about the SBP being the first upgrade to what would be an eventual I-42 linking Tulsa and Memphis, and connecting NWA while doing so?
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codyg1985

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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #29 on: February 07, 2015, 11:12:20 AM »

Quote
It would be a dream come true for a 4 lane divided all the way to Harrison, but 412 across the State would be miraculous,well at least to US 67.

It might be a more realistic dream to have US-412 completely upgraded to an Interstate quality facility between Tulsa and Springdale. Obviously the gaps between the Cherokee Turnpike and Springdale Bypass will get more difficult to fill as more development goes up along the corridor. It might be a little forward thinking for OK DOT and AHTD to acquire ROW for the corridor.
Fictional territory, I know, but wasn't there sporadic talk about the SBP being the first upgrade to what would be an eventual I-42 linking Tulsa and Memphis, and connecting NWA while doing so?
 

I think it was supposed to upgrade all of US 412 between Tulsa and Jackson, TN.
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rte66man

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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #30 on: February 07, 2015, 08:33:41 PM »

^^  I haven't driven US-412 in Oklahoma for several years now, but what's wrong with its median such that it couldn't be upgraded to a freeway in the future?  I see a grassy median all the way from Tulsa to West Siloam Springs, then also from Siloam Springs to Tontitown.

Not wide enough in AR.  Plus the real problems are at Siloam Springs and Tontitown to wherever the western end of the Springdale bypass is.
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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #31 on: February 07, 2015, 08:43:32 PM »

Plus the real problems are at Siloam Springs and Tontitown to wherever the western end of the Springdale bypass is.
Tontitown will all be bypassed: http://www.arkansashighways.com/environmental/environmental_studies/001966/Maps/001966_2008.05.25_DPH_Disp_Cou.pdf
From there to Siloam Springs is Ozark National Forest, so it shouldn't have sprawl problems. The only issue then is Siloam Springs and its 1961 bypass. A new bypass was being considered in 2007, and could be built in the future if desired.
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rte66man

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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #32 on: February 07, 2015, 08:48:06 PM »

Plus the real problems are at Siloam Springs and Tontitown to wherever the western end of the Springdale bypass is.
Tontitown will all be bypassed: http://www.arkansashighways.com/environmental/environmental_studies/001966/Maps/001966_2008.05.25_DPH_Disp_Cou.pdf
From there to Siloam Springs is Ozark National Forest, so it shouldn't have sprawl problems. The only issue then is Siloam Springs and its 1961 bypass. A new bypass was being considered in 2007, and could be built in the future if desired.

Didn't realize the Springdale Bypass went that far west.  It will take AHTD and ODOT another 20 years to build a Siloam Springs bypass.
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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #33 on: February 07, 2015, 09:43:56 PM »

They need to get off their fucking dicks and build a Siloam Springs bypass. The current route is full of lights, slow, packed with traffic, and just sucks.
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US71

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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #34 on: February 08, 2015, 09:16:55 AM »

They need to get off their fucking dicks and build a Siloam Springs bypass. The current route is full of lights, slow, packed with traffic, and just sucks.
Right after they replace the Broadway Bridge, the I-30 bridge, and widen I-630 ;)
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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #35 on: February 08, 2015, 03:56:06 PM »

^^  I haven't driven US-412 in Oklahoma for several years now, but what's wrong with its median such that it couldn't be upgraded to a freeway in the future?  I see a grassy median all the way from Tulsa to West Siloam Springs, then also from Siloam Springs to Tontitown.

Not wide enough in AR.  Plus the real problems are at Siloam Springs and Tontitown to wherever the western end of the Springdale bypass is.

Not wide enough for what? A freeway is a freeway, regardless of the median width. Just pave or over and put up a Jersey barrier. Or do like I-44 in southern Oklahoma and just put a cable barrier in the middle. You don't need fifty feet of median space to make a freeway median.
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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #36 on: February 08, 2015, 04:36:53 PM »

I think they need to widen pretty much every state road in the city limits of Fay/Sdale/Rogers/Bville and I-49 to 8 lanes and build the entire US 412 bypass before a new terrain Siloam Springs bypass. I'm not sure there is this great influx of traffic between Tulsa and Springdale, or that that traffic is a priority to AHTD compared to connectivity within the actual metro areas
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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #37 on: February 08, 2015, 07:57:08 PM »

Why wasn't the first segment of the Pine Bluff bypass signed as AR 565? Instead it was signed as spur US 65. Maybe the first part of the Springdale bypass will be signed as spur US 412. That would explain why the "TBD" is in a shield.
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NE2

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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #38 on: February 08, 2015, 10:42:34 PM »

Maybe the first phase will be US 71S, since it'll go from I-49/US 71 west to the airport. Or maybe it'll be US 980.
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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #39 on: February 08, 2015, 10:54:05 PM »

Maybe the first phase will be US 71S, since it'll go from I-49/US 71 west to the airport. Or maybe it'll be US 980.
I vote for AR 68 ;)
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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #40 on: February 09, 2015, 03:24:45 AM »

What will the freeway spur to the airport be numbered as? AR 512? AR 980? US 412S?
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AHTD

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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #41 on: February 09, 2015, 01:24:33 PM »

Two things to note here:

The Springdale bypass is being constructed as a four-lane divided, FULLY CONTROLLED ACCESS (read: Interstate) facility. At this time the only exits/interchanges along the route are at I-49 and State Highway 112.

That stated, the construction will actually end just to the west of State Highway 112 at the location where the NWA airport access road will be constructed. Public access will terminate at State Highway 112 until the airport access road is open.

Which brings us to the second note.... the airport access road will be constructed and maintained by the airport authority. It will not become part of the state highway system but rather exist as a private drive.

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NE2

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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #42 on: February 09, 2015, 01:43:23 PM »

The plans are no longer on the site, are they?
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AHTD

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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #43 on: February 09, 2015, 02:34:36 PM »

Here is what we currently have:

From the Connecting Arkansas Program web site:

http://www.connectingarkansasprogram.com/corridors/21/highway-412-benton-county/#.VNkFwGB0zDc

From the Arkansas Highways web site (old stuff):

 http://www.arkansashighways.com/environmental/environmental_studies/001966/001966.aspx


Was there something else somewhere else?

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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #44 on: February 09, 2015, 02:55:46 PM »

Currently Advertised Projects & Announcements
http://www.arkansashighways.com/ProgCon/General/JOBS_include.aspx
The plans are no longer on the site, are they?

The plans have been moved from the "Current" link posted in the above quote to the "Previous"" construction plans:

http://www.arkansashighways.com/ProgCon/PREVIOUS%20LETTING%20PLANS/2014/DEC%202014/CA0907.PDF
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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #45 on: February 09, 2015, 04:16:38 PM »

The plans have been moved from the "Current" link posted in the above quote to the "Previous"" construction plans:

http://www.arkansashighways.com/ProgCon/PREVIOUS%20LETTING%20PLANS/2014/DEC%202014/CA0907.PDF
Ah, thanks. Apart from the screenshots posted above, the following is of interest:
*112 south will be signed TO WEST 412 from the bypass south. The bypass probably shouldn't be signed this way on I-49, however, unless the 2 miles of US 412 from I-49 to 112 are particularly bad (and 112 is just fine through Elm Springs). Interestingly, a few of the assemblies show TO WEST TBD instead. The obvious implication is that the first draft of the plans had 412 in all places (it is in fact being built as Route 412 section 2), but they realized it would not be a good way to sign 412 for now.
*Exit 9: 112 / Elm Springs / Cave Springs (why not use the distance from the state line?)
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Scott5114

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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #46 on: February 09, 2015, 05:41:43 PM »

I'm sure it's a long shot, but since this will be an Interstate-grade facility, is there any chance of an I-149 designation?
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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #47 on: February 09, 2015, 06:32:50 PM »

No to I-149. It will simply be US 412.
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US71

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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #48 on: February 09, 2015, 06:33:43 PM »

I'm sure it's a long shot, but since this will be an Interstate-grade facility, is there any chance of an I-149 designation?
Be kind of silly, IMO, since whatever it is designated will likely be a temp designation until it's completed and becomes the new 412.
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Re: US 412 Bypass - Springdale, Arkansas
« Reply #49 on: February 12, 2015, 06:31:36 PM »

412 could be concurrent with the interstate.........
..........haha, just kidding, this is Arkansas.
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