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Author Topic: Ohio  (Read 40096 times)

coldshoulder

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #175 on: May 11, 2017, 03:03:25 PM »

There also are/were plans to extend a freeway off of that ghost end in the eastern part of the downtown freeway loop in Youngstown.  According to those city/metro maps (they were printed on regular office copy paper) that I got from a Turnpike service plaza in the late 1990s, it was to continue eastward and then northward to connect with I-80 near Hubbard.

Mike

Yes, the long-planned "Hubbard Expressway", intended to carry either and/or both OH-7 and US-62, from the stub freeway end at Albert Street, continuing northeast through the east side of Youngstown, then connecting with I-80 in Hubbard Township.

This project has been dormant for some time; certain officials have attempted to "revive" it a few times over the past 30 years, but as I recall, at some point about 10 years ago, ODOT officially withdrew their support....meaning it will likely never get built.
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Sykotyk

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #176 on: May 11, 2017, 06:44:36 PM »

There also are/were plans to extend a freeway off of that ghost end in the eastern part of the downtown freeway loop in Youngstown.  According to those city/metro maps (they were printed on regular office copy paper) that I got from a Turnpike service plaza in the late 1990s, it was to continue eastward and then northward to connect with I-80 near Hubbard.

Mike

Yes, the long-planned "Hubbard Expressway", intended to carry either and/or both OH-7 and US-62, from the stub freeway end at Albert Street, continuing northeast through the east side of Youngstown, then connecting with I-80 in Hubbard Township.

This project has been dormant for some time; certain officials have attempted to "revive" it a few times over the past 30 years, but as I recall, at some point about 10 years ago, ODOT officially withdrew their support....meaning it will likely never get built.

Somewhere just a year or two ago about reviving it. Mostly for the argument that gets used a lot: industrial development. Build a freeway there, and you can bring business there. With 711 built, it's not as necessary. But with the new Chill-Can area being built at the end of the US422 freeway and the Himrod interchange from US622, there may be some truth to that. Those two freeways easily accessing that property made it quite attractive to the develpers (it was their family's original location for Star Bottling, so it had some sentimental value, but easy access to the east side of Youngstown made it stick).
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Roadsguy

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #177 on: May 12, 2017, 10:11:18 AM »

Here is a Mahoning County Highway Map from 1970 showing the proposed US-62 running across the southern portion of Mahoning County, north of Sebring, Salem, and Washingtonville; and showing the cloverleaf interchange with OH-11, before proceeding eastward into Columbiana County and then onto Pennsylvania.  However, there is no indication of a proposed southerly extension of OH-680 to that freeway...although I recall seeing that in another map of some sort.

http://gisapp.mahoningcountyoh.gov/Public_FTP_Folder/Historical_Maps/H1970/HIGHWAY_1970A.pdf

Huh, I wonder what PennDOT had planned to connect to it. It couldn't have been more US 62 since by the state line, current US 62 is already way up in the Sharon-Hermitage area.
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coldshoulder

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #178 on: May 12, 2017, 11:10:17 AM »

Here is a Mahoning County Highway Map from 1970 showing the proposed US-62 running across the southern portion of Mahoning County, north of Sebring, Salem, and Washingtonville; and showing the cloverleaf interchange with OH-11, before proceeding eastward into Columbiana County and then onto Pennsylvania.  However, there is no indication of a proposed southerly extension of OH-680 to that freeway...although I recall seeing that in another map of some sort.

http://gisapp.mahoningcountyoh.gov/Public_FTP_Folder/Historical_Maps/H1970/HIGHWAY_1970A.pdf

Huh, I wonder what PennDOT had planned to connect to it. It couldn't have been more US 62 since by the state line, current US 62 is already way up in the Sharon-Hermitage area.

Had that proposed east-west freeway/expressway been built, it's likely that US-62 would have proceeded in a northerly direction via the cloverleaf at OH-11, multiplexing with OH-11 to US-224 in Canfield, then up South Raccoon Road to the Shields Rd./Canfield Rd. intersection, where US-62 currently continues northeasterly along Canfield Road.

OH-14 would have multiplexed on this proposed east-west freeway, beginning northwest of Salem (in fact, that short 4-lane portion north of Salem that was built was, or has been signed as "14T"), with OH-14 continuing on this route eastward past OH-11 towards Pennsylvania, to connect with PA-51, northeast of East Palestine, where the current two-lane OH-14 meets PA-51 at the Ohio-Pennsylvania border.

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Buck87

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #179 on: May 17, 2017, 10:14:06 PM »

Anybody know if they are even considering adding lanes on SR-2 from the I-90 split to SR-58 in the near future?  That's about the only other widening I can consider being warranted out there in the next 20-30 years.

They did just replace the first two bridges on OH 2 west of the I-90 split, so knowing whether or not those new bridges were built wide enough for 3 lanes would go a long way to answering that. I was actually just through there last week, but unfortunately wasn't paying attention to this detail. Anyone know if they were built wide enough for 3 lanes?

I was through there yesterday and the OH 2 bridges west of the I-90 split were NOT built wide enough for 3 lanes.

Also, work has started in the medians on either side of the I-90/OH2 bridges that are about to be replaced at the OH 57 interchange, and that construction zone has the first variable speed limit signs I've seen in Ohio. When I went through eastbound around 2pm the speed limit was 60, and when I came back westbound around 11pm it was 50. (the regular speed limit there is 65)

And in other news on this corridor, there hasn't been any progress on adding exit numbers to OH 2 in over a year. The exit numbering, (which also includes median mile markers every 0.2 miles) still stops at OH 61, with only the westbound set of BGS for that exit having exit number tabs. The rest of the exits in Erie County around Huron and Sandusky remain unnumbered, however, once you cross into Ottawa County (which is also crossing into a different ODOT district) there are exit numbers in place for remainder of the freeway, although without median mile markers.
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Hot Rod Hootenanny

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vtk

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #181 on: June 13, 2017, 12:31:30 AM »

Sure, blame a long straight ramp for drivers' bad behavior. How is this different from any straight rural highway entering a small town? Park a police car at the east end of the bridge over the Olentangy, issue hundreds of speeding tickets, problem solved.
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Buck87

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #182 on: July 05, 2017, 09:44:14 AM »

Seeing more of these "toll" banners added to Ohio Turnpike signage in district 2. This set of signs is at the OH 53 north exit off the US 20/US 6 bypass in Fremont



VS986

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When it comes to volume, the Ohio River is not a tributary. The Upper Mississippi is.

amroad17

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #183 on: July 05, 2017, 11:13:12 PM »

^ This is actually a good thing.  I see nothing wrong with it.
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silverback1065

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #184 on: July 06, 2017, 08:08:56 AM »

illinois does it
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seicer

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #185 on: July 06, 2017, 08:34:40 AM »

Doesn't the MUTCD require this anyways? The signage for the Ohio Turnpike varied greatly and it wasn't always obvious that the highway you were turning onto was a toll road.
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sandwalk

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #186 on: July 10, 2017, 09:04:03 AM »

I see nothing wrong with adding these "TOLL" signs. However, I thought it was pretty self-explanatory that if you were getting onto the "Turnpike" you knew you were going to pay a toll. :D
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Bitmapped

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #187 on: July 10, 2017, 04:19:14 PM »

I see nothing wrong with adding these "TOLL" signs. However, I thought it was pretty self-explanatory that if you were getting onto the "Turnpike" you knew you were going to pay a toll. :D

Not necessarily. Parts of the Pennsylvania Turnpike are free, for example.
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seicer

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #188 on: July 10, 2017, 05:07:54 PM »

And there are a lot of roads with the name "Turnpike" in them that are not toll. Folks from other countries (or even different regions of the states) may not know what Turnpike even is.
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sandwalk

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #189 on: July 10, 2017, 09:25:19 PM »

Tolls are literally in the definition of "turnpike." Also, the Ohio Turnpike has been collecting tolls since it opened in 1955.

Taken from Merriam Webster dictionary:
Definition of turnpike
a (1) :  a road (such as an expressway) for the use of which tolls are collected (2) :  a road formerly maintained as a turnpike
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mgk920

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #190 on: July 10, 2017, 09:44:25 PM »

Tolls are literally in the definition of "turnpike." Also, the Ohio Turnpike has been collecting tolls since it opened in 1955.

Taken from Merriam Webster dictionary:
Definition of turnpike
a (1) :  a road (such as an expressway) for the use of which tolls are collected (2) :  a road formerly maintained as a turnpike

Why 'turnpike'?  In the early years, the toll taker would go out and manually 'turn the pike' to let the traveler pass once his or her toll was paid.

Mike
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Roadsguy

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #191 on: July 10, 2017, 09:53:16 PM »

Tolls are literally in the definition of "turnpike." Also, the Ohio Turnpike has been collecting tolls since it opened in 1955.

Taken from Merriam Webster dictionary:
Definition of turnpike
a (1) :  a road (such as an expressway) for the use of which tolls are collected (2) :  a road formerly maintained as a turnpike

But the Connecticut Turnpike and most of the Delaware Turnpike don't have tolls. Yes a turnpike "should" be tolled, but clearly not all are, so a road having "Turnpike" in the name isn't enough of an indication to drivers that a road is tolled. Not to mention the numerous toll roads not named "XYZ Turnpike" that need some standardized toll indicator.
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seicer

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #192 on: July 10, 2017, 10:46:20 PM »

And in other countries (notably Mexico and Canada), Turnpike is not used in any sense of a toll road. With the examples above, there are many local roads that have "Turnpike" in the name but have not collected tolls in over one-hundred years.

There is a legal and logical rationale to providing TOLL banners when a road is tolled. It's clear, concise and to the point, unlike tiny logos for roads that do not imply if it's tolled or not. Can you tell, at 65 MPH, if the New York Thruway logo is a toll road or not (where Thruway is not a clear indicator of a tolled facility)? The New Jersey Turnpike logo (where Turnpike is in very tiny lettering)? Pennsylvania Turnpike? Chicago Skyway?
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GeekJedi

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #193 on: July 11, 2017, 07:46:47 AM »

Tolls are literally in the definition of "turnpike." Also, the Ohio Turnpike has been collecting tolls since it opened in 1955.

Taken from Merriam Webster dictionary:
Definition of turnpike
a (1) :  a road (such as an expressway) for the use of which tolls are collected (2) :  a road formerly maintained as a turnpike

However, someone who (for example) lives in Wisconsin and has never heard of a turnpike would likely not know of the type of road, nor the definition of "turnpike", regardless of the literal definition. It's one of those words that would literally never come up in everyday conversation. However, "toll" is a pretty universal word used in many different contexts, but always means a fee.
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6a

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #194 on: July 11, 2017, 06:56:24 PM »

As there were "turnpikes" there were also "free pikes" - with High Free Pike in Madison County OH remaining as the only existing example I'm aware of that still retains that designation.
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Rothman

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #195 on: July 12, 2017, 08:24:34 AM »

As there were "turnpikes" there were also "free pikes" - with High Free Pike in Madison County OH remaining as the only existing example I'm aware of that still retains that designation.
...or even "shunpikes."
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vtk

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #196 on: July 13, 2017, 07:52:58 AM »

As there were "turnpikes" there were also "free pikes" - with High Free Pike in Madison County OH remaining as the only existing example I'm aware of that still retains that designation.

Cool, I never knew the etymology of that road. However, it seems that in the early 20th century every road in Madison County was of the form "___ Pike"; roughly half of them have now taken the suffix Road instead.
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plain

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #197 on: July 13, 2017, 11:22:05 AM »

There are several "turnpikes" I can think of, especially in Connecticut and Virginia, that are not only toll-free but aren't even freeway.

I definitely like the idea of the MUTCD guidelines requiring the yellow TOLL banners. Pennsylvania is doing it now too and Virginia has them at at least two slip ramp entrances to VA 195. But judging by what I've seen on Street View, the state of Oklahoma needs to get with the program like right nooooowwww
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Rothman

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #198 on: July 13, 2017, 01:10:38 PM »

A lot of old turnpikes that are now free once had tolls a very long time ago.

It was also not unheard of for a resident along a road to set up their own makeshift toll booths in the 18th and 19th Centuries.
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Sykotyk

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #199 on: July 14, 2017, 06:04:07 PM »

There was also 'free' Pikes. Notable around Pittsburgh, as the Steubenville Pike (US22) and Washington Pike (US19) were still well known as the actual name of stretches of the road. The Freeway US22 bypassed the old two-lane Steubenville Pike (now called Old Steubenville Pike), and the current freeway is quite regularly referred to as the Steubenville Pike though it's actual name I'm not certain.
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