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Author Topic: Ohio  (Read 64137 times)

GCrites80s

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #350 on: March 19, 2020, 08:28:27 PM »

At least it doesn't say "Hillards"
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coldshoulder

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #351 on: March 24, 2020, 08:47:56 PM »

Over in the General Highway Talk forum, there is an active thread titled "3di Poll".  Buck87 posted regarding I-280 near Toledo, which caused me to visit Google Maps to reacquaint myself with that section of roadway, including the southern extension (OH 420) below the Turnpike.

Somebody help me out here.  The southern termination of OH 420 at US 20/US 23 utilizes a traditional trumpet, but has an "extra" ramp from EB 20/23 that follows outside of the main trumpet, appearing to duplicate the exact same movement, but apparently there to avoid, for EB 20/23 travelers needing to exit at Pemberville Road, a very quick and short weave with the almost immediate loop exit coming off the trumpet. 

Would I be correct in thinking that's the reason for the additional ramp?  And was it always there, or was it a "safety correction" some years after the original construction?
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zzcarp

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #352 on: March 24, 2020, 09:45:57 PM »

Would I be correct in thinking that's the reason for the additional ramp?  And was it always there, or was it a "safety correction" some years after the original construction?

That interchange, the ramp, and the interchange at Pemberville Road were all constructed at the same time and opened in 2006. You are correct that the ramp is to eliminate the weaving due to the close proximity of the interchanges.

Before that, OH 420 met US 20-23 at an at-grade divided pseudo-interchange with US 20-23 having the right-of-way. I believe that dates back to the construction of the expressway from the Turnpike to US 20-23, and certainly pre-1980.
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Hot Rod Hootenanny

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #353 on: March 24, 2020, 10:36:02 PM »

Would I be correct in thinking that's the reason for the additional ramp?  And was it always there, or was it a "safety correction" some years after the original construction?

That interchange, the ramp, and the interchange at Pemberville Road were all constructed at the same time and opened in 2006. You are correct that the ramp is to eliminate the weaving due to the close proximity of the interchanges.

Before that, OH 420 met US 20-23 at an at-grade divided pseudo-interchange with US 20-23 having the right-of-way. I believe that dates back to the construction of the expressway from the Turnpike to US 20-23, and certainly pre-1980.

According to Historic Aerials, the "at-grade divided pseudo-interchange" goes as far back as 1963.
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Buck87

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #354 on: March 25, 2020, 02:34:14 PM »

Looking at it closer I see that ramp is the only way to get to Pemberville Rd from 20/23 east. Never really noticed that before.

I don't really have any memory of what the 420-20/23 intersection looked like before the rebuild. When you say " at-grade divided pseudo-interchange" do you mean something kinda like this?

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.5065382,-82.8308716,558m/data=!3m1!1e3
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zzcarp

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #355 on: March 25, 2020, 06:01:06 PM »

Looking at it closer I see that ramp is the only way to get to Pemberville Rd from 20/23 east. Never really noticed that before.

I don't really have any memory of what the 420-20/23 intersection looked like before the rebuild. When you say " at-grade divided pseudo-interchange" do you mean something kinda like this?

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.5065382,-82.8308716,558m/data=!3m1!1e3

It looked quite a bit like that route 269 interchange to which you linked.

Here's an aerial pic of the 420-20-23 intersection as it looked like before the interchange was constructed:





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Buck87

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #356 on: May 11, 2020, 07:59:44 PM »

Drove through Ashland for the first time in a while and noticed that the southern US 250 / US 42 intersection is now at grade. The old configuration had US 42 crossing US 250 on a bridge, with a 2 lane access road connecting them in the southwest corner, in kind of a quasi interchange. 
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Hot Rod Hootenanny

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #357 on: May 11, 2020, 11:09:46 PM »

Drove through Ashland for the first time in a while and noticed that the southern US 250 / US 42 intersection is now at grade. The old configuration had US 42 crossing US 250 on a bridge, with a 2 lane access road connecting them in the southwest corner, in kind of a quasi interchange. 
According to Google Earth, the interchange was torn down by 2015.
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thenetwork

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #358 on: May 11, 2020, 11:20:51 PM »

Drove through Ashland for the first time in a while and noticed that the southern US 250 / US 42 intersection is now at grade. The old configuration had US 42 crossing US 250 on a bridge, with a 2 lane access road connecting them in the southwest corner, in kind of a quasi interchange. 

There also was a similar, tighter connector road on the Northeast side as well, as seen by this overhead view:

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Ashland,+OH+44805/@40.8632241,-82.2903499,584m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x8839fb4c7c45928f:0xec32ce48c044248f!8m2!3d40.8686675!4d-82.3182178


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zzcarp

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #359 on: May 12, 2020, 09:12:51 AM »

Drove through Ashland for the first time in a while and noticed that the southern US 250 / US 42 intersection is now at grade. The old configuration had US 42 crossing US 250 on a bridge, with a 2 lane access road connecting them in the southwest corner, in kind of a quasi interchange. 

There also was a similar, tighter connector road on the Northeast side as well, as seen by this overhead view:

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Ashland,+OH+44805/@40.8632241,-82.2903499,584m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x8839fb4c7c45928f:0xec32ce48c044248f!8m2!3d40.8686675!4d-82.3182178

The connector road on the northeast side was built first with the US 42 bypass (when US 250 still went through downtown Ashland) and managed all movements. In the early 90s when they built the US 250 bypass north of town and multiplexed it with US 42 back to its original alignment, they built the connector road in the southwest quadrant. Both then functioned as quasi RIRO "exits" from the US 42 mainline to/from US 250/SR 96.

I assume when the original overpass reached the end of its life, ODOT thought a conventional intersection would handle the traffic better than the substandard interchange and would save money on maintenance versus replacing the bridge.
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Hot Rod Hootenanny

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #360 on: May 16, 2020, 09:53:36 PM »

After partaking in a quarantine roadtrip in Western Ohio today I can tell everyone that it appears ODOT is replacing all the roadside signs along OH 15/US 23 in Hancock & Wyandot Counties (ODOT district 1). Along with the interchange between I-75 & US 68/Oh 15 still being worked on, ODOT is also replacing the bridge deck on US 68 over Oh 15 (SE corner of Findlay). Finally, ODOT has blocked the medium for two minor roads that cross OH 15 between US 68 & Oh 37.
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okroads

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #361 on: May 18, 2020, 01:58:24 PM »

After partaking in a quarantine roadtrip in Western Ohio today I can tell everyone that it appears ODOT is replacing all the roadside signs along OH 15/US 23 in Hancock & Wyandot Counties (ODOT district 1).

Wonder if the new signs will include the addition of exit numbers on OH 15 & US 23.

6a

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Ohio
« Reply #362 on: May 19, 2020, 05:09:34 PM »

I-71 is underwater south of downtown Columbus. They’ve also closed the floodgates at Frank and Harmon Roads.

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thenetwork

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #363 on: May 19, 2020, 09:17:03 PM »

I-71 is underwater south of downtown Columbus. They’ve also closed the floodgates at Frank and Harmon Roads.



And HOW many years did it take ODOT to assign a control city to SR-315???
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Hot Rod Hootenanny

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #364 on: May 20, 2020, 11:10:27 AM »

I-71 is underwater south of downtown Columbus. They’ve also closed the floodgates at Frank and Harmon Roads.


And HOW many years did it take ODOT to assign a control city to SR-315???

20 years
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PurdueBill

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #365 on: May 20, 2020, 04:11:06 PM »

A couple of the signs on 71 NB approaching 70 and 315 actually had Worthington shown long enough to have the lighting on the signs and a center tab for the 315 exit; I think I recall them being there in about 2009 and they may actually go back a few years before that (especially given the lighting being installed).  Why it wasn't included on similar signs of more recent vintage (like eastbound on 70 where it was Cleveland, Wheeling, nothing, and Cincinnati going across the 4 signs) is weird.  I like parallel structure...it doesn't matter if the others are regional and 315 gets a local control city; it looks wrong.
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Hot Rod Hootenanny

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #366 on: May 20, 2020, 07:23:34 PM »

A couple of the signs on 71 NB approaching 70 and 315 actually had Worthington shown long enough to have the lighting on the signs and a center tab for the 315 exit; I think I recall them being there in about 2009 and they may actually go back a few years before that (especially given the lighting being installed).  Why it wasn't included on similar signs of more recent vintage (like eastbound on 70 where it was Cleveland, Wheeling, nothing, and Cincinnati going across the 4 signs) is weird.  I like parallel structure...it doesn't matter if the others are regional and 315 gets a local control city; it looks wrong.
ODOT has never used a control city for 315 in either direction along I-70. Back in the "old days" (opening of the outerbelt through 2000), I-270 used "Olentangy River Rd" North & South as the control city for 315 from I-270.
I do recall ODOT changing the overhead signs for 315, around OSU campus in 2001 (while I was a student there) and added Worthington for 315 NB & Columbus for 315 SB. I do believe around this same time, ODOT, gave 315 SB the control city of Columbus up at I-270.
On the other hand, when work was finally completed on Spring-Sandusky (I-670/US33/Oh 315) in 2004, all the overhead signs for 315, along I-670 just gave directions (North & South), no cities.
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sparker

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #367 on: May 20, 2020, 07:48:27 PM »

I-71 is underwater south of downtown Columbus. They’ve also closed the floodgates at Frank and Harmon Roads.



Wow -- that looks like CA 99 near Tulare during the 1997 floods -- every low spot inundated.   
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wanderer2575

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #368 on: May 20, 2020, 10:49:28 PM »

Would I be correct in thinking that's the reason for the additional ramp?  And was it always there, or was it a "safety correction" some years after the original construction?

That interchange, the ramp, and the interchange at Pemberville Road were all constructed at the same time and opened in 2006. You are correct that the ramp is to eliminate the weaving due to the close proximity of the interchanges.


What I find bizarre about the US-20/23 and OH-420 interchange is the narrowness of the US-20/23 corridor in a rural location.  No left shoulders, and the OH-420 and Pemberville Road bridges have vertical abutment walls.
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thenetwork

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #369 on: May 21, 2020, 10:47:34 AM »

Would I be correct in thinking that's the reason for the additional ramp?  And was it always there, or was it a "safety correction" some years after the original construction?

That interchange, the ramp, and the interchange at Pemberville Road were all constructed at the same time and opened in 2006. You are correct that the ramp is to eliminate the weaving due to the close proximity of the interchanges.


What I find bizarre about the US-20/23 and OH-420 interchange is the narrowness of the US-20/23 corridor in a rural location.  No left shoulders, and the OH-420 and Pemberville Road bridges have vertical abutment walls.


Never understood why ODOT never widened the US-20/US-23 overlap from Woodville to near Perrysburg into a 4-lane divided expressway after all these decades as it has been a heavy truck route (even after the I-75/Ohio Turnpike connection was completed in the late 80s).

Yeah, you COULD argue that SR-795 was built instead for the truck traffic, but that is too far north of a jog and the lack of traffic proves it.

All the times I used to use US-20 from Norwalk to Toledo to get to and from college.  It was easier (and cheaper) to shunpike and US-20 was pleasant to drive on -- 4-lanes, even through the smaller towns -- UNTIL you hit Woodville when the road went to 2-lanes all the way to I-75.  It was damn near impossible to pass slower traffic back then, and I assume it hasn't come close to improving since.

In fact, getting anywhere from the Southeast Toledo Metro area to the Northwestern I-475/US-23 corridor has always been convoluted with finding the right combination of thoroughfares.   Either you have to take an interstate combo that takes you out of your way for a spell, or a combination of surface streets in order to cross the Maumee River, which is the main roadblock in that town.   The least they could've done is to complete the US-20 expressway through Wood County.
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wanderer2575

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #370 on: May 21, 2020, 12:39:51 PM »

Would I be correct in thinking that's the reason for the additional ramp?  And was it always there, or was it a "safety correction" some years after the original construction?

That interchange, the ramp, and the interchange at Pemberville Road were all constructed at the same time and opened in 2006. You are correct that the ramp is to eliminate the weaving due to the close proximity of the interchanges.


What I find bizarre about the US-20/23 and OH-420 interchange is the narrowness of the US-20/23 corridor in a rural location.  No left shoulders, and the OH-420 and Pemberville Road bridges have vertical abutment walls.


Never understood why ODOT never widened the US-20/US-23 overlap from Woodville to near Perrysburg into a 4-lane divided expressway after all these decades as it has been a heavy truck route (even after the I-75/Ohio Turnpike connection was completed in the late 80s).

Yeah, you COULD argue that SR-795 was built instead for the truck traffic, but that is too far north of a jog and the lack of traffic proves it.

All the times I used to use US-20 from Norwalk to Toledo to get to and from college.  It was easier (and cheaper) to shunpike and US-20 was pleasant to drive on -- 4-lanes, even through the smaller towns -- UNTIL you hit Woodville when the road went to 2-lanes all the way to I-75.  It was damn near impossible to pass slower traffic back then, and I assume it hasn't come close to improving since.

It actually has, somewhat.  US-20 is now five lanes (undivided) between Woodville and OH-420.  That helps service the traffic to/from I-280 and points north.  I don't know when the widening was done, but I'm thinking it's been at least a dozen years.

But US-20/23 is still two lanes between OH-420 and I-75.
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zzcarp

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #371 on: May 21, 2020, 12:43:54 PM »

Quote
It actually has, somewhat.  US-20 is now five lanes (undivided) between Woodville and OH-420.  That helps service the traffic to/from I-280 and points north.  I don't know when the widening was done, but I'm thinking it's been at least a dozen years.

But US-20/23 is still two lanes between OH-420 and I-75.

It looks like it was completed in 2008. I remember driving it on one of my trips back to northern Ohio a decade ago.
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thenetwork

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #372 on: May 21, 2020, 02:59:14 PM »

Quote
It actually has, somewhat.  US-20 is now five lanes (undivided) between Woodville and OH-420.  That helps service the traffic to/from I-280 and points north.  I don't know when the widening was done, but I'm thinking it's been at least a dozen years.

But US-20/23 is still two lanes between OH-420 and I-75.

It looks like it was completed in 2008. I remember driving it on one of my trips back to northern Ohio a decade ago.

Good to know.  My last time down that segment of US-20 was before then.  I bailed out and took SR-51 into Toledo in 2016.
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Buck87

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Re: Ohio
« Reply #373 on: May 22, 2020, 08:36:39 PM »

They even made the 5 lane portion 60 mph, which I was pleasantly surprised by since it doesn't have a median
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Re: Ohio
« Reply #374 on: May 24, 2020, 12:00:22 PM »

They even made the 5 lane portion 60 mph, which I was pleasantly surprised by since it doesn't have a median

That continuous center left turn lane is likely used very rarely (all intersections are with minor township roads at obtuse angles); ODOT apparently decided that was sufficient separation of thru lanes to allow a higher speed limit.
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