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Author Topic: I-95 (JFK Highway) sign replacement project  (Read 8424 times)

ixnay

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Re: I-95 (JFK Highway) sign replacement project
« Reply #25 on: June 20, 2016, 08:09:56 PM »

Maryland was certainly the poster child of how to do Clearview wrong. Quite a few examples on the FHWA Clearview errors site were from the state.

Can we have the link to that site?  I tried to Google it without luck.

ixnay
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1995hoo

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Re: I-95 (JFK Highway) sign replacement project
« Reply #26 on: June 20, 2016, 09:01:05 PM »

Maryland was certainly the poster child of how to do Clearview wrong. Quite a few examples on the FHWA Clearview errors site were from the state.

Can we have the link to that site?  I tried to Google it without luck.

ixnay

Scroll down to the bottom. I recognize several signs from Northern Virginia and several from Maryland:

http://mutcd.fhwa.dot.gov/resources/clearviewdesignfaqs/index.htm
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jcn

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Re: I-95 (JFK Highway) sign replacement project
« Reply #27 on: October 16, 2016, 02:45:14 PM »

I spoke to MDTA about this a while ago actually, and they said that they plan on keeping New York as the northbound control city and the reason for that is because New York starts to become the control city at Canton Ave which is outside the project limits, so they want to keep it consistent.  Also, they said that they don't plan on alternating control cities because it would confuse drivers.

We should only worry about the northbound control city if the I-95 flyover ramps in PA causes most northeast through traffic to start traveling on I-95 through Philly.
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cpzilliacus

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Re: I-95 (JFK Highway) sign replacement project
« Reply #28 on: October 16, 2016, 09:29:15 PM »

I spoke to MDTA about this a while ago actually, and they said that they plan on keeping New York as the northbound control city and the reason for that is because New York starts to become the control city at Canton Ave which is outside the project limits, so they want to keep it consistent.  Also, they said that they don't plan on alternating control cities because it would confuse drivers.

We should only worry about the northbound control city if the I-95 flyover ramps in PA causes most northeast through traffic to start traveling on I-95 through Philly.

New York is signed on I-95 in Prince George's County as well in Fairfax County, Virginia. 

Once the Bristol, Pennsylvania project is completed, I hope that MDTA will consider signing Wilmington and Philadelphia, at least on mileage signs, and perhaps on the mainline, since their use of New York will become inconsistent with the way  that Delaware and Pennsylvania sign northbound I-95.
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epzik8

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Re: I-95 (JFK Highway) sign replacement project
« Reply #29 on: October 17, 2016, 03:24:58 PM »

I spoke to MDTA about this a while ago actually, and they said that they plan on keeping New York as the northbound control city and the reason for that is because New York starts to become the control city at Canton Ave which is outside the project limits, so they want to keep it consistent.  Also, they said that they don't plan on alternating control cities because it would confuse drivers.

We should only worry about the northbound control city if the I-95 flyover ramps in PA causes most northeast through traffic to start traveling on I-95 through Philly.
It's actually spelled Caton Avenue. Sorry, I'm not being mean! Just saying.
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PHLBOS

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Re: I-95 (JFK Highway) sign replacement project
« Reply #30 on: October 17, 2016, 05:05:02 PM »

The Maryland Transportation Authority (MdTA) is soliticting bids to replace much of the signage along JFK Highway (I-95) in Baltimore, Harford and Cecil Counties (details here).

All well and good - except - no mention of Wilmington or Philadelphia as control cities on I-95 northbound.  With the PTC and PennDOT actually making progress on getting enough of the interchange at Bristol done to complete I-95, I think it is time for Maryland to show Wilmington and especially Philadelphia as control cities on its signs north of Baltimore (and between the Capital Beltway and Baltimore as well).

The bulk of those signs were replaced in 2012 to show Clearview font. Adjustments were made to mileage signs during that time, and a few control points where changed too. Are they swapping out signs again because of the end of Clearview?

Looks like they're installing bigger guide signs with larger legends on them. The drawings make it seem like they'll still be in Clearview, but given how this happens after Clearview isn't allowed anymore, it may see a return to Highway Gothic for these signs.
When one looks at the detail sheets, towards the back; it appears that the only Clearview font displayed is where it should be (per prior FHWA guidelines); mixed-case lettering on dark backgrounds.

One thing I don't like about Maryland interchange signs (and such has existed long before the Clearview font came to light) is that they seem to vary in size at multi-ramp interchanges (cloverleafs & so forth).  The BGS at the first ramp is larger than the BGS displaying the message for the subsequent ramp.

While the intent may be to highlight the immediate exit; the size mixture just looks off & disjointed IMHO.
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epzik8

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Re: I-95 (JFK Highway) sign replacement project
« Reply #32 on: December 02, 2016, 06:40:32 PM »

Can they maybe change the Exit 85 signs (MD-22 Aberdeen) to Clearview already???
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cpzilliacus

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Re: I-95 (JFK Highway) sign replacement project
« Reply #33 on: December 04, 2016, 08:43:08 AM »

It's actually spelled Caton Avenue. Sorry, I'm not being mean! Just saying.
I spoke to MDTA about this a while ago actually, and they said that they plan on keeping New York as the northbound control city and the reason for that is because New York starts to become the control city at Canton Ave which is outside the project limits, so they want to keep it consistent.  Also, they said that they don't plan on alternating control cities because it would confuse drivers.

We should only worry about the northbound control city if the I-95 flyover ramps in PA causes most northeast through traffic to start traveling on I-95 through Philly.
It's actually spelled Caton Avenue. Sorry, I'm not being mean! Just saying.

To make matters interesting, in addition to Caton Avenue, there's also an entire part of Baltimore City know as Canton.  And there is a Canton Court in the Canton part of Baltimore, in addition to the crumbling (and not signed and due for replacement sometime soon) Canton Viaduct on I-895. 
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cpzilliacus

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Re: I-95 (JFK Highway) sign replacement project
« Reply #34 on: July 19, 2017, 09:53:51 PM »

MDTA has posted a invitation for bids (IFB) on the Maryland Marketplace site for the replacement of signs along I-95 (JFK Highway) from MD-24 (Exit 77) in the south to the "Newark Toll Plaza" (in Delaware) in the north including the intermediate interchanges up to and including MD-279 (Exit 109).

Quote
The work to be performed under this contract is located along I-95 John F. Kennedy Memorial Highway, I-95 On ramps and I-95 Off ramps from MD 24 to the Newark Toll Plaza in Harford and Cecil Counties. Signing along this section of I-95 will be upgraded and replaced to meet the latest requirements in the Maryland Manual of Uniform Traffic Devices (MdMUTCD) and the Authority’s current policies. The project will include replacing overhead sign structures and ground mounted signs, upgrading sign lighting, and adding w-beam traffic barrier in specific areas.

Annoyingly (to me), it seems that the control city for the northbound side appears to remain New York, with no mention of Wilmington and no mention of Philadelphia, which I think should be changed since the Pennsylvania Turnpike Commission's Bristol interchange project is supposed to be sufficiently completed to complete I-95 in 2018, meaning that a contiguous I-95 will serve Wilmington, Philadelphia and New York.

The proposed new signs on MD-279 at least have a TOLL banner for on the ramps leading to I-95 northbound (and the Delaware Turnpike barrier).   

All of the sign plans are in a (large) .pdf document that can be captured from Maryland Marketplace site.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2017, 10:48:26 PM by cpzilliacus »
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PHLBOS

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Re: I-95 (JFK Highway) sign replacement project
« Reply #35 on: July 20, 2017, 11:04:38 AM »

All of the sign plans are in a (large) .pdf document that can be captured from Maryland Marketplace site.
Given that the plans are dated March of 2017; one has to wonder whether or not the Clearview references & graphics for the signs shown in the plans & details will be replaced with Highway Gothic via addendum/change order or in the shop drawing process.
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cpzilliacus

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Re: I-95 (JFK Highway) sign replacement project
« Reply #36 on: July 20, 2017, 12:26:38 PM »

All of the sign plans are in a (large) .pdf document that can be captured from Maryland Marketplace site.
Given that the plans are dated March of 2017; one has to wonder whether or not the Clearview references & graphics for the signs shown in the plans & details will be replaced with Highway Gothic via addendum/change order or in the shop drawing process.

Good question. 

Given that this part of I-95 (JFK Highway in Maryland from Exit 67 (MD-43)  to Exit 109 (MD-279) and then the Delaware border) has never gotten one cent of funding from any federal program (administered by BPR or FHWA) ever, I  suppose they could probably get away with keeping Clearview if they really want to do that, though generally, MDTA adheres to MUTCD standards for everything in their system.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2017, 12:28:58 PM by cpzilliacus »
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PHLBOS

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Re: I-95 (JFK Highway) sign replacement project
« Reply #37 on: July 20, 2017, 01:22:40 PM »

Given that this part of I-95 (JFK Highway in Maryland from Exit 67 (MD-43)  to Exit 109 (MD-279) and then the Delaware border) has never gotten one cent of funding from any federal program (administered by BPR or FHWA) ever, I  suppose they could probably get away with keeping Clearview if they really want to do that, though generally, MDTA adheres to MUTCD standards for everything in their system.

From your earlier-posted Invitations For Bids link:
Quote from: Project Bulletin Description
Signing along this section of I-95 will be upgraded and replaced to meet the latest requirements in the Maryland Manual of Uniform Traffic Devices (MdMUTCD) and the Authority?s current policies. The project will include replacing overhead sign structures and ground mounted signs, upgrading sign lighting, and adding w-beam traffic barrier in specific areas.

I guess the question here is, does the latest version of MdMUTCD differ from the Federal MUTCD in terms of allowing usage of the Clearview font?

And while this stretch of I-95 is a tolled facility; the recent sign changes along both the Garden State Parkway & the New Jersey Turnpike to more MUTCD-style/compliant signage seems to indicate that toll facilities are being mandated to conform regardless of whether or not federal funding was received.
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cpzilliacus

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Re: I-95 (JFK Highway) sign replacement project
« Reply #38 on: July 20, 2017, 09:08:17 PM »

I guess the question here is, does the latest version of MdMUTCD differ from the Federal MUTCD in terms of allowing usage of the Clearview font?

The Maryland MUTCD makes no mention of fonts at all (I just checked), so presumably what applies at the  federal level also applies in Maryland.

And while this stretch of I-95 is a tolled facility; the recent sign changes along both the Garden State Parkway & the New Jersey Turnpike to more MUTCD-style/compliant signage seems to indicate that toll facilities are being mandated to conform regardless of whether or not federal funding was received.

In the past, MDTA has generally been pretty aggressive about compliance with the federal MUTCD (I  think of a few signs on their system that might not comply, but they are quite rare).  One that comes to mind on I-895 northbound will be gone pretty soon, since it is on the soon-to-be-replaced Canton Viaduct, the first sign informing motorists of Exit 10, Holabird Avenue.  This is a sign that has been copied from its predecessors several times (dating back to the 1960's, maybe earlier) and is of an especially elderly design. Curiously, the second sign is of a much more modern design.

My suggestion upthread that MDTA might not want to comply was speculative at best. 
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TheOneKEA

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Re: I-95 (JFK Highway) sign replacement project
« Reply #39 on: July 21, 2017, 09:36:55 PM »

A lot of the signage along I-95 in this segment is either new or sufficiently recently installed to appear new, so I'm curious as to why they are already scheduled for replacement.
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cpzilliacus

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Re: I-95 (JFK Highway) sign replacement project
« Reply #40 on: July 21, 2017, 10:14:18 PM »

A lot of the signage along I-95 in this segment is either new or sufficiently recently installed to appear new, so I'm curious as to why they are already scheduled for replacement.

MDTA seems to try  to replace all signs about every 10 years.
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