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[CoreySamson]

From the one time I've been to a Buc-ee's, I feel like it'd be a great place to stop on the occasional roadtrip, but be way too big of a pain in the ass to be your daily fill-up-and-buy-a-Coke station.

The smaller ones where I live surely are! There's one near me that has about 40-50 pumps which feels about the right size to me.

[Bobby5280]

The first Buc-ee's locations in the Houston area were pretty ordinary/normal in size. Then they just started getting bigger and bigger.

From the one time I've been to a Buc-ee's, I feel like it'd be a great place to stop on the occasional roadtrip, but be way too big of a pain in the ass to be your daily fill-up-and-buy-a-Coke station.

Yeah, the giant-sized Buc-ee's stores do not function the same way as a neighborhood 7-Eleven where you just drive down the street to pick up a six-pack of Bud Light or something. Driving onto a Buc-ee's property has the same feel as going to a large Walmart or even a shopping mall. I think the executives for Buc-ee's understand this and choose their locations carefully so they do work as ideal stops on a road trip. The typical giant Buc-ee's store tends to be near major highway junctions on the outskirts of a major city or at a key road trip point, like the one off I-10 in Alabama. That's the I-10 exit to go down to Gulf Shores.

It's probably a good thing I don't have an opportunity to visit a Buc-ee's store on a frequent basis. I would be gaining a lot of weight eating a bunch of their beef jerky!

I got a good laugh visiting the Buc-ee's web site recently.  On the home page they had a big announcement about the Warner Robbins, GA store being open. They used the tag line: "Potty Like a Rock Star!" They do have very clean (and big) restrooms.

[SoonerCowboy]

The first Buc-ee's locations in the Houston area were pretty ordinary/normal in size. Then they just started getting bigger and bigger.

From the one time I've been to a Buc-ee's, I feel like it'd be a great place to stop on the occasional roadtrip, but be way too big of a pain in the ass to be your daily fill-up-and-buy-a-Coke station.

Yeah, the giant-sized Buc-ee's stores do not function the same way as a neighborhood 7-Eleven where you just drive down the street to pick up a six-pack of Bud Light or something. Driving onto a Buc-ee's property has the same feel as going to a large Walmart or even a shopping mall. I think the executives for Buc-ee's understand this and choose their locations carefully so they do work as ideal stops on a road trip. The typical giant Buc-ee's store tends to be near major highway junctions on the outskirts of a major city or at a key road trip point, like the one off I-10 in Alabama. That's the I-10 exit to go down to Gulf Shores.

It's probably a good thing I don't have an opportunity to visit a Buc-ee's store on a frequent basis. I would be gaining a lot of weight eating a bunch of their beef jerky!

I got a good laugh visiting the Buc-ee's web site recently.  On the home page they had a big announcement about the Warner Robbins, GA store being open. They used the tag line: "Potty Like a Rock Star!" They do have very clean (and big) restrooms.

I agree Bobby. Locally (OKC area), when filling up, I rarely go inside a convenience store, just fill up at the pump, and go. Different story when traveling though. Buc-ees' is a great stop for restroom, fuel and beef jerky LOL.

[Plutonic Panda]

I was browsing around the new OkDOT website and found this schematic of the proposed SH-9/I-35 south interchange:



https://oklahoma.gov/odot/progress-and-performance/federal-grant-awards/build-grants/mcclain-county-i-35-and-sh-9w-interchange.html

This project is now at stake as governor Stitt has formally opposed it. Many critics are not happy with tax payer monies being used to fund this project even though the tribes are forking over 10 million towards it. I imagine other improvements are to be had as well though I’m not sure how much those cost as they are likely just reconstruction of existing pavement, possible new bridge, and acceleration lanes but I am not sure what all is proposed in that regard.

I will say I do like the proposed flyover and roundabout but I am not happy with the interchange design overall. Highway 9 needs to become a full freeway loop connecting to I-44 and eventually somehow tying in with SH-152 to connect at the SW Kilpatrick extension and airport freeway. While we’re at it remove the fucking tolls on the existing roads!! I really despise the direction Oklahoma is moving to tolling all new freeways.

But no matter how far any of that is into the future it should all start with this interchange being a fully directional interchange. Here are some articles on the current situation:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.oklahoman.com/amp/4925446001

https://kfor.com/news/local/proposed-i-35-hwy-9-flyover-ramp-causes-rifts-between-odot-governor-and-chickasaw-nation/amp/

[Plutonic Panda]

On another side note and honestly a fantasy wish here, SH-9 should be extended over I-35 and a new Canadian River crossing be made NE of Goldsby to directly tie into SH-9 East. At the very least preserve right of way for it in the future when funds can be found to fully upgraded SH-9 East to a freeway through Norman.

[Scott5114]

On another side note and honestly a fantasy wish here, SH-9 should be extended over I-35 and a new Canadian River crossing be made NE of Goldsby to directly tie into SH-9 East. At the very least preserve right of way for it in the future when funds can be found to fully upgraded SH-9 East to a freeway through Norman.

My fantasy wish was actually the opposite, to extend the SH-9 expressway west of I-35 on the Cleveland County shore, then cross in such a place that it could cut SW and tie into existing SH-9 west around Santa Fe, thus bypassing Riverwind entirely. But Norman is building a riverside park in that area, so that's likely not a realistic idea anymore.

The old SH-9/SH-74 crossing, before I-35, connected Jesse Drive in Goldsby with 24th Avenue SW in Norman. Some of the piers are still there–Alps has photos. It would be nice to have a bridge here again simply as a backup to the I-35 bridge in case it gets blocked by an incident–the next nearest bridges are miles away in either direction.

[In_Correct]

I like the Tolls.

[Revive 755]

I will say I do like the proposed flyover and roundabout but I am not happy with the interchange design overall. Highway 9 needs to become a full freeway loop connecting to I-44 and eventually somehow tying in with SH-152 to connect at the SW Kilpatrick extension and airport freeway.

Looks like there had been a plan for a somewhat similar corridor that made it to the EIS stage in the mid 1970's:  https://hdl.handle.net/2027/ien.35556030801120

[Plutonic Panda]

I will say I do like the proposed flyover and roundabout but I am not happy with the interchange design overall. Highway 9 needs to become a full freeway loop connecting to I-44 and eventually somehow tying in with SH-152 to connect at the SW Kilpatrick extension and airport freeway.

Looks like there had been a plan for a somewhat similar corridor that made it to the EIS stage in the mid 1970's:  https://hdl.handle.net/2027/ien.35556030801120

Wow it looks like I-44 had not even been completed past I-40 at that point. It looks they can still do most of that if they secure ROW at least quick enough.

[rte66man]

I will say I do like the proposed flyover and roundabout but I am not happy with the interchange design overall. Highway 9 needs to become a full freeway loop connecting to I-44 and eventually somehow tying in with SH-152 to connect at the SW Kilpatrick extension and airport freeway.

Looks like there had been a plan for a somewhat similar corridor that made it to the EIS stage in the mid 1970's:  https://hdl.handle.net/2027/ien.35556030801120

Wow it looks like I-44 had not even been completed past I-40 at that point. It looks they can still do most of that if they secure ROW at least quick enough.

For 10+ years, what was US62 (didn't become I-44 until the 80's) took a hard 100 degree turn just north of SW 74th.  That part was built to act as a connector to the H.E. Bailey turnpike when it was opened in 1964. For a couple of years years, US62 narrowed to 2 lanes from 74th south to the South Canadian River. The other lanes were graded, but I'm assuming ODOT didn't have the funds to pave immediately. What was I-440 wasn't completed north until the mid 70's.

[Plutonic Panda]

Douglas BLVD/ I-40 interchange meeting was today.

https://www.ok.gov/odot/Programs_and_Projects/Public_Meetings_and_Hearings/20170117.html

Three alternatives

Alternative 1 - Single Point Urban Interchange (SPUI) -- A Single Point Urban Interchange is a basic diamond interchange with a single signalized central intersection in the center of the bridge. The Douglas Boulevard traffic along with the I-40 ramp traffic will converge to a single point utilizing the single set of traffic signals. The SPUI interchange accommodates large traffic volumes efficiently with minimal right-of-way impacts. I-40 will be improved to a six-lane facility. Through the interchange, Douglas Boulevard will consist of six through lanes, dual left-turn lanes, and right-turn lanes where needed. Entrance and exit ramp lanes will also be constructed along I-40. Collector-distributor roads will be removed and will not be re-constructed. See attached graphic of SPUI.

Alternative 2 - Tight Urban Diamond Interchange (TUDI) with Ramp Flyover — A Tight Urban Diamond Interchange is an interchange that compresses a standard diamond interchange. This design includes all four interchange ramps, as well as the option of adding a future flyover ramp for northbound Douglas Boulevard traffic destined for westbound I-40. The compressed interchange with the ramp flyover accommodates large traffic volumes efficiently by removing a heavy left turn movement from the interchange and the resulting footprint requires minimal right-of-way. I-40 will be improved to a six-lanes facility. Through the interchange, Douglas Boulevard will consist of six through lanes, dual left-turn lanes, and right-turn lanes where needed. Upon construction of the northbound to westbound ramp flyover, the northbound to westbound left-turn lanes on Douglas will be removed. Entrance and exit ramp lanes will also be constructed along I-40. Collector-distributor roads will be removed and will not be re-constructed. See attached graphic of TUDI.

Alternative 3 - Cloverleaf Interchange — The existing cloverleaf will be completely reconstructed to accommodate widening I-40 to a six-lane facility. All ramps and both collector-distributor roads will be reconstructed. Through the interchange, Douglas Boulevard will consist of four through lanes, two lanes for loop ramp weaving, two additional lanes located in the median which can be used in the future for left turning traffic, and entrance and exit lanes where needed. Entrance and exit ramp lanes will also be constructed along I-40. See attached graphic of the new cloverleaf.

Personally I prefer option 2 because I'm a fan of flyovers and it takes less space than a cloverleaf and hate cloverleafs in general.

Alternative 1 has been selected as the preferred alternative.

https://www.ok.gov/odot/Programs_and_Projects/Public_Meetings_and_Hearings/20170117.html

This project has received 50 million in federal funding.

I-40 Highway Reconstruction and Widening

The $50 million grant to the Oklahoma Department of Transportation will be used for a lane addition and interchange improvement project on I-40 and the Douglas Boulevard Interchange. These upgrades will improve safety and efficiency for more than 50,000 vehicles per day, of which 15 percent are commercial trucks. These crucial grant funds will help advance this critical project’s timetable by five years.

On March 15, 2021, Cole joined a delegation letter, led by Inhofe, to the U.S. Department of Transportation in support of this funding for the I-40 highway reconstruction and widening project.

https://cole.house.gov/media-center/press-releases/oklahoma-awarded-100-million-in-competitive-highway-grants

[Bobby5280]

Meanwhile it looks like Tom Cole forgot the Lawton-Fort Sill area even exists. For years now there has been a project on the books to add a pedestrian bridge to one of the two Gore Blvd bridges over I-44 in Lawton. Yeah, no, that can appears to be kicked down the road to whoever knows when. Maybe if enough people jay-walking I-44 get splattered by traffic it might inspire a change.

On the way to work this morning I saw one older lady walking along the median of I-44 going North of Gore Blvd. She was holding up one of her arms as if hailing a cab and appeared to be talking to herself. South of the Gore Blvd crossing I saw a fellow walking along the EB Gore on ramp to WB (SB really) I-44.

[Plutonic Panda]

I feel bad for Lawton. In regards to Oklahoma, it’s not a city that is insignificant either for the state. It should get more than it gets. The fucking traffic signals in some parts of the city look like they are from the 70s. Lawton needs a freeway loop around it.

My hope is this, medicine park is a really cool low key area that hasn’t really been discovered yet. I suspect as OKC, WF, and Tulsa grow the demand to get out of these big cities to small towns for some R&R will only grow. MP has potential to become a pretty popular town one day if they make the right moves. Maybe this will draw more interest to Lawton.

The army could decide to further invest in Fort Sill. Perhaps a private company takes it upon itself to build a large manufacturing plant. I wish Stitt would promote SW OK more.

[US 89]

Meanwhile it looks like Tom Cole forgot the Lawton-Fort Sill area even exists.

I hate to break it to you, but he’s definitely not the only one. And it’s a shame considering the economic and strategic value of Fort Sill.

[Scott5114]

Tom Cole forgets every urban area exists.

[Bobby5280]

I feel bad for Lawton. In regards to Oklahoma, it’s not a city that is insignificant either for the state. It should get more than it gets. The fucking traffic signals in some parts of the city look like they are from the 70s. Lawton needs a freeway loop around it.

There is a lot of things that look dated in Lawton. Regarding freeways, Rogers Lane (which runs between Fort Sill and Lawton) badly needs to be upgraded. It's a fake freeway that's little more than a glorified street. I don't even know how it can carry the US-62 designation since it doesn't even have any shoulders. On top of that the portion of I-44 that runs through Fort Sill needs to be improved. The stretch running past Key Gate looks like a throwback to the 1960's.

Lawton does need a Southern bypass, mainly to connect the big industrial district to I-44. There is an enormous Goodyear tire plant out there along with several other industrial facilities. 82nd Street is one outlet used to go South out of town to avoid Lawton traffic and connect with I-44 via OK-36. 82nd Street is just beat to hell. The road's deteriorating condition is wreaking havoc on trucks. Goodyear has complained about it. The only thing that appears to be happening is just one patch job on the street after another.

My hope is this, medicine park is a really cool low key area that hasn’t really been discovered yet. I suspect as OKC, WF, and Tulsa grow the demand to get out of these big cities to small towns for some R&R will only grow. MP has potential to become a pretty popular town one day if they make the right moves. Maybe this will draw more interest to Lawton.

Lawton has a lot of potential for tourism and other industries. But much of it is going unrealized. There is a lot of activity in Medicine Park though. It does appear more people from OKC, Tulsa and elsewhere have "discovered" it. They're visiting in greater numbers. There is a lot of selling and buying of properties out there lately. The downside is little is being done to improve infrastructure out there. The narrow streets can handle only so much traffic. I could have went out there this past weekend for 4th of July festivities, but I chose to keep my sanity instead.

[rte66man]

I feel bad for Lawton. In regards to Oklahoma, it’s not a city that is insignificant either for the state. It should get more than it gets. The fucking traffic signals in some parts of the city look like they are from the 70s. Lawton needs a freeway loop around it.

There are a lot of things that look dated in Lawton. Regarding freeways, Rogers Lane (which runs between Fort Sill and Lawton) badly needs to be upgraded. It's a fake freeway that's little more than a glorified street. I don't even know how it can carry the US-62 designation since it doesn't even have any shoulders. On top of that the portion of I-44 that runs through Fort Sill needs to be improved. The stretch running past Key Gate looks like a throwback to the 1960's.

Lawton does need a Southern bypass, mainly to connect the big industrial district to I-44. There is an enormous Goodyear tire plant out there along with several other industrial facilities. 82nd Street is one outlet used to go South out of town to avoid Lawton traffic and connect with I-44 via OK-36. 82nd Street is just beat to hell. The road's deteriorating condition is wreaking havoc on trucks. Goodyear has complained about it. The only thing that appears to be happening is just one patch job on the street after another.

Knew you would bring that up

I've often wondered whether the Army is the reason 44 didn't get improved after the original road was built in 1964. The railroads prevent effective widening to the east. Maybe the Army didn't want to give up any of the base?

[SoonerCowboy]

I feel bad for Lawton. In regards to Oklahoma, it’s not a city that is insignificant either for the state. It should get more than it gets. The fucking traffic signals in some parts of the city look like they are from the 70s. Lawton needs a freeway loop around it.

My hope is this, medicine park is a really cool low key area that hasn’t really been discovered yet. I suspect as OKC, WF, and Tulsa grow the demand to get out of these big cities to small towns for some R&R will only grow. MP has potential to become a pretty popular town one day if they make the right moves. Maybe this will draw more interest to Lawton.

The army could decide to further invest in Fort Sill. Perhaps a private company takes it upon itself to build a large manufacturing plant. I wish Stitt would promote SW OK more.

I agree the Medicine Park area has some real growth and tourism potential, along with the nearby Wichita Mountains Wildlife refuge. A big problem with the MP area is a friend of mine, has a band that has performed twice there, and they were telling me that all the restaurants and bars close super early, like even before the concerts were over. I do not know if it is covid related or not, but does seem like they are missing out on major business opportunities.

[Bobby5280]

I've often wondered whether the Army is the reason 44 didn't get improved after the original road was built in 1964. The railroads prevent effective widening to the east. Maybe the Army didn't want to give up any of the base?

I doubt if the Army is an issue. Several other major military installations have very good super highway access. In Georgia I-185 effectively continues as a freeway for miles into Fort Benning. I-781 in Upstate New York was built as a connector for Fort Drum. Watertown nearby doesn't have any freeway loop or spur. Fort Bliss in the El Paso area is surrounded by Loop-375 and US-54 and is divided by the Spur 601 freeway. Fort Hood was part of the pitch to get the US-190 freeway in Killeen re-signed as I-14. The long term pitch for that route is connecting other military installations in the Deep South. To me it appear the military kind of likes super highway access to its installations.

In Lawton, I think the recent work they did to improve the Rogers Lane exit at I-44 was done partly to benefit the Army. The entrance to Fort Sill Gate 2 was re-configured in that project.

It would not be difficult to widen I-44 through the Key Gate area in Fort Sill. The old Rock Island rail line that came up into Lawton from Walters was decommissioned years ago. That rail line is what runs nearest to I-44 by Key Gate. The active BNSF line is adjacent to it about 40-50 yards to the East. If ODOT could get the old rail line ROW they would have more than enough room to add proper width shoulders or even additional lanes to I-44 there.

Of course there's plenty of room to expand Rogers Lane as well. The old "Artillery Village" housing area on the other side of the Rogers Lane sound wall was demolished 15 years ago. It's just unused, vacant land now.

I agree the Medicine Park area has some real growth and tourism potential, along with the nearby Wichita Mountains Wildlife refuge. A big problem with the MP area is a friend of mine, has a band that has performed twice there, and they were telling me that all the restaurants and bars close super early, like even before the concerts were over. I do not know if it is covid related or not, but does seem like they are missing out on major business opportunities.

Perhaps shorter hours could be a COVID-19 thing. I know the Park Tavern stays open til 2:00am on weekends and midnight during the week. Restaurant hours can vary. The Old Plantation stays open til 9:00pm. My thinking is if Medicine Park continues to gain popularity and new places to eat or socialize open the various night spots out there will stay open longer. Just be careful about the police out there. They'll pull you over if you're speeding just a little bit.

[Rothman]

I-781 was built because the Army was threating to shut down Fort Drum if it wasn't (BRAC).

[Bobby5280]

I wish the Army would apply some leverage like that down here. The need for upgrades is quite a bit more legit, IMHO.

[rte66man]

I've often wondered whether the Army is the reason 44 didn't get improved after the original road was built in 1964. The railroads prevent effective widening to the east. Maybe the Army didn't want to give up any of the base?

It would not be difficult to widen I-44 through the Key Gate area in Fort Sill. The old Rock Island rail line that came up into Lawton from Walters was decommissioned years ago. That rail line is what runs nearest to I-44 by Key Gate. The active BNSF line is adjacent to it about 40-50 yards to the East. If ODOT could get the old rail line ROW they would have more than enough room to add proper width shoulders or even additional lanes to I-44 there.

I had missed the diversion of the UP line to the BNSF tracks just north of the Main exit to the fort

[bugo]

For 10+ years, what was US62 (didn't become I-44 until the 80's) took a hard 100 degree turn just north of SW 74th.  That part was built to act as a connector to the H.E. Bailey turnpike when it was opened in 1964. For a couple of years years, US62 narrowed to 2 lanes from 74th south to the South Canadian River. The other lanes were graded, but I'm assuming ODOT didn't have the funds to pave immediately. What was I-440 wasn't completed north until the mid 70's.

Here is a link to an aerial of this curve in 1969.

https://www.historicaerials.com/location/35.393701060303385/-97.5719383238522/1969/16

[Plutonic Panda]

It looks like ODOT is planning a grade separation for SH-4 at Fox Lane:

https://sh4atfoxlane.publicmeetinghub.com/alternatives-considered

ODOT would be wise to buy ROW at SH-37 for a grade separation.

[bugo]

Is there still a 4 way stop at OK 3/OK 4? There was in 2007.