Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[longhorn]

Except for some work around Salado and Temple to Bruceville Eddy area, I-35 expansion is complete, and man what a difference. Better sight lines, and lesser elevation changes along with a much needed third lane (smart making all the overpasses ready for a fourth lane) makes the drive much less stressful.

I do not know if Waco is on the docket for a full rebuild with a fourth lane added in each direction as Temple is getting now. And it will be an engineering marvel to see how they replace the Adams street interchange AND keep it open at the same time. Who knew road engineering had increased so from the 1950s.

[Bobby5280]

Some parts of I-35 on the North and South ends of Waco were upgraded from 2 lanes each direction to 3 just a few years ago. It would be a tight squeeze to fit in a 4th lane in each direction through the central part of Waco. Adding another lane while keeping existing frontage roads in place would result in some very short off ramps. Some bridges would have to be greatly modified or rebuilt. So much of this I-35 upgrade between Austin and the I-35E/I-35W split seems like a totally brand new highway.

I agree, the upgraded freeway is pretty nice. But it also makes me feel like I'm not really out of "the city" during a drive between the Dallas area and Austin.

[Scott5114]

Imagine how you'd feel on the British motorway network...minimum standards require 3 lanes!

[compdude787]

Three lanes is best for inter-city freeways that connect two large metro areas that are within 200 miles of each other and have lots of smaller towns along their route. That's definitely the case with I-5 between Seattle and Portland, which is mostly three lanes in each direction in most of its length and it certainly does feel rural to me. I typically imagine an urban freeway being anything more than three lanes in each direction. For that reason, I-90 between Issaquah and Snoqualmie Pass has always seemed a bit weird to me being four lanes in some of the uphill stretches. I'm used to seeing freeways be that wide in more urban areas.

[Chris]

Better sight lines, and lesser elevation changes along with a much needed third lane

Similar to I-35 between Waco and Hillsboro?

These photos were taken in 2015 shortly after completion of that stretch.

[wxfree]

Better sight lines, and lesser elevation changes along with a much needed third lane

Similar to I-35 between Waco and Hillsboro?

These photos were taken in 2015 shortly after completion of that stretch.
-photos removed-

The two areas are of similar design, and designed to high standards.  The photos severely exaggerate or completely make up the undulations due to the zooming effects.  Notice that the exit to Abbott is a mile away from the first sign, and then the next sign is for the exit.  There's a lot of distance in that photo.  The hill is noticeable, but you barely feel it at 75.  There's almost no curve at all before the hill.  Here's an aerial view of it.  https://goo.gl/maps/auGRJ38jbis  (The wild curve in the photo is the almost non-existent curve just north of the bridge near the bottom.)

Here's where it was discussed before.  http://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=17052.0  I said there "I've driven the entire stretch of new road both ways and never thought anything about the design except for how smooth it is."

[Marc]

As of a few weeks ago, Salado is done. So really, the only two-lane stretch left is Temple to Bruceville-Eddy, but there's A LOT of work to be done there. My wife and I live in Round Rock and my folks live southwest of Waco. The Temple to Bruceville-Eddy stretch can easily take an 1hr 10min drive into a 2hr drive. Because of this, I use SH 317 to FM 2113 the vast majority of the time.

[longhorn]

Kudos to the construction team or teams that handled this major project. The speed at which it was done is pretty impressive. The most impressive feat is smoothing out of the elevations.

I agree Temple is a mess and will be for about a year. I wander if I35 between Belton and Temple be rebuilt using concrete since its Asphalt now but already three lanes wide in each direction.

On a side note, 190 (I-14) from I35 to Killeen is planned to be expanded to three lanes in each direction too.

[Marc]

I wander if I-35 between Belton and Temple be rebuilt using concrete since its Asphalt now but already three lanes wide in each direction.

I doubt it as they have recently applied a new layer of asphalt through the 190 interchange. The old asphalt and concrete sections through north Waco and Bellmead remained in place, so I wouldn't see why the Belton to Temple section would be redone.

[Tom958]

I was just messing around on Streetview and found this fascinating item in Troy: as of November 2016, it appears that the southbound roadway is to be elevated on a new viaduct while the northbound remains below grade on the legacy roadway. I'm curious about it, but not enough to try to find the answer on TxDOT's website. So, anybody here know what's supposed to happen there?

[Anthony_JK]

I was just messing around on Streetview and found this fascinating item in Troy: as of November 2016, it appears that the southbound roadway is to be elevated on a new viaduct while the northbound remains below grade on the legacy roadway. I'm curious about it, but not enough to try to find the answer on TxDOT's website. So, anybody here know what's supposed to happen there?

It may be that they are building the southbound viaduct first, then it will serve as a temporary 2x2 facility while they reconstruct the northbound roadway as a similar viaduct over Main Street. Standard procedure with converting underpasses to overpasses in Texas, I figure.

[Tom958]

It may be that they are building the southbound viaduct first, then it will serve as a temporary 2x2 facility while they reconstruct the northbound roadway as a similar viaduct over Main Street. Standard procedure with converting underpasses to overpasses in Texas, I figure.

Could be, but it seems like a stretch to either fill in or bridge over such a deep depression. OTOH, the side of the retained fill looks very temporary.

[Brian556]

Quote from Tom958:

I was just messing around on Streetview and found this fascinating item in Troy: as of November 2016, it appears that the southbound roadway is to be elevated on a new viaduct while the northbound remains below grade on the legacy roadway. I'm curious about it, but not enough to try to find the answer on TxDOT's website. So, anybody here know what's supposed to happen there?

That's like I-35 @ Cesar Chavez in Austin:
https://www.google.com/maps/@30.2621406,-97.7361673,3a,75y,202.91h,90.6t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1s0UOlHqwDqYG69YgrmO-XHg!2e0!6s%2F%2Fgeo3.ggpht.com%2Fcbk%3Fpanoid%3D0UOlHqwDqYG69YgrmO-XHg%26output%3Dthumbnail%26cb_client%3Dmaps_sv.tactile.gps%26thumb%3D2%26w%3D203%26h%3D100%26yaw%3D3.5865347%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i13312!8i6656

[Henry]

All I can say is, holy shit!

[longhorn]

I was just messing around on Streetview and found this fascinating item in Troy: as of November 2016, it appears that the southbound roadway is to be elevated on a new viaduct while the northbound remains below grade on the legacy roadway. I'm curious about it, but not enough to try to find the answer on TxDOT's website. So, anybody here know what's supposed to happen there?

http://ftp.dot.state.tx.us/pub/txdot-info/my35/wac/fliers/3a1.pdf

Once the new bridge is complete, I -35 will move to it, and the "trench" will be filled in and the north bound bridge built in its place. Its the method that's been many times in the reconstruction of I-35. That trench in Troy floods everytime there is a heavy rain storm, and causes backups. I will be glad when its finally gone, talk about a relic from the 60s.

[longhorn]

https://www.google.com/maps/@31.1017006,-97.3599235,3a,75y,336.86h,81.31t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sG047Ywfkp6_6gfP8ZUUJgg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

I saw this weekend in Temple at the Adams interchange rebuild, the southbound lanes have been moved the new concrete surface.

https://www.google.com/maps/@31.0957661,-97.3697891,3a,75y,261.8h,64.24t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s4KYimv9NraSqrqapmcV0Aw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

This viaduct in Temple will be sunken beneath grade, how TxDot does that and keep I-35 flowing will be interesting.

[longhorn]

Three lanes is best for inter-city freeways that connect two large metro areas that are within 200 miles of each other and have lots of smaller towns along their route. That's definitely the case with I-5 between Seattle and Portland, which is mostly three lanes in each direction in most of its length and it certainly does feel rural to me. I typically imagine an urban freeway being anything more than three lanes in each direction. For that reason, I-90 between Issaquah and Snoqualmie Pass has always seemed a bit weird to me being four lanes in some of the uphill stretches. I'm used to seeing freeways be that wide in more urban areas.

Why would it be four lanes wide, truck climbing lanes?

[compdude787]

Three lanes is best for inter-city freeways that connect two large metro areas that are within 200 miles of each other and have lots of smaller towns along their route. That's definitely the case with I-5 between Seattle and Portland, which is mostly three lanes in each direction in most of its length and it certainly does feel rural to me. I typically imagine an urban freeway being anything more than three lanes in each direction. For that reason, I-90 between Issaquah and Snoqualmie Pass has always seemed a bit weird to me being four lanes in some of the uphill stretches. I'm used to seeing freeways be that wide in more urban areas.

Why would it be four lanes wide, truck climbing lanes?

Yes, the four lane sections of I-90 are indeed truck climbing lanes.

[Tom958]

That's like I-35 @ Cesar Chavez in Austin:

Indeed it is. That's part of where my guess came from.

http://ftp.dot.state.tx.us/pub/txdot-info/my35/wac/fliers/3a1.pdf

Once the new bridge is complete, I -35 will move to it, and the "trench" will be filled in and the north bound bridge built in its place. It's the method that's been many times in the reconstruction of I-35. That trench in Troy floods every time there is a heavy rain storm, and causes backups. I will be glad when its finally gone, talk about a relic from the 60s.

Thanks for the link!

Actually, according to http://uglybridges.com/1529501, it was completed in 1957. It's fair to say that this highway dates from the pre-Interstate era, with some bridges dating from 1954 and some culverts earlier than that.

I had the pleasure of driving from Atlanta to Austin by way of Tyler and Waco last summer, and while my impression of Texas highways had been one of modern megastructures, I was pleasantly amazed by the more modest and seemingly meticulously engineered structures of the past. In most states, the highway agency decides on a few certain ways of doing things and implements them cookie-cutter style all over the place, but Texas displayed a lot of diversity. I hope someone's photographing the old stuff before it's gone, even the crappy hole that floods in Troy.

[dfwmapper]

TxDOT is more than capable of cookie-cutter designs. Just look at the stacks at I-20@US 67, I-20@I-35E, I-20@I-45, I-20@US 175, I-635@US 80, and I-635@I-30, which are all damn near the same design (check street view on the bottom level and notice the giant center column that supports all 4 left-turn ramps).

[compdude787]

TxDOT is more than capable of cookie-cutter designs. Just look at the stacks at I-20@US 67, I-20@I-35E, I-20@I-45, I-20@US 175, I-635@US 80, and I-635@I-30, which are all damn near the same design (check street view on the bottom level and notice the giant center column that supports all 4 left-turn ramps).

Even though they all use the same design, those stack interchanges are pretty unique compared to most other stack interchanges, as the right-turning ramps are really close to the center of the interchange and are completely inside the left-turning ramps, whereas most stack interchanges place the right-turning ramps outside the left-turning ramps and further away from the center of the interchange.

[J N Winkler]

TxDOT is more than capable of cookie-cutter designs. Just look at the stacks at I-20@US 67, I-20@I-35E, I-20@I-45, I-20@US 175, I-635@US 80, and I-635@I-30, which are all damn near the same design (check street view on the bottom level and notice the giant center column that supports all 4 left-turn ramps).

In road enthusiast circles those have traditionally been called the "cookie-cutter stacks," but I think I have also seen them called the "pylon stacks" because of the center columns (which are explicitly labelled as "pylons" in the construction plans I have seen, notably for I-20/US 67).

[Bobby5280]

TxDOT is more than capable of cookie-cutter designs. Just look at the stacks at I-20@US 67, I-20@I-35E, I-20@I-45, I-20@US 175, I-635@US 80, and I-635@I-30, which are all damn near the same design (check street view on the bottom level and notice the giant center column that supports all 4 left-turn ramps).

All of those interchanges along the South side of Dallas are pretty old, built at a time when most freeway to freeway interchanges elsewhere in the country were ordinary cloverleaf interchanges. Across the rest of the world direct connect flyover stack interchanges are still very rare. I think TX DOT didn't start making bridge columns decorative until the late 1990's. The stack interchanges at TX-190/PGBT & I-35E and TX-190/PGBT & US-75 have fairly generic bridge structures and those were built in the 1990's. They just started using slightly less drab color schemes.

[Brian556]

Quote from compdude787:

Even though they all use the same design, those stack interchanges are pretty unique compared to most other stack interchanges, as the right-turning ramps are really close to the center of the interchange and are completely inside the left-turning ramps, whereas most stack interchanges place the right-turning ramps outside the left-turning ramps and further away from the center of the interchange.

I've always dislike this because it feels counterintuitive

[jlwm]

TxDOT is more than capable of cookie-cutter designs. Just look at the stacks at I-20@US 67, I-20@I-35E, I-20@I-45, I-20@US 175, I-635@US 80, and I-635@I-30, which are all damn near the same design (check street view on the bottom level and notice the giant center column that supports all 4 left-turn ramps).

Even though they all use the same design, those stack interchanges are pretty unique compared to most other stack interchanges, as the right-turning ramps are really close to the center of the interchange and are completely inside the left-turning ramps, whereas most stack interchanges place the right-turning ramps outside the left-turning ramps and further away from the center of the interchange.

That must have been the preferred design of the day from TxDOT. The four level stack US59 Eastex and I-610 interchange in Houston used to be like that until a few ramps were reconstructed in the mid 90s. The current I-610 EB to SH 288SB ramp is like that. Both four level stack interchanges were built around the same period, the US59 Eastex/I-610 interchange was completed in 1979 and the SH288/I-610 interchange in 1980. They were built a bit later than the ones in Dallas, but they were probably inspired by the Dallas cookie-cutter stacks.