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Author Topic: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?  (Read 4993 times)

roadman65

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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #25 on: June 15, 2017, 04:57:37 PM »

I believe at one point, Interstate 465 and 69, US 31, 36, 40, 52, and 421, and IN 37 and 67 are all concurrent. If only concurrencies were signed on I-465...
Indiana would be bankrupt.

Hey if Colorado and New Mexico can have US routes on interstates and not be signed why can't Indiana?  :bigass:

The same with US 67 and US 90 in TX, as the rest of the state seems to have no issue signing them (US 87 gets signed on I-27 and on I-10 for example) and Arkansas is another with US routes on interstates.  US 64 through Fayetteville was not signed at all when I drove it last year.

At least some ramps tell you what exit to use to continue on the beltway for whatever route your on as the last time I was there in 08 US 31 S Bound was told to follow I-435 East to Exit x.
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Sheryl Crowe

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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #26 on: June 15, 2017, 05:17:55 PM »

Hey if Colorado and New Mexico can have US routes on interstates and not be signed why can't Indiana?  :bigass:

Or Utah. Good luck following US-89 through it's I-15 concurrencies, or the US 189/I-80 concurrency, which isn't signed at all (see my signature).
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csw

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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #27 on: June 15, 2017, 05:40:57 PM »

At least some ramps tell you what exit to use to continue on the beltway for whatever route your on as the last time I was there in 08 US 31 S Bound was told to follow I-435 East to Exit x.
As far as I know, these are signed on all the US Routes that intersect I-465 (31, 36, 40, 52, 421). Here's US 40's on the west side:

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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #28 on: June 15, 2017, 07:05:34 PM »

I believe at one point, Interstate 465 and 69, US 31, 36, 40, 52, and 421, and IN 37 and 67 are all concurrent. If only concurrencies were signed on I-465...
Indiana would be bankrupt.

Hey if Colorado and New Mexico can have US routes on interstates and not be signed why can't Indiana?  :bigass:

The same with US 67 and US 90 in TX, as the rest of the state seems to have no issue signing them (US 87 gets signed on I-27 and on I-10 for example) and Arkansas is another with US routes on interstates.  US 64 through Fayetteville was not signed at all when I drove it last year.

At least some ramps tell you what exit to use to continue on the beltway for whatever route your on as the last time I was there in 08 US 31 S Bound was told to follow I-435 East to Exit x.
As far as I know the US routes on the beltway are not signed.
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roadman65

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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #29 on: June 15, 2017, 07:11:49 PM »

I wish our nation's capital would just let MD and VA sign US 1, US 29, and US 50 on I-495.  Extend VA 110 to cover US 1 through Arlington and Alexandria.  I am sure that VA could come up with useful numbers for US 50 and 29 along the inside of the Beltway.  US 50 along the John Hanson Highway could be MD 595 and a nice three digit could suffice US 1 in College Park and Hyattsville.

DC from what I have seen or heard does not shield the US routes anymore and removed some without even replacing them as well.  No one uses the numbers as in DC its all New York Avenue, Rhode Island Avenue, and Constitution Avenue etc.
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Sheryl Crowe

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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #30 on: June 16, 2017, 09:13:10 AM »

Are there any maps that show I-69's original proposed route through downtown? I believe they would have the downtown loop as well.
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silverback1065

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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #31 on: June 16, 2017, 11:11:48 AM »

All of the highways the us 465 are signed at the ramps to tell you which exit to get off on to continue the route, except US 36/SR 67 pendelton pike, they never replaced those when they redid the interchange a few years ago.
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silverback1065

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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #32 on: June 16, 2017, 11:13:03 AM »

Are there any maps that show I-69's original proposed route through downtown? I believe they would have the downtown loop as well.

I'll try to post it, but basically 69 was supposed to shoot straight north from the north split, the western part of the loop never got very far off the ground, so i dont think there are maps of that.
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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #33 on: June 17, 2017, 08:24:13 PM »

I believe at one point, Interstate 465 and 69, US 31, 36, 40, 52, and 421, and IN 37 and 67 are all concurrent. If only concurrencies were signed on I-465...
Indiana would be bankrupt.

Hey if Colorado and New Mexico can have US routes on interstates and not be signed why can't Indiana?  :bigass:

The same with US 67 and US 90 in TX, as the rest of the state seems to have no issue signing them (US 87 gets signed on I-27 and on I-10 for example) and Arkansas is another with US routes on interstates.  US 64 through Fayetteville was not signed at all when I drove it last year.

At least some ramps tell you what exit to use to continue on the beltway for whatever route your on as the last time I was there in 08 US 31 S Bound was told to follow I-435 East to Exit x.
I guess there is really no point in signing them.
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Mapmikey

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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #34 on: June 17, 2017, 09:01:57 PM »

I wish our nation's capital would just let MD and VA sign US 1, US 29, and US 50 on I-495.  Extend VA 110 to cover US 1 through Arlington and Alexandria.  I am sure that VA could come up with useful numbers for US 50 and 29 along the inside of the Beltway.  US 50 along the John Hanson Highway could be MD 595 and a nice three digit could suffice US 1 in College Park and Hyattsville.

DC from what I have seen or heard does not shield the US routes anymore and removed some without even replacing them as well.  No one uses the numbers as in DC its all New York Avenue, Rhode Island Avenue, and Constitution Avenue etc.

The US routes used to be well-signed in DC as recently as 15 years ago and quasi-signed at the beginning of this decade.  Poking around GMSV it is nearly non-existent now, as you have said.  All of these routes have turns, so that is worthless.

If US 1 were still signed I would say just keep it in DC because it is not a through route on either side of DC for a considerable distance, but moving US 29 and US 50 onto the beltway would certainly make sense.  On the Virginia side, US 50 should also be put on I-66 because Arlington Blvd has a truck restriction.
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Revive 755

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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #36 on: June 17, 2017, 10:53:50 PM »

I thought someone had posted, somewhere in the last 10-12 years, the original proposal(s) of the freeways in Indy (an innerbelt, ala Columbus to the east). I'm not sure if it was here, or back on MTR. Maybe it was Stephen Summer?

https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=2257.msg51367#msg51367
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Rothman

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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #37 on: June 18, 2017, 10:57:59 AM »

I wish our nation's capital would just let MD and VA sign US 1, US 29, and US 50 on I-495.  Extend VA 110 to cover US 1 through Arlington and Alexandria.  I am sure that VA could come up with useful numbers for US 50 and 29 along the inside of the Beltway.  US 50 along the John Hanson Highway could be MD 595 and a nice three digit could suffice US 1 in College Park and Hyattsville.

DC from what I have seen or heard does not shield the US routes anymore and removed some without even replacing them as well.  No one uses the numbers as in DC its all New York Avenue, Rhode Island Avenue, and Constitution Avenue etc.

The US routes used to be well-signed in DC as recently as 15 years ago and quasi-signed at the beginning of this decade.  Poking around GMSV it is nearly non-existent now, as you have said.  All of these routes have turns, so that is worthless.

If US 1 were still signed I would say just keep it in DC because it is not a through route on either side of DC for a considerable distance, but moving US 29 and US 50 onto the beltway would certainly make sense.  On the Virginia side, US 50 should also be put on I-66 because Arlington Blvd has a truck restriction.
Not to go too far off track here, but moving US 50 onto the Beltway doesn't make much sense to me, given how important of a route it is into DC from the east.
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silverback1065

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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #38 on: June 19, 2017, 12:14:40 PM »

I'm pretty sure West St was supposed to pretty much be the location of the missing leg of a Downtown Indy Inner Belt

the original place is actually west of the white river, but because the river is in the way, they chose west street, that's why it's like 8 lanes wide
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westerninterloper

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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #39 on: June 20, 2017, 09:29:06 PM »

A few other maps from the same source I posted earlier. Sorry about the poor quality; the original Purdue docs are fuzzy.













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silverback1065

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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #40 on: June 20, 2017, 09:40:28 PM »

I'm not sure what the hell they were thinking not having anything going northeast, they seriously fucked that up royally.  I'd rather not have 65 exist inside the loop than not having 69.
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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #41 on: June 21, 2017, 12:33:51 PM »

I'm not sure what the hell they were thinking not having anything going northeast, they seriously fucked that up royally.  I'd rather not have 65 exist inside the loop than not having 69.

It looks like they thought about having 69 go northeast, and then decided not to go through with it. Probably a bunch of NIMBYs cancelled it.
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silverback1065

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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #42 on: June 21, 2017, 01:34:12 PM »

I'm not sure what the hell they were thinking not having anything going northeast, they seriously fucked that up royally.  I'd rather not have 65 exist inside the loop than not having 69.

It looks like they thought about having 69 go northeast, and then decided not to go through with it. Probably a bunch of NIMBYs cancelled it.

basically, and after that, they tried to build 165 which would have went from the north split to 38th st, if they did that, they would have inevitably built 69 eventually.
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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #43 on: June 24, 2017, 12:28:01 AM »

g
I'm pretty sure West St was supposed to pretty much be the location of the missing leg of a Downtown Indy Inner Belt

IIRC within that linked document is a discussion of West Street and the proposed west leg of the Inner belt.  The intent was to put it below ground level like a good chunk of the east leg, but tests indicated the water table w from the White River was too high to allow that. West Street / Missouri Street was the result

the original place is actually west of the white river, but because the river is in the way, they chose west street, that's why it's like 8 lanes wide
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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #44 on: August 09, 2017, 11:08:55 AM »

I'm guessing it was done to limit the state and US highways going through Indianapolis. The beltway there works pretty good too. The only freeways within the beltway are I-65 and I-70 both of which travel through the area but I-69 and I-74 get put on the beltway.
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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #45 on: August 09, 2017, 08:53:04 PM »

I remember as a kid back sometime in the 1970s seeing a map of what was supposed to be current and future Indianapolis interstates, and it had I-74 on the southeast side inside I-465, going up Southeastern Ave until it turned due west to the south I-65-70 junction.  Same map had I-69 coming in Binford Blvd until it turned due south to the north I-65-70 junction.
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silverback1065

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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #46 on: August 10, 2017, 07:45:52 AM »

I remember as a kid back sometime in the 1970s seeing a map of what was supposed to be current and future Indianapolis interstates, and it had I-74 on the southeast side inside I-465, going up Southeastern Ave until it turned due west to the south I-65-70 junction.  Same map had I-69 coming in Binford Blvd until it turned due south to the north I-65-70 junction.

hmm, i didnt think 74 was ever proposed to go inside the loop. 
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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #47 on: August 10, 2017, 09:07:18 PM »

I remember as a kid back sometime in the 1970s seeing a map of what was supposed to be current and future Indianapolis interstates, and it had I-74 on the southeast side inside I-465, going up Southeastern Ave until it turned due west to the south I-65-70 junction.  Same map had I-69 coming in Binford Blvd until it turned due south to the north I-65-70 junction.

hmm, i didnt think 74 was ever proposed to go inside the loop.

Since I've never seen it anywhere else, I'm wondering if it was added by the mapmaker to catch others copying their maps.
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Re: Why are most of the roads in the Indianapolis area signed on I-465?
« Reply #48 on: August 11, 2017, 08:45:12 AM »

I believe at one point, Interstate 465 and 69, US 31, 36, 40, 52, and 421, and IN 37 and 67 are all concurrent. If only concurrencies were signed on I-465...

This is correct, between Exit 46 (US-40) and Exit 47 (US-52) on Indy's east side these routes are all concurrent on I-465.   Once I-69 is signed, I would expect SR 37 to be truncated at its junctions with I-69 at both Bloomington and Fishers so the count would go down by one.
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