Tolls proposed for Cottonwood Canyons

[Rothman]

I think that photo with a gondola in it would look awesome. There are tons and tons of valleys you can go to where there won't ever be a gondola.

Beauty is truly in the eye of the beholder.

Reminds me of Alonzo Hawk in Herbie Rides Again wanting to tear down the Coliseum and put up a shopping center...

[Jim]

As for the capacity carrying only 16 people a minute seems wrong. The proposed gondola in LA claims it can carry 5k people per hour

When completed, the proposed project would have a maximum capacity of approximately 5,000 people per hour per direction, and the travel time between Union Station and Dodger Stadium would be approximately seven minutes.

https://www.metro.net/projects/aerial-rapid-transit/

Here's one article that mentions capacity.  One 35-passenger cabin about every 2 minutes.  That sounds reasonable to me, given that it takes some time to load and unload 35 people and their ski/board equipment into and out of a gondola car.  It's also a long ride - 30 minutes to Snowbird and a few more up to Alta.

[paulthemapguy]

Yep, bus lanes and snow sheds are the real answer to this issue. Assuming bus service can actually be increased as promised.
The real issue I have with the gondola is that it will cost 729 million dollars to initially build, it will be expensive to operate, it can only carry 16 people a minute on average, it won't be able to operate in anything resembling high winds or avalanche danger, one of the support towers is actually in an avalanche path... just seems to me like a huge waste of money to not meaningfully improve anything.

Well they have to do something to improve capacity, and if expanding the roadway is off the table, the solution has to involve another mode of transportation besides the passenger car. Buses are a great idea, because they would use the existing roadway, but that solution would be completely impotent if the same volume of passenger cars is allowed to use the road as before.  The buses will do nothing to help if they're stuck in the same traffic jams as those that currently exist. Scrapping that idea, the next-least obtrusive transportation option would be aerial gondola, or giving buses exclusive usage of the existing roadway. The terrain is unsuitable for any rail line to go straight enough to achieve an efficient speed, I'm assuming.

[Plutonic Panda]

As for the capacity carrying only 16 people a minute seems wrong. The proposed gondola in LA claims it can carry 5k people per hour

When completed, the proposed project would have a maximum capacity of approximately 5,000 people per hour per direction, and the travel time between Union Station and Dodger Stadium would be approximately seven minutes.

https://www.metro.net/projects/aerial-rapid-transit/

Here's one article that mentions capacity.  One 35-passenger cabin about every 2 minutes.  That sounds reasonable to me, given that it takes some time to load and unload 35 people and their ski/board equipment into and out of a gondola car.  It's also a long ride - 30 minutes to Snowbird and a few more up to Alta.

I completely forgot to factor in loading and unloading skis and snowboards and what not. That is a great point. I'm sure that will slow things down.

[US 89]

Yep, bus lanes and snow sheds are the real answer to this issue. Assuming bus service can actually be increased as promised.
The real issue I have with the gondola is that it will cost 729 million dollars to initially build, it will be expensive to operate, it can only carry 16 people a minute on average, it won't be able to operate in anything resembling high winds or avalanche danger, one of the support towers is actually in an avalanche path... just seems to me like a huge waste of money to not meaningfully improve anything.

Well they have to do something to improve capacity, and if expanding the roadway is off the table, the solution has to involve another mode of transportation besides the passenger car. Buses are a great idea, because they would use the existing roadway, but that solution would be completely impotent if the same volume of passenger cars is allowed to use the road as before.  The buses will do nothing to help if they're stuck in the same traffic jams as those that currently exist. Scrapping that idea, the next-least obtrusive transportation option would be aerial gondola, or giving buses exclusive usage of the existing roadway. The terrain is unsuitable for any rail line to go straight enough to achieve an efficient speed, I'm assuming.

Yeah, the canyon is generally too steep and narrow for a conventional rail line to be workable.

As for the capacity carrying only 16 people a minute seems wrong. The proposed gondola in LA claims it can carry 5k people per hour

When completed, the proposed project would have a maximum capacity of approximately 5,000 people per hour per direction, and the travel time between Union Station and Dodger Stadium would be approximately seven minutes.

https://www.metro.net/projects/aerial-rapid-transit/

Here's one article that mentions capacity.  One 35-passenger cabin about every 2 minutes.  That sounds reasonable to me, given that it takes some time to load and unload 35 people and their ski/board equipment into and out of a gondola car.  It's also a long ride - 30 minutes to Snowbird and a few more up to Alta.

I completely forgot to factor in loading and unloading skis and snowboards and what not. That is a great point. I'm sure that will slow things down.

Also, you ever watch people move in ski boots? Not exactly quickly...

[Plutonic Panda]

So then, what would be the big deal about just widening the road a little bit to allow for buses?

[Rothman]

Perhaps a cog railway...

[Plutonic Panda]

Perhaps a cog railway...

Remember that picture that Max posted about those little Robo cars in Las Vegas? Those don't take up much room. You wouldn't have to widen the road that much. Now all we would need them to do is get them to go 150 mph and problem solved.

[Plutonic Panda]

Well here's one way they're getting a few cars off that road.

https://kutv.com/news/local/udots-cottonwood-canyons-crackdown-targets-holiday-ski-traffic

[Plutonic Panda]

Looks like they're going with the bus alternative for Little Cottonwood so no trams or gondolas if I'm understanding it right:

https://fb.watch/E2Lo22GCgZ/?mibextid=wwXIfr

[The Ghostbuster]

I think they made the right choice. I'd rather take the bus than take a tram or a gondola.

[Plutonic Panda]

I think they made the right choice. I'd rather take the bus than take a tram or a gondola.

They should at least widen the shoulders so they can be used as bus lanes.

[Rothman]

Sanity prevailed.

[Plutonic Panda]

Some more details from UDOTs website:

Bus service to the canyon will also increase significantly, with buses operating every 10 to 20 minutes during peak periods to offer a more frequent and reliable alternative to driving.

To support this expanded service, UDOT will build new bus stops at Snowbird and Alta designed to handle more people and improve rider comfort.

UDOT is also working toward implementing a tolling system to help manage traffic demand and reduce congestion. This, combined with the elimination of winter roadside parking near the resorts, will help improve travel times and safety in the canyon.

For now, UDOT is implementing bus service in Little Cottonwood Canyon, and is hoping to move forward with similar improvements in Big Cottonwood Canyon pending the outcome of an environmental study. 

"We need improvements in the canyon now to address the traffic challenges we are experiencing today," said Devin Weder, UDOT project manager. "By moving forward with these buses and infrastructure improvements, we are laying the foundation for a better, more reliable transportation system in the canyon."

- https://connect.udot.utah.gov/2025/12/17/udot-moves-forward-with-travel-solutions-for-little-cottonwood-canyon/

[Plutonic Panda]

The plan for the Big Cottonwood Canyon road moving forward including tolls. Project could be complete by 2028.

https://ksltv.com/local-news/udot-advances-big-cottonwood-canyon-transit-plan/908198/