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Author Topic: Intersection help.  (Read 1162 times)

Baloo Uriza

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Re: Intersection help.
« Reply #25 on: July 04, 2018, 12:56:17 PM »

Northbound approach...



Southbound approach...



So how do you deal with long vehicles turning or emergency vehicles trying to break the roadblock?  Amercans tend to drive like they're starring in Chinese dashcam videos.
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jakeroot

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Re: Intersection help.
« Reply #26 on: July 04, 2018, 01:57:03 PM »

Northbound approach...

https://i.imgur.com/hJ1rJKP.jpg[/img]

Southbound approach...

https://i.imgur.com/CIPgBuc.jpg[/img]

So how do you deal with long vehicles turning or emergency vehicles trying to break the roadblock?  Amercans tend to drive like they're starring in Chinese dashcam videos.

The intersection would have emergency vehicle pre-emption, so by the time the emergency service arrived, it would be green for that direction (being careful not to create a yellow trap). If for some reason that wasn't an option, any approaching emergency service would approach slowly (as is required at red lights), wait for traffic to clear (maybe a couple seconds of waiting), and then proceed. Either way, not detrimental.

Like many dual left turns, trucks may have to use both lanes. If I had more ROW to work with, I would have created a wider intersection that allowed for more turning room.

For what it's worth, countries at both ends of the spectrum use waiting points: Denmark (few road deaths), South Africa (quite a lot of road deaths). Japan also uses them, and they have a very low road death rate.
« Last Edit: July 04, 2018, 02:02:24 PM by jakeroot »
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Baloo Uriza

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Re: Intersection help.
« Reply #27 on: July 04, 2018, 03:08:17 PM »

Northbound approach...

https://i.imgur.com/hJ1rJKP.jpg[/img]

Southbound approach...

https://i.imgur.com/CIPgBuc.jpg[/img]

So how do you deal with long vehicles turning or emergency vehicles trying to break the roadblock?  Amercans tend to drive like they're starring in Chinese dashcam videos.

The intersection would have emergency vehicle pre-emption, so by the time the emergency service arrived, it would be green for that direction (being careful not to create a yellow trap). If for some reason that wasn't an option, any approaching emergency service would approach slowly (as is required at red lights), wait for traffic to clear (maybe a couple seconds of waiting), and then proceed. Either way, not detrimental.

Like many dual left turns, trucks may have to use both lanes. If I had more ROW to work with, I would have created a wider intersection that allowed for more turning room.

For what it's worth, countries at both ends of the spectrum use waiting points: Denmark (few road deaths), South Africa (quite a lot of road deaths). Japan also uses them, and they have a very low road death rate.

To be fair, Denmark and Japan also have far lower rates of people driving in the first place; cycling, walking and public transport are substantially more popular there, whereas cars tend to be more of an enthusiast-or-last-resort mode and the level of training drivers in those places get tends to be considerably higher than in America.
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jakeroot

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Re: Intersection help.
« Reply #28 on: July 04, 2018, 04:03:47 PM »

Northbound approach...

https://i.imgur.com/hJ1rJKP.jpg[/img]

Southbound approach...

https://i.imgur.com/CIPgBuc.jpg[/img]

So how do you deal with long vehicles turning or emergency vehicles trying to break the roadblock?  Amercans tend to drive like they're starring in Chinese dashcam videos.

The intersection would have emergency vehicle pre-emption, so by the time the emergency service arrived, it would be green for that direction (being careful not to create a yellow trap). If for some reason that wasn't an option, any approaching emergency service would approach slowly (as is required at red lights), wait for traffic to clear (maybe a couple seconds of waiting), and then proceed. Either way, not detrimental.

Like many dual left turns, trucks may have to use both lanes. If I had more ROW to work with, I would have created a wider intersection that allowed for more turning room.

For what it's worth, countries at both ends of the spectrum use waiting points: Denmark (few road deaths), South Africa (quite a lot of road deaths). Japan also uses them, and they have a very low road death rate.

To be fair, Denmark and Japan also have far lower rates of people driving in the first place; cycling, walking and public transport are substantially more popular there, whereas cars tend to be more of an enthusiast-or-last-resort mode and the level of training drivers in those places get tends to be considerably higher than in America.

I can't find any info on number of licensed drivers per capita (not sure what your source was), but of the three countries I listed, South Africa has the least amount of cars per 1000, 165 to be exact. Denmark has 480 per 1000, and Japan has 591 per 1000.

It's not about the number of drivers. It's about the training. And I will admit that Denmark and Japan are probably better trained than us. But that doesn't mean we are incapable of handling my proposal. Nowhere in the US has designed an intersection like mine, as far as I know. There's no way to know how well it would work.
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Baloo Uriza

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Re: Intersection help.
« Reply #29 on: July 04, 2018, 05:43:16 PM »

Northbound approach...

https://i.imgur.com/hJ1rJKP.jpg[/img]

Southbound approach...

https://i.imgur.com/CIPgBuc.jpg[/img]

So how do you deal with long vehicles turning or emergency vehicles trying to break the roadblock?  Amercans tend to drive like they're starring in Chinese dashcam videos.

The intersection would have emergency vehicle pre-emption, so by the time the emergency service arrived, it would be green for that direction (being careful not to create a yellow trap). If for some reason that wasn't an option, any approaching emergency service would approach slowly (as is required at red lights), wait for traffic to clear (maybe a couple seconds of waiting), and then proceed. Either way, not detrimental.

Like many dual left turns, trucks may have to use both lanes. If I had more ROW to work with, I would have created a wider intersection that allowed for more turning room.

For what it's worth, countries at both ends of the spectrum use waiting points: Denmark (few road deaths), South Africa (quite a lot of road deaths). Japan also uses them, and they have a very low road death rate.

To be fair, Denmark and Japan also have far lower rates of people driving in the first place; cycling, walking and public transport are substantially more popular there, whereas cars tend to be more of an enthusiast-or-last-resort mode and the level of training drivers in those places get tends to be considerably higher than in America.

I can't find any info on number of licensed drivers per capita (not sure what your source was), but of the three countries I listed, South Africa has the least amount of cars per 1000, 165 to be exact. Denmark has 480 per 1000, and Japan has 591 per 1000.

Just because someone has a driver's license doesn't mean they prefer to drive for every trip, either, just means that they can drive.

It's not about the number of drivers. It's about the training. And I will admit that Denmark and Japan are probably better trained than us. But that doesn't mean we are incapable of handling my proposal. Nowhere in the US has designed an intersection like mine, as far as I know. There's no way to know how well it would work.

Not just better trained, but have quality access to, and tend to use, the best tool for the job.  I can't imagine Denmark varies a whole lot beyond lack of quality access compared to the Dutch, but from all accounts I've had for the Dutch is that people in Denmark and Holland tend to prefer bicycle and mass transit where possible.  Driving where it's practical to use other modes available is seen as a status symbol for poor people trying to pretend they're not poor.  Probably more a Dutch thing than a Danish thing since Holland definitely got the infrastructure right after realizing that focusing on private car ownership as the main mode of transportation was literally killing people in the streets, and made hard changes to improve.
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jakeroot

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Re: Intersection help.
« Reply #30 on: July 04, 2018, 05:53:03 PM »

I think we've gotten a bit too far off-topic. I'd rather stay focused on my proposal. I don't mind brief tangents, but I don't want this descending into another "America sucks at driving" thread. We have enough of those.

Amtrakprod, I'm interested in seeing your thoughts when you return.
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Baloo Uriza

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Re: Intersection help.
« Reply #31 on: July 04, 2018, 10:31:48 PM »

I think we've gotten a bit too far off-topic. I'd rather stay focused on my proposal. I don't mind brief tangents, but I don't want this descending into another "America sucks at driving" thread. We have enough of those.

Amtrakprod, I'm interested in seeing your thoughts when you return.

Felt more like a "don't block the intersection" thread.  Intersection's too narrow to warrant pulling forward into the intersection in the first place, large vehicles offtrack, and pretty much everywhere but California considers it a run signal if it turns red while you're in the intersection anyway, despite what three bad but vocal drivers here think.
« Last Edit: July 04, 2018, 10:34:47 PM by Baloo Uriza »
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jakeroot

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Re: Intersection help.
« Reply #32 on: July 05, 2018, 01:52:50 AM »

I think we've gotten a bit too far off-topic. I'd rather stay focused on my proposal. I don't mind brief tangents, but I don't want this descending into another "America sucks at driving" thread. We have enough of those.

Amtrakprod, I'm interested in seeing your thoughts when you return.

Felt more like a "don't block the intersection" thread.  Intersection's too narrow to warrant pulling forward into the intersection in the first place, large vehicles offtrack, and pretty much everywhere but California considers it a run signal if it turns red while you're in the intersection anyway, despite what three bad but vocal drivers here think.

Just stop Baloo. You're not making any sense. You're coming across as a bit foolish. We've shot down your false statements about intersection movements many times before. Don't start it here again.
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Amtrakprod

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Re: Intersection help.
« Reply #33 on: July 06, 2018, 04:41:22 PM »

Hi Jake! Really loved your design, the one thing is is that it would most likely have reflective borders and doghouses instead of towers, also Waltham wouldn’t have the before intersection signals! Great design though!!


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jakeroot

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Re: Intersection help.
« Reply #34 on: July 06, 2018, 05:51:39 PM »

Hi Jake! Really loved your design, the one thing is is that it would most likely have reflective borders and doghouses instead of towers, also Waltham wouldn’t have the before intersection signals! Great design though!!

Yeah, the stop line signals are more of a midwest or western thing. I quite like them, so I try to include them in my designs.

The left turns are flashing yellow arrows, so they are basically the same thing as doghouses in terms of how the behave. I have not yet created a backplate with a reflective border, but it's on my to-do list.

Glad you like it!
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Amtrakprod

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Re: Intersection help.
« Reply #35 on: July 07, 2018, 10:13:27 AM »

Hi Jake! Really loved your design, the one thing is is that it would most likely have reflective borders and doghouses instead of towers, also Waltham wouldn’t have the before intersection signals! Great design though!!

Yeah, the stop line signals are more of a midwest or western thing. I quite like them, so I try to include them in my designs.

The left turns are flashing yellow arrows, so they are basically the same thing as doghouses in terms of how the behave. I have not yet created a backplate with a reflective border, but it's on my to-do list.

Glad you like it!
I was saying the right turn signals would be doghouses, I personally love FYAs


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jakeroot

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Re: Intersection help.
« Reply #36 on: July 09, 2018, 06:47:24 PM »

Hi Jake! Really loved your design, the one thing is is that it would most likely have reflective borders and doghouses instead of towers, also Waltham wouldn’t have the before intersection signals! Great design though!!

Yeah, the stop line signals are more of a midwest or western thing. I quite like them, so I try to include them in my designs.

The left turns are flashing yellow arrows, so they are basically the same thing as doghouses in terms of how the behave. I have not yet created a backplate with a reflective border, but it's on my to-do list.

Glad you like it!

I was saying the right turn signals would be doghouses, I personally love FYAs

Oh, I gotcha. I was wondering why you'd want doghouses, since I've seen many FYAs in Massachusetts.

Would doghouses still be used on poles? I've seen doghouses on poles before (in several places, including Mass), but wasn't sure if they were still regularly installed.

My area generally uses 4- or 5-section towers on masts for right turn filters, hence why I used them here. The one hold out is Spokane, who seems to like doghouses on poles.
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Amtrakprod

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Re: Intersection help.
« Reply #37 on: August 12, 2018, 01:51:16 PM »

Hi Jake! Really loved your design, the one thing is is that it would most likely have reflective borders and doghouses instead of towers, also Waltham wouldn’t have the before intersection signals! Great design though!!

Yeah, the stop line signals are more of a midwest or western thing. I quite like them, so I try to include them in my designs.

The left turns are flashing yellow arrows, so they are basically the same thing as doghouses in terms of how the behave. I have not yet created a backplate with a reflective border, but it's on my to-do list.

Glad you like it!

I was saying the right turn signals would be doghouses, I personally love FYAs

Oh, I gotcha. I was wondering why you'd want doghouses, since I've seen many FYAs in Massachusetts.

Would doghouses still be used on poles? I've seen doghouses on poles before (in several places, including Mass), but wasn't sure if they were still regularly installed.

My area generally uses 4- or 5-section towers on masts for right turn filters, hence why I used them here. The one hold out is Spokane, who seems to like doghouses on poles.

Even on the bottom section, Massachusetts really hates 5 sections for some reason.


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