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Author Topic: Maryland  (Read 39043 times)

Tonytone

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1850 on: July 15, 2020, 11:14:15 PM »

I always assumed that the choice of New York as the control city for I-95 north is purely down to institutional inertia on the part of the MDTA, and I would expect to see signage changes at some point this decade now that the I-95/I-276 interchange is open.

I can remember a time when the "control city" on northbound I-95 in Maryland between White Marsh and the Delaware border was usually "N J Turnpike."  And that made some sense as long as I-95 was not completed between Philadelphia and Edison, N.J. (New Jersey Turnpike Exit 10).

Now with I-95 complete, IMO there should be mention of Wilmington, Philadelphia and New York.



N.J Turnpike was still displayed on I-95 signs on MD 279 until late 1994.

Crazy for MDDOT to sign 95 like this, I need understood why MD does this since you have multiple cities before NY. That's like being in Florida and having a sign for NC for I-95 North.

Yea that's where you're going if you are heading north, but they should have the next state on the current state your in BGS.

To be fair, the picture above is an old one - the sign on MD 279 now says "New York" rather than "N.J. Turnpike".  Although I would have considered "Philadelphia" either before "New York", or instead of "New York".

Oh yea I know that sign says NY now, but most of the signs on I-95 in MD Say "New York" For I-95 North.
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sprjus4

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1851 on: July 16, 2020, 03:59:32 AM »

Crazy for MDDOT to sign 95 like this, I never understood why MD does this since you have multiple cities before NY. That's like being in Florida and having a sign for NC on I-95 North.
I-95 South in Petersburg, VA - ”Miami”

Honorable mention to “Atlanta” for a control city on I-85 a few miles north of here.

But agreed, for the most part, the next largest city should be signed.

Miami, Jacksonville, Savannah, Florence, Fayetteville, Richmond, Washington, Baltimore, Philadelphia, Newark, New York, etc.

Interesting to see long distance destinations here and there, such as “New York” on I-95 in Northern Virginia, but it shouldn’t be a primary control city for Maryland, maybe once or twice in conjunction with Philadelphia at large junctions, but that’s it.

North Carolina seems to use smaller towns such as Benson, Dunn, and one could even say Rocky Mount should reasonably not be included either. VDOT uses Rocky Mount as a control city from Richmond south, though should be Fayetteville IMO.

Throughout NC, it should be Florence, Fayetteville, and Richmond, nothing else.
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mrsman

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1852 on: July 16, 2020, 01:23:13 PM »

Crazy for MDDOT to sign 95 like this, I never understood why MD does this since you have multiple cities before NY. That's like being in Florida and having a sign for NC on I-95 North.
I-95 South in Petersburg, VA - ”Miami”

Honorable mention to “Atlanta” for a control city on I-85 a few miles north of here.

But agreed, for the most part, the next largest city should be signed.

Miami, Jacksonville, Savannah, Florence, Fayetteville, Richmond, Washington, Baltimore, Philadelphia, Newark, New York, etc.

Interesting to see long distance destinations here and there, such as “New York” on I-95 in Northern Virginia, but it shouldn’t be a primary control city for Maryland, maybe once or twice in conjunction with Philadelphia at large junctions, but that’s it.

North Carolina seems to use smaller towns such as Benson, Dunn, and one could even say Rocky Mount should reasonably not be included either. VDOT uses Rocky Mount as a control city from Richmond south, though should be Fayetteville IMO.

Throughout NC, it should be Florence, Fayetteville, and Richmond, nothing else.

I believe that nearly all of us (except MD DOT) agree that the control on I-95 north of Baltimore should be Philadelphia for the entire state of MD.  NYC can be signed on mileage signs if there is room and if Philadelphia is already signed.

I also agree with the notion that two control cities, where there is room on the signs, would be helpful to denote certain local cities that would otherwise be skipped.  These second cities would not be used if there is only room for one city.  Second cities between Baltimore and Philly that can be signed: Aberdeen, Newark Del, Wilmington, Chester.

I think your list of primary control cities is spot on for I-95.  I would consider Newark NJ (and Trenton) to be more appropriate as secondary controls though.

The use of Miami and Atlanta in VA is interesting, but appropriate given the long distance travel of the snowbirds.  As these are only done in conjunction with another control and only for very few signs near the important junctions they can stay.  But as you said, the Miami sign should be with Fayetteville not Rocky Mount.  Rocky Mount is a secondary control that can be signed with Fayetteville SB and Richmond NB.  And I would take a similar approach with the other small towns that are signed along the route - those are appropriate as secondary controls only.  In other words, Fayetteville and Richmond are primary controls, Rocky Mount and Petersburg are secondary controls, and Atlanta and Miami (within VA) are bonus controls.  A primary control should always be signed.  A secondary control should be signed if there is room.  A bonus control can replace a secondary control only for very specialized circumstances.

There is a wonderful thread on control cities on the fictional board.  I think you made a wonderful suggestion for I-95.

https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=23745.0
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cpzilliacus

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1853 on: July 16, 2020, 03:15:00 PM »

I believe that nearly all of us (except MD DOT) agree that the control on I-95 north of Baltimore should be Philadelphia for the entire state of MD.  NYC can be signed on mileage signs if there is room and if Philadelphia is already signed.

I suspect MDTA decides for the roads under its jurisdiction.

I still feel that Wilmington, Delaware (only) should get mention along I-95 in Maryland.  DelDOT mentions Baltimore several times on I-95 southbound in their state. 

I understand it to not be favored by MUTCD, but I think signing all three (Wilmington, Philadelphia and New York) would be appropriate - or at least two of them, and making sure that all get mentioned in terms of distance signs at least once or twice.
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jmacswimmer

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1854 on: July 16, 2020, 04:01:54 PM »

I believe that nearly all of us (except MD DOT) agree that the control on I-95 north of Baltimore should be Philadelphia for the entire state of MD.  NYC can be signed on mileage signs if there is room and if Philadelphia is already signed.

I suspect MDTA decides for the roads under its jurisdiction.

I still feel that Wilmington, Delaware (only) should get mention along I-95 in Maryland.  DelDOT mentions Baltimore several times on I-95 southbound in their state. 

I understand it to not be favored by MUTCD, but I think signing all three (Wilmington, Philadelphia and New York) would be appropriate - or at least two of them, and making sure that all get mentioned in terms of distance signs at least once or twice.

SHA does seem to follow MDTA's New York preference based on these signs.

I agree that all 3 cities should be used - I think MDTA could follow VDOT's approach with juggling the Hampton Roads cities on I-64 east leaving Richmond.  At the very least, maybe SHA could add signs on I-695 approaching exit 33 resembling this sign on I-295 approaching exit 28.  And then on I-95 itself, MDTA could cycle between cities on the various mileage signs as VDOT does with the mileage signs on I-64 (examples past exits 200, 205, 211, and 220).

Since MDTA's post-interchange distance signs typically use the next interchange, followed by a more local location, followed by the control city (example here), maybe MDTA could use the bottom line to cycle between Wilmington, Philadelphia, and New York.  Currently, Wilmington does make one appearance on the middle line following exit 100.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2020, 04:14:44 PM by jmacswimmer »
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MASTERNC

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1855 on: July 16, 2020, 04:28:06 PM »

I believe that nearly all of us (except MD DOT) agree that the control on I-95 north of Baltimore should be Philadelphia for the entire state of MD.  NYC can be signed on mileage signs if there is room and if Philadelphia is already signed.

I suspect MDTA decides for the roads under its jurisdiction.

I still feel that Wilmington, Delaware (only) should get mention along I-95 in Maryland.  DelDOT mentions Baltimore several times on I-95 southbound in their state. 

I understand it to not be favored by MUTCD, but I think signing all three (Wilmington, Philadelphia and New York) would be appropriate - or at least two of them, and making sure that all get mentioned in terms of distance signs at least once or twice.

SHA does seem to follow MDTA's New York preference based on these signs.

I agree that all 3 cities should be used - I think MDTA could follow VDOT's approach with juggling the Hampton Roads cities on I-64 east leaving Richmond.  At the very least, maybe SHA could add signs on I-695 approaching exit 33 resembling this sign on I-295 approaching exit 28.  And then on I-95 itself, MDTA could cycle between cities on the various mileage signs as VDOT does with the mileage signs on I-64 (examples past exits 200, 205, 211, and 220).

Since MDTA's post-interchange distance signs typically use the next interchange, followed by a more local location, followed by the control city (example here), maybe MDTA could use the bottom line to cycle between Wilmington, Philadelphia, and New York.  Currently, Wilmington does make one appearance on the middle line following exit 100.

There is a mileage sign for Philadelphia and New York on I-95 past the Laurel rest area (SHA maintained)

https://goo.gl/maps/GDzZ5WAafTym8LsH6
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cpzilliacus

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1856 on: July 16, 2020, 04:56:34 PM »


There is a mileage sign for Philadelphia and New York on I-95 past the Laurel rest area (SHA maintained)

https://goo.gl/maps/GDzZ5WAafTym8LsH6

Yes, except for a few times when it has been knocked down or damaged, it has been there for a long time, though it is not made up of extruded aluminum like most BGS panels on Maryland interstate highways. 

It is (unless there has been a recent change) the only mention of Philly anywhere on I-95 in Maryland.
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AcE_Wolf_287

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1857 on: July 16, 2020, 10:11:53 PM »

ok so i dont really know what category to put this in but,

I-70 was supposed to end at I-95 at Exit 50, and if i did it would run on the southern part of that park,
is there anywhere else I-70 could've been rerouted to end at I-95 at another location

and I-83, i know it was supposed to end at exit 57 at I-95, but could I-395 go underground and end at I-83 in baltimore, and I-83 takes that designation, and the old I-83 would be I-183

im kinda confused on these 2 routes, and also theres I-97, why does it and at auxiliary routes?

but does anyone else have any clue about this?

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1858 on: July 16, 2020, 10:50:15 PM »

ok so i dont really know what category to put this in but,

I-70 was supposed to end at I-95 at Exit 50, and if i did it would run on the southern part of that park,
is there anywhere else I-70 could've been rerouted to end at I-95 at another location

and I-83, i know it was supposed to end at exit 57 at I-95, but could I-395 go underground and end at I-83 in baltimore, and I-83 takes that designation, and the old I-83 would be I-183

im kinda confused on these 2 routes, and also theres I-97, why does it and at auxiliary routes?

but does anyone else have any clue about this?
I-97 was a later addition to create a freeway between Annapolis and Baltimore crafted in the 1970s and 1980s, constructed by the mid 1990s. IIRC, it used interstate funding from unbuilt sections of I-70 and I-83.
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Tonytone

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1859 on: July 16, 2020, 10:52:01 PM »

I believe that nearly all of us (except MD DOT) agree that the control on I-95 north of Baltimore should be Philadelphia for the entire state of MD.  NYC can be signed on mileage signs if there is room and if Philadelphia is already signed.

I suspect MDTA decides for the roads under its jurisdiction.

I still feel that Wilmington, Delaware (only) should get mention along I-95 in Maryland.  DelDOT mentions Baltimore several times on I-95 southbound in their state. 

I understand it to not be favored by MUTCD, but I think signing all three (Wilmington, Philadelphia and New York) would be appropriate - or at least two of them, and making sure that all get mentioned in terms of distance signs at least once or twice.

SHA does seem to follow MDTA's New York preference based on these signs.

I agree that all 3 cities should be used - I think MDTA could follow VDOT's approach with juggling the Hampton Roads cities on I-64 east leaving Richmond.  At the very least, maybe SHA could add signs on I-695 approaching exit 33 resembling this sign on I-295 approaching exit 28.  And then on I-95 itself, MDTA could cycle between cities on the various mileage signs as VDOT does with the mileage signs on I-64 (examples past exits 200, 205, 211, and 220).

Since MDTA's post-interchange distance signs typically use the next interchange, followed by a more local location, followed by the control city (example here), maybe MDTA could use the bottom line to cycle between Wilmington, Philadelphia, and New York.  Currently, Wilmington does make one appearance on the middle line following exit 100.

There is a mileage sign for Philadelphia and New York on I-95 past the Laurel rest area (SHA maintained)

https://goo.gl/maps/GDzZ5WAafTym8LsH6
I think I figured out why MDDOT, uses NY instead of Philly.

Simply it’s because of traffic from DC to NY. Maybe due to the popularity of the areas between tourists & traveling residents/workers from DC to NY.

 of course we would know all the cities & states in between DC/NY. We know the area & some of us travel everyday between the two places.

I dont think any other states in the US have a traveling work force like the area between DC-DE-PA-NJ-NY.

However the DOTS should be putting the correct cities on these BGS’


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famartin

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1860 on: July 16, 2020, 11:41:16 PM »

Inertia is why MDOT SHA and MdTA use NY, since the old eastern turnpike complex traditionally bypassed Philly.
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Tonytone

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1861 on: July 16, 2020, 11:46:23 PM »

Inertia is why MDOT SHA and MdTA use NY, since the old eastern turnpike complex traditionally bypassed Philly.
The signs have been replaced many times since then. Im sure they have realized it’s connected now.


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epzik8

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1862 on: July 29, 2020, 10:19:29 AM »

I believe that nearly all of us (except MD DOT) agree that the control on I-95 north of Baltimore should be Philadelphia for the entire state of MD.  NYC can be signed on mileage signs if there is room and if Philadelphia is already signed.

I suspect MDTA decides for the roads under its jurisdiction.

I still feel that Wilmington, Delaware (only) should get mention along I-95 in Maryland.  DelDOT mentions Baltimore several times on I-95 southbound in their state. 

I understand it to not be favored by MUTCD, but I think signing all three (Wilmington, Philadelphia and New York) would be appropriate - or at least two of them, and making sure that all get mentioned in terms of distance signs at least once or twice.

SHA does seem to follow MDTA's New York preference based on these signs.

I agree that all 3 cities should be used - I think MDTA could follow VDOT's approach with juggling the Hampton Roads cities on I-64 east leaving Richmond.  At the very least, maybe SHA could add signs on I-695 approaching exit 33 resembling this sign on I-295 approaching exit 28.  And then on I-95 itself, MDTA could cycle between cities on the various mileage signs as VDOT does with the mileage signs on I-64 (examples past exits 200, 205, 211, and 220).

Since MDTA's post-interchange distance signs typically use the next interchange, followed by a more local location, followed by the control city (example here), maybe MDTA could use the bottom line to cycle between Wilmington, Philadelphia, and New York.  Currently, Wilmington does make one appearance on the middle line following exit 100.
It bears repeating that even with the I-95 gap being eliminated by the Pennsylvania Turnpike interchange project, New York continues to be the control city for I-95 northbound between southwest Baltimore and the I-295 split south of Wilmington because most through traffic takes I-295 over the Delaware Memorial Bridge and to the New Jersey Turnpike instead of going through Wilmington, Philadelphia and over the Delaware River via the Pennsylvania/New Jersey turnpike connection. When the northbound control city becomes Wilmington past the 295 split and then Philadelphia once you get north of Wilmington's CBD, it's more intended for local travelers who aren't assumed to be going north of Philadelphia.
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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1863 on: July 29, 2020, 11:25:00 AM »

Crazy for MDDOT to sign 95 like this, I never understood why MD does this since you have multiple cities before NY. That's like being in Florida and having a sign for NC on I-95 North.
I-95 South in Petersburg, VA - ”Miami”

Honorable mention to “Atlanta” for a control city on I-85 a few miles north of here.

But agreed, for the most part, the next largest city should be signed.

Miami, Jacksonville, Savannah, Florence, Fayetteville, Richmond, Washington, Baltimore, Philadelphia, Newark, New York, etc.

Interesting to see long distance destinations here and there, such as “New York” on I-95 in Northern Virginia, but it shouldn’t be a primary control city for Maryland, maybe once or twice in conjunction with Philadelphia at large junctions, but that’s it.

North Carolina seems to use smaller towns such as Benson, Dunn, and one could even say Rocky Mount should reasonably not be included either. VDOT uses Rocky Mount as a control city from Richmond south, though should be Fayetteville IMO.

Throughout NC, it should be Florence, Fayetteville, and Richmond, nothing else.
Thought they got rid of the 'Miami' in VA?
They used to have it on the I-95/I-295 intersection.

I agree, I don't get why Philly gets so shafted for control city both on I-95 in MD and on the NJTP.
I don't like the inconsistency too, how on the NJTP it has Wilmington but on I-95 in MD nothing about Wilmington.
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Tonytone

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Maryland
« Reply #1864 on: July 29, 2020, 11:30:43 AM »

Crazy for MDDOT to sign 95 like this, I never understood why MD does this since you have multiple cities before NY. That's like being in Florida and having a sign for NC on I-95 North.
I-95 South in Petersburg, VA - ”Miami”

Honorable mention to “Atlanta” for a control city on I-85 a few miles north of here.

But agreed, for the most part, the next largest city should be signed.

Miami, Jacksonville, Savannah, Florence, Fayetteville, Richmond, Washington, Baltimore, Philadelphia, Newark, New York, etc.

Interesting to see long distance destinations here and there, such as “New York” on I-95 in Northern Virginia, but it shouldn’t be a primary control city for Maryland, maybe once or twice in conjunction with Philadelphia at large junctions, but that’s it.

North Carolina seems to use smaller towns such as Benson, Dunn, and one could even say Rocky Mount should reasonably not be included either. VDOT uses Rocky Mount as a control city from Richmond south, though should be Fayetteville IMO.

Throughout NC, it should be Florence, Fayetteville, and Richmond, nothing else.
Thought they got rid of the 'Miami' in VA?
They used to have it on the I-95/I-295 intersection.

I agree, I don't get why Philly gets so shafted for control city both on I-95 in MD and on the NJTP.
I don't like the inconsistency too, how on the NJTP it has Wilmington but on I-95 in MD nothing about Wilmington.
Its because Mdot is a lush crum bum.

Edit: /S


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« Last Edit: July 29, 2020, 11:46:59 AM by Tonytone »
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74/171FAN

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1865 on: July 29, 2020, 11:45:55 AM »

Crazy for MDDOT to sign 95 like this, I never understood why MD does this since you have multiple cities before NY. That's like being in Florida and having a sign for NC on I-95 North.

I-95 South in Petersburg, VA - ”Miami”

Honorable mention to “Atlanta” for a control city on I-85 a few miles north of here.

But agreed, for the most part, the next largest city should be signed.

Miami, Jacksonville, Savannah, Florence, Fayetteville, Richmond, Washington, Baltimore, Philadelphia, Newark, New York, etc.

Interesting to see long distance destinations here and there, such as “New York” on I-95 in Northern Virginia, but it shouldn’t be a primary control city for Maryland, maybe once or twice in conjunction with Philadelphia at large junctions, but that’s it.

North Carolina seems to use smaller towns such as Benson, Dunn, and one could even say Rocky Mount should reasonably not be included either. VDOT uses Rocky Mount as a control city from Richmond south, though should be Fayetteville IMO.

Throughout NC, it should be Florence, Fayetteville, and Richmond, nothing else.
Thought they got rid of the 'Miami' in VA?
They used to have it on the I-95/I-295 intersection.

I agree, I don't get why Philly gets so shafted for control city both on I-95 in MD and on the NJTP.
I don't like the inconsistency too, how on the NJTP it has Wilmington but on I-95 in MD nothing about Wilmington.


The location Tonytone linked to is the only Miami sign left in VA on I-95 SB last I remember.
« Last Edit: July 29, 2020, 03:43:00 PM by 74/171FAN »
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1995hoo

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1866 on: July 29, 2020, 01:30:24 PM »

Thought they got rid of the 'Miami' in VA?
They used to have it on the I-95/I-295 intersection.

....

Last time I went through there, the BGS north of I-85 that had Miami was gone, but there was still one LGS just to the south of I-85 that listed Rocky Mount NC and Miami. Street View shows it was still there in July 2019, which is more recent than my last trip through that area.

The BGSs now list Rocky Mount NC and Durham. Kind of odd they just say "Durham" and not "Durham NC," but maybe they're concerned that someone might confuse Rocky Mount with the one in Virginia even though it's nowhere near I-95 or I-85. As far as I know, there is no Durham in Virginia.
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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1867 on: July 29, 2020, 01:57:30 PM »

^

Interestingly, when they replaced signage for the I-85 junction a few years back, they actually kept "Atlanta" on one of the new signs.
https://www.google.com/maps/@37.2509151,-77.3946529,3a,74.7y,158.85h,93.64t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s1S-qerVUGu0qFydkevXW3Q!2e0!7i16384!8i8192!5m1!1e1

Additionally, another sign at the northern I-95 / I-295 junction directs traffic bound to I-85 South "Atlanta / Durham" to follow I-95 South. https://www.google.com/maps/@37.699489,-77.4491556,3a,37.5y,201.79h,88.73t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sF6qFQ-wRyNUjsf86WTYAGA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192!5m1!1e1
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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1868 on: July 29, 2020, 02:00:21 PM »

The BGSs now list Rocky Mount NC and Durham. Kind of odd they just say "Durham" and not "Durham NC," but maybe they're concerned that someone might confuse Rocky Mount with the one in Virginia even though it's nowhere near I-95 or I-85. As far as I know, there is no Durham in Virginia.
North Carolina does a similar thing on US-17 with "Chesapeake VA". As far as I'm aware, there's no Chesapeake, NC to be confused with.
https://www.google.com/maps/@36.2497747,-76.3181705,3a,49y,69.65h,83.79t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sl0PQuo37dvM9j_gmo527Fg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!5m1!1e1
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1995hoo

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1869 on: July 29, 2020, 03:38:00 PM »

 :wow: :wow: :wow: :wow: :wow: :wow: :wow:

?s=20
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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1870 on: July 29, 2020, 04:11:09 PM »

The BGSs now list Rocky Mount NC and Durham. Kind of odd they just say "Durham" and not "Durham NC," but maybe they're concerned that someone might confuse Rocky Mount with the one in Virginia even though it's nowhere near I-95 or I-85. As far as I know, there is no Durham in Virginia.
North Carolina does a similar thing on US-17 with "Chesapeake VA". As far as I'm aware, there's no Chesapeake, NC to be confused with.
https://www.google.com/maps/@36.2497747,-76.3181705,3a,49y,69.65h,83.79t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sl0PQuo37dvM9j_gmo527Fg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!5m1!1e1

The only example I can think of in MD like this is the "York PA" signage for I-83 north from I-695.

Interestingly, once on I-83 the first pull-thru at exit 16 still includes "PA", but the next 2 after that at exits 18 & 20 drop the "PA".  Maybe SHA figures people have it figured out by that point? :-D
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mrsman

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1871 on: July 29, 2020, 04:15:34 PM »

The BGSs now list Rocky Mount NC and Durham. Kind of odd they just say "Durham" and not "Durham NC," but maybe they're concerned that someone might confuse Rocky Mount with the one in Virginia even though it's nowhere near I-95 or I-85. As far as I know, there is no Durham in Virginia.
North Carolina does a similar thing on US-17 with "Chesapeake VA". As far as I'm aware, there's no Chesapeake, NC to be confused with.
https://www.google.com/maps/@36.2497747,-76.3181705,3a,49y,69.65h,83.79t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sl0PQuo37dvM9j_gmo527Fg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!5m1!1e1

Many states by default will sign the state if the control is out of state, regardless of confusion issues.

Of course, there are some who would say that only the largest cities may avoid mention of the state.  I don't see a harm to indicating state name, especially if you are only adding two letters.

On roads, it seems that states are abbreviated with the postal codes most of the time.  However, they can use an alternate form of abbreviation.

AP Style Guide for newspaper articles:

Quote

When the name of a state name appears in the body of a text, spell it out. When the name of a city and state are used together, the name of the state should be abbreviated (except for Alaska, Hawaii, Idaho, Iowa, Maine, Ohio, Texas and Utah). States should also be abbreviated when used as part of a short-form political affiliation. Examples: He was travelling to Nashville, Tenn. The peace accord was signed in Dayton, Ohio. The storm began in Indiana and moved west toward Peoria, Ill.

Here is how each state is abbreviated in AP style (with the postal code abbreviations in parentheses):

State Abbreviations
Ala. (AL)   Neb. (NE)
Ariz. (AZ)   Nev. (NV)
Ark. (AR)   N.H. (NH)
Calif. (CA)   N.J. (NJ)
Colo. (CO)   N.M. (NM)
Conn. (CT)   N.Y. (NY)
Del. (DE)   N.C. (NC)
Fla. (FL)   N.D. (ND)
Ga. (GA)   Okla. (OK)
Ill. (IL)   Ore. (OR)
Ind. (IN)   Pa. (PA)
Kan. (KS)   R.I. (RI)
Ky. (KY)   S.C. (SC)
La. (LA)   S.D. (SD)
Md. (MD)   Tenn. (TN)
Mass. (MA)   Vt. (VT)
Mich. (MI)   Va. (VA)
Minn. (MN)   Wash. (WA)
Miss. (MS)   W.Va. (WV)
Mo. (MO)   Wis. (WI)
Mont. (MT)   Wyo. (WY)


AP style does not require the name of a state to accompany the names of the following 30 cities:

Cities Not Requiring State Names
Atlanta   Phoenix
Baltimore   Pittsburgh
Boston   St. Louis
Chicago   Salt Lake City
Cincinnati   San Antonio
Cleveland   San Diego
Dallas   San Francisco
Denver   Seattle
Detroit   Washington
Honolulu   
Houston   
Indianapolis   
Las Vegas   
Los Angeles   
Miami   
Milwaukee   
Minneapolis   
New Orleans   
New York   
Oklahoma City   
Philadelphia


While there are many cities outside of the above list that are well known to the American public, for smaller cities that are out of state, I would include the state abbreviation.


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bluecountry

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1872 on: July 30, 2020, 06:23:58 PM »

I believe that nearly all of us (except MD DOT) agree that the control on I-95 north of Baltimore should be Philadelphia for the entire state of MD.  NYC can be signed on mileage signs if there is room and if Philadelphia is already signed.

I suspect MDTA decides for the roads under its jurisdiction.

I still feel that Wilmington, Delaware (only) should get mention along I-95 in Maryland.  DelDOT mentions Baltimore several times on I-95 southbound in their state. 

I understand it to not be favored by MUTCD, but I think signing all three (Wilmington, Philadelphia and New York) would be appropriate - or at least two of them, and making sure that all get mentioned in terms of distance signs at least once or twice.

SHA does seem to follow MDTA's New York preference based on these signs.

I agree that all 3 cities should be used - I think MDTA could follow VDOT's approach with juggling the Hampton Roads cities on I-64 east leaving Richmond.  At the very least, maybe SHA could add signs on I-695 approaching exit 33 resembling this sign on I-295 approaching exit 28.  And then on I-95 itself, MDTA could cycle between cities on the various mileage signs as VDOT does with the mileage signs on I-64 (examples past exits 200, 205, 211, and 220).

Since MDTA's post-interchange distance signs typically use the next interchange, followed by a more local location, followed by the control city (example here), maybe MDTA could use the bottom line to cycle between Wilmington, Philadelphia, and New York.  Currently, Wilmington does make one appearance on the middle line following exit 100.
It bears repeating that even with the I-95 gap being eliminated by the Pennsylvania Turnpike interchange project, New York continues to be the control city for I-95 northbound between southwest Baltimore and the I-295 split south of Wilmington because most through traffic takes I-295 over the Delaware Memorial Bridge and to the New Jersey Turnpike instead of going through Wilmington, Philadelphia and over the Delaware River via the Pennsylvania/New Jersey turnpike connection. When the northbound control city becomes Wilmington past the 295 split and then Philadelphia once you get north of Wilmington's CBD, it's more intended for local travelers who aren't assumed to be going north of Philadelphia.

Meh I don't like it, especially since the NJTP has 'Wilmington' as the control city even though most thru traffic on that route is for the I-95 mid-Atlantic Balt/Wash.
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famartin

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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1873 on: July 30, 2020, 09:45:06 PM »

I believe that nearly all of us (except MD DOT) agree that the control on I-95 north of Baltimore should be Philadelphia for the entire state of MD.  NYC can be signed on mileage signs if there is room and if Philadelphia is already signed.

I suspect MDTA decides for the roads under its jurisdiction.

I still feel that Wilmington, Delaware (only) should get mention along I-95 in Maryland.  DelDOT mentions Baltimore several times on I-95 southbound in their state. 

I understand it to not be favored by MUTCD, but I think signing all three (Wilmington, Philadelphia and New York) would be appropriate - or at least two of them, and making sure that all get mentioned in terms of distance signs at least once or twice.

SHA does seem to follow MDTA's New York preference based on these signs.

I agree that all 3 cities should be used - I think MDTA could follow VDOT's approach with juggling the Hampton Roads cities on I-64 east leaving Richmond.  At the very least, maybe SHA could add signs on I-695 approaching exit 33 resembling this sign on I-295 approaching exit 28.  And then on I-95 itself, MDTA could cycle between cities on the various mileage signs as VDOT does with the mileage signs on I-64 (examples past exits 200, 205, 211, and 220).

Since MDTA's post-interchange distance signs typically use the next interchange, followed by a more local location, followed by the control city (example here), maybe MDTA could use the bottom line to cycle between Wilmington, Philadelphia, and New York.  Currently, Wilmington does make one appearance on the middle line following exit 100.
It bears repeating that even with the I-95 gap being eliminated by the Pennsylvania Turnpike interchange project, New York continues to be the control city for I-95 northbound between southwest Baltimore and the I-295 split south of Wilmington because most through traffic takes I-295 over the Delaware Memorial Bridge and to the New Jersey Turnpike instead of going through Wilmington, Philadelphia and over the Delaware River via the Pennsylvania/New Jersey turnpike connection. When the northbound control city becomes Wilmington past the 295 split and then Philadelphia once you get north of Wilmington's CBD, it's more intended for local travelers who aren't assumed to be going north of Philadelphia.

Meh I don't like it, especially since the NJTP has 'Wilmington' as the control city even though most thru traffic on that route is for the I-95 mid-Atlantic Balt/Wash.
That’s actually a good point. If Wilmington is not important northbound, why is it important southbound? (Reverse is true of Trenton, Newark and Camden...)
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Re: Maryland
« Reply #1874 on: July 31, 2020, 10:40:54 PM »

Quick tangential post: I drove north on I-95 twice in less than 24 hours between exits 77 and 85 earlier this week returning from a temporary daily errand, and in that time, the sticker for the Residence Inn off 85 at Ripken Stadium on the first lodging sign was replaced by one for the Comfort Inn (former FourPoints/Clarion) on the other side of the interchange. There are so many hotels off that exit that they're split between two blue service signs. I'm still waiting for them to add a sticker for the Marriott Fairfield that opened a few months ago. At least they're finally putting up Clearview signs in the vicinity of the interchange.
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