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Author Topic: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)  (Read 6377 times)

lstone19

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #50 on: February 14, 2020, 03:11:57 PM »

Correct me if I am wrong, but any adjustments between I-390 and I-355 on I-290 was predicated on the agreement with CP Rail for changing out the bridge west of Itasca. CP wants IDOT to foot the bill 100%.  Same CP Rail that was in a squabble with ISTHA over the I-390 link in Bensenville.

As I understand things, Metra owns that line although CP operates freight trains on it and has operational control (meaning it is dispatched by CP dispatchers and is in the CP employee’s timetable (for a railroad, the employee’s timetable is where speed limits and special instructions are listed)). But I believe any capital spending is controlled by Metra.

It is true that Metra owns most of the ROW, CP Rail has trackage and haulage rights along that specific route, all the way into the city to service what few remaining online customers are left.

This would include the overpass at I-290 in Itasca.  However when IDOT proposed the changes to the bridge, it was CP Rail who complained the loudest because they use the line to get freight in and out between Bensenville and Spaulding Yards.

CP Rail owns the line from Sabula to Spaulding (Elgin). Metra owns 2 tracks from Spaulding to CUS except for tracks from Bryn Maur to the Bensenville Yard to the IHB. Metra only owns the two tracks on the north side of the yard, but the rest belongs to CP.

Some technical corrections (not that any of this is road related):
- Spaulding is the crossing of the line (Metra Milwaukee District West) with the Canadian National former Elgin Joliet & Eastern west of Bartlett. CP ownership ends west of the Big Timber Road station.
- Going east, CP operational control and freight rights end at Western Ave. East of Western Avenue to Canal St. (where Amtrak ownership begins), the passenger main tracks are Metra owned and dispatched while the freight rights to now just one industry, for historical reasons, are now with Norfolk Southern as successor to Conrail, before that Penn Central, before that the Pennsylvania, and originally a railroad nicknamed the Panhandle that ended up as a Pennsylvania subsidiary over 100 years ago which was the original owner of the north approach tracks to Union Station. 

Anyway, just as we find the history of some roads fascinating, so is the history of some railroads.

As for CP's interest, I suspect it would have to do with maintaining capacity just as with the high-speed shoofly that is to be built for where the BNSF crosses I-294 while that bridge is lengthened. Weekdays, CP is constrained to operating between Metra's hourly off-peak service and I suspect CP's concern is making sure any long-term construction doesn't end up closing their freight windows between Metra trains.
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edwaleni

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #51 on: February 14, 2020, 10:03:31 PM »

Correct me if I am wrong, but any adjustments between I-390 and I-355 on I-290 was predicated on the agreement with CP Rail for changing out the bridge west of Itasca. CP wants IDOT to foot the bill 100%.  Same CP Rail that was in a squabble with ISTHA over the I-390 link in Bensenville.

As I understand things, Metra owns that line although CP operates freight trains on it and has operational control (meaning it is dispatched by CP dispatchers and is in the CP employee’s timetable (for a railroad, the employee’s timetable is where speed limits and special instructions are listed)). But I believe any capital spending is controlled by Metra.

It is true that Metra owns most of the ROW, CP Rail has trackage and haulage rights along that specific route, all the way into the city to service what few remaining online customers are left.

This would include the overpass at I-290 in Itasca.  However when IDOT proposed the changes to the bridge, it was CP Rail who complained the loudest because they use the line to get freight in and out between Bensenville and Spaulding Yards.

CP Rail owns the line from Sabula to Spaulding (Elgin). Metra owns 2 tracks from Spaulding to CUS except for tracks from Bryn Maur to the Bensenville Yard to the IHB. Metra only owns the two tracks on the north side of the yard, but the rest belongs to CP.

Some technical corrections (not that any of this is road related):
- Spaulding is the crossing of the line (Metra Milwaukee District West) with the Canadian National former Elgin Joliet & Eastern west of Bartlett. CP ownership ends west of the Big Timber Road station.
- Going east, CP operational control and freight rights end at Western Ave. East of Western Avenue to Canal St. (where Amtrak ownership begins), the passenger main tracks are Metra owned and dispatched while the freight rights to now just one industry, for historical reasons, are now with Norfolk Southern as successor to Conrail, before that Penn Central, before that the Pennsylvania, and originally a railroad nicknamed the Panhandle that ended up as a Pennsylvania subsidiary over 100 years ago which was the original owner of the north approach tracks to Union Station. 

Anyway, just as we find the history of some roads fascinating, so is the history of some railroads.

As for CP's interest, I suspect it would have to do with maintaining capacity just as with the high-speed shoofly that is to be built for where the BNSF crosses I-294 while that bridge is lengthened. Weekdays, CP is constrained to operating between Metra's hourly off-peak service and I suspect CP's concern is making sure any long-term construction doesn't end up closing their freight windows between Metra trains.

I stand corrected.
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JoePCool14

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #52 on: February 16, 2020, 10:20:33 AM »

Replying to the discussion about Flight 191, I personally don't believe naming the highway after that incident is really necessary. However, a sign marking the location of the crash site would be more appropriate.
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Beltway

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #53 on: February 16, 2020, 01:47:41 PM »

Replying to the discussion about Flight 191, I personally don't believe naming the highway after that incident is really necessary. However, a sign marking the location of the crash site would be more appropriate.
Wikipedia:
For 32 years there was no permanent memorial to the victims.  Funding was obtained for a memorial in 2009, through a two-year effort by the sixth-grade class of Decatur Classical School in Chicago.  The memorial, a 2-foot-high (0.6 m) concave wall with interlocking bricks displaying the names of the crash victims, was formally dedicated in a ceremony on October 15, 2011.  The memorial is located at Lake Park at the northwest corner of Lee and Touhy Avenues, two miles east of the crash site.

https://www.dpparks.org/parks-facilities/lake-park/flight-191-memorial/
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The Ghostbuster

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #54 on: February 17, 2020, 03:34:51 PM »

I think a sign in remembrance of Flight 191 would probably be enough. I merely made the suggestion to name the highway after the road as a way to stimulate a conversation on this board. The highway will likely remain named as O'Hare's Western Bypass.
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edwaleni

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #55 on: February 17, 2020, 04:47:34 PM »

I think a sign in remembrance of Flight 191 would probably be enough. I merely made the suggestion to name the highway after the road as a way to stimulate a conversation on this board. The highway will likely remain named as O'Hare's Western Bypass.

I share the sentiments, but I can't imagine it keeping that name long.

The days of ISTHA roads keeping their generic titles are over.

At this point it could be named the Kobe Bryant Highway. But it will probably be someone a little more political.

Since most of our former govs are in jail or just coming out, and its not "big enough" for a mayor, and too small for a president.

20% more or less will reside in DuPage County, I will guess it will be some old dead Illinois politico that served in Congress.

It will be the least controversial.

John McAuley Palmer (1817-1900), a US Senator for Illinois (1891-1897) was elected as a Republican, but switched to being a Democrat later, and helped get Abraham Lincoln elected as President. He ran for President as a Democrat on the platform of keeping the gold standard, but was 79 years old. He was a Civil War general.

There is also an elementary school in Chicago named after him.

He checks all the right buttons. Easy to say on the WBBM traffic report on the 10's.  "No delays on the Palmer".
« Last Edit: February 17, 2020, 04:49:44 PM by edwaleni »
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ilpt4u

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #56 on: February 17, 2020, 09:50:39 PM »

For a State that claims to be the Land of Lincoln, the fact there is no Lincoln Freeway/Expressway/Tollway has always seemed odd to me

And before anyone objects due to Lincoln Highway, IDOT has no problem with having a Kingery Expressway and Kingery Highway

Sorry, Adlai Stevenson, but I-55 should have been named after Lincoln, not you. And kept the name the whole route between Chicago and St Louis thru Lincoln and Springfield instead of just Cook County, but that name change is not happening anytime soon
« Last Edit: February 17, 2020, 09:54:19 PM by ilpt4u »
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Big John

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #57 on: February 17, 2020, 09:55:42 PM »

Knowing Illinois, would they name it after Obama?
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ilpt4u

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #58 on: February 17, 2020, 10:01:25 PM »

Knowing Illinois, would they name it after Obama?
Not yet. We waited until Reagan passed until I-88 was renamed from the East-West Tollway to the Ronald Reagan Tollway

Still waiting on the Richard J Daley Freeway/Expressway/Tollway, or possibly the Richard M Daley Freeway/Expressway/Tollway
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Beltway

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #59 on: February 17, 2020, 10:10:46 PM »

For a State that claims to be the Land of Lincoln, the fact there is no Lincoln Freeway/Expressway/Tollway has always seemed odd to me

No Lincoln International Airport, either.
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ilpt4u

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #60 on: February 17, 2020, 10:15:49 PM »

For a State that claims to be the Land of Lincoln, the fact there is no Lincoln Freeway/Expressway/Tollway has always seemed odd to me

No Lincoln International Airport, either.
Do have Abraham Lincoln Capital Airport/SPI in Springfield
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SEWIGuy

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #61 on: February 18, 2020, 08:29:14 AM »

For a State that claims to be the Land of Lincoln, the fact there is no Lincoln Freeway/Expressway/Tollway has always seemed odd to me

And before anyone objects due to Lincoln Highway, IDOT has no problem with having a Kingery Expressway and Kingery Highway

Sorry, Adlai Stevenson, but I-55 should have been named after Lincoln, not you. And kept the name the whole route between Chicago and St Louis thru Lincoln and Springfield instead of just Cook County, but that name change is not happening anytime soon


You realize there are tons of things named after Lincoln in Illinois right?  Including something like 90 schools and Lincoln Park in Chicago, which are IMO a much better things to name after someone than a strip of concrete.
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edwaleni

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #62 on: February 18, 2020, 11:20:00 AM »

Knowing Illinois, would they name it after Obama?

There is already a constituency that wants to rename I-57 south of I-80 the Barack Obama Highway.

US 30 is already Lincoln Highway.  The Abraham Lincoln Bridge is the I-39 bridge over the Illinois River.

The other option was to name the bypass the Charles Percy Tollway, but he was a Republican Senator and Chicago Dems would object. That is why Palmer works. he was both GOP and Dem.
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The Ghostbuster

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #63 on: February 19, 2020, 06:03:53 PM »

Hopefully, if the West O'Hare Bypass does get a new name, they don't name it after the recently-pardoned ex-governor Rod Blagojevich.
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lstone19

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #64 on: February 19, 2020, 06:16:19 PM »

Hopefully, if the West O'Hare Bypass does get a new name, they don't name it after the recently-pardoned ex-governor Rod Blagojevich.

When I moved to the Chicago area some 20+ years ago, I wondered why most of the roads (and in particular the tollways) were referred to by the locals by their number rather than their name. They can name it what they want but I doubt I'll refer to it as anything other than 490. To the extent I use names for the tollways (less and less as time goes by), they're still the Tri-State, East-West, Northwest, and North-South and never for the latter three, today's official names for them.
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mgk920

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #65 on: February 20, 2020, 04:04:02 AM »

Hopefully, if the West O'Hare Bypass does get a new name, they don't name it after the recently-pardoned ex-governor Rod Blagojevich.

Blago was not pardoned, only his sentence was commuted to time served.  The conviction is still on his record.

Mike
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Joe The Dragon

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #66 on: February 20, 2020, 01:27:26 PM »

and blago may have to gift the name to trump.
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Brandon

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #67 on: February 20, 2020, 01:30:54 PM »

and blago may have to gift the name to trump.

:rofl:

[rant]I absolutely detest that he got out early.  He violated the public trust, and still doesn't fucking understand that what he did was so fucking wrong!  :angry: :banghead:[/rant]

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SEWIGuy

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #68 on: February 20, 2020, 02:37:55 PM »

and blago may have to gift the name to trump.

:rofl:

[rant]I absolutely detest that he got out early.  He violated the public trust, and still doesn't fucking understand that what he did was so fucking wrong!  :angry: :banghead:[/rant]




Look who commuted the sentence.
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hobsini2

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #69 on: February 22, 2020, 06:07:54 PM »

Knowing Illinois, would they name it after Obama?
Not yet. We waited until Reagan passed until I-88 was renamed from the East-West Tollway to the Ronald Reagan Tollway

Still waiting on the Richard J Daley Freeway/Expressway/Tollway, or possibly the Richard M Daley Freeway/Expressway/Tollway

Actually, officially, I-55 has 2 names. The Stevenson and The "Barack Obama Presidential Expressway". There are a few of those signs up. One is in place on I-55 SB at I-294.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2020, 06:09:56 PM by hobsini2 »
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JoePCool14

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #70 on: February 24, 2020, 09:35:17 AM »

Knowing Illinois, would they name it after Obama?
Not yet. We waited until Reagan passed until I-88 was renamed from the East-West Tollway to the Ronald Reagan Tollway

Still waiting on the Richard J Daley Freeway/Expressway/Tollway, or possibly the Richard M Daley Freeway/Expressway/Tollway

Actually, officially, I-55 has 2 names. The Stevenson and The "Barack Obama Presidential Expressway". There are a few of those signs up. One is in place on I-55 SB at I-294.

It would be pretty egregious to try and name yet another highway after him, especially considering he's only been out of office for about 3 years. If you want to slap names on highways, roads, etc., it would be nice if (a) you waited a bit longer to do so, possibly after that person is out of the active political circle, and (b) not name several main roads in the same region after the same person at the same time.

More likely, 490 will just be named after some random corrupt Illinois politician. In an ideal world, it would receive no other name (at least in my opinion).
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edwaleni

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #71 on: February 24, 2020, 11:18:41 AM »

Knowing Illinois, would they name it after Obama?
Not yet. We waited until Reagan passed until I-88 was renamed from the East-West Tollway to the Ronald Reagan Tollway

Still waiting on the Richard J Daley Freeway/Expressway/Tollway, or possibly the Richard M Daley Freeway/Expressway/Tollway

Actually, officially, I-55 has 2 names. The Stevenson and The "Barack Obama Presidential Expressway". There are a few of those signs up. One is in place on I-55 SB at I-294.

It would be pretty egregious to try and name yet another highway after him, especially considering he's only been out of office for about 3 years. If you want to slap names on highways, roads, etc., it would be nice if (a) you waited a bit longer to do so, possibly after that person is out of the active political circle, and (b) not name several main roads in the same region after the same person at the same time.

More likely, 490 will just be named after some random corrupt Illinois politician. In an ideal world, it would receive no other name (at least in my opinion).

My brother suggested it be called the Ernie Banks or Minnie Minoso. He said we already have the Walter Payton Highway (US-34).  I don't think anyone wants to call US-51 the Butkus.
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ilpt4u

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #72 on: February 25, 2020, 12:56:10 AM »

My brother suggested it be called the Ernie Banks or Minnie Minoso. He said we already have the Walter Payton Highway (US-34).  I don't think anyone wants to call US-51 the Butkus.
If US 51 connected Chicago to Urbana-Champaign (instead of US 45) I bet it would already be the Dick Butkus Highway

When did IDOT designate US 34 the Payton Highway? Is it actually signed anywhere?

I thought, not too long after Sweetness’s death, that Ogden Ave should have been renamed Walter Payton Ave...this is not quite the same, but similar
« Last Edit: February 25, 2020, 01:09:08 AM by ilpt4u »
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Konza

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #73 on: February 25, 2020, 01:01:38 AM »

They should change the route number to 890 and name the highway after Coach Ditka.
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ilpt4u

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Re: I-490 (Western O'Hare Bypass)
« Reply #74 on: February 25, 2020, 01:11:48 AM »

They should change the route number to 890 and name the highway after Coach Ditka.
“Welcome to the Mike Ditka Tollway” (with the Ditka “flying the bird” Picture) would be a great Welcoming sign to the roadway
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