Coronavirus pandemic

[webny99]

I am curious as to how this virus will affect AADT stats.

Without a doubt it's having a tremendous, unprecedented impact. Around here traffic on most roads has easily dropped by 50% or more. Afternoons are a bit closer to normal, but the morning "rush" is literally non-existent; maybe 20% of former traffic levels on many roads. Besides businesses being closed and people working from home, schools are also closed. Two huge traffic generators basically shuttered overnight. And then you factor in anything entertainment-related or large-event related also being cancelled. And restaurants. Basically we are testing the limits of finding out just how few of our trips really are essential.

I would say all state and local DOT's should postpone all AADT counting until this is over.
I saw a counter set up a few miles from home the other day and was kind of hoping they'd just throw out whatever data they collect and redo it next year.

[jeffandnicole]

There was an article on NJ.com, mostly copying a Oregon article about their temporary self service. Honestly it was the oddest article with some head-scratchers of reasons. Supposedly pump jockies can't maintain the 6 foot distance, yet I'm sure the same stations have convenience stores inside the building where cashiers will be within 6 feet of customers. Apparently they are allowing pumps to be left on if no one is working at all.

https://www.nj.com/coronavirus/2020/03/oregon-lifts-prohibition-on-self-service-gas-due-to-coronavirus-nj-unlikely-to-do-it.html

[bandit957]

For what it's worth, the number of new U.S. cases on Worldometer dropped today, and is less than what it was even 2 days ago.

Even using a 2-day rolling total, it's dropped for the first time since at least March 3, maybe earlier.

[Rothman]

NYSDOT is plowing ahead with counts to capture the effect...hopefully with enough care on how to handle them in the future when this is over.

[US71]

For what it's worth, the number of new U.S. cases on Worldometer dropped today, and is less than what it was even 2 days ago.

Even using a 2-day rolling total, it's dropped for the first time since at least March 3, maybe earlier.

But there may be people who have it but don't show symptoms yet. So hold off on that victory lap.

[bandit957]

But there may be people who have it but don't show symptoms yet. So hold off on that victory lap.

I know there have been all along.

[hbelkins]

If I'm getting gas at a station where the gas pumps don't have hold-open latches, I slide the gas cap under the nozzle handle and it works perfectly. (Although the work vehicle I sometimes drive, a Jeep, doesn't even have a gas cap now, just a flap on the filler tube behind the door flap.)

I figure enough gas gets on the pump handle to kill any virii anyway, so I haven't been too worried about it, although I've been using hand sanitizer immediately after pumping gas.

[Brandon]

For what it's worth, the number of new U.S. cases on Worldometer dropped today, and is less than what it was even 2 days ago.

Even using a 2-day rolling total, it's dropped for the first time since at least March 3, maybe earlier.

But there may be people who have it but don't show symptoms yet. So hold off on that victory lap.

Around 80% of people never even show symptoms anyway, and it's debatable as to how contagious they actually are.

[jeffandnicole]

For what it's worth, the number of new U.S. cases on Worldometer dropped today, and is less than what it was even 2 days ago.

Even using a 2-day rolling total, it's dropped for the first time since at least March 3, maybe earlier.

But there may be people who have it but don't show symptoms yet. So hold off on that victory lap.

Around 80% of people never even show symptoms anyway, and it's debatable as to how contagious they actually are.

Very contagious?  No.

Somewhat contagious?  Probably.

While most of the early 'victims' who got Covid-19 could have their source traced, we are now over 100k with the virus in the US.  Much of that has some via contact with others, many of whom had no or light symptoms, or left behind something (ie: on a door handle) that the next person would've picked up.  The more prone you are to catching something from someone else, the more likely you can get something from incidental contact.

For what it's worth, these people complaining about kids handing out playing basketball and such most likely also have gone out to a supermarket or convenience store to pick up supplies.  They're just as guilty as being out in a group setting as the kids playing a game. 

When my wife and I take walks, I get this feeling that people are looking at us as if we're not practicing social distancing, even though in the privacy of our home we're sitting and eating next to each other, and sleeping in the same bed.

[NWI_Irish96]

For what it's worth, these people complaining about kids handing out playing basketball and such most likely also have gone out to a supermarket or convenience store to pick up supplies.  They're just as guilty as being out in a group setting as the kids playing a game. 

First of all, getting groceries is a necessary activity and is going to require some risk of exposure.  Basketball is not a required activity.

Secondly, you can maneuver your way through a grocery store without close contact.  Basketball requires being in close contact. 

My wife is a respiratory therapist and is disconnecting ventilators from (dead) patients every night now.  If people saw what she saw, they would be staying 100% inside their homes except for once or twice per week grocery trips.

[D-Dey65]

For what it's worth, the number of new U.S. cases on Worldometer dropped today, and is less than what it was even 2 days ago.

Even using a 2-day rolling total, it's dropped for the first time since at least March 3, maybe earlier.

Gee, that's funny. I've heard the opposite. On either Thursday or Friday, I heard the number of cases broke the 100,000 mark. Yesterday, I heard it broke 200,000.

[hotdogPi]

For what it's worth, the number of new U.S. cases on Worldometer dropped today, and is less than what it was even 2 days ago.

Even using a 2-day rolling total, it's dropped for the first time since at least March 3, maybe earlier.

Gee, that's funny. I've heard the opposite. On either Thursday or Friday, I heard the number of cases broke the 100,000 mark. Yesterday, I heard it broke 200,000.

It hasn't hit 200,000 yet. You're probably thinking of 1,000 vs. 2,000 deaths.

[Henry]

As it is now, I'm working from home thanks to the stay-at-home order, so I haven't had too much time to be on this forum, but I'll find some breaks here and there.

[webny99]

NYSDOT is plowing ahead with counts to capture the effect...hopefully with enough care on how to handle them in the future when this is over.

I know March is usually a big month for traffic counts - I had seen quite a few around here at the beginning of the month.
I'm fine with them doing counts, as long as they're used only as a historical data point and not to justify long-term decisions.

[LM117]

Our governor is planning to make a "major announcement" during his press briefing today. Safe bet that VA is fixing to join the list of stay-at-home states.

[J N Winkler]

Secondly, you can maneuver your way through a grocery store without close contact.  Basketball requires being in close contact.

In my weekly trips to the grocery store since this crisis arrived in Kansas, I've observed a wide spread in people's understanding of what social distancing means.  It was not until last Saturday's trip that I saw my first person wearing a mask, and there is still no shortage of people who don't realize that if the aisle is only six feet wide and they are standing still while trying to decide whether to put an item in the cart, they are blocking the way for everyone else.

UPDATE!: A state-wide stay-at-home order goes into effect for Kansas on Monday

My home county (Jefferson) went into 'lockdown' this morning [3/28/20], along with Osage County.

A concern about the governor's order has surfaced in the last day or two:  it exempts churches and gun shops.  It also suspends all lockdown orders at the county level and prohibits counties from making orders that are less or more restrictive while it is in effect.  Exempt entities are still expected to practice social distancing, but the limit of 10 people gathering does not apply.

[kalvado]

Secondly, you can maneuver your way through a grocery store without close contact.  Basketball requires being in close contact.

In my weekly trips to the grocery store since this crisis arrived in Kansas, I've observed a wide spread in people's understanding of what social distancing means.  It was not until last Saturday's trip that I saw my first person wearing a mask, and there is still no shortage of people who don't realize that if the aisle is only six feet wide and they are standing still while trying to decide whether to put an item in the cart, they are blocking the way for everyone else.

Turn your back to them, hold your breath and pass.

[GaryV]

A concern about the governor's order has surfaced in the last day or two:  it exempts churches and gun shops.  It also suspends all lockdown orders at the county level and prohibits counties from making orders that are less or more restrictive while it is in effect.  Exempt entities are still expected to practice social distancing, but the limit of 10 people gathering does not apply.

Because of separation of church and state, orders cannot apply to churches.  However it would be the height of irresponsibility for a church flaunt that status.

Perhaps gun shops are exempt because of 2nd Amendment issues.

[hotdogPi]

A concern about the governor's order has surfaced in the last day or two:  it exempts churches and gun shops.  It also suspends all lockdown orders at the county level and prohibits counties from making orders that are less or more restrictive while it is in effect.  Exempt entities are still expected to practice social distancing, but the limit of 10 people gathering does not apply.

Because of separation of church and state, orders cannot apply to churches.  However it would be the height of irresponsibility for a church flaunt that status.

Perhaps gun shops are exempt because of 2nd Amendment issues.

Because of separation of church and state, orders cannot apply to churches differently from other businesses – making an exception to keep them open is not allowed.

[GaryV]

A concern about the governor's order has surfaced in the last day or two:  it exempts churches and gun shops.  It also suspends all lockdown orders at the county level and prohibits counties from making orders that are less or more restrictive while it is in effect.  Exempt entities are still expected to practice social distancing, but the limit of 10 people gathering does not apply.

Because of separation of church and state, orders cannot apply to churches.  However it would be the height of irresponsibility for a church flaunt that status.

Perhaps gun shops are exempt because of 2nd Amendment issues.

Because of separation of church and state, orders cannot apply to churches differently from other businesses – making an exception to keep them open is not allowed.

Because the government cannot restrict the practice of religion, religious services must be exempt.

[hbelkins]

The Constitution does not require "separation of church and state." Wish I had $1 for every time I've read or heard that it does. What the Constitution (First Amendment) does stipulate is that the government cannot establish an official religion, or prohibit anyone from worshipping freely as they see fit. It also does not permit the government to restrict the ability of the people to peaceably assemble.

I'm curious as to whether or not we will see any court challenges to some of these orders. In Kentucky, the very first thing the governor did was to encourage churches not to hold services. Then, he prohibited churches from holding services. Now, gatherings of more than 10 people are prohibited by executive order. I saw a story over the weekend that someone in Maryland had hosted a party with around 60 people in attendance, in defiance of the governor's order prohibiting gatherings of more than 10, and had been arrested or cited for it. I wonder if his lawyer will cite the assembly clause of the First Amendment as a defense.

Saw this morning that DiBlasio has stated that churches/synagogues in NYC that continue to hold services in defiance of his order might be permanently shut down. Now, that will almost definitely draw a court challenge if it happens.

As for gun shops being excluded, I don't think that's a Second Amendment issue. Some states actually address the closure of gun shops via executive order in their statutes.

[LM117]

Our governor is planning to make a "major announcement" during his press briefing today. Safe bet that VA is fixing to join the list of stay-at-home states.

Aaaaaand here's the stay-at-home order.

https://www.governor.virginia.gov/newsroom/all-releases/2020/march/headline-855702-en.html

[SectorZ]

As for gun shops being excluded, I don't think that's a Second Amendment issue. Some states actually address the closure of gun shops via executive order in their statutes.

The gun shops staying open as well was per Dept. of Homeland Security guidelines.

[sprjus4]

Our governor is planning to make a "major announcement" during his press briefing today. Safe bet that VA is fixing to join the list of stay-at-home states.

Aaaaaand here's the stay-at-home order.

https://www.governor.virginia.gov/newsroom/all-releases/2020/march/headline-855702-en.html

Didn't see that one coming... 

And until June 10, wow.

[bandit957]

The Constitution does not require "separation of church and state." Wish I had $1 for every time I've read or heard that it does. What the Constitution (First Amendment) does stipulate is that the government cannot establish an official religion, or prohibit anyone from worshipping freely as they see fit.

That's pretty much the same thing.

That said, limits on private gatherings must have only a limited time and scope. Government isn't allowed to arbitrarily prohibit all private gatherings, especially when these gatherings pose no risk to the community.

I saw a story over the weekend that someone in Maryland had hosted a party with around 60 people in attendance, in defiance of the governor's order prohibiting gatherings of more than 10, and had been arrested or cited for it. I wonder if his lawyer will cite the assembly clause of the First Amendment as a defense.

If it was a party of 60, a court challenge probably wouldn't work. The numbers and timeframes of any public policy are supposed to have a basis that is not arbitrary. If the order said no gatherings of more than 3, and he had a private gathering of 10, I think he'd have a case. If a constitutional right can be completely gutted by executive action, it's not worth the paper it's printed on.

We can be creative about avoiding these orders, as long as we're safe in the process. Take the upcoming Cincinnati roadmeet, for example. Instead of saying it's one event with 11 people, I can say it's 11 separate events each with one person. If we use an outdoor public space, and everyone is at least 6 feet apart, it's safe. Six feet isn't a huge distance. When the pirates drank lime juice to prevent scurvy, people thought that was unusual, but it worked. If we have 11 events spaced 6 feet apart to prevent a virus that should have been stamped out months ago, people will say, "Wow, people back in 2020 sure were weird." But it works. Of course, none of that should matter when it's almost June, but at the glacial pace at fighting this virus, who knows?