Las Vegas Boulevard

[DenverBrian]

The whole point of the Strip is to look at all the pretty lights and stuff. Can't really do that in a tunnel.

Let Fremont be Fremont and LVB be LVB.

Um, you don't have to be in a vehicle to look at all the pretty lights and stuff. Plenty of people do that while walking.

Y'all are so blinders-on to the effects of the road that you can't see the after effects. Putting LV Blvd underground opens up land - valuable land - at the surface. Land upon which could be built restaurants and shops, touristy stuff, etc. Las Vegas has proven time and time again that rubes will spend boatloads of cash on things that are shiny and flashy.

If Hard Rock can spend $1B to acquire The Mirage and then another $1-3B to renovate and add a 700-foot guitar hotel building where the volcano used to be...then I posit the combined casinos have $20B or more to put The Strip underground if they knew they'd make $60B or more on new retail in a a pedestrian mall ala Fremont Street. Just sayin'.

[Scott5114]

The main thing that Frank Sinatra (and its sort-of-eastern-counterpart Koval Lane) accomplishes is being a backdoor to the Strip properties for the employees. So if you're going to improve Frank Sinatra, you need to improve Koval too, for the benefit of the properties on the east side of the Strip. Unfortunately, Koval tees out at Twain, and it also is part of the stupid Formula One track. (Said stupid Formula One track is also another reason LVB isn't going to get removed or buried anytime soon. Maybe after their contract with Uncle Clark is up.)

You could maybe improve Paradise Road, but that'd really only be useful north of Twain. South of there, it's far enough away that you may as well take Maryland Parkway or Valley View or what have you.

Also, since someone mentioned Desert Inn...I'm a little pissed that this amazing "super-arterial" is basically useless because it takes longer to get through the DI/Paradise intersection than it does any of the intersections with LVB. (Yesterday I lost 20 minutes to it because it turns out the damn thing was closed, so I had to go up to Sahara anyway.)

Actually, now that I think about it, you could turn Las Vegas Blvd into a similar idea that Wacker Dr is in Chicago. The Lower Blvd would be 2 or 3 lanes each way with limited access, say once a mile, for through traffic. The Upper Blvd would be for the tourists and trucks. I could see a scenario where it would access points at Mandalay Bay Rd, Flamingo Rd, Desert Inn Rd, and Sahara Ave. I know it's a bit fictional but it is related.

This would be a neat way to handle the service traffic currently handled by Frank Sinatra and Koval, but... 

...it would be incredibly disruptive to build since you'd basically have to tear up the entire Strip all at once. Some businesses sued the county over lost revenue because the street they were on was closed for a few days due to Formula One. I can just imagine Bill Hornbuckle and Anthony Carano showing up to a Clark County Commission meeting raising holy hell over this.

[Scott5114]

The whole point of the Strip is to look at all the pretty lights and stuff. Can't really do that in a tunnel.

Let Fremont be Fremont and LVB be LVB.

Um, you don't have to be in a vehicle to look at all the pretty lights and stuff. Plenty of people do that while walking.

Y'all are so blinders-on to the effects of the road that you can't see the after effects. Putting LV Blvd underground opens up land - valuable land - at the surface. Land upon which could be built restaurants and shops, touristy stuff, etc. Las Vegas has proven time and time again that rubes will spend boatloads of cash on things that are shiny and flashy.

If Hard Rock can spend $1B to acquire The Mirage and then another $1-3B to renovate and add a 700-foot guitar hotel building where the volcano used to be...then I posit the combined casinos have $20B or more to put The Strip underground if they knew they'd make $60B or more on new retail in a a pedestrian mall ala Fremont Street. Just sayin'.

My guess is the reason the casinos don't push for this is because they wouldn't make $60B or more on putting LVB underground. Fremont does great, but it doesn't do so great that it puts a dent in Strip visitation. Which means that the ROI just isn't there to Fremontize the Strip.

If people want Fremont, they know where to find it. Presumably, all the people staying on the Strip are there because they don't want Fremont.

[kernals12]

Actually, now that I think about it, you could turn Las Vegas Blvd into a similar idea that Wacker Dr is in Chicago. The Lower Blvd would be 2 or 3 lanes each way with limited access, say once a mile, for through traffic. The Upper Blvd would be for the tourists and trucks. I could see a scenario where it would access points at Mandalay Bay Rd, Flamingo Rd, Desert Inn Rd, and Sahara Ave. I know it's a bit fictional but it is related.

Such a road already exists, except it's 12 lanes, it's called interstate 15.


The traffic on the Strip is almost entirely people visiting the casinos.

[jeffandnicole]

Actually, now that I think about it, you could turn Las Vegas Blvd into a similar idea that Wacker Dr is in Chicago. The Lower Blvd would be 2 or 3 lanes each way with limited access, say once a mile, for through traffic. The Upper Blvd would be for the tourists and trucks. I could see a scenario where it would access points at Mandalay Bay Rd, Flamingo Rd, Desert Inn Rd, and Sahara Ave. I know it's a bit fictional but it is related.

Such a road already exists, except it's 12 lanes, it's called interstate 15.


The traffic on the Strip is almost entirely people visiting the casinos.

I was about to say...there's already a bypass for traffic wanting to go past the Strip area.  And numerous other parallel North-South streets to the Strip.

Vehicles on the Strip are generally on the Strip purposely.

[kernals12]

I really don't think anything needs to get fixed with Las Vegas Blvd, the road. It's fine to drive on. Walking on the sidewalks next to it? If you're a person that enjoys walking faster than a sloth, it's an exercise in restraint.

I think airport-style moving walkways would be quite an effective solution on paper. But given how frequently I saw escalators that were out of order while I was there, I don't think that would work either.

[Plutonic Panda]

I am a huge supporter of tunnels and the only tunnel that needs to be placed here is for a heavy rail subway.

[kernals12]

I am a huge supporter of tunnels and the only tunnel that needs to be placed here is for a heavy rail subway.

The need for trains to stop to let other people get on and off makes them slow, hence the failure of the monorail.

[Plutonic Panda]

I am a huge supporter of tunnels and the only tunnel that needs to be placed here is for a heavy rail subway.

The need for trains to stop to let other people get on and off makes them slow, hence the failure of the monorail.

Wtf. And way from the the airport to Fremont would be much faster than driving. I say this as someone who loves driving the blvd but the monorail is more or less a tourist ride than meaningful transit. Vegas has grown where it needs a subway.

[RoadWarrior56]

My biggest issue with the monorail is that is was never extended south to connect with the airport.

[Max Rockatansky]

I hear those things are awfully loud.

[PColumbus73]

A downside of the monorail is that it's lack of visibility, and the fact that people have to navigate through the casinos to get to it from Las Vegas Blvd, the east half of the Blvd at that. Naturally, the casinos have an incentive to try and capture that foot traffic and thus it's not in their interest to make it easier to get to the stations. The individual people-movers are more geared to move people between properties, not provide a general mass transit service, again, they would prefer to keep potential customers within their properties.

Quoting my previous response since it's relevant.

Additionally, the monorail began as a shuttle between casino properties and was grafted to serve as a semi-public transit line. Would be similar if the monorail at Disney World was expanded as a rapid transit system for Orlando, sure it could work, but it wasn't designed for everyday commuters.

[jeffandnicole]

My biggest issue with the monorail is that is was never extended south to connect with the airport.

A downside of the monorail is that it's lack of visibility, and the fact that people have to navigate through the casinos to get to it from Las Vegas Blvd, the east half of the Blvd at that. Naturally, the casinos have an incentive to try and capture that foot traffic and thus it's not in their interest to make it easier to get to the stations. The individual people-movers are more geared to move people between properties, not provide a general mass transit service, again, they would prefer to keep potential customers within their properties.

Quoting my previous response since it's relevant.

Additionally, the monorail began as a shuttle between casino properties and was grafted to serve as a semi-public transit line. Would be similar if the monorail at Disney World was expanded as a rapid transit system for Orlando, sure it could work, but it wasn't designed for everyday commuters.

When the monorail was first proposed, it was to go to the airport.  But the Taxi Lobby in Vegas, which transported a very high percentage of travelers from the airport to the casino hotels, was very much against it and was able to get that portion of the line cancelled. They built the line anyway but being it was stuck in the back of the casinos with very little signage, it never was well traveled except for some convention business.

Then Uber/Lyft became a thing, which the taxi lobby couldn't overcome.

[1995hoo]

I am a huge supporter of tunnels and the only tunnel that needs to be placed here is for a heavy rail subway.

The need for trains to stop to let other people get on and off makes them slow, hence the failure of the monorail.

Wtf. And way from the the airport to Fremont would be much faster than driving. I say this as someone who loves driving the blvd but the monorail is more or less a tourist ride than meaningful transit. Vegas has grown where it needs a subway.

Notice what it says under his avatar. You have to take his comments with a significant grain of salt.

[PColumbus73]

My biggest issue with the monorail is that is was never extended south to connect with the airport.

A downside of the monorail is that it's lack of visibility, and the fact that people have to navigate through the casinos to get to it from Las Vegas Blvd, the east half of the Blvd at that. Naturally, the casinos have an incentive to try and capture that foot traffic and thus it's not in their interest to make it easier to get to the stations. The individual people-movers are more geared to move people between properties, not provide a general mass transit service, again, they would prefer to keep potential customers within their properties.

Quoting my previous response since it's relevant.

Additionally, the monorail began as a shuttle between casino properties and was grafted to serve as a semi-public transit line. Would be similar if the monorail at Disney World was expanded as a rapid transit system for Orlando, sure it could work, but it wasn't designed for everyday commuters.

When the monorail was first proposed, it was to go to the airport.  But the Taxi Lobby in Vegas, which transported a very high percentage of travelers from the airport to the casino hotels, was very much against it and was able to get that portion of the line cancelled. They built the line anyway but being it was stuck in the back of the casinos with very little signage, it never was well traveled except for some convention business.

Then Uber/Lyft became a thing, which the taxi lobby couldn't overcome.

I remember the taxi lobby being a major reason the monorail didn't go to the airport.

Perhaps now the rideshares have taken a chunk out of the taxi business there, it might be somewhat easier to build the airport connection.

A Deuce BRT or rail line along the Strip might be better for increasing ridership, with a monorail transfer on Tropicana Ave.

I also think it wouldn't be a bad idea to have general purpose express lanes on I-15 between I-215 and I-11, similar to I-271 in Cleveland but with no Strip exits from the express lanes.

[Max Rockatansky]

When we are in Las Vegas in November I'm going to ask my wife if she wants to "take a Deuce on the Strip."

[kernals12]

When we are in Las Vegas in November I'm going to ask my wife if she wants to "take a Deuce on the Strip."

She'll be blinded by the lights

[PColumbus73]

When we are in Las Vegas in November I'm going to ask my wife if she wants to "take a Deuce on the Strip."

Guess it's better than The Stripper

[SeriesE]

I am a huge supporter of tunnels and the only tunnel that needs to be placed here is for a heavy rail subway.

The need for trains to stop to let other people get on and off makes them slow, hence the failure of the monorail.

Wtf. And way from the the airport to Fremont would be much faster than driving. I say this as someone who loves driving the blvd but the monorail is more or less a tourist ride than meaningful transit. Vegas has grown where it needs a subway.

Maybe something fully automated like the Honolulu Skyline could work? Now the question is should it be above ground or underground. Above ground works great for tourism - the tourists can look out the window for the lights/decorations/buildings. Below ground might be better because of weather - shade the trains from the summer heat

[Scott5114]

I say this as someone who loves driving the blvd but the monorail is more or less a tourist ride than meaningful transit.

You say that, but my wife works with someone who uses it every day as part of his commute. (Granted, the number of people that are able to plausibly do that is pretty low. But if you work on the Strip and are one of the few that live nearby...)

[PColumbus73]

Is installing switches for a monorail more difficult than a traditional railroad or light rail system? From a technical perspective, how difficult would it be to build a branch off the existing LV Monorail? Maybe having a western loop of the monorail running down Sammy Davis and Frank Sinatra, reconnecting with the existing line at Sahara and Tropicana.

I also think an elevated light rail or heavy rail that ties in with the pedestrian bridges on Las Vegas Blvd would be a nice feature. Maybe if they could find trains with (tinted) glass ceilings and large windows to make it easier for sightseeing.

[mrsman]

Is installing switches for a monorail more difficult than a traditional railroad or light rail system? From a technical perspective, how difficult would it be to build a branch off the existing LV Monorail? Maybe having a western loop of the monorail running down Sammy Davis and Frank Sinatra, reconnecting with the existing line at Sahara and Tropicana.

I also think an elevated light rail or heavy rail that ties in with the pedestrian bridges on Las Vegas Blvd would be a nice feature. Maybe if they could find trains with (tinted) glass ceilings and large windows to make it easier for sightseeing.

These are important questions.  I think ideally, if I was starting with a blank canvas, I would provide an elevated rail system with two lines that basically connect along the Central Strip (Harmon - Sands).  One line is wholly along the Strip from Blue Diamond to North LV.  The other line branches southeast to reach Henderson, Airport, UNLV, joins the Strip line between Harmon and Sands, and then branches to serve the Convention Center, Downtown (another transfer to main line), and then heads northwest to the Summerlin area. But given the existing monorail, it would seem better if that line were extended to serve Downtown, Airport, and suburban park and rides.

With the monorail already in place, I would work on first keeping the fares in line with normal transit fares for the area (i.e. no more than 1.5 x the bus fare) and then extending north as follows: Paradise-LV Blvd-3rd-Casino Center.  The west line turns onto Charleston-Rancho-Washington to end at Rainbow near the I-11/613 interchange at a park and ride.  The east line heads into NLV, following LV Blvd.  The monorail also should be extended south and east to reach near UNLV (Tropicana/Paradise) and the Airport terminals.  A branch off the existing monorail should serve the west strip, essentially following Flamingo and then serving the casinos on the west side of the Strip, with a detour to serve the stadium, and ending at Blue Diamond.  The capacity and frequency of the monorail would need a dramatic increase.

I also like the idea of general purpose express lanes on I-15.  Skip the strip area and provide access to I-11 and Downtown.

[hobsini2]

Is installing switches for a monorail more difficult than a traditional railroad or light rail system? From a technical perspective, how difficult would it be to build a branch off the existing LV Monorail? Maybe having a western loop of the monorail running down Sammy Davis and Frank Sinatra, reconnecting with the existing line at Sahara and Tropicana.

I also think an elevated light rail or heavy rail that ties in with the pedestrian bridges on Las Vegas Blvd would be a nice feature. Maybe if they could find trains with (tinted) glass ceilings and large windows to make it easier for sightseeing.

These are important questions.  I think ideally, if I was starting with a blank canvas, I would provide an elevated rail system with two lines that basically connect along the Central Strip (Harmon - Sands).  One line is wholly along the Strip from Blue Diamond to North LV.  The other line branches southeast to reach Henderson, Airport, UNLV, joins the Strip line between Harmon and Sands, and then branches to serve the Convention Center, Downtown (another transfer to main line), and then heads northwest to the Summerlin area. But given the existing monorail, it would seem better if that line were extended to serve Downtown, Airport, and suburban park and rides.

With the monorail already in place, I would work on first keeping the fares in line with normal transit fares for the area (i.e. no more than 1.5 x the bus fare) and then extending north as follows: Paradise-LV Blvd-3rd-Casino Center.  The west line turns onto Charleston-Rancho-Washington to end at Rainbow near the I-11/613 interchange at a park and ride.  The east line heads into NLV, following LV Blvd.  The monorail also should be extended south and east to reach near UNLV (Tropicana/Paradise) and the Airport terminals.  A branch off the existing monorail should serve the west strip, essentially following Flamingo and then serving the casinos on the west side of the Strip, with a detour to serve the stadium, and ending at Blue Diamond.  The capacity and frequency of the monorail would need a dramatic increase.

I also like the idea of general purpose express lanes on I-15.  Skip the strip area and provide access to I-11 and Downtown.

Is it possible to convert the monorail into a light rail? Thinking about this in terms on expansion.

[mrsman]

Is installing switches for a monorail more difficult than a traditional railroad or light rail system? From a technical perspective, how difficult would it be to build a branch off the existing LV Monorail? Maybe having a western loop of the monorail running down Sammy Davis and Frank Sinatra, reconnecting with the existing line at Sahara and Tropicana.

I also think an elevated light rail or heavy rail that ties in with the pedestrian bridges on Las Vegas Blvd would be a nice feature. Maybe if they could find trains with (tinted) glass ceilings and large windows to make it easier for sightseeing.

These are important questions.  I think ideally, if I was starting with a blank canvas, I would provide an elevated rail system with two lines that basically connect along the Central Strip (Harmon - Sands).  One line is wholly along the Strip from Blue Diamond to North LV.  The other line branches southeast to reach Henderson, Airport, UNLV, joins the Strip line between Harmon and Sands, and then branches to serve the Convention Center, Downtown (another transfer to main line), and then heads northwest to the Summerlin area. But given the existing monorail, it would seem better if that line were extended to serve Downtown, Airport, and suburban park and rides.

With the monorail already in place, I would work on first keeping the fares in line with normal transit fares for the area (i.e. no more than 1.5 x the bus fare) and then extending north as follows: Paradise-LV Blvd-3rd-Casino Center.  The west line turns onto Charleston-Rancho-Washington to end at Rainbow near the I-11/613 interchange at a park and ride.  The east line heads into NLV, following LV Blvd.  The monorail also should be extended south and east to reach near UNLV (Tropicana/Paradise) and the Airport terminals.  A branch off the existing monorail should serve the west strip, essentially following Flamingo and then serving the casinos on the west side of the Strip, with a detour to serve the stadium, and ending at Blue Diamond.  The capacity and frequency of the monorail would need a dramatic increase.

I also like the idea of general purpose express lanes on I-15.  Skip the strip area and provide access to I-11 and Downtown.

Is it possible to convert the monorail into a light rail? Thinking about this in terms on expansion.

I would think so, but don't know for sure.   Depending on the light rail specs, I would hope that at least the existing right of way and the support columns could be reused.  Although looking at GSV of the LV monorail and some elevated light rail, it seems that light rail generally needs much wider support columns. 

[PColumbus73]

Since monorails don't use tracks like conventional rail, converting the monorail would likely involve shutting down the entire system in order to convert it. They would probably only be able to keep the pillars, assuming it can support the conventional rails. there would also be some tight spaces that the conversion would have to work around, like at the MGM / Wet Republic.

It might be better to keep the monorail as a tourist shuttle / loop around the Strip and have a regular light rail / subway for the local commuters. Like with the idea of general-purpose express lanes for I-15 to filter the tourists from regular traffic.