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Gordie Howe Bridge (US-Canada)

Started by CoolAngrybirdsrio4, January 13, 2022, 02:01:53 PM

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ElishaGOtis

Quote from: Sani on June 18, 2026, 05:34:28 PM
Quote from: davewiecking on June 17, 2026, 09:08:41 PM
Quote from: oscar on June 12, 2026, 11:59:22 AM
Quote from: Sani on June 12, 2026, 10:53:32 AMWelp. Should've known someone in DC was going to throw a tantrum and stop it from opening. At this point, they'll have to just hold a "soft opening" and not tell anyone at the White House until traffic's already moving.
You can't do a full "soft opening" without help from the Homeland Security department, to among other things supply border agents on the U.S. side. The recently-confirmed DHS secretary, who gave up his U.S. Senate seat for that position, is unlikely to cooperate, whatever his personal views on the bridge.
Mullins indicated it was staffed and ready to go. That may have been a moment of honesty before he remembered to whom he is beholden.
I get that there's no practical way to do a "soft opening" for something like this. You can't tell thousands of DHS employees to go to work without someone in the chain of command mentioning it to their boss. But boy, it'd be nice to just get the damn thing open and worry about the tantrums of politicians later. It'd be a lot harder to close it once it's open than to keep it closed, I would think.

Nexus only maybe?
I can drive 55 ONLY when it makes sense.

NOTE: Opinions expressed here on AARoads are solely my own and do not represent or reflect the statements, opinions, or decisions of any agency. Any official information I share will be quoted or specified from another source.

My ideal speed limits (FAKE/FICTIONAL NOT OFFICIAL) :
https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=1Ia4RR_BaYyzgJq4n3JcYzkNZjLYKzGQ


Beltway

Quote from: kalvado on June 18, 2026, 08:54:36 PM
Quote from: vdeane on June 18, 2026, 08:11:12 PM
Quote from: Sani on June 18, 2026, 05:34:28 PMYou can't tell thousands of DHS employees to go to work without someone in the chain of command mentioning it to their boss.
Thousands?  I never knew an individual port of entry required nearly so many.
Did you take into account supervisors, second line supervisors, facility manager office, support team, office for regulatort compliance, department of redundancy department, and both actual inspectors?
Four shifts needed to cover 24/7/365
Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

kalvado

Quote from: Beltway on June 19, 2026, 11:52:02 AM
Quote from: kalvado on June 18, 2026, 08:54:36 PM
Quote from: vdeane on June 18, 2026, 08:11:12 PM
Quote from: Sani on June 18, 2026, 05:34:28 PMYou can't tell thousands of DHS employees to go to work without someone in the chain of command mentioning it to their boss.
Thousands?  I never knew an individual port of entry required nearly so many.
Did you take into account supervisors, second line supervisors, facility manager office, support team, office for regulatort compliance, department of redundancy department, and both actual inspectors?
Four shifts needed to cover 24/7/365
Quote from: Beltway on June 19, 2026, 11:52:02 AM
Quote from: kalvado on June 18, 2026, 08:54:36 PM
Quote from: vdeane on June 18, 2026, 08:11:12 PM
Quote from: Sani on June 18, 2026, 05:34:28 PMYou can't tell thousands of DHS employees to go to work without someone in the chain of command mentioning it to their boss.
Thousands?  I never knew an individual port of entry required nearly so many.
Did you take into account supervisors, second line supervisors, facility manager office, support team, office for regulatort compliance, department of redundancy department, and both actual inspectors?
Four shifts needed to cover 24/7/365
Sounds like at least 10 000 full time jobs

Beltway

Quote from: kalvado on June 19, 2026, 01:44:28 PM
Quote from: Beltway on June 19, 2026, 11:52:02 AM
Quote from: kalvado on June 18, 2026, 08:54:36 PM
Quote from: vdeane on June 18, 2026, 08:11:12 PM
Quote from: Sani on June 18, 2026, 05:34:28 PMYou can't tell thousands of DHS employees to go to work without someone in the chain of command mentioning it to their boss.
Thousands?  I never knew an individual port of entry required nearly so many.
Did you take into account supervisors, second line supervisors, facility manager office, support team, office for regulatort compliance, department of redundancy department, and both actual inspectors?
Four shifts needed to cover 24/7/365
Sounds like at least 10 000 full time jobs
Even the largest U.S.–Canada ports don't approach 10,000 employees. A major land port typically has a few hundred staff across all shifts. The math doesn't scale the way you're suggesting.
Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

kphoger

Quote from: Beltway on June 19, 2026, 03:24:13 PMThe math doesn't scale the way you're suggesting.

He forgot to use the  [sarcasm] [/sarcasm]  formatting tags.

He Is Already Here! Let's Go, Flamingo!
Dost thou understand the graveness of the circumstances?
Deut 23:13
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: PKDIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

Beltway

Quote from: kphoger on June 19, 2026, 03:34:27 PM
Quote from: Beltway on June 19, 2026, 03:24:13 PMThe math doesn't scale the way you're suggesting.
He forgot to use the  [sarcasm] [/sarcasm]  formatting tags.
Sarcasm noted. The math still doesn't work.
Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

Scott5114

Quote from: BloombergLutnick Delayed Canada Bridge Debut to Seek Bigger Cut of Toll Revenue
Josh Wingrove, David Welch, Thomas Seal

June 25, 2026 at 11:33 PM UTC


Commerce Secretary Howard Lutnick intervened to delay the opening of a new bridge between the US and Canada and is pressing to renegotiate the deal for a larger share of toll revenue, people familiar with the matter said.

Earlier this month, Michigan and Canadian officials planned an opening ceremony for the C$6.4 billion ($4.5 billion) Gordie Howe International Bridge, even going so far as to send out invitations. But they abandoned the event at the last moment when Lutnick stepped in, the people said, speaking on condition they not be identified to describe the negotiations.
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

Max Rockatansky

I wonder if the ceremonial ribbon will be creatively snipped whenever the bridge actually opens?

Beltway

Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 26, 2026, 11:25:20 AMI wonder if the ceremonial ribbon will be creatively snipped whenever the bridge actually opens?
I have a section of ceremonial ribbon used at the Fort McHenry Tunnel opening. Scissors were used to give everybody a ~12 inch section. It was red, white and blue ribbons about 3 inches wide each and sewed together.
Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

Max Rockatansky

Quote from: Beltway on June 26, 2026, 04:24:53 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 26, 2026, 11:25:20 AMI wonder if the ceremonial ribbon will be creatively snipped whenever the bridge actually opens?
I have a section of ceremonial ribbon used at the Fort McHenry Tunnel opening. Scissors were used to give everybody a ~12 inch section. It was red, white and blue ribbons about 3 inches wide each and sewed together.

But what makes that snipping "creative?"  As far as snipping goes that seems pretty standard.

Beltway

Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 26, 2026, 04:28:32 PM
Quote from: Beltway on June 26, 2026, 04:24:53 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 26, 2026, 11:25:20 AMI wonder if the ceremonial ribbon will be creatively snipped whenever the bridge actually opens?
I have a section of ceremonial ribbon used at the Fort McHenry Tunnel opening. Scissors were used to give everybody a ~12 inch section. It was red, white and blue ribbons about 3 inches wide each and sewed together.
But what makes that snipping "creative?"  As far as snipping goes that seems pretty standard.
It was a creative thing to do for the audience, something I didn't expect.
Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

Max Rockatansky

Quote from: Beltway on June 26, 2026, 04:31:15 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 26, 2026, 04:28:32 PM
Quote from: Beltway on June 26, 2026, 04:24:53 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 26, 2026, 11:25:20 AMI wonder if the ceremonial ribbon will be creatively snipped whenever the bridge actually opens?
I have a section of ceremonial ribbon used at the Fort McHenry Tunnel opening. Scissors were used to give everybody a ~12 inch section. It was red, white and blue ribbons about 3 inches wide each and sewed together.
But what makes that snipping "creative?"  As far as snipping goes that seems pretty standard.
It was a creative thing to do for the audience, something I didn't expect.

Every significant road dedication ceremony I've been to has included trinkets of some kind.  When I went down to the Centennial Corridor dedication ceremony Caltrans D6 gave away all sorts of things.  I have most of them on display in my garage.

kalvado

Quote from: Beltway on June 26, 2026, 04:24:53 PM
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on June 26, 2026, 11:25:20 AMI wonder if the ceremonial ribbon will be creatively snipped whenever the bridge actually opens?
I have a section of ceremonial ribbon used at the Fort McHenry Tunnel opening. Scissors were used to give everybody a ~12 inch section. It was red, white and blue ribbons about 3 inches wide each and sewed together.
A very serious question - what would be the color of ribbon for this bridge, given it is built on Canadian dime?

Beltway

Quote from: kalvado on June 26, 2026, 07:34:34 PM
Quote from: Beltway on June 26, 2026, 04:24:53 PMI have a section of ceremonial ribbon used at the Fort McHenry Tunnel opening. Scissors were used to give everybody a ~12 inch section. It was red, white and blue ribbons about 3 inches wide each and sewed together.
A very serious question - what would be the color of ribbon for this bridge, given it is built on Canadian dime?
Canada paid for the bridge, but ceremony protocol isn't based on who wrote the check. Since the opening event will be on the U.S. side, the ribbon will be the standard U.S. red‑white‑blue. But then again it might be different.

Ceremonies are hosted by the jurisdiction with the larger, more secure, more logistically suitable port‑of‑entry -- almost always the U.S. side.
Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

Scott5114

I don't think red-white-blue is standard anymore, if it ever was. (It could be the standard in a particular state or region, though.) A quick persual of image search results for "highway ribbon cutting united states" shows the following:

MS: red, white, and blue
TX (Austin): purple with gold "GRAND OPENING"
TX (Williamson County): blue with project logo
NPS: yellow
WV: red, white, and blue
CA: orange
MI: red
MN: blue (tied between two Telespar posts bearing half-scale shields)
AZ: red

If I had to guess, the Gordie Howe ribbon would likely be red, since that's what MDOT has used in the past, Canada would have no objection to it, and red was one of the team colors for the team Howe played for. But it seems like the real determining factor is just whatever the organizer thought would look good and whether they have the budget to print something on it or not.
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

Rothman

Quote from: Scott5114 on June 27, 2026, 12:28:02 AMI don't think red-white-blue is standard anymore, if it ever was. (It could be the standard in a particular state or region, though.) A quick persual of image search results for "highway ribbon cutting united states" shows the following:

MS: red, white, and blue
TX (Austin): purple with gold "GRAND OPENING"
TX (Williamson County): blue with project logo
NPS: yellow
WV: red, white, and blue
CA: orange
MI: red
MN: blue (tied between two Telespar posts bearing half-scale shields)
AZ: red

If I had to guess, the Gordie Howe ribbon would likely be red, since that's what MDOT has used in the past, Canada would have no objection to it, and red was one of the team colors for the team Howe played for. But it seems like the real determining factor is just whatever the organizer thought would look good and whether they have the budget to print something on it or not.

Nice fact check.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

Beltway

Quote from: Rothman on June 27, 2026, 10:20:53 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 27, 2026, 12:28:02 AMI don't think red-white-blue is standard anymore, if it ever was. (It could be the standard in a particular state or region, though.) A quick persual of image search results for "highway ribbon cutting united states" shows the following:
MS: red, white, and blue
TX (Austin): purple with gold "GRAND OPENING"
TX (Williamson County): blue with project logo
NPS: yellow
WV: red, white, and blue
CA: orange
MI: red
MN: blue (tied between two Telespar posts bearing half-scale shields)
AZ: red
If I had to guess, the Gordie Howe ribbon would likely be red, since that's what MDOT has used in the past, Canada would have no objection to it, and red was one of the team colors for the team Howe played for. But it seems like the real determining factor is just whatever the organizer thought would look good and whether they have the budget to print something on it or not.
Nice fact check.
In fact, there is a whole spectrum of possibilites for the color scheme of the opening ribbons -- there is no one-fits-for-all scheme -- as his list shows.
Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

Rothman

Quote from: Beltway on June 27, 2026, 11:02:47 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 27, 2026, 10:20:53 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 27, 2026, 12:28:02 AMI don't think red-white-blue is standard anymore, if it ever was. (It could be the standard in a particular state or region, though.) A quick persual of image search results for "highway ribbon cutting united states" shows the following:
MS: red, white, and blue
TX (Austin): purple with gold "GRAND OPENING"
TX (Williamson County): blue with project logo
NPS: yellow
WV: red, white, and blue
CA: orange
MI: red
MN: blue (tied between two Telespar posts bearing half-scale shields)
AZ: red
If I had to guess, the Gordie Howe ribbon would likely be red, since that's what MDOT has used in the past, Canada would have no objection to it, and red was one of the team colors for the team Howe played for. But it seems like the real determining factor is just whatever the organizer thought would look good and whether they have the budget to print something on it or not.
Nice fact check.
In fact, there is a whole spectrum of possibilites for the color scheme of the opening ribbons -- there is no one-fits-for-all scheme -- as his list shows.
Another strange response...
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

Beltway

Quote from: Rothman on June 27, 2026, 11:08:18 PM
Quote from: Beltway on June 27, 2026, 11:02:47 PM
Quote from: Rothman on June 27, 2026, 10:20:53 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on June 27, 2026, 12:28:02 AMI don't think red-white-blue is standard anymore, if it ever was. (It could be the standard in a particular state or region, though.) A quick persual of image search results for "highway ribbon cutting united states" shows the following:
MS: red, white, and blue
TX (Austin): purple with gold "GRAND OPENING"
TX (Williamson County): blue with project logo
NPS: yellow
WV: red, white, and blue
CA: orange
MI: red
MN: blue (tied between two Telespar posts bearing half-scale shields)
AZ: red
If I had to guess, the Gordie Howe ribbon would likely be red, since that's what MDOT has used in the past, Canada would have no objection to it, and red was one of the team colors for the team Howe played for. But it seems like the real determining factor is just whatever the organizer thought would look good and whether they have the budget to print something on it or not.
Nice fact check.
In fact, there is a whole spectrum of possibilites for the color scheme of the opening ribbons -- there is no one-fits-for-all scheme -- as his list shows.
Another strange response...
Why is that? The discussion seems to reveal that there is no standardized method for designing this.
Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

kphoger

Quote from: Beltway on June 26, 2026, 07:44:05 PMthe ribbon will be [ insert literally any color scheme at all ]. But then again it might be different.

He Is Already Here! Let's Go, Flamingo!
Dost thou understand the graveness of the circumstances?
Deut 23:13
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: PKDIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

hbelkins

When planning these ceremonies, I've used black-on-yellow "Caution" tape before for symbolic ribbon-cuttings.
Government would be tolerable if not for politicians and bureaucrats.

GaryV

Quote from: hbelkins on June 29, 2026, 02:12:02 PMblack-on-yellow "Caution" tape before for symbolic ribbon-cuttings

That would be appropriate, since at this point the Gordie Howe is only a symbolic bridge.

Beltway

Quote from: kphoger on June 29, 2026, 01:51:48 PM
Quote from: Beltway on June 26, 2026, 07:44:05 PMthe ribbon will be [ insert literally any color scheme at all ]. But then again it might be different.
Discussions and opinions evolve and change as you receive more data.

Those brackets show the proper way (at least from an academic standpoint) to quote someone and insert your own text. But then you should not accept it unless and until you look up the original quote, so that you can verify whether or not it is accurate.
Baloney is a reserved word on the Internet
    (Robert Coté, 2002)

Rothman

Quote from: kphoger on June 29, 2026, 01:51:48 PM
Quote from: Beltway on June 26, 2026, 07:44:05 PMthe ribbon will be [ insert literally any color scheme at all ]. But then again it might be different.


I considered the consequences of pointing that out earlier and decided my energy was better spent elsewhere.  Thank you for picking up the torch.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

kphoger

Quote from: Rothman on June 29, 2026, 03:33:39 PMThank you for picking up the torch.

I like to think of myself as a sort of legacy steward on here.

He Is Already Here! Let's Go, Flamingo!
Dost thou understand the graveness of the circumstances?
Deut 23:13
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: PKDIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.