Newark Bay-Hudson County Extension

[roadman65]

Not great: Cost to widen N.J. Turnpike extension to Holland tunnel balloons to $10.6B

The cost increase was blamed on inflation and the cost to borrow money to do the project, Turnpike Authority officials said.

"Inflation and rising interest rates have an impact on nearly every project in the NJTA's capital program, said Tom Feeney, a turnpike authority spokesperson. "The impact is greatest on projects like this one scheduled to be built over several many years. It is not unreasonable to anticipate that these estimates will change again as supply change issues normalize over time."

This is already getting pilloried by many, as you might expect. A more than doubling of the costs of a project that is already unpopular and facing a ton of local opposition is not great no matter what way you look at it.

And MultiMillionMiler wonders why they extort tolls from drivers in NJ.

[Ted$8roadFan]

Not great: Cost to widen N.J. Turnpike extension to Holland tunnel balloons to $10.6B

The cost increase was blamed on inflation and the cost to borrow money to do the project, Turnpike Authority officials said.

"Inflation and rising interest rates have an impact on nearly every project in the NJTA's capital program, said Tom Feeney, a turnpike authority spokesperson. "The impact is greatest on projects like this one scheduled to be built over several many years. It is not unreasonable to anticipate that these estimates will change again as supply change issues normalize over time."

This is already getting pilloried by many, as you might expect. A more than doubling of the costs of a project that is already unpopular and facing a ton of local opposition is not great no matter what way you look at it.

$10.6B.....sort of like Boston's Big Dig.

[roadman65]

If they do as thorough study on how to spend money as how to protect the environment, they could find ways to do this more reasonable.

Not to be sarcastic either here, but implying my thought here literally.  If the Hatfield's and the McCoys would develop a procedure that takes in every factor together, they could save us taxpayers a big bill in the end

[NoGoodNamesAvailable]

Taxpayers have nothing to do with this. The Turnpike Authority runs off toll revenue and not taxes.

And if you're going to bother to mobilize and rebuild the entire bridge and viaduct, it's actually stupid to not spend the little extra to widen it.

[Rothman]

The "little extra" is a heckuva understatement. 

[roadman65]

Taxpayers have nothing to do with this. The Turnpike Authority runs off toll revenue and not taxes.

And if you're going to bother to mobilize and rebuild the entire bridge and viaduct, it's actually stupid to not spend the little extra to widen it.

Never said it did. Responding to the latest troll who believes tolls are way to high in NJ with tolls in PA to be only applied on straight roads and winding freeways should be free, and I-80 needs to end in Providence.

Then the politicians still do have a say in bureaucratic matters which even the NJTA is influenced by politics despite not being state government.

[jeffandnicole]

Taxpayers have nothing to do with this. The Turnpike Authority runs off toll revenue and not taxes.

And if you're going to bother to mobilize and rebuild the entire bridge and viaduct, it's actually stupid to not spend the little extra to widen it.

Never said it did. Responding to the latest troll who believes tolls are way to high in NJ with tolls in PA to be only applied on straight roads and winding freeways should be free, and I-80 needs to end in Providence.

Then the politicians still do have a say in bureaucratic matters which even the NJTA is influenced by politics despite not being state government.

Since the Governor can veto the board meeting's minutes that approve the projects, in a way there can be some taxpayer influence. But this action rarely happens.

[roadman65]

Not taxpayer, but  political. Two different things. Bureaucrats are very much motivated by politics as much as anyone these days.

[jeffandnicole]

Not taxpayer, but  political. Two different things. Bureaucrats are very much motivated by politics as much as anyone these days.

The point being, the taxpayers can call the Governor's office and try to persuade the governor to veto the minutes to the meeting.  It's a route that most people who are against a project have no clue it's an available avenue, and the Governor will probably ignore those that have called, but it does exist as a last-ditch effort.

[Rothman]

Not taxpayer, but  political. Two different things. Bureaucrats are very much motivated by politics as much as anyone these days.

The point being, the taxpayers can call the Governor's office and try to persuade the governor to veto the minutes to the meeting.  It's a route that most people who are against a project have no clue it's an available avenue, and the Governor will probably ignore those that have called, but it does exist as a last-ditch effort.

Heh.  I am sure that happens all the time.

[Plutonic Panda]

This project is still pushing forward and scheduled to begin in 2026 and the entire project wrapping up by 2040:

https://www.constructionequipmentguide.com/new-jersey-wants-a-nearly-11b-turnpike-widening-from-newark-to-jersey-city/62802

[Plutonic Panda]

Still moving forward, slowly:

https://www.globalhighways.com/news/newark-bay-bridge-upgrade-approved

[Great Lakes Roads]

A public meeting on this project was held on June 18th.

The project does the following:
1. Widens the extension from 4 (2 lanes each way) to 8 (4 lanes each way) between interchanges 14 and 14A
2. Widens the extension from 4 (2 lanes each way) to 6 (3 lanes each way) between interchanges 14A and 14B
3. Replaces the Newark Bay Bridge with a twin set of cable-stayed bridges
4. Improve interchange 14
5. Upgrade the road design to modern standards

[The Ghostbuster]

Am I correct in saying that once construction of the New Jersey Turnpike Newark Extension expansion project is completed, there will be no other segments of Interstate 78 in New Jersey that are less than six lanes wide?

[seicer]

East from Exit 14B, Interstate 78 will still be four lanes.

[roadman65]

Someone on line brought up a interesting point to why the Newark Bay Bridge should remain as two lanes instead of adding another.  On FB someone mentioned that the Hollland Tunnel will always be four lanes and to add six lanes to I-78 wouldnt help but cause more bottlenecks at 12th Street.

To me that sounds like truth, but I'm not sure if other traffic such as those for 14A and 14B and the Science Center alone warrants the widening of the Bay Bridge.

[Plutonic Panda]

Someone on line brought up a interesting point to why the Newark Bay Bridge should remain as two lanes instead of adding another.  On FB someone mentioned that the Hollland Tunnel will always be four lanes and to add six lanes to I-78 wouldnt help but cause more bottlenecks at 12th Street.

To me that sounds like truth, but I'm not sure if other traffic such as those for 14A and 14B and the Science Center alone warrants the widening of the Bay Bridge.

Well, the tunnel does need to be widen and expanded, and if New Jersey widen their part leading up to the tunnel at least I can say hey we did our part now it's time for you fuckers to do yours. There's that.

[roadman65]

Someone on line brought up a interesting point to why the Newark Bay Bridge should remain as two lanes instead of adding another.  On FB someone mentioned that the Hollland Tunnel will always be four lanes and to add six lanes to I-78 wouldnt help but cause more bottlenecks at 12th Street.

To me that sounds like truth, but I'm not sure if other traffic such as those for 14A and 14B and the Science Center alone warrants the widening of the Bay Bridge.

Well, the tunnel does need to be widen and expanded, and if New Jersey widen their part leading up to the tunnel at least I can say hey we did our part now it's time for you fuckers to do yours. There's that.

If this were a perfect world yes.  But we live in a society that focuses on removing freeways in place of boulevards with stop lights. We also have politicians that are for mass transit to replace cars, but no plans to implement or even admit to themselves that the average Joe won't give up their freedom of driving.

[Plutonic Panda]

Someone on line brought up a interesting point to why the Newark Bay Bridge should remain as two lanes instead of adding another.  On FB someone mentioned that the Hollland Tunnel will always be four lanes and to add six lanes to I-78 wouldnt help but cause more bottlenecks at 12th Street.

To me that sounds like truth, but I'm not sure if other traffic such as those for 14A and 14B and the Science Center alone warrants the widening of the Bay Bridge.

Well, the tunnel does need to be widen and expanded, and if New Jersey widen their part leading up to the tunnel at least I can say hey we did our part now it's time for you fuckers to do yours. There's that.

If this were a perfect world yes.  But we live in a society that focuses on removing freeways in place of boulevards with stop lights. We also have politicians that are for mass transit to replace cars, but no plans to implement or even admit to themselves that the average Joe won't give up their freedom of driving.

Yeah, I get it. I'm one of those people I'm not giving up my freedom of driving. I also get what's going on in New York but my point is New Jersey can just widen their part and say well here we go we did what we can do now the buck is passed to New York and then they can explain why there's traffic backups because they refuse to address a bottleneck. I can see both sides of the argument. I'd still advocate for widening the New Jersey side as much as possible. And if people would learn how to drive better it wouldn't be that bad with better driver etiquette, which would allow for a bigger queue capacity. Potentially preventing the road from backing up onto other facilities.

[vdeane]

Even if NY were to spend literal billions to widen the tunnel, where would all that traffic go?  It just empties onto Manhattan streets.  There's going to be a a bottleneck somewhere.

I don't see the point of widening the Turnpike east of exit 14A.

[The Ghostbuster]

Could the bridges and tunnels in the New York City Metropolitan Area be congestion-priced like Manhattan south of 60th St. is?

[Plutonic Panda]

Even if NY were to spend literal billions to widen the tunnel, where would all that traffic go?  It just empties onto Manhattan streets.  There's going to be a a bottleneck somewhere.

I don't see the point of widening the Turnpike east of exit 14A.

I mean, you build more parking garages you build more park-and-ride lots for more people to transfer to mass transportation infrastructure. I really don't understand this mentality like why the fuck do anything?

[roadman65]

The question is how do you get people yo give up their cars?  To use park and rides requires a self sacrifice.

To build more garages will only give another expense if parking in New York isn't expensive enough.

[Plutonic Panda]

The question is how do you get people yo give up their cars?  To use park and rides requires a self sacrifice.

To build more garages will only give another expense if parking in New York isn't expensive enough.

Well, I don't think we should be trying to get people to give up their cars. We should however, be building a robust transit network and give people the option to move around without a car and then let people decide if that's the way they want to travel. I'm not too familiar with the northeast but to me it kind of seems like it's a little bit like the Bay Area where there's tons of different transit agencies that really should be consolidated to make it easier and more seamless. But maybe somebody can correct me on that. I don't know if it's as difficult as it is up in the bay.

[vdeane]

Honestly, looking at the traffic layer of Google Maps this morning, I'm not convinced that widening the tunnels would even do anything.  There are two points of delay that cascade back impressively, but neither one is the width of the tunnel - the first is the traffic lights through Jersey City (with the local streets themselves showing up green, and all the red being on the approaches to the first light) and then again where the tunnel empties onto local streets in NYC.  They only way to really uncork this would be to build both a freeway through Jersey City and the Lower Manhattan Expressway.

Not to mention that the Holland Tunnel is already within the congestion zone.